The Sevan Podcast - #47 - Royce Dunn

Episode Date: June 10, 2021

The Sevan Podcast EP 47 - ROYCE DUNNE & BRIAN FRIEND @ROYCEY_BOY @SEVANMATOSSIAN @BRIANFRIENDCROSSFIT The Sevan Podcast is sponsored by http://www.barbelljobs.com Follow us on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/therealsevanpodcast/ Sevan's Stuff: https://www.instagram.com/sevanmatossian/?hl=en https://app.sugarwod.com/marketplace/3-playing-brothers Support the show Partners: https://cahormones.com/ - CODE "SEVAN" FOR FREE CONSULTATION https://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK! https://asrx.com/collections/the-real... - OUR TSHIRTS ... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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See the PC Optimum app for details. On a 1 to 10 relative to our other guests, how, how prepared are you for Royce? Oh, I've been looking forward to talking to Royce. Oh, you think I should? Hi Royce. Hey guys. You were avoiding answering the question. Let me see. If I, if I ask you on a one to 10, how prepared you are, and then you say, I'm looking forward to talking to him.

What does that mean, Brian? I mean like to ten how prepared you are, and then you say I'm looking forward to talking to him, what does that mean, Brian? Does that mean like you're really prepared? Yeah, you could sit back for a little while on this one, I think. Oh, man. I regret asking you now. I regret asking. You just got into my head. No, you know I'll always follow your lead.

You're supposed to say I'm here to support you, Savon. Of course. Hi, Royce. Hey, how are you guys? Good. Thanks for doing this. What time is it where you're at? It's 8 a.m.

Oh, thanks. We are, and it's 8 a.m. on what day? Thursday. Thursday. So it's 3 p.m. here on Wednesday, and I think it's 5 o'clock where you're at, Brian? Correct. Are you near Melbourne? Where are you? What city are you in? I'm in Brisbane, which is pretty much on the center of the East Coast.

So Melbourne is like a three to four hour flight from here or like a two day drive like 20 hours 18 hours are you allowed out of your house more than two hours a day yeah so brisbane is where like open to business there's um like we do like a check-in on an app when you go to like a restaurant or something and um there are there's like like every business needs to have a COVID-safe plan, but we had our semi-final here, and we were allowed to have a full-capacity stadium. We've got football games on with full stadiums. You can travel as far as you want. It's all good.

Amazing. Well, good for you. Were you ever locked down? Were you ever told that you could only come out of your house two hours a day in the city you're in? Yeah, in the middle of 2020. It was like when the whole world was in lockdown. We were locked down as well.

And it wasn't too bad. We got out of that lockdown pretty quick. And our state has been doing pretty well. Like Melbourne, Victoria, the state that Melbourne's in, they just re-locked down this week. They're supposed to get out of lockdown on Saturday. They've been locking down like, it feels like once a month they've been doing a snap lockdown because they just keep getting clusters and not knowing where they're coming from. And yeah, the government's got a little bit, a couple of problems down there, I think.

Do people actually obey the lockdown in well they're very used to it in melbourne so i think they they have been and it's pretty steep fines if you're you're busted to my knowledge i don't think anyone's been fine it's more just the threat of it um but yeah everyone was pretty compliant here in our state as well no one was really mucking around too much yeah well in the city i'm in no i don't well i guess some people did because there was no traffic but i just ignored all that shit i just rolled i just didn't it just like i just rolled i got i got stuff to do i have parks and beaches to go to and dogs to walk and fresh air to breathe.

That's the whole point of America, right? I guess, yeah. Maybe you should come here and run for president. Yeah. It's a little different here because we're technically not a republic. We're not a republic at all. We're still a colony. So the freedom is not, the freedom doesn't,

it's not quite the same, you know, like there's no freedom of speech. And, you know, if we can't go somewhere, we can't go somewhere. We can't really pull the old constitution argument because it's not how it works here. So, but as a smaller country, it's just in general a bit tamer anyway.

So it wasn't too bad. You're a huge country. I don't think people realize how big you are with a relatively small population. Yeah, it's pretty crazy. So Australia is roughly 92%, 93% the size of the U.S., so it's almost identical to the U.S., but the population, I think, is maybe 25 mil max, so about the same as California. How much of the country is uninhabitable, really?

It depends who you ask. The native Australians, the Aborigines, inhabit all through everywhere. You name it, there's been someone living there. But settlement-wise, white Australia tends to be pretty much on the coasts there's there's not a lot going on in the middle it'd be mostly like um it'd be mostly like farmland and that kind of thing and um there's a lot of like similar i guess to america with the like reservations there's a lot of um land that's been given back to aboriginals it's like their their territory and um they they can kind of do whatever they want with it and kind of keep keep intrers out, I guess, for lack of a better word.

But they can't keep Coca-Cola out, but they can't keep Coca-Cola out. Yeah, you've seen the – what's that movie where they drop the bottle in Africa? Gods Must Be Crazy? Oh, yeah, wow. That movie was out before you were born. Holy cow, what a deep breath and depth of cultural knowledge you have. Brian, we're sending people to Mars. They could pump the water in from their ocean.

They could pump in 2 trillion gallons of water if they wanted to the center of their country, run it through a desalinization plant and make the world the biggest lake. Those are smart people in Australia. That whole place is inhabitable. I remember what they did with Dubai. That was the same. There's that photo of Dubai in one of the hotels where it's like 30 years ago it was literally a desert.

So it's plenty of space on earth for people, but it's not cost effective, so they just keep overpopulating the 10 locations on earth that are nice to live in and leave the rest of it untouched. Brian, where did you have Royce ranked? What was your guess for – boy, I'm really putting you on the hot seat nonstop today. What was your rank?

What did you predict he would place in the semifinals at the Torian Pro in Australia? Prior to seeing the programming, I had him about fifth or sixth. After I saw the programming, I bumped him up to second. Oh, very honest. If I was you, I would have just said second. That was very honest of you. And what did you see in the programming that made you think that bumped him up?

Well, I know that there are about half a dozen, maybe eight guys in Australia that on any given weekend could have taken those top three spots, or at least that's what I think is the case. And so when I saw the programming coming out, I put those eight guys on a sheet of paper and I looked at all the workouts and I gave a plus or a minus or a zero if I thought the workout was favorable or not. And in the case of Royce, I had five pluses, one minus and one neutral workout. And I just thought this program is awesome for him. I have some other like just intuitions based on following the guys on Instagram, but I just pumped them up. I said, you know, and I don't always like to make the obvious picks. Like that was one of those picks where when I put it out there, a lot of people said, oh, no, I got Kahn Porter. I got Baden Brown. I don't think Dunn's going to make it.

But just kind of knowing his skill set and what he excels at, I thought that it could be a really good weekend for him. Obviously it was. So thank you, Royce, for making me look good. And being that you're half your you're a descendant of Leonard Nimoy, you didn't let emotion get in the way of your judgment. You went based on his athletic performance and not your – like me, your love for the past and historical characters.

It's very interesting. Recently, more and more people have messaged me on Instagram when I put out the rankings, and they'll say, you're underrating this person, you're overrating that person. And I always respond and I'll say, well, let me know. What are some things that you see? Because you know that probably I know the person. And a lot of times they're like, I think he's good at this, I think he's good at this, but probably I'm just being emotional because I like the guy or know the guy. I'm just being emotional because I like the guy or know the guy. So I try to refrain from that. I do know some of the athletes better than others, but I always try to assess what I've seen from them when they have competed and what I know about their strengths and weaknesses. And then, like I said, reading like there's an Instagram is tough, but I think Royce, you can tell me what you think about this. I haven't really asked a lot of athletes about it, about this. I haven't really asked a lot of athletes about it, but I think that sometimes people who take a year or two away from competition, specifically individual competition,

that are still in the age range where they can be competitive and then come back to it. I know, Seven, you don't necessarily agree with this all the time, but that they can come back and do pretty well. And Royce wasn't necessarily taking time away from competing. He just focused more on team competition. Then, obviously, they had lockdown. I think he has a pretty good setup there at his house. I think he's following a pretty good program. And so I was expecting him to do well. And then, obviously, when I saw the program, I thought he could do really well.

So the question to you, Royce, is, and it's a good one, I've said that if people take time off from the sport, it's very difficult to come back. I believe that there's something in regards to the pain cave that once you leave it, you really, really don't want to go back. I don't think – God, this is going to really – this is stupid to say again because I already fought with Matt once, put a rip on our relationship. I don't believe Matt can take a year off and come back and win it. with Matt once, put a ripple on the relationship. I don't believe Matt can take a year off and come back and win it. But yours, there's a nuance or a different factor to you.

What Brian is saying is you took a year off from individual, but you stayed in the game. You stayed in team competition. And how did that affect you? Yeah, I think I'm probably inclined to agree with you, Siobhan. I think if you take a year off, not that it couldn't happen, but I think that would be like the hardest situation to come back from. As you say, it's like you're a rookie again in a way because you don't even know what the lay of the land is

as far as the athletes are from the last year. You haven't seen the performances. And it's just, you know, you've got to think, well, I also guess it depends on why you took the time off, overcoming that particular obstacle and bringing yourself, as you say, back into the cave. I think that's quite tough to do. And I had a kind of a micro version of that myself,

just like coming from the team back to individual. It was like I've forgotten what the pressure of individual is compared to team and team is for me at least it's mostly fun like yes you don't want to be the person who lets your team down so you feel a pressure to um to to you know be to perform in the moment but when you're actually just sitting there like in those in those stalls about to go out for an event and you realize that like it's all of your own back and, you know, if you look down out there, it's your fault. That's pretty daunting. So that was hard to come back from even just in that regard.

But at least I had been competing. I knew what the athletes were like and I knew what I could do with certain workouts and so i still felt very much um comfortable from that aspect but mentally um yeah that that pressure hit pretty hard what i thought i was used to but it was it was different you know like it was a harsh comeback i suppose and the exception to that might be women who take a to take well and i say that because women who take a year off to have a baby they seem to come back with some ferocity actually there's a good track record in crossfit um for the mums who come back like the next year which is crazy because if if i had even just like a minor

abdominal injury that mimics um but i feel like you need the whole next year just to like um you know retrain but but i think that just goes back to what i was saying about why you have the year off if it's something like that that's um you know obviously like it's without getting too deep into it there's no no one gets through a a you know a new child experience unscathed like just physically but also you know the stress of a new kid um even like your postpartum depression is far more common than people think like there's all kinds of battle scars you'll carry but it's it's generally a positive experience obviously like it's it's mostly something you want. And if it was accidental, you still obviously are grateful for the gift.

And so you're having this mostly positive year and you also can't wait to get back. Because if you could have a baby without having to be pregnant or take time off, who wouldn't want to wait their one, right? So you are you are trying to get back and so you're kind of hungry if your year off was because you're burning out you want a year off well then you go drag yourself back into it the next year and so it's maybe you know a lot harder to to convert that that year back but yeah the track record of the girls who come back from babies in this sport is pretty intense. I think it's almost a near-perfect record.

Ladies and gentlemen, post all your negative comments to Royce for comparing a minor abdominal injury to being pregnant. Although I think it's beautiful. I want to tiptoe out of the room. tiptoe out of the room. Maybe what if, what if you took a year off and you made yourself strap like a 25 pound vest to you for nine months? So you, you, you took to mimic being born. Maybe, maybe they're actually cheating. They're getting some sort of hormonal advantage and they've strapped for nine months of the, their workout. Cause I, you know, these women keep working out while they're pregnant and maybe, maybe it's just like just weight vest training that makes it so that they can come back so strong and then they have that one minor hiccup that's called the birthing process but whatever any any any

chump could do that yeah i think that i mean that's kind of like the point right is that there's no real there's no real comparison to it and it and it quite literally is uh training through adversity you know it's a it's a very i don I don't know, twisted definition of the train hard and fight easy. But I think the problem is, the kicker is that after the birth, there's a lot more. It doesn't actually get easier straight away. Like you actually, you do get like a dump of hormones. And I've had so many pregnant women from our gym tell me they felt so strong in their last trimester, like physically strong.

And then after the birth, they were like weak again because you're losing all these extra red blood cells. You're losing all these hormones. Your body is like just going through mass trauma. And so it's healing. And so, yeah, you actually come out far weaker in a weird way. And so that has a physical toll, but also has a mental toll as well where you feel obviously like a bit in tatters sleep schedules out of control all kinds of sleep

the sleep man yeah it's not just the lack of sleep it's the broken sleep that's what that's what breaks you and then you know there's there's so much people don't talk about it enough i guess or at least not publicly of course but it's up to the individual but there's so much more mental health stuff that goes on too with moms like mom guilt's a real thing you want you have you want to get back to your life but you feel guilty because you you should um be loving this this kid like more than anything else so what you know so there's all these conflicting emotions and it really it really can mess with people and um you know people don't i guess don't realize what that is like i mean i say i saw it with my wife and she's not even like an athlete like she wasn't rushing back to compete it was just simple things like i just want to sit down and watch a tv show

but i feel so guilty because i shouldn't want to watch a tv show more than i love my baby right but it's a really false equivalency like it's not a person who takes so much you know you need you need to like have had something um back for yourself and so it's um there's it's pretty pretty deep battle you know that that post post birth thing so i think that honestly i mean i've never experienced it obviously but i would have to say based on what i've seen the physical toll of birth is is the least of the worries it's that mental emotional it's the long journey after that you know that people that makes it all the more crazy that these girls are re-qualifying in that year going through all that like i guess in a weird way maybe it makes the competition side the easiest thing they've done that year perspective

everything right how many kids do you have we've got three now and how old are you i'm 30 wow you're you're like chasing down travis travis mayor mayor you're driving down you're you're chasing down travis mayor are you having more? Yeah, is he four now? Is Travis four? Yeah, I think so. I think he just had his fourth. Yeah. Are you going to have more? You never say never, but Laurie, my wife, has called it. She's like, no, that's it.

And how old is she? She's 34. Okay. Yeah, and another thing interesting is probably probably age plays a part in that too, because we, my wife and I waited till she was 39 and I was 43. And I could have never at, if I would have had a baby at your age at 30, you know, between 30 and 40 were my grinding years. I mean, I would just, I literally worked every second I was awake 365 days a year. And so then by the time my kids came, I was like tapped.

I was like, all right, I'm good. I'm good with working. I'll just spend all this time. Yeah, it's an impressive time. I mean, you're kind of in your peak manhoodness. Everything you built in the first 30 years now has to be put to work. How tall are you? so i still don't actually know i had on my license for the longest time 183 centimeters which is like maybe half an

inch over six foot um but then i've measured myself randomly since then and i've even come up with 185 at times um so i'm between somewhere between 83 and 85 centimeters 100 and 83 85 but um bang on six foot basically just over six foot and how much do you weigh um about 105 kilo at the moment so 231 232! Yeah, you look very thick in your photos. You look like a very large man. Well, it doesn't matter how tall you are, how much you weigh, or what you think. Brian will tell us. Brian, how tall is he and how much does he weigh?

Tell him so we can solve the mystery for him. If he hadn't said that, I would have guessed that he was 6'1", 220. So I would have been a little off on the weight. Yeah. A little heavier. How much will you weigh when you show up to the games?

I can only assume I'll be down to like 102, like 225. Doing a lot more endurance training. I mean, I've actually been running more and swimming more this year or like 2020 to 2021 than any other year. But I also started doing more weightlifting again than I have been in the last few years. And so I didn't think I'd put on weight, but we did some like testing, some force testing stuff.

And they always say weigh you before it. And yeah, I was like 105 106 so going up like yeah five to eight pounds is that are you are you doing more of that stuff because of the program you're following well literally that that testing day was just oh sorry the weightlifting you mean the weightlifting the running the swimming yeah the running the swimming is just it's just always been a weakness that i'm not an endurance athlete, and so I've just been slowly improving that across my career, I guess. Rich does do a lot of that, so it's more just making it a priority and getting it in each week rather than it's the first thing that you skip in a week, right?

When you're busy, well, at least I do, is the running and the rowing. Everyone loves to keep the Metcons and the weightlifting in. But then also, ironically, I hadn't been doing that much strength these last couple of years because it wasn't a weakness and I wanted to put more time and effort into the conditioning. But I started getting back into the Bergner strength stuff because it was more complexes and just working on the technique, right, just making sure I'm still moving well rather than just trying to add weight per se.

But, yeah, just the extra volume has added some mass. What's Rich's program called? Mayhem? So one of the elements of it is they do Mayhem Bergener strength. So they're working with Mike Bergener and Sage Bergener, and they write all the weightlifting program for all the Mayhem tracks. And then what is the other programming you do? It's Rich's programming, and what's it called? Is it like Mayhem Competitors, or what is it?

Yeah, so the actual program is called Mayhem Athlete, and then they have a bunch of tracks, and the one I follow is the What's Rich Doing? So literally Rich just texts what he's done that day to Jake, and Jake writes it into the software, and it publishes two weeks behind him so that they never have to worry about a lag. Whereas I think a fair few of the Mayhem athletes do Mayhem Compete,

which is where Jake and Rich actually sit down and program it. And often they will do the Mayhem Compete workout as their workout. So when you look at what Rich is doing, there's a lot of overlap just a couple weeks behind it. Don't you need to be doing – how long have you been following his programming? Since July of 2016. Okay. So for a long time.

So you're a happy, happy customer. You're getting results. You're like, I found my spot. Okay. a happy, happy customer. You're getting results. You're like, I found my spot. Okay, but if it's lagging two weeks behind and this is the training he's doing to prepare himself for the CrossFit Games, shouldn't you be getting it maybe two weeks ahead of time now?

Yeah, so around big events like regionals or the semifinals will change up a little bit. So obviously I've got a crew here as. We'll change that up a little bit. So obviously I've got a crew here as well at my gym that I'll train with, so we might improv some of the workouts heading into the semifinals. But then this year, for example, they had a track. They set up a temporary track for each of the semifinals, so you can go into the Mayhem, into the Sugarwood,

and choose Uncompeting at Torian Pro. And they've got all the workouts. Obviously you've got them from the Instagram, and they've got the efforts of the workout design to peak you into the week. Did the same thing for Mac, did the same thing for Granite. And then leading into the games, Jake just added me to a text thread with a few of the other qualifiers, and so they're sending us what Rich is doing.

It'll be Wednesday, your time. I'll get today what Rich did today. That's the day you guys just lived. And then so we're following that long and then I'll get over to the States as early as I can, probably early July. And I'll head up to Tennessee and we'll train up there and we'll kind of put together a bit of a camp. And so, yeah, prepping into the event, I'll be doing,

I'll be training day in and day out with them. And and just throughout the year the two weeks is never like the open for example like i i kind of don't especially this year with the top 10 thing i didn't really bother peaking for it i just followed what's rich doing until it was technically two weeks before the open and then just did the open and kind of um skipped ahead to the to the training after the open so it's not a big deal most of the year and then as i ahead to the training after the Open. So it's not a big deal most of the year. And then, as I said, around the big comps, there's procedures in place to help those of us who have qualified get the most success we can.

Look at me trying to find a hole in Rich's programming, and you're like, uh-uh. I get on a special text thread with Rich because I qualify for the Games. Sorry, Brian. Go ahead. Is there any difficulty or concern about being able to travel to the United States? Nothing's a lock, I guess, so I'm not trying to get too excited. But I've spoken to a lot of guys here in Australia, both Australians who have traveled to the U.S. for work

as well as a couple of U.S. citizens that come here for work. And apparently it's not that hard. You just, the Home Affairs, it's called Australia in Australia, the Home Affairs, you just kind of keep reapplying for an exemption. If they knock you back, you just reapply with more info until basically you wear them down, is what I've been told. People like that just keep reapplying. They eventually, if you make a big enough deal

and you have enough support documents, they'll just let you go. Is CrossFit helping with that? Do they send you something on gold parchment with Dave Castro's signature on it? Straight away, the day after, they send us the official letter with an invite, as well as obviously you get the online invite and all that kind of thing in the email to actually register. But they sent us a proper letter.

And then our Australian, New Zealand CrossFit HQ manager, his name is Ed, he wrote all the athletes a special letter signed by Rosa that talks about our status as an official, as a professional athlete in the sport of CrossFit and so on. So those are the first two documents. I tried the application last night with that. I should hear back from the Australian government either today or tomorrow. And if they knock me back then,

then I'll just, I'll request, I'll hear CrossFit to, you know, just keep upping the ante of, like, more supporting documents, more official stuff. Maybe, yeah, maybe like a letter from Dave if it needs to be they've been pretty good HQ been really good proactive like reaching out to us really early and filling us in a little bit about

what the procedure will be like in the states when I get there did a radio turn on behind you yeah I'm just at the gym and there must be someone getting a workout because they're cranking the... Would you mind opening the door and telling them kindly to shut the fuck up?

It's fine. Like the group of athletes that qualified, if you find some success in getting over here and you know that Bade or Jay or Cara or one of the girls is struggling, will you guys kind of work together and share what's worked to help try to get everyone over here? Yeah, definitely.

So me and Jay, for example, have already been chatting a bit. He's got a guy. I assume some of the athletes have some managers and stuff that are helping them with the application process. It's pretty straightforward, actually. When I did it myself, I thought I was going to get someone to help me, but it's actually pretty straightforward. If I get knocked back, I'll get some help for the reapplication

just to make sure I'm getting the best chance. But yeah, like for example, I got a little intel from an American I know who just got back to Australia. And the way it works in Australia is that when you get back here, you've got to do a two-week quarantine in a hotel. They take you from the airport to the hotel and um you can't leave your room for uh for 14 days and you have to pay 3 000 australian dollars so about a dollar fifty american um so three three thousand australian and um that you have

to pay that that's your price for leaving the country and coming back i guess and then um but someone who came from america she actually had a special case exemption and she didn't have to pay for it and they do that there are exemptions we don't we don't have to pay and um so i shared that with with ed to to tell all the australian athletes that we we very much should be applying for an exemption of like look we've just represented the country in sport. I know for a fact like the tennis players when they came for the Australian Open for example weren't paying for a quarantine. I mean they decided to do a different route where you do this like personal quarantine where you can like pay these companies and fly in a private

jet, you get to skip all the government stuff but it costs you like hundreds of thousands. But there are exemptions and precedent for athletes and people who are like representing the country that don't have to pay for this quarantine. So I'll definitely be trying to get the exemption there. And I told the other guys about it so they can try to do the same thing. So, yeah, we definitely like get it together. Isn't that amazing? You can pay money to get around it.

We have a border with Canada. Canada is the country to our north. And it is – the horror stories of Americans crossing the Canadian border are endless, right? Endless. I mean they harass the shit out of us coming into their country. And yet one time I flew on a private jet from Ohio to Toronto. And we landed. And I think we landed like at 6 o'clock at night.

And the customs had already stopped working. So we just got off the jet. No one stamped our passport. And we rolled into the country. And it just makes me realize that this whole thing is theatrics. It's all just... It's nauseating to me i i i'm not against people being rich i'm not against people paying people to get shit done but um but i am against

the fact i mean i've heard that before too in new zealand and australia that if you pay like 250 000 you can quarantine at home i'm'm like, geez, come on, man. Come on, come on, man. The first players did. But yeah, it's $250,000 or something grand. And these companies, like special companies, do it for you. They get you on a private jet. You're in your own bubble in the airport.

You never actually go into the public part. You get to land and go straight to like the hotel of your choice, like some five-star resort, whatever. It's, yeah, you you know it's the great it's the uh the one great um discrimination on earth is is classism right it trumps every other kind of phobia whatever you want to what you want to call it like racism sexism you know homophobia it's all come second to classism you got enough money you just you know rules for me but not for me, right? That's just how it goes in every aspect of life. And we know it to be true, right?

We see it. We know that billionaires live a different life to us, but we kind of just weirdly accept it because we all kind of wish we were the billionaire, right? Well, and I don't have a problem with that. I'm okay with my neighbor driving a much nicer car than me or finding a job or finding a job that makes more money than me, or I'm, I'm okay. I, I realized that first class seats are important because they help subsidize, they're really expensive on an airplane and they help subsidize the ticket costs for the rest of the airplane. And I, I bought a 1986 Mercedes SEL used for $3,000. And when that car came out on the market, it was the most expensive production car ever made at $106,000. But I bought one mint 20 years later. And there were great features in there. You know what I mean? It was the first car with

an airbag. So I mean, I like the fact that, um, rich people will buy all that stuff. It'll get innovated. Then once enough people have self parking cars, it trickles down. I'm cool with that, but there's something about not trusting the people to quarantine by themselves. But if you pay enough money, you all of a sudden become trustworthy. That's the part I don't like. i mean like like money shouldn't money shouldn't make you trustworthy or less trustworthy i i agree with you on principle and i and i agree with you with the um like the same same idea i don't i'm not like an eat the rich guy i don't care that people have money like it's everyone for the most part everyone works for

it right and i think i actually heard it put put really well about um Bezos for example about Amazon um someone was watching some talk show and the guy was like look I don't I don't begrudge Jeff Bezos for his first couple of billion because he created a product that we all use it like why is why is he rich because we all buy things from Amazon like we get what we want right he's like but I do begrudge him his second billion, which was like when you get so rich and powerful that you start to, you know, what's the word? Cheat the game, I guess.

So you start to rig the game where, you know, like everyone's in lockdown except Amazon. Amazon's allowed to, you know, keep making millions while we're all small businesses get put out of business. So that kind of thing, that comes later. Yeah. We got rich the first time through mostly legitimate means. And as you say, even the fact that

while these companies pay barely any tax, the small amount of tax they do pay is what pays for most things because our couple of hundred bucks a month in tax definitely doesn't get anything done. That's a good point. There's more intricacies to it than just, you know, rich people get good stuff. But at the same time, it's like, you know, it's not a perfect theory,

but it's the same thing with like adoptions, right? Like they make the costs of adoption so exorbitantly high in the hopes of just weeding out, you know, untoward people. And as you say, on principle, money doesn't make you trust whether you're a good person, but at least there's theoretically a bunch of people. It makes crime harder, right? Like if you go, if you're walking past a car and it was unlocked, it's a lot easier to rob, to steal the change out of the console than if it was locked, right? You can still pick the lock lock but maybe you keep walking because you can't be bothered right so the higher you raise the bar it does naturally weed out more undesirables of course there's no guarantee and you'd be naive

to think that just because i can afford a private quarantine doesn't mean i'm not gonna screw around and break all the rules but at least it's it's somewhere to start from right right right well said i i like how you threw a metaphor in there the the change in the cars but at least it's somewhere to start from, right? Right, right. Well said. I like how you threw a metaphor in there, the change in the cars. I love a good metaphor. Yeah, not from personal experience, obviously. Are you born and raised in Brisbane?

Yeah. And did you play sports as a kid? Yes, I played Australian football. It's cool. I don't know i played uh australian football it's called i don't know if you guys know it but it's very similar to like daily football and how old were you when you started that uh five or six like right when i started school and that is that the only sport you ever played you did you do gymnastics or soccer um like i did in school we did a bunch of different sports but that was the only sport you ever played? Did you do gymnastics or soccer? Like I did in school, we did a bunch of different sports, but that was the only sport I played properly.

And then Australia's got a pretty good swim and track and field program in school and high school. It's probably the only program that's pretty comparable to the States, I guess, like other sports. It's so funny. We had Jesse Williams training here for a while. He played for Alabama for four years. like other sports like it's so funny like you know um we're talking we had jesse williams training here for a while he played for alabama for four years um i don't know what the university is called alabama university i guess they he won like four championships with them and so he's a

superstar and we're talking about that and how like college coaches or even high school coaches can get paid in the hundreds of thousands of the millions in the states i mean in australia the football coach is just the pe teacher who's on you know 60 grand a year who just does it that's that's his unit cover for that week for that month so it's just very much under resourced compared to the states but swimming and track because australia does decent in the olympics at both those sports we'll see like a lot more resource and a lot more programs and the scouting infrastructure is a lot better. You'll get good swimmers picked up when they're like 10,

whereas it's not the same with other sports. Do you have brothers and sisters? Yeah, I've got one older brother, one younger brother, and a younger sister. Wow. Okay, so you're the third oldest. Second oldest. Oh, the sister. Say that again. Tell me who's who again.

Older brother, then me, and then a younger sister, and then a younger brother last. Yeah, doesn't that make you the third oldest? I mean, I guess semantically I don't know the difference. Second oldest or third oldest. Wait, Brian, he's got two younger than him. Yes. So he's the second oldest. No, he's got two younger than him.

Oh, second. Okay, right, right, right. Sorry. Right, right, right, right. I see what you're saying. Yeah, yeah, semantics. All right. I'll learn how to do it.

I'm a percentile. I'm a percentile now. Is. Yeah. Semantics. All right. I'll learn how to. Cookie percentile now. Is it, is it a, is it a competitive group? These four? Uh, not really.

No, my older brother is quite a bit older. He's, he's five years older than me. And then me and my two younger siblings are within a five year gap. So me and my little brother get on really well. Um, me and my sister got on great when we were kids because we were very close in

age. And, um, my little brother was, was a bit too young for me to like be competitive with like i was always like his older brother and uh and then me and my sister didn't really compete because um we just it's a different relationship brother and sister or at least for us it was um so no it was we were all pretty much like our own kind of game. Are you competitive? Funnily enough, I wouldn't have said yes, but obviously I am. And when it comes like I actually surprised myself in competition with how hard I go in workouts and the times I put up versus my training. Because in the moment, I'm just possessed to like want to beat people. Whereas like in training or in general, I definitely don't relate to that, that kind of mentality,

but it's a bit of a curse that just comes over me, I guess. What is the most discomfort, physical discomfort you felt in your life? Like have you, did you ever, i know you haven't given birth um what is do is it is it a crossfit workout i guess that's an easy easier answer because that's what like is it refreshing your head trying to think of any injuries i've had like really bad i'm pretty fortunate i've never really broken anything or any physical injury I've had hasn't been massively painful for whatever reason I ruptured all the ligaments in my ankle

actually at the 18 regionals but I kind of barely felt it as sad as it sounds I think honestly the most pain I've been in was probably a CrossFit workout sounds very sheltered doesn't it Brian you're perplexrian you're you're perplexed you're not buying it you know something that happened to me that you ruptured all your

ligaments in your ankle in 2018 regional that's the year you qualified and made the games yeah so on the box i don't think it's on camera but on the box step over workout as i was coming down um my ankle just rolled under. So, you know, 220 pounds plus two 70-pound dumbbells came down this ankle. And my ATFL completely ruptured, grade three tear. And my ankle rolled so hard that the most painful part was the bruising of my foot against the underside of my medial ankle bone like the the foot rolled so hard at the bones bruise and um that was the heart that was the most painful part that lasted the longest too but um my physio who's a friend of mine he he lied to me and told me it was a grade two tear and it was

still attached and you'll be all right and it's like you know do this rehab and don't run it for a couple of weeks and we'll be sweet by the games. And it was fine. And then after the games, he told me, like, yeah, no, it was completely ruptured. If you'd rolled your ankle again, you'd be needing, like, surgery. So because I didn't want you to think about that because then you probably would have. So that was – and there's nothing you can do anyway, right?

He's like, you couldn't get surgery on it. So I just told you it's a grade two for your own head but the rehab is exactly the same whether it was two or three so no ethical issue as far as like you know malpractice but it was just um try and keep me positive like oh yeah no it's still still a little bit attached you're okay um so yeah it was it was completely erupted how did you do with the games in 2018 uh i think like most rookies i got completely flattened it was it was an awesome experience and i loved it i look i remember after i won the total i was sitting there thinking like you know guys like noah olsen have been like at

the time in 18 i think it was his fifth trip maybe i like you know he's got this guy's been to the games five times he's a perennial top 10 like, and he's never won an event, and I have. So I was super, like, humbled and grateful for that, like to have made a mark. But then I pretty much languished in that bottom heat and had a couple of good finishes and, like, a couple of, you know, a heat win to feel awesome about the experience.

But, yeah, it was very much like like i think most rookies with a few notable exceptions you just it's the shock of the uh of the level of competition and also just the the unsureness right like i remember vividly the um the chaos workout was like it was such a cool idea and like i wish i wish now i'd enjoyed it more at the time of like how cool it was that we were doing an event where like you know the ultimate kind of crossfit um theory of a workout of like hey do this until i say stop and then i'll tell you what to do when we get there and i just went out really conservative i was just so scared like oh what if it's the 20 minute

workout what if i burn out like you know i've got to pace this out just trying not to hurt right just being a bit soft and i wish i'd kind of done what khan did which was he was he just went hard out he was like leading the pack for like halfway and he fell back a bit like he got he got pipped by a few people but still finished like pretty decent i think he was top 15 and so like that was better than i i came like fourth last in that workout because i just waited too long to make the move and so i yeah a bit a bit of that at the first in your first games right it's a bit unsure of like you know you don't want to try to pace every workout almost too much of like you don't want to hurt too much you want to you know finish strong but really i wish i'd gone in there with a bit more confidence and just attack the workouts and like just had to

go and see what what i was capable of someone you know who was also in the last heat a lot at that Games? Who? Josh Bridges. Oh. 2018 was the first year that I was told I couldn't do the behind the scenes anymore. Ironically, that was the beginning of the end for

CrossFit. Just a correlation. Yeah. That hurts, Brian. That hurts. crossfit just a correlation um yeah uh that hurts brian that hurts that hurts my buddy did you did you were you in heats with josh yeah yeah so i had a good time with josh and he's a good dude and yeah he was he was pretty broken that year i remember he was talking about it actually every time someone would ask him like hey i mean you're right like he's limping from like from the warm-up area and he would tell us about yeah it's the knee and this and that like he obviously got when he got all the surgeries after that game so he says like i'm just gonna get through this games and then go get these surgeries get all the stuff cleaned up and you know get back to it so it made me feel better even though i know he was like at like probably

50 capacity it was like oh yeah i'm in the same heat as josh bridges like they're not not total losers down here like we're all we're all get the same heat as Josh Bridges. Like there's not, not total losers down here. Like we're all, we're all get the rub shoulders with Josh at least. And, um, I beat him in that, in that snatch,

uh, bar muscle up workout. So that was like a, a cool moment of like, we're doing okay here. So it made me feel better. So grateful to Josh for, uh,

given, given the bottom heat, some hope and making us feel like we were still athletes. I think, I think the story goes he was deployed. This was early on in his career. And he was training overseas. And I think they wrestled a lot.

And the guys wrestled a lot in his deployment. And he was wrestling a guy, and something happened to his knee. And to this day, I don't think it's ever fully recovered. I think he's had a bunch of surgeries. But whenever I talk to him, I'll say something to him. I think I was just on the phone with him the other day too. I was on a three-way call with him and Dave and he said that basically he's avoiding super heavy stuff because his knee just can't take it anymore. And I think, I think he's really cut back on his

like ruck runs. I think that's something that a lot of the seals, like that's sort of their bread and butter for conditioning. And I think he's, I don't want to miss butter for conditioning and i think he's i don't want to misspeak but i think he's cut back on on those two running with really heavy stuff yeah that knee that knee is definitely screwed up he should take a golf or something uh the golf is well if you do if you do real got so in a real golf tournament you can't use a buggy you have to walk so you're going to walk 18 holes it's pretty it's pretty That's why all the golfers these days look like freaking baseball players. When they used to be like fat white guys smoking cigars. Now they're all like elite athletes.

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you in sunday morning uh sunday morning i can't remember if I was in second or third but I was at least in third I knew I was in the top three and which is I think a tough spot to be in, well it depends on your confidence level at sports but I think most people would agree

that it's tough to be in the spot with a day left versus like fighting for the spot, at least you're having a clear goal and um you know if you shoot for the stars kind of thing you miss at least you haven't had a go but if you're the one hold the ball and drop it it's a much worse feeling so the pressure is a bit higher and um so it was it was just yeah it was a pretty like emotional day i guess like it wasn't even you know super it sounds really deep but it was it was actually pretty pretty um just basic of like i was pretty stressed out like as i said it was a big um shock coming back from teamed individual of like it's all self-imposed stuff

right like ego stuff like oh if i don't qualify like i'm in my mind i'm supposed to be a good athlete if i don't qualify that i'm not a good athlete what does it say about me and you know or just all like you know your basic ego stuff and i was just getting a bit like man do i even like want this like what if i what if i do qualify i'm gonna start training for the crossfit games like this sucks i don't want to do this anymore and uh the breakdown kind of came from just like you know it was it was like the fourth day in a row because you know thursday i worked thursday morning and then we had check-in all night and stuff so like the fourth day in a row because, you know, Thursday, I worked Thursday morning and then we had check-in all night and stuff. So it was like the fourth day in a row that Laurie has like basically spent all day at home with these three kids, these three crazy kids. One of them is a newborn that like can't be put down or she cries.

And like while I'm off like, you know, competing and then all the months before that when it's like I'm just off in the shed, you know, basically like mucking around training. that when it's like i'm just off in the shed you know basically like mucking around training right like if i'm not going to qualify and make and like actually treat this professionally then all the all those last few months has really just been me mucking around like you know having a good time pretending to be an athlete while she's been doing the hard work so it was like i wanted this at one point and maybe like you know this weekend's going to warm me down a bit but if i don't like fulfill my potential or at least have a crack like even if i don't qualify i have to treat this seriously or it's or it is not worth like not honoring laurie's time and my kids time when i told them i couldn't play because i have to go train all that stuff so

it's like it just really has to be a conversion a conversion of the of the effort and uh and that kind of pulled me out of a little bit of like all right like i owe this to more than just myself and um and yeah it was pretty simple as simple as that it was like i was just having a moment of like yeah like everyone does in comp like you you know this sucks like why do we why do we sign up for this i hate this and then um like, yeah, but it's not about how you feel. I mean, if it was easy to do that, there'd be a lot more athletes, honestly. People think the hard part is the training and all that stuff, but the hard part is actually walking through all the self-doubt and also just not going to water at the moment when it counts.

Were you in the car by yourself? Did you talk this out with someone or did you talk it out with yourself? I was just in the car by myself. you talk this out with someone or you talked it out with yourself that was just in the car by myself just listening to some tunes listening to some country tunes some of those some of those songs that get emotional you know it was actually ironically the thought came to me i was listening to um i can't remember who sings it but it's called something to be proud of and it's like it's a pretty emotional song it's like like these lyrics about, you know, this guy getting his dad telling his life story. And like, you know, life is as simple, you can be as proud of your life as simple as putting food on the table for your family and stuff.

And it's like, just really like classic, like, you know, American country values. And which is pretty universal, right? And yeah, it just got me thinking about family. And I was thinking about the kids and how like they didn't want me to leave that like that sunday they didn't want me to go and jack was trying to ask if he could come with me and um yeah it just got me thinking about all that stuff and then yeah it was a bit of a yeah a bit of a mini breakdown of like i don't want to do this i should just go home right now like withdraw and just go home and hang out with the family but that's when i started thinking like no if you just quit now like an idiot then you then you just wasted their their last year or two

anyway so it's it's time to like pony up and let's go did the um and how many did the sorry the last part the clean and jerk was on saturday night right that's right did the way that that event ended weigh into your feelings at any point on Sunday morning? Because I'm guessing you were pretty bummed about that last bar. Why? How did it happen? I'll give you the run through. So, well, it's funny.

There's two parts to it, right? Because we knew and a lot of the athletes, a lot of the spectators, I think, knew as well. There was a tie break on the last bar with how quickly you cleaned it like the person who hits it the fastest gets the win but i also think quite a few people didn't realize that and so from their perspective you know three two one rotate i basically ran to this bar picked it up hit it hit a decent clean and then just completely thrown the jerk like really really obvious miss like just kind of what is this idiot doing like why did he rush that so much and miss it like what a loser and then i reattempted it but had nothing left and fouled it pretty miserably and it was like

people just like what is this guy doing like what did i just what i just watch but um what it was is it was a bit of a gamble with like the three boys had hit it already. I know them all personally and they're all better at jerking than me. So I figured if I take my time, I'll probably be the slowest anyway. So I'll just try and send it and just try and gamble on a win. So I missed the bar, but because I was the fastest person to hit the bar before it, it was the same placing. If I was the last person to hit the final clean jerk or the first person to hit the one before it, it still gave me fourth place.

So it was like nothing really lost. And I think it was a good moment for me, honestly, because while it would have been cool to get an event win on the event that everyone thought I should win, it was a good kind of humbling of like, look, you know what? That didn't go to plan. And I look like an idiot in front of everyone missing this bar by rushing it. But don't worry about that so much.

Like get out of your head. Like you're not here. Like the fans are awesome. Don't get me wrong. I'm not to sound ungrateful. Like I really love the support from people I know and people I don't know alike. But at the same time, you're not there.

You're not working out just to make fans happy and get a clap and look cool. Like we're here to do a job and get points and qualify for the next stage. So it kind of got me out of my head a little bit of like, yeah, look, stop worrying if you fail. Like if you fail, you fail, but you've got to give it a try. And so, yeah, it's easy to say I wish I'd gone back and hit the bar. But in a weird way, like I said to someone the other day, I was like, if I could do my time again, I'd do the exact same thing. I would just try and hit it.

Like actually pull myself together and try and hit it. Because, you know, you can't be scared of failure. You got to risk it sometimes. I was surprised that you decided to take your shirt off for that lift. Why? Is that slippery? Does it make the bar slippery? Why do you say that, Brian?

Just because you kept it on for every other bar. Yeah, a lot of people put their shirt back on for like a heavy lift because it stops the bar from slipping. But I personally never had that problem, at least not with the weights I can hit. My clean and jerk is probably not as heavy as it should be for what I can front squat and strict press. So if I had better technique, if I was like a pure weightlifter in my weight class, I should be able to clean and jerk like 190, 200, like 440 pounds kind of thing.

Like a lot of the guys in my weight class here in this country, I know a few of them, they can hit like 430. So at that weight, you know, maybe yes, I probably need the shirt on. guys in my weight class here in this country i know a few of them they can hit like 430 so at that weight you know maybe yes i probably need the shirt on but like for the weights i lift i've never had a slip so shirt on shirt off doesn't matter but i had my belt under my shirt so i was like gonna ditch the shirt so i could like access my belt easier and just i didn't want to waste any time i was all about this perfect transition to the bar and trying to win this tie break but you know the critical part about that is you have to lift the bar. So that didn't go well.

And Brian, he's twice as thick as the rest of the guys. He's got like a wider platform to rest on, and he's got some chest hair that the knurling can hold on to. He's good. Well, I've got to say. It's good observation, Brian. As little as I invest in motion when I make the rankings, when I'm sitting there watching and I'm obviously pulling for him because I'm like, man, Royce, first of all, I think he's a really good guy, although I haven't met him before.

I obviously want the guys I pick to do well. I was like, man, I wonder if he kept his shirt on, if he would have hit that lift. It's like maybe a silly thought, but that's what I was thinking. That's what I was thinking. Well, I think the bar felt good for me was the moment I put my hands on it and pulled off the ground, I realized that I grabbed the bar, like, with both my hands to the left, like, too far off center. And I kind of tried to adjust it on the jerk a little bit. And then it went up nice, but it was like,

I felt like the entire 335 pounds was on my left arm. And I immediately just crumbled and dropped it. And I was like, damn, if I was just in the center, I think I could have pulled off a fast clean and jerk. So it wasn't even the shirt. It was just the fact that when I ran over there, I just didn't grab it in the right spot, which is what happens when you rush.

So it was, like I said, one of those calculated risks that this time didn't pay off. It's interesting. On one hand, you made a rookie mistake by pulling the bar, but you made a veteran wrong hand placement, but you made a veteran advancement by not letting it get into your head. And it can give you confidence now going into the games knowing, hey, I can screw up an event and still win this shit.

Yeah, exactly. What do you think his competitors think about him, Brian, after seeing his performance? Like the other people who will be at the games? Yeah. Like what do you think the – is he on their radar? Does the winner of the Tory and pro get on people's radar is is the competition stiff enough in australia where he's like oh shit we got a fucking another guy who's going to try to break the top 10 this year uh i'm pretty curious about that actually

i mean obviously james newberry did make the top 10 in 2019 and there are you know there's a lot of people who think jay crouch is very good and has a lot of potential um so to hang with him and and end up beating him by the end of the weekend is great uh you know that thing that i said at the start with those like six to eight guys in australia that i feel like in any given weekend could be right up there um i think that it's such a tight community all there that they all kind of know that and know each other too. Um, but we haven't seen, I mean, just, just being honest outside of James doing that, we really haven't seen the guys from Australia in the top 10. So I'm pretty curious to see if that can happen. If I was a

competitor, the thing that scares me about Royce is that he's that big, obviously he's that strong, but he also is amazing at gymnastics. Like the three workouts that had the most gymnastics on the weekend were all top three finishes, I think.'m i've actually been you know one of the things i wanted to ask you was what like what how are you so good at ring muscle-ups chest-to-bar pull-ups and hanging with these small guys because a lot of big guys struggle with that yeah i i honestly don't know i just i although pulling gymnastics has always been good, like fine for me, like toes to bar, bar muscle-ups, chest to bars are all some of my better movements. The pressing gymnastics is where the size –

I definitely feel like how heavy I am. And I've got a pretty long reach. Like I would call myself naturally a better squatter than I am a deadlifter, for example. But my deadlift is actually quite high because i got pretty long arms like austin maliolo style you know paula varas bar right so um it kind of works for me great with uh with those kinds of mechanics but the the long arms and the and the heavy weight make like handstand push-ups like very very difficult they're probably um i don't know if it's the

it's the worst in the field but they're probably up there Bukowski for example has better handstands than me, we're roughly the same size but I think just limb length wise he's got a better ratio of arm to body plus he's got better endurance than me I think just from his sporting background and the kind of athlete he is But he won't hang with you on the upper

body pulling stuff, maybe legless rope climbs but chest to bar pullbar pull-ups, I think you have an advantage, bar muscles, ring muscle-ups. I hope so, yeah. I would think so. I would certainly bet on myself, depending on the workout, in that regard against Brent. And vice versa, in other workouts, he has the advantage.

So, yeah, I think it's just the pulling gymnastics do very well. The pressing gymnastics still need work. But like anything, at the end of the day, I'm just probably never going to beat a Jay Crouch on a handstand, depending on how many handstands there are, on a handstand workout. But just like Jay is probably never going to out-clean and jerk me. And the time it would take Jay to beat me, the time and effort it would take him to train to beat me

in a clean and jerk would cost him way too much elsewhere. And the time it would take him to train to beat me in the clean joke would cost him way too much elsewhere and the time it would take me to get that good at handstands would cost me elsewhere but you've just got to make sure that the things you suck at aren't so bad that you can't come back from it. People don't want to admit this and I guess to certain athletes it's not true but of course there is luck in the programming like you'd be naive to think there isn't and you know certain athletes like your tears and your mats seem to be immune from that because there's really nothing they can't do at least very well

if not win but I think for most of the of the athletes in the middle programming plays a bit of luck and you know i looked at the that one workout from the mid-atlantic challenge that was um 10 rounds of one legless row climb four strict handstand push-ups six heavy dumbbell snatch 100 pounds like that's my dream workout if there has to be a handstand push-up workout that's that's me because anyone well anyone most of the people at the games could do four and broke it for 10 rounds that's not hard the legless rope climb i think is much more of a factor than the four handstands which is good for me and the dumbbell is heavy as crap so that's like you know no one thinks that in the

first two rounds until you're like six rounds in that dumbbell is very heavy so that's the perfect workout for me for a handstand workout right that's the handstand push-ups done for the weekend. And it was a workout that I could probably top five. So it's like there's a bit of luck in that, right? Versus if the programming was Mary from the games, I would have probably been right there back with Brent in the back of the heat, just dying slowly, being like, crap, I wish I was smaller. Because what can you do, right?

It's too late. It's too late. You're there and you weigh 220 pounds. dying slowly being like crap i wish i was smaller because what can you do right like you just it's too late it's too late you're there and you weigh 220 pounds well you're the second big guy who's told us that that handstand push-up workout is favorable jason hopper said the same thing he's like if there were big sets of strict handstand push-ups that would have been different before i could do and seven i think we got to ask him since we asked what competitors might think about him what do you think about hopper Have you watched any of his stuff? I have to admit that I haven't watched virtually any of the Mac. But whenever I see,

I mean, I guess it's a bit of a cognitive bias just from CrossFit's origin. I think this is true of most of the Aussies. And back to your question, Zivane, about what the competitors think about the Aussies. I think there is a natural tendency to look at the US events and the US field and just assume it's stronger and deeper because historically it has been.

And so I think, unfortunately, it wouldn't be a lot of the Americans, I think, that look at our region and see many threats, apart from like your standouts, like Tia and James, obviously, are flying the flag pretty high. But, you know, I doubt that many guys that don't know me personally looked at the pro and thought okay this guy's gonna be a threat i think it's just yeah that's the event in australia there's the event in south america there's the event in africa like it's not on the radar and it's and it's kind

of similar for me like i don't know jason hopper into watching the events but i think like when someone wins an event in America you've got to assume this person is probably pretty legit because there's just more people more talent

it just runs deeper so I think it's it's a pretty legit claim to be the winner of the MAAC it was a super stacked field so yeah I don't know Jason I didn't watch any of his events but I think

as Castro put it best he's for real. Isn't it interesting that Tia's biggest threat, and Brian, correct me if I'm wrong, also comes out of Australia? The first and second best crossfitting women in the world are sitting on that giant island that's barely populated? Yeah. Yeah, that is really cool. Honestly, that's a populated. Yeah. Yeah. That is really cool. Honestly, that's a,

that's a cool, um, Sarah, do you call her Cara, Cara, Cara Saunders or Cara Saunders or what's her name now? Cara. Oh yeah.

I like Cara. That's what I always call her too. I think we have her on the podcast coming up here in a couple of weeks. And she, and she won the Torian pro also, right? Right. By a lot more than I did. the Torian Pro also, right? Right. By a lot more than I did.

Yeah, she just smashed it. By the way, Savan, Royce won by one point. Oh, that's awesome. How many points did you have? Do you remember? It was 549. Oh, wow. So there's a lot.

It wasn't like six to five. It was like, wow. So there's a lot of, it wasn't like six to five. It was like, wow. It was seven events. That's incredible. Do you know who took second place? Jay. Jay, okay. And did you guys leave on good terms?

Is it all fun and games? Yeah, so I knew Jay a a bit i met him a few times and we interacted but we got a lot closer over the weekend we had a lot more chats and um he's a really good bloke and like you know he's kind of it's funny because his his kind of brand or his reputation is like he's this wonder kid right he's this young kid he started when he was like 15 under under rob forte and um he's been on the team with rob a couple times and now he's like he's obviously solid like he didn't ironically he didn't have a finish worse than 10th so he was had a much better consistent record than i did over the weekend i just hit a few more home

runs in him but um so he's like the real deal but for someone who is you know considered this like young gun he's actually pretty like he's very like, he's very, like, together. He's very mature. He's got – he's wise, I guess is the word to put it. Like, which I think is a lot of Rob's influence probably as well. But also I think he's just a kid with his head screwed on. And so, yeah, I really like Jay, and we get along quite well. You have this contraption at your gym.

It's the – I don't know what you call it. Brian probably knows what it's called. It's the, it's a replica of the handstand walk cushion. But yours is made of wood. What's that thing called, Brian? It's just the obstacle course. It's probably got stairs on one side, ramp on the other. The obstacle, yeah.

Yeah, stairs on one side. But I'm looking, I'm going through Instagram and the first time I see it, I'm like, wow, that thing looks like it's made of wood. And then I see it in another photo and I zoom in. I'm like, man, this, this looks like a liability. What, where did that come from? Did you make it? And have there been any injuries on that? So back in 18, um, when they released, I mean, it's made of plywood. Yeah. Yes. It's made of made of fly with

um some like uh actual i can't wait what they're called like two by fours like proper wood underneath it framing it um there's probably 20 sharp corners on that thing so so we we made well one of the boys um cj one of our training partners he just made one like went to winter bunning sports and wood and just made it in 2018 when they released at regionals that that workout because the ai ones are um they're about 1500 us and then to ship them out to australia it's like another like 700 us or something it's just it's just too expensive so plywood cost i think cd got it all for like 150 bucks put it together himself it's a bit bodgy we still have it here at the gym. It's a bit of like a memorabilia.

We still use it. And then I know a carpenter here in Australia and he makes like peg boards and flyer boxes and stuff for the gyms. And I said to him, I sent him all the measurements from the CrossFit website and I said, hey, can you make this? And he goes, yeah, sure.

And he's put like a pretty professional spin on it. Like he's sanded like around all the corners. it's like nice and polished he's put like logos on it he's installed some wheels so when you it's velcroed together when you pull it apart you can like wheel it around the gym so like even lorry can like move it at home like you don't have to be like you have to be strong to lift it or anything it's like quite easy to maneuver and i've personally never never had a fall on it um one of the boys came over to my house to train he fell on it but like it was i mean you got you got bruised like it's hard wood obviously but if no one's ever been like mashed up by it i think you know if you just do the proper

progression in your handstand walk and try a few plates first or little things like that then you should be fine because you're attempting like weightlifting right you're attempting a weight you are theoretically prepared for so you don't just like someone just punches you in the face with a handstand ramp if you fail you're failing kind of gracefully because you're at least in the realm of attempting it so as long as you're not just like some some random walks into a gym and goes oh let's give this a try next minute so yeah it could be a liability and it's definitely not as safe as the as the foam ones but like me personally i don't attempt even in a workout i don't attempt a handstand walk if i'm

not confident i can make it because it's training i wouldn't risk an injury anyway um and i think mike um as in the owner of the cross victorian was toying with the idea of getting a bunch of them made for the pro but in that situation in a comp setting I think it he just he couldn't justify the risk to athletes of falling down on a piece of wood um because it's a competition environment where people are going to take risks and push themselves and throw safety out the window so for the safety of athletes it was like no we'll scrap that idea but in training i think they're great especially if you um if you have the capacity to train on it you know what you're doing so i see i see tons of them around on instagram now like

like that guy that i know um he's made a few more for a few other gyms and even back in 2018 like people were like making up their own ones out of wood like all over the place so um the wooden the wooden ramps do exist out there you should throw a couple hundred mouse traps around the outside of it just to give you extra incentive to not cry hey if you fall now now you're really screwed exactly you did what were you saying earlier when we first started talking that um a couple weeks prior to the games that all of the mayhem athletes who qualified for the games will fly out to Tennessee ahead of time yeah I assume so I assume all of them that can make it will be going and tell me about that is does he do that every year is that part of the programming I mean that

sounds really cool that sounds really enticing and like, wow, what a great opportunity. It absolutely is. And so 2018, I remember after the regionals, I messaged Rich on Instagram and said, hey, I follow your program and I just qualified for the CrossFit Games. And Rich got back the next day. I woke up to the message because obviously the time difference of him being like hey man that's this is awesome like come on out tennessee like we're trained for the games like blah blah blah and at the time i think i was technically the first

satellite mayhem athlete to make the games all the other making athletes were like at crossfit mayhem and um in in the years since then it's obviously exploded and there's heaps more athletes um love them in the states on on mayhem athlete and uh it's a bad year for um it was a painful year to be locked down last year because on instagram all i'm seeing is they actually done a bunch of um camps over the last couple years um they always always have to train with rich obviously and rich always gets any athletes to come and, like, he'll, like, you know, make us do, like, demos and stuff and just add to the experience. Like, so he brings in all the guys. And so heaps of Train With Riches had a bunch of different athletes

and then they had the US Warrior Army Fitness Team out there and then they've had a couple of training camps since then. I saw, like, Medeiros was there after the games. So some of the Riches and the Mayhem crew have been doing a lot more as like a product of their program and wanting to grow that side of it. So this is the first games camp that I'll be going to since we didn't have a games last year for teams. So I think it's something that will be a regular thing

and definitely a huge value add if you're a Mayhem athlete, like the chance to go out there and train with Rich and the crew. It's pretty phenomenal. Where will you stay? Hopefully at Rich's house. I haven't actually asked him yet. But it's a bit more complicated because I have to do a seven-day quarantine when I get to the States.

According to who? That's a law that we have in the united states it's it's probably it's probably federal i think it's probably like a um it's like the department of homelands um like like uh policy for newcomers but the irony is and i was talking about the boys here in the gym who's who's been in the states recently this is this is how bureaucratic it is i have to quarantine for days, but anyone else in the household doesn't. So even though I'm in, even if I stay at the same house, like with Rich, for example, he can still leave.

He's not quarantined. So what does that achieve? I don't know. Nothing. But it's the rule. Whereas that's why here in Australia, you have to be, you have to go to a hotel room and you can't leave the room because originally we had two-week quarantines in our home but people were like yep yep i'll quarantine and then day two they're like a music festival so yeah that's

what i would do that's what i would do i would do i would do minute two minute two yeah yeah so it would be people would go out yeah people would go on like a party on the way home from the airport i'm like i want to go home and get a shower. These people have COVID and they're out hitting up music festivals and stuff. So, yeah, the quarantine. But the fact is that I have to do a seven-day quarantine. So I'm hoping that I can do that at Richard's house. I haven't asked him yet. I'm hoping I can do it at his house where I can train in the barn versus in some holiday inn where I'd be doing burpees next to my bed for a week, which would be kind of lame.

So, yeah, fingers crossed. I mean, it just comes down, I guess you know, I'd be doing burpees next to my bed for a week, which would be kind of lame. So, um, yeah, fingers crossed. I mean, it just comes down, I guess, honestly, um,

space in the house, like Rich's go, if you guys stay in there already, I'll have to figure it out. I can maybe stay with chase chases in Knoxville. So, um, a couple of about an hour and a half away,

but chase has got a pretty sweet home gym and I can hang out with him and just head over to the cookbook when he does. So I guess there's a few options they don't have anything as nice as a holiday inn in cookville by the way so you better lower your standards a little bit yeah well the first year we went over there in 18 we were staying it's like some like i don't know what it was called it's like just a like a dodgy motel like from a movie and um and rich was asking us like yeah like where are you staying and i told him and he was like oh yeah all right and um so like the next day he actually organized for us to go because his house was full he organized us to go stay with his mom

so his mom took us in because because janice was like there's you're not staying there guys that's like so dodgy it's the worst part of cookville you guys got a kid with you come and stay with me so um yeah i mean we knew nothing we just like rocking up like oh yeah it's awesome tennessee is amazing i uh when the first time i went out and visited rich i don't remember what year it was what year it was but i stayed in this hotel i think it was like a hampton inn or something and i was i was really into insects at the time and they had all the and they got great insects in Cookville. And I could just leave my hotel room and just go out to the parking lot where they had those big old floodlights that looked like they're from a crime scene. And there'd be just millions and millions of bugs.

I'm like, wow, what a great hotel. They provide 10,000 varieties of beetles and spiders and shit. Some of your bed, too. Some bugs in the bed, too. You don't have any tattoos? I got one on my left butt. And you used to have piercings. Yeah.

Tell me about your, you had a nose ring and you had the stuff in your ear. What was wrong with you? Were you a drug addict and then you got off drugs your ear what was wrong with you were you were you a drug addict and that was and then you got off drugs and that was your way of acting out or like what why does someone do that it looked like you were on your way to making those big old ears because you had like little plugs in yeah yeah that was it was far more simple which was just i was young and thought it looked cool um i never had the nose i had an eyebrow piercing oh eyebrow right and i took that out.

I kind of outgrew that even before I grew up because it was just annoying. And we'd catch on a towel or whatever. So I took that out even before I didn't think it looked cool anymore. And then the ears, yeah, I just, I don't know. I grew up and I liked punk music and I kind of liked the punk look a little bit, but I wouldn't, you know, not full punk, but like just enough to get like a little little stretcher but the funny thing is like my earlobes are like stuck to my head like i don't have proper earlobes so doing that little stretch actually gave me an earlobe and then uh when i took him out the hole like closes down but not entirely so now i have like earlobes so it worked out oh so it was like some healthy

body it was functional body modification instead of getting plastic surgery you just performed your own yeah really really cheap plastic surgery no it was um it was just because i thought it looked cool i was just young and that's what i was into when you look back at those pictures do you think you look better now without them or with them? I think I look so different with them in that it's hard to relate. But I think I look better now in this stage of life, put it that way. I think as a dad of three kids, it's definitely a better look to not have an eyebrow piercing and some holes in your ears. Yeah, maybe I'm just getting old. I don't think I was ever into that.

But you have almost a James Bond look to you. You have a good square jaw. You look kind of ageless. And when I saw that, I'm like, wow. Because when I see that stuff, but then I didn't see the tattoos. I'm like, if he was a drug, recovering drug addict, he'd probably be covered in tattoos also. Yeah, that's a pretty accurate in tattoos also. Yeah, it's

a pretty accurate stereotype most of the time, I think. Yeah, stereotypes are great. Stereotypes start somewhere, right? Yeah, for sure. For sure. What's the tattoo on your bicep? It's the Christian fish, the Jesus fish.

And tell me, what is Jeremiah 2911? I wish I was – maybe I'll be a Christian when I grow up. The best part about being a Christian is that you get to say cool numbers like that. Like guys in the military, you get to do that. Bravo, Charlie. And then Christian guys get to be like 2911. That's my jam.

So tell me, what is Jeremiah 2911? I actually have it. I can get you word for word. Don't screw it up. I have it on my desktop here. It's from the chapter of the Bible, Jeremiah, the verse 29, line 11, which is, For I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord, plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.

And why does that resonate? Well, how old were you when you came across that? It was probably, it was pretty recent. It was probably like three or four years ago. And why does that resonate with you? It's one of the more common Bible quotes, like the John, for he loved the world so much that he died for it. There's a couple of Corinthians ones that people always use in their wedding vows about the strongest of these is love. It's one of the ones that it's

pretty well known, and for good reason. There's a, you know, there's a context every verse. Like there's something happening in that verse that Jeremiah's trying to tell the people about. But as just a general platitude, it's a pretty good, it might be a pretty good summary of the entire New Testament, which is, you know, essentially the ethos is that what we go through in life, like our normal, this life on earth is kind of an enormous sum consequence of all the decisions that we make as free-thinking beings. And so, yes, good things happen, but also pretty bad stuff happens too.

And Christianity never said it would be saved from the bad things in life. It's just a promise that this is a temporary thing, and then there's a much greater plan for us afterwards, i.e., the afterlife. So one of the phrases, one of the teachings of Jesus in the New Testament was about stop loving the world so much. Don't worry if you get a good shake at this life, because this is just one part of it. And there's so much more good to come that all the bad will never compare. And so that's kind of, you know, that can apply to many levels as far as just

a nice little prayer to say before you have to go do something you're nervous about that, hey, it's going to work out the way it's supposed to up to you know existentialism of like what's it all about hey don't worry there's a plan there's a future like in essence it's just that that verse is just saying god doesn't ever do anything to you that will harm you and you know people like to throw out the phrase or like oh it's god testing you or whatever like there's no evidence in the bible that god makes bad things happen to you to see how you react. It's the fact that bad stuff happens because that's the nature of this world. And if God wants to stop everything bad from happening, well, then we wouldn't have any

free will, would we? Like you can't take away the bad without taking away what causes most of the bad. So it's saying that, you know, life is what it is, but there is a plan, there is hope, there is a future. And that's kind of the entire promise of the New Testament. Well said. Ladies and gentlemen, did you hear what Roy said? You are free thinking.

You can free think. I honestly believe that more than half the planet doesn't even know what thinking is i think i i remember when i learned how to think i wasn't i wasn't until my 20s and i was like oh shit this is thinking yeah there's a i was just a fly i just reacted to shit yeah i think there's a huge following or like um whether people even like know how to verbalize it there's a there's a great attraction to the idea of determinism like that you're just a passenger on the ride and even the things you think you're choosing are only because of all the things that have happened and blah blah blah and and there is there is some comfort in that right and it's and

it's a lot of uh it leads to a victim mentality of like, it's not my fault, so therefore I can't be blamed. But, you know, anyone great in history, as far as I know, you know, call me out on my ignorance, but every great person in history, depending on how you define great, believe in free thinking, right? That we are free beings, that they get to decide our fate and can turn anything around if we want to. And that is literally what is stated in the Bible.

And that's what I believe, that God made us as free thinking individuals. Free will is the most sacred gift he gave us. And so while there is a comfort in determinism, I think free will is harder to accept, but it's where you need to go if you want to make your life better in any way, which is easy to say from someone who's not been through a lot of hardship. Like, I know that's the problem, right? It's the thoughts and prayers argument. Like, no one who's going through bad times wants to hear that, oh, my thoughts and prayers are with you, because that doesn't feel good when you're in the moment. But there's only really one way out of a bad situation, which is taking responsibility, taking free will.

You can't just wait to be saved by someone. It might happen, but that's a very vulnerable place to be in. You should believe in free will. In defense of what you're saying, if you don't practice it in good times, it won't be there for you in bad times. By that I mean if you wait until shit hits the fan and your wife dies in a car accident to start meditating, you've started too long.

You should practice in good times and cultivate the skill of mindfulness so that when the shit does hit the fan, you have that tool. It's like CrossFit. You train in the garage so when you go to the games and they do put in handstand push-ups, you're prepared. It's a great saying, right? There's no atheist in the foxhole.

When faced with your end, everyone wants there to be something more but when the good times are rolling no one no one cares or thinks about that stuff right but that's when you should care and think about it the most right right do you think you would ever change from something else do you think you would ever change from something else? Do you think you would ever switch? Do you ever see people switch? You do see people switch, but I can't see myself there. Like, easy to say, I guess. That's your jam, 29-11. Yeah, yeah. I think that, to me, that evokes the most, like, it then links me and reminds me

and brings me back to the to the rest of of all other scriptures and um in the rest of the bible that that as a christian you're supposed to study and take in but that's kind of like my hook that like really gives me that grand like feeling of what it's all about and then you can go deep from there based on what i need what i what i want to to get me through whatever situation. Is everyone at Rich's Gym a Christian? I'm not sure. Are there any heathens there? I think it's mostly.

I can't think of anyone who isn't. They're a pretty good group. They're all on the same page, I think. Yeah, I can't think of any either royce have you started doing any of the mayhem mindset stuff i haven't no that's uh he's got a guy over there seven named i think jim hensel that he's been working with on the mindset stuff and a lot i know a lot of uh people in that in that group have, I think, more slowly started to build some of that into their life. And I don't know how it coincides with the training necessarily, but I was just wondering if you knew anything about it.

It's hard work. Yeah. It's hard work probably, especially for athletes who are so used to getting all of their wins and all of their progress from moving. especially for athletes who are so used to getting all of their wins and all of their progress from moving. And I'm guessing, I don't know what the practice is that, that, that Jim Hensel teaches, but I bet you that there's a lot of stillness in it, but there's a lot of not moving in it. I would say that's a pretty safe assumption. Yeah.

My, um, my wife has taken these courses. They're called the POS in the courses. They're non-denominational, uh, retreats. You go away for 10 days. They have longer courses, 30 days after you accomplish the first 10 days. They don't accept any money from anyone. You don't pay for it. You just sign up and go. And then they send you home with an envelope and you can send money when you get home and that's to keep them clean and pure. And it's basically no eye contact and no talking for 10 days with other people. And, um, the experiences she has are profound. And when she returns from them, she's noticeably different. And meditation basically is a, it's, it's being, it's, i don't think a lot of people know what it is but it's basically cultivating awareness and it is it is the it is the crossfit of mental development it is fucking hard and uh and it terror and it terrifies people if you say oh you're going to go away for 10 days and you're not going to get to make eye contact or talk with someone for 10 days.

I mean, there's other people there, but you're not supposed to make eye contact with anyone or talk to someone. And, man, it's a lot of sitting and just watching, you know, watching yourself cultivating mindfulness. And it's cool that it's non-denominational. You know, anyone can go who wants to do that. Yeah. I'll sign you up. Your wife would kill you if you did that. I was just thinking about how much time you must spend away from home for the games.

And I don't want to harp on it because I know it probably weighs on you and your wife enough. But then the fact that you have to come back and do a quarantine and she knows, oh, he's just right over there when he could be over here changing diapers is just... Yeah, that two weeks will be the hardest for sure. They should give you a pass. They should test you. You're 30 years old.

I wonder if anyone 30 years old with your fitness, well, I already know the answer to this, has died in Australia. No. I think... How about in the world the world no there should be some sort of pass and who cares how rich you are hey this guy came in his his blood sugar levels are not non-existent he burns everything off and he's 30 years old give him a pass he gets to go home and quarantine at home ah you're 100 i'm not gonna say that i might get in trouble i was i was gonna make a list of things if you are where you do have to stay in the hotel yeah yeah royce what's it what's it like traveling between what's it like traveling

between australia and new zealand right now um we have a bubble between australia and new zealand so it's like back to where it used to be, which is free travel. The Australian and New Zealand passports pretty much act like pseudo citizenship. A New Zealander can come to Australia and get a job and start working and pay tax and just basically live here as long as they want, as long as they can afford it. That's how it used to always be and that's how it is now again with this bubble. So it's like free travel. It was kind of sketchy when coven started because a bunch of kiwis here who didn't have citizenship because you didn't need it except when they rolled out like all the government assistance for covid like helping all like you know the pay the business to pay their employees to stay in business kiwis weren't

um eligible and it was like well hang on like we've been here for 10 years we're not citizens because we didn't need to be but Well, we can't go home now. It's too late. Like the borders are all closed. It's going to cost us money, whatever. So that was like sketched like a month or two, and they quickly like caught up and were like, oh, okay, all the New Zealanders and PRs, as long as you proved you'd been

in the country for more than three months or something, you started to get eligible. So they fixed it pretty quick. But, yeah, it's basically like the free travel it's kind of like europe it's like you can just kind of bounce between the two it's pretty cruisy do you know if you're going to compete again or is this your last year do you know like how many years you're going to do this i don't know how many years but it's definitely not my last year um but i don't know if i'll go back individual again next year or team, but I definitely can't see myself not having a go again next year

in some capacity. I just enjoy it too much, like the day in stuff. Like competition gets a bit not pleasant, but I just enjoy the day in, day out too much. And we've got two young guns at the gym. Will Carney, who's actually – he was he's like the uh the jay crouch of tia and shane so he was um started at bed at tia and shane's gym up in gladstone when he was like 15 and um yeah he's like shane's protege like the whole weekend at the pro because

he competed became top 10 um like shane was on the you know having a call every night how you going like talking through strategy like tia tests all the workouts for us and she's like telling Will her times, which of course she beat all of us at everything all the time. And her times are not a good, not even for male athletes, are a good guide for the workout. It'll just make you depressed. That Amanda 21 and the muscle-ups and the snatch, Tia did the 21 muscle-ups unbroken.

Like there were some of the men who couldn't do that. Or if they did do it, they fell to pieces on the snatches. Tia went unbroken on the muscle-ups. I think she was the only girl to do 20 unbroken in 2018 also to start the 30 muscle-ups for time. Yeah. Oh, yeah? Christy Amarant got her by like a second or two it was so tight but but tia was like four reps ahead of her at the 20 mark because she yeah we did 30 reps for

time um in the in richard's barn before the games and uh me and james so i went i went 20 unbroken then then eighth and two and james went 15 10 5 and then tia went 20 and 10 and beat both of us i was like this is not good for my confidence right now this is not not doing my ego any any favors doing anything did you did you say justin medeiros was was out at cookville did you say that yeah it's on there it's on their youtube he YouTube. He went for one of the camps they did right at the start of this year. I don't know the exact date, but they did a bit of a camp, and Justin was there. Is he following the Mayhem training?

I don't believe so. I think in the video, Rich says, yeah, we've got a bunch of our athletes, plus just a few people who we just wanted to give a good time to. It's almost a bit of a reward for Justin. Like, hey, this new guy is doing well. I think it's just Rich giving back to the next generation. Just invited him to come along and have a good time.

When you train with him, what do you see? Do you see – is it like everyone says? I mean, people just say he's just all go. Did you get to witness that? Or is he more of a coach role when you're there? No, he's more of a mentor, I would say. Like he's kind of like seasoned advice, but like you're not going to see, like he's not like kneeling next to you,

like telling you to like get your elbows higher on the snatch or like, you know, fixing your back position or whatever he i think he like just trusts and respects the athletes enough that they know what they're doing and um he'll give advice if someone's like battling with something but it's more of a mentor role and it's um and it's a lead by example which is what everyone says but that's true like you just you kind of can't argue with with like if you write up a workout it's crazy you can't really say oh that's that's silly when he'll he goes and does it so it's like well you know he's doing it and obviously he's pretty damn fit but so are we right so we should be able to do it too and so you just kind of like get on with it and that makes you know a bit of complaining

good amount of complaining goes on but um it's it's also just his willingness to suffer he always jokes about how he like tries to not hurt in a workout like you know i remember when they asked him one time when he won that the lift off the first ever rogue lift off and they said why did you singles on that barbell and he goes i just don't want to hurt that much but he actually it's his willingness to hurt like this when they do those repeat round workouts where it's like 10 sets and he's just like the first set you're like i think this is a mistake like i don't know i don't think we should do eight of these like we've screwed up here but he just like is willing to hurt himself for eight more sets whereas i'm like maybe four is good maybe i should just stop at four this sucks

i don't want to do this so yeah he's just got that good mindset he's just uh he's just tough with nails how'd you like competing on the team with him uh awesome like it was it was kind of a weird sense of calm right because you it's a bit of like um that larger than life like when you're on the team with rich you just like we're going to win right like it's just a known fact and so that's how you approach the workout like we're going to win and so you just push so much harder you know it's the magic of the mayhem freedom i think is that while rich can't win the whole workout by himself because there's four people he really does you really do feel like we're definitely going to win because we got rich and so everyone brings like their next level it brings their a game because you just full hardly believe you're going to win.

God, I love that. So the people who've been on the team with him are really fortunate. I think so. Yeah, I think it's an amazing experience to be, you know, like it's been said before, there are a few athletes in the history of different sports that change the game and are like, you know, it's powerful to be around those people and with rich it's not the physical ability it's it is his mentality right it's the fact that he um the first person to win four like he just has the ability to kind of walk through the fire i guess and not

and if he does that himself he's good at pushing that dad away and so that is inspiring like from that perspective from the mental perspective that is inspiring from that perspective. From the mental perspective, yeah, it's great that he's really fit. And it's cool being on his team because he's going to smash the workout really fast. But it's more just like when you're around him, you don't doubt yourself as much either because, well, we're rich. Of course we're going to smash it. He's just so nonchalant. He's just so down-to-earth and cool, calm, collected that you just can't help but be at ease.

So his confidence is contagious. It's not. not yeah that's the best way to put it yeah i can totally i can totally see that he seems in total control and so you're at calm and so you and then you obviously want to live up to his expectations you're on his team and it's an honor and you don't want to be seen as the weak link on the team either exactly yeah so there's a little bit of pressure but outweighed by the by the confidence i think yeah healthy pressure i thought it was a two man it was a four man team you were on with him uh the pro was the two man two man team okay okay that's what in the picture that's what i thought i saw yeah i thought i was gonna get in trouble i thought you were gonna laugh at me for saying that brian i thought i was gonna get in trouble for saying that i'm probably the other other boys

this guy first of all he doesn't have a big instagram account he i mean he's got a lot of followers but he doesn't got a lot of posts so he's easy to do research on and second of all but the hard part about Royce is there's not a lot of history basically every picture is him working out or his wife or his kids but there's no like you don't get to see him when he's like 16 like smoking a

cigarette you know what I mean like the earrings was the best I could dig out Brian is there anything burning you want to ask him before we let this guy go get a workout in? No, I think we've, I mean, I could, like I said, I could talk, probably talk to him for another hour, but I think that we've done a good job. I was, I've been impressed with your articulation, especially on the spiritual side of things. Yeah, you're smart as shit. What did you study in school? Ironically,

I just did a year, a year of what we call it university. I just did a year of university and decided that I, I was sick of studying like all through school just to go straight back to uni. So I dropped out and went and got my personal training certs, did that a couple of years and then found CrossFit and never looked back. So the answer is nothing.

Wow. What do your parents do? They're both nurses. Ah, so you come from some smart people. Do you have two more minutes? I want to ask Brian one more question. Yeah, probably exactly two minutes. There's actually a class I'm supposed to be coaching, but I'll give you two more minutes.

Okay, here we go. Brian, when we see someone like Royce, who's 6'1", 350 pounds, and we have Jason Hopper coming out of I don't even remember where he won, who's 6'1", 350 pounds, do you think that, does that make you think that the programming at

semifinals is doing a disservice at finding the good athletes, and that they're going to get smoked at the fucking games because the average height is five, 10, one 85. Like does, does anything or the athletes evolving? Do you see anything that's like,

Oh shit. I like this programming. They're not getting the right dude for the games. I don't feel that way about either Royce or Jason. I feel like there'll be fine at the games. Awesome. All right. He dodged a bullet Royce. And then we'll go offline and be fine at the games. Awesome. All right. You dodged a bullet, Royce.

And then we'll go offline and you'll tell the truth. No, no. Brian's good as gold. He's a sharp ax. He'll use it if he has to. All right. Thanks, brother. Thank you, guys.

Thanks so much. Yep. Yep.