The Unmade Podcast - 110: Grunt of Approval

Episode Date: April 27, 2022

Tim and Brady discuss isolation, re-visiting entrance songs, 'bent' workers, Aussie spoons, the martian moon Phobos, and ordinary people. Go to Storyblocks for stock video, pictures and audio at storyblocks.com/unmade - https://www.storyblocks.com/unmade Go to Backblaze for all your online backup needs - there's a 15-day free trial - https://www.backblaze.com/unmade Support us on Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/unmadeFM Join the discussion of this episode on our subreddit - https://redd.it/ud34t9 Catch the podcast on YouTube where we often include accompanying videos and pictures - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkIRMZDOKKKs-d14YPmLMxg USEFUL LINKS Entrance Song episode - https://www.unmade.fm/episodes/episode109 Smooth Operator by Sade - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TYv2PhG89A Tim's hand-written list as a bonus pic for Stakeholders - https://www.patreon.com/posts/65667948 Isn't She Lovely by Stevie Wonder - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE56g61mW44 Dreams by the Cranberries - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yam5uK6e-bQ Jurassic Park theme - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDlU08RU7Tk Longleat Safari Park - https://www.longleat.co.uk Line of Duty - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_of_Duty Bent Coppers - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i35TeNu1gp4 Pictures of Spoon of the Week - https://www.unmade.fm/spoon-of-the-week There are some nice Phobos pics and a videos in the YouTube version of this episode - https://youtu.be/cvBOpWXc-Is Phobos - https://solarsystem.nasa.gov/moons/mars-moons/phobos/in-depth/ Mediocre and unsuccessful people - https://www.unmade.fm/press-play Baby corn - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_corn

Tim, you're recording under some duress, I believe. That's right. You're making me record and I don't want to. No, that's not true. Not that kind of duress. For the 110th time. It's like, what? Another one of these.

We're at home. We're in, well, isolation, quarantine. I'm not sure. Quarantine, I don't think is the right word. But we had some relatives staying with us over the weekend and there was a COVID test of positive. So we're all what they call in Australia close contacts. Is that the same terminology in other places?

I know what you mean. Yeah. So you haven't got it, but you have spent some time with someone who did get it. That's right. That's right. So they're still with us and we're all together. They're kind of keeping upstairs. We're downstairs and I'm negative. We're negative and I'm feeling fine. But you know, I've got a week inside. Do you look upstairs at them, like up the staircase and think, oh, they're like, that's the hot zone up there? Yeah, I've put an armed guard at the bottom of the stairs

with instructions to shoot if anyone appears. No. Okay, fair enough. And there is a little bit of movement. You know, they come down to grab some things and to eat and that sort of stuff. We're not being too silly about it because they're wearing masks and we've got quite a bit of space.

Okay. But as long as they cry out, unclean, unclean, as they take steps forward to the other parts of the house. Drama in the Hein household. You have to have a bit of humour to get through. I mean, we've got a week and we've got a bit of it to go. So, you know, you've got to have a bit of humour about it and make it last. But I've come into one of the bedrooms, bunkered down here, instructions for other people to

be quiet while I do this very important work that I said I have to do here, when really I'm just doing a podcast. Is there a slight buzz of excitement around the house that an unmade podcast is being recorded while everyone's there? Is that a big deal? There was when I brought up at dinner that, all right, guys, ideas, please, let's go. There was when I brought up at dinner that, all right, guys, ideas, please, let's go. No one eats until they've paid for their supper with an idea.

So, yeah. So, I've got the notepad. There is a bit of excitement, a few well wishes of good luck on your mate, all that kind of stuff as I went into the room. It's like when they're, like, filming a TV show or a film, like, on your street and they shut the street down and you see all the cameras and everything and maybe a celebrity. It's like that. I know. I know. And I know this, for those in New York, that happens every day on every street corner. But for those of us that grew up in Tarelgon, that's like a life-defining event to actually just see a TV camera.

Like, see it, even if it's just the news. But if they're filming a film, my goodness, I could have died happy then. I remember when the first time I ever saw a TV news camera, we were doing a cross-country running event for school. Yeah, where all the different schools all turn up and you do a cross-country run. And we were all lined up at the start line and like Channel 10 or someone came along. So, the guy with the camera was, like, walking along the start line to show all the kids in a row.

And as the camera came past you, you'd all wave at the camera. And, oh, the frenzy of excitement that camera lens caused amongst all those kids about to run the race. Oh, God. The fact you might be on the news- And then you watch the news that night and sure enough, you're not on. That's right. Yeah. That's right. Oh, God. The fact you might be on the news, and then you watch the news that night and sure enough you're not on. That's right. That's right.

It was huge news that you could be on the TV. That's right, as a kid. Oh, my goodness. The idea of being on TV. Oh, God. I once saw a guy at our school. He wasn't a teacher. He was obviously there for some sort of business,

and I thought I'd seen him on the news once. And I remember going up to him because he had this beard and saying, I've seen you on the news. And he looked at me and says, mate, I haven't been on the news for 10 years. And I was like, he's Mr. He was on the news just because he's a guy with a beard. And I think that was, I saw him on the news. I'd be like, what? You were on the news 10 years ago? That's awesome. That's right.

Oh, golly. Yeah, big moment. So, anyway, but, you know, someone – when I was young, there were no people recording podcasts nearby. That didn't happen in Tarragon. That was future technology. So, there is a bit of buzz here. It's like the night before Christmas.

I'm not sure that happens a lot in Tarragon now. No. maybe not. But they've got the new KFC bucket, so they're happy. Maybe that's a secret antenna to finally beam in some Wi-Fi for around Taralgon. Parish notices is obviously, there's a burning topic. Last episode, I talked about entrance songs. What would your song be when you walk into a room like Hail to the Chief or the Queen's got God Save the Queen and that?

What's your entrance song? I know a lot of wrestlers and boxers and people like that, athletes already have them, but I think everyone should have one. And the podcast idea was people can come on and talk about what their entrance song is and why. And I sprung this on Tim. And Tim's a bit of a music lover and having something like this sprung on him was a little bit mean of me, really, when he hasn't had time to do lists and cross-reference things

and really, really think it through. And I promised him next episode, he could about it and the next episode he could tell us what his choices are. Tim, was that a list I saw you holding? Oh, yeah. This is a list. I got a few- Is it laminated?

I got a few. I'm willing to sign it, actually. I'm pretty proud of the list. Yeah. I know you said next time in parish notices, you'll be able to have your one. And then I maybe even pushed it a little bit and said, well, maybe I'll have three and I'll have one. I've got 12 on the list in front of me. If you're going to keep me to 10, I can cross two off, but I'll need another hour.

Two off, but I'll need another hour. I want to keep you to one, but anyway. We've had lots and lots of suggestions from other people. I'll just tell you some of the songs suggested by some of our listeners, some civilians. Maddy Rife on Reddit said, The opening riff to Red Hot Chili Peppers, Suck My Kiss. Oh, yeah.

Bearska said, Oxygen by Tonight Alive. I don't know that one. Komakazi, Smooth Operator by Sade. Smooth Operator. That's a nice one. Yeah, yeah. And that's what's his Carlos Sainz. That's his preferred song, isn't it? The Formula One driver.

He's really into Smooth Operator. Oh. He sometimes sings over the radio in the car at the end of a race if he has a good race. That's nice. Smooth Operator. Smooth Operator. Gravity Tortoise, Take 5 by the Dave Brubeck Quartet. We've had lots and lots of suggestions.

I won't read them all out, but thank you. And keep them coming. It is interesting to read them. But, Tim, what is your one and final decision for your 12 entrance songs? Am I going to be able to read the 12 or...? You can read the 12. All right, all right.

I'll read them quickly, so I'll just run through them. But you have to pick one at the end, all right? You have to pick one at the end that is going to be your actual entrance song. There are 12 on the piece of paper, and there's one with an underline on it, and I'm going to hold to that 12, that one. Sorry, I'm even saying, I can't even say it. I'm going to hold to that 12. That will be my final 12.

All right. Maybe you should attribute each one of these songs to one of the apostles. I started with a bit of a giggle one. This one is the first one. Stevie Wonder, Isn't She Lovely. Imagine walking in and having a... I actually thought about the bridal march as well. That would be a fair-

Every time I walk in, they're playing the wedding song. Because if there's ever a time where people stand up, look around, and wait for someone to walk in, but- Or some funeral dirge or something. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Look, here it is. Arcade fire, wake up beastie boys

sabotage big grand announcement there's an australian band called the whitlums and they have a song called buy now pay later it's beautiful piano and i it sits in my mind almost constantly there's another australian band called you My. They have a song called Purple Sneakers. And I like that too. That sits with me all the time. Pet Shop Boys, Suburbia. Fantastic. Beautiful. It's just, yes, anyway.

I promised I wouldn't commentate, so I'll keep going. The Wanderer. You can commentate. You can commentate. All right. I'll just take 15 minutes on each one. No. I like The Wanderer by U2 because it's not a very typical U2 song to choose.

It's a bit about, well, it's a bit about wandering. Anyway, I've got nothing interesting to say about it. All This Time by Sting. That's a bit of a cheat because I had that as a ringtone for quite a while. There's also a really happy song which has been on my mind for the last week or so, which you'll remember by Things of Stone and Wood, a song called Happy Birthday, Helen. Happy birthday, Helen. And it's just this joyful, glorious song.

And I like the vibe. So a lot of these I'm choosing because, as you might imagine, the musical vibe of it, which sets a tone that I feel suits me rather than something literal like Smooth Operator, which is, you know, something that he's trying to embody. What have we got? Oh, and there's ACDC, For Those About To Rock We Salute You, which I think is just an awesome lay down kind of song. And then there's, this one was a close, a close second, which is By The Cure. It's a song called In Between Days, which is a fantastic song.

Again, it's a throw down, bang, here we go, walk in the room announcement kind of song. I think the instrumental version of Pictures of You would be quite a cool song to walk into a room to. Man, nice, nice call out. Wow. I'd like to walk into a room to that. Yeah, yeah. I didn't even know you knew who The Cure were. Like, that call out. Wow. I'd like to walk into a room to that. Yeah, yeah. I didn't even know you knew who The Cure were. Like, that's just...

I know. I've seen The Cure. I saw The Cure at... Yeah, I saw them perform at Fuji Festival in Japan. And it was getting late and we wanted to go back to our hotel, but I wouldn't go until they'd played Pictures of You because it's my favourite Cure song. It's a lovely song.

It's a beautiful song. That's a good idea. As is the number one. Here we go. My number one, the song I've chosen is Dreams by the Cranberries. Do you know that song? I don't know if I do. How does that go?

Well, I'm not going to sing it because she's an irish female singing a song and now well obviously you'll add it in in the edit later surely maybe and and every other forever for in every episode from here on when i when you say hello tim welcome to the podcast and boom and come in why choose that? Firstly, because it sounds so optimistic. So it's sort of a really slow – it's sort of a throw-down announcement, inspiring, optimistic, aspirational kind of song. And it's called Dreams, so it sort of has that sort of feel about it as well. But it's not particularly the lyrics.

I mean, it's a song about my dreams. It's never quite as it seems. My life is changing every day in every possible way. And oh, my dreams. It's never quite as it seems. It's never quite as it seems. One of these great songs that's kind of happy and inspiring, but also has a touch of sadness, just enough lament.

I'm just trying to think of any other time I've said, go on, Tim, sing a bit of the song, and you have been able to resist. All right. Oh, my life. Oh, my life. Oh, my life. Wow, I started a little high there. I've got nowhere to go. That's amazing.

That was pretty good. It's changing every day in every possible way. Every possible way. Oh, yeah, I know that one. Yeah, that is a great song. Yeah. I've been thinking about mine, and I think I'm going to stay with Walk in the Room by Paul Carrick because I've kind of committed to it now. But my two other options would be the theme music from Jurassic Park.

There's this place near where I live called Longleat, which is a big stately home. But the guy who owned it until he died recently was a really eccentric rich person who created this huge animal park there that you can drive around and monkeys climb on your car and lions walk around your car and everything. It's really amazing. And when you first enter, they have these huge, huge doors like in Jurassic Park that open up and you drive into. And every time we drive through them, I play the Jurassic Park music as they swing open and we drive in the car.

It's amazing. Oh, that's great. And the other one that I think would be kind of cool if I was willing to be a little bit ironic and not take myself too seriously would be the instrumental version of the sofa shop just playing as I walk in and but it's the instrumental version that just at the end has the don't you do a thing until you see the sofa shop as it ends yeah and I'd and I'd time it so every time I walked in a room the instrumental played and I shook a few people's hands and stuff like that. And then as I sat down, just that little singing part cut in beautifully.

Don't you do a thing until you see the sofa shop. And then bang, and then you start your speech. Let's get to business. It would be wonderful to have a day where everything was just perfectly timed and music came on in the times when you were travelling from one meeting to the next. And then soon as you went to say something, it faded out and bang, you said what you, you know. Lovely. All right.

There we go. You've got your songs out there. Oh, wow. That was exhausting just sharing you about them. There were a few suggestions from some of the others who were staying in the house. Eye of the Tiger, which is a really big song for those sorts of big occasions. Highway to Hell also came up. But apparently it's the version from Megamind, which is like a slightly electronic version.

But apparently it's the, you know, the Megamind guy. It's his announcement song that everyone sings when he comes in. Okay. So those were the two that were mentioned around the place. Keep them coming, people. We're happy to keep hearing your entrance song ideas. Can I just say something? I notice you're wearing the Top Gun t-shirt for recording again.

Is that, like, is this now your, like, are you in the Air Force? Like, are you in the- This is my pyjamas, that's why. And I always recorded in my pyjamas. So, this Top Gun t-shirt's one of my pyjamas, that's why. And I always recorded my pyjamas. So this Top Gun T-shirt's one of my pyjama tops. You've always had different T-shirts and things on every time we record, but now you've had a couple in a row with that, and I'm like, well, maybe it's his uniform.

Like, maybe you're a Top Gun now and you've just got ten of those and you just wear them every day. I'm coming live from Miramaya. So is that like, are they Top Gun pyjamas or is it a Top Gun T-shirt you happen to be wearing as pyjamas? No, actually they are pyjamas. It is a Top Gun T-shirt. I mean, you could wear this out and about and look pretty cool. But it did come as a set that I got for Christmas, which has this Top Gun T-shirt.

And then it has these like more pyjama-y type trousers with little Top Gun logos all over it. The trousers are very pyjama-y and I don't wear them, but the T-shirt I do wear. I wear it strictly as a pyjama T-shirt. I love it. You've got Top Gun pyjamas. And so you're...

I'm the best of the best. I feel the need, the need for sleep. That's right. I was sleeping inverted. So, ideas for a podcast. Who's going to go first? You go first. I'm wondering which of the eight that I've pulled off my mediocre list,

these are the least mediocre of them, and I've still got them here, and I haven't worked out which is the least mediocre of these ones. Tim, tell me what phrase comes into your mind when I say this to you. I'm interested in one thing and one thing only. Oh, you've stumped me. That sounds familiar, but oh. I'm interested in one thing and one thing only. I can't pick it.

Bent coppers. Oh, yes, of course. Oh. Line of duty. Yes, fantastic. So in Line of Duty, there's a character who's investigating corrupt police and whenever the investigation goes anywhere, that doesn't involve catching bent coppers.

He tries to bring him back on track. I just want bent coppers. It's like he's a very focused man. We're only interested in one thing here and one thing only, and that's bent coppers. My idea for a podcast is called Bent. And what happens is people from a certain profession, it could be any profession, and they just talk about and tell stories about people that did their job that went wrong, that went off the rails, that became bent. So, like with coppers, I mean, police corruption is serious business when we talk about bent coppers. Politicians would be another easy, another low-hanging fruit, bent politicians and things like that.

Politicians would be another easy- Another low-hanging fruit, bent politicians and things like that. Yeah. And, you know, you get dodgy doctors. But every occupation has its kind of people gone wrong, bent versions of people that do their profession. Your profession's fantastic, in fact. Yes. This is going to be painful. Yeah, that's a classic.

So, but I like doing anything. Painful. Yeah, that's a classic. So, but I like doing anything. Like, I bring together a bunch of people who, you know, scientists or railway workers or anything. I want to talk to everyone from every profession and find out about who are your bent people, your notorious ones that went a bit wrong. It doesn't have to be criminal. Often it will be, obviously. But it doesn't have to be criminal, corrupt, a little bit fraudulent, just a bit naughty,

maybe. People that bend the rules, that do the wrong thing, that have brought shame on the name of your profession. I want to hear about your version of people who are bent coppers. I'm interested in one thing and one thing only, and that's bent coppers. Yeah, this is a really interesting topic this is great saucy stuff there's probably a distinction to be made between people who are bent and people who are slack like oh yeah in every workplace and in the industry there are people who are known as

you know they don't pull their weight they don't do their job they cut corners they're not the person you'd entrust the good jobs with. And some people, you know, that can be sort of their hallmark their whole career. I'm not talking about just people who are incompetent. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's just, yeah. To me, that's everyone in the world except me, basically.

So, yeah, I'm not talking about that. But they've got to be real wrong. Like, they've intentionally done something that's- It has to be wrongdoing. Wrongdoing. Phew. Well, then I'm off. That's a relief. In the world of science, it could be someone who, you know, falsifies the results of their scientific research to make their paper a bit sexier, you know. Yeah.

We found this happened when in fact you didn't. You didn't get the results you expected, but you pretend you did, which you probably won't go to jail for, but it's a bit bent. Yes. Or another aspect that would be interesting in this is finding out what the motive was. Like in other words, we did this so that I could make money or I did this so that I could get that promotion. And just to see whether it's ambition or glory or, you know what I mean? what was the thing that tempted them to jump out of the- Money or power or were they just trying to dig themselves out of a gambling debt or, you know, all those sort of things.

Yeah, became desperate. Or just scared of losing your job, you know, yeah. Or threatened, you know, they maybe did it reluctantly, but someone had something over them and they were pushed into it. Yeah. Yeah. What's an industry that you would be interested to find out more about? I want to find out about the corruption almost in the industries you wouldn't think there was corruption in. Yeah.

Like, you know, like zookeepers or like, you know, things, you know, things like that. Things that just seem like quite, yeah, vets. People that we think of being, having very noble and pure kind of unpretentious vocations. And yet in the vet world, whoa, that's a rotten apple. But I wonder what there is in the zoos. You know, I took a backhander to send those monkeys to the zoo in Romania or something like, you know. That's right, yeah. I gave the penguins some additive in their food to make them more active when the queen came to visit.

That's right. I think an interesting industry for this is journalism. I'm always really interested when those stories come out where someone has made up a story, made up facts, exaggerated. Yes. Particularly when it's, there was one about a decade ago, Pulitzer Prize winner, I think at the New York Times, I should add at this point, lest I have to become one of those podcasters that make things up and bend the rules. That's off a shady memory. But anyway, there's a bunch of those that have been written up. Well, you suddenly realise that a major investigation they've been doing has been compromised or-

There was a whole series of The Wire that was based on that. That was pretty cool. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah. Did you ever see anything like that in your time as a journalist? I've got some memory of some story breaking where someone had made up a bunch of stuff and got in a lot of trouble. But it's, you know, yeah, I guess it happens.

What about the horoscope person? Just making stuff up instead of really looking at the stars. No, that's a good one. That's a good one. Journalists, plenty of bent journalists out there, I'm sure. I wonder if there are any KFC franchise store managers who have cut corners and broken the code. Only used 10 herbs and spices. Whoa. Just holding one back. That could be the answer to- I've wondered about that with the rogue stores that we've been to where things- you can

just tell something's not quite right and consistently not just on one shift but consistently and i think there could be a bent manager there you always get the stories about you know these dodgy american preachers right yeah do you think there's something about like you know ministry and church that does lend itself to corruption or just gets more publicity than average because it's such a pious profession. Yeah. Look, there certainly are many rotten apples. It depends what you mean going off the rails. Like putting aside for the moment the predatory behaviour of, you know,

certain activities. Yeah. Which is in some ways another category. But there's also those, you know, tele-evangelists who are looking to make money and so forth. That's who I'm thinking about. Yeah, yeah. I think there are people, I reckon there's a combination

of people that think this is a community of people who I can potentially rip off and they may be intentional about going into it and being involved in it, but it's probably more likely those who are involved in it and then attempted by, oh, if we do it this way, then we actually can make a lot of money. And then suddenly that becomes not the side benefit or the way to fund it, but the aim of the game. And I reckon they become blind to that because I do think there's

an element of Christian preaching and ministry because it's public you where for people who have a narcissistic tendency so you can get glory like you can be you can be it's a community where lots of lots of industries like this i guess sporting clubs but there's a place where you can have power and be the center of attention and that can attract some people that have not fully worked through the full motives of why they're going about what they want to do, yeah, rather than, you know, service and so forth like Jesus. Podcasting could be a bit that way too, I think.

It is. Yeah. Of course, you find it mostly endlessly fascinating in the area, you know, most about, don't you? Yeah. So I find it horrific but fascinating in the world that I'm involved in. Yeah. But I think this is a good idea.

Yeah, bent. Oh, yeah. And you get YouTubers who fall from grace as well. How do you fall from grace as a YouTuber? Like, what do you do? There are ways. There are ways. Faking views, are they?

Or paying your mum to click? You can sometimes get caught faking or doing something in a video you weren't supposed to do and stuff like that. That happens. Oh, okay. Get in touch with us, people. Tell us about your profession and tell us about the bent people in your profession. Who's doing it wrong? We want the dirt.

We want to hear the stories. And the names. Name names, people. We won't tell anyone. Name names. Sport names, people. We won't tell anyone. Name names. Sport is great for it. Sport is great for falls from graces and people who are bent and cheat and stuff like that. Oh, yeah.

Sport is a classic for it. Good idea, man. Good work. Let me mention our sponsor. It's Storyblocks. Ah, good stuff. This is my impersonation of Tim when I say Storyblocks. Ah, good stuff. Ah! This is my impersonation of Tim when I say Storyblocks.

You ready? You say Storyblocks and I'll be you. All right, everyone. It's time for our sponsor, Storyblocks. Ah! That's your endorsement. That's what you're adding to the sponsorship message. That's what Storyblocks want.

They don't want all your words. They just want the, is the grunt in there? Yes. And why do you make your voice go up eight octaves when you impersonate me? It's like a little boy voice. Hey, everyone. Hey, everyone. Hey, everyone.

It's time for Storyblocks. It's Brady here. Welcome to another episode of the Unmade Podcast. Hi, I'm Tim. All right. Storyblocks.com slash unmade. Storyblocks has a demand-driven library of entirely royalty-free 4K and HD footage, After Effects and Premiere Pro templates, music, images,

sound effects and more. They offer subscriptions that will fit any budget, including their unlimited all-access, which gives you unlimited downloads. To find out more, go to storyblocks.com slash unmade. You sound like your dad doing that. That's awesome. That's who we should get.

We should get him to read an ad. Oh, that'd be awesome. Oh, that would be good. I don't think the Storyblocks servers are ready for the amount of downloads they'd get if my dad did a sponsorship message for them. Man, he is impressive. I'll tell you what's impressive, Storyblocks, because this week they really helped me out. I was doing a video and I interviewed a person who was a poultry engineer who's involved in designing all the machines and mechanisms

at like chicken farms where they, you know, collect eggs and stuff. And I wanted to show some footage and like what's the chance of me being able to film in a chicken farm like zero and if I could it would take me forever so I went to Storyblocks and I have to admit I thought I don't know how good my chances are here they had so much footage from chicken farms like with all the chickens and all the eggs and the machinery collecting the eggs if you put poultry farm into Storyblocks, prepare to be amazed. They were so good.

I was able to, I had everything I wanted and more. Yet again, Storyblocks saved the day. And if you're a creator of any sort, whether you need sound effects or for podcasts or pictures for graphic design you do, or video, storyblocks.com slash unmade. Get a subscription. It is such a useful tool. Whoa.

See, when I try and say anything else, it doesn't work. It's all I got. Thanks, Storyblocks. Thanks, Storyblocks. Sorry about my high-pitched voice. I hope that's not hurting business. And now it's time for... Spooned Eye Week.

Speaking of my high-pitched voice. So, Tim, because you are stuck in an isolation bubble, I thought I'd get you out of jail today and bring a couple of spoons I've been meaning to show for a while now. Good stuff. To my shame, I've been meaning to show for a while now. Good stuff. To my shame, I've not gone into isolation with the spoon. Well, I have my spoon collection on the wall, but not a new one. I've got a couple of spoons here that I got for Christmas from my brother-in-law, Darren, who is an occasional listener to the podcast, I believe.

So I always have to be careful what I say. He's a very handsome and lovely man. Right. And Darren got me for Christmas two Australian themed spoons. Apparently now when he sees Australian spoons on his adventures, he decides to buy one for me. Yeah. The first one is this one, which is just a pretty regulation silver small spoon. But all along the stem, all the way up to the handle,

are kind of little metallic sculptures. Oh, yeah. You can see there's a koala hanging onto the side of the stem like it's a tree. Yep. There's a boomerang partway up, and right at the top, right at the handle is a metallic sculpture of an emu with some kind of black onyx-like stone embedded in its flank. Yep.

It's quite an elaborate, sort of quite a knobbly, rustic spoon, I would describe that as. Yeah, that's like looking at Australia itself. Just in our courtyard here in our apartment, we've got an emu and a boomerang and a koala, coincidentally. I'm sure you do. This next coincidentally. I'm sure you do. This next one is something I'm sure you have. This is a, again, a spoon, but the sculpture on top of this time is a jar of Vegemite.

That's awesome. Iconic. Nice. Iconic. Vegemite is a yeast vegetable extract spread that Australians love to spread on their toast and sandwiches. It is not to everyone's taste, but I love it. I love it. My goodness. It's kind of like peanut butter or peanut paste, as they call it, except it's black and

tastes totally different. And tastes nothing like it. No, I know, I know. But it's like it's the texture. It's a spread and that's what it's used for. My wife has been converted to Vegemite and like, she's usually quite anti-Australian to wind me up. Like, you know, she jokes about Australia.

And whenever she asks for toast with Vegemite, I swear, I feel so proud. Like a little, like I feel this little swelling up in my heart of like patriotism and pride that she's gone for the Vegemite. This is also incredibly heavy, this spoon. Incredibly top heavy. That Vegemite jar at the top. I reckon this might be the heaviest spoon we've ever featured. It's almost like it's an actual jar of Vegemite on top of the spoon.

It's big, isn't it? Really big. I can't wait to send it to you for the official weighing by your daughter because she's our official wearer of spoons. Yes. Because she's going to be very impressed by the weight of this spoon. We'll pull out the big scales. All right. Nice work, man.

Thank you, Darren. Keep it in the family. Well, two spoons in short time there. That's a very economic little spoon of the week there, man. Well done. Good work. Yeah, unfortunately, I haven't got some 25-minute anecdote about a childhood holiday to Victoria to go with the spoon.

You're just going to have to make do with that. about a childhood holiday to Victoria to go with the spoon. You're just going to have to make do with that. Well, I apologise to those listeners who have tuned in for that this week. And, of course, this is the time where we announce our prize winners. We like to give away things to our Patreon supporters. Go to patreon.com slash unmadefm to join them. There will be a link in the description.

We are sending a Unmade Podcast spoon. These are our official spoons struck here in the UK to, amazingly, Tyler from Iowa, who won the tape last week, I think, or maybe cards last week. He won something last week and he's won again. This time the coveted spoon. Wow. Tyler from Iowa. Are you sure we're not giving the same things to the same sort of 10 people every week in a different order?

Like we do have. Well, the algorithm is weighted towards people who've been supporters for longer and more generous ones. Right. But not, but everyone's a good chance. And I did check. I don't think Tyler's won a spoon before. I do. You can't win the spoon twice. That's one of my rules.

But we have more than 10 patron supporters, don't we? We do have more than 10. Yes, we do. Yeah. Amazingly. Another one of those is Glenn J from Florida, who's getting this Sofashop mixtape. Well done, Glenn J. That's gold. That's gold.

That's great. Yeah, it's a good get, that. And Unmade Podcast Collector Cards. A few cards have been popped in an envelope and sent to Victor from National City in California, which I'd never heard of and I think is a cool name for a city. Yeah. Caleb from Texas. Bartle from the Faroe Islands.

I don't think we've had one from the Faroe Islands before. I don't even know where the Faroe Islands are. Kojo from the United Kingdom and Iona Maria from New York. Cards coming your way. Is the pressure on me to come up with the moon of the week this week because you've done the spoon of the week? As if I would let you do moon of the week. Well, come on.

I only know one moon. Funnily enough, just before we started recording, I was reading the Times newspaper over my special K at breakfast, and page three had a story all about one of the moons in the solar system. So, I almost switched to that one, but I've done too much research to not do my chosen moon of the week. And I think people are going to like this one. So, anyway, before we go any further, here it is. So, Tim, we're off to Mars. Mars.

We're off to Mars. Mars. It's not the nearest planet to Earth, but it's kind of considered Earth's sort of brother. It's our friend, isn't it? Twin. Yeah, yeah. It's our friend. Yeah. Mars holds a fascination over us like no other planet.

What do you know about Mars and moons, Tim? I have no idea how many moons Mars has. I don't think of Mars as having moons. I presume it does. Or what is it? Unidentified satellite objects or whatever their official name is that you were saying. USOs. Mars has two natural satellites, two moons.

Right. They are called Phobos and Deimos, who are Greek gods. They're twins. They're the horses on Mars' chariot. Is that right? No. The Roman god Mars, didn't he have two horses to his chariot and the two moons are named after?

I don't think so. I think you could be right, but I don't think you are. I think Phobos and Deimos were twins, and I think they were sons of Ares, who was also kind of Mars. Yeah. Let's move on from that. People can do their own research there. I don't think they were the horses, but I'm going to talk to you about Phobos. Phobos is the larger of the two moons.

It's still not very large. It's actually quite small. In fact, it's so small, its gravity hasn't been able to pull itself into the shape of a sphere. It's more of a kind of looks more like a potato. I think you're looking at, you know, 20 kilometres type size. Oh, wow. It's quite small, but it's very, very close to Mars. It's only 6,000 kilometres from Mars.

It's the closest any moon is to its planet. Right. And because it's so close, it really races around Mars at a really high speed. In fact, it goes around Mars much quicker than Mars turns on its own axis. So, in the course of a day, you will actually see Phobos rise and set twice. Right. The moon will rise, zoom across the sky, zoom around the planet, rise again and go across the sky and set.

So, it's quite a fast-moving object. You see it twice a day. Its most distinctive feature is a big crater. I remember one of the other moons we talked about had a great big crater where it got nearly smashed apart when something crashed into it. Yes. Phobos has got one of those too. It's called Stickney.

It's also, it transits the sun quite often. So, if you're on Mars, it's not uncommon to see this moon go across the face of the sun, like an eclipse. Yeah. But because it's not big enough to cover the sun, you just see it go across the sun. It's like this black potato shape going across the face of the sun. But I think the thing that's most interesting about Phobos, well, there is a lot of things that are interesting about Phobos. We know a lot about it. We've got lots of pictures of it because we have sent so many probes to Mars, but we've never

been able to land on it. And it has been tried a few times to visit Phobos and to land on Phobos, and it has been tried a few times to visit Phobos and to land on Phobos, but it almost seems doomed every time we try. I'll tell you three quick stories about interesting ones. My favourite is in 1988, the Russians sent a probe called Phobos 1 that was supposed to go to Phobos, but some dude was in the control area and was sending some commands and instructions to the probe, telling it what to do and how to turn and stuff like that. And he made one typo. He got a hyphen wrong in his instructions and sent it up to the probe and it completely ruined the mission. It

ended the mission and everything went wrong and they never heard from it again because of this one hyphen. Either he wasn't supposed to type or he added or something like that. And the whole system they had to have everything double checked before it was sent to the probe was- fell apart a bit and it got mucked up. This guy became a bit of a villain, lost his job. Bent. There was another probe around the same time called Phobos 2 and they were going to have this big investigation into what went wrong with Phobos 1

but they decided not to because they thought it would scare the people in charge of Phobos 2 so much that all become so paranoid that they were going to get sent to the salt mines or something so they delayed the investigation into what went wrong with Phobos 1 and they let Phobos 2 keep going and that did get to Mars but when it came time for it to land on Phobos and get close to Phobos, something went wrong with its computer as well, and it never landed. So, that was strike two. Right. And then there was another lander that they were going to send now in 2011.

That was called Phobos Grunt. And that got sent up on a rocket into Earth orbit, and it was supposed to be in Earth orbit, and then get fired off to Mars. But something went wrong with that one too. And it never even left Earth orbit. And after going around the Earth for a little while, it fell back to Earth and they think it crashed into the ocean. So we are yet to go to Phobos, to land on Phobos, to orbit Phobos.

And every time we try, something seems to go wrong. So we've been to Mars, right? We've got lots of stuff at Mars. Lots of times. Oh, yeah. We've landed. We've landed. Humans haven't. Yeah, but probes have. And We've got lots of stuff at Mars. Lots of times. Oh, yeah, we've landed. Humans haven't, yeah, but probes have, and we've landed lots of stuff on Mars.

Driving around Mars and all that kind of stuff, but we can't go to its moon. We haven't been able to get to the moon, but because so many things have been sent into Mars orbit and gone around Mars and stuff, we've taken millions of photos of Phobos. We've even taken pictures of Phobos from the surface of Mars, looking up at it as if it's the moon. Those transits of the sun we've got pictures of and everything. So let me send you a picture of a transit Phobos, because that's quite cool. Have we been to the other moon?

Phobos's twin? Deimos, no. Right. We have not. Have we tried or we just focused on Phobos? I don't think so. I think for, I don't know that, but I don't think so. Phobos is the bigger and more interesting one.

I like to think that Phobos is out there just avoiding us. Like, we keep sending stuff to it and it just moves so fast, it's ducking and weaving and just avoiding us and refusing to be- That's a cool thought. Here's a nice picture of Phobos. Oh, yeah. It's very potato-like. And here's a picture of one of those transits where you see it going across.

Oh, yeah, right. So, it's really big from the perspective of what we're seeing. Well, yeah, it doesn't look as big as the sun looks. And remember, Mars is further away. So, it is actually quite small. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it is quite close to Mars, so that makes up for a bit. Yeah, yeah.

There you go. Phobos. F-O-B-O-S, is that right? No, it's P-H. P-H-O-B-O-S. Oh, right, okay. Phobos. Nice.

Okay. Well, yeah, no, that's a moon. Yeah, it's quite an interesting character. In that first picture I sent, you can see that big stickney crater there. Would it be fair to say that Phobos is the closest moon to us apart from our moon? Well, I would argue Deimos is closer because Deimos is further from Mars. When it's on our side of Mars, it would be closer to us than Phobos. Right. Okay.

So, I think Deimos might have that title. Venus and Mercury don't have moons. Oh, really? Is that because they're too close to the sun? I don't think so. I mean, maybe in the case of Mercury. I don't know. But I think Venus could potentially have a moon if fate had gone that way, but it just didn't. Get a moon, Venus.

Come on. Everyone's into it. Get a moon. Jupiter's got like, how many moons has Jupiter got again? I thought there was only eight. I know. Oh, gosh. No, there's loads. And Saturn, I think, has got even more.

They could lend out moons. They could. lend one to venus mars seems to be happy with the two even though one of them's a bit recalcitrant phobos there we go nice work okay well that's a pretty solid moon of the week i'll give you that not quite as interesting as some of the others but you get more points because it's close and looks like a potato. So that's great. No, I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take that as I'm on notice. Lift your game, Brady.

I want better moves. I didn't say that, but I'm just saying, you know. All right. All right. Way to put yourself under pressure for your idea for a podcast. I'm not guided. We don't have time for that, do we? Let's just ask a few more questions about Phobos.

Oh, yeah, now you're talking. Come on, then. Was it called Phobos Grunt? That was the mission. Phobos Grunt. That was the mission. Grunt. Phobos Grunt.

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What's your idea for a podcast, Tim? Okay, so let's look at this mediocre list and pick one of them. Let me start, test the waters a little bit by giving you an idea that, again, came up in conversation tonight from one of the people in the house. This is the Anthropocene Reviewed Reviewed. So we've got some John Green fans in the house at the moment. John Green being the author who was on the podcast a dozen or so episodes ago. Very popular and sent us a copy of his new book.

Trying to flog in his book. Flog in his book. Well, he's done well because he sent me a copy of his new book. Trying to flog in his book. Flog in his book. Well, he's done well because he sent me a copy, and the people in the house have been reading it, and they've loved it so much. He reckons a whole podcast reviewing this book, which is called The Anthropocene Reviewed, based on John Green's podcast itself, is a good idea.

So I said I'd mention that, and that's a big shout-out to John Green. You've got some mega fans here in the house at the moment. I like that. A podcast reviewing. You could just review, because that's obviously a podcast too, Anthropocene Reviewed. You just review every episode of Anthropocene Reviewed, saying how good a job you think John did in that episode. Yeah, yeah. We've visited this idea again in the past. People could do it with the Unmade podcast. They could go through and make the Unmade podcast. They could go through and make the Unmade podcast reviewed and that would be depressing.

That would be depressing indeed. It would be. I'd rather they didn't. Look, the idea I've got here is called the sane ones. So cast your mind back. Very famous advertisement campaign, marketing campaign by Apple, Think Different, where the very famous poem was portrayed with images of Albert Einstein and John Lennon and all these great people.

And the words came out, here's to the crazy ones. Here's to the crazy ones, the misfits, the rebels, the troublemakers. And they were talking about the great people of history, the contrarians, the mavericks, the people that have gone off script and done something really outlandish and new. And Apple was quite pretentiously putting itself in that category and saying, here we go, we're breaking out of the tyranny of the blanket PC world

and we've got our new and different Apple product, which is funny now because Apple's just such a blanket product about everywhere. About the only thing you can't do is ignore them because they change things. But here's to the crazy ones was the idea of these mavericks. But I'm a bit cynical about these crazy ones because I think they're often really flawed people.

And that might be interesting from a particular point of view, but they're fated in every way. And my podcast explores those who are not mavericks. I'm interested in the sane ones. That is, my podcast would interview people who kind of self-describe themselves as boring people. And I've met lots of these people and people who describe themselves as ordinary or boring or there's nothing much interesting about me

or they've done the same thing for a long time in an understated, unseen kind of way in a particular vocation. They're not the people, they're the opposite of those people that go and seek glory. And I think they're actually often really, really fascinating as to why they've made the choices that they have. And this podcast would explore the very nature of the conservative and non-maverick, non-contrarian, very moderate decisions.

Conformist. Conformist decisions that they've made in their life and how they've made them and why they've made them and where it's taken them. Are these people particularly successful? No. No? No, because otherwise-

So it's just like you're seeking out very average people. Yeah, which could be a bit pejorative, like asking people, can I interview you for my podcast, which is boring people who have not been successful. But if you say successful people, then you end up, it ends up being that kind of podcast again where, oh, and then it all exploded or then it was amazing. They could be successful.

They could not be successful. Who cares what the successful bit is? But then you're giving them glory. I'm more interested in the conformity or how they – just the very nature of how they go about their life. Like I've got a relative who left school early and got a job as I think like a fitter and turner. I'm not sure. You know, sort of in the sort of hands-on welding sort of work. Worked – bought his house almost immediately, has lived in it and has now retired

and worked at this very same workplace just down the road for over 50 years and doing the same job, didn't move up into management or ownership, just did pretty much the same job that entire time. Rode his bike every single day to the same place, came back at the same time, pretty much had the same rhythm about having a shower, putting pyjamas on, eating dinner, you know what I mean, watching the news, going to bed. And he's become almost like legendary in our minds for the sheer understated consistency of the way he went about his life, brought up two kids,

was involved in his community via his church in a very understated, not up the front, not as a platform, not in any sort of significant leadership responsibility. Don't you find that fascinating? Don't you find that amazing? Do you think your podcast by its nature, though, like say you were the interviewer, are you trying to defy that are you trying to find that one thing about the person that's you know there must be something about you that's different even if it's the thing that makes it feels like you're they're like by

putting them on a podcast you're almost trying to defy that like or like are you you know there must be a reason for it did something exceptional happen that made you so unexceptional? Otherwise, what are you going to ask them? You can have a conversation with someone. You've done this all your life. You talk to someone and you ask them to explain their life. And it's not because you're searching to find that one thing where you go, aha, but you're a great pianist. There we go.

That's your one little glimmer, your diamond. What's interesting is the telling itself wow okay so you chose to do that and you just someone takes you through their life or explains how they are some of these people all the time are saying oh it's not very interesting or it's not very much but the kind i guess the premise of the podcast is ordinary ordinariness can itself be interesting it It can be extraordinary. It can seem extraordinary in the listening if you focus on it and are attentive to it. But even that you're trying to make exceptional, aren't you?

Wow, you're so ordinary that it's exceptional. Like no one else is as ordinary as you. It's amazing. Come out and check this guy out. There's a paradox with numbers called what is the lowest number that has nothing interesting about it? You know, you can say, well, zero is interesting for obvious reasons, as is one. And two is the first even prime number. It's the first prime number. Three is the first odd prime number. You know, you can find something interesting about four or five, and you can go up into the

thousands. Every number has something interesting about it. And they say, what is the lowest number that has nothing interesting about it? But the problem is, and say it was like 10,478. Yeah. But it's interesting that that's the lowest number that has nothing interesting about it. That's right. So, it loses its status and you have to go to the next number. And it feels a bit like you're doing that.

You're trying to find someone who has nothing interesting about them, but that's what's so interesting about them. Like. That's true. There is a paradox at play, but that works. Then it works as a podcast idea. Yeah. I've often been like, you're very good at this as well,

because you're very other centered and you can interview really, really well and get people to talk about themselves. And you don't feel the need to interrupt and give your own anecdote. You know what I mean? Like you do that really, really well and get people to talk about themselves and you don't feel the need to interrupt and give your own anecdote you know what i mean like you do that really really well that that that's a wonderful way of getting people to explain something about themselves and realize things about themselves or just just to feel relaxed to talk about themselves in ways they might not ordinarily do in normal in normal party situations where there are others that jump under the spotlight and have the witty conversation and have the witty anecdotes and all that kind of stuff.

Like I've been at parties before where it's like a friend of a friend or it's some relative or something where you don't really know anyone. And what do you do? You can either stand there on your own or you can just sort of laugh along with another conversation. But what I've often done is just look at someone who's sitting on their end, go over and sit next to them and just ask them about themselves. And actually the way the night becomes interesting is that you spend, you have a deep, you talk for an hour and a half with one person rather than making small talk with 100 people, which is like death to me. You actually realise, oh, this person,

I remember one guy doing this years and years and years ago. He was just talking about he's been part of Rotary all his life. And I was like, I don't really know what Rotary is. Tell me about Rotary. And so he just explained what that's about and then how he'd lived and where he'd moved and stuff. And there was nothing that- they're not going to make a movie of his life. But I was absorbed by it because you're pushed into the details, I guess. That's the point of it.

But you're not pitching some kind of unsung hero podcast. It's not like the person seems conservative, but in fact, you know, they've been, they've fostered 350 orphans in their life. No, there's heaps of those podcasts already. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You want someone who's just like.

Ordinary. Banal. Banal. Well, the point, but that's kind of the point is that there's no one they you know this is a person with i mean i mean i agree with you i think everyone is interesting and anything can be made interesting but you're sort of almost you're deliberately making a challenge for yourself there but yeah but i do think that i do think even when i'm talking to someone who you know is not exceptional, you are always looking for something, that different thing, that little point, that little

talking point, the thing I'll come home and tell my wife later. I always think even when I'm interviewing someone, I'm always pushing and probing and looking for that little thing that is interesting, you know, because you want life to be interesting. You don't want, you don't want to, I wouldn't want to talk to someone for an hour and come away from it and think, wow, that person really is boring on every single front. I guess that's – or perhaps that is the subtle way of going about it, that you're finding – well, here's what the insight is. It's that you're learning something, that even though there may be

nothing exceptional in the sense that it would make the news or that the whole room would go, oh, my goodness. But I find it interesting because I'm learning something about, oh, tell me about that. That's, you know, and so I find it is interesting because you're learning about a person or you're learning about a little corner of their life. Yeah. I mean, to be clear, I think everyone is interesting. I'm sure it would work.

What did you call it again? I can't remember. Tim, you're biting your nails. Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry. I got sent several messages from people with advice on how you can stop biting your nails. I must send them forward. You do need to. I'm actually biting my nails while I'm talking to you on a podcast recording. I'm just trying to help you. I'm not telling you off. I know you want to kick the habit. No, no. Very good, very good.

What did you call that podcast idea again? I called it The Sane Ones, but that's a very bad idea, even for a Tim name, that's a bad name. But it could just be called Ordinary or Extraordinary Podcast or Ordinary People, famous film. Ordinary People. Yeah, that's good, Ordinary People, yeah. Unexceptional.

It is kind of a bit unfair on the guest, isn't it? Like, you're right, it's a tough sell. But that's why they could be self-selecting. You could say, this is a podcast where people who describe themselves as ordinary people are interviewed. And you know what I mean? That sort of sets the premise because there are people who talk that way and that sort of adds the element that the interview will seek to defy

that, you know. It would be interesting to talk to someone who defines themselves as- describes themselves as ordinary for a while. I like that. I think there's something there. I don't think we- I don't think we quite cracked the nut, but I think there's something really good there. I think there is a podcast there.

Who is the most ordinary person that you know? I don't know. I keep, I'm flipping through the little sort of, you know, index in my mind. And every time I think of someone, I think, oh, no, but they have got that about them. That's quite cool. Again, name names. Bent people and ordinary people. They're our two targets this time.

That's what we want. Yeah, that's what we want. Surely with you in such close proximity to your family, you were given secret words to smuggle into this episode? Oh, yes. Oh, dear. Oh, dear. It's going to be a stretch too.

Oh, no. See if you can make me say them. I always like you trying to make me say them. Oh, right. Yeah, okay. Yeah. Okay. So, let's say this is a really hard one. Am I going to be explicit or am I going to take you on a journey of a story and try to get you to say the word? Don't take me on too long a journey.

But, yeah, but don't just, like, don't just, like, mime it either. The thing that was funny before about your Vegemite spoon was that it was like a mini Vegemite, right? So imagine all sorts of things that all the vegetables and condiments and things that are small, that have their normal size, but then there's a small version of them. Like, you know how there are tomatoes, but then there are, like, those little cherry tomatoes and they're, like, a small version of that. Yeah. Like it small version of them. Like, you know how there are tomatoes, but then there are like those little cherry tomatoes and they're like a small version of that. Yeah. Like it's one of them.

So start naming some. Oh, like mini carrots and things. Yeah, keep going. So a small vegetable, small potatoes. This one's actually fun to eat and that often when you go to eat it, you mimic eating it like it's the big one, but it's fun and ridiculous because it's like tiny. Oh, gosh.

I'm trying to think. All right. You use prongs. Mini sweet corns. Yeah. Baby corn. Yeah, that's very well done. There you go. Baby corns. Yeah. Well, that's very well done. There you go.

Baby corns. Yeah, well, mini corn. Mini corn. And I said- Mini corn. I said, what's mini corn? And then the answer came, you know, baby corn. So I don't know if baby corn is correct or mini corn is correct.

But you know when you get like a- I think baby corn. A canned tongue or, you know, like a sweet and sour sort of dish or something like that. It's got those tiny little corns. And you try to eat it like Bugs Bunny but with little teeth. Spit it around. I resist the temptation even now to do that, and I did that as a kid. That's a classic dad joke.

Oh, yeah, yeah, good stuff. So there we go. That was a particularly tough one. I know why that hasn't come up before now. KFC used to do corn. I don't know if they still do corn. They used to do it. Corn on the cob is good.

I often buy corn on the cob to have for dinner, and then sometimes we just don't get around to cooking it. I don't know why, because I always enjoy it. Do you eat it properly, or do you, like, cut it off with a knife? No, I eat it with my hands and, you know, crunch it with my teeth. Yeah. You know, Bugs Bunny style. Yeah, nice. Nice work.

In fact, that'll get a grunt. Oh, yeah. Thank you. Corn. Thank you Bunny style. Yeah, nice. Nice work. In fact, that'll get a grunt. Oh, yeah. Thank you. Corn. Thank you very much. Thanks, Tim. Thanks, Tim. Bent coppers.