The Ryen Russillo Podcast - The Hunter Heisman Argument and New NBA GM Survey Reaction, Plus MLB Playoffs With Kevin Millar and the NHL Is Back With John Buccigross

Episode Date: October 9, 2024

Russillo opens the show with a look at past Heisman winners and how that history can be applied to this year (0:30) before Ceruti joins to go over the annual NBA GM survey (15:02). Then, he’s joined by Kevin Millar to break down the divisional round, share stories from his playing days, and explain why it’s not time to panic about Aaron Judge (31:18). Next, John Buccigross comes on to preview the upcoming NHL season and explain the significance of Wayne Gretzky’s goal record (54:20). Finally, Ceruti and Kyle join for Life Advice (81:02)! How do I handle someone being too flirty with my girlfriend? Check us out on YouTube for exclusive clips, live streams, and more at https://www.youtube.com/@RyenRussilloPodcast The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Host: Ryen Russillo Guests: Kevin Millar and John Buccigross Producers: Steve Ceruti, Kyle Crichton, and Mike Wargon Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We're doing something different. We got some baseball playoff talk and we're previewing the hockey. This year we've got Malar on baseball, Butcher Gras on hockey. I'm going to talk a little bit about this Heisman thing that I wanted to get to with Travis Hunter, also the NBA GM Survey and the Life Advice in our Thursday pick. It's the Ryan Russo podcast presented by FanDuel. Football is in full action

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And also Nico Iamaljava plus 1000 right now. He's behind a few other names there on the Heisman odds. So if you want to get the hook up, visit fandel.com slash Ryan RYE to download America's number one sports book. The ringer is committed to responsible gambling. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available and listen to the end of the episode for additional

details. Must be 21 and older and President-elect states gambling problem call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. This episode is brought to you by Movember. The mustache is back with a vengeance. Look at Travis Kelsey. Before he rocked that Super Bowl ring, he rocked that super soup strainer. Grow a mustache for November. You'll do great things too. You won't win the Super Bowl, but your fundraising will support mental health, suicide prevention, and prostate and testicular cancer research. And if you don't want to grow a mustache, you can still walk or run 60 kilometers, host an event, or set your own goal and mow your own way. Do great things this November. Sign up now.

Just search Movember. A couple things in the open that I want to get to. I've been kind of teasing this Heisman thing, and then I also want to talk about the NBA GM survey. We'll bring in Saruti for some of that, some stuff that I like, some stuff that you're like, hey, how did that happen? But that's what happens when we take polls

of a bunch of different people. But it's also what happens with the Heisman. If you look at Heisman voting this year, there's a lot of stuff that I wanna get to historically here. So like, look, after this weekend, we're gonna be at the halfway point of the season, okay? And I talked a bit about it with McShea and my Travis Hunter push,

at least based on what we have right now, and also touching up with Leinert a a little bit who won it back in 2004, but it's really been, it's become and has been, I'd say since 2000, the default quarterback award. So if you go back since 2000, it's 20 quarterbacks and one Heisman, three running backs and one wide receiver, Devante Smith. So we're talking three positions. And like the history tells us, I mean, look, it wasn't like this was new.

And whenever you start thinking about like MVP, the NFL, it's just hard to make a case for anyone being more valuable than the top quarterback, like you've got to do something really, really special to win that award and the way running backs have kind of been phased out as a priority in the NFL, you know, like at least it's still open for them, for the Heisman in college. So looking at some of the historical stuff, you know, I know that I felt like it's always been the best kind of like who's the best quarterback on the best team. That's not always the case, which I think is good.

If you go back to RG3's year at Baylor, they were 10 and three. They ended up 13th in the AP. That's actually a good sign to me. And he was fully deserving. He had a spectacular year, but there's also the story element of that, that you have to realize that voters are always going to be into and the story was putting Baylor on the map. The Vanderbilt of the big 12 in a way, maybe not that bad in the timing of that with Vandy's week is a little different. How about that Kentucky spread, by the way? So look, there's another year in there where

Cam Newton wins it in 2010. I think that season for Cam Newton and Auburn, I think it's the most important quarterback play I've ever seen in my lifetime from just a guy carrying a team that was not your standard SEC title winning team that was loaded with NFL talent everywhere. There was actually not much NFL talent on a team, which is kind of shocking when

you think about all these, all these NFL draft picks that have come from SEC national champions. So if cam and I wonder, like if cam doesn't have that comeback against Bama at Tuscaloosa, like one of the all time games in the history, at least to that part of the country, like what Cam had lost momentum because he felt like there was just so many weeks he was saving Auburn and then at least do a national championship. Cam ended up with. Seven hundred and twenty nine first place votes.

That is a staggering total. If you look at the total number of voters to the Heisman as of today, I have this number here somewhere. I think it's like 900 plus voters that vote on the Heisman. Some other places have said it's 850, but there's a lot of people that vote on this. So you have to think of like the momentum of the story and then sometimes the momentum of groupthink a little bit too. So Cam winning 729 first place votes over Andrew Luck, who had 78 first place

votes, like that was, that was still the right choice because not only are you talking about story, best quarterback, best team, but it was the most outstanding season of any player in college football and it paid off with a title on top of everything else. So you got that. But I do wonder like what would the voting had been like if they hadn't had that comeback against Alabama. 2009 Heisman vote bothered me.

Ingram won it running back Bama. And think about that cam number was 729. Ingram won the Heisman in 2009 with 227 first place votes. Toby Gerhart was second. The white rhino, I believe. Colt McCoy was third. I would have voted for Endomic and Sue. He had 100, so he came in fourth, but had 161 first place votes.

That year I thought Sue was the most dominant player in college football. That's supposed to be what the award is, but it's not necessarily what happens. Sue was going to be tough. An interior defensive lineman, like he's the best. Yeah, he's the best. He disrupted the game more than any other player that played, but there was just no way that many people were going to vote for an interior defensive lineman. It just, it wasn't going to happen. So was I like outraged? No. But I remember back in the day with Van Pelt, we're sitting there talking about it.

I go, I gotta be honest with you, like every week I'm watching Adam and Sue. Like, I don't think anybody's, I don't think there's a player that's actually better than this guy, but I guess he's just not going to win. Uh, yeah, right now, I guess it's 928 voters for the Heisman. So if you look at the preseason favorites, because this plays into it too, kind of your awareness as a voter or the awareness of where the storylines can go and also how expectations play into whether or not somebody's deserving of getting a Heisman vote. So if you look at the preseason odds on FanDuel,

you had Milro, Carson Beck, Ewers, Dillian Gabriel were all around eight to one. But that's really just trying to figure out a market. Like that number, there's a little value in there if you think you're jumping on something a little bit earlier. As hard as it is to pick that, hey, I'm gonna pick this guy and it's gonna hold up and he's gonna win enough games and he's gonna have the expectations. And on top of like being a favorite,

that actually can work against you. And I have a comparison for that a little bit later here. But all three, or excuse me, all four of those quarterbacks were all around the same area here because they're just trying to create some kind of market to get people interested in, in placing a bet on it. Um, as of right now, I'd say all four are still alive, even with Milro's loss at Vandy, Beck's loss, Dylan Gabriel could be the favorite perhaps after this week, yours missed time,

but he's going to be back in the game against Oklahoma. But Beck has the six best odds still. And I wonder if that's just because the beginning of the year, he was, he was on the list of people we need to pay attention to, um, because the reality is Beck, like what has he actually done? Like, how does he have the six best odds other than he's just kind of a leftover of bringing, being a preseason favor? What has he actually done? Like how does he have the six best odds other than he's just kind of a leftover of being a preseason favor?

It's kind of a marketing part of this where we're giving you the list, it makes sense. Like the Beck storyline makes sense. Pretty good last year, figured some things out. You know, coin toss, could have played, maybe win a national championship last year. Again, there's a lot of assumptions with all of this stuff after losing to Alabama in the SEC title game, but watching this year, I'm kind of like, is

he still on this list just because he was on the list in the preseason? Like, here's a perfect example. Will Howard is never mentioned the quarterback of Ohio state. He has never mentioned ever as like a Heisman guy. His stats are better than Carson Beck's pretty much across the board. Again, I think Carson Beck is a more complete quarterback. It's different, but stats, stats the same. Ohio state to this point has been better.

What if Ohio state puts it, we don't even have to put it on Oregon. They just beat Oregon. They're the number two team in the country. And it's like, yeah, but that's like the marketing part of it. There was never any Will Howard awareness momentum for him over the summer and into the early parts of the season. But if you stacked him up against Carson Beck, like I look at Beck's number going, well, why is he on there other than just kind of being left over a little bit? So I do think the marketing part of it is really important. Well, the favorite today is Ashon Gentey from Boise State, and he should be. I get it.

Five games in, he's got over a thousand yards, 16 touchdowns. He's 260 yards and six touchdowns better than Caleb Johnson from Iowa, who's terrific. Only Caleb and Hampton from UNC are over 700 yards. And granted it's Boise, so it might be a little bit harder for some of the casual voters to buy into that. over 700 yards and granted it's Boise. So it might be a little bit harder for some of the casual voters to buy into that. Um, but those are the numbers and they're absurd. And if he keeps up this pace in combination with what has now

been kind of a coin toss quarterback market, I think he has a real chance at this. And maybe there's some sympathetic, like do it for the little guys. As, as the group of five teams are questioning their future with every new piece of news and movement about where college football is headed, is there some kind of sympathy vote that happens for Gentie, where again, it feels almost insulting to say it,

it's a sympathy vote because the guy has been a stud. I mean, he's got a season worth of numbers and we're not even halfway through for him. But a moment, allow me a moment for Travis Hunter in Colorado. By the definition of the award right, the most out to be awarded to the most outstanding player in college football, why are we talking about anyone other than Travis Hunter? Okay, I want to talk about Charles Woodson again. I've teased this a little bit. Woodson was the best defensive back on a Michigan team that went 12 and O national the whole deal. All right. But the excitement around Woodson winning that year, which is going to be hard for

any defensive player was that he played offense too. Kinda. All right. Like he returned punts. He ran one back for touchdown. He only returned 33 punts a year. He had 11 catches, two touchdowns and they let him run it. They gave him three carries and he ran it in.

So he had three total offensive touchdowns on 11 catches and three carries. All right. So I don't know what his targets were. So let's say 14 touches on offense and he returned 33 points. That was kind of the clincher back then. It was a long time ago, kids, you're going to have to trust me. But, you know, Peyton Manning couldn't beat Florida. You know, if you look at Peyton Manning's, that was the year Manning was, if he was going to win it, that would have been the year. But Michigan has this incredible season.

And if Woodson doesn't play any offense, I bet you Peyton Manning still wins the Heisman. But it's like, no, wait, this guy's doing both things. You want to talk about's doing both things. You want to talk about somebody doing both things? Because before I go to the back to finish on the Travis Hunter part, like Jabril Peppers in the news, in 2016, they gave him 27 carries.

Remember they were lining up and doing those stupid formations? And it's not even like a Michigan thing. It just was gimmicky. Like let's, we have somebody here, especially with the Michigan history and Woodson, like let's get him some touches. Let's make this exciting. Like people are going to pay attention to this a little bit.

And ultimately like they gave him 27 carries and we talked about it. We talked about some stupid stuff. We tried to figure out who's going to win the Heisman, right? The Heisman moment thing, which I despise. Like, yeah, but did he have a Heisman moment? I don't know. He's the best player in college football that year. Yeah, but what was his moment? All right. So what he had to be on CBS. He had to be like, he had to be a last second touchdown.

It had to be something that just like that to me is cheating. That's that's cheating the award. It's about all the games. It's about whether or not you're better than all of these other players. And for Hunter to be playing both ways this well, I don't really care what Colorado's record is going to be. I don't know what it's going to be. Maybe we're in a peak moment here and the schedule is going to get tougher and they're

going to fall off again. Or maybe they've really figured some stuff out because it's looked like they've at least figured out how to not have their quarterback get blasted for three and a half hours. But if we're really looking at what the definition of the ward is and in comparison to who the favorites were, because I do think something's also happened here. Like when I was a kid and you looked at politicians, the vice president was always in the mix to run for president.

All right? And it was just understood because they were on the nation's radar. The party didn't have to reintroduce somebody and it just kind of made sense for the incumbent to just go, all right, well, this is gonna be the party selection. And granted, we have that on one side right now

in a different way, but I almost wonder with the Heisman back in the day, you had to have that same kind of awareness. You had to be on everybody's radar, but now being the favorite, and I think it's the same in politics, like if you're exposed for too long, if we know who you are for too long, then we turn on you.

I think that happened to Andrew Luck a little bit. It's like, well, if this guy's so good, how come the team isn't doing better? All right, well, I'll pick the team that's 10 and three because I didn't expect as much from him. So that's kind of baked into this entire equation. But if we're talking about most outstanding and somebody that isn't playing offense as a gimmick

is actually one of the best receivers in college football on top of being one of the best defensive backs. I don't think this should be that challenging in comparison again with where we're at halfway through the season with the group of QBs that were the favorites. Pick up a win this NFL game day on FanDuel, America's number one sportsbook right now. All customers get a profit boost every single NFL game day. That means you can pump up your gridiron winnings multiple times a week. FanDuel has tons of ways you can get in on the NFL action.

You can bet on money lines, player props, game day specials, and more. Okay, let's take a look at the Thursday board for Thursday Night Football. As of right now, the Niners on the road favor by three and a half at Seattle. The total on this one is 45 and a half. I like San Francisco.

I like to imagine the loss against Arizona. I think Seattle's coming back to earth a little bit here with this one, brutal loss for them. So sure, we could say both teams are super motivated the whole deal, the 12. I like San Francisco minus three and a half. One parlay they have up on there, the Anytime touchdowndown score.

So that would mean Mason and Walker, both running backs go, and then Debo, and then Metcalf, the number one receiver options as well. I just think those are really hard, although that one's paying out plus 16.55. If I want to come up with something here, go a little alt on this. I actually like Mason to score.

Just Mason overall to score, to try to get back on the right side of things because his fumble basically cost them the game against Arizona. So that is the lean San Francisco. Plus with super simple live betting, lightning fast bet settlement and instant withdrawals, FanDuel makes betting on the NFL easier than ever before.

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I still have some for you before we get to the interviews on today's pod. I wanna bring Sarudy in for this one because it's the annual nba.com GM survey, 50 questions ahead of the new season. John Schuman does this and it's a lot of fun. I just think it's awesome. And I also don't wanna be guilty of finding like three things that I think are dumb

and then being like, I can't believe how dumb this thing is because it isn't, it's really enjoyable and I hope they do this every single year. However, Shuren and I did feel like, I mean, we're not going to sit here and be like, great take GMs, that one's really good too and go through our 10 favorites that we completely agree with because I just don't think that's as interesting.

Let's at least try a couple that were like, huh, are you down with that? Yeah, we should also point out, I think we didn't do this enough last year, and people were like, dude, you think that actual GMs filled this out? I don't know what percentage of the GMs filled this out, probably low, but you know,

some pro-nauts is guiding sis. I think it's higher than people think, actually. I don't think it's as bad as the coach's poll. That's, you know what I mean? Right. So I don't think it's zero GMs. I, but I don't look, I don't think it's 30 maybe, you know, but if I had a guess, I'd say it's north of 15, but I can, I have, I have no idea. I've not asked anyone about it.

All right. We'll take 50%. We'll take 50%. I mean, most of it. Yeah. I like, I don't have many gripes with, you know, I have not asked anyone about it. All right. We'll take 50%. We'll take 50%. I mean, most of it, yeah, I like, I don't have many gripes with, you know, I'll leave my magic bias aside. Jalen Sugg's not being on some of the defensive rankings.

Did bug me a little bit, but it's not gonna ruin my day. So we'll move on. Glad we got that out of the way there. I mean, the point is, if you're asking 30 people 50 things, there's going to be a few, they're like, how did you land on that? So let's run through some of this stuff. If you could have any player moving forward to build a team around, because

my favorite one ever is that Carl Anthony Towns got it one year. I thought Wemba Nyama at 77% was low. Or is it just that hey, Jokic is the finish deal, Donch is just the finish deal, five to seven years with them, and maybe Wemba Nyama has somebody rolling to his legs twice in his career? I don't know. I still thought it was low to be 77%. Yeah. I'm not playing like the Wemby Zag game here, but. Oh, okay.

Let's hear it. No, I mean, there's a likelihood he's going to be great, but at some point there's a line between a guy who's already awesome and already an MVP candidate, like what, you know, what, how many definite years can you get out of him versus whatever the promise of what Wemby could eventually be, I mean, his team is rookie year, obviously he's got a better point guard this year. We'll see, but you know, how far away are they away from winning stuff? Probably decently far, I would suggest. So I, I don't think it's insane. Like obviously I would pick Wemby, but I, I,

I'm okay to hear an argument for somebody else. I actually SGA tied with Jokic for 10% and then Luca was, he had, it looks like he got one vote. I think I would take SGA over Jokic, just because I mean, everyone talks about Jokic, he might retire in like two years and just go back to Serbia, who knows? Yeah, except he probably won't.

But, you never know. Best center, I don't know, I just think that most guys just keep playing pro sports because it's kind of awesome and he's a super competitive guy. So I don't, like why you're dominating. You know how much fun it must be to just dominate other people, you know?

I don't know what's left for me. What could I do at this stage in my life where like you just dominate everybody. Yeah, but you don't love horses as much as he does. So just saying. No, but we did have a horse years and years ago. Not worth it. It's worn everybody right now.

No, it escaped all the time. Okay. Best, best center in the league. Uh, Yocic 87% of the vote. Um, I actually think that this should be higher. I don't, I don't know how anybody's voting for anybody else at this position. MB had 10% when Benyama had 3% Jokic had 93% of the vote last year. I don't, I don't know why it's only 87. This is the Embiid thing.

Uh, it's inexcusable. Like Jokic is at this point, I don't know how, I don't, I don't think you hate this term, but like, I don't think there's really an argument to be made. Like it's without a doubt to me that Jokic is just, but I like Embiid, rootin' for him this year, hope the sixers have a good year. We were just in Philly, Philly was awesome. I was talking about this with the my Uber driver. He also has doubts about Embiid and his health and the whole season. So it's not just people on Twitter. Like sometimes I think the Philly fans like they just get really aggressive on Twitter, but you met one in real life and he was very reasonable. I have

more of an issue just with the overall like question. This is one of the things I wrote down. The positional voting kind of feels pointless, right? Like, Luca, he was voted best point guard, and then he also, he probably is the best point guard. Like, okay, I wouldn't argue with that, but he also got votes at shooting guard and small forward. SGA was second at point, second in point guard and third in shooting guard.

Tatum was voted as the best small forward. I don't even think he plays small forward for the Celtics. Luca was second in small forward. Like I would argue that Jalen Brown is probably the small forward. I just think the positional thing, like I understand why they ask it, but really other than center,

I don't think we should even be asking what guys, what, who the best player at a certain position is because center is the only one where it's like kind of at least you can bet. Yeah, that guy's definitely a center. Although we had the argument about Duncan for a million years, whether or not he was a power forward or something.

Uh, I'm okay. I'm okay. You're right. But I wouldn't want to see them get rid of the vote. Okay. I think it's just up to us to run through everything that you just said and then make sense of it that way. But I saw like, I don't know, they were like Celtics fans being like,

look at this Tatum, you guys doubted him best, best small forward. It's like, yeah, but I would still take Luka over him. Like, what does this even mean? I don't know what that means. And Luka came in second in the small forward category. So I just think it's kind of a pointless exercise, but I'm glad you enjoyed it. Well, I don't know that it was, yeah,

it's kind of pointless, but I want it to remain pointless and on the radar. Best off season, OKC at 37%, Philly at 33%. I think Philly's was so remarkable because they had like one shot at it and it all worked out perfectly. Like everything you would hope could possibly happen. And it's just because the Clippers wouldn't give Paul George the extra year, then everything fell in place. Because if that doesn't happen, I have no idea what the sixers offseason looks like. It probably doesn't look like Paul George, but I also think with OKC being at 37%, the Knicks being at 33% of the vote that the- The Knicks are 20, Sixers are 7.

Right. OKC 37, Sixers 33% of the vote. The point that I was making is I feel like it's a little dismissive of the Knicks and this is the new part of it because the Bridges thing is so long ago now. And the fact that they got OG done and they bring in Kat who, you know, you know how I feel about it. I've got some Kat thoughts a little bit later on in this segment.

I think there's an argument to be made that that's still better than what the Thunder did. I think the Thunder thing is just the moves that they made specifically Caruso and in Hardenstein, like those are moves like, could you win a championship with those? I think, I think people, people, there's just like a, this whole list is basically, okay. See in Boston, like it feels like there's just a lot of okay. See in Boston love, which is fine. I don't disagree. I'm like, I think, uh, speaking of,

I think SGA is the number one pick pick to win the MVP from the GMs. So I don't disagree with that, but there's just a lot of OKC and Boston love here. So I don't know, that's how I feel about it. I just can't imagine resigning OG, trading for bridges, getting car on Anthony Towns. It's like, no, the team that had Hartenstein and Carusa did better than you did.

Yeah. Yeah, but could you make an argument? I mean, again, I'm not trying to play devil's advocate, but could you make an argument? I mean, again, I'm not trying to play devil's advocate, but like, could you make an argument that like that was the heart is seen specifically in the crew server, but he thinks he was on the best defender list. At least some, he got some votes. Like that can propel. Okay.

That was the, okay. See his biggest problem last year was what rebounding and they get the exact guy that they need. Like that is the best off season move because they could potentially win a championship. I think they're, maybe people were saying their level is higher because of what they did. I wouldn't argue with you like the guys, the totality of what the Knicks did like with the names and it is better,

but okay. See, I think might be in a better place to win a championship because of the things that they made. That's totally fine, but it's not really what the question is. That's fair, that's fair. Whenever I see the off-season thing,

I always feel like whatever the most recent stuff is. But then again, if it was most recent stuff, then the Knicks would have won it, because that cat trade happened in non-hot stove season. Or the cat trade hurt them. There you go, maybe some GMs are like, hmm. Yeah, because I don't. Yeah, DiVincenzo.

Who would have ever thought, I'd like the team that got DiVincenzo, not the team that got Carl Anthony Townsend. Maybe everybody's right. Rookie of the Year, Reid Shepard, runaway 50% of the vote. Risa Shay as the number one pick, only had 13% of the vote.

I thought that was even high. I was like, is there any chance that the number one pick in the draft is not gonna get any GM to vote to pick him for potential Rookie of the. Uh, who knows? SAR had 7%. What are you talking about? You're looking at, you're looking at what rookie will be the best player in five years.

The rookie of the year, he didn't get one vote. Oh, he didn't? I wrote that down. That was one of my points. That's not, two different ones. Okay. Great catch. Saruti. Cause you're right. Who will win? Reed has 50% of that vote. Zach Edie has, all right two different ones. Okay, great catch to Rudy, because you're right, who will win? Reid has 50% of that vote, Zach Eady has. All right, go ahead, give me the rest of it here, because now I'm better. For Rookie of the Year this year, Reid Shepard's won it 50, Eady's second with 30, Castle's 13, and then Holland, Saar, are the other two guys getting votes.

Risha Shea did not get a vote. Now there is another question of which rookie would be the best player in five years. Reed is still one kind of runaway, 43%, then Castle, then Risha Shea with 13%. So yeah, so I don't remember, I went back and looked at as many as I could of a number one pick who didn't even get one vote in the GM survey to win rookie of the year.

The only other time it happened was, I believe was Markel Foltz and he got hurt before the season. So it doesn't even really count. So this is like unprecedented. Okay, this is even better then. I'm so glad you found that because I guess I was looking at the other rookie category here in my notes for this one. Cause I was like, why is Bob Carrington

getting all this love? Yeah, right. So he didn't even, even Sar got one vote. Yep. And you can't vote for yourself. Remember, so it wasn't just Washington being like, all right, that's our guy. Yeah, we nailed it. We're incredible. Yeah, I looked at the one right below it, who'll be best rookie. So I moved my notes around. There's a lot of reach out, love. Yeah, people are all over it. Then's steal of the draft bub Carrington tied with Kevin Carter furfy Dalton connect Terrence Hannah jr. and

top itch all right so let's see I think the last one I know what I did I wrote down Reed Shepard's 50% and then I did the notes off of everybody else error paces 30 30% of the voters said that they were the most fun to watch on offense. And Carlisle get coach of the year stuff. Okay. This is the one that I want to finish on here. So let's double check here. Old guy on a plane notes. Best shooter. Do I have this right? Do you have this in front of you? I do. Who's the best pure shooter in the NBA? I'm just kidding. Steph Curry. Rick Carlisle's wet. Yeah. Rick Carlisle got two votes. Don't leave him open yet. Curry got 87% of the vote, also receiving votes,

Durant, Luke Kennard, Trey Murphy III, our boy Trey Murphy III, and Clay Thompson. So, yeah, I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Curry got 87% of the vote, also receiving votes, Durant, Luke Kennard, Trey Murphy III,

our boy Trey Murphy III, and Clay Thompson. What are we doing? Who's voting for anyone other than Steph? Like this is the one where, what the fuck are you doing? He's the best shooter ever and he's still awesome. So why are you trying, you're trying way too hard if you're not voting for Steph.

This should be 100%. Well, at least one vote would have to be for a non-Steph. Oh, that's right, yeah, yeah, right, yeah, yeah. But last year it was 90%, so it wasn't even universal from the other 29 teams last year either. So maybe you say the you know, did Something Golden State whoever filled out this survey for Golden State. They say hey, let's give our guy I thought I got clay a bone here. I don't know Trey Murphy's we all love Trey Murphy seems aggressive Luke Kennard

I Think he's played up like 82 games the last couple seasons total So I don't I don't know how you could put him in there Durant You know, I'm not gonna argue with Durant because he's a unicorn, but this goes back to, didn't you have a debate with SVP years ago about who the best shooter was? And he was making an argument that it wasn't Steph

because of percentages. Yeah. Okay, so this is really good. This plays imperfectly within my cat point. Okay, so you know how Cat just started saying, and by the way, you shouldn't be the first person to say it, although I guess if you're doing it, it's not bragging, but Kat was like, I'm the best shooting big man

in the history of the NBA. And the first time I heard it, I was like, well, that can't be true. And then you looked at some of the numbers, you'd be like, he's really tall, and he makes a ton of threes. Like, damn, it might be true. Like, is it actually true?

And then it kind of became kind of accepted. And then I thought about it even more. I go, you know what? I'm gonna keep fighting it, because it's just stupid. You're catching shoots out there and now you're the best shooting big ever. We're going to dismiss all the stuff Dirk did to get into his shot. And just because of some shooting percentages and catch and shoot threes, like Cat doesn't get into his stuff. Or you're gonna tell me that Kat, because of his three point shooting percentage,

should be looked at historically as a better all time big man shooter than Kevin Durant, when Durant's actually like dribbling into some of this stuff and pulling up in the mid range and everything else that goes with it. Like, I don't wanna talk percentages. And yet you're right, like 10 plus years ago, Van Pelt and I were having an argument about Curry.

And I was like, well, he's the best player or he's the best shooter in the, in the league. And he was like, well, how come Corver has a higher percentage? And I went, I don't want to talk about Kyle Corver's three point percentage. The job of the shots that they're asked to take where Curry has to get himself into his offense. He has to take it off the dribble. Sometimes it's off the catch.

Sometimes it's I'm gonna get to the elbow and then step back. Like the catalog of shots for Steph Curry are so much more diverse than what Kyle Corver's doing. Like you can't, you don't get to just win the argument because he's at 43% from three and say Curry at that time of the argument was like 37%. And I think it's the same thing that we should be doing whenever we hear Carl Anthony Towns is the best shooting big of all time. Like it's not

the same. It's completely dismissive of Dirk and Durant. I would agree. The, the cat thing of him just saying that it kind of reminds me of, you know how like there's like brands where it'd be like, Hey, you know, we're, we're the number one water park in America. It's like, what'd you, you know how there's brands where it'd be like, hey, we're the number one water park in America. It's like, you talk to five people who said you were number one, that's it, and you're just like, hey, we're number one now. Like the metrics for that are stupid.

There are shows, podcasts that do that, and it works, because people are just like, wait, is that, are you? Oh my God, and then it just becomes a thing. So I'm glad. Biggest show at the network. Biggest show, yeah. And it doesn't even mean anything, but you could say it

because you could find whatever metric you want. So for Kat to say that, it's like, okay, I know what you're saying and why you're saying it, but let's use some context clues here, guys. I remember one of the Sports Nation guys, I was like, how are things going? He's like, the fastest growing show in America. Zero to one.

What does that mean? What does it mean though? Like what's the overall rate? Well, we're the fastest growing show in America and it was great. It was beautiful strategy because you couldn't really say like in what category by what metric could you argue there's some math in there

where it's not completely misleading. So yeah, I think that's really important when you start seeing the next propaganda sites popping up a little bit more, Kat's gonna have some big nights. Like I'll never, no one could ever look at me seriously and convince me to be like, actually Kat's a better shooter than Kevin Durant.

He's just not. They're both tall, so congrats to them and their height. All right, good stuff. Looking forward to next year. Can't wait. Let's talk some baseball, postseason baseball in the hotel room locked in last night, East Coast time.

So it was a late one for a boy. I forgot what that was like. Kevin Millar from the MLB network joins us now. You can watch him with Ryan Dempster and Sierra Santos on the network's intentional talk throughout the postseason. And of course, MLB network has pre and postgame coverage for every game of the postseason. I was watching it last night after that Padres win against the Dodgers. Uh, this is a spicy series.

It's a lot of fun. I can't believe anybody hits Michael King to be honest with you. I mean, he has that one inning where you're like, how the hell did he end up giving up runs? But here we are at two and one. Uh, what, what most kind of resonated with you from last night's game? Yeah, it's funny. Michael King's been unbelievable, right? I think everybody gets to see him on the stage, but he reminded me last night's game. Yeah, it's funny, Michael King's been unbelievable, right? I think everybody gets to see him on the stage,

but he reminded me last night of Sean Manaya as far as that crossfire from the right side. Like, it's funny because my son was asking me like, why is he changing sides? And I was explaining to him like to go inside to a righty from a left side is very important. And then here comes King. And it's almost like he's the same way to lefties,

but filthy, obviously, slider, breaking ball, slur, whatever you want to call it to right handers. And really, you know, it's been awesome to watch him on this stage because there's a calmness about him with all of the side shows going on between the Dodgers and the Padres. You were able to see him just kind of like there's a calmness, him with all of the sideshows going on between the Dodgers and the Padres, you were able to see him just kind of like there's a calmness. You know, even when the home run happened, even when the grand slam happened, even when all the stuff's going on on that mound. Yeah, let's get into the Machado part of this because he's a brilliant player. Like I remember him coming up and then they stick him at third base. I go this is not even

his natural position. Now I think he's playing the best defensive third base of anybody in all of baseball when he first comes up. But he got into a lot of people and I would say a lot of it was all on him. A lot of it was his fault. The Dodgers Padres thing is its own self. But you know, I thought it was weird that Flaherty after giving up runs would go at him like that. But then I you know, you guys, you want to talk about long memories, baseball players. So I don't know if there's something else that's left over. I don't know

maybe if it's good for the Padres who feel like they're sticking up for themselves against the Big Brother. So I don't know if it's about like if if it were younger Machado I would just be like dude that's on him. I don't know if there's more to this now. How do you see it? Yeah I think that some guys like to play that role. You know you you're looking at Jesse Winkler and, you know, and with the Mets. We've had him on the show many times. Good dude, right? Nelson, he's like the villain. He's slamming his helmet in Milwaukee. He's I mean, obviously that homerun hit yesterday. You're like, it almost left the stadium.

You can watch it as long as you want. But I think some some dudes, that's their role. Machado is a great player, dude, like a great defender, behind the scenes, teammates like him. Perceived at times as like maybe it started with the bag at first base, when he kind of stepped on the first baseman's foot. That stuff happens. I played first base many years. Many guys would go ahead and cleave me by accident, whether it's intentional. It doesn't matter at that time time it happened. So we had the incidents where he threw the bat and Baltimore and all that stuff, but you grow in this

game. I think this mature Machado is smart. I think his base running last night started that entire rally for the Padres. No one looks at the intangibles in this game. And there's so many things that win baseball games besides the home run and the pitcher striking out 12. But like that base running play that he made as he took off from first base, Freddie Freeman makes a nice play, goes to throw to second base and he leans inside. That's the kind of stuff that wins ball games. And now we have wheels are going around the bus and boom, boom, boom, boom. And they score whatever it was at that moment. That's winning baseball. So I believe Manny Machado is a winner.

I believe that the sideshow stuff, I didn't like the way he tossed the ball into the dugout. I don't know all the stuff. I know in the sixth inning, you know, the game before game two that there was a ball they were getting ready to throw out. And he kind of threw it in there towards Dave Roberts and it hit, you know, a little bit firm, right?

We've seen all on Twitter and all the stuff. So that kind of stuff can get under your skin but you know Manny played for the Dodgers organization they know Manny and I think behind the scenes good dude good leader and you know as long as he's taking care of the boys with that 300 million. Yeah I didn't know what to make of the throw because it's him and I go well he probably meant to do. But I was just so surprised the way Flaherty had talked to him that, I mean, something's going on with pitchers now, man.

Like you can give up three, but you give up three runs and then strike out the guy to end the inning and you start acting like he insulted your family. Like this has been on like a massive hockey stick type graph of reaction from pitchers now that I don't ever remember seeing it like this. I think it's exciting I think we all love it they wrote on with screaming from the strike one strikeout you know the first

inning against the Royals and he's sticking his tongue out and like there's there's some differences going on on this stage right and Carlos Rodone is a really nice quiet dude with some emotions. But like his start, we're like, I'm like, wow, first inning strikeout boom. There's a lot of screaming. There's a lot of energy. You know, I remember it's just different. I think it's Matt's effort. Basically let's go. And that's why I was telling you about the calmness to King. Like he had a calmness about him that is this process. Even Walker Bueller, you saw him last night coming after that inning and slammed that stuff

and slammed the trash can and you know, there's some, I like to say red ass in there and you like that as a teammate because the game right now is awesome. The game is played at the highest level, the purity of baseball, there's no branding, we're talking about wins and losses. And it is first time we've seen all LDSs tied at 1-1 in the history of baseball. Like that's, that was like, wow. I mean, so the game's in a great place. And

yeah, there's some, there's some side shows, but I think we had side shows with the Yankee Red Sox. Like we had side shows, it was just stuff. All right, let's talk Mets Phillies because when you look at just Manai last night, I think the number was he had thrown one change up to a left-handed hitter after the All-Star break, right? And he's got Harper in the sixth and he starts him with that change.

And all I'm thinking about is like, you had to have thought I need to win this first pitch and now get him thinking about something like whatever his preparation was. And then to be comfortable that you're not gonna, you know, you're not gonna leave it up for a pitch that you're not throwing the lefties at all. This is kind of the fun part of it

because there can be these incredible regular season numbers from guys and then they get lit up and you can't expect it, and then there can be heroes from starters that you didn't have great expectations for. What did you see from him last night and the rest of the series? I just think that he has just adjusted so awesomely. He reminds me of Sid Fernandez back in the days

with the match, that crossfire, just the adjustments that this level allows you to make. People think, hey, you get to the big leagues, we're here, ha ha, we're here, okay, this is awesome. Look at us, we're rich and our jerseys are hanging and the spikes are polished, but to stay in the big leagues is hard. And Sean went through some transformation periods

where maybe the confidence and thinking, where am I at? And he had to change and then he started going back to video and going in the off season, eating better, getting your body in better shape, playing at the highest level in the world. Because now you look at him, he's established himself. By the way, the Phillies lineup and that Phillies team is probably the best team going in on paper

as the most complete team before these playoffs started. Like you're sitting over there going, okay, you got Nola, you got Wheeler, right? Like you're sitting over there going, okay, you got Nola, you got Wheeler, okay, Ranger Suarez, by the way, was the best pitcher in baseball for the first two months. Luis Hill with the eight, he's probably the other guy. So you're looking at the most complete team

that I would look at was that lineup and their chemistry and they were at the World Series and they went in and all this stuff, you're like, it's still here. Now you've got these Mets and then Sean Maniah is able to calm that team and shut that team out and down. Tremendous adjustments from him, tremendous work ethic behind the scenes that I don't think people understand that he's put in and what a great guy. Big Suarez evens it up today? I do. I think the series goes fine.

I really do. I know there's something special to Mets, but like we're so, if you notice every game that happens, right? The guardians come out and whoop the Tigers butt early on. Boom, three-one home run, Thomas. You're like, oh my God. Okay. Don't mess with the guardian Steven Bolger.

And all of a sudden, flip the script. We got Tara Skruvopich and the game goes all the way and we're like, oh my God, okay, don't mess with the guardians, Steven Bolch here and all of a sudden, flip the script, we got Tara Scrum a pitch and the game goes all the way, you know, shut out. And we're like, oh my goodness. And then the Tigers, when you're like, wow, I do believe in their bullpen chaos. I do believe that this is the one team that can win. And then the Mets, you know, they're run,

but the Phillies win and the Mets win. It's like, you go back and forth. If the Dodgers wouldn't won last night, it would have been like, oh my, here come the Dodgers, right? But now the Dodgers is like, cry me a river and the Dodgers staff and here we go. That's what's so fascinating with flashback. You believe the series goes game five. Okay. So let's talk a little guardians tigers here because you knew not that the Cleveland offense is off the charts, but you, you felt like with their backend, it's probably the most versatile, although San Diego with all their additions,

like we get an argument about like how deep, can you go three or four arms? Padres have shown that. Cleveland's shown it all season long. But then, you know, you look at the Tigers approach and you go, can they actually figure out a way to get through this series with Scoobal going like, I was looking at it, if game five in theory,

he'd have four days rest. So can the Tigers find a way to get through with this with one starter? They're not going to do that. I wouldn't imagine the Guardians bullpen again like they did yesterday. But it just is like how can the Tigers actually pull this off with maybe the best pitcher in baseball going twice? It's crazy, right? It truly is crazy. And we were talking about that this morning on the conference call. If there's a team right now, because this wasn't the way they played all year, you know, you couldn't. People think, oh, it's easy. Like, yeah, yeah. Okay. Bring this guy in. He's throwing a hundred. Bring Vesta. He's throwing a hundred. Bring this guy. Yeah, they will wear down.

You have to have starting pitchers in this league to win championships. So that's where I think they'll fall short at the end of the day. This has all been fun. Like AJ Hinch said, he loves the chaos. But my point is you have to have starting pitchers. You have to have dudes go deep because when you, especially when you get to a seven game series, the more I see you, and you're talking about three or four pitchers you lean on in the bullpen,

the more I see you, yeah. So you can't bring me in every night. You're going to eventually like game five and game six know that my outpitch is a slider. I've seen your slider. Instead of reading reports, I face you three times in a series. Advantage starts creeping towards the hitter. And so I think what we're seeing, it's been fascinating. Cleveland obviously, you know, solid club.

I don't think offensively they're tremendous, which is fine. Their strength is their bullpen has been awesome all year. Right? Clausay we've seen is just a man rock. He gave up a home run to Carpenter. So he doesn't give up using two hits to anybody in an inning. Um and he's been remarkable. Probably the best closing year

we've ever seen in baseball. You put him in top three with Mariano. Whoever the great years and Gagne and all the stuff, the great years but he's been devastated. So that's their strength but I mean it's kind of fun to watch. The the Tigers here like I you're gravitating to this holy cow. Who are they bringing in next? And it feels like they got 12 lefties and 12 rides that all throw a hundred miles an hour.

Yeah, I liked that you brought up the familiarity thing. Cause if we go back, you know, 2004, I was living in Boston. I grew up with it. I was obsessed with it. I was in the stadium, you know, for 2003, 2004. I was across the street at the baseball Tavern. Shout out to Rooney, you know, full of sorrow,

full of sorrow after a bunch of those nights. But I'll never forget, like Pedro going up against them, I hated because I could tell how familiar they were with him. Like they knew there might be that one inning where they can try to like wear him down a little bit. It wasn't like they were going to get seven on him, but maybe they get two or three and it changes the game. Or every other game it's like, hey Pedro's good for like seven scoreless and when they'll figure it out. But then I think on the other side, your lineup in 04 is the only lineup

that I felt like could put good at bats together against Moe. Just because you would say, it wasn't like you would think, but it just was a little bit more comfortable for you, especially with the imbalance schedule, all the games wasn't like hey we own this guy but there was a trade-off there where both number one weapons weren't as dominant because of that familiarity both lineups had with those guys. You're exactly right like I always said you know at some point some reporter came with me goes hey do you know that you and Edgar Martins have the highest average variety against Mariano?

Like it might've been three for freaking seven or something at that time, whatever it was. I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. Nobody wants to make a living off Mariano Rivera, but I agree with you what you said. The familiarity, that's a great word with my fake teeth that I have in, is that we've seen him and understand him. If he makes his pitches, we're out, but we know what he has.

He is throwing a hard cutter with impeccable command. And if Posada steps up under my hands and he misses middle, then we have a chance. If he sets up under Trot Nixon's hands and misses middle, then we have a chance. He missed to Billy Miller, and Billy Miller had great at bats was our nine hole hitter against Mariano Rivera.

So the matchups, our team, bat lineup, yeah. We didn't fear Mariano. We weren't gonna make a living on him because he was one of the all time greats if not the greatest and classiest dude you're ever gonna see, but he only had that one pitch. We needed him to make a mistake, but we've seen him and understood that.

Billy Miller, one of my favorite, I've never seen Billy Miller give up into the bat. Like an entire season. He's an unbelievable dude, bro. He's Billy Ballgame. He doesn't get enough credit. He won the baddie pound in 2003, hit him nice.

He got the home run off Mariano Rivera when we had the fight night, you know, when the A-Rod and Arroyo are very tech and then he got the hit. You know, everybody talks about Malara walks, Dave Roberts steals and then Billy ball getting his hit because it kind of gets like lost. Like how do we tie the game and then pop the home run off quantity in game four. But it's funny because you just kind of say quick and depends on what highlight you watch and sometimes just steal. You know, well, Malara got to walk to get to dave roberts to get this deal. Well, then wait a minute who tied the game

Billy ball game base it up the middle mariano try to kick save beauty note socks tied it up and here we go Yeah, you had to watch it every night to appreciate I wouldn't appreciate him unless he had been on my favorite team at that time and yes see him go like, oh, okay We've got a guy on second, but this is who I'm facing, I'm hitting this side of the plate, like this is the about we need. And then it's like, oh wait, bases are loaded,

this guy isn't that good, like I'm gonna try to tear into one. And you just, to see his adaptability based on what his approach needed to be every single time, it was nothing, you can't appreciate it unless you're watching it every single night for six months. So I've always, I actually saw him in your locker room after a game once and I was like talking to him about it.

And he was like looking at me being like, I can't believe you're this excited about it. I was like, yeah, I'm not really, I'm pretty young. I'm not, you know, I'm not really a super, super professional medium. I love you, Billy. So yeah, man, do you want to hang out? Do you want? Yeah. One beer please. Yeah, right, right. No, super professional media. I love you, Billy. So yeah, man, do you want to hang out? Do you want?

Yeah. One beer, please. Yeah, right, right. No, he was cool. He was cool about it. But no, I think there's something to be said about looking at some of these matchups and trying to figure stuff out.

I think that actually transitions well into Aaron Judge, right? Guy's gonna win MVP. We know how great he is. We know what the resume is. But you look at the batting average in this postseason now, MVP. We know how great he is. We know what the resume is, but you know, you look at the batting average in this postseason now, we're talking about just north of like 200 here. And do you,

do you see something where it becomes he's, he's not getting matchups that you would expect? I mean, maybe it's just the randomness of baseball, Kevin, which is certainly probably the number one thing here. But when you see him continue to struggle and how much they're going to lean on him in that lineup, is there anything that you notice? No, I really do think that it's like the old, you know, Braves days when they had this run and everybody wants Shipper Jones, but then like Keith Lockhart would step up and hit a big double. You have to understand going into a

series and it's just like if you and I were manager we're like before the year it was ending that we need to make we're not letting Aaron Judge beat us. Period end of story. Like sometimes you and I guarantee you said with two weeks left this season why would you let Aaron Judge get a pitch because he goes on these home run tears and then drives in five with two swings and you're like why are they pitching to him we always say the same thing why not let Wells beat you and I used to say that on deck when Poppy was hitting they would try to go with two swings and you're like, why are they pitching to him? We always say the same thing, why not let Wells beat you? And I used to say that on deck when Poppy was hitting. They would try to go, oh, too fast ball inside the Poppy

and he would go, whoo! And he kind of looked at me and throw the bat towards me. I'm like, why are they pitching? Why not let Malar and Trot Nixon beat him, right? And so the fascinating thing about baseball and Bryce Harper goes through it and he even said a few interviews, he said, hey, I can't anticipate them not pitching me.

I gotta be ready to hit, right? But we know that they're kinda pitching around Bryce Harper, and they're gonna kinda pitch around Aaron Judge. And I'm talking about the moments where you can, but you can't let him beat you. So I think the superstars at times get like a bad rap, like they're struggling or the games. No, dude, Aaron Judge is top three players in our game,

put them wherever you want. Oh, Tony, they're going to say last night, Oh, well is this moment too big? And Dave Roberts and Angela's questions. And you're like, what? It's been two games, two games. Like if you go one for seven, a couple of Ks, they think you're struggling the postseason. Mookie bets. He homers and it hits a rocket ship to right center like, oh, now he's out of it? Like he homered the night before, but he got robbed and Pro Farms was robbed him again, the same type play. But here we are as me to go, oh yeah,

Mookie Betts really struggling with postseason's left. And I get it, that's that's what they are. Here are the numbers. Players get offended. Hey dude, we're not jumping on you, but these are the numbers. Your last 12 games, you're hitting two for 43. But just watch the game. I don't think Aaron Judge, I think he's been a victim of awesome pitches and awesome pitching and they haven't made a mistake to him. And yeah, dude, he got knocked his last at bat.

That feels good. It was an infield hit kind of. And so he goes to sleep like, am I out of it? And that's kind of like Mookie Bats like, is he out of it? Yeah, I would say, I would feel that way. I homered off King, sat on a breaking ball, had a great bat, boom, pro part in, make a catch. And then I hit a ball right back up the middle, up the right center. So yeah, in my ability, that's all I need. Yeah, I really like that answer, Kevin, because it's the headline, you know, Mookie struggles and then he looks like he's completely locked in last night.

And that's what's supposed to happen with the great guys. Like, hey, just give it time. It's going to happen. The judge numbers are just bad, but I don't, I don't like just sitting there and be like, well, that guy's not good in the postseason. It's like, well, no, there has to be beyond just these are the numbers. Is there anything that you're seeing?

And I feel like sometimes when the other team is so dialed into their approach, like they're game planning you, how the guys, the pitchers get together and be like, hey, this is what we're gonna do. But then next time through we're gonna do this, you're always gonna make that bullpen decision. Everything's gonna be kind of revolving around where he's at.

You just wonder if you go, okay, I need to change the approach. Like I'm gonna get, I should get one, maybe two things to hit here. And do I have to just go for it? Do I have to like focus on, he's so good that he probably doesn't have to like look for a side of the plate, maybe the way.

I'm not trying to be inocular, but like, I always felt like with you, if somebody was gonna throw you middle in at home, it was like, you know, you'd be like, I'm not waiting around. This might be the best pitch I'm going to get. Right. Right. And you could tell when you were geared up for it. Like I could always tell when I was like, oh, he got exactly what he wanted.

Exactly. Like he was like, I can't believe this guy gave me this pitch this time. I wonder if Judge has to go look. And this is me just sitting at home watching it going, all right, this is what's happened at this point. Maybe I need to pick a spot here a little quicker. I don't know. Yeah, I think you're right. He's six foot seven, 300 pounds. So he doesn't really have to look. I think he touches the ball and he goes way further and crazy abnormal

stuff. Any hits for a high average, any hits for high power. He drove in 140 plus RBI's. I don't want him to beat me. I can live with everybody else beat me. So I just think that in these situations, on these big stages, the stars, I mean, they do, but like, you always see the kind of the role players step up and get that big knock, you know, like Castellanos is going to be the guy because Bryce Harper, they don't want to let beat him. If that makes sense, right? And then when, when let the, right? I mean, your stars kind of like are the guys. If you got multi-stars, that's different. Like Dodgers do. All right.

You think the Yankees still come out of the American league? I do. I do think the Yankees, in my opinion, are the best team. I think they got a tough match up tonight with Seth Lugo, hands down. But I think Clark Smith's going to match them pound for pound, and you're just looking for the big hit. I just don't want, I don't need to chas this coach and stuff. I don't need that.

I want the Yankees to play like judge and who's going to be the judge. some pound for pound, then you're just looking for the big hit. I just don't want, I don't need to Chaz's quotes and stuff. I don't need that. You know, I want the Yankees to play like judge and who they are, right? I don't need all the, hey, that they got lucky. Well, time out Chaz, you know they didn't. I mean, they're big league ballplayers, just like you are. All right, final thing.

I want to let you know that 20 years ago, I did ironically buy a long sleeve cowboy up shirt that I didn't wear, but I knew that I was like, when I break this out like 20 years later, this is gonna be a real conversation starter. So even when I bought it, I wasn't buying it just because I was so caught up in everything, because I was like, this is ugly as sin.

Long sleeve, black t-shirt, not great material, fire, I think all over the sleeves, but I never threw it away just because I was like, whenever you break this out later on in life, it's gonna be a nice go-to, but I never threw it away just because I was like, whenever you break this out later on in life, it's gonna be a nice go-to. And I'm still waiting. It's like a bottle of wine all because of you. Even though I knew at the time it wasn't like,

hey, you're not gonna wear this to the rack. You know it's terrible. But I always wanted to thank you for the inspiration to pull the trigger on that. Cause that was a big investment for me back then. Dude, that's awesome. I want to save ones with you. I'm like, I don't know if this goes up here to the northeast, but we're going to

ride. You guys could get away with it a little bit better than I could. If I had worn it seriously out with my buddies, like we see you're really into the, you like the team that much. I'd be like, well, all right. Are you really trying to pick up the checks in that shirt? It was hard enough in Boston back then, especially we didn't have any money. But my man, thank you so much for this. Enjoy the rest of the playoffs and I

appreciate the time to catch up. All right. I appreciate it, brother. It's awesome, man. Thank you. You're home for hockey. I love what we're doing this week on the pod. Hockey season gets started and who better to talk to than John Butcher-Gross, VSBN. What's up? Hi, Ryan. Great to see you. Ready to go. The long season begins. A lot of them are long, but this is a physical grind. Let's run through some top storylines here and again, take it wherever you want. Your instincts on this topic, far better than mine. Florida, all right, they win the Cup.

I got to see them in person and I remember like the first thing I thought of is they were beating on the Bruins. I'm like this team is deep. Like there's just so many different options, although the depth I don't think speaks to like it wasn't some roster digger like nobody's going to beat those guys. Where are they right now with some of the turnover and the likelihood of repeating? I think they're with some of the turnover and the likelihood of repeating?

I think they're the class of the league. I think they've become a destination franchise all of the sudden out of nowhere. Once I got Matthew Kachuck, I was listening to your, I think your last episode, you were talking about the life is good phenomenon. And if I had a life is good model right now, it's Paul Maurice.

Can you think of a more life is good guy than Paul Maurice? Just his age, his demeanor, the fact he was in the game for a hundred years. He got his first job in Hartford in his late 20s. And shout out, they're still, they're still racing cars through 84, right? It's unbelievable. They still drag race through interstate 84. It's lawlessness, Honda Acuras, Honda Preludes go in 110. It still happens. Good to know.

Yeah. But anyway, but Paul Murray, so he's in the game forever. He wins a cup last year, becomes this, you know, he becomes this performance art news conference dude out of nowhere. We see that during the postseason. We see it during the Amazon prime, you know, behind the scenes NHL series that's going on right now, where he is just this performance art bit that he's putting on. And he's just a great guy to talk to. And yeah, life is good. I see that logo. I see that t-shirt, that's your model, if you're going to come back and bring that thing back. It's Paul Maurice and the Panthers. Like I said, Carter Verhege signs last night, you know, eight year extension. He was going to be

a UFA. These guys want the rink is in Fort Lauderdale. They live down there now. They take golf carts and flip flops with coconut sun tan oil in the air. And it's just, it's amazing. It's the place to be right now. Okay, so Montour moving on, like despite, it doesn't even matter.

Like you don't even see it as a blip. Well, Montour again, he's a dude for sure but they become this defenseman reclamation destination you know they did it with Montour. Gustav Forslain got waived twice and traded he's now a number one defenseman in the league and he signs for 5.8 he's a nine million dollar. By the way can I interrupt how does that happen with Gustav how do you go from like this is the equivalent of somebody being waived in the NBA, and then it's like, you're not just making

a random All-Star team, you're considered one of the best small forwards in the league. Like how does that happen in your sport? Yeah, it just, you know, you have physical attributes, but for some people, it's a rough sport, it's a violent sport, so it's gonna take some guys probably a long time to get comfortable and then to be in the right spot to feel like someone's on your side.

But it doesn't make sense. Yeah, he was in Vancouver. Carolina is a good franchise. Again, they were deep. So maybe he wasn't going to get his chance. He just happened to come to a place where he got a chance and everything just works. And suddenly, like I said, they have a number one guy, Oliver Ekman Larson was like, he was gone. His career was over. He comes in, he wins a cup last year, goes

to Toronto. So they hope they're going to do it again this year with Adam Boquist. He's going to run their power play, bought out by Columbus. And now he runs the defending Stanley Cup champions power play. Again, they get to get hit in the face with a puck last night. So we'll see if he comes back. But yeah, so so far they've been able to find D-men and for some reason make them better. And that's what they hope again. They have eight of their top nine forwards still back and they just make up their fourth line,

whatever they want. And so I just think right now they haven't figured out that they're in a three, four window where I think they're the prohibited favorite to win again and certainly to come out of the East. Okay, so let's go to the other side. Edmonton story down three, I'll get it to a game seven.

I think it's better, although it might feel worse because you know, whatever, I don't really wanna debate that part of it, but we know the makeup. We know how talented the top line is. I think the dry side of injury, once we kind of knew more about it, kind of made sense to think like, how can this guy not be an impact when I think he's, you know, one of the best players in the league.

They've added a couple forwards that you like, I know Fogel's out, there's probably some questions still about the D depth past the top two guys there, but who are they now? And is maybe that not matter as much as where they're at mentally with what they've gone through. Yeah. Like I said, I think it's good in a lot of ways. I mean, for the league, if they lost game seven, it's kind of like the old red Sox Cubs curse.

So it was kind of good that I kept going and going and going and going. Cause once it's over, it's over. Right. And it is different. It is. It just is different. It's totally different. It is. For anybody like we're going, no, this is good. And you're like, oh, my pain, my annual renewal of pain is good for everybody. But then when they win, like it's just not the same in Boston anymore. It's just not the same.

No. So go ahead to your point. You were absolutely right. And so his search for his first cup and we'll continue and that's good. And so, yeah, they had a good July 1st. They went out and signed Jeff Skinner, a guy who could score 30, 35 goals playing with Dry Cytl.

Arvidsson is just the kind of guy they need, a veteran guy who can score 25 goals, had a good run with the Kings, and they brought back Henrique. So they were exposed for two young guys, Broberg and Holloway. The Blues come in and swoop them up. They decide not to match. So now they have this big salary that they can add at the deadline. They get pretty much out of whatever they want come deadline time. You know, Darnell nurse could come around and have a career year. He's that second pair D you talked about. It's possible.

Like Brett Kulak's a real player down there on the five, six pair. He's like a real NHL player. He's fine. But yeah, they're probably maybe like two guys. They think this Ty Emberson guy can be a guy. He played with Knobloch and their coach in Hartford and stuff. So they think that maybe he's a guy, but yeah, they have a big salary slot. They can go get at the deadline, anybody, just about anybody they want. It'll likely be a defenseman, but you never know. Like I said, nurse could pop this year and have an amazing year. These other guys, someone could step up. And so now they're looking for something else. But I just think with the hunger,

the maniacal situation of a McDavid going for his cup and the fact that dry sidle extended, it looks like McDavid will extend. So now that there's no, right, there's no drama around the organization, no angst. These guys enter, they're out, they're in now. So now that they're in and they bought in do an amazing rank as the Mercedes Benz of ranks. It's unbelievable facilities Obviously, it's dreadful to live there in the winter. I'm going I'm going this winter. I'm going to a game. Yeah. Yeah, just go man I'm it's it's like Hartford and Worcester on steroids. So you'll you know, you'll know you'll fit right in

You'll get the feel right away plenty of parking Plenty of parking not a lot of outdoors basketball. Okay Plenty of parking, not a lot of outdoors basketball. Okay, let me just ask you one molass McDavid thing, because I think the arc is a very familiar, repeatable arc for the NBA star. It's like, hey, this guy's really good, oh, he's so much fun, and his approval rating's through the roof,

and it's like, kind of like where Anthony Edwards has been, right, and if Anthony Edwards doesn't step up in the playoffs, Minnesota gets eliminated in the second round, it may have nothing to do with him, but it'll turn into like, Oh, do we like this guy that much? I think it happens predictably to so many NBA players and it's, they may not be any different. It just, we end up not liking them as much as we did in the beginning.

I don't know that that happens the same way with NHL players, but where are let's say neutral parties with McDavid? Yeah. I still think he's recognized as the best transformational figure of this whole new age of the NHL. As Crosby slowly ages out, McDavid will be the new guy that all the younger guys are pointing to as they enter the league. For the 25, 26, 27 years olds, it was Crosby. Now, as the 16, 17, 18 year olds eventually make the NHL, it's McDavid to play the game at that speed and that skill and that hockey sense. No one's ever done it before at that rate. Uh, he's done it without any international

stage which stinks. That's kind of one thing in other sports. If they're, if their team isn't good, they can always go for their country and win gold medals or World Cups or whatever the tournament is and whatever soccer tournament they have. They have 14 of them every year. I know. So he hasn't had that, right? He hasn't had an Olympics, hasn't had a World Cup. He's going to have four nations this February, which will be fun. So we'll see him out there with other fellow superstars. And then again, you'll see even more how much better he is than everybody else. So he hasn't really had that. So it's really just him stuck in the most northernest city in the northernmost city in the league in Edmonton, way up there in North in the mountain time zone. It's kind of all by himself trying to bring this franchise back. Now they've arrived where they're

at least, okay, now we're in the ring. They're in the octagon. They finally got in there last year. Now they're a legitimate threat. Now he becomes the star of the league. So I really do think the shine is on him. I think he's a somewhat likable figure, little awkward, very quiet, but I think he's coming out of it a little bit, starting to accept it.

And I think this would be a good, that's funny, that's actually, now you've asked that question. I'm kind of thinking as you asked me and as I'm talking, I think this will be a good four or five year window for him where he really does blow up in the entire sports world and in the hockey world he becomes the absolute king. As again, as Ovechkin ages out and breaks the record and then Crosby slowly ages out, he's going to run the sport now for the next five, seven years.

There's still some other teams I want to get to, but let's stay with a Vechkin there, what 41 goals shy of Gretzky's mark? Or 42, 41 to tie, 42 to break. Yeah. Are people for this or against it? Yeah. You know, that's a great way to ask it. I really haven't, I thought maybe there'd be more anti stuff, especially out of Canada, because they were always kind of an anti-Russian country when it came to these

Russians coming over and leading the league in scoring. That was their sport, man. And they don't want anybody... And the US wasn't much of a factor really. The US never had the really major, major, major superstar. They're good players, but no one like the Russians coming over, beret, and then Fedorov. And then it just seemed like they were villains. Like they were perfect villains for the nice Canadians, right? These guys were expressionless and they had these amazingly hot girlfriends and they love South Florida. And it was just not fair.

And they didn't know what was going on in that country. It was like no rules over there. Are they taking the Russian gas? Are they on steroids? Like, you know, all that stuff gets thrown the Russian players away. And so they're just the ultimate villain. But overall, I think that, you know, I that stuff gets thrown the Russian players away. And so they're just the ultimate villain. But overall, I think that, you know, I bet you can, is such a likable guy.

He's such a goofy character. He's you know, out of shape, overweight, 250 pounds, still just clapping one timers in on his bus stop, you know, power play one time where he stands up with his legs totally straight and then just winds up. So he just kind of likeable guy, you know, and now he's got a young family with kids and now he's gray and he's grayed early. And so it's just, he's just really kind of a, almost like a cartoon character here as he's about the break.

I think this is the biggest record breaker really since Aaron broke Ruth's record, like, you know, because of the characters involved and, and Gretzky being so likable and just an amazing ambassador. So yeah, I think overall and Wayne's support for it. So it's become like, I think a good only good news story for, you know, like I said, 75% of the hockey population. Yeah. I mean, you've got the LeBron scoring mark, but I don't know if that number is thought of as prestigious as it's certainly not the home

run number. And we're close enough in age that we just know how much we worship these home run numbers, but the home run numbers don't matter anymore because we went through an era where we were questioning everything. We may not have been questioning in the moment, but we're certainly questioning all of it now and it's ruined. It just has. It's not really the way.

In the basketball numbers, I don't know that anybody's ever cared about those, but those Gretzky numbers are like the holy grail of numbers. I remember like my gym coach in junior high explaining to us, hey, do you know that this means that Jim Rice would have to hit this many home runs? This is what Gretzky's doing.

Like you guys are in none of us, we all played basketball and no one skated, so we didn't really realize it. But I remember like that first moment of going, you're telling me somebody would have to hit 102 home runs to do the equivalent of what Gretzky's doing here now.

So I thought that there would be perhaps more pushback. I think it's funny though, in a Vechkin, like the nice part of it is nobody's, nobody's questioning because of him, right? We don't, we don't have that baseball question, uh, coming over to hockey just because the way he looks. Right. Yeah. Like, right. Cause I was there when Barry Bonds,

I was doing sports center the night Barry Bonds broke the record. It was, there was no celebration, no excitement about that at all. Right. It was like, the career mark. Yeah, the Aaron number. The career mark. Think about what you thought that moment could be and then what it was. Now, obviously 73, the first time through,

I think all of us were stopping everything we were doing, but you're totally right. Like there was nothing, it was such a bummer. It was this letdown and you know, for a million different reasons, or maybe just one. And basketball points, there are so many. It's like the Japanese stock market numbers, I remember back in the 90s, I used to say,

what does that even mean? What, it's like, it's up four million today. What does that even mean? I don't even, yeah, no, I hear you on that one. Keep going, yeah. And then, and no one knew the number, like no one knew Kareem's number. Like they didn't have that number memorized, right?

The three pointer, the three pointer kind of changes a little bit. So yeah, so the basketball, and again, I was a gigantic basketball fan, that those numbers never really meant very much to me. You know, when the guy was, oh, he's out the 10th highest, I didn't care Larry Bird was the 11th highest score of all time.

That's not why I would love Larry Bird or watch Larry Bird. But yeah, these other numbers, like 18 majors with Nicholas, that's a huge number. If someone approaches that one day, that'll be a big story, especially if Tiger would have. That would have been gigantic because it's Tiger and Nicholas. You know, the tennis major thing, remember that was the thing for a while. Now it's like- Everybody just sort of smashed through it at the same time. Yeah. They took, yeah, right. Once they passed Sampras, the three of them just kind of took turns and that's kind of lost. And maybe it will as it ages out and Djokovic has it for a long time, because he will have it for a very long time. It could be 50 years, 60 years

for him. But yeah, I think this number has some heft. You know, I think it will translate sport wise. Like Willie, get it this year. 42 is a lot. He just got it two years ago though. You can have one of those career years on the power play where you get 18 power play goals and suddenly you can get 42 goals. I think it's more likely next year, you know, early next year around Christmas time next year. But yeah, I'm kind of curious to see the meeting event, how much other sports cover it. We have added a lot of Washington games on our ESPN plus schedule in April, just in case he's chasing it.

So we do have a couple of those reserved. Um, and we may trade those out at the end if he doesn't have a great year, but, um, it's going to be a fun watch. And, uh, if he gets it, it would not be surprised if he gets it this year, but, um, I would think more next year. I still want to run through some teams here. Dallas is a popular pick. Um, you know, going into last year, sometimes you just come up with a reason evident and I thought was just better,

but part of it is, Oh, Dallas ran out of gas. You get a retirement. They moved on from a couple of different people. Uh, how real is Dallas's threat to everyone else? Yeah, they're a real threat. I think one reason why some casual hockey fans, they'll look at them as a threat because they have so many fins. I think fins are the most underrated under the radar country when it comes to hockey players. Like they know they're good, but they don't know how good they are and most underrated, under the radar country when it comes to hockey players. Like they know they're good, but they don't know how good they are.

And they're very, you know, they're very quiet. You know, they, you know, and they just have those kinds of guys, you know, Hintz and Hayskyn and like these guys are so good. But you know, again, that Canadian face of McKinnon or Crosby or McDavid, it just, it translates better, you know, for people. And so these guys get underappreciated. And even like the Panthers, this Anton Lundell guy, he'd be a first liner on 17 other teams. He's the Panthers third line center, you know?

And so they're kind of that interesting team like that. And then the other guys are young that are coming up a really good, you know, Johnston and Stan Cobin, Bork, Maverick Bork. You know, these are really good, you know, Johnston and, and Stankhoven, Bork Maverick Bork. You know, these are really good minor league players. And then the older guys, Ben Sagan, Pavelski just retired. So yeah, they have a really interesting mix of people of young prime and older guys with experience, a great coach and Peter DeBoer, a really good organization and they have the goalie in Ottinger kind of that CEO wears a suit to the news conference guy, Jake Ottinger, like an NFL quarterback vibe to him.

So they're the complete package and that's gonna be the biggest hurdle for McDavid out west. All right, let's talk Leafs. We know the history and who they're supposed to be. I mean, I just have a hard time just going like, oh, you can never pick them because of what's happened. Goaltending was an issue last year.

I think it was 23rd is the number that I found. So they're gonna go with the young guy. And then last year. I think it was 23rd is the number that I found. So they're going to go with the young guy. And then I noticed, I thought it was funny because again, I sat behind him in one of those playoff games, stole ours. The backup for the Panthers is their backup now. I would think a team wouldn't want to sign him as a backup because he's so enormous. It's tough to get around him when he's at the chair,

just maneuver. Like the trainers have to just watching them try to get around his body. So look, they think they've upgraded the goaltending position, but it's always been a question of toughness with this group. They bring in a new coach and now, you know, they're just supposed to be tougher. So how much are you buying into them changing their identity? Yeah, they're still top heavy, four guys who make over 10 million AAP. Again, hockey's a hard salary cap, no luxury tax. You can't cheat it. There's no, um, you know, NFL

reconfigure the salary bonus structure stuff. It is what it is. And once they signed John to ours, so that deal for some reason, it really hamstrung them from the goalie out. I think wall's already hurt. I don't think he's playing tonight. I think Stolhard is actually playing in their opener, believe it or not. Is he the biggest goalie in the NHL? He's enormous. I, I, when the goalie, when the goalie is cheated, they put the big old American league chess protectors inside their sweater. Remember the big giant thing that the, you know, John McSherry, those guys used to wear behind on plate. Um, he, yeah, they were,

but he's legitimately that big now that they have those rules with goaltending equipment. But yeah, for them, they're a regular season juggernaut. They play regular season hockey, and it doesn't translate to the postseason. And I don't see enough difference and changes. Yeah, they brought Chris Tenet. He'll block a shot with his face in the middle of February for fun and then laugh about it. So yeah, that's good.

But I mean, it's not Bobby Orr here. So I just, you know, it's going to be interesting to see what they do. And Mitch Marner is a UFA next summer. Will they try to package him at some point this season, especially if it doesn't go well, to a team that would maybe extend him to a gigantic number like Columbus say, and could, you know, Toronto begin to reconfigure that way? Because Columbus has some defensemen they would probably trade. And they even have a goalie in Merzlikin. So for some reason, if he plays great, maybe Toronto bets on him. So I just wonder if Toronto is in the middle of that with the Marner thing over their head,

and he's such a Toronto kid rock star there. That could play a part in their regular season a little bit. But again, massive talent, regular season juggernaut will kill all the bad teams, you know, easily. But then we don't know until the play, we don't want to see, we don't want to talk about them until the postseason and Craig Barube, who you mentioned the head coach, one of the toughest guys ever, the chief who will probably beat up every Maple leaf on the team now at age 59. And the players know that. And I think that's what they're thinking that he does have that presence,

that terrifying presence still to scare these guys into mental toughness that they need. Uh, that was really good, but I'm glad you brought up the roster construction stuff too, because of the hard cap. And it's always funny. Like I remember, cause I just love all the CBA stuff. Like when they finally got the hard cap and the players had to give back 25% of the salary, we're going back like 20 years only because I remember like talking

to St. Louis about it. It was like, so that extension that you signed, like 25% of it is just gone after you missed all that time too, right? So like 2004, 20 years ago. 20 years ago. And then you looked at what the Maple Leafs were spending free cap. And it was, it was like monstrous, like the gap. And then you're going, okay, to make it fair for everybody else. Like we're going to tell the maple leaves, you can spend this much less than you did.

Like if you, you remember it, but just if people are into that, the curiosity, if you look at like annual salary for the maple leafs were prior to the hard cap and everything, they were just spending and spending and spending, and it still didn't even matter. Um, but when you talk about the construction of the roster, I think it's really important because you get these special players and you roster, I think it's really important because you get these special players and you go, okay, well, this is what the market is. Like we got to lock it up.

Like you could look at Colorado and I love their four guys. I love their four guys, but they might have as bad of a drop off after their four to the rest of the guys that are getting ice time as anyone else in the league. So I don't want to be dismissive of them, but you know, it's kind of that Florida lesson last year, like you're going to have to find other guys on

other lines to step up beyond the stars. And I think Colorado, um, you can't fault them for tying up the special players, but it's a real balancing act trying to figure out these rosters, which I actually think makes it exciting how often you'll go through the off season transactions and see how willing GMs are to just move people around trying to find any depth in the puzzle pieces even if it just doesn't make any sense in the headline of the trade.

Right, yeah, you gotta have three lines for sure, almost four, you gotta have two sets of D for sure. So yeah, when you're building your roster in the NHL with the hard cap, you need to keep that in mind. And once you start signing a guy like, you know, McKinnon 13, 14, Rantenden is going to want 13, 14. They already have, you know, McCarr at nine and a half. You know, Florida doesn't have any of those guys. You know, their highest guy is 10. You know, the goalie is 10 and a half, but he's almost up. Barkov is at 10. Kachuk is, you know, in the nines. Verhege

just signed in the sevens. Sam Reinhart stayed in the eights. My guy. Could have got 12 in the open market. But again, they love it there. It's tax-free, so they get a little bit of a break. The weather's amazing. The quality of life is just outstanding. The girlfriends and wives love it. They're happy. It's just, I'm telling you, it's amazing. Once Kachuk went there and changed everything, it's like, if you probably, it's the number one draft pick city.

If you ask like an 18 year old, where do you want to get drafted or where a guy wants to play, it's definitely in the top three with Miami just down the road with the weather, the best weather in America from, you know, November 1st to April 1st to South Florida. It's not even close. And, and so they are in a year. It kind of reminds me of the 80s Celtics. Whenever they would bring someone in, there will always be like, remember Otis Bird song came in for like 14 games, I think in the eighties. And like, it was just like, if they went there, they just felt like I'm

going to be a better player. I'm happier. This team is going, it's cooking. It's the Celtics and the Panthers with no history like the Celtics had are kind of, they're that team now. People want to go there and they want to stay. And so it's going to be interesting to see, like I said, the window is huge. And I think they're the team that beat now for a good three to five years. All right. So a couple of last things here, because again, I don't know it well enough if I should bring up the Devils as a contender. I think you've got to bring up Boston somewhat, but it just feels like things are off there right now. Who else, who else?

And if it's any of those teams, feel free to take it wherever you need to. Yeah, I think the East is pretty open for Florida if they stay injury free, I really do. Are the Devils like Toronto? Are they going to be a regular season juggernaut? They're a little better from the goalie out. Markstrom's a real goalie. Who they got this year did not have a goalie last year. On defense, they have a lot of defense. Some of them are very

young, but they have a deep defense. And then the forwards, you know, again, they're Bratz, little guy, Hughes, a little guy. Mercer was young, Dawson Mercer, a key guy, Tino Meyer. So they have some, they have a lot of stuff there right now. They have a coach coming from Toronto with a lot to prove the weight of the world off his shoulders. I think the Devils are probably the scariest team in the East to Florida. The Rangers are certainly a team that can muck it up and they bullied the Devils the last two, three years. And so that's the thing about the Rangers, they might have that playoff edge still on New Jersey. So the Rangers wish to start, can he needs a contract? He just turned down 88 million for eight years. He turned out 11 million a year from the Rangers. So he's

a UFA next summer as well. So he'll probably end up getting 12, 12 and a half. And then do the Rangers have enough? They're an older team. And I just don't know come playoff time. But again, they can muck it up if they figure that out. And Chris Drury, who runs them, will try to figure that out. But they're, they're contract, they're a little messed up with the hard cap and trying to figure out how we have the best team. And you have to forecast young guys who are up in the future and can we add that guy at the deadline?

So it's a lot going on with the Rangers, which that's why I'm a little leery about thinking about them. But yeah, I don't see anybody in the East, even close to Florida right now that can beat them four out of seven times. Should I have mentioned Vancouver by now? I don't know. You know, I, you know, they lost the door up in Lynn home who they had in the, in the post season there, but they liked their team a lot.

It's a pretty bullish market. The goalie situation, Demko was hurt last year. You can't win without a goalie. So I'm not too sure on them. I kind of look at, I actually, what my question Ryan is, is Nashville better than Colorado? Cause you mentioned how top heavy Colorado is. That's what, that's what I'm trying to, I don't think so. Cause I think if you drafted just off those two teams, three of the first four guys are Colorado, McCarr, McKinnon and Rantanen, maybe Yossi goes two overall or three overall. So the other team, so if one team

has three of the four best players, they're probably better. But Nashville is really interesting team with a lot of gamers, a couple of young guys. You never know Mike pop very trots is just a winner. So I'd watch out for Nashville a little bit there in the central division. That's a good division with Dallas Nashville, Colorado. They might be the best big three, top three in the four divisions. TG After this, I can't tell if you're getting Panther season tickets or you're going to be on Fort Lauderdale Zillow. So it sounds like you're all in.

BD I already am a landowner in area code 34105. So I'm down there already. So yeah. I'm going to cross Alligator alley over there and in the Naples So yeah, I got my maybe my heart does go down there this time of year Hey, this was awesome, man And we'll we'll check in a couple times this season if you're cool with it. All right, it sounds good All right, John butcher grass. Peace, you know who he is You want details fine I drive a. 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you can possibly imagine. And best of all,

kids, I am liquid. So now you know what's possible. Let me tell you what's required. Our email address for this part of the show is lifeadvicerr at gmail.com. What is up to Steve and what is up to Kyle and also not cool Oregon who was hanging out but probably won't talk a ton. Here we go, builder macking on my girl. Hey gang, greetings from Dublin, Ireland. Age 39, height six foot, weight 183.

You guys weighing yourselves in day of or is everybody just way more locked into their weight lately? I'm not gonna argue. Player comp, I play like Woody Harrelson, looks like he should play in White Man Can't Jump. Noteworthy gym fitness stats, did a sub 18 minute 5K this year. Okay, we got it.

Four mildly visible abs. Tell you what. All right. It's a great icebreaker. What, four pack? If you could say, I had said, I was like, I have four apps. She's like, you've developed four apps? I was like, no, I have four apps.

Wow, this is gonna be way less cool. Hold on, let me clarify. No, she loved it. She loved it. Didn't work out. I recently moved into a new house with my girlfriend. As it's a new build, there are a number of outstanding issues we were finding, which we have been raising

to the builder's contractors this week. The foreman called over to our house, talked through some of the outstanding issues. The first time I was there alone, we talked through some of the items. To be honest, I don't actually care all that much about most of them, but my girlfriend does. So, you know, I played the role of concerned homeowner.

However, I asked him to come back again when my girlfriend was there later to discuss it with both of us. He's a young enough lad, I'd say mid 30s, seemed like a decent sort of chap, relatively handsome, nice eyes, quite enchanting. Okay, dude. But short and could add a few more pounds,

important for later. Anyway, he did come back later and he went through the items again, and both of us there and he answered our questions. However, he spent the entire time just staring at my girlfriend. He barely looked at me, even when I made a comment or asked a question.

And then at the end, when he was leaving, the following conversation happened. Foreman bashfully to my girlfriend, just so you know, that was me yesterday. Girlfriend, what? Foreman, on Sunday I was walking through the estate. You saw me. I was here on a site visit.

Oh, I did? Yeah, that was me. Sorry. It's hard to convey in text, but it was weirdly flirty and intimate, not by my girlfriend, I might add, it was kind of the fuddled throughout. Again, I was standing right there. So question of the pot is what the hell was this and what should I have done? Initially, I thought we had just read through my relative apathy about the house and decided my girlfriend was the one to

direct attention to, but it was weird and felt like he was into her. He's supposed to come again to my house tomorrow to check on some stuff when I'll be away. My girlfriend is there alone. Context, I'm not particularly threatened by the guy. I'm worried my girlfriend would do anything and my girlfriend is quite attractive. Shout out to you. Should I have called this guy out? Should I have laid this guy out? I'd say I have 20 pounds on him. Should I just ignore it and get the house subsorted? Advice needed, PS, I don't even like American sports

that much, but I like you guys. PS, oh, PPS, sorry if this is long. Don't worry about it. No, it's great. Yeah, it's fine. We're fine, okay. Kyle, let me start. The good news is he's got a new house and a desirable girlfriend. That's confirmed, right? Yeah. We're fine. Okay, Kyle. Let me start this one. The good news is he's got a new house

and a desirable girlfriend. That's confirmed, right? Yeah. You're winning, man. You're winning, man. Yeah, did you check out that sub 18, 5K time too? Don't forget that. Yeah.

I think it can be a little bit like feeling weird when there's another dude around who's got skills you don't have. And I think that might be playing into it a little bit. Like any walk of life, mechanic, get my oil change. Like that guy knows way more about this than me. And me and my girlfriend are just sitting in the two seat, or me and my wife are just sitting in the two seats.

Like, all right, well, you let me know when it's done. Something I maybe should be doing myself, but I'm not. And you're the guy. Electricians, whatever. So I think that could feed into it a little bit. This is a young, handsome guy who's working with his hands, probably gets looks a lot. And he was like, I'll look back. I don't know. I think laying out and you know, should I lay him out? Should I, you know, ream him out? Whatever the two options he said, I don't, I don't know. I don't think so. And also your girlfriend did

a great job of like, there was no like, oh yeah, that was you. Like this all worked out great as far as like her being like, yeah, I don't know what you're talking about, dude. You were like probably took a little blow to his ego. Like, yeah, I thought I saw you looking back at me. It's like, yeah, I don't know what you're talking about, guy. So, you know what, I think the contractors and people that work with their hands could be, you know, just a little rougher around the edges in general.

And I think they'd charge it to the game and just, you know, hope there's no more problems with the house. Yeah. I have like some weird intimate knowledge of situations like this. So as I mentioned, my wife, she does a lot of commercial real estate and she just genuinely knows more about like buildings

and houses and stuff than I do. My dad, I said this at the live show, I've said it multiple times. Yeah, but you know more about FIFA. I do know more about FIFA. I do know more about FIFA I don't know. Yes, so we all we all have our skills Exactly, um and hair trends. Yep. Yep, but dude, but what about shallow man that New Dillon trailer? Not interested in that movie not interested at all. I'm out of the biopic thing

We're doing too many biopics these days. I just whatever anyway. Anyway, we've digressed. But, and my dad is a plumbing, heating, air conditioning guy. So like, I, and I didn't get any of that. Like, my dad doesn't like sports. He likes fixing cars. I'm the exact opposite. Didn't get any of that. It's not genetic, but didn't get any of that rubbed off on me. So like, we've had people come over to the house,

different inspections, things like that. And like, I'll have to kind of defer to my wife or my dad. And it is a pretty emasculating feeling. Like, I don't feel good about it but it is what it is like she's the kind of the expert on the thing and if and you're in the situation where I'm not saying like she's like breaking down what the HVAC situation is but she clearly has some stuff about the house that she likes and doesn't like so it's a weird position for you to be in and I'm and like I've definitely

been judged before for this and I'm sure you got judged on this as well but I just I tell myself the same thing I feel like I'm winning at life right I've got I'm married got a kid things are as well, but I just, I tell myself the same thing. I feel like I'm winning at life, right? I've got, I'm married, got a kid, things are going pretty well. Like I may not know how to fix my toilet, but like I'm, I feel like I'm a decent member of society and I'm good at some other things. So you just gotta kind of look at it that way.

I think Kyle nailed it too. Dude, are we talking about this guy or you? What's going on right now? I'm just trying to open up about, I've had this, I've had this experience. You are. But I think Kyle said it the right thing like your wife didn't even remotely take the bait on this So that's a I mean not that you needed that sound

That's a great sign and that's probably a little bit emasculating for that guy as well So I think I think you clearly come out the winner here There's no point in like fighting this guy or like hitting his face or not using him for projects in the future But I get I get why you feel the way you feel. Well, yeah, Kyle, that was an awesome point. Just like, what's the problem here? But sometimes, like if your girlfriend is really attractive, some guys are just such fucking weirdos. Dogs. They can't. Right. Well, I didn't even know that he's being a dog. Like he might just be so weird.

He just, he can't handle, he's probably not talked to anybody this attractive for a really long time and he's losing all sense of self. Like he's just all the sensory overload. No, I'm serious. Like he's just the boundaries. Yeah, he doesn't, he doesn't like, oh my God, I'm actually a hot girl has to talk to me. I'm hot, you're hot, what's the problem here?

I think we all know what happens next, right? Right. So I gotta feel about Lowe's gift cards. Although I don't know, they're over in Dublin, so. Got an account. I don't know if you're over in Dublin, so. Got an account. I don't even know if they're over there. Yeah, I mean, you don't wanna beat him up. You're gonna get stuff done in the house here.

If it really bothers you, tell him to not come back when it's just your girlfriend, you know? And maybe you could even see it that way. You could say to him, be like, okay, next time you come back, I'm gonna make sure I'm here because I don't want you coming back just when my girlfriend's here.

And you saying that without saying anything else might be so weird that then he's kind of thrown off a little bit and then he's on the defensive, you know, find a way to make him mentally weaker than you. All right. Uh, is there a way, is there a way you could just shoulder them in the kitchen? Like, well, you like, what's the measurement over here? Oh, we've got to worry about this ductwork and you just give them one of those into the side by the kitchen island, we've got to worry about this ductwork. And you just give them one of those into the side

by the kitchen island, which people don't do anymore in normal society. Just a shiver. Does that make them think? Cause it's not like, did you assault me and be like, no, I'm sorry, you know, the kitchen island, this is why you're here. My shoulder's just so big.

Yeah, I can't just walk into people. Open up some more space. I've got 20 pounds on you. I think there, it sounds like you really wanna get the work done and it's sort of harmless, but you feel like it's disrespectful. But I would go with that I don't think he's like trying to be Craig Mack over here.

I think he's probably just not used to having an audience that is as attractive as your girlfriend. And that's probably what it is. But I would be on high alert for it. You know what I mean? But I also think it's worth saying to her, I don't really like that guy's deal and he's not gonna come over here when I'm not here.

And he's doing the work for you, so he has to adapt to that. He doesn't have to be there when you're not there. Yeah, maybe he's a little like father intent tolish. I'm redoing the sopranos and he's just like, you know, a lot of my day I'm going to people's houses. The husbands are home, you know, doing my work and you know, throwing my line out there.

And if it gets a little tug, cool. Maybe that's what he's doing. It's just like running along. Right, yeah, go ahead. Sorry, sorry. That guy loves ZD and long looks. That's what he likes doing. It's just like running along the- That guy, right, yeah, go ahead, sorry. It's like that guy loves ZD and long looks. That's what he likes, I don't know. Loves a long look, loves a long look. Now, as I said that, though,

remember a lot of contractors are gonna be there during normal working hours, so maybe our guy is not home, so that's not super, but if he had said he was gonna come back, why don't you just say, like, next time you come back and you have to meet with one of us, whether it's coming indoors, you're not coming in unless I'm here. And even if you don't even feel like it's worth that level of intimidation,

just fucking do it anyway. Cause now he's going to be receiving, Oh my God. Like he may not even be like, was I weird? Does the other guy win in that case? Cause then it's clearly in your head. Now it's in your head. Now he's like, I got this guy. Yeah. Is everything okay at home? What's going on? I think it's the opposite. and he's like, oh dude. Now he's like, I got this guy, yeah. Is everything okay at home? What's going on? I think it's the opposite. I think you just act like it didn't even happen and just act like this guy is beneath you

in whatever direction you have. I don't know, I went to a, when I first moved to LA, I went to a pretty fancy party and I was there with a girl that was really attractive and John Han looked at the two of us and was like, there's no fucking way these two are together. And guess what happened? John Han talked to her the rest of the night.

So my guy, John, am God. I love it. I still like him. Think about that. I still like him. I was like, whatever. If I see him at Sundance again, guess who's not going out to the smoky patio with him.

This guy. I didn't care. I didn't care. Cause I didn't really care about the situation, but there was a part of me that was like, it's like the Seinfeld episode where he wasn't dating the girl that he was just super offended

that the guy assumed that they weren't, or maybe that was Costanza. I don't know. That sounds like a Costanza situation. Okay, all right. I'm bad at golf. Please treat me like an adult. 41 years old, six foot, two 15, no major stats. Okay, all right. I'm bad at golf. Please treat me like an adult.

41 years old, six foot, 215, no major stats. I do crossfit four times a week. I'm just trying not to get a major injury. I started playing golf around age 18 and semi-regularly for about six years. I took a hiatus after getting married in 08, having a son in 14. Three years ago, I reached a place in my life

where I was ready to pick up the bag and commit to being decent at golf. I hit the range at least once a week and I take another trip once a week just to work on the short game. I took lessons two years ago. I feel like I have an understanding of what it takes to strike the ball well and putt effectively. The problem is that none of it's actually translated to a lower score.

In a word, I suck whenever I get to the course. My height and build, I should easily be driving the ball 230 yards, but when I step to the tee box, I'm lucky to get it 180 most of the time. Yeah, if you're 215 at six foot and you're hitting at 180, something is wrong. It's an equipment issue too, that seems like, like people walk out of their bed and hit 200 now.

Now I'm not disrespecting this guy, that just, something's wrong here. So really letting you have it. Well, it's true, like the equipment now, like I mean, he was hitting 300, it doesn't even matter anymore, but. Well, it's true. Like the equipment now, like, I mean, you said 300 doesn't even matter anymore, but. Well, great. I can strike my irons fairly well,

but never enough to make up for my horrible drives. By the time I get to the green, I'm already two strokes over. So putting feels kind of pointless. It's not all bad. I do par the occasional par three and short par four. My issues that every time I go out and play as a single, which is almost every time I get paired up with someone

that is significantly better than I am. Whenever this happens, these gentlemen often treat me as if I'm just learning to play the game of golf. I get a lot of well-meaning pep talks, tips and tricks from them while they are, you like the lessons from strangers, pal? I'm not even keeping my scores. I'm really just still counting how many balls I'm losing, which is hard to tell how far you drive

when the ball's like not in sight. So I don't really know how one of these days. I'm really just still counting how many balls I'm losing. It's hard to tell how far you drive when the ball's not in sight. So I just really know how it is these days. Yeah, what'd you shoot today, eight? Yeah. No, he says minus three. He's like, damn, yeah, I only lost three balls. Yeah.

Or that, yeah, yeah. Be like, I had a six today. And I don't know, sometimes those tips work. And then the last tip I got was like, just focus on one tip, because you got so many tips. The one that I've been using lately is, put the weight in the center of your feet and sit on an invisible bar stool.

I don't know, that's working. And I just try to think about one at a time. So I like the tips and I like feeling like, listen, these guys are way better at golf than me. I'm the glue guy in this foursome here. And that's just how it is. And no one's got a problem with that. And so it's nice to know early on that no one has a problem

that the fourth guy being me, you know, is just getting his steps in out there. That's just speaks to your heart though. That's what Kyle just did is he explained Kyle in just a very short story. Is that Kyle wants to be friends with people and he wants to be social and everybody starts at like a hundred with Kyle.

And then you're going to work your way down where I would say maybe people started a 40 now with me where it used to be zero and Kyle, everybody's a hundred. And then he's going to keep you at a hundred. Even if other people are like, let's knock this guy down another 10 points. And Kyle's going to be like, no, let's keep them at a hundred.

The fact that Kyle would golf with strangers and be like, do you have more tips for me? Speaks, speaks to where your heart is at. And it might be the most complimentary way I could ever describe you. This is all I'm not, this is none of this is, is, is to make fun. It's just, that's incredible. All right. So back to our email or whenever this happens, um, get a lot of well-meaning pep talks. That's when we said tips.

I love the tips. Consistently out driving, outscoring me. I'll almost get admonished for any lapse in etiquette while playing with them as if it's my first time in the course. By the time I get to the 18th hole, I'm usually so over it that I score even worse than I otherwise would have because I'm just so mentally exhausted. I'm normally a really chill guy

and I don't let the behavior of others dictate my behavior. But after four hours, it starts to wear me down. I know the only way to get better at golf is to play more rounds of golf. Therefore, I know I will have to deal with this more and more as I seek to achieve my goals of breaking 100, eventually breaking 90. All caps, or excuse me, bold type here.

What is the remedy to this? Should I let these guys know upfront that I am bad but I'm not interested in their coaching? Or would that just line me up for even more awkward time in the next four hours? Could you issue a PSA on your show telling guys on courses around the country to cut this out? I think that's the move.

Yeah, let's just do it. Golfers that are the move. Yeah. Let's just do it. Um, golfers that are good. Fuck off. You sucked it some point. You absolutely sucked. And so when you're playing with somebody new, it's doesn't always know where to park the cart for the next hole on the course. They've never fucking played before. Why don't you just relax a little bit? All right. Cause I'm, I'm, I've done that a ton of first time on a course course I get paired up as a single, but dude, where are you putting the cart? Well, sorry, I didn't discover this place, so I didn't map it all out.

I'm not a cartographer, so my apologies. I'll move the cart to the next spot over there. All right, there's always a couple of etiquette things that I know that I'll always kind of mess up when I'm at somebody. Like when I played RIV, I was so nervous that I was going to do something wrong the whole time, but they have caddies with you the entire time. So, you know, as long as your shirt's tucked in

and you're not an asshole and you tip well. So anyway, I was super nervous about that. And then it just took me like three holes to relax the whole time. But back to the golfer part of it, like it's great that you're good at golf, but you know that you sucked at some point. And some guys are great with bad golfers.

I'm not good, I'm not getting any better better but I play fast and I don't complain. I don't like nothing is worse than if you're a guy barely breaking 100. Play fast. Play bad fast at least. No one to pick the ball up. Yep. Yeah but also don't like start swearing and like losing your mind because you're playing bad when other guys are good. Like one of the guys that played it with Riv, I think was three over for the day. And it was just awesome to even watch. So I just try to appreciate it instead of being somebody that was mad about how bad I was doing.

So, I don't know, this PSA thing got derailed here a little bit. I feel for you a little, but it's just, it's so frustrating because it's like one time when like a guy's jacked and he's in the gym and you're starting out at the gym and it's super intimidating, like you see his muscles and you're like, a guy's awesome. Or somebody's starting a new sport when it's like a little guy that's fucking just right in the middle of a fairway and parring all day long.

And he's looking at you and you're bigger. Like I've seen the look and it's like, you may be bigger than me, but I'm better than you. I'm like better at golf. Yes. Better in life. I don't know. Like, do we want to, do we want to go inside and grab a pen and start taking a tally on everything here?

So I live longer. That's what I do. I know, but some of those guys that are good at golf and it's like their mall cop, like get back at the high school, high school bullying thing that I've noticed where it's like, okay, like just cause I might work out and you don't, and you're going to stare at me when you fucking dart at an eight iron. Yeah. I feel like you have the most,

like the car story you told the other day about the guy, like you, I have no run-ins with people typically. Like you have so many incidents where it's like, I just wonder, are you just looking at people the wrong way? Like, I don't know this golf thing you're talking about. I've never even experienced this. But like you have more stories like this where dudes are just like out of nowhere, just throwing shade at you.

And I hate to say it, but like, is this something you're doing? Like, are you, because you do have kind of this like, and I say this out of love, like you're a little bit off putting it first. Like you, you are but it's like you, you're, you're guarded. Like you're almost like, I don't want to smile at this person unless they smile first. So I wonder if you're just like, you're just, your life experience is just totally different than mine. Cause I don't, I don't know. I don't

have these things happening. That's a good question. I've asked it of myself a few times recently. But yeah, I look, not every golf outing has been like that. There's been some really good ones. Like, so you see the bag and I have nice shit. The guy was like, dude, that bag is sick. And I turned to him, I go, I suck.

And he's like, what? And I just said, yeah, I suck, let's go. You know, I'm a kid. That's how we open all of our, our five sums at Roosevelt. Cause there's, I don't know why for the walking course there, they have fives and we rarely do we have fives. And so there's always at least one or two guys and my buddy, uh, come that I usually go with, he's just, that's the Oprah. He's like, Hey, how you doing Patrick, Kyle, just so you guys know, we suck.

And everyone's like, Oh great. We suck too. And open. He's like, Hey, how you doing, Patrick? Kyle? Just so you guys know, we suck. And everyone's like, Oh, great. We suck too. And everybody the vibe is the vibe. It does take a load off. Yeah. Yeah. For this guy, I wonder, like, is there one golf course in town? It sounds like you've got a time. I wouldn't say you want to manipulate your time to like try to find, you know, but maybe it's a different course. If the time is good. You're

like, maybe, maybe I'll go play with the old who aren't driving it as far, but they're great with the irons like me. So maybe that's what it is. Maybe you just change the venue. It sounds like, because I think it's hard to change your golf time if you're like, this works for me. Everything in my life fits together here.

So maybe is there a worse course that, maybe you'll just see some different clientele that maybe more your speed and you'll just see some, some different clientele that maybe you're more your speed and you'll, uh, you know, uplift all boats, whatever that's like, do you have any friends that could you get a force them together? I only because like I'm with you, like I do not like golfing with people. I don't know. I'm okay, but I just, it bothers me. Uh, and I'm way more comfortable with just like the six or so guys that I know that

golf and I don't I rarely ever Get out of step out of that circle. I certainly don't go to a course by myself You might not have that option So this is just dumb but it's like the easiest solution is just like can you find a core group that can go? Semi-regularly even if it's like every couple of weeks and because like the likelihood if you're trying to get better you're gonna end up having to play with randoms like that's just How it is but like if you get the once every two, three weeks where you get to play with your buddies and it loosens up

and then you could actually really just concentrate on playing better, that'll help you. Yeah, I've been playing with a lot of not great guys and that's been great for me. So I'm wondering, are you like in one of those like certain parts of Florida just produce a bunch of awesome football players? Are you just like, is there, are you on the side of town

where everybody at three o'clock is awesome? I don't know. Maybe just try to venture out a little bit. Yeah. Look, I think I was a little harsh on that because not every experience that I've had, but I've had so many experiences like when I first started and then I first started all over again like a year and a half ago and you'd be out on the course and just be looking at these guys that would be like just dicks about you hitting it

into the, not even out of bounds, but just shanking your drive and then being over there. And as long as you play fast, man, and I've had a couple of guys go, hey, do you mind if I tell you something? Like some guys saw me top the ball and I was like, no, I'm totally fine with it. What?

And he's like, you're just pulling your head up. And it fixed the rest of the day. You know, I was with a different guy who was like- That's the go-to advice though. Yeah, it's a good one though. Stay down on the ball, stay down on it. You? And he's like, you're just pulling your head up and it fixed the rest of the day. You know, I was with a different guy who was like, stay down on the ball, stay down on it. You're picking your head up. I think golfers also can be incredibly supportive too on top of everything. True. That's what I found. Sometimes it's like, Oh, you know, you completely slice it right. You're like, you know, that'll play.

You might be a great contact. Yeah. Great contact, can I just ask before we move off this, probably end the segment, what's your gear situation like? Cause that could really be said, I know you said you got nice clubs, but like, I mean your actual outfit. Like if it's like, wow, that guy's got awesome golf stuff. Usually, and he has a bad drive, then even I'm like, this guy.

No, I'm a total poser. Like I'm playing in this golf tournament and I told them I was like- I fucking love good golf clothes though. Sue me, I don't care. No, no, I don a total poser. Like I'm playing in this golf tournament and I told them I love golf clothes though. I was like, no, no, I don't have the gears. All standard. Nothing, nothing ridiculous. It's just the bag. I have some nice stuff in there. I don't know what it was. It was going to do by bad stuff. No. All right. That'll do it for the. Pulling that out of my Range Rover. Yeah, I know. I think we get some Wilsons. over. Yeah, I know. I think we get some Wilson's.

Who'd you get those from? Like, oh, that's a minor. Yeah. Yeah. I love the state. I don't know. It's my go-to. All right. I don't think I did a good job on that. You guys are terrific. All right, thank you to Kyle. Thank you to Saruti Wargon as well. Check out our podcast YouTube page as well and subscribe. Ryan Russell Podcast, Rainier Spotify. Must be 21 and older. Present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus and present in DC gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com.

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