The Sevan Podcast - Darren Hunsucker | The Winningest Coach in CrossFit #1037

Episode Date: October 13, 2023

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Just like that you shall receive what's going on oh shit dude i didn't know what times are rough at mayhem and you're working at the footlocker dude this is my this is my little hole in the wall office that i built what's up with the shoes in the back? Are you selling those? Yeah, this is a, this is what it looks like when you accomplish or sorry, like when somebody else accomplishes something,

you just put it up on your wall. Are the, are those riches shoes? Yeah. Yeah. That's brilliant. Yeah. Yeah.

I hung them up. So, you know, I got to have something just to show like my kids. Yeah. That's awesome. Three kids you know, I got to have something just to show like my kids. Yeah, that's awesome. Three kids. Three. Three kids.

Crazy. Yeah. I know, right? Hey, you. Go ahead. You're, dude, like you're like boys everywhere, huh? I'm trying. What, like skateboarding and like.

Tennis. Tennis. Tennis. Crazy stuff. Tennis. A little tennis. A little jujitsu. A little striking.

How awesome, man. I'm loving it. Did you grow up skateboarding? No. No? I don't know how to fight. I don't know how to skate. Dude, I was, I'm doing, you know how they say don't have your kids live, don't live through your kids vicariously?

You are that. 100, 100%. 100%. Fully leaned into it. Fuck you. I'm going the opposite way. They're going to do everything that I wish I would have done. But, I mean, but even, like, all this stuff, watching them, you haven't even, like, jumped in?

No. Like, hey, I want to learn, too. Like, hey, hey, listen to me. I wrestle with them, and I play a lot of tennis with them, but I suck. I mean, like, they tell me, basically, I'm not playing tennis. Wow. Yeah. They're like, hey, dude, that's tap tennis. You know what I mean? They're like they tell me basically I'm not playing tennis. Wow. Yeah. They're like, Hey dude, that's tap tennis.

You know what I mean? Coaching one-on-one. Yeah. They just, you are not even close. You suck. Exactly. Hey, are you comfortable? Um, uh, how old your oldest one?

Oldest one is seven months Your oldest kid? Sorry, oldest, sorry, my bad Going on five Ivy will be five here soon Okay, Ivy? Yep Darren, do you like dad?

Have you assimilated to someone calling you dad? It's weird It's Yeah It's weird. It's, uh, um, yeah, it's just like what, like what always gets me is watching TV, like sports, especially because that's always something that I kind of like try and like relate to. Cause I still feel young. It's like when I watch like an NFL game and I see a kid out there who's 21, 22 years old, I'm still in my head. I feel like that.

But then I'm like, holy shit, I am 32. You know, it's like, you know, these, I mean, like at that point in a sports career, you are like retired or on the tail end of it. So, yeah, kind of hearing it and especially now taking my kids to school or taking Ivy to school and seeing uh parents that i graduated with yeah it's such a crazy crazy like surreal moment i i i didn't think i would ever get used to it and it took about eight seconds as soon as they called me dad i just turned into dad it was weird yeah yeah yeah yeah and i mean

and especially now like breaking that like barrier of like when she hears or like they hear my wife call me darren and they're like call me darren like no no you call me dad okay you're like but darren i'm like no no no so yeah there's always like the little like corrections when i'm on the tennis court with my oldest who just turned nine he calls me seve oh seve you weren't even close to hitting oh seve you're never gonna beat me again how's it on the back and stuff it's like it's okay seve all that well when he wins he cries and now he wins every time so he cries a lot like at the end of every game he'll talk shit to me the whole game and then he wins and he starts crying and i go what's wrong i feel bad you're so old how how polar opposite are your kids from each other yeah yeah they're they're

it's weird yeah i know they're not even from the same family sometimes that's that that's the that's the one thing or one of the things that's one of the things I notice so much now is that between my first and my second, so Ivy's going on five, June's going on three, night and day difference. Ivy, like, if you even raise your voice, she will cower down. You know, she's, you know, I'm like timid and stuff. I mean, but super friendly, loves everybody. June, if you yell at her, she's going to yell at you back.

You know, like if you turn around to her, she's going to bite you. You know, I'm like, she's not afraid to punch. You know, she's not afraid to yell. And it's like I raised you both the same. At least I want to think that. But, yeah. Hey, that's a great observation. I have kids like that, too. Being assertive and like kind of aggressive to them. There is really effective. And I have others who just melt into a ball of shit. If you raise your voice, they just turn into goo.

You're like, fuck. I know. Yeah. And it is, I mean like June, I mean, yeah,

like I can like yell at her and I won't even like feel bad. Ivy, if I like yell at her, I'm like, man, you know, was I a little rough on her? Was,

you know, I'm like, was I a little harsh? Cause like, yeah, I mean, and of course, 10 10 days later she'll of course just like remind me of it she's like dad you yelled at me pretty bad the other day i'm like i know i know i'm sorry oh i get that june they're reflecting on you yeah i'm like i'm like sorry i'm like it's like i don't know what else to do then my kids will be like uh my oldest be like i don't think that's really an effective way of parenting i'm like what yeah yeah yeah he's like savvy good yeah good try uh heidi croon just straight to business

straight to business uh darren why don't the whiteboard brief videos uh so for those of you who don't know darren is the programmer for uh the mayhem empire for affiliates that do mayhem programming that's correct right yes yep and so heidi must go to a gym where they do mayhem programming and now she has some wants to get right down to business and and right to it uh darren uh why don't the whiteboard brief videos what is what is she referencing is that something you guys do so yeah so whatever platform you're using whether it's you know sugarwad wadify push press all those different ones that are out there um you have what's called like your weekly overview or your daily overview that kind of shows you the, you know, layout of the programming. And so within the whiteboard, we usually offer, or we always offer at least a breakdown of what the warmup is,

the workout for that day strength, if there is any accessory work, work type stuff. Now, sometimes with the whiteboard itself, with the gymnastic stuff, we kind of pull from different areas. So, you know, we have Pamela who's been working with, you know, the Mayhem athletes and stuff. We'll get stuff from her helping out with the gymnastic side because that's more of her repertoire. And accessory stuff, we'll pull from other bits and pieces of Mayhem coaches or just Mayhem athlete coaches so with those we just kind of provide like small little snippet links rather than just a full breakdown of it um we do offer notes with i mean within but yeah that's you know i mean what's what's great about our

programming and also like with this community because like what i love is stuff that she's asking is stuff that brings it to our attention and take that into effect. And like, OK, maybe that is something that we should start adding in. You know, if there is more people that want it and want to see more from that, then, yeah, we can definitely look at adding more breakdown. So if there was a Helen video, if Helen was the workout, you might talk about show someone like how to do kettle swings, kettlebell swings, or maybe different kinds of pull ups or hey, make sure that when you run, do this or whatever. But if you're saying there's handstand walks, instead of it being in the video that you make, there'll be a link that says, hey, this is how you do handstand walks, a separate link if it's if it's within the workout then it's me doing it if it's like accessory pieces stuff like that then there probably will be links provided to it and and what heidi and what heidi's reverent heidi's basically saying is like hey i just want to watch one video don't make me click shit yep all right fair enough thank you heidi for your

uh uh cody bradshaw darren have you done my birthday workout oh god i hate it when people ask questions like that people send me workouts and then like or send me a video that's 25 minutes long have you watched it yet like dude you sent that two days so cory cory man who is this guy we need to slap him around a little bit oh yeah no no cory's court cory's great cory is you know i'm a i mean basically like one of our mayhem knights you know he's always i knights. He's always on. I mean, Corey is awesome. He's at all the train with the riches and stuff like that.

Corey, I have not done your birthday workout yet, nor have I built up the capacity to do your workout yet. I want to say there's over 500 burpees. I mean, it just looks like something that's going to take me an hour plus hey cory write your birthday workout in the comments i want to see this thing if that's the i'll say if that's the one that i'm thinking of darren let's hear it on a side note please tell me rich has a small penis please tell he's got everything in life going for him please please don't tell there's very few people who've seen his penis.

I know you've seen his penis. No. I have seen a lot. Tell me the perfect man has this tiny penis like this. Please. But I cannot confirm nor deny. I'm sorry. I'm going to have to leave that one out there. Is that bro bro code you can't talk about the guy's penis when you see yeah yeah

that's that's that's typical bro code that's something that i'm trying to teach my seventh month old son before just trying to establish it right off the bat you don't want him going to school man like dad has a tiny penis we do not we do not that cannot be day that cannot be day one of preschool teacher pulls out an eraser and he's like that's what my dad's penis looks like that's a lie hey dude your kids will say shit like that i know my kids are nuts dude dude that's the i mean and again like that's like all the stuff that's kind of going through again having, having two daughters off the back and then now having a son, we got to have that talk of what this other part is. Yeah. And it's like, hey, you know, I mean, it's like, you know, that's just the way that God made them or, you know, like trying to give like a easy cop out answer.

Well, I mean, not a cop out. That's the truth. But at the same time, it's like, all right, how do we kind of veer them away? Because it's all like, you know, you're being like a magician. It's all smokes and mirrors with it's like, hey, divert the conversation somewhere else, like real quick or show them something cool. There's a girl in my son's tennis class. And the kids are all close. They've been doing tennis together, you know, five days a week for four years. And the girl comes and goes, hey, my dad got a new wife. So now I have a stepmom.

My kid's telling me this story. It's like, so she's telling us she got two moms. I'm like, yeah. And he goes, and then I'm like, oh shit. And he goes, some other kid asked, which mom do you like better? Oh no. And I go, and so my son looks at me and my two other sons, he goes, that's a dumb question. And my two other sons who are six are like, why is that dumb?

And they're like, dude, you don't like the stepmom more ever and i'm like and i just was like yeah i'm raising this one right that's fact that yeah he knows he understands the nuances i know yeah he was like sebi taught me that my boy um darren what is the best bronco for a family? Oh my God. Your car is amazing. Everybody, everybody. Do you still own that? I was kind of afraid to bring it up. Like you were going to say you had to sell it to like put an ad on for your third kid

or something. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, not yet. Debatable. As far as if I'd sell a kid or the Bronco. God, that thing is nuts, dude. I love it. I, I'm, you i'm you know i grew up um my oldest brother his hit his first vehicle so kind of story behind this bronco is my brother donnie the oldest his first vehicle was a 93 bronco black xlt so yada yada um that's where i fell in love with

the vehicle didn't know anything about him prior, but absolutely, you know, loved it. I love that everybody else loved it, you know, because like, even at that time, it was like 2003, 2004. It's like, you didn't see these vehicles like on the road, especially in like Michigan. after his kind of died on them and then kind of disappeared, I always said I'd try and find another one like it. And I happened to run across this one that I actually bought this from a guy that's out in California. He was in Northern California. So I had to call him up. I talked to him online, gave me all the videos and stuff, talked to him like on the phone. It was almost like a dating site. I like felt like I like knew this guy i'm like way beyond and i had to have it shipped back to i'm a michigan but i mean i'm always the nostalgic type i like anything from the obs which is the 90s era all the way down to the 60s so the newer one 1993 bronco that's a 93 yeah and that's you own you, you own that. Like that's like where, if you're sitting where you're from, where you're sitting, where is that?

Uh, that is sitting probably 20 feet away from me. Wow. Yeah. Is that your daily driver? No, that is not, that is not, that is not the economy driver. Plus like putting, putting three kids in the back of that thing on a 40 degree day with no top on, you know, I'm like all the heat is on me. So I absolutely love it.

But my kids hate it in that. Yeah. So it's cold where you're at right now. It is. Yeah. We woke up. It was almost, it was probably just touching thirties. Why, why don't you move to Cookville? Cause your mom and dad are in michigan family is it just family yeah yeah so when uh when i just and i finally you know started to have kids or jess is your wife yep she is at least that i know of right that she tells me um but yeah when we um when we finally started having kids or had ivy you know, we kind of just had that feeling where like, you know, I, I, I personally like if it was just me, you know, wasn't married or anything. I would have stayed in Cookville until the day that died. But, you know, having kids, being married and stuff, both our families are in Michigan.

We wanted our parents to be grandparents. We didn't want to have to have them have to travel 10 hours just to see you know especially on my side of the family it would have been our first as far as like grand you know like grandkids for justice side um barry had a couple but still you know her family's getting older and my family's only getting older and traveling will only be harder for them so we're like all right we need to actually make this change sooner than later before it gets harder and harder. You have siblings, Darren? Yeah. How many siblings?

So two older brothers and then three younger brothers. So Donnie and Matt were the ones that had passed early on. And then my three younger brothers, Mitch, Dustin, Marcus. So there were five of you? well six well well six total yes so you lost two brothers yeah yep how old were you when that happened so matt matt was the first one i was 12 and then donnie was so matt was 2004 donnie was 2007. so i was 12 and then 15 holy shit dude yeah yeah yeah and and you know like that I mean that that kind of correlates like with you know like the story that Rich told as far as because Rich and Donnie so my oldest who had the Bronco and stuff they were they were they

were like best friends they were born Donnie was born July 9 9th rich was july 21st who is that that's rich's moms or dads so rich's mom is my mom's sister okay so so so so you guys are legit cousins legit yes yeah okay yeah so your moms grew up in a house together fighting over bowls of cereal and shit exactly yep yep there were nine of them there were six sisters and then three brothers and what state was that in that was in michigan catholic michigan you know so you had to right no no goalies allowed no no soccer without the goalie yeah okay and so and so was so rich was raised in michigan being best friends with your oldest brother donnie so Rich so Rich moved down man I don't want to butcher it Rich moved down to Cookville when he was I believe four but like

from like that like time frame even like when they were born they were always I'm like together and then throughout the years you know they I mean like they would see I'm like each other you know just just periodically we probably see Rich maybe twice a year and then as they they got older, you know, cell phones, all that stuff started, you know, to become a thing. They kept in contact. Rich would come up to visit more because he was able to drive. And that's where the whole kind of competitiveness between all of our cousins really started to amp up because Rich was dominant in his sport. My brother Donnie and my brother Matt,

they're all dominant like in their sports and our, and all our other cousins too as well. So we just became a super like competitive based family. Do you remember him being 16 and driving up and all the, all the family, like being excited that all the cousins coming over and pillow sleeping in the living room and all that shit. Dude, it was, it was awesome because he would, we'd probably get like, you know, I mean, cause again, back then cell phones weren't a thing just yet. They were, you know, if you had one, you were cool and we weren't cool. But we would, you know, I get that call.

Hey, Rich is coming up, whatever, next day. So it was always, you don't sleep, you wait. They may get in super late because it's a 10 hour drive. So you're probably waiting for them. They get in at 2, 3 a.m. Rich would always bring like friends with them too. Or sister Kayla would come up, which was awesome. Or he'd bring, you know, like three of his friends, four of his friends.

And we'd play Super Smash Brothers. We'd play, you know, Mario Party. And then we'd wake up and go play sports. Yeah. So. What a good childhood. Both your parents are still alive? Yeah.

Yep. I wonder, I mean, now that you have kids, I mean, it must be a trip because no one knows what it's like to lose a sibling. But then you don't know what it's like to lose a child. But when you had your child, when you first had Ivy, did you start to kind of replay that loss through what it would be like through your parents' eyes? Were you like, oh, shit. You know, when I lost Matt, so I was 12. And, like, it was weird because, you know, like, when you're 12 years old and you lose, like, somebody, I mean, yeah, of course it sucks. You know, like, you go through the whole, like, emotional side, but you really don't know what, you know, I'm like how to feel, you know, you really don't know.

I mean, like how to take it, how to explain it, how to tell people about it, you know, so like a lot of kids, you kind of just, you know, kind of become, you know, kind of block out the noise or just kind of numb to it. Right, right. And then, and then after Donnie, that's when I was like 15 or so. So so I was older. And of course, like, you know, Donnie being the oldest, he was like our I mean, our like everything. You know, I mean, that's that that's who we learned everything from. I mean, it's your oldest brother. That's the one you look up to the most. And after that, that's when it really hit me. You know, as far as like, holy shit, you know, this sucks. But I watched I watched like what my mom went through with Matt.

And then after Donnie, I was like, man, how like how like how do you stay so strong? My mom is a very faith driven woman. And she she she did not crack like it's crazy. Like she didn't break down. I mean, yeah, you know, she, she, she sobbed, but it's like, she was the one, she was still getting us up, getting us ready for school, taking us. And that's where, I think that's why CrossFit, I kind of found it to be like the closest thing to what I had back home is, you know, I found such a close group of friends and family that made our life so much better. Like loss sucks, but you, but there's a lot of good that actually comes from it as well. You know, I mean, you know,

not that it ever in the long run, like out or I shouldn't say long run in the retrospect, it doesn't outweigh losing them, but it's like, I gained so much more friends. Our families became so much more closer, you know, and, and, and everything. So, yeah, I mean, it is, it's, uh, and then now having kids, of course you, that, that's always like in the back of your mind, it's like, but you cannot, you cannot let that affect it. I mean, that's, I think that's something that I'm trying to hold to because, um, what do you mean? You can't let that affect it. You can't raise your kids like with fear. Yeah.

You know, because the first couple of years, even after like losing Matt, you know, Matt, Matt was gunshot, you know, I mean like it was a suicide and,

uh, how old was he? He, he was, well, he would have been 13, 14, 14.

Holy shit. Yeah. And I, I mean like Matt 13, 14. Holy shit. Yeah. And I mean, like Matt, Matt was a great kid. Now what's crazy about it. He was, he was one of those kids. He was freakishly strong, like for his age, but he was, you know, ADHD. He, I mean, you know, I shouldn't even say he was ADHD. He just needed a lot to do.

You know, he was super hyper, always, always doing something, but outdoor kid, outdoor kid, outdoor kid. I got three outdoor kids. Yep. A hundred percent. Love to hunt, do all that stuff. But, um, you know, he was, uh, he was very, he was very like sporadic and, uh, you know, you would never know. Yeah. I wouldn't call it, you know, I'm like a bipolar thing by, by, by any means, because now I can't ever lash out. But like if you told him to jump off a building, he would do it. If you told like I can't tell you how many times my mom get calls like, you know, the school would be like, hey, Matt, Matt ran away from school. Why do you do it? Somebody told him to, you know, Matt beat up a kid on the playground.

Why do you do it? Because some kid told him to because he got mad at him. kid on the playground why'd he do it because he some kid told him to because he got mad at him right so you know he he he had that in him as far as you know he just caught him on a bad day but um yeah so you know that's I mean kind of sorry rambling a little bit but you know that's that that's kind of like where I've I've really had to figure out I don't want my kid living in that fear of I'm always hovering over him being like I don't want you to do anything because the fear of losing you. You know, I mean, what what will happen happens now? I'm not saying I just let my kid run around, you know, I'm aimlessly going without any watch. But I watch what my parents went through and my dad started to get more and more paranoid.

Like you, you just saw it, which is natural. I mean, you lose like two, you know, like two, two kids. Yeah. Watching him like go through something like that and seeing how paranoid he got and how it kind of affected us. Cause like, Hey, can we go over so-and-so's house? No. It was.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't blame him. I'm on that team yeah so you know i mean i i mean yes like i am a lot more aware of things i try and look for signs i try and look for you know things but i mean like stuff stuff happens donnie i mean donnie was a car wreck he was just driving home you know so you can only do so so much i i wonder i bet i suspect that your three grandkids have been the great even though it's you know 10 years later 15 years later i bet you it's the greatest the fact that you're staying around your parents is probably the most healing they've felt yeah since that happened i mean grandkids are

a miracle right i mean i i can just see what they did to my parents i can't even believe what happened to my mom and dad yeah they're like new people yeah it probably healed the out of them you giving them three grandkids you know and it's uh it probably healed you too probably healed you too you know i mean because of course after like everything you know and it's uh it probably healed you too probably healed you too it did you know i mean because of course after like everything you know there were numerous reasons why i left one i just wanted a you know a change of scenery but two it's like after those couple years households started to change you just like i said things were kind of more edgy and i just needed a chain of a a like change of scenery oh so you, how old were you when you moved out?

As soon as I graduated high school. So I was 17 and you know, rich, rich, rich, I mean, was up visiting and that's, you know, we got talking and he's like, Hey, and that's where, you know, he just started getting into CrossFit. I think it was like two or three months in it. He's like, Hey, why don't you come down? You know, I'm really thinking about getting serious into this stuff and open up a gym. Of course I'm 17. Like I tell people, it's like, hey, why don't you come down? I'm really thinking about getting serious into this stuff and open up a gym. Of course, I'm 17. Like I tell people, it's like you think open up a gym, have a private jet, and we're going to ride off into the sunset.

Yeah, and a girl. Yeah, exactly. A girl, jet, gym. Yep, exactly. How much older is he than you? Four years. Four years. Yep.

So he comes up to the house, and then you drive home with him. You make the drive back to Brookville. Yeah. And at that point, I remember Dave went to some competition on the East Coast somewhere, and he called me from there, and he's like, at the airport, he's like, hey, dude. And I go, what? He goes, the next CrossFit Games champions here. I'm like, what do what do you mean he goes there's this kid here that's fucking nuts dude you're not even gonna believe him and it was rich yeah yeah and then rich and dave never says that shit i don't think i can't remember too many other people he said that about yeah i was gonna say

that was the regional then uh had you moved to cookville by that point so yeah yep yeah were you at that event with them yeah yep yeah so like guys like uh i believe spencer hendel was there i want to say brandon phillips like you know like guys guys did you compete did you compete at that i did not no no okay no no no that's when i just started coaching him come on but why didn't you compete because i when i came and visited, you would work out with him and you would hang with him and you were fucking incredible. Why didn't you compete? You know, scared, honestly, why, why didn't you compete? Not like I don't like it, but what's the, no, no, no. And I've, I have honestly thought about that for years because I'll even like, look at that stuff too and be like, why, why didn't I sign up?

And I mean, the only thing that I can kind of like kind of correlate it to is I grew up in a big family. I did everything with somebody, you know, nothing I ever did was kind of on my own, like individual base. The only sport that I, and honestly, like the sport I was best at was wrestling, which is an individual sport, but I didn't like it. I did not enjoy it. I didn't like it i did not enjoy it i didn't like the spotlight i i mean and i don't know why that that just sounds stupid because everybody no i think that the darren i know doesn't like the spotlight that you're not a um you never seeked attention anytime i was around you which makes you a good wingman to rich well yeah and

and you know i'm like i'm like i love to joke, yeah. And, and, and, you know, I'm like, I'm like, I love to joke. I love to be, I'm like authentic, but you know, stuff like that, but it's like, yeah, I mean, I don't know. It's just, I, I, I just never really thrived in those kinds of situations like where I just felt good about it. I love football. I love team-based stuff. And, uh, you know, I mean, and, and, and to be real, I love doing like my own thing. Like I love to have that freedom, like, hey, I can work out when I wanted to, but I also could coach when I wanted to. I could do other things when I wanted to. I saw Rich, you know, Rich was in the gym 10 to 12 hours, you know, and that's bam, bam, bam, you know, and of course I would jump in on a lot of

that stuff like early on because I had nothing else to do. But I also liked the idea of being 18, 19. Hey, I can go to the bar after, hey, I can go, you know, to the lake and swim, you know, if like somebody wanted to. So earlier on, yes. And then, and then as I got older, I found coaching and I loved it. I loved it. You know, I just lived off of it literally but but yeah did you do you wish do you wish in hindsight you would have competed i think earlier on yes um you know right when you got there in the beginning you should have done some comps with rich yeah yeah yeah i mean it and rich rich was so far ahead of everybody else. He was. And I don't want to downplay what anybody else did because they were all super fit.

But Rich was literally the same, a man amongst boys out there. Yeah. He was. He was out there doing things. And the thing that I tell people all the time is what he did on the competition floor, nobody will ever realize how good he really was. Cause he did that shit in training nonstop and even better. It's like, you know, like out there, he just did what he had to do to like survive and like grant surviving was just killing it. But like, you know, in the gym, he was, he, he, he was doing stuff without any type of food in his body, any type of,

you know, rest between pounding a McDonald's double cheeseburger and doing this. It's like, you know, so, oh, sorry. I'm getting myself worked up. I need some water. No, yeah, get yourself worked up. That stuff is good to hear. I want to go back to your early days of coming to Cookville,

but I want to ask you this question. I heard that there's this UFC fighter, Israel Adesanya, and he fights in 185 pounds and he's a really good fighter. Maybe arguably the best who ever did it. And he said, the reason why I think it was him. The reason why Michael Jordan is better than LeBron James is in the fans eyes is because not because of the numbers,

but because of the numbers but because of the emotional um appeal in his performance he got the fans to invest in him emotionally i feel like rich has done that better than any crossfit athlete um ever that there's something about him that makes you not i mean obviously's the winner, but then you're also invested in him for some other reason. That's not like tangible, like the way he carries himself or the way he looks at the crowd, or there's some sort of his style. There's a style he has. He is like, you know, he, he wants to win because he wants to win. Like if you take 300,000 out of the equation, you know, dollars, he would still beat everybody's ass.

You know, he would still win the CrossFit Games. He still wants to win that bad. And, like, that's something that you can't teach. You know, that's something that you're born with. And I always, like, tell people, too, it's cool to see what Rich did with less. cool to see what Rich did with less, less coaching, less, like less availability and knowledge of like, you know, movements. Um, I, you know, I'm like nutrition, stuff like that. He was able to put out the performance he did nowadays.

And it's just like, you can look at any sport, you know, they talk about LeBron invest over a million dollars into his body you know i'm like every year and it's like michael jordan was smoking a you know cigarette or i you know or i'm like cigar up until 2 a.m playing golf and then he'd go win the nba finals you know it's like so you didn't see rich with those things on his legs that like he wouldn't sit up with his legs up with those norma tax or or like something wouldn't sit up with his legs up with those. Normatex or like something like that. Yeah. I don't even know what they are.

Yeah. No, I mean, like as as he got more and more into it and, you know, that's that's something to to Rich's credit. He's he's he's very smart. Rich, Rich is Rich is always learning. Like he's always reading something. He's always looking for, you know, the new, better thing of how to get better at like something. So, you know, that's, that, that's something that I always do do or like, I always did give him credit for, especially if he got, you know, like if he got injured, he would attack it. He's like, Hey, I'm going to get this fixed instantly. You know, I watched him roll his ankle numerous times, you know, spraying it dang near or a couple of times. And within. Within three days, he's up and doing something because he's just rehabbing the crap out of it. Like I said, there's different breeds.

Corbin Bowman, $5. Just remember, Darren, like and subscribe. Smash that like button. Yeah, smash something. Corey Bradshaw. Oh, geez. 50 minutes. jesus christ

for max oh wait this is a different one for max reps and teams oh team okay good 250 calories row 50 burpees over the rower 50 calorie assault bike 50 dumbbell uh facing burpees 75 calorie row oh yeah yeah this is a mess no one's doing he's not doing this he's not doing this no second 50 burpee uh box jump overs what the fuck is this number 24 to 20 100 no no no, 20, 24 inches for men, 20 for, for lays and then a hundred calorie row. So you're a coder. You're like a computer coder. You can just read. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I would say that's my two month college degree. Do you ever dream about, um, uh, workouts? You ever wake up and you're like, oh shit, I got to go write that down right away. Or have you ever been in bed and like,

you think of a workout and you have to get up and write it down? I got to go write that down right away. Or have you ever been in bed and like you think of a workout and you have to get up and write it down? It honestly like it's it's not it's not just a movie scene. Like, yes, that happens all the time. Like we're all like wake up and I'm like, wow, that was really good. And, you know, the worst thing about having a dream is trying to put it all back together. Yeah.

Like it's weird how it kind of comes to you throughout the day. You're like, shit, I I did just or I did dream about that. Or like, you know, the order's messed up, but I do that. I've had that happen to me so many times where I got to get to my laptop or I got to get to a piece of paper and I got to write it down. Like, or, or, or even times like there's, there'll be times where I'll actually program a workout and I'll put like a time base on it of how long I think it should take. And all of a sudden I'll wake up, be like, oh shit, that was supposed to be five minutes. Not, not, not six minutes. What the fuck is going on with this new stream yard?

Did you see those balloons go up? I did. I was like, is it my birthday? I thought it was it. We noticed that you did a hand gesture or we noticed that if you did, I went like this the other day and this happened. Whoa. We noticed that if you did I went like this the other day And this happened Whoa Nothing

So you did something You did something that summons the balloons That's awesome That's awesome I was going to say That's unreal You're going to be out here for the next hour Just throwing your hands around

When I'm going to bed at night it drives me crazy because if i think of a question i have to go then get up and write it down yeah because i just so i can get it off my brain so that i can go to sleep somebody so somebody told me a while back or maybe it was one of the headlines that I read, because I'm a headline reader. I never just click and read through articles. I just read the headlines. But they had mentioned that if you, as soon as you wake up, if you did this every morning for at least 30 days straight, as soon as you woke up and wrote down exactly what you dreamed about, or from what you could remember, that by the 30 day mark. Or so you would be able to start. Having lucid dreams.

Where you could actually control them. So you could actually get within your dreams. I know I'm kind of getting kind of like. Into the inception stuff. But you could start controlling. What you're dreaming about. You could start to alter the path of it. The way that you wanted to.

Okay I'm going to do that. So I'm going to do that tomorrow. So when I wake up tomorrow what if i don't have a dream what's the first one i write down what do i write down you just feel like dream dream day one bam yeah yeah i beat my kid in tennis right that would be a dream in all the years well let me paint the scene first the scene is you and you and rich are sitting in in that garage it is or that barn on the top of the hill at his dad's house and you guys start writing workouts down and all the years and all the times you've done that you ever get in a fight with rich over

it what's the most heated it got about like not agreeing on a workout you ever get where someone stormed out like fuck you yeah i mean there oh did you get like that occasionally yeah yeah yeah i mean like stuff like that happens you know it's uh i'm trying to think of a specific time like if i could really not that i mean nothing like where i could be like hey this is how it happened but yeah i mean like there there were times like where you know know, like Rich would, or, or, I mean, the one thing about Rich, and again, I'm not going to downplay Rich's program by any means, cause he's the best. I mean, in my opinion, he's the best at all time with it. But, you know, there were like some days where you just knew because like we, we would always

get, you know, whether I was up the barn early or later on, we started training at his house and he built, you know, the whole thing was, uh, if you got there early, some, sometimes you would just jot down stuff like, Hey built you know the whole thing was uh if you got there early some sometimes you would just jot down stuff like hey you know like let's do this and you would always have to write them down with the idea of it's probably going to get changed but you know there were like some days where you just kind of were adamant about it like hey rich we did we did 300 wall balls yesterday i really don't want to do thrusters. Or, hey, we got this coming up tomorrow. We got strength after. Let's try it and do this.

And be like, no, we're going to do this. But I also think that's what made it so great is that it was the stuff that you needed to do. Because like I tell people all the time, you got to be built for Sunday if you're going to go to the games. You can't be built for Wednesday. You can't be the show-off guy who comes in the first day or two and wants to just dominate. You got to be the guy that's still standing up on the final or the person on the final day. So, yeah, you know, there were times where it's like, F this, you know, that's stupid. But in the end end you always ended up

doing it i mean that's just the reality of it do you do you remember it was you in this um in rich and there was a dude with the fro i can't remember he ended up being on the l1 team like he had a jew fro trying to remember his name he was a good dude he was like he was he was i think like he was like a preacher or something he was your age he was like, he was, he was, I think like he was like a preacher or something. He was your age. He was my age. He had a Jew. He was like always talking to me about the Bible. Always. He was cool.

He had a Jew fro. Oh, wait, he, what's that guy's name? Are you talking about, are you, are you,

are you talking about Ben Rogers? No. Okay. I was, I was about to say, he never, I was trying to picture him even like with longer hair. Cause he always had had a short hair.

He had curly hair. Oh, he used to have curly. Holy cow, you're really making me feel bad. Anyway, we were up in the barn and me and Senior were smoking cigarettes and drinking Coors Light in the room with you guys working out. Do you remember that? I mean, having senior there drinking and smoking was like the the normal thing it just felt like it was a tuesday i just couldn't believe that i was in you guys are working out and we're in there just drinking and smoking i can't remember what we

were smoking it was i can't remember i mean i don't remember i mean i can't remember if it was lucky strikes or mall mall or what i was like Strikes or Marlboro or what. I'd say Swisher Sweets or Black and Mild. I just couldn't believe it. That's awesome. Did, in those victories that Rich had, and you're in the back with him, was there ever, there were some times when there were some ups and downs, obviously, it's across the games. were there ever any games where you're like oh shit he's not gonna win this one i mean you were well i mean you were back there a lot too but

i mean honestly there was never besides like the very first one as far as after taking second you know because you just don't know but after that no i mean even even what was the was it four was it 13 or 12 where uh the swim workout or it might have been earlier than that or like was it 11 where he started off and he and he took like 32nd place and then and then i don't remember correctly if that was the same year as the triple three where he was like walking. But it's like at that point, I think, you know, like, you know, the picture was being painted.

Hey, this is the year that, that Rich is going to fail. Like, it just doesn't look like he has it in him. But, or, or like something bad happened. Like, yeah, like he's broken and he can't, he can't come back this weekend, maybe next weekend, but not this weekend. Like the one that really did scare me, it wasn't even the games. It was a regionals. I think it was Cincinnati. So if it was 12 or 13, but it was Cincinnati regionals,

it was the famous one, him and Scott Pancheck. Oh yeah. And you know, I'm like, rich was, I'm like, rich was sick. So, you know, I mean, you know, rich sick is still above and beyond, but still, it was just the fact that we didn't know like that first or second day, like what he had. So it's like if something legitimately messed him up to where he could not get out there and actually do the minimum work requirement, then yeah, you are. I mean, you are screwed. So it's like that at that point, like I was worried because for a guy like him and really any athlete, it's like, what's, what's that going to do to you mentally? I mean, you train all that, you're all this hype to win it, come back to it. And of course,

at the time that's your lively, like that is your sole livelihood. Oh yeah. Here we go, man. And look at this. This is the famous, this is the famous throw it famous throw it over your head. Yeah, why would they make that illegal? It's a brilliant move. It was, but- Why make that illegal? Because you can't see what your bar is doing?

Or they just didn't want somebody throwing it on top of their head. Man, Scott. This is when everybody still had great knees i would say is crossfit hard on your knees i don't think if crossfit is hard on your knees because i don't do it at this level competing is hard on your knees because of the sheer volume crossfit itself is not hard on your knees no okay okay and that's and that's the part that's hard to break people up of course everybody sees you know that's that's the ongoing battle is the yeah my knees my knee i did 300 uh air squats uh two days ago with a 16 pound vest do you do murph out well i don't

tell i'm kind of like i've never done murph with the vest you're a closet murph guy so i'm no i've never done murph with the vest so i'm kind of Murph guy? No, I've never done Murph with a vest, so I'm kind of prepping. You know what I mean? I took my obby, my nine-year-old. Don't tell anybody you're on your podcast that reaches a ton of people. Well, they don't listen to this part. Here. Okay.

All right. Well, I'm going to go tell my seven. Yeah, there you go. Yeah. I mean, honestly. My knees feel great. My knees feel great. I'm 51.

It was nothing. I go ass to grass. My knees feel great. I mean, I feel great. My knees feel great. I'm 51. Like it was nothing. I go, I go ask the grass. My knees feel great. I mean, yeah. Since I stopped, I mean, I like, I never got to the point of, you know, some of these athletes, but since I stopped competing at that level, my body feels a lot better. Okay. You know, it's, I mean, because like, that's, that's what it takes. Like, you know, like I said earlier, it's like, you've got to be built for the grind. And, uh, you know, that's what you gotta go to. You gotta squat when you don't want to. It's like, you know, when you're just an everyday athlete or everyday person like us, it's like, you can choose when not to squat and when to squat and feel good. You know, you can control movement a lot better. Cause's not it's it's for time but it's your

time yeah i did i mean sets of 15 yeah taking turns with my son it was yeah it was chill i see what you're saying okay yeah i was gonna say my wife makes fun of me all the time because there'll be times where i'm where i'm doing a workout and in my mind and i'm sure you know you go through it and everybody does who kind of outside of that like competitive realm but it's like you remember what you could do let's just say 10 years ago and and like how you did it and you you think you still have it in you and then all of a sudden three two one hits or halfway through a workout you're like holy shit I am not nowhere near that you know your heart rate's way higher your legs are more blown up your arms hurt and it's like I'm just gonna stop like you know i mean there's there

there's times where i'm doing a workout and it's like five sets with like a one-to-one rest i'm like hey i'm just gonna do four i mean you know that's enough you know that's such an awesome place just to be at for me this um this the dude who produces this podcast the executive producer matt suza yeah he said that there was a guy who came into his gym who did 30 seconds on and 30 seconds off on the assault bike and i want to say got 427 calories in 30 minutes and it's a little dude it's a little dude like under one i want to say under 180 so i i'm like oh i'm gonna try that and i'm gonna shoot for 300 i got to the sixth round i quit i'm like i'm not doing this that's that i seriously six minutes in i'm like nope i'm not doing i'm not even gonna go

for 300 it was so fucking bad dude but what's so and i love the assault bike and i'm like i know i do too that's my fucking mind what's so funny about that though is that there's no requirement within that 30 seconds you could have got on there for 30 seconds and just and and like just held a calorie right right right but you know i mean great and i mean intensity is all relevant to you you know as far as like what you wanted but that's what's funny about it. You just quit at that. Yeah, because I was so depressed because I thought I'm like, well, I'll do three. I go, hey, can I do 300? He goes, that was like the baseline for our gym. We told people they should aim for at least 300.

Yeah. And I'm like, holy shit that I mean, it was, you know, in like in like that's what I tell people too, about workouts like that. When you can mathematically figure it out within a first set or two, as far as where, where you're, where you're probably going to end up. It sucks. Cause that's when reality kind of sets in of what you got to put your body through to get to that point. You know, I mean, if you want 300 calories, that means you got to have a hundred and a, you know, 50 by the, you know, 15 minute mark, you know. And then you start breaking it down even more than that. Okay, I got to have 10 calories in 30 seconds or whatever.

And then all of a sudden you start getting all the numbers thrown out. It's like, shit, I'm falling off pace. Well, maybe I can go 12 this time and eight this time or eight and seven. I don't know. Yeah, it's crazy. Is it true that next year you'll be leaving Mayhem and going to HWPO? Yeah, that's exactly true. Those rumors are true.

Okay. Yeah, the rumors are true. You can clickbait that. Is it true? Is it true? The word on the street. Were you ever in the gym when Matt and Rich were in there together? Yeah. Yeah. And we're like from day one. I mean, no one knows Rich better than you were from day one.

We like up. This ain't going to end good. This is this is oil and fire. Were you like, oh, shit? No, no, no. You know, I mean, people people wanted to make that out more than, you know, I'm like what it was. It's just like the simple fact of, you know, it's like, I mean, sometimes there's just not a good mesh,

you know? And I mean, it happens all the time. Like with things, it's like, Hey, you know, you're different.

Darren, hold on. Let's let I, um, Greg, uh, Glassman and Dave Castro are prickly dudes like like if you if you enter in the room wrong though they will fuck you up you get a start off on the wrong foot with them

they will both like yeah it will not be fun yeah anyone in the room i i suspect it's very much i mean it could be i mean rich is a very nice guy he's a gentleman of the highest order yeah a little bit that i know him and a little bit I know Matt, it's the same way. If you enter the room wrong, if you get off on the wrong foot with them, boy, it's going to be tough getting back on the right foot with them. Matt's especially quirky. They're both kind of competing for the same thing. Earlier on, when Rich was still an individual, that was kind of competing for the same thing. It's like, you know, I mean, yeah, you know, earlier on, like when Rich was still an individual, that was a little, you know, that was kind of short, but even so it's like, Rich is one of the most competitive. I mean, Rich is, if not the most

competitive person within the sport. I mean, the guy, the guy will die on the competition floor, probably have to shoot him with a tranquilizer just to get them off of it. But, you know, so of course, like somebody walks in who all the media, everything else, people like you, yeah. Yeah. Who are like, Hey, this guy is going to take your spot. This guy's better than you. This guy is, you know, so it's like, you know, it's just like the same thing. Like if I hear something about somebody else of, Hey, this guy's a douchebag, this guy's an idiot. And all of a sudden I meet that guy, like in person, my first initial thought is, hey, I don't like you because everybody told me you are a douchebag.

Right. You know, and it's not like that that's what was, you know, people are telling that, but it's like, that's what CrossFit wanted. They wanted to see like this, like collide of Titans. Right. You know, like when Matt and Rich. Who doesn't?

Who doesn't? Exactly. Because controversy makes a better story than them hugging and frolicking through flowers and dancing with each other. And it's competitive. It's a sport. Yeah, 100%. So, yeah, I mean, of course. But did you know when the first time they're in the room together, you were like, like, I know when someone walks in the room and they meet Dave for the first time, if they say something stupid or to Greg, I'm like, oh, that's not going to work out.

That relationship's over. They won't be invited to dinner. Like, did you know? Oh, that's not going to work. Knowing Rich's personality and knowing Matt's personality. Yes, you would you you as you know, you as a person that knew both, you just knew that, yes, this this probably wasn't going to be, you know, the the best. Although, you know, there were times like where, you know, like, I mean, they were like, I mean, they were great together. They'd be laughing. They, you know, I mean, they'd be cutting up, but I think as the stress of the competition and, you know, other things started to, to build, I think that's just where that separation, it's almost like, um, I'm trying to think the best example,

but like when you're It happens with fighters in the same training camp that like they're getting along, getting long. And then a fucking few months before the fight, they're like talking crazy shit about each other. Seeing some like, okay, here, here we go. Like, uh, one of my best friends in, I'm a high school. I would see him every day, but it was for short snid bits of the day.

Well, there was, you know, so, you know, all the, I mean, we always hung out afterwards, stuff like that, but it was like hour, two, two, two hours. Then all of a sudden, like his, you know, family went off on vacation or, you know, like something like that. He had to stay with us for over a week. That was the most heated. And after that, like, we didn't talk like very, very much like, you know, a week or so after we were around each other all the time, you know, and it was kind of like that, you know, I mean, kind of like that feeling apart, you know, like where you got little snippets. Awesome. They, they, they, you know, they were great. But when you put yourself in that realm and you're around it, you're, you're, you're by somebody during the ups and downs, you know, and like, you see things that might annoy you or things that don't mesh well with you or not up to, you know, what you morally believe in,

that's where things start to happen. You get that magnet flipped around and it just throws. So do you think that, um, do you think that somewhere inside, um, uh uh rich wants to have a protege i think so um or or do you think it's sincere when he says yeah i'm just not good at coaching i'm not available emotionally you know how he'll say this shit or do you think that somewhere inside like he'd like to have a uh take someone under his wing i uh i think so too but i kind of think that rich kind of said it you know as well it's like coaching one-on-one is just not his style you know he is he rich is always willing to lend

a handout you know to help people i mean like you know to answer questions but i think you know, to help people. I mean, like, you know, to answer questions, but I think, you know, for him personally, it's like, he, he still wants to compete at the highest level. You know, even if, I mean, even if he's not rich does. Yes. Oh, so he, oh, wow. Okay. He does. I mean, but want to, Hey, but want to in like able to are like two completely different things. Right. Right. You know? And I mean like also for him too, he gets on kicks mountain biking. Okay. Now, now he wants to be the best mountain biker in the world, which scares the shit out of me. Cause he probably will be. Yeah.

And, and that takes me out of a job. So, you know, he better figure it out like with it. Meaning you want, you want to keep coaching him? Well, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. No, no. I'm just saying, you know, Rich being within the sport of a CrossFit is great for the whole MMA community.

Rich is awesome in it. Rich loves it. He loves all this. But, you know, if he goes dive bombing into mountain biking, well, he's a guy who goes all out into something, you know, then he's going to be mountain biking well he's a guy who goes all out into something you know then he's gonna be mountain biking which when he trained for the leadville he was mountain biking all day and that's all he thought about that's all he wanted to do his workouts were based around mountain biking what did um this is gonna be a weird question here uh justin v mountain biking

is too dangerous we can't have that um um so it's slamming your head on the ground for 100 reps every day um you're talking about burpees handstand push-ups but yeah still oh oh oh um i don't this is gonna sound this is gonna be a weird take i don't think rich can do biking because i don't think he's willing to get um smaller that small yeah i mean you basically have to turn into a waif yeah you have to have just be ass and quads i mean you have to let the entire upper body go you really do yeah yeah yeah no is he willing to drop down to 165 pound man i don't know you know i know i know could you could you imagine you know i would talk some hellacious shit about him if he got that skinny.

I mean, but it would be so fun to be like, what the fuck happened to him? I do. That's rich, rich for meth. Froning. Meth.

Meth. Froning. Somebody needs to render that image up. I, to make, what would the fittest man in the world look like if he did meth for a month? I think, I also think Rich knows that he could get himself back to the way that he is within a couple months, you know, or, or, or so, but it's what he'd have to put himself through

to get to, like you said, like that, you know, like that bottom weight position that would allow him to perform at the highest level. Cause him, him doing as well as he did for his first time at, you know, at the Leadville 100. Yeah. I think, you know, I'm, I'm hoping it didn't just light some crazy fire in him to where he's like, now I want to win it because I think I can. If it does awesome, I will be his biggest supporter at the same time. But at the other time, yeah, that is, I mean, for his lifestyle, that's just not going to work. Cameron, what's up, dude?

Not true. Look at Cam Haines. Runners aren't supposed to look like him. Here's the thing. I can't, all my friends who got into biking and a couple of biking events that I've been at, the dudes are the best guys have no upper body. Yeah. I mean, like they have like those model shoulders.

There's always going to be the one or two outliers too. It's like that. I'm not talking about good. You were talking about Rich wanting to be the best. Well, yeah, yeah, exactly. And you got to have some sort of weird body issues to be the best biker in the world or best runner. You just never see the best runner in the world is like at that distance is, is.

Yeah. I mean, a twig. Yeah. Skeleton. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

And that's what always, you know, like, I, like, I'd always tell people I would much look at Hunter McIntyre. Exactly. He's not, he doesn't run world-class times. Yeah. Yeah. And I was going to say, that's a point there, there, there too. But it's like, I would, I would train for the CrossFit games any day than I would try and be a world-class marathon runner. Say that again. You would what?

I would much rather put myself through a CrossFit, like trying to train for the CrossFit games any day, then try and train to be a world-class marathon runner, if not the best, to know what they have to put themselves through as far as sheer volume of just running and the weight they have to be at and holding sub five minute miles to me is just insane. Like I almost feel like, and again, I'm not saying that, you know, like I could win the CrossFit Games before I ran, you know, a sub five-minute mile for multiple miles. But I feel like one is more obtainable than the other. I'm not going to say which.

I don't want you clipping that. Say it. Say it. I will not. What's the most amazing thing you ever saw him do? Oh, I would say one of the coolest ones that I saw off the back was when he hit the 225 Isabel. And he did it in like three minutes or, you know, like something like that, because at that time, everybody like a 225 snatch, even, even at that time was a very respectable lift.

You know, it's like, I think, you know, he had, he had registered or like most people were hitting numbers of like a great, like, Hey, this is going to be my, my, my best lift for the year was like a two 75. So to hit two 25, you know, for 30 reps as fast at like, as he did to me, it was one of the coolest things watching it. Um, especially early on, look at that, the old and squat. Oh my God. And then the squat snatch it too, for, for a guy like me that struggled so much with snatching as far as heavy weight, to watch him do that, oh, the old threes too. Where is that?

What gym is that? That was the second. Yeah, that was the one that was downtown. And then right over there to the Wattify. Log your score, Rich. Come on, sign in. Wow, it was that. He didn't even miss a beat. He not miss one even tired yes that's the most incredible thing him signing in and doing all the signature

but uh yeah i i mean that that that to me was one of the coolest things then i think he went when he went to abacare down in um when he went to jerry world and and he did it uh uh on the stage um with the hologram because remember that they had the hologram of him doing it the year or two prior and they so they had froning versus froning i didn't know they did that or if i did i forgot wow yeah did you do it faster yeah beat yeah rich beat rich yeah rich rich yeah were you at that event were you at that person that can beat rich is rich were you at that event i was not i want to say um uh my cousin jj okay all right sorry it wasn't a hologram it was it was the actual video but yeah how many um how many people were there when he did that oh gosh there was uh there there was a lot. I don't want to butcher you.

Is it like 10,000 in the stadium? I was going to say it was in the Cowboys stadium. And yeah, when he came out, I just thought that was so cool to put himself, because like Rich shines the best when he's on the stage. He's one of those people, he's like a Brady and stuff like that, where he's clutch. Like the spotlight doesn't affect him. He just can do

clutch things and clutch moments. And that's something I try and like tell people to that, like, want to be at that top level. It's like, you gotta be able to hit those moments. You don't have to be perfect on them. Like you're, you're not going to go a hundred for a hundred, but it's gotta be a 60, you know, it's gotta be a 60, 40 or a 70, 30 30 you can't be a 50 50 guy or a 50 50 person you think that if rich continues biking that it would somehow hurt the bottom line of mayhem that fewer people would because is that were you just joking or you are you really no no no yeah yeah that's me i mean that's me i don't think me. I don't think it will. I don't think it will. Rich's legacy will stand the test of time because like I said, you know, it's.

Oh, I don't. Yeah, Darren. But if he didn't keep doing CrossFit, if he didn't keep. Yeah. I mean, the reason why Mayhem is so successful, I think is because he kept going team. Don't get me wrong.

Like it's successful because he won. But the reason why I think it's so successful is because he kept going team. Don't get me wrong. Like it's successful because he won. But the reason why I think it's so successful is because he kept going team and he was in the gym and just everyone and their mother passes through the mayhem empire. It definitely helps it. I mean, I will. I mean, I will not deny that 100 percent. Yeah. But Michael Jordan. What have you done for me lately?

Fans really are. What the hell? Here's the thing, though, too, is like everybody respects though a legacy michael jordan's shoes are still the top sellers right guy guy hasn't touched the basketball and god knows you know how long i mean i shouldn't say but guy has the michael jordan of crossfit you're right you know there's other really great um um basketball players that everyone's already forgotten already. Exactly. Like I bet you the magic Johnson shoe don't sell so good. No, no. You know, I mean, it does not.

Right. And yeah, but I mean, but like, seriously, it's like, you know, stuff, I mean, stuff like that, because that's what I always like tell. That's what I like tell people too, is like, I feel bad for people that got into this sport later. And in the sense of they missed out in my opinion of one of the golden, probably if not the best era of like CrossFit that 2011, 2012 to like 2017, you know, or so where it's like those those to me were like the best years where you saw, I think, the very best out of these athletes who did it, who did it because they wanted to win, who did it because, you know, they, they, they went in the gym, they either had a coach didn't,

I mean like didn't have a coach, but they were just, you know, the best of the best. They were, you know, the, the, the cream of the crop. And you know, to see Rich live or to see any of these guys live like Ben Smith back in his heyday, Scott Pancheck, you know, Matt, even, you know, his heyday scott pancheck you know matt even you know during like his round tia you know like back in her early days to see those people live at that time was the most unbelievable thing i mean in that tennis stadium the lights i mean you were there it was just one of the coolest feelings so yeah we're just getting old man

um well there's this there was this talk I had with. With Dave and then Andrew Hiller kind of ran with it the other day, also really fucking put the nail in the coffin. I don't know if you watch any of his content, but he put out a video. Yesterday, so so basically what happened was Mayhem released this newsletter that said CrossFit is over, and then Roy went on this podcast saying that was a fuck-up. We didn't mean to say that.

Dave was on my podcast. I don't think we talked about that specifically, but I told him what I thought CrossFit needed to do, what the athletes needed to do if they grow. And then Hiller really took it and put all of that shit together. The last 10 minutes of that video is nuts. If you haven't seen it, just go to the last 10 minutes but basically what he says is for every person he basically says how many people has rich froning introduced crossfit to

versus other people and he says for every piece of fruit rich running i think this is the metaphor used for every piece of fruit rich froning picked off the CrossFit tree, he put 10 more pieces of fruit back on the tree. And I'm not taking a dig at the other people, but I don't think CrossFit grows if the affiliates don't grow. I don't think that you get bigger sponsorships. I don't think that you get – I don't think that there's – you don't professionalize the sport. You don't PFAA it. The only way it professionalize the sport. You don't P F a,

a, the only way it, because if the affiliates go away, it's done. It is done. Bo buy toast. Yeah. And so you see someone like a rich or a Scott pan check who are really

immersed in the community, in the gym, in the gyms, in the gym space right that all the panchik brothers own a gym you know what i mean noah olsen's parents own a gym you know what i mean rich froning owns the gym these just these older athletes are um they're they're immersed in the game and i think that's the only way uh dude i think it's i i really believe it's the only way, uh, dude, I think it's, I, I really believe it's the only way it's going to grow. And other than that, people will, it will suffer if it goes the other way. If we just start trying, if we don't nourish the roots and people are just taking from

it and not giving to it, it will suffer. Well, and, and, you know, that's kind of the, that's, that's kind of the thing that always kills me about stuff like this is, um, these – they kind of follow their own model. They don't want to be consistent. They always want to throw you for a loop. They always want to keep you on your toes. But it's like when you find a recipe that works, it's the same thing that we deal with with a cell phone a shoe stuff like that it's like why do we just all of a sudden decide to flip it on its back and just go you know like the other example are you talking about like the the way you qualify

for the games like hey just yeah sure regional games is that yep yep okay yeah you know i'm like something that like i mean the open yeah the open is probably the best example. You know, again, you know, you go from five tests to three tests or whatever. It used to be cool. To it mattering, to it not mattering. Exactly. It used to be cool to win the open. Like I remember sitting on my computer, update, update, update. Like, hey, who's going to win?

Bailey doing the last workout three or four times in like three hours. It's like that shit was so cool. And it got people hyped up. The media was at the top of its game. That's when, you know, you were doing your thing and Heber was, you know, in it and stuff full on, like with CrossFit, there was so much stuff that was community based that got everybody excited. Like, you know, I mean, seeing, seeing like the Rich Froning shirts, you know, like the, the Jersey sales back then were, you know i mean seeing seeing like the rich froning shirts you know like the jersey sales back back then were you know completely different than you like what they are now it wasn't you're buying it because you know them you know it was like you bought them because you bought into them

right you know i mean um though you think the open should mean something again yeah it do it it was so much better and and again i think if you shit the bed at the open, you're fucked. Yeah, you're just fucked. Exactly. I mean, you know, but it was like, that's like, that's when it was so cool for those everyday athletes to get behind to get behind a athlete in the open, who are at the top of their game, or at least close to it. in the open who are at the top of their game or at least close to it and, you know, get excited about it. It's like, hey, I am team rich or I'm team mad or I'm team, you know what? I mean, I want to see them win the open. Now it's like, eh, you just make top 20 or top 200 or top 30 and you're good. It doesn't matter because they're just going to, you know, I might reconfigure it and throw you somewhere.

And I don't blame the athletes, but you hear athletes like Samuel Cornway or Sarah Sigmund's daughter, just straight up say the open doesn't matter. That breaks my heart. Yeah, it does. It does, you know, because especially as a,

I'm a competitive person, it doesn't matter. Or sorry, I don't want to say it doesn't matter. It matters. No, I mean, like no matter what,

if you are competitive, you should want to win regardless. It's like, you know, if you want to win the games, win the open, right. If you, you know, if you want to win the games, win the open, right. You know, if you, you know, if you want to win, you know, the games, when you're semifinals, it's like, don't, don't compete for, for, for mediocrity or just getting by. What about, um, and I don't, it's going to, for some people, it's going to sound like these

things are in conflict, but I don't think they're in conflict at all. What do you think about people who say, Hey, don't peak for the open peak for the games. That still doesn't mean you shouldn't try your hardest at the open, right? Yeah. That's a, that's a completely different level of fitness, open fitness compared to games, fitness, like open fitness. You got to be able to sell your soul for 10 to, for six to 12 minutes. I mean, I mean, I'm like, we'll just say, you know, and then, you know, and then after that you're done, you know, that's just mentally preparing yourself just for one workout each week of where, you know, your body's just gotta be ready to go. Now there are people like I've watched, I mean, I've watched this so many times of,

I've seen people who train way less perform way better than somebody that has trained for the open itself. I'll use Dre as a example, okay, who's one of the mayhem media guys and one of the mayhem athletes. Dre is one of the most unbelievable athletes I've ever seen in my life. The fittest to never make the games. This guy can flip a switch on the turn. I mean, like it's nothing. He would sit in the back, work on something for six to eight hours, pound a muffin, drink a monster, and go dominate if not. Oh, God. Wow, look at my hair.

Which one is Dre? Dre's Asian? Is that due to Asian? Yeah. Phil. Dre is. What does that do? Oh, no shit. I didn't know that but yeah but I mean but like seriously Dre Dre is just one of those guys you know who I mean who

could look at his fucking arm dude I know I know that's why that's why I put myself in the middle so my arms hide that's crazy it's so upsetting but no I mean but like that but like that level of fitness is different than the games you know is different than regionals you know regionals you have to be smart you have to know who's around you sectional stuff like that you've got to play the numbers game you know open you're trying to put out the best score possible you know you know i mean like the regionals you got to survive for the next workout the next Workout the next workout Let me read this comment Mason Mitchell Savon loves my mom

And yet he's never done her You're right I do Love your mom and I have never done it give her my number Please thank you I mean I have to read some Of the comments can't we just can't hoard all Of the that's your was that your son that wrote that? You watching?

Could be my... Could be. Yeah. But yeah, you know, it's just... I mean, it was just such a different time like back then. You know, it's... I mean, people talk about the good old days and stuff all the time. But I think there still could be athletes like that.

Yeah. old days and stuff all the time but i think i think there still could be athletes like that yeah i i don't i i don't think that there's some recipe that's driven people out of the i don't think there's some recipe that makes it so you can't you can't do what scott and rich have done the fittest the the fittest will still win i mean no no no matter what the openness laid out as you know whether it's a three workout five five, five, you're still going to see the top people at the top. Like, you know, I don't think that that will, will ever change, but I think of overall what it means to the whole community itself. You know, you definitely saw that dissipate. you definitely saw that dissipate. So, I mean, as far as determining who's the fittest, I still think you're still going to get the same result in the end. FanDuel Casino's exclusive live dealer studio has your chance at the number one feeling, winning,

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That's just me. I'm trying to think what it would look like if every athlete, you know what I mean? Yeah. It took, you know, one day a week and committed to something, to doing something for their local affiliate or for the community or for something just to reinvigorate. Because basically, and I'm saying to do it, like, I'm not saying to do it because you're altruistic. Do it for selfish reasons. Know that if you grow shit around you, that you then will reap the benefits, right?

If the game sells out, you make more money, right? So it's like, it's, it's just like NFL players find out NBA players, community outreach is what keeps their name alive. And again, it's like, yeah, you can be a little selfish with it of, Hey, I'm doing this for you. But at the same time, you know, you have to have the other side of it where I'm doing this because it's right. Because like you said, this is what, this is for everybody. This, these people have made me, I would not be where I am, who I am, all that stuff. It's like, when you drop the term, I, and start using the term, we, you will prosper so much better in this sport or just in anything. I mean, like, just like, you know, in my opinion, you got

to, athletes got to stop with the individual based up of i you know i did this no you did not we did this we brought you here you did not come out of the womb completely throw your mom and dad out the window and then just start feeding yourself and stuff you know again there there's a process there's a community everybody got somewhere because of something or because of somebody so did you ever Did you ever at the games say something to Rich that you're like, fuck, I shouldn't have said that. That was too lighthearted. Because you would keep things very light.

And obviously, the things that you did that made Rich comfortable could make other people uncomfortable. I always had to be like, holy shit, Darren's on on fire right now and whatever he's doing is working on rich but i could tell everyone else was like fuck this is weird because you because it's like basically we would see in his crossfit games dreams like leaving as he's like not in first place and you're like dude you suck you know what i mean like what do you want to do after if you when you lose what do you i mean you would just be just prodding him and he has like his hands in his head and he's sitting on the ground against the fucking rogue rig and i'm like wow this is how you i was not just a complete dickhead

but no you weren't a dickhead but like you were on a level with them that the rest it was like you guys were on acid and we weren't like we couldn't like go to where you guys were i'll say very very very well could have been if it's one thing I shouldn't say, I always say if it's one, but my dad at an early age, I learned from him, my dad is great at reading the room. Like he's really good at, at, at like understanding different emotions and knowing of when to joke with somebody and when not to joke with somebody, you know? And I think that kind of helped me in the long run as well, as I was able to kind of learn from him of like timing, timing is like everything of when to say something coaching as well.

You know, it's like, you can't treat every athlete in your gym the exact same. And that's a hundred percent what I felt like with Rich is, you know, I mean, I'm not going to talk to Rich the same way that I would like talk to my wife or, you know, like something like that. But it's like, you know, distractions are huge in those stressful situations. If I could, you know, be that person that could just, you know, help take his mind off of it. Because, you know, I found out, hey, you know, after we work out, what do we do?

We go do something else. We go wakeboard. We go to the lake. It wasn't just always CrossFit, CrossFit, CrossFit. I was trying to make it feel as much as being in the gym or at home in his barn where he was his best and try and replicate that at the CrossFit games. It's like, hey, after we got done working out at home, what do we do? We would downplay each other. We would make what do we do? We would downplay. I'm like each other, you know, we would like make fun of each other. We would, you know, say something. So, you know, you, you try and like bring that and you try and bring that environment to them or to your, your athletes.

That's amazing. That's amazing. Who is that in the front there? That's me. That is you? That's what I used to look like. Do you know, you look like, what's his name there? The guy from Deadpool. Ryan Reynolds? Yeah, you look like Ryan Reynolds. Oh, thanks, man. Yeah.

Thanks. That's a compliment. Yeah. And then my younger brother, Dustin, is right behind him. Oh, is Dustin Asian? No, he is not. He's just squinting because we're going at the speed of light. a compliment yeah and then my younger brother dustin is right behind him oh is dustin asian no he is not he's just squinting because we're going at the speed of light uh dustin needs a either dustin or rich needs a patch going the speed of light we are hauling uh dan guerrero seven have you ever signed up for the Open? They absolutely love ripping you here away. Hey, go in all your free time, Dan,

go look it up. Go through the... Type my name into Google and see if I've ever signed up. I'll tell you, if there was 300 air squats in an Open workout with a vest... Yeah, I'm prepping for it. Yeah, they better crown the CrossFit Games champion Then and there

Heidi Kroom Dan he borderline invented the open Dan You won't no not Dan Oh Not Dan Not Dan He borderline invented the open

Darren are you Asian I am not So just Not Dan. Not Dan. He borderline embedded the open. Darren, are you Asian? I am not. I am not. So just don't assume. I'm German. Are you a boy? Last time I checked.

I don't want to assume. Last time that I measured, I am. This thing that you said about uh uh reading the room emotionally and um timing are you are you a good husband you think you if i asked your wife hey he understands when to talk to me and his timing's good because my wife says talking to me is all about timing yeah you know are you good with your wife in regards to that? Growing up like with six brothers or well, five brothers, I, that was, that has been an adjustment because, you know, going from boys and, you know, the emotional side of things and then girls, you know, and that's something also as a father is what to say, when to say, and also you learn about different emotional stuff as well. It's like

this stuff they didn't teach in sex ed class. And it's like, and of course that's not the stuff that I paid attention to. Right. But I would, I would, I am, I am a good, oh man, that's really tough for me to answer. I would like to think that I'm a good husband, but I always need, I always need more and more work or I could always need more and more work. Let me ask you this. Is it important to you to be a good husband? It is. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, have you ever had somebody tell you it's not?

I mean, hopefully not. Right, right. Okay. So you're saying it's a shitty question. Okay, fair. Yeah, yeah yeah yeah but no no no it's i mean i mean if it's if it's one thing that i do like to do i also do do like to listen but at the same time you you do learn me me and my wife are almost like the same besides she's a woman and I'm a man, obviously. But, you know, unlike that sense, we are very competitive people. So we can never work out together because we would kill each other because we both want to win.

So and that's also the thing. I mean, just like you said, timing. Like if she's having a bad day, I also have to kind of think, okay, how would I want somebody to talk to me if I'm having a bad day? Usually it's just don't talk to me, which is such a great thing. You know, it's like, Hey, we'll just deal with this, you know, like, you know, later or something like that. But if it's one thing or just, just does a great job where she, she doesn't hold on to anything too long. Like if we're mad at each other, that's amazing well i hey hold on let me finish okay okay okay because that's not a strong suit for a lot of women they have seasons these motherfuckers have seasons now now granted now grant if you do something that kind of lines up

with what you fought about 10 or 20 days ago or 10 years ago then it gets brought up but if you can stay away from that but yeah no she what what's so funny about it is like if we're both mad at each other like we just get done fighting you know because everybody fights whether people want to say they do it's instagram versus you know i'm like i don't think if you i don't think if you're if you're not fighting in a relationship i think you have a problem exactly because probably the relationship's constipated yeah i mean that like like yeah you're headed you're headed for a day it's gonna spill the top of the dam. It's not going to be pretty. A hundred percent.

Yeah. And that's the, and that's the other thing too, is you need to understand when something or like when to say sorry, but also how to let things go and realize it's not a big deal. Like, you know, there are, there are things that my, there's times like we're sitting there silent treatment, no one's talking. And all of a sudden, like I i i start to smile because i'm kind of looking at her to see like if she's mad and all of a sudden i'll catch her looking at me because she's trying to see if i'm mad and then we'll just start laughing you know it's just one

of those things where okay then it's over with it may last a couple days like that doesn't happen until a few days later right and i always feel like like i'm never in a fight and like i'm happy i'm fighting yeah i'm like fuck dude i just want I'm never in a fight and like, I'm happy I'm fighting. Yeah. I'm like, fuck dude. I just want this shit to be over. Well, and you know, like when I was little and, uh, me and my mom would like get into it or something like that, you know, parents and stuff like that. But, um, um, uh, I had a really bad stutter at a younger age, which I still do, but at

that time. So it's like when I would want to argue like with her, the emotions would start getting to me. And of course, if you have a stutter and you're trying to argue with somebody, it's a hundred times harder to say what you want to say, because now you can't get the words out and makes you more frustrated. So it's half the time. I just, you know, you just walk away pissed off at eight, nine years old. Cause you couldn't say what you want it to. And like, that's something. Cause you couldn't say what you wanted to. And like, that's something too, you know, like when I, you know, let's just say that we fight, it's like, I have to try and control that as much as I can. Cause if I can't say what I want to say, then it's really going to get bad. Cause now I'm getting even madder. What is stuttering?

I don't know. I don't know if I was just dropped in, you know, in a well or something at a young age and just kind of came out. But like, it's it's a nervous thing. You know, it's it's something. So it's a coping mechanism. It's kind of like not it's it's not like real. It's well, you know, it's yeah. Yeah. Who knows? I mean, sorry, I shouldn't say who knows because people obviously who are experts, someone thinks they know. Yeah, exactly. But I mean, it could be shouldn't say who knows because people obviously who are experts. Someone thinks they know. Yeah, exactly. But, I mean, it could be a number of, like, different things. But for me, it's nerves, you know.

It's just, like, when I get overexcited about something, you know, you get going. And sometimes what you're thinking is way ahead than what you're actually saying. When I was a kid and I learned how to burp Remember when you learned Did you ever learn how to do that? No I can't burp I have a disease my man You have a I can't burp disease?

Yeah that's exactly it No I mean yeah I just I can't burp like I can't make myself burp It's happened but it's like Can you burp if you drink sparkling water too fast? Can you whistle? No. The only time that I would burp is if I drank an excessive amount of beer or something like that, and I just made myself throw up.

You don't burp? I never heard of no one who doesn't burp. It's like 20 years of burping just comes out of me at once. It's like, my mom would love you. My mom hates burping. Anyway, I, when I first learned how to burp, I would do it all the time as a little kid. Yeah. Like, like, and then eventually I was just always burping. I didn't even know it. Someone's like, Hey, you just burped. I'm like, I did. And now I notice on this show, on this show, I burp like crazy. Just be tapping in the middle of a conversation with somebody. I just start burping. Yeah. And I wonder if stuttering is like that, like one time you use it as a coping mechanism and then you just start leaning on it. Yeah, I mean, I mean, it could be you could write a book about it. I won't read it, but yeah, it could be. You could write a book about it. I won't read it, but you could. Jake Chapman, have you tried to drink piss?

You mean to cure his he can't drink fraud problem? I have not, but thanks, Jake. I'll try that. I'll filter that down. Have you tried to drink this? I want to know the guy that has said that Are you going to have a fourth? What? Are you going to have a fourth?

I would like to You would? Yeah, I would say If we're able to I mean, Jess came from a family of three older brothers So four of them And then me coming from a larger family I absolutely love it.

I wouldn't change it. So how long have you been married? Been married since 14, so almost 10 years. Excuse me? So, sorry, we've been married since 2014. Oh, 2014. You freaked me out for a second. Okay.

And your oldest kid is um uh five yeah so six years ago you just stopped using protection and and is it really like that just six years of just yeah and fly no so we so so we tried prior um and uh uh and then just actually miscarried And then after that After that it was weird It was like a year and a half to almost two years Like you know we kept trying You know we kept Going through all this stuff Then we went and saw a

I'm a specialist and we did the whole IUI thing I what? Wait IUI Okay good So you said it wrong Okay good cause I never heard of IUI but something Caleb will know

Something starts with an I You did something starts with an I There we go I know the I is the right IVF Oh look there's an IUI too Holy shit So with that we did the IVF

Which kind of sounds weird cause our first child's name is Ivy. So IVF. But yeah. So then we did that. Wow. Colorful language too. Man, I don't have to read this. Insemination.

That's a great word. You take the dollop of semen and you inseminate it. Wow. That's scientific. It's exactly like what I said when I walked in there, this is what I want. This is what I'm going to do. But, uh, but yeah, so then after, after that process and this was what I guess it'd be 2017 when we were trying it, 2018. And, uh,

that was right when I was on the team with Rich and then the year, the next year when I did the, uh did the first year of the four person team. So 2018. And yeah, then then right after that, we're we're able to have Ivy and then haven't had issues since. We've been very, very fortunate. But but basically, that's what it's like when you want to have kids. You don't ever just you never have to worry about birth control. No. Ever.

Just keep having kids yes yes god that because i was with my wife forever and then and then we were always using birth control we was condoms i'm i was born in 72 we've gone sheepskin dude jesus criming and then um and then and then she got pregnant and she had she had a miscarriage yeah and then And then she got pregnant and she had a miscarriage. Yeah. And then she got pregnant again and we had the kid. But then it was on. Do you know what I mean? Like, I couldn't even fucking believe it.

Well, no, no, no. I mean, it was off, but it was on, yes. It was on. Yeah, it was off. Yeah. Yeah. I just couldn't believe, like, you could have sex. I didn't know you could have sex with a girl without a condom on.

I didn't even know. And then it just was like just five years of just no pun intended. Mayhem. Yes. That's exactly, that's exactly how we got our name. Exactly. We're going to call it mayhem.

He called you, Rich called you one day and he's like, what are you doing? You're like mayhem, mayhem. He's like, all right, Jim, that's the gym name. All right. All right. See you in five. God, isn't it? Do you like your wife when she's pregnant? Like do you find her like, like a more emotionally, physically and attractive?

Like just like, wow. Yeah. Seeing, especially seeing like what they put themselves through, like the, the, the appreciation. I mean, the, you know, level of like appreciation of like, holy cow, you know, cause like, you know, the comments are always made, you know, men, I'm like, men could never do this. And I a hundred percent agree. I never do that. I agree. You know, it's, I mean, that's, I mean, that is, that is a different level there. I, when my wife got pregnant, I'm like, aren't you scared shitless? She's like, thanks. And like, how it all-

How are you going to get that out of you? Explain that to me. It's like the ship in the glass jar. You know that thing can't come out through that opening, right? When we were in the hospital, you know, and I mean, for our very first, I mean, there's no movies or anything out there that ever prepares you for what's about to happen. But, you know, we're sitting there and stuff and we're looking at the doctor. Jess is propped up, you know, got the legs here.

And and then all of a sudden I see this thing above him start lowering and it's all these lights and like all these. I'm like, you know, I'm like, like looking around. I go, what's going on? Is this like saw? I was like sitting there. I'm like, oh my God, is it going to touch me? It's just crazy. And I'm like, just that I was like, this is, you know, and what do you say to somebody going through something like that? Cause you know, coming from a coaching background, it's like, you know, do I talk to her? Hey, you know, 10 more seconds, hold on. You know, we're almost through this five minute and wrap. It's like, all right, we're going to rest. We're going to get a heart rate down. Let me go get my spoon and my ladle here and

get ready for this kid. It's like, geez. Does she want more? Yeah. Yeah, you're stoked, dude. Now, like I said, if we're able to and everything still. What do you mean? Just taking a toll on her body? Just having babies? Yeah. And, of course, like, you know, the older you get, the chances of things happening and, you know, stuff like that, the risk, you know. And, yeah, of course, the toll that it takes on them how old

Are you I mean how old is She I mean how old is she 33 Oh okay My my I had my first one At 43 my wife was 39 She had she had the twins at 41 that's I Just shit him out on the fucking

Living room floor dude But hey, dude. Go get the napkins. After the second, it was like that. It was like Home Depot tarps and shit. It was like that, dude. But the second miscarriage, she almost died, dude. And she said she wasn't going to have any more kids.

I mean, yeah. But I still was like so excited. We still didn't use protection. And I got twins. Yeah. I'll say, you know, I mean, that's, but I, but I still was like, so excited. We still didn't use protection and I got twins. Yeah. I'll say, you know, I mean, that's, you know, I'm like good for her. I'm like, just as far as that, that sense. Cause yeah, I, I couldn't imagine going through something like that. You know, that's always cool with not having that experience. Yeah. I, I, I am too. I, I am too. Okay.

And I'm so glad they get to do it. And I know her, but yeah, I know. It's like, I'm glad rich won the games too. And I'm glad I, I get to know him, but like, I, I, that looks too hard for me too. A hundred percent. And that's, you know, I love the comment that everybody makes. You're like, Oh, I wish I could just work out all day like you guys. Or, you know, or.

Oh, right, right. Oh, my God. That is one of the funniest ones. It's like if you actually understood what it took and what you put your body through. I mean, I was at a lesser level trying to do it. I couldn't imagine, you know, what the T is, the mats, the rich and all them, you know, putting themselves through. And, you know, outside the toll, the family toll like that, it takes as well. It's like that's it's just a whole different thing that no one will ever understand unless they go through it.

You know, it's like war. It's like all that stuff. Unless you're there, you just don't know. Do you do you do you love going to mayhem and letting your kids run around with Rich's kids? Look, you did it. You put your thumb up. I do. We have to figure out how to turn that shit off. That is embarrassing.

What if we get a real guest on here and it's not Darren? Exactly. But yeah, I mean like being – You just love sitting on the porch with Rich and just like looking at all your kids playing and just be like, holy shit, dude, we're doing it. It's a crazy reality just to look at as far as being 17. And he was, he was just, he was just turning 21, you know, from like where we started and then to where it is now, you know, how the landscape changed, how people that have cycled in it, you know,

people that have cycled in and out of your lives for those, you know, 14 years or, you know, however long it's been, the people that came and went, you know, the things that happened like in between it's, you know, it's so crazy because everybody's like, Hey, don't blink. Your life will pass you by. And it's like, at the time, it's one of those things. You never understand it until you look back. You're like, dude, those years flew by. But it's cool, right? You're glad you put in all the hard work.

And relationships aren't easy. Like, I'm sure relationships aren't easy. You stay close to your cousin. You have a wife. Relationships are fucking hard, but it's worth it. It is a hundred percent to like see to see your your kids be able to do the things that you grew up loving as a kid. Just like you. I mean, you know, just like you said, you always want to skateboard here. You want to do that stuff and you're letting your kid have have that life that you always wanted. Well, the same thing. I'm like the other side of me is,

I mean, I didn't have a hard life. It's not like I grew up in poverty or it's like, I didn't have anything. I had, I had an amazing life. I had a bunch of brothers, I had a bunch of cousins and I loved it so much that I wanted my kids to have that as well. Like all my brothers are having kids now, you know, and my cousins are all having kids around us. So it's like to know that they're gonna have that oh my gosh it's awesome what do you guys do any crazy big family reunions uh i mean like we it's if you like being around like my or like our family and stuff like we get together pretty much two to three times a week i I mean, all of us, like, you know,

you mean like with your mom and dad and shit, like, I'm like mom and dad, cousins, you know, brothers and stuff. Like we're all three times a week. Oh yeah. I'm like, we're, we're always like doing something. Like we're either building something or helping some out at their house, you know, or we're just hanging out or like playing sports. Like, you know, we got together before the lions game on Sunday and we played, you know, football and we all, you know, got together. So, I mean, that's, uh, you know, as much as we're getting older, we still feel like we're still younger. And, you know, that's what I love. Like we did a go-kart, you know, thing years and years ago, like at my house we did, you know, we, we do all this stuff just. Yeah.

did you know we we do all this stuff just yeah what do you think the key is to um so so you and richer you and richer um uh cousins good friends um boys will be boys we fight with each other we get over it then you get a wife and he gets a wife and and things get more complicated obviously right and other people start having pains what do you think the key to having a um a good what do you think the key is is to having good relationships those are two really sounds like high quality relationships you have one with your wife ones you should be proud of and the one you have with rich what do you think the key is like some people might say it's communication others say trust others might say forgiveness do you have a yeah i mean like understanding you know you just have to you have to realize too that other people have lives but you know um have ever like you know like you like get those you you run into people and uh you know like that you haven't

seen in a while and they're like oh you never reached out to me. And it's like, well, Hey, well the phone works, you know, I mean like both ways and stuff like with rich or, you know, like with rich and my like cousins and like stuff, it's like we, you know, I'm like, we never say that. It's like, you know, if you don't talk to some of them for like a long time, as soon as you see, you know, I make each other, it's like, you never left, you know? And it's it's i would never say that to someone and i would say i'm great at long-term relationships too yeah yeah you never waste a second saying that to someone you never reached out yeah you and i know those people who say that to me like yeah i'm just like are you out of your fucking mind we're with each other right now and

that's how you're gonna spend your time with me yeah and it's like yeah you you should never expect that you know i mean you should never expect that. You know, I mean, you should never, you know, I mean, like being, being, being grateful was something that I was always taught. It's like, Hey, you'd be grateful because there's, you know, I mean, because of this, there's always somebody that has it worse, you know? And then, you know, I lost some, or, you know, I mean, I lost family members, somebody else lost their whole family or like somebody grew up without a family, you know, it's like, you know, stuff like that, learning that at a young age and all, and like all my cousins and brothers having that understanding, I always appreciate that. Cause when you get outside of that shit and you get into, let's just say a

group of friends or families that don't have that and everything is nitpick, everything is, well, she said, you know, he said kind of deal. It's, it is, is, is is so toxic it's just like social media and you know i'm at all that stuff it's like everybody loves to read about negative but it's like how often do you you're like you see more negative stuff than you ever see positive and and it should never be like that so you're you're saying i'm i'm interpreting it just for my, for my brain. Don't put demands on a relationship. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, Hey, you know, you have to talk to me three times a week or Hey, you know, I didn't text me back in 20 minutes. Yeah, exactly. It's like, you know, I mean, Rich and I, and you know, a lot of, we're in all these different, you know, like text threads.

It's like, if no one answers your text, you don don't you don't text that thread be like hey did you guys get my text or hey did anybody it's like oh they didn't read okay well not a problem on to the next on to the next you know meme or on to the next thing it's like you know life i mean everything goes on it's you know everybody gets so caught up on just like one thing of what one person says and oh what about this this line um if you are that kind of person you'll never get to hang out with cool people like rich froney like if you need so if you like the last thing rich can do is respond to every text message he has to choose like three people he can respond to every so he's like okay my mom and my wife and uh the ceo ofhem, whoever that is.

Those are the only three people I'm going to pick up with always. And everyone else can go fuck himself. That's how I run my life. Right. Actually, he has to like you'll never be friends with Rich if you expect a response back every time. There's no fucking way. Yeah. And so you won't know any great people if you're that kind of person who says you didn't reach out to me. You'll be stuck with douchebags. Exactly. Exactly. And, you know, and like that's kind of crazy. The irony in that. It honestly is. And it also kind of like it kind of goes back to like what you know, like what friends you want around you. Do you want friends that tell you, you know, I'm like I may tell you what you want to hear or have friends that tell you what you need to hear.

It's like, you know, if you just surround yourself like with hype mans, you're just going to get bullshit, you know, all the time. You're never going to get those, you know, just that feedback of things that keep you in check. And I mean, and that's what I love about, again, you know, the family cousins and myself like that is like we can keep each other in check with the amount of respect given back saying, again, you know, the family cousins and like stuff like that is like, we can keep each other in check with the amount of respect given back saying, oh, thank you. You know, not like, oh, what the hell, you know, or, or, Hey, you know, I'm like, why'd you say like that? And it's like, we never attack each other. You know, that's one of my biggest pet peeves is the way somebody opens up a conversation with you and their voice is raised and they sound like they are attacking you because then as a person you go right into defense mode and then you start getting these things of wow i don't like you because you're yelling at me rather than hey you know

if we have a problem let's calm down let's talk about it or hey you know may want to think about this you know just along those lines i've noticed i didn't realize like when my kids whine i didn't notice that me and my wife ever whined until i had kids and then i noticed my kids whine and then i'm like oh shit me and my wife whine and it's much more subtle when adults do it yeah i'm like holy shit yeah exactly wh mean mining is such a what a fucking stupid thing one of the worst sounds especially like when they you know not a good trade it doesn't help anyone it's like a pity party and they're like oh i'm just so tired oh yeah yeah i'm like wow that sounds like me sometimes i'm like yeah it is it, the things that you pick up on. And again, the stuff that,

you know, it does, it just, it just sets you up just for failure on it. It's crazy. Um, you, you, you, you opened with two girls and then you had a boy. Yeah. I don't have any girls. Um, if I had another baby, I think I never thought I would say that I want one or the other, but I think if I had another baby, I'd want a girl. But if I'm going to be completely honest, also, I'm really happy. I have boys. Yeah. Um, and some of my friends are like, Hey dude, you're so bummed. Girls are so much better. Like, like just straight. Tell me that. Were you happy you had a boy? Was it like, okay, this is awesome. Like there was some sort of like, Tell me that. Were you happy you had a boy? Was it like, OK, this is awesome. Like there was some sort of like there's like girls, you got a bunch of wood and with boys, you got steel and you like working with steel or vice versa.

Girls are steel. And you got like, do you feel like there was something you were going to be able to impart to a boy? Or was there a different reaction you had to a boy than a girl? I'll tell you, having girls really did. I honestly think, kind of filled a void that, I mean, that I was missing. You know, just having kind of, one, teaching patience, but two, like, empathy, you know, and, like, all that stuff, you know, as far as, you know, just taking, because, like, with a boy and with brothers and all that stuff, you know, you can, I mean, like you can be, you know, in a sense, rougher with them. You can be a little harder on them and stuff because it's a boy, you know, that's, that, that's, that, that's the way they're like, that's the way society, you know, how it's always been is, you know, you want to try and mess that, but now, you know, like with

girls too, as well, you know, you want to make sure that you can bestow those traits as well. You can be tough on them, you know, you can teach them stuff, but at the same time, they are so good at teaching you how to be a better person. You know, it's like where they've actually taught, taught me how to like take my level down a little bit, be a little calmer with things and how to actually, you know, give them that, you know, give them that different type of love, you know, where I can still give them tough love, but I understand now, oh, what that, I mean, what, what everybody talks about, what, you know, dad talks about being a, I'm a girl dad, you know, I never knew what that was.

What does that look like? Can you give me an example of that? What would that look like? What does that look like? Can you give me an example of that? What would that look like? So, I mean, like with my mom, so my mom, she was never abusive. I want to say that right off the bat. My mom was an amazing woman. But if we were getting out of line, it's like, hey, I mean, you're going to get hit. It was like, hey, if you're not behaving get hit. Yeah. You know, it was like, Hey, if you're not, I'm like, you know, I'm like behaving or anything like that. And, um, you know, of course,

Hey, when you, how many boys did you, how many, there were six of you all together. Yeah. Yeah. See,

here's the thing too, that people don't realize. Let me just add this in there. There's things you can do to your kids when you have six kids or three kids that you can't do when you have one kid. Yeah. Like, so for instance,

my three boys can be in the shower together and they can start rough housing. I can be like, fuck you get out, turn off the the shower take him to the garage and make him do 100 burpees yeah all three of them yep you do that to one little girl you're a fucking abusive asshole you do that to three boys and you're teaching them like okay it's it's us against you dad yeah exactly like yeah it's a total different yeah it is yeah so so when you have a mom who's slapping around six boys that's different than a

mom's drunk mom slapping around one boy you got six fucking boys yeah exactly like it's a different yeah it's different i totally agree it's so a different game yeah but you know so like knowing that as far as you're like what we went through getting that like respect and stuff you know like when i had you know like when i had a girl so like when I had Ivy, I had to try and find where that common line was because exactly like you said, there were six of us boys, but I couldn't be like that to my one daughter. Right. You know, I actually had to learn how to, you know, how to communicate with her one on one and actually, you know, get her to understand rather than, hey, you're going

to get a spank in her. Hey, you know, you're in go kneel. You know, it's like, it, it, it almost taught me of how to answer the famous question that every kid has. Why? Well, the famous answer we would always get was because I said, well, you know, when you're around six boys, you know, all at different ages, that kind of registers differently with everybody because now, you know, you got, well, mom's just being an a-hole or, you know, or, oh my God, you know, this is awful. Now it's like, Hey, I got to explain to this girl why I'm yelling or why I'm upset, you know, bring that down, you know, a little bit. And again, you know, teacher from there to there. So, you know, from being a, you know, from like being a kid around all

of it now to being a parent with a single kid that's where i had to make that or try and mend that um uh seven did you let do you let him put on clothes first yeah fuck yeah i i actually would turn off the shower and throw him three towels and then take took him straight to the and it ended up being the best night ever we stayed in there and worked out for like two hours yeah go in the streets and do burpees yeah well i took him to the garage it was fucking freezing it was awesome we bonded that night you know and uh that's something too that uh you know with parenting it's like you gotta make sure that you and your wife are on the same page like with parenting which was something that you know jess and i struggled early on you know you know my wife still struggle exactly yeah we

do we fought one day a month for fucking 10 years and then we had kids and it was fucking like whoo yeah you know because couple again and and then that's it it's like everybody was raised different you know what just was yelled at as a kid and what i was yelled at at you know for as a kid could have been you know i, I mean, a completely different side. So it's like trying to find where that common ground is of like, hey. You know, this is how we want our kids to be brought up, you know, you know, but then, you know, also getting us to understand, hey, we're not your friends, we're your parents. parents, you know, I, I, I mean, I think nowadays that's something a lot of people struggle with the most, and I'm not calling out parents in general because I call it myself like every day, but is, you know, being that parent to your kid and not being that, that a best friend,

you know, it's tough. It is. the um someone was that someone was asking uh earlier um seven do you fight with your wife frequently it's kind of it's definitely not frequently i can't stand fighting and the fights are nothing like they were before when we had kids and i've said this many times if we ever fight in front of the kids i have a very strict rule that you have to make up make up in front of the kids too always always even if i have to fake it like i will fucking make up my kids are going to see me make up with my mom and they're going to see me like how i want them to be in a good relationship but but truly what you just said i can't think of anything we don't fight about money we don't fight about like all the stupid shit we fight about is just me like hey, dude Why'd you park there? Hey, dude. Why is that cat? I just stepped on that stool

She never does she never bitches at me. She my wife never Never nags me like I can just I can just go into the garage and just vanish for five hours And she won't even like she don't even care. She's so she's so cool, but If I fucking do something to the boys that she doesn't like Like if I grab one of them by the boys that she doesn't like, like if I grab one of them by the arm and she goes, Hey, you disrespected him.

Fuck. It's on man. It's on like donkey Kong. And, uh, and, and I get it and I'm, and I'm, and I'm trying to learn and,

uh, say that. I mean, yeah, yeah. You know, I mean, that is a relationship with someone that you don't have that other shit

figured out first. Good luck. Yeah. The kids are going to complicate some other shit. If you're already like fighting over money and shit or something like that, or you're in a relationship with someone and you don't have that other shit figured out first, good luck. Yeah. Because the kids are going to complicate some other shit. If you're already, like, fighting over money and shit or something like that or you're in a lot of trouble. I'll say if you are fighting over money prior to kids and you have kids, you realize everything costs a lot more. Yeah. And that's a different – but, yeah, you know, it's – again, I mean, I was taught with a belt and spoon.

Other people were taught – Wooden spoon? Wooden? Oh, yeah. Hell, I mean, I mean, I was taught I was taught with a belt and spoon. Other people were taught, you know, wooden, wooden. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Hard. I got a little I got a little wooden spoon. Not a lot.

No belt. Fuck. Yeah. Yeah. But but, you know, like I said, to my parents credit. And again, it's not like they were ever abusive. But imagine trying to get six kids in line, you know, to sit to sit in church for an hour being quiet, you know, to go to a grocery store. Because back then, you know, dad, you know, I mean, dad worked until five.

Mom was at home with the kids. Yeah. Like my mom had to get stuff done. It's like she did not let the house become a wreck. She made sure we're all fed, made sure that she was able to still get us to doctor's appointments and all this other stuff. So it's like, yeah,

I can a hundred percent understand. I got the broomstick. Oh damn. A fist and coffee table. Your dad would slap you with a coffee table, pick a cup of Renee K. I got the bell. He's like,

hold on. He's like, hold on. Let me go get the coffee table. Don't move. Yeah. Hey, dude. I'm sure you lived it, but my three boys will be just going crazy in our bedroom and we'll tell them to stop 100 times.

And like, and they're just jumping off the bed, banging off the walls, hitting each other with towels. It's just fucking chaos. And me and my wife are maybe just in there trying to get dressed. And we've each told him to stop five times. And like, at that point, I had basically have to be like, hey, baby, you got to leave the room because you're not going to like what's about to happen. Yeah. And they're like, what? What are you going to do?

Yeah. You know, like, and I'm just like, holy fuck. It's like being at the zoo with the monkeys and they're throwing shit at you. Yeah. I'm like, yeah, you know, like you're on meth, dude. It's crazy. Yeah. I can only imagine how six would be.

Well, especially if they're fighting with each other and someone's got to get the last hit. And you're like, oh, my God. Yeah, I know. I know. And again, like I said, that like my mom, I mean, looking back on it, I give her all the credit in the world because every parent, every first time parent learns at that moment how hard it really is. Yeah. It's just just having one. Yeah. And then all of a sudden you start thinking about, OK, how to how three it's like, holy cow, you know, So it is worth it. No one listened to this. Who's like, it's crazy. It is so, there is no, there is no better part or, you know, like as a parent, then like the things that you've tried to teach your kid for months and you haven't heard or haven't seen an off son, like they do it

that day. Like they say, thank you to like a, a, a stranger, you know, that like, you know, says something to them or, you know, like they hold the door or they finish all their food. It's like, those are the moments that are worth it. When you see them say, thank you, God, I'm so glad you said that. You just are like, yeah, that's my fucking kid. Like you won the game. Like, seriously. I mean, like as soon as like I hear it, I'm like, thank you, Ivy. I mean, I like say it back. I'm like, thank you. I'm like, that is amazing. It's like, it. I mean, like as soon as like I hear it, I'm like, thank you, Ivy. I mean, I like say it back. I'm like, thank you. I'm like, that is amazing. It's like, it's one of the best, best things. It's like, I, I, I never want my kid or I like, I never want my kids to be those kids that can't be controlled by other

people. You know, I mean, you know, I don't ever want to be, you want to be a dog that you can take out that doesn't bite people or jump out of the car and shit. Yeah, exactly. I don't ever want to get a call from a teacher saying, hey, I cannot get your kid to calm down or, you know, or like grandparents or aunts or something like that or watching them saying like, hey, you're you know, I'm like your kid needs you. You know, I want you know, I mean, I want my kid to feel like that they can you know, that they can survive out there with it. You know, I don't want them to feel like that. They always need dad. Would you ever think about homeschooling your kids? No, no, never. How come? No, never. I, I loved, I loved elementary, middle school, high school.

I loved it too. Yeah, it is. That's where, that's where I made all of my friends. That's where I was really taught respect and that everybody, there are other people that have it worse than you and stuff like that. It's like, you know, I, that really made me appreciate. I love seeing like my daughter, my youngest or my oldest who just started preschool. She's so excited about school. She loves like dropping her off. She doesn't even hug me. She literally like, as soon as the teacher opens the door, she sprints in, you know, all the other kids, or I shouldn't say all the other kids, some are being held by her parents and they don't want to go. She's so excited. And I love that. That's one of the coolest things. Paige Powers, you were, you were all up in her shit this year at the games. Like she was your girl. You were everywhere. I saw her uh behind the scenes you were with her she did great page page is awesome did you enjoy that and what's is that the first time you've been at the crossfit games with a woman coach the woman have you done that for second time so so so the year prior which would have been her rookie season or whatever you know i mean I'm like, we were there and like a lot, that was a learning, you know, experience of, Hey, this, you know, this is harder than it looks this year.

She came in there, had amazing confidence, you know, and, and what was cool is she felt like she belonged, you know, it's like, um, I mean, I always say it, I, you always see it to like, when people come to work out with, with rich who may be games or you know aspiring to be at the games and uh you know you see them getting extra rich and all of a sudden they're nervous or like they're just not performing the way that they are and that's kind of like page's first year she was so nervous being by athletes that she looked up to or maybe idolized and i mean this is one of the coolest moments i've ever been you know like been a part of or witnessed because she had just failed. She had just failed prior.

So like the so so her her snatch, the very last snatch. So she said she had two attempts at snatch, two attempts at clean jerk. She failed her last snatch. So and in this format, which I hated, I hated the layout of this one one because if you were back in the warmup area and Paige had to lift last. So if you know, like in the athlete corral, they're all underneath the stadium and they line every athlete up. Well, everybody gets to warm up and then line up. Well, if you go first, you just came off a warmup a minute or two prior. Paige had to wait 15 minutes.

Wow. Almost. Wow. Okay. But she missed the second snatch. Is that her mom and dad right there? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. That's her mom and dad. That's a good looking couple. That gray hair dude's her dad? Yeah. Kevin's awesome. Laura's great. She's got a great family.

Those are friends and grandma and grandpa. But for her to step- That's grandpa or dad? dude so great great kevin okay that's her dad and then the guy next to him is his dad no shit that dude looks younger than the other dude right they look awesome they're yeah that's a good looking family wow awesome look at that is she wearing a mayhem Jersey? Uh, either that or a page powers Jersey. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Mayhem Jersey. So you love that. She made that lift and that was like, Oh my gosh. The last, the last lift of that event. So everybody, well, everybody's watching, you know, the person going, but she's the last one. So it's like that pressure moment. Like I talked about earlier,

you got to hit clutch stuff and clutch situations. And, you know, yeah, that was maybe five pounds under her PR, but that's still a hell of a lift, you know, to even. So, yeah, that was that. Is it what is it like? So you go from is that your first athlete you've coached like that at the games now? Two years ago since Rich? you go from is that your first athlete you've coached like that at the games now two years and you know i don't ever want people to you know get the feeling that you know i'm like this all-out coach i mean for rich like that was always like the ongoing joke that was rich's coach it's like no i was rich's bag carrier slash hype man slash you know joker but with but with well

the truth is dude it's i don't know let me push back on that a little bit i think it's a little underplayed you were his training partner you were his coach you were his hype man you were his emotional outlet you were actually more than a coach granted rich does a lot of his own programming but like um you were actually significantly more than his coach, I think. Not I think, I know. I witnessed it. I witnessed it. You were closer to him than any other coach was to their athlete.

Let me put it that way. I didn't see other fucking athletes loving on there or treating there. I mean, you were clearly a relative in there. It's very obvious you guys are very close. Well, I never even thought of that. You two are the two closest coach athlete that I ever witnessed in terms of the relationship. Yeah. So exactly. Yeah. So if you were, if you were, if you're not the most winningness, you're definitely the closest, the most intimate.

Well, thank you. And yeah, I mean, you know, in that sense, yes, we had a great community support with it where I was able to be a part of it with it and with Paige, you know, so like Paige actually lived here in Michigan. This is where she is from. She was working out with my cousin JJ and I, you know, over at his barn. He has a nice little gym set up. And she had reached out a year or so prior and was like, hey, I'm an up-and-coming teen. She was very successful in the teen side of things and knew that I was in the area and was wondering if she could come work out with JJ and I. After a year, she was starting to build and get great.

She's working out with JJ and I every day. I was like, wow, you, you are really good. I mean, you know, she, I mean, she, you know, she was checking all the boxes just as far as, you know, Hey, mentally she's, she's holding up great. Um, she's awesome to be around. She has all the physical features. And, uh, that was kind of when, you know, the sport was really getting into these kinds of training hubs. But from my prior experience, and like I preach all the time, a great coach is awesome. But just like you said prior, having a training partner, you can never supplement that. And that is something, you know, kind of like we were talking about with Rich, having all these different people around him to train with, I was like,

that's what she needs. She needs to be around. I mean, that's how I kind of look at things. And a lot of people, if you want to be the best, you got to put yourself around the best. And, you know, knowing her personally and her family, knowing what her values were and how she, you know, was, I was like, Cookville would be a great fit. As much as pridefully it hurt me to say, hey, I can't be enough for you here. You know, not, but I did not want to rob her of that too. I'm trying to be like, Hey, you didn't want to let her go. You were like, you were digging her. Okay. Well, but you know, I mean, but you know, like saying like, Hey, you know, stay here and let's just see, you know, I'm like, what I can figure it out.

Exactly. That, that, that would not have been fair to her and it would have robbed her of so much more. Right. Right. And so, you know, I mean, we kind of had that talk, you know, I was thinking about for, for a while, um, you know, and, you know, and stuff. You talked to your wife about that? Like you're in bed and you're like, Oh fuck Jess. And she's like, what? And you're like, I'm really digging Paige, but, and I want, and I want to like forge this into like my athlete, but fuck,

it's not what's best for her. Yeah. I mean, Jess, Jess is close with Paige and also her, like forge this into like my athlete but fuck it it's not what's best for her yeah i mean just just as close with page and also her and my parents you know i'm like as well and um after after the first year that she was at the crossfit games as a individual you know kind of looking back on things and kind of looking into the new season i was like all right what's the next step you know and i was kind of thinking i'm like like, you know, Hey, this is the, I mean, I was already thinking about it prior because, you know, I'm not at that fitness level. So it's like for me training with her, I could not train the way like that. It's like, I was one hour a day and go home and hang out with my family. Right. You

know, where she, she needed that eight eight plus hours you know right and all that other stuff so i was like all right you know this is what we need to do and just you know i mentioned it i kind of had the reassurance of jess and my cousin jj as well of like hey that's probably the best thing for her and yeah i wonder if it was like that with heppner and kerstetter because he obviously fucking digs her and probably didn't want to let her go. But he's like, hey, you got to get over there with the best. Well, and that's the thing is I 100 percent respect it. If you know if that's the thing as far as from him is you got to swallow your pride and realize and you cannot be stubborn in your ways, you know. And like that's exactly like what I felt.

I felt like I was getting stubborn, like, hey, you got to train this way. It's like, no, the sport evolves every single day. You know, the athletes evolve every single time. It's like, you got it. You got to adapt. You got to adjust. Um, uh, Kyle Landis. Uh, what about T and Shane? Yeah. I'm sure they were very close to maybe I misspoke, but I'm, but the, the relationship sexually. So that's not fair. Well, yeah. And, and, and Rich and Dan do three positions, and I heard Tia and Shane only do one. There were other people who were close with their athletes.

Don't get me wrong. This relationship between Rich and Darren was – there were times when the athletes would come together where the coaches really weren't allowed to hang like it just the energy wasn't there but darren could hang darren would go wherever rich would go and rich would go wherever darren would go and i kind of just pushed myself in it was just different yeah there's i can think of a dozen times when it's it's like um would it would be rich you and matt or um rich josh and you or or uh quant you

rich and there were just different times and the coaches wouldn't be around but darren would be there and darren would be chopping it up with the best of them where the other coaches maybe didn't have the confidence to hang in that um situation it was a very unique uh it was a very unique relationship. Different times, yeah. And I mean, like I said, just to maybe be that person that could relieve that stress as far as like, hey, let's get our mind off this and talk about something else. I mean, loved it. Loved it. I mean loved it loved it So do you spend most of your days?

What do you spend most of your days making videos and programming programming and then making videos that's relating the programming to the world? So I have started in the past gosh, man six six months or so. I'm now an early morning person I never used to be but I had to adapt kids and all And yeah, so I get up, um, around like five, five 30 and, uh, yeah. And I've worked for a couple hours. Um, give my wife a break because, you know, she does her, I mean like whole, whole side of things as well. She does the, I make nutritional stuff. And so I give her a break. So take the kids, do all that. And then work a little bit more. Then I go work out with the kids that aren't in school.

The kids that aren't in school. Okay. Yep. Yep. Kids, kids are in more. Then I go work out. The kids that aren't in school. The kids that aren't in school. Okay. Okay. Yep. Kids, kids are in school. Then I go, uh, work out with my cousin JJ and,

uh, and then people, you know, that come over there. We still have friends, cousins. My dad actually started working out with us. And yeah,

then the end of the day is family time, hang out and back at it. Dude, it's crazy. Your, yours and my life is pretty much identical my kids are just a little older so a little bit different things but i get up really early i do this show and then as soon as we get off here i'm going to take the kids and they'll be mine until for you know the

next three or four hours then i'll bring them home and i'll let them just play in the yard or whatever and then i'll work out or they'll work out with me. I'll work out. And then I get, and then it's back to either kid stuff or family time. It's crazy. I do. Yeah, it's, it's,

it's such a good life. It really makes you appreciate what your parents went through. You know, like thinking about like working nine to fives and shit. Oh my God. I mean, I wonder if you're going to, if you, I know you said you'd like school and I know you're pretty selfless, but I wonder if you're going to, if some party is going

to end up wanting to raise your boy, like not want to send him to school and like, and, and like be a rent. No, no, no, no, there's, there, there, there's no way they just need that. But you know, it's, uh, yeah. I mean, you know, thinking about too, you know, I'm like my dad, you know, getting up six, getting home around four or five and then, you know, just sitting down. I'm like in a chair. I mean, you know, in a sense, cause you go through that whole mental grind of that day and then just coming home, you know, yelling about something because, you know, that's what dads do. They come home and they look for a problem, you you know something's dented or something's missing then yell and then you sit down and you just watch like tv and that was that whole kind of process and uh you know i give my three younger brothers all the credit in the world they are electricians um you know they work full-time jobs

and they're still able to come home as well. I mean, all three of them, electricians, huh? Yeah. Oh, wow. That's hardcore. Yeah, it is. It is. But you know, is your dad an electrician? No, uh, uh, he, he, he, he worked with, you know, cables and stuff as far as I'm like, they like connector pieces. So I guess within a sense, but no, not as the professional, not a professional. Yes. Hobbyist. So, yeah. So, you know, it is, it's, it's great. Like I tell people, I haven't worked a day in my life. I, I, I really haven't, cause I don't feel like what I do is work. You know, I, I absolutely love it. Um, I'm never bored of it and I always get excited about it. Um, Dan Guerrero, people are not afraid. Savant people are not afraid. People are not

afraid of Savant. People are not afraid. Like an M and M thing or like, we're not afraid people are not afraid of seven people are not afraid like an m&m thing or like we're not afraid seven i don't know i don't know i don't know i don't know what he's talking about dan's my homeboy he always has really insightful shit to say wait well yeah yeah totally yeah we're gonna dive into that you know they say you should hang out with um people who are smarter than you yeah sometimes i you should hang out with people who are smarter than you? Yeah. Sometimes I like to hang out with people dumber than me. I love being in a room with people that have no idea what they're talking about,

but trying to BS my way into it to where they actually look at me and be like, wow, you're really smart. Now, Grant, that's maybe only happened once. All the other times you're like, wow, you really don't know what the hell you're talking about. 32 years. I was like, wow, they actually cracked the code. But you try and drop in those conversations. And there's times where you catch yourself, you're like, wow, this is way above my pay grade or way above my head. It's like being around Rich, being around rich when he was, you know, first time with Reebok or, you know,

going to all these other stuff and they're talking all this stuff and I'm just sitting there. I'm like, yeah, you know Reebok's been in the NHL for years. And you don't just drop a line here. And just kind of look around and be like, am I right guys? But so insightful stuff. Your, what do you, from, from where you see, um, is what do you think the future of CrossFit, um, holds like CrossFit? Um, um, try to be more specific, CrossFit headquarters, CrossFit Inc, CrossFit, let's say crossfit and it's um you know 10 to 15 000 affiliates what do you think the future holds for crossfit from where you see the the the the trends you've seen so yeah i mean i've heard you

know people talk about obviously you can get into the thing about you know crossfit is dead or or or whatever but i think crossfit as a whole will stand the will stand the test of time as much as people want to say it's on a downward thing and stuff it's like look what covid did covid actually showed the value of a affiliate you know the value of a community of the training program for sure none of us motherfuckers died who eaten, eaten train, right. Okay. But I mean, but no, I mean, but like, you know, I mean, seriously, like you saw people wanting to be back in a gym, you know, you saw people wanting to be backed by everybody. I mean, I got all the equipment at my house to work out, but I still

drive 15 minutes, go to my cousin's barn and work out with him and other people because I want to be by people. I love, I love that feeling. So I think CrossFit in itself will ride, you know, like ride off into the sunset. You know, I mean, I mean more. What if we just went through a low point too? What there's just ebb and flows right yeah 2008 huge then 2014 huge then back down from 2014 and 2017 18 huge again and now it's just it's just what if it's just a uh this you are there it's always going to be a rocky terrain especially like with the way you know that things do kind of get shuffled around. But I do think eventually, and I do believe in like HQ itself, that they'll actually find a good, you know, rhythm,

especially if they get the media back and going, you know, with that and actually create that overall value within, again, the masters, teens, all that stuff, the, you know, I mean, adaptive and show that, hey, the reason why we're here is the community. It's not like, hey, you guys owe us something.

We owe, we, we owe you something. And why do you say the media, you think media has played a huge role? You have any insight in the media just by the huge role it's played in the mayhem empire? I mean, media and CrossFit in general, dude, you can go back on the YouTube stuff and just look at views of, you know, of like what, I mean, content being put out now it's a flooded market of just individuals talking about the same thing over and over, you know, about, Hey, what their training day looks like. And so back then, you know, it was a community based thing was, you know, you followed through like their life

to where it actually told like their, you know, like their story and you got behind athletes. You know, now it's like, what are you going to do today? I'm just going to train, you know. Okay, well, great. You know, like watching like the old like Rich Stuff or Matt Stuff where you saw like what his family was doing or like what they did outside of CrossFit and then how they brought it all in was awesome. I absolutely love that. Dude, I was tripping the other day. You know, YouTube's the world's second largest search engine after Google.

I could see that. And so I was tripping the other day. I went over to the CrossFit. First of all, you can't even find the CrossFit YouTube channel. You have to scroll down 26 places. So if Caleb pulls up CrossFit right now, pulls up YouTube and types in CrossFit, it doesn't come up. CrossFit Games comes up. It's fucking, it's kind of nuts.

And you have to scroll down like 27 spots or something. And let's see. Yeah, just type in CrossFit. Okay, so, 14. You get the point. There's no CrossFit. There's no CrossFit. Oh, there's one, but look it.

Go back to the one with the Asian guy. Look it. But there's not even the CrossFit symbol there. So you would just pass right by it. So keep going. This whole algorithm with you and asians yeah they just know i'm huge i need more i'm trying to get more asians to watch my show okay keep going rich that's crazy that is that is actually i've never seen that one

it doesn't even look like rich hey that's what rich's face is gonna look like if he gets into mountain bike riding it was all gaunt and shit okay keep scrolling down um um don't get all look at caleb showing his love for rich just get stuck scroll look at liver king's in there before crossfit we still haven't seen crossfit dude so so then i finally went to the crossfit this is nuts dude this is worse than when i looked at it yesterday wow oh my god dude holy shit dude i mean this is nuts so that's so sad though man so here's the thing they haven't posted they hadn't posted on their youtube station in 12 days until yesterday and they hadn't posted on the game station in 12 days until yesterday and so i'm just trying to figure out what's going on over there they need to be posting every single

day yeah there has to be you have to you have to be on the daily cadence of um or else you're gonna get beaten by dudes who have podcasts in the side of their house dang them dang those podcast people oh yeah look at shit yeah so um yeah i mean i agree with you if they don't if they don't figure out their media game they are um yeah it's been too and how about the journals not even turned back on something's not right dude something is just not right over there i don't know what the fuck it is but there's good people over there i'm i'm i'm cool it is but there's good people over there i'm i'm i'm cool with don i like don he looks like a hard worker he's a straight shooter he works out i like dave i like nicole i was gonna say you know i mean never i've never had a problem with

anybody within the crossfit you know like hq realm um you know it's just but it just at the same time just makes you question okay what's what's going on behind the scenes here. And again, I know- Fire your HR department. How many people do you have in HR? Fire all six of those people and hire six new media people. Just let it right there. Yeah. What is going on? I know. I mean, you know, like I said, you, you, you, you'd like to believe, you know, that they're working towards something, which I do. I, I, I mean, I do think it is coming. Um, I do think, you know, changeover stuff like that happens. I just think that they were stuck in a rut or in a hole for so long of, you know, being just one-sided on, on something that trying to wean it all out of there and just kind of reset it, which really

can't even like reset it. Cause you've tried to establish something, you know, for, for, for so long. So just kind of resetting and going back to zero just isn't going to happen, you know, cause otherwise, yeah. Otherwise you just erase history, which is your best history. But yeah, I know it's, it is, it's just, do you know how much you guys spend on media every year? I do not. No. But it's a big number. Yeah. I mean, well, I could imagine, yes.

I mean, because you know as well as anybody, media is everything. It's expensive. It is, yeah. It's expensive. It's a lot of hard work. If you don't pay those dudes good money, they'll burn out. Like I talked about Dre and Scott that's there now, Ben and all the other ones. Scott's the VanderSloot guy.

Yeah. Love him. Awesome guy. Ben, love him. I had so much fun meeting those guys at games. And they are. They're the chillest but hardest working dudes. I don't just say that because they're part of our company.

I actually, I've watched them and I feel, like said i mean i feel bad yeah when you're asleep when you're asleep they're in the hotel room editing yes i mean like you know being i'm like being you know i'm like at the games and i'm like waking up and i'm like all right i'm gonna go get a coffee and i look at them their eyes are cracked and you know all that stuff and they're like oh i just got done editing something i haven't slept i'm like what yeah i was like jeez oh pete but yeah no they do awesome but the appreciation i wonder if mayhem spends more money on on the on on media than hq i hey you're you're you're talking to the person that just is sitting in his barn. How often do you, how often do you ever get, do you ever get a call from rich? I mean, like, dude, that was shitty programming today. Like I said, we, we have that, we have that

appreciation and that, um, uh, you know, respect like where it's like, Hey, you know, you might want to look at looking at things like this, you know, a little bit, which I love, you know, it's never going to be the, the, the attack conversation, like, Hey, it sucks. So it was going to be, Hey, you know, everything's looking good. Let's try and maybe try a little different route on like some of this stuff or see if we can change things up a little bit. So if you ever were, if you ever were to message me that, then I'd think something was really wrong. Like, hey, you're fired. It's coming after that. If you lived in Cookville, would you replace either Angelo or Rory on the podcast?

I don't. Rory is great talking. Me, I don't have that in me. Angelo is- Oh, shut the fuck up. Angelo just doesn't- You're amazing talking. You and Angelo should have your own podcast.

Angelo just doesn't care, which is so awesome for him. I'm glad that he found something too that people can grab a hold of because Angelo is such an awesome guy. He's so funny. The stuff that he talks about and comes up with is great. So I would just say that I would just replace Rich because we just swap out. So you would and it would be Rich is gone. Yeah.

And they would still call it the Rich Froning Podcast. Okay. I'm going to text you later and tell you what i think about that idea i don't want to say it publicly you'll feel like i'm attacking you yeah i say remember say it nicely uh brother i really appreciate you coming on you demand yeah thank you seriously i really appreciate you having me and it was great seeing you uh at the games and it was fun watching you work with Paige And I look forward to having you back on again It was great

Are you a student of the game? Do you stay involved? Will you watch Rogue closely? Yeah Hey, are you going? No, are you? No, family Don't say no like no

Be like no Stay here and watch it from my private screen Exactly Alright brother Alright dude have a good day Later Darren Hunsucker That dude's I like that dude that dude's got a uh a wide swath of character traits that I love

and like different energies and I don't know what the word is but I dig him he's super cool yeah um Adam Blakeslee if I were to have programming critique Darren I'd like some of the accessory programming not compound the movements of the day's Metcon. I don't know what that means, but thank you. Sounds smart. Isn't that how they used to program most CrossFit affiliate workouts? They would just, whatever accessory work or strength work was supposed to be what was done in the Metcon? Oh, okay. I didn't even understand that now i kind of understand if i were to have any programming critique darren i'd

like some of the accessory programming not compound the movements of the days not compound the movement the accessory work shouldn't be the same as the metcon oh that's what he's saying but that's how it's. Always been. Yeah. That's how it's always been. I like going to a class where. If it's.

I don't know. Cindy. They coach you through squatting and pull-ups. And push-ups beforehand. I like that. Yeah. Definitely. I think it helps give you some cues to think about if i while you're doing the workout yeah if i understand what adam's

saying oh when's my next shattuck and fix coming just posted one i think yesterday i'll probably maybe i'll post one today i liked it how i saw um it's it's a multi-camera shoot i saw a camera sitting on the hood of a car in another shot yeah yeah that one got wrecked by a branch what do you say uh dad can i borrow your phone and then you airdrop and then you airdrop the footage to your phone my mom tell me about your workflow caleb my workflow uh my mom usually will film on top of me putting up a tripod it's like there'll be a fixed shot and then my mom will film some stuff as well dude this this uh this video is kind of crazy i i wonder what um oh i have to leave in seven minutes i want i i need to talk to hillar about this i need to do a show with hillar

it's been forever this this this this is fucking what were you thinking do you have this much free time on your hand how long did it take you to make this video this is nuts and where did you get this music it's from oppenheimer oh shit we're busted look at there's the camera on the hood yeah i'm like what the fuck is beaver doing i wrote spielberg yeah nice like holy shit i think most of that footage is my mom she did a really good job no shit yeah she's a photographer oh she is yeah she knows oh hey so i first of all one i wonder how she like she probably it breaks her heart what's happened to photography i wonder if she's accepted it already just with all the vertical shit it's probably just but like i've finally started accepted it but it must break her heart but dude there's some really risky shots in this from that perspective i wonder what so god so so she is good look at the framing of this shit

and the eye staring at you yeah dude and then this half and then come over and grab the other half. Yeah, she did really good. Damn. I want to show you guys. Hold on. Look at this. Look, look in this shot. So, so this is good.

Frame great with the license plates. And then this, and then this shot right here. Watch how there's a slow pan to the left right before the cut. And that signals you that we're going over there. And then she cuts to it, or you cut to it. It's good shit, dude. She filmed it really well. Made it easy to cut together. And this exposure's hard to work with, with the fucking blown out in the back.

What's that thing back there with the handle that looks like a... I think that's a gas can. Oh, that needs to be filled with... Wow, that's a tall, skinny gas can. Yeah, I think either a gas can or an oil can. I can't remember. That needs to be made to turn into a workout implement. Yeah, there's that and then there's a railroad tie like right outside that door

too that we haven't been able to move yet. What is that? It's like a log? No, it's like a probably a five, six foot long piece of steel just steel. Oh. It's so heavy. Do you know

how to weld? Technically, no, but I could probably do it. Weld some chain to that thing and drag that thing around. Yeah, you could do that. Do like a sled drag. Sevan needs that gas can for his power washer. I'm not getting a gas power washer enough people. Uh,

Oh yeah. Some P I have some text messages. I have to open. People are like, dude, electric will be fine for what you're doing. Audrey. I know how to weld.

Of course she does. Well, these nuts, um, Greg C on today's masterclass of sevenbon teaching beaver the skills of filming and into the creative vision how much of your work at crossfit was like this no no i'm not even teaching him someone already knows i'm just admiring his work no i didn't do any of that at crossfit listen those fucking jackasses are way were way better than me i was just there first so i got the money

and i mean it all those dudes were better than me all right um thank you uh i think today's thursday shut up and scribble is shut up and scribble scheduled for today yeah i think so i think it's it's on my calendar i don't know we do our obligatory obligatory i'm supposed to leave in three minutes i wonder if my wife is texting me yet no let's do um let's do our a obligatory uh call to um let's see if i can hook the phone up who should we call we only have time to call one person today

who do you think we're more likely to get Taylor or JR Taylor Taylor's self and his phone number for anyone who wants it is turn the volume up on this

703. Oh shit, I called it wrong. It's 4158. There we go. Oh jeez. Is it ringing? it's ringing I can't tell what's going on no it just says calling oh there it goes why doesn't the phone always work perfectly

so disappointing it is makes me feel like I'm an amateur no no it shows me that I'm an amateur. No, no. It shows me that I'm an amateur. Fucking pathetic. The thing is, is I never try to improve on anything. I need to come back in here and just spend time with my shit.

Someone text me, are you podcasting right now what do you think uh savvy cold call an affiliate and see if they sell you a membership what do you mean like call just call an affiliate and be like hey what's up what's up that'd be oh what what's tomorrow's schedule is tomorrow fr Friday. Yeah. Tomorrow's Friday. So listen, this is okay. So I know what you're asking. So this is what I think is happening.

I think today we'll be shut up and scribble. Then I think tonight really late. Most of you will be asleep. Like at midnight, we'll go live to test the cameras that crashed crucible because Hiller and Sousa don't arrive there until tonight. So tonight I think we are going to do a live crazy late night show. There'll be three in the morning on the East coast and we'll just be checking up live crazy late night show it'll be three in the morning on the east coast and we'll just be checking up the cameras and setting the cameras

and then in the morning i guess tomorrow morning crash crucible starts damn that's crazy and that's all i know and um yeah so yeah we're just winging that shit but the the the with the camera test we've done so far, holy shit. You guys are going to be stoked. We might be acting like jackasses, but it's going to look beautiful. You're going to see Colton. You're going to see the sweat dripping off of Colton's nuts. It's going to be good.

Nice. It's nice, yes. Okay. Love you guys. See you tonight, tomorrow. We'll be busy all weekend. I'll see all you guys at Shitload this weekend because of the crash crucible. I forgot all about that. Better tell my wife.

All right. Bye-bye.