The Unmade Podcast - 117: Human Organs

Episode Date: September 22, 2022

Head to https://actnow.climeworks.com/Unmade to start removing CO₂ from the air today... Hover - register your domain now and get 10% off by going to hover.com/unmade - https://www.hover.com/Unmade Support us on Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/unmadeFM Join the discussion of this episode on our subreddit - https://redd.it/xl4z07 Catch the podcast on YouTube where we often include accompanying videos and pictures - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkIRMZDOKKKs-d14YPmLMxg USEFUL LINKS Stumpman Merch - use code PEG23 - https://the-unmade-podcast.creator-spring.com/listing/tim-stumpman-logo Glenn Wheatley - Amazon books - https://amzn.to/3qWMFeH Glenn Wheatley Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_Wheatley John Farnham - You're The Voice - https://youtu.be/tbkOZTSvrHs Pictures of Spoon of the Week - https://www.unmade.fm/spoon-of-the-week Send your own spoon by following these instructions - https://www.unmade.fm/send-us-a-spoon Darwin, Australia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin,_Northern_Territory Saturn's Missing Moon - https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2022/09/saturn-rings-missing-moon/671478/ The Science Paper - https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abq3184 Human Organs - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_organs_of_the_human_body

I know it's really naff to talk about dreams, right, and to talk about what you dream about. Oh, here we go. I know how boring it is. Yeah. I know it's boring. But do you have like a recurring either like anxiety dream or more to the point when you've got like loads to do and you just can't get on top of things and you feel like you're falling behind in life, a dream that will always happen?

Yes to both. I had an anxiety dream when I was young about crossing the road and never quite getting to the other side and a car coming. Right. I can imagine that. Well, your legs are all, your legs go all weak or something, do they? Yeah. Well, it's just, I just kept crossing at a specific stop outside the house we lived in. I can picture it now. It was actually just across in front of our neighbour's house at that house. And I just can't get to the other side. I also never get hit by the car car but it's just forever in that moment of tension you know the other one I can relate to in terms of I have conversations in my dreams about issues that are coming up at work or conversations that I anticipate are going to happen you know

right so they happen a bit they flicker every now and then I have two recurring dreams I actually have three but I'll only refer to two recurring dreams that happen when life's getting a bit on top of me, like I've got lots of deadlines, lots of work I need to do. One is I'm back at high school about to do year 12 exams, your final high school exams, but I haven't done any learning all year and I've done no revision and I'm completely unprepared for the exam and there's no way I could possibly sit the exam. And the other anxiety dream I have is I have to do a performance, like a stage performance, but I don't know any of my lines or any of the

songs I have to sing or anything. I've learnt nothing. Yeah. I definitely had that one at the time of the school plays. I would wake up and I'd be quoting lines half full and, you know, sitting up in bed. Yeah. But I had a double whammy last night because this week I've got like a lot I need to get done and not enough time. There are lots of time pressures on me this week and I just can't possibly do all the work I have to do. I'm really feeling it. So, it was no surprise that I was going to have one of those dreams last night. feeling it. So, it was no surprise that I was going to have one of those dreams last night. But I had a double whammy last night. Last night, I had to do my year 12 exams, like on Tuesday and Thursday. And then on the Friday night, I was going to have to perform as Hamilton in the musical

Hamilton. And I didn't know any of the songs and I wasn't able to sing them. And I was having to explain to people, I can't possibly do both of these in one week. Oh, that's classic it was so it was funny that the two anxiety dreams I have managed to merge into merge into one I love that there's an aspiration in there as well it's not it's not you're not back at a school play you're actually you've made it to Broadway like you're in Hamilton like that's amazing the funny thing is I reckon I could sing all the songs from Hamilton. So I don't know what I was stressed about. Not only is it never going to happen, so the dream shouldn't be stressing you out, but even if it did, you'd be fine.

Do you have a teddy? Do you take a teddy to bed? No. Like to comfort you in the dreams? No, take a teddy to bed? No. Like, to comfort you in the dreams? No, I just get into bed without one. I just stuff it. I just put it off the side table and say, you stay there, teddy, I'll see you in the morning.

You're so brave. Sometimes I'll just glance across at him just to make sure he's there, though. But, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, for sure. Do you have anything you take to bed for security my wife but our dog invites himself brooklyn certainly jumps on the end of the bed and he's crawls his way up so he's a bit he's a big teddy bear that's for sure i remember being at this party once i wouldn't this must have been in my 20s or 30s it was at a house

and there was one guy in there particular who was the real life of the party he was a real larger than life character he seemed like you know everyone knew him and he was the joker and he was like you know he was the guy and it was it was a big party that loads of people were just crashing at the house so at about like you know three or four everyone said oh it's time to go to sleep and we all just crashed on sofas and on the floor of the lounge and that and And this guy who'd been like, you know, Mr. Life of the Party, like got on the sofa and then went over to his backpack and pulled out this little like handkerchief type cloth and laid out on the sofa and just put the handkerchief up against his face. And I was like, what's going on there?

I said to my girlfriend at the time, what's going on there? What's with the handkerchief? And he said, oh, he's just had that since he was to my girlfriend at the time, what's going on there? What's with the handkerchief? And he said, oh, he's just had that since he was two years old And he can't sleep without it Wow And he was like in his 30s Even if he was going to a party, he had to get this hanky out and sleep next to it It was kind of cute

He's a little blankie, wow Do you reckon you can take something like that into a marriage? Like, at what stage of a relationship do you break it? Well, I think you can, yeah I think you can break it? Well, I think you can. Yeah, I think you can. Do you? Do you not think you can? Well, it's interesting.

I understand it. And maybe there's a large event why he's so attached to it. And that's very significant for all sorts of... Well, it's clearly significant for him. I don't know what I think about it. I feel like he should have grown out of it. But if he's willing to pull it out at a party at the age of 30, I imagine he's going into, I don't think he's giving it up ever.

No, no, no. I wonder if he'll be buried with it. Well, that would be nice. It would make sense if he still got it at that stage. It's a bit like Steve Waugh, the famous cricketer, who had the same handkerchief in his pocket his entire career is that right you told me the red yeah that red one had that red handkerchief yeah that's a superstition this is a little bit a blankie is a bit different to a superstition isn't it it's a bit more you're a bit more forgiving of it i don't think you go to

bed without your top gun t-shirt now because you've got it on most of the time i've got it on again in the morning i've got a rotation of probably three or four sleeping t-shirts and the top gun is just one of them but i think you just noticed that one more so uh i i like to think that you'll be in an old folks home one day you'll be 94 and some nurse will be just helping you put on that top gun t-shirt again it'll be all faded and stuff you look i can't sleep without it you're wearing the same thing for the third podcast in a row, Man in Black in a Black Cap. Yeah, but this is my uniform. This is all part of my image, my brand now.

I can't go anywhere without it. Okay, right. The truth is it's winter. It's my warm jumper that I chuck on as I run out the door and the cap. Speaking of your brand, we did mention late in the last episode, we looked at that picture of Tim playing a cricket shot in his teen years, and he remarked that his shadow in the photo would make a really cool sports logo, like the Michael Jordan Jumpman logo.

Just to let you all know, I have had that turned into a piece of artwork, and it is available on all sorts of merch now. T-shirts, backpacks. I think we even have it on a sports bra if you're interested. Wow. So, if you want to get some Stumpman Tim sports merch, I will link in the show notes. And I'm thinking maybe just as a little sneaky bonus for people who are listening at the moment, we'll do a little discount if you use the discount code. Have you got some secret words today?

Should we use one of your secret words from the girls? Oh, yes. Which one? Peg. Peg is one of the secret words. Does that work? Is that enough words? Just in case there isn't enough letters.

I don't know if there's a minimum number of letters. We'll make it. What was the number you liked? It was 23, wasn't it? Because of Dermot Brereton, the Hawthorne footballer. 23, yeah. Was that the number? Tainted a bit by Michael Jordan, but we can go with 23.

I guess there's a Jordan connection there too, so... Peg 23. Put in peg 23 as your word to get a little discount on your Stumpman merch. And I believe that discount will work across all the store if you want to buy other Unmade Podcast merch. There's quite a bit of it these days. Quite a bit of it unsold. Is that what you're saying, mate?

Got warehouses full of the stuff. But yeah, have you looked at any of the merch yourself? You've been tempted? I do like it, yeah. You'd be surprised to hear that i don't have a lot of sports clothing like i have a t-shirt and a jumper that i might go for a walk with the dog in in summer but that's about it yeah so maybe i need to stock up a little bit use that peg 23 tim you'll get a discount is it inappropriate to sign your own sports merch like

if i was to if i was to buy one of my own sports, like, do you think Jordan ever bought a T-shirt, like an Air Jordan Nike T-shirt, and then, like, signed it and then just wore it? You know what I mean? Like, I've got an autograph. Well, A, yes, I do think it's weird to sign it for yourself. But B, I think it's weird to wear signed merch at all. I think once something becomes signed, you retire it,

and it's for, like, framing or displaying. I'm not a believer in wearing the signed merch at all i think once something becomes signed you retire it and it's for like framing or displaying i'm not i'm not a believer in wearing the signed merch a friend of mine's son uh took a cap to an australian cricket match and all the australian cricket team signed his cap it was brilliant i couldn't believe the signatures he had on it and he was like wearing it around london like you know like as his hat i said i can't believe you're wearing that that's that needs to be retired that belongs in a museum that belongs i i don't know about that i think some if it's valuable i guess or where i think you do what you're going to get the most enjoyment out of i like the fact that he was wearing it and enjoying it and and they were fading and he's got the signatures i think that's kind of cool i like it although i you know i'm not i'm pretty partial to some signed merch myself something autographed and but i don't know it's however

you're going to enjoy it and get used how would you feel if i had a limited edition lp signed by nick cave and then i was out walking one day and it started raining and i didn't want to get my hair wet so i held up the lp in the air to stop the rain landing on me. That's a bit different. You're not using it for its express purpose. You're damaging it in a one-off event. But it's like you would pull it out and you wouldn't necessarily frame it. You would pull it out and use it. I kind of like that idea.

I read books that are autographed by authors. It could rain on the hat. It could rain on the hat. That's true. Yeah, right. I wouldn't read a book that was autographed either probably because you're going to damage it. Oh, no, I love doing that.

I love that it's both got me and them in it. And apart from the Tom Hanks one that you got me, that's in a very safe spot, I have to say. But I had another copy of that that I'd already read several stories from. But, yeah, other ones I like to use them. Okay. Well, each to their own. to say but i had another copy of that that i'd already um read several stories from but yeah i um other ones i i like to use them okay well each to their own if you have any autographed memorabilia of any type let us know what you've done with it have you preserved it in some special way do you use it in any way especially i'd be interested to hear what have you got signed and

what have you done with it unmadefm at gmail.com or go to all the usual places and let us know tim have you got an idea for a podcast yes and it's not unrelated to your mention of nick cave you'll be pleased well let's be honest i'm pleased to say this is the part of the podcast that i call the toilet break that's right we're about to do a deep dive into music trivia um look i've just been reading i've just finished a book which i really enjoyed called paper paradise which is a biography of a person called glenn wheatley do you know who glenn wheatley is wasn't he john farnham's music manager yes yes well done nice work

perfect i don't know where i pulled that from but yeah and now it's time for spoon of the week no it's this is a glenn wheatley's interesting guy, and he's a rock manager. He's also an entrepreneur in the music industry, and he owned radio stations and stuff like that. But he's most famously known as the rock manager of John Farnham. John Farnham, for those around the world, is an Australian singer. He's probably somewhere – I was thinking somewhere between Phil Collins and Michael Bolton.

You know, he's sort of, you know, it's a bit of pop and a bit of soft rock, isn't it? He's somewhere in there, that sort of. I like that you've come up with a place to put him. I was thinking of this spectrum of musicians. He is, that's probably about the right place to put him. But he's also like, that's musically, that's where I'd place him. But on like the nationalistic spectrum he's kind of like in a bruce springsteen type place where he's like synonymous with the country he's like yes australian singer like bruce springsteen's the american singer his music isn't like bruce springsteen but or cliff cliff richard in england you know multiple generations yeah yes good call

and and i have to say as a segue poor john poor John Farnham is in hospital at the moment. He's been diagnosed with a mouth cancer, very sadly. So the voice is under threat. And his life is under threat. But apparently he's doing quite well. And that's a little bit of what prompted me, just thinking about him, I've been listening to his music a little bit lately because I do love it. He hit stardom

for the second time when we were um kids in the 80s and so glenn wheatley's a really interesting guy because he's his manager now i'll come back to explain a little bit more about him but my podcast is basically about rock managers and there's been some really fascinating rock managers over time brian epstein the manager of the beatles and colonel ton parker the manager of elvis presley and there are others as well there's some really really great ones glenn wheatley though he's a really interesting guy though because he's he started managing john farnham when john farnham was on his back not popular anymore he'd been a teen idol but he was embarrassingly uncool right in his sort of

early 30s and had nowhere to go and was down to his last 50 as a family and all the rest of it and glenn wheatley mortgaged his house to help him record an album called whispering jack which had this awesome song on it called you're the voice and um it was this massive punt And radio stations wouldn't play it Like you would send it out without a cover and name on it Trying to get them to play it And then finally someone played it

And it just took off And it's now the biggest selling Australian album of all time By an Australian in Australia And John Farnham, as we've said, has become legendary So he's a bit of a hero, Glenn Wheatley Going in that far, you know, risking his house for his artist. I guess one of the reasons I knew who Glenn Wheatley was as well, and most Australians perhaps do, is John Farnham, who is actually a very funny man. And when he would be interviewed, when he wasn't singing, was a very jokey and very colourful personality.

He always mentioned Glenn Wheatley, his manager. He would always make fun of him publicly. So, if it was on Hey Hey Saturday, the Australian television show, and he was being interviewed after doing one of his songs and they'd say, what are you up to? What's going on? He would always point out Glenn Wheatley in the wings and make jokes about him and belittle him in quite an affectionate way. He was sort of like John Farnham's whipping boy when it came to making jokes. So, everyone knew who he was because of that he was always pointed pointed out in the wings that's right yeah and they actually became a little bit of a duo like that and there was a famous advertisement by a big telecommunications company in australia telstra they did an ad that

featured both of them you know what i mean and and bantering on and joking right yeah so he's he also he the highs and lows as well like he went to to jail for a while because of tax evasion a little bit later on in his life and so he was bankrupt once as well but then he also had been a multi-multi-millionaire and so really interesting life and sort of book that i really love but they're really fascinating these managers these people they earn 20 of their artists and they do all the business and oversee very very large organizations and you'd think there would be a podcast about rock managers but i can't find one i can't find one and i can't believe it and i'm tempted to do one

because they're so interesting my favorite rock manager is a guy called paul mcginnis who's the manager long-term manager of the band U2. He hasn't managed them for about the last five years or so. But again, he found them three, four months into their career, just four skinny little guys playing stuff, you know, around town and just says basically, OK, well, we're going to go to the world. You know, and just to take a group like that and steer them and manage them through,

obviously they've got to have the musical chops as well, but it's a fantastic story to be the biggest band to the world you know and just to take a group like that and steer them and manage them through obviously they've got to have the musical chops as well but it's a fantastic story to be the biggest band in the world do the biggest rock tour of all time and do it over and over and over again they're so fascinating and the rock world industry is just so interesting you mentioned nick cave earlier are you going to tell me who nick cave's manager is i actually don't know who nick cave's manager is he has no one of of significance that is. I actually don't know who Nick Cave's manager is. He has no one of significance. That is really interesting. I don't even know if he has a manager. Let me look it up.

People just will be sitting on the edges of their seats waiting for this information. Bit of live Googling here. Someone called Susie Goodrich. I've never heard of her. I don't know why. There's not an up-to-date Nick Cave biography actually Which is something else

Believe it or not I've been tempted to write But I would not do adequately Is there any degree to which you consider me to be your musical manager After you know Hein Hund and various other musical endeavours and merch I think that's a Is that a fair description? I'm the talent and you're you're

sort of the business brains but you're also the talent but i'm not the business brain so you're like it's like you're managing yourself and me i don't know oh is that a fair i think that's kind of right you're we're a bit like john farnham and glenn wheatley where i'm i'm sort of john farnham a because i've got a great voice and yeah you and you're sort of in the show as well, though, but you're the sort of business brains behind it as well. Right, okay. Is that fair? I don't know.

I'll listen back and see how offended I am later on. I've called you both the talent and the brains. I don't know how you could be offended by that. Yeah, that's true. I have to say one of my other favourite managers is a guy called Miles Copeland. And Miles Copeland was famous for a variety of reasons in rock music, but most notably he was Sting's manager for many, many years. He's not anymore.

He also founded a record company called IRS Records, which famously signed REM. So he's like discovered REM, which is another massive achievement. So two massive artists really, but he was Sting's manager and he appeared in a few of Sting's documentaries as well. And he's very straight talking. Like he would just tell, he's the guy that tells the truth. He says, if you want, he says, I, I, he goes, he's got a very strong American accent. He goes, I'd tell Sting you've got to write a verse and then a chorus and then another verse and then back to the chorus and then the bridge,

something slightly different because we're bored, and then the chorus two more times and that's it. And I want you to do that over and over and over again. And any time Sting would depart from that because of some creativity, it's like, look, we're going to have to have a chat. creativity it's like uh look we're gonna have to have a chat it was just very very very blunt and flat out about um people's worth he famously this is on one of sting's documentaries when sting's putting together like a new backing band and stuff and he's negotiating with the backing band about how much they're going to get paid like it's like hey there's a big show tonight

and they're like how much money's on the table and he It's like, hey, there's a big show tonight. And they're like, how much money is on the table? And he's like, no, no, no, no, no. That's not your table. Forget what's on the table. That's Sting's table. And the guy's like, well, what happened? Tell us how much is on the table and what percentage?

And he's like, no, no, no, listen, this is Sting's table. Let me tell you, if Sting can't make it tonight, but you guys go on, how many people are going to want their money back? But if you get a cold and you can't come tonight but Sting is coming, guess how many people are going to turn up? Every single one of them. He goes, it's not your – just totally blunt, hardcore, you know, like – and that's often the case with these guys because rock –

the rock musician needs to be cool but also friendly cool but also behind them is often a very savvy and in the music business hardcore. Not as hard as record company owners but managers play it hard as well. I reckon at the start of the next Unmade Podcast episode as an experiment, I'm going to say, hey, everyone, it's Brady here. Unfortunately, Tim can't make it to the podcast today.

See how many people listen. Then we'll try it the next week. The difference with the one the next week is it won't be uploaded because I don't know how to upload a podcast. Rock Managers is, you know, a podcast about Rock Managers is a good, solid, normal podcast idea Not your funniest No, but every now and then I have an idea that you could actually do

And this is why Yeah, I'm a bit, I don't know what to say I'm a bit thrown by the fact we've come up with an actual idea that would make a decent podcast So, yeah, let's move on all right well we're now gonna have a message from a sponsor and we're doing things a bit differently this week it's something i recorded a couple of days ago so i'm gonna throw to myself take it away brady okay everyone we're gonna do something a little bit different for today's episode sponsor, which is Climeworks.

And this is a company that has really captured my imagination, if you excuse the pun, because obviously I'm a bit of a science geek. And Climeworks is a company that is doing something pretty sciencey and pretty techie that I find really interesting. In a first for the podcast, we're actually going to talk to someone from the company. We're talking to a member of the Climeworks team, and that's Rachel O'Brien. Welcome, Rachel. Thank you very much. You must be pretty experienced by now at explaining what Climeworks does. So let's hear your executive summary. What we do in a nutshell is remove CO2 from the air to fight global warming. How we do

that is we developed technology. It's called direct air capture. We directly capture CO2 from the air. From 2009 to 2022, we've made huge steps from measuring milligrams of CO2 in a lab to now removing tons of CO2 from the air from our latest plant, Orca, which is in Iceland. We are now on a journey to remove megaton and gigaton levels of CO2 by the end of the mid-century. They're kind of like giant air purifiers, aren't they? That you'd have in your office, except these are like out in the open, sucking in the air, taking out the carbon dioxide. It's exactly that. I think it's a really great way of explaining it, actually. It's essentially, yeah, lots of filters, kind of just filtering the air, powered solely by renewable energy. And we use geothermal energy because we're in Iceland.

Our machines are built to filter the air for CO2 and then we take that co2 and we actually liquefy it so essentially we are making sparkling water if you will so that sparkling water is pumped underground to our neighbor carb fix and there that is where some more magic happens they take the liquefied co2 and they inject it into the ground actually it's roughly i think about 800 to 2000 meters and the great thing with Iceland is that you have basaltic rock and basaltic rock is almost has the texture of a sponge, a hard sponge. So you inject the CO2 and it fills all of the gaps of this basaltic rock and becomes hard calcite matter. So essentially you're creating a new rock formation. It stays there

permanently. It can't come back up. And that's the really unique process. And where we really want to differentiate that process as being totally different to other carbon capture technologies out there, because we are removing CO2 from the air, as opposed to capturing it at like a power plant. So you are kind of reducing the levels of CO2 in the air. And then you're also ensuring that it never comes back again and contributes to global warming. It feels like nature already has a pretty good way of doing this called trees. Why are you not just planting more trees?

I mean, we love trees and we think that we should be planting more trees. Everyone, if you can, keep planting trees. Right now in the world that we live in, in order to have enough trees to remove the amount of CO2 in the air, we would need land the size of Europe. Whereas direct air capture technology is scalable, stackable, it's completely modular, it's a thousand times more efficient in terms of land space. So I'm imagining people listening to this are probably thinking, well, that sounds good. Good for you, Climeworks. You're doing some good work there. How does it affect them? How can they get involved? In order to kind of scale and get to that gigaton capacity, which is our, you know, our dream, we kind of need everyone involved

working together and removing CO2. We actually launched our webshop about two years ago. And in that time, we've accumulated about 15,000, what we call climate pioneers, that's kind of individual customers. And those people are taking mostly monthly subscriptions. So they subscribe to Climeworks and we remove CO2 in your name. So you can start a subscription as low as $1, £1, €1 euro whatever fits your lifestyle and your budget um up to you know however much you would like to commit basically the more the better of course for us but um you know ultimately it's it's a really great way for you to you know feel

like you're contributing to reversing the effects of climate change whilst you know also i think we're all um eco anxious probably with everything that's going on around us um so there's also that feeling of okay i'm planting a tree but i can also contribute to the scale up of a technology which is really trying to reverse the effects of climate change just at this point let me give people a website act now dot climbworks dot com slash unmade. And I'm going to put that in all the descriptions and the usual places so people can click on to check it out,

become one of these pioneers, perhaps. Thank you so much for talking to us today. Again, that link will be down in the description, actnow.climeworks.com slash unmade. Iceland is probably now my favourite place in the world to go. Next time I go there, I know I'll be offsetting my flight. No, not offsetting. I will be recapturing my carbon dioxide via Climeworks.

But hopefully when I'm there, I'll get to come and see Orca as well because I'm really excited to see it. The pictures and the videos look amazing. So I want to come and have a look, maybe make a video about it as well while I'm there. That would be great. Okay, we're back to the normal show now. Thanks, Climeworks.

So I know what I'm getting you for Christmas, Tim. Getting you to get you a Climeworks deal, some carbon dioxide out of the air. That would be greatly appreciated. I'm sure. You do blow out a lot of carbon dioxide with all your singing and music talk, so you're probably contributing more than your fair share, so it's the least we can do. It is good. It's a good remedy for people who are full of hot air.

That's true. Yeah. Okay, so I guess now it's time for... Spooned on the Week. Well, Brady, tonight's spoon is a very formal and official-looking spoon from Darwin. Darwin. Darwin. North Australia, northern tip of the Northern Territory,

which is a territory of Australia but not a state. It hasn't got full statehood at this point. I've never been to Darwin. Have you been to Darwin? No, I've only stopped at Darwin Airport. I've never been to Darwin either. It drinks the most beer of any city in the world, doesn't it, per capita? Oh, really? Well, it is very hot, that's true.

It is hot. I have some friends in Darwin at the moment, and they've got me thinking about Darwin, so when I was looking through the collection, I pulled it out. I did have a sister who lived in Darwin. One of my half-sisters certainly lived there for a while. And I'm sure this is where it found its way into my father's collection. She sent it down.

Okay. It's old. It's got a nice, it's one of those nice round scoopy bits, but with a little tiny point at the end, which I always think would be really helpful if you've got like a vanilla slice that you're pushing into something with a bit of pastry crust and the stems elegant and small, but you can see it's really quite an old spoon probably from the 16th or 15th

century. And it's either that or it belonged to Charles Darwin and he's put his name on it, which is a very personalized way of handling your cutlery But Yes Very nice Alright White enamel with what I can assume is the coat of arms of Darwin

Which I have to say is not on brand for the Darwin that drinks the most beer of any city per capita Or the crocodiles If you've seen Crocodile Dunwoody And that's your vision of Australia, then you're certainly seeing an area close to Darwin. What do you think of when you think of Darwin? What's the first thing that comes into your head? Kakadu National Park, I think.

But that's not in Darwin. That's in the Northern Territory, but it's not in Darwin. Isn't it close by? Well, having not been, I don't know how far away it is, but I just told the truth. Like, that's what comes into my mind. It's a part ice cream um or cyclone tracy that's what i would think of cyclone tracy it was it was christmas

wasn't it when cyclone tracy knocked out was it like 72 or something no 75, 75, I'm pretty sure. I think I remember as a child it being just before we were born. And a massive cyclone flattened the entire city of Darwin. So that's the interesting thing about Darwin. They talk about it being all new. It's all been built since then. It was 24 to 26 of December. So it did cover Christmas Day. 1974.

Four. Ah, okay. I do remember seeing a book that was one of those hardback books in our kids' library at primary school, which was called When Tracy Came for Christmas. And that's where most of my Cyclone Tracy knowledge comes from. I mean, a lot of people associate Australia with, like, scary animals and spiders and things like that. But we don't have a lot of natural disasters. Other than fires, we have good fires and a bit of flooding, but we don't have a lot of earthquakes and we don't get like cyclones and hurricanes and things like that.

So, when you're growing up, knowing that there was a cyclone that had hit Australia, that was quite a scary thought. So, Cyclone Tracy always did loom very large for Australians, especially Australians of our age who were hearing about it as little boys and girls. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's what I think of, Cyclone Tracy.

Anyway, thank you for that spoon, Tim. There will be a picture in the show notes, as always. And now it's prize-giving time. Have you got the guitar? Oh, no, it's over got the guitar? Oh, no. It's over in the church. Oh, no. Oh, no.

You're just going to have to sing a cappella for these winners. Well. Okay, here we go. The winner of the Unmade Podcast souvenir spoon, absolute collector's item, is Julius B from Germany. absolute collector's item is julius b from germany julius b from germany all right and the sofa shop mixtape it's a double victory for the germans is going to miri a also from germany so we've got someone b and someone A. That's great. A and B. Nice.

Yeah. Myriad. And then we have a Spoon of the Week collector cards. The craze that is still sweeping the planet. And we are sending a handful of these cards out to Jed T from Australia. Oh, Jed. Nice. Well done, Jed. Vince P from the USA. Vinny P. Yes. Yeah. Vinny P. On you, Vin. Nice. Well done, Jed. Vince P from the USA.

Vinny P. Yes. Yeah, Vinny P. On your Vinny P. Vinny P. And Gordo B from Canada. Gordo B with a big Australian accent. You got one, Gordon B, at last.

Gordon, of course, being Sting's real name. Gordon Sumner. So nice tie in there as well. How is that for drawing long bows and tenuous connections between segments on the show? You wait till I do it with the next name you read out. Okay. What can you do with Joshua R from Michigan?

Joshua Redmond is a jazz saxophonist, and Sting had some jazz players in his band at one stage for the album The Dream of Blue Turtles. Well done, Josh. All right. And last but not least, Joseph D from Hull in the UK. Joseph D. I mean, what was the surname of Joseph, Jesus' father?

Could have been. The Carpenter, I think. His middle name was The and then Carpenter. Joseph the Carpenter. Oh, so that would be Joseph C, right? We've got Joseph D. All right. From Hull in the UK.

Cards coming your way. Now, Tim. Yeah. Here it is. Oh, you're not. You're not, are you? No. No, man.

No. No. Moon of the Moon. No, man, no. Moon of the Moon. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I considered not doing it this week, and I just thought there'd be outrage amongst the civilians.

There'd be civilian unrest. It's too early for a toilet break. All right, come on, let's bring it on then. It's the segment that civilians will queue 12 hours to listen to, the moon of the week. And we have today, very, very interesting, we have moon news. We have a moon in the news. Whoa.

Tim, we're off to that famous planet Saturn. Oh, Saturn. I like Saturn. Out there Saturn. I like Saturn. Out there beyond the orbit of Jupiter. Saturn's a good-looking, good-looking moon. And why is it a good-looking moon? Well, because of the lovely rings. Indeed.

And that's what we're talking about today. Because Saturn's been around for about 4.5 billion years. But apparently it's only had its rings for maybe 160 million years and the question is where do those rings come from and there's been new research just published in the last week or so that has shed light on that and has come up with a very solid theory as to what's going on with the rings and they believe the cause of saturn's is, can you guess? Space junk. People on Saturn just blasting things off into the space and it all collecting itself. I'll give you a clue.

No. I'll give you a clue. What's this segment called? Moon of the West. Oh, it's a previous moon that's disintegrated. They believe it could be a moon that strayed too close to Saturn and was ripped apart. And the rings are the remnant of that moon. I've heard that theory before, but they've done some new research with some new data from the Cassini spacecraft. What they were trying to do was answer another question about

Saturn. And that is, why does Saturn sit on an angle of about 27 degrees, a tilt, as to where it should be if it was straight, spinning like a top in the plane of the ecliptic, the way the planets are supposed to? But it's on this 27 degree tilt. And they thought maybe it had something to do with gravitational interaction with the far-off planet of Neptune. But the mathematics weren't working out. It didn't work.

They did some more calculations, and they found what did work was if there used to be a moon that was no more. And they did some calculations based on that and it made the tilt work, but it also explained the ring around Saturn. So to quote the Guardian newspaper, they said, an inner moon strayed too close to the gas giant, causing it to be pulled apart, painting out its own orbit in a trail of shattered icy fragments. The hypothetical lost moon has been nicknamed Chrysalis. Here's a quote from Jack Wisdom, a professor at MIT. Just like a butterfly's chrysalis, this satellite was long dormant and suddenly became active and the rings emerged. Wow. So there we go. Saturn has 82 or 83 moons, depending on what you read. It used to have another one, probably, and 160 million

years ago, it got ripped to pieces. They reckon 99% of that moon would have actually crashed into Saturn itself. But what's left in the rings still weighs about 15 million trillion kilograms. It's almost entirely ice. 95% of it, water ice. And the rest is a bit of rock and metal. They call this a grazing encounter. But it was pretty violent for a graze well let me tell you i have a couple of questions you said before that the moon tilts but if we're

in space and there's no up and down how what is tilting doesn't mean anything or are you saying that all the planets spin in the same as if they were rolling down the same yes it's it's saturn saturn that tilts by the way not the moon but yeah so what's happening is the sun is at the center of the solar system yes and the planets all rotate around at different distances and they all rotate on the same plane like it's a like like the solar system's a huge pancake and they're all just doing their own loops around the pancake so all the all the planets are traveling around the sun on the same plane that is true isn't it why is that well the reason for that is is because the solar system formed as a spinning disc of gas that condensed so when everything condensed into planets and there was no longer a spinning disc of gas, it maintained the momentum and direction that they would have had in that

disc. That's why all the planets are going in the same direction and they're all going on the same plane of flatness because they all formed out of the same disc. It's like if you had a pancake and then you got rid of most of the batter and just left little rings of batter, they would all be on the same plane of the frying pan. So, all the planets are going around the same plane of the frying pan on which they were formed. They're all going in the same direction and they're all going at the same around like the equator of the sun,

so to speak, at different distances. And the planets themselves, not only are they going doing laps of the sun, but they're also spinning on their own axis like little tops. So it's like little tops that are spinning around themselves and at the same time doing huge sweeping circles around the sun. And are they all spinning as if they had a north-south pole up and down on that sphere, are they? Yes. Oh, right. Yes, and that axis upon which they're spinning, the tops are spinning, theoretically should be at exactly 90 degrees to the plane of the ecliptic.

They should be like spinning tops on there. But some of them are spinning in different ways. For example, I think Uranus is spinning. Its axis has become so tilted that it's actually level with the ecliptic and it's rolling around the sun like a bowl almost wow but most of the planets have got slight tilts from that perfect top spin because they've been knocked by asteroids and they've been whacked and stuff like that the earth the earth isn't perfectly upright a bit of a tilt which is why we have seasons why we have summer and winter and

that because sometimes your part of the planet is tilting towards the sun at summer and sometimes your part of the planet is tilting away from the sun in winter. And so Saturn also has this 27 degree tilt and astronomers were just interested in this tilt. Why is Saturn being knocked off? Why? And they've come up with this obliteration of this moon i'm picturing like endor and then the death star explodes above it and then is you know ends up spraying all its

bits and pieces spray around into a sphere and just you know spin around that's essentially what happened it must have looked amazing if you could have stood on the surface of saturn which you can't because saturn has no surface but if you had have stood on the surface of Saturn, which you can't because Saturn has no surface, but if you had been down on Saturn level looking up, it must have looked incredible. It must have looked incredible from anywhere. The Ewoks would have been cheering. What do you think of Chrysalis as a name? No, I don't like it.

I was hoping for something better than that, and I went, oh, yeah. Chrysalis is a bit more like if something was closed in and then suddenly had opened up, but this is something that's exploded yeah exactly a chrysalis i associate with things like you know coming to life but it was basically the death of this moon that caused the rings to happen so it was it was it was almost like yeah i think they've i think they've got it wrong there professor what's his names the the the tim of naming things down there. Yeah. Well, he's called Jack Wisdom. You'd think he'd be better at naming stuff, but he's a professor of planetary science at MIT.

Maybe that's just the name that everyone gives him because he's so crap at naming. It's like, oh, Jack Wisdom. What's a name? Like Charlie Big Potatoes. Yeah. Mr. Clever Pants, Jack Wisdom, named it Christmas. Nice one.

Nice one, Jack Wisdom. God, I hope I never have to interview Jack Wisdom now. All right. Nice. All right. Anyway, he's the lead author of the study, and it's a very interesting study, Brady says, to try and claw back some ground.

When you say it's a study that's just that's an idea and they've written it down right that's like what what yeah but yeah but it's a bit more tool than that they haven't they haven't just said oh imagine you know imagine if it was made of ice cream they've they've used a whole bunch of data and readings and new measurements taken by this cassini spacecraft that's been traveling around saturn and they've they've then done some modeling and make sure that everything fits with the readings and how far away everything is from each other and planets. And they've made sure it mathematically works.

Right. They've looked it up in big books and stuff. No, and it's been peer-reviewed. It's been published in the journal Science, which is a big deal. And for something to get in Science, it has to either be checked very rigorously or it has to make a really good story that's going to get in all the newspapers. So, it definitely met one of those two criteria. Well, it's appeared on Moon of the Week, so it's certainly getting-

I'm just saying you've made it there. You've made it. Interesting. Okay. So, that's a moon that no longer exists, but you think may have existed and may be the rings of Saturn. That's interesting. That's a good-

Yeah. The rings of Saturn are the remnants of this destroyed moon. And it also traces the orbit that this moon used to take, they said. Yeah, right. Oh, okay. That was a good moon of the week in that the moon doesn't exist anymore. And it's only a hypothetical moon. But it sounds like the explanation that makes sense to me.

I think they go with that one. And now let's talk about Hover. Oh, Hover. Hover have sponsored this episode. Hover, the domain registrar. Get 10% off your first domains by going to hover.com slash unmade. Hover's brilliant. Easy to use.

They've got all the best dots, the dot coms, the dot nets, the dot orgs, all the dots you want, plus the dots you haven't even thought of yet. They've got everything. I've registered loads of domains with Hover. I then link them to my websites or I sit on them for a rainy day. I know Tim's got a few sitting in his Hover basket. Got anything nice to say about Hover today, Tim? I do. I think a lot about Hover. Can I say one of the things that Hover assisted to happen is that remember when the internet first came out we had to say https backslash yeah double colon you know unmade yeah all that kind of stuff yeah none of that with hover they don't make you do that stuff anymore no i mean no one does but i'm just saying they don't just in case people i don't know if i could take full credit for that but

they've always got specials too i'm just having a look they've currently got 92 percent off their dot stores so if you wanted to buy tim hein dot store or you know candy apples dot store 92 off at the moment off those domains they're practically giving them away that's crazy same with dot shop is 87 off they've always got these great bargains going dot me 33 off what's a what's a domain you'd register what about man in black man in black i mean i'm imagining man in black.com will be gone because that's too cool a name. I don't see what else is available. Well, if it isn't, I'm sacking my manager. Maninblack.me you could get.

You could get that, Tim, because you are the man in black in a black cap. That's the name of my album, maninblack.me. Maninblack.studio. Wow, there you go. Maninblack.studio if we made that our production, you know, our music arm. Could be a massive spinoff business. Man in black.management could be my domain if I start managing you full time. That's true.

Man in black.website if you wanted to start a website. Imagine if you had to have the name website in everything that was a website. Who would use.website? Who registers domains with something dot website it's kind of like that's really doing what it says on the tin isn't it that's the that's the kind of website name your parents would come up with isn't it it's like we've named it a website i don't know i'm sure people must use it if they've got it there but i don't i can't see why you would have that one it's called google google.website. And you can find everything.

I love it. Man in black.plumbing. When my second album fails and I have to go back doing something else. Man in black.surf. For when you merge your two great passions in music and surfing. Oh, that's great. Nice. Man in black.legal.

When our contract disputes over the royalties gets turned. We have to form an in-house legal service it's all here at hover it's very addictive looking at hover i find it very addictive it is it is it's uh it's like yeah it's like window shopping go to hover.com slash unmade to check out what's available and register all the good names before they're gone if you've got some idea in the future, you're thinking, oh, I'm going to do this one day. And when I do, I'm going to need a website. Get the name now before someone else does. It's really cheap. It's really easy. 10% off, hover.com slash unmade. Thank you, Hover, for supporting this episode. Thank you, Hover. Okay, Tim, time for my idea for a podcast. Yo. This is also something I would love to do as a YouTube channel, but I'm never going to do it also something I would love to do as a YouTube channel,

but I'm never going to do it. So I'm going to use it as my podcast idea because I haven't got time. But you'll see why this would be very suited to one of my YouTube channels as well. I haven't decided on a name yet, but for now, let's call it, let's just call it, let's just not be clever. Let's just call it Human Organs. This is a 79 episode podcast about all the organs in the human body each episode dedicated to a different organ it could be just scientific how it works health history culture we all feel

very close to human organs we all have lots of we all have them i know a name a perfect name yeah the organist you're the organist the organist. You're the organist. The organist. I was thinking the organ grinder. The organist is good too. But yeah. Did you say 79? There are 79 organs? Yes. 79.

It was 78. They discovered a new one recently. Wow. What have you got? Your heart and your lung? Yeah. That's pretty much all you need, isn't it? What else do you need?

What other organs are there? That's the basics. They're the two. That's the king and the queen of the organs, aren't they? What else do you need? What other organs are we? That's the basics. They're the two. That's the king and the queen of the organs, aren't they? Hang on a second. Hang on a second. Hang on a second, Tim. I'm going to get my timer out here, right?

Because I thought of doing this and you've talked me into it. I'm going to set my timer for two minutes and in two minutes I want to see how many organs you can name. Go. Heart, lung. Yeah. Is the gut an organ? The stomach? Stomach is one, yes, stomach.

Oh, right, okay. What other organs are there? The kidney? Yeah. What else is down there? The sexual organs, like the reproductive system. Well, yes. The genitals.

Yes. Right. Yes. Yes. The pancreas. Yes. There's nothing in your knees or your feet, are there? Your arm.

It's all pretty much around the torso sort of area, isn't it? So if we come up higher, there's nothing higher. It's all pretty much around the torso sort of area, isn't it? So if we come up higher, there's nothing higher. It's all around there, surely. Let me pause the timer to help you because let me tell you what an organ is. We probably should have done that before I started the timer. Because an organ is, according to Wikipedia, an organ is a collection of tissues joined in a structural unit to serve a common function.

Maybe it will help me if I tell you using one, there are different ways to define organs and there are different lists. But for example, on the list I'm looking at, the ears are an organ. Oh, right. I'm starting the timer again. Okay. All right. The ears.

Yeah. Well, you say, then you go into things like the nose and the mouth. They're a collection of tissues. Okay. I don't know. Yes, yes. The mouth is an organ all right the tongue might be a separate organ or maybe it's part of the mouth organ no no the tongue is yes or the harmonica as it's called called scientifically um yeah the uh what uh what do you got adam is the central nervous system perhaps an organ? That's a bit...

I don't know. It might be. A bit technical there. Yes, the nerves. Nerves. Yes, nerves. The muscles. Muscle groupings.

Perhaps the muscle system. Your skin might be an organ. Yes, your skin is an organ. Your skin is the biggest organ. What isn't an organ? Is your hair an organ? I mean. Yes, according to this list, it is.

Well, now we're just naming body parts. Your bones, are they organs too? I believe they are. No, that's ridiculous. What about my hat? Is my hat an organ? No, your hat is not an organ. No.

And, oh, hang on. I think the time is about to go. Your bowels. Time's up. Time's up. Time's up. How many was that? Let me tell you. 71?

Oh, I didn't know. I wasn't counting. Who knows? Let me tell you some ones you probably should have said, though. Right. The brain. Yes. Nice.

You could have had the gallbladder. Oh, yeah. Fallopian tubes, although you don't have those. Well, yes. The large intestine, the liver. Oh, the liver. That's the one I was thinking of. The lungs, mammary glands.

Oh, yes. Yeah, and like ovaries. So there's a few here that, you know, the prostate. Well, I said the reproductive system, and I feel like there's a few in there. Yeah, the spleen, the appendix. You don't really need that, do you? Thyroid, trachea, the testes. And it's got your nails.

I nearly said nails as a joke. The penis and the scrotum. Right. They all have a role to play. They do. Yes. What bit of us aren't organ which well are we just all organs lots of organs put together well i mean that is one way to describe a human i guess isn't it yeah what's a collective noun for organs good question what

is it well they all a they all the different organs have um their own collective nouns. So it's a tangle of stomachs, a whim of livers, a nebula of brains, a confusion of kidneys, and a cooler of hearts. I told you that they've discovered a new organ. Recently they added a 79th organ to the traditional list, and this is something called the mesentery. It was once thought to be part of the digestive tract, but they did a lot of looking at it with really powerful microscopes and electron microscopes.

And they discovered that this structure was more sort of linked to itself and interlinking than they previously realised. So they decided, in fact, what they thought was a bunch of little things going on was all one big structure so they've called it the mesentery this is an organ that attaches the intestines to the posterior abdominal wall in humans and it's formed by the double fold of the peritoneum it helps in storing fat and allowing blood vessels lymphatics and nerves to supply the intestines, among other functions. There you go.

So a bunch of stuff inside you that they thought was just all bits and pieces, it turns out it was all joined up and it's a new organ, the mesentery. The body is amazing, isn't it? Amazing. Incredible. It is ridiculous. And I think it would be a great series, 79 parts, doing a different organ every week.

Absolutely. Yes, it's fascinating to know exactly what they do. But the sorts of facts and trivia historically, how they've been understood, how they're worshipped, how they have a special significance. But, yes, just how to take care of them, what damages them, what's good for them. Yes, yes.

Fascinating. What can go wrong, what can go right. Have you got a favourite organ in your body? I would have to say, I know everyone will say the heart i guess i do because dad had so many heart attacks i was fast i knew more about the heart when i was young like i sort of understood because i was forever looking at x-rays and diagrams and explaining what was going on and the idea of having a heart attack because he had five and had open heart surgery. So I feel like, and I knew his doctor, Dr. Ogilvie was his heart doctor and his heart surgeon, and I felt an affinity for him and knew him.

So being a heart doctor sort of feels extra special somehow because of that. If you were a surgeon, would you have a specialty? Would you like to be a brain surgeon or would you like to focus on the gut? Being quite squeamish, I would like to do whatever one involves the least, you know, like the idea of being a brain surgeon, like sounds cool. But the idea of cutting someone's head open and like poking their brain kind of freaks me out a bit. Same with being a heart surgeon.

I don't think I could be a surgeon. I don't think I could do it. When I watch all those shows like Grey's Anatomy and all those TV shows in which they do surgery, which like my wife loves, I'm always on the sofa, like curled up in a bowl covering my eyes whenever they cut something open. I can't handle it. I'm not surgeon material, which is also probably why I couldn't make a video series about the human organs. I think I'd struggle. Oh, no, that should be great. I've spent time scouring YouTube looking for operations to watch. I just love it.

Oh, no. Oh, yeah. No, that's like my worst nightmare. No, not having that. But a podcast is good because you don't have to look at all that stuff. So maybe a podcast about the organs is the way forward for me to sort of to do this thing I'd like to do without having to quite look at all that stuff. It would be an interesting podcast idea to walk through and talk through an operation, though, wouldn't it? So now I'm doing this and be able to describe it in great detail and just walk people through.

Now I'm doing this and this is what this looks like. That's a different experience to watching it. Watching it's a bit obvious, but describing it, or particularly a doctor saying, and now what I'm going to try and do here is this, and I've got to try and do this. And I particularly think about those doctors who go in thinking about a brain surgeon in particular, I guess, but going in going, okay,

this is going to be a 15 hour operation and just stealing yourself. I'm going to stand here for 15 hours do something that requires ridiculous levels of attention yeah it is amazing isn't it are they allowed to check their phone in those 15 hours i don't think so but then but their hand they've got those gloves and your phone doesn't work with those gloves on well that maybe that's what the nurses do like when they you know because you know how they like dab their forehead and do like everything for them. Maybe they might just say like, you know, give me some suction here. Give me my scalpel quick.

Hold up Twitter for me so I can check my mentions. Just see if I won that thing on eBay. That's right. Phone. Scalpel. No, there are different braid surgeons. I think my favorite organ is the eyes. Oh, yeah. The eyes are amazing. Like, not only are they just an amazing piece of machinery, but they're so

important. They're such a, like, they connect us to the rest of the world in such a special way, more than any other sensors do. And I think the eyes are incredible things. Because I wear glasses, I've spent a lot of time with optometrists, which is not quite the same as an eye surgeon. But I have thought about, or I did years ago, becoming an optometrist. But I was so bored by being at the optometrist by the end of each appointment that I would scrub that idea. I'd go, no, this would be a boring job.

Like I'm bored being here concerning my own eyes. And I'm certainly not going to be interested enough to do this with someone else's eyes. That's for sure. Yeah. Can I just say something else? I was, tonight we were at home before I came to record this podcast. And we were watching the show Antiques Roadshow, which I know you know, great classic show. And I know you love yeah yeah it's

great and and for those who are not aware this is when people bring um antiques so-called antiques things from around the house and from relatives along to a big fair and they film and experts get to describe where it's from and it all builds up to the you know what's it worth the valuation but we we went we went tonight and looked on YouTube because one of the daughters asked about, oh, I wonder what the most expensive thing is that we've had on Antiques Roadshow. And we realised that there's a whole bunch of clips

from an American version of the show, which I didn't know if you know existed or not. The thing I really noticed is the response of the people from the UK and the people from America and how different they are. I know we've mentioned this before, but I really noticed it tonight with the Americans that when someone's told, you know, that this vase is actually worth, you know, 13,000 pounds, they sort of stand there and go, oh my, well, that is a surprise.

British people, yeah. Yeah, that's right. Are you going to sell it? Oh, no, no, my. Well, that is a surprise. British people, yeah. Yeah, that's right. Are you going to sell it? Oh, no, no, my Aunt Gladys would never approve. Well, certainly insured, perhaps, but oh, my. On the American one, when they tell them the price, it doesn't matter what it is, they start crying. Like, they're so...

It's like, I can't. It's money. Oh, i can't believe it and they just they wail when they're so moved and i don't know is that something obviously that british people are more reserved but is it that americans just love money like they're just everyone has a weakness for money obviously but i think it's more i think money is more celebrated in america like if you have a lot if you have a lot of money you'll get a lot of money that's like reason to be praised or reason to boast or you know like this is a good thing i did you know like i've done something or i've got something that's worth lots of money you know you're pleased about that but you're not you're

not allowed to be seen to be pleased in the uk that would be crass. That would be a bit grotesque. Yes. Yeah. So, whereas, yeah, Americans, you know, they're more, they have a more entrepreneurial spirit. They do. It's the new world and it's all about new ventures. But it was really noticeable that there was no modest, oh, wow, that's, you know, got great sentimental value. They oh, wow, that's, you know, got great sentimental value. They were. Yeah.

Oh, it's not about the money, of course. I was curious, but of course, it's a family heirloom in England, whereas in America, you've gone in because you're hoping it's going to be payday. That's right. It's payday, boys. It's like, thank you, grandma. Like, thank you. Oh, God. This is the greatest thing they've ever done.

My grandma had this for 80 years, but I always thought it was worthless. But now it is worth something. It's like they've won a game show. Like, it's a totally different experience. Oh, geez, it was funny. All right. Have we finished offending pretty much all our audience? Or is there any group?

That's it. Brain surgeons. Americans. Is there any group? That's it. Brain surgeons. Americans. I know we've got one of your secret words in because that's how we came up with our discount code for the Stumpman merch.

Peg 23 to get your discount on your Tim jumping shadow logo link in the notes. Have you got another word? Yes, but I can't remember what it is. Oh, dear. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, dear. It was called out to me as I left. Normally you write this stuff on the back of your hand.

I know. I didn't. No. I remembered peg. I don't remember the other one, but it's a very short word the same. Dog? Yeah, like that, but no, it's not dog. Should we just guess every word until we get it? Keep going.

Would you recognise it if I said it? Yes. Cat, cap. Cap. I think it's not dog should we just guess every word until we get it keep going would you recognize it if i said it um yes hat cap cap i think it's cap i i think i'm not kidding i literally think it's cap yes all right all right nice i had i had all the short words in the english language and i think i got it with my fourth guess people are going to think you edited out 45 minutes there but there we go oh that's oh what a relief