The Unmade Podcast - 14: Nicknames

Episode Date: July 13, 2018

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I'm waiting for Tim to arrive. He's flown all the way across the world, from Australia to England. Hey, mate, I'm good, I'm good. How was the flight? When I come out at Heathrow, I imagine the final scene in Love Actually, you know? Love is... Yeah, except for Hugh Grant and stuff, you get me. Welcome to my house in England. We're recording in person. This is exciting. It is.

You sound excited. I'm sorry. I'm a little bit jet lagged, but I'm good. And on the fly over, as promised, you've come up with a huge big list of ideas. I can't wait to hear them. Do I even need to give ideas? You must have so many that I can just put my feet up, surely. Well, having carried you this far, I feel like I need to keep you involved to some degree.

But I do have a long list in front of me. You were standing in the corner a minute ago going, oh, these are all rubbish. Can you go first, please? So, I will go first. Are you ready for my first idea? I am, I am. Yeah, you shoot ahead. Get us going.

So, the idea for this podcast is called Nicknames. And it's a podcast all about, funnily enough, nicknames. Oh, that's great. Because there's so much stuff with nicknames. There are people with nicknames. There are places with nicknames, sports teams, and I think you could go in all sorts of different directions. There are so many directions you could go in here, I haven't even really completely focused it in my head, but I do think it would be really good fun.

Today we're going to talk about interesting inanimate objects with nicknames, like Big Ben, the bell, you know, in the clock in London and things like that. This week, we're going to talk about famous people from history who had interesting nicknames. One of my favourites is Lyndon Johnson, the US President's wife, was Lady Bird Johnson. She was called Lady Bird since she was a kid. Or Buzz Aldrin, of course, I would do, the moonwalker, things like that. How did they get their nicknames? What do we think of them? The show could also come up with nicknames for things, critique them, ones we like, ones we don't like. I just think this is a very fertile ground.

I think this is brilliant. I think this is actually probably one of the best ideas you've had. It wouldn't make your top ten. No, this is really- in fact, I think there's a whole- when you just said it, I thought, oh, that's great. There's a whole podcast just in people and their nickname and how they got it and why. I didn't even think about things like Big Ben and inanimate objects. That's right. That's so funny how we personalise objects like that with nicknames.

Have you had nicknames over the years? I've never really had a nickname for you. I've just always called you Tim. Have you got like, you know, what have you been called over the years? When I was a kid, I was amused, but I kind of had three names like Tim, Timmy and Timothy and different people would call me different ones and cousins affectionately called me Timmy or when I was little, it was like little Timmy. And so, they still call me that sometimes, but obviously it's Tim most of the time and Timothy very, very rarely. Although I quite, I've grown into liking Timothy more as I get older, but as a kid, it sounded, you know, dorky and too formal and stuff. There was time when um i was doing youth work stuff at one stage and a particular group of people started calling me hindog hindog hindog yeah i like that yeah tim's surname is hind for those who've never delved

into the show notes or our website so hindog is yeah your surname with dog on the end i mean it's sort of funny because it's i'm so not a hind dog kind of character. That's like a big football player kind of name. You know what I mean? Like more of a surfer name. But I'm just not that person. So, it's kind of a little bit ironic. Was it hind dog or the hind dog?

No, it was hind dog. But that was a few people for a little while. And thankfully, that never caught on beyond that. Well, I well lucky you just said it on a podcast timbo i get a little bit in fact i call myself timbo sometimes you call yourself timbo well as as you know in in hey everyone it's timbo here that's your radio name again ironically like ah timbo's come up with a good idea again. Hey, hey, you know, that sort of thing. Because again, Timbo is, I'm just not a Timbo kind of guy. No, you're not a Timbo. A hind dog I'm going to try.

I'm going to take that for a test drive today when we go out for lunch later. What about you, man? Well, man. Well, we call each other man, but that's just like, that's not really a nickname. That's just, I don't know what you'd call that. That's just like. I don't know where it came from. I can't remember. I think it came from somewhere, like a film or something, but I don't remember. Lost in the mist of time. It's been around for years, but I have very few nicknames and have had very few over the years. There's a very small group of people who call me Braids. I've never had a good one as well. Obviously, adaptations of your name are obvious nicknames,

and that happens a lot, whether it's your first name or your surname. My favourite nicknames, and I know very few people with this, but I have like a subgroup of friends who I'm just peripheral to, who all their nicknames have nothing to do with their real name. You would never know their name to hear their nickname. Yeah, right. Like it's Goose and the Field Marshal and Stormin and all these like, they've all got all these weird nicknames and then real names are like, you know, John and Fred and that,

but they've got all these really elaborate nicknames. How did they come up with that? And there's always this incredible long story behind it. So, I'm jealous of people who like have nicknames that have nothing to do with their name. I think that's pretty awesome. I mean, Australians are classic. I think they're unique. We say that we're unique in that we're forever shortening words down. Diminutive, yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. So, and adding an O. So, Steve or Steven becomes Steve-O and Dave-O from David. And we're

forever doing that with even really, really, really short names. You almost make them launder to add the O and to make them sound a little bit longer so jim becomes jimmy or jimmo or you know like it's it's an adaptation in that way an adaption but i imagine that's not just an australian thing although it must be done in a different way in different cultures i mean obviously it happens elsewhere but it is it is like a big part of australian culture and they'll even do it to things that you think are almost like inappropriate to do it to. Like a shotgun is a shoddy. Yeah, right. Like, are you giving nicknames to like firearms now? Like, why do we want to give things nicknames? Maybe we feel we own them a little bit more. They become more personal.

Yeah. Is it like a- is it almost like a badge of closeness? Like, yeah, okay, everyone at work calls you Tim, but I'm close enough to you to call you hind dog. Like, yeah, okay, everyone at work calls you Tim, but I'm close enough to you to call you hind dog. But it's funny because there's nothing more personal than your actual name. So, you're actually- you're giving someone a new title to make it more personal when actually that has no basis or foundation. You're putting that- you know what I mean? Like, there's nothing more personal than their real name, but you're wanting to give them

something else to make it even more personal, which is ridiculous in a way. I'll tell you a nickname that I find annoying. Because another thing that people have nicknames for are where you're from. Australians, of course, are called Aussies because we put the diminutive on that, like we would. Like, if you're from Ohio, you're called, like, Baka'a, Baka'i and things like that. But the place that I'm from and where you now live, if you're from South Australia, one of the nicknames for South Australians that's always annoyed me is crow eater. Oh, yeah.

People from South Australia are called crow eaters. I mean, obviously, they don't eat crows, the bird. The crow is not even the bird of South Australia. It's not like it's the state bird or anything. I don't know why the crow has become so associated with South Australia. One of the Australian rules football teams from South Australia has subsequently been called the Adelaide crows, which kind of annoys me as well. Because hang on, if we're people who eat crows- Where does the crow eating come from? Do you know even? No, I don't. I mean, there is a saying to eat crow, isn't there? In fact, until now, I've never associated it with the saying of eating crow. What does the saying eating crow?

Eating crow is a colloquial idiom used in English-speaking countries that means humiliation by admitting having been proven wrong. So, surely we're not called crow eaters because we're saying we're- Well, it's obviously a pejorative term given by other states, probably Victorians, where I'm from. So, South Australians have kind of adopted it a bit now, haven't they? Would a South Australian call themselves a crow eater? Or is it just outsiders that call them crow eaters?

It could be a situation where the name that you're given in a derogatory way, you adopt like the wigs in history and that sort of thing and you own it. And so, that's why they're called the crows. You're going to call us crow eaters, we'll be the crows. They're sort of, you're blunting the attack by judoing it or whatever. I remember when I was a kid and we were moving to South Australia, people said, oh, you're going to be a crow eater. And I sort of picked up that, oh, that's what you call the Adelaide people.

But I don't know why it is or where it comes from. It might be based in football, losing football matches or something way back. South Australia is a slightly smaller state than those big states to the east. So, I could see how you would give like a humbling name to the smaller state. And then that's just been lost in time. And then to a point where we would even call our football team crows. You know, it's funny because on the emblem for South Australia, isn't it a magpie? It's actually a piping shrike, which looks like a magpie,

but it's a different bird called a piping shrike. Tell me about that. Like, why is that? Luckily, I have Wikipedia here. I didn't know that. See, you can tell I'm a real South Australian and you're an import because you don't know that. No.

The piping shrike is the emblematic bird that appears on South Australia's flag. Hang on, is it a real bird? Emblematic bird, like it's a made-up bird. I never knew this. appears on South Australia's flag. Hang on, is it a real bird? Emblematic bird, like it's a made-up bird. I never knew this. Because the name Piping Shrike is not used to identify any bird, there has been some confusion over what bird it represents.

While some think it resembles the magpie lark, the original reports specify that it is based on the Australian magpie and the government's... So, you are probably more right than me. So, it's a magpie, but they've just given it a new name to put it on the flag because magpies were trademarked. Is that right? I don't know. The piping shrike first appeared on the Governor's ensign in 1903. That's the Governor of South Australia.

And was also on the state badge when it was proclaimed in 1904. So, it sounds like it's like a made-up bird. Wow. There you go. The term piping strike is commonly mistaken to refer to the magpie lark, which is incorrect. It is. It's like they've got a magpie and then someone's coloured in the wigs a little bit differently and made up a name for it and that's our state bird.

So, that's like a fictional bird on the South Australian flag? Welcome to England, by the way. You come all the way across the world to record with me in England, and all we're doing is talking about the South Australian state flag. Piping strike? Is that what it is? Strike. Strike.

S-H-R-I-K-E. Which is a nickname for a magpie in South Australia. It sounds like it. Anyway. Sporting teams have heaps of nicknames, don't they? Yes. I've watched a doco series, which I'll talk about a little bit later, actually, a particular sport I'll explain then.

And it's like being part of the team means you get a name. It's part of an initiation. You've been welcomed because you've got a nickname. And that's pretty legendary, I imagine, in most team sports. I'll tell you a sports person who had an interesting nickname, and that was the Australian cricketer Mark Waugh. Because Mark Waugh- I've forgotten his nickname.

Well, he joined the Australian cricket team. He has a brother, Steve Waugh, and his brother became successful before him and was an established Australian cricketer, and Mark Waugh was always trying to break into the team. The surname Waugh is spelt W-A-U-G-H. It sounds like war, like World War II, but it's spelt differently. Mark-u-g-h that sounds like war like world war ii but it's spelt differently mark war finally kind of broke into the team and became a very successful player obviously in his own right but his nickname for years and years was always afghanistan because

famously the afghanistan war at the time this was years ago before afghanistan had its new wars had an old famous war and it was always referred to as the Forgotten War. So because Mark Waugh was considered the Forgotten War because his brother Steve Waugh was more famous, his nickname in the team was Afghanistan, and that stuck for years and years. That was his nickname among the players. Hey, Afghanistan.

I've never heard that before. Your cricket knowledge is extremely far more expansive than mine. Far more expensive But hang on a second But actually he's not the most forgotten war, is it? Don't they have a third brother? Dean, Dean War And he never played cricket?

Yeah, I don't think he played for Australia No Yeah, he's like gone He's not even a forgotten war He's not even It's like Imagine having a brother who's really famous Who's called the forgotten war

Because he's not as famous as the other brother. We're in a Baldwin's at Chiturfa here. Yeah. I'm so unfamous I'm not even as famous as my unfamous brother. Whose nickname is based on the fact that he's not as well-known as the other guy. You are well down the pecking order, my friend.

Well down the pecking order. Anyway, nicknames, good podcast idea. I don't feel like i just want to keep i feel like there's so much more to this we keep talking about there it's a really really good idea there is we'll come back to it another time maybe but in the meantime i want to hear an idea from you this episode of the podcast has been brought to you by audible we actually have a really cool book to recommend but it ties in with an idea later in the show. So we're going to talk about Audible then. I've given a little bit of a foretaste for it when I was talking about the documentary.

My podcast idea is called Explain a Sport. The reason this has come about is because I've been aware forever, of course, of American football. Well, since I've been an adult, not really forever. As a kid, I didn't know much about it. NFL. And I've never known much about it. I know there's a Super Bowl. I know there's something else called the Rose Bowl. I know some of the teams like the Dallas Cowboys, but I didn't really know the details and you watch it and it's never made an impression on me. It was almost like, why are they playing football with so much equipment on, helmets and so forth? But I got watching a doco series and i've learned a little bit more i've got a really good mate who's just really loves it and has not tried

to convert me but has talked about it and i've been i've been vaguely interested in it but i i was watching this doco series the fact you refer to you use the word doco so casually instead of documentary shows your australian nickname listen oh yeah you always say doco and i always think oh man that's this australian as you say when you refer to docos of course i didn't i don't even think about that yeah i was watching a documentary series called all or nothing which is made by the nfl and john ham from mad men is narrating it and they follow through in the first season the arizona cardinals all the way through and it's in depth like wheat by wheat and you know you really get to appreciate it so my my podcast there's a sense at some stage early on i was really taken by it

but i needed to understand the sport what does this mean because it's quite a complex game and a very unique game really quite unlike you sort of think it's supposed to be like rugby but it's it's actually not at all even though there's a an area that you're trying to get the ball to, you know, it's so different. And I needed, I was like, I need someone to explain this to me. And so, my friend has been explaining it to me through text messages and so forth. But I was thinking, explain a sport. There are sports you think everyone knows about, but you don't. And so, a podcast that goes through and, well, let's explain this. What you're trying to do is to get from here to here, and you've got to do this and that would be of interest and then it could go off increasingly into more obscure sports and talk about why the sport is interesting or why forgotten sports why

they've been forgotten used to be huge this game was huge in the 1800s but it's not played anymore and then there's new sports that come out, like I think PE teachers or physical education teachers talk about, like, let's make up a sport. It's like baseball, but it's rounders, but we're going to do this and this and this and adapts it. But sometimes they come up with whole new sports. You've got to get across the yard with the ball and touch this and go. So, you can explain them. Does the doco you've been watching explain football, American football, or is it made with that as assumed knowledge and you've just been enjoying it for the storytelling and learning about the sport is something you've been watching explain football american football or is it made with that as assumed knowledge and you've just been enjoying it for the storytelling and learning about the sport

is something you've kind of had to do on the side to assist your enjoyment of the documentary no it assumes that you are american or you just have known this game your whole life yeah your podcast idea like are you imagining it being explained by like an authority to someone who's not an authority or is it just someone like talking from on high out to the audience or have you thought about how the format would work well i thought it no the explanation could be between two people so someone like me and someone about it could be and so i get to ask the questions that everyone's asking yeah because sometimes when you when you want to learn about a new game or something, oh, how do you play, I don't know, backgammon or particular card game? And you might read up about it.

And that can be really helpful. You can read the instructions, which is supposed to be helpful. You can watch a YouTube clip. And sometimes I always find if I've watched a YouTube clip to understand something, I don't know, I feel like I want to ask questions. Hang on a second. Before you move to there, what about this? If this happens at this stage? So, the podcast kind of enables you to do that. It's a dummy's guide, but you get to ask questions about it. Why would you do that? Or why is that called that? I'm going to make a controversial claim here.

Yeah. I think that is not a good idea for a podcast. Man. Sorry. Wow. And the reason is, I think that is not a good idea for a podcast. Man. Sorry. Wow. And the reason is I think that it is too big a handicap to try to do that without visuals. Yeah. Like you would have to be explaining so many things in such detail that could be so easily glossed over with just like a single image. Yeah. A whiteboard or a single image or a bit of video.

with just like a single image. Yeah, a whiteboard or a single image or a bit of video. And also, if you explained the sport for 100 hours and people formed a picture in their head of what the playing of that sport looked like, the moment they watched 30 seconds of the sport, they'd be like, I didn't even imagine it looking like that after your explanation. No, it's not like they've come out of a cave

and they've got no idea. Okay, explain the concept of sport to me. Like you do, you could sit, let me put it the other way. You could watch NFL for a hundred hours and you may not pick up exactly. I mean, you get the premise of what's going on, but there's so many things you'd like, it's almost like you've watched a game or you've watched it a little bit and now you listen to the explanation. It's like, okay, okay. that's why they're doing that uh fair enough but i still

stand by my original call that i think this would be too difficult too much of a cognitive load even if you've seen the sport before which you're right most people would have it would be too much to be visualizing all the things it would be so now imagine you're in front of the line and you're throwing it forward, but you could step back and there would be so much minutiae you'd be describing that needs visuals. I like the idea, you know, and you know I love sport. But I think there is a sport podcast inside your idea, fighting to get out.

But I think it has to be something different to just like explaining the sport to someone who doesn't understand the sport. I think that's not, I think that's like a valuable service and like there's something to be said and, you know, there's an idea there, you know, there's a demand for it. And I think there's also, it could be done in lots of entertaining ways. I think an audio only format is not the natural home for it this is a way it could be saved because and that is by a the same people and two characters one person who's knows lots about the sport another one who just has no idea and there's a rapport about let me explain this and why is this of interest and why do people and what's the history behind this? I think there's something there about explaining a sport.

And you're basically trying to convince the person to become- to admit, oh, this is- you know what I mean? To become informed and excited about the sport. Why I love a sport would be a good podcast. Like, if I said to you, Tim, I love NFL, I love American football, and you're like, oh, that's never really done it for me. And you did a podcast where the other person evangelises for their sport. I think you would drop in a little bit of this is why I like it. This is how it works. But it would be less explainy.

Yeah. I think maybe that's like a better way into talking to people about sports they don't know, rather than like explaining it and how it works. I think that's too- I think that's too like rules based and too, a bit too dry. What I hear you saying is it could be based around anecdotes. Like the reason this is, what happened, the reason this is exciting is because actually once upon a time in 1985, this player did this and I was watching and you know what I mean? It's just the reason that's amazing is that never happens.

Like I can't believe that happened. And you know, so there's a bit of context behind the things you're explaining about. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. A really good example of that is test cricket, which is this sport that lasts for five days. And everyone knows this game goes for five days and can end in like a no result, a draw. A draw is not a tie when the scores are equal. A draw is we ran out of time and there was no conclusion to the game.

So, no one wins. And everyone thinks that's ridiculous. What a boring sport that you can play for five days and you don't even get a result because you ran out of time. And yet, draws can be a fascinating part of the game. Some of the most exciting matches in history have ended in draws. It's a big part of the strategy of the game, playing for the draw, playing for the win, trying to get a draw when you're going to lose.

So, having someone who loves cricket explain to someone why draws are actually a feature rather than a negative part of the sport would be quite interesting. Cool. I'm trying to work out in the midst of my idea, because I've become quite interested in NFL watching this documentary series. It's kind of clicked as to why it's tense and exciting as i've journeyed with these teams a different team each season and i realized how much comes down to a few seconds and one move and one catch and you know there's only 16 team games in the regular season and so that's all

given a context to it and i get it i get i kind of get it now even though there's lots i still don't know about the game and i haven't actually watched a full game yet because it's not the nfl season or anything nfl would be a really tough game for it too because I only really watch the Super Bowl and occasionally I watch a college game or sometimes I watch an NFL game and every game I watch I learn like a new really complicated rule. There's lots of rules in American football and exceptions and like really like they've got very specific rules. It is a complicated game. I do enjoy it very much though it is a game i enjoy i'll tell you what i pride myself on knowing a lot about sport

and watching lots of sports and i also think i i'm pretty good at watching a new sport and picking it up pretty quickly and learning about it there's one sport that i've watched a few times on tv that completely baffles me and i and it's like it's come from another planet and i don't know what they're doing i don't know how you win it's like it's come from another planet and I don't know what they're doing. I don't know how you win. It's like, it's made up. It's like a joke on me. And I had to look up its name because I can never remember its name properly either. It's called Kabadi. Kabadi. Kabadi. Let me try and guess what Kabadi is. Okay. Is Kabadi that- Oh, no, because the premise of this works. There is that

winter sport where they push that little shuttle thing and it slides along the ice and they've got to, with broomsticks. Oh, curling. Curling, okay. I've just offended all our Canadian, many Canadian listeners now. That's curling, that's right. I thought I knew the name of that. But cabal sounds a bit the same.

Is it that sport, but it's done on grass? No. That would be lawn bowls. Oh, yeah. So, no, Kabaddi is like- Kabaddi looks to me like a sport that a PE teacher made up and got the kids to play it. Is it a big game then? Is it like- It's big in India.

Wow. And there's like a league and everything, which you won't believe when you see it. I'm going to show Tim a YouTube video of people playing Kabaddi. And they're on like this indoor court with like painted lines. And there's two groups of men in this case. And some of them are holding hands in one rectangle. And there's one guy who's like trying to run into other rectangles. And it's kind of like a game of chasey, like tag.

Are they- What are they doing? So, there's no ball. No, it's like- It almost looks- It's like chasey meets all over Red Rover. What? Now they're tackling him. Yeah. What on earth is going on? It's kind of like Keepings Off or All Over Red Rover.

We used to call that British Bulldogs one time. Yeah. Yeah, British Bulldogs, yeah. There's a scoreboard. There's a time. It's 21 to 34. Yeah, there's a clock. What's it kind of like?

They're wearing numbers. It's like a netball or a tennis court in a funny way, isn't it? With different zones. But they're trying to like touch this person. And I don't know, apparently the person is saying something. I think they're saying kabaddi, kabaddi, kabaddi. Like there's an aspect of the game where you have to say something out loud. And once you've said that, you can get-

Now the men are holding hands in pairs. There's about a dozen people on- Are they two teams or is there sort of one- There's two teams. Two clear teams and one guy's surrounded by another team. They're dancing. And then they've tripped him over. They all hold him down.

This sport baffles me. I've sat and watched it for an hour on TV and not understood it. Have you done any Wikipedia-ing or reading? Yeah, I've read about it and stuff. So, do you get now what it is or is it- I still don't really get it. I still don't get it. I have read about it. Have you done any Wikipedia-ing? Yeah, I've read about it and stuff. So, do you get now what it is? I still don't really get it. I still don't get it. I have read about it.

Kabaddi. K-A-B-A-D-D-I. Yeah. So, check it out, people. I wonder if we could- All the Indian people who listen to this who are Kabaddi fans, their heads are going to be going crazy right now with anger and frustration. But I find that sport baffling.

See, they would come on my podcast and talk about- explain why Kabaddi is awesome and how long- I can see it's the sort of game you can play, obviously, as like in the village. You don't need lots of equipment. You can just play it with lines on the ground by the looks of it. It looks fascinating. I'm interested. I wonder if we could get a Kabaddi league going in another country or somewhere else. Is it ever played anywhere else?

And could we get a fan club or a game? I don't think Kabaddi needs fans. Like, Kabaddi's like, it's big business. Oh, no, no. Outside India. Right. Yeah, yeah. We'll see.

Anyway, there you go. Are we on your right? No, that was my idea, wasn't it? Yeah. So, it's your go now, isn't it? Yes, that's right. So, Kabaddi wasn't your idea. No.

It was part of my conversation. That was your idea. Oh, thank God. Me again. Brady invented a sport. Hasn't he done that before? Thank goodness. This next podcast idea of mine is called Wholesome.

In a world full of podcasts about crime and murder and politics and all these terrible podcasts that we have to listen to to find out what's going on in the world or to entertain and titillate us with murder and crime, I'm proposing a podcast which is all about butterflies and joy. And in every episode, the hosts just do something incredibly wholesome, like bake a cake, fly a kite, pick strawberries. Every episode is just your host just doing something that's all about niceness and everything's nice and everything's positive and it's just like a ray of sunshine in people's lives.

That is awesome. I love this idea. That is great. It's like an afternoon at your house. The reason why I love this, looking for something to watch on Netflix or a TV show, there's so much dystopia now. You know what I mean? There's so much of, you know, crime. It's so bleak and so dark.

Now, I understand I don't want to live in a fantasy world where that doesn't exist. And I like, you know, art that engages in that stuff. But if you don't, you get so over it. There's a taste. It's like, can I just watch something nice? Is someone making a, you know, a series for Netflix or something that's just, that's wholesome? And man, you're doing it. There you go.

Not necessarily just baking bread, but you know what I mean? Like people living their lives and it's not involving things as dark as them. I don't think it should be like, you know, a two dudes talking podcast. That's just positive when you talk about good things, though. I think that would be a bit like- It's a bit dull, yeah. Yeah, like that newspaper that promised it was only ever going to print good news. Yeah.

Yeah, and, you know, and that went out of business and couldn't even print that because it was a bad news story. But, like- How would you do this then? Would you- this would be lots of editing and sounds and smells and... No, it would just be like an in-situ podcast, which, you know, these things exist. We should make one. I actually think we should make an episode of Wholesome

while you're here. So, maybe we'll go and do that in the next few days. You just, yeah, you just take remote microphone setups, which are pretty easy, and you just go out and record. You talk it through. Okay, now I'm at the oven and I'm doing this. And you talk about how you're feeling. This smells great.

Gosh, it's tempting to taste this and all that kind of stuff. You tell anecdotes while you're doing it. For example, say we were to fly a kite and you and I went out now and flew a kite, which would be quite a spectacle because I don't think I can remember how to fly a kite. That would be half the fun. But then at the same time, you would tell your stories of childhood memories of flying a kite. For example, my childhood memory of flying a kite was I was given a kite when I was very

young, which was actually a tiger's kite, which will impress you, for the Tigers football team. But it wasn't your beloved Richmond Tigers. It was my beloved Glenelg Tigers. So, it was a big yellow kite with a tiger's face on it. I remember it vividly. I didn't know how to fly a kite. Turns out my dad didn't know that much about it either.

But he took me to the park. We got it airborne and then he let me hold the string. You know, I was young and dumb and scared. And I think I didn't know I was supposed to hold it or something and I let it go. And then the wind took my kite and it flew away and it flew over like the Sturt Creek near Morfitt Road. It flew and it flew across to Morfitt Road and it disappeared into the distance. And I imagine I started crying because my Glenelg Tiger's kite was gone.

And we ended up running home and then jumping in a car and having this, like, search across the neighbourhood until my kite was found in, like, the car park of a local vet surgery eight blocks away or something like that. You got it back. I got it back. But that would be, like, the sort of thing that's in Wholesome. You tell, I mean, maybe that's a bit of a scary story for Wholesome, but that's what it would be like. You nearly lost the kite. Yeah. But that's what it would be like the sort of thing that's in Wholesome. You tell, I mean, maybe that's a bit of a scary story for Wholesome, but that's what it would be like.

So it's not just all, now I'm unwinding the string. You'd still tell stories and have banter and things like that. So, you know, you've got to make an entertaining podcast still. I love this idea. I think this is great. Yeah. I thought you would. Yeah.

It's more for you than me because I think you're a bit of a dudley do-right and you seek out wholesomeness. You know, you're a family man, you know, and I'm not a family man. You're a bit of a nice guy, so. I don't think you're alien from this idea. It's your idea as well. Yeah. I am capable of niceness. I gave you a drink earlier.

You did? You did. It was so awesome. I said don't put it on the table in case you leave a stain. Well, there's a bliss in these things as well. Like you gave me a Diet Coke and I don't drink Coke very often. And so I just take a swig of it. I go, gosh, that's great.

You know what I mean? So, you know, you could talk about why is it tasty. Tell me some other episodes. I said picking strawberries, going to the you could talk about why is it tasty? Tell me, what are some other episodes? I said picking strawberries, like going to the zoo. That's a wholesome thing to do. What are some other wholesome activities? Well, you mentioned the cooking thing, but I think in particular, baking bread.

Just the smell. No, going to a bakery is one of those things. Just going in and talking about what you see. A picnic. Yes, yes, absolutely. Climbing a tree. Yes, climbing a tree. Building a bill you see. A picnic. Yes. Yes. Absolutely. Climbing a tree. Yes. Climbing a tree.

Building a billy cart. Oh, yeah. Making a sandcastle. There's a million episodes. Well, there are. There are millions of memories packed into each one of these as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's heaps of ideas.

I'll tell you my best sandcastle building story. When I first started working at the BBC, I did a feature for TV about the furthest point you could get in all of England from the sea. Like geographically, what's the point you could stand where you were furthest from the coast that was possible? Oh yeah, I remember this. Yeah. So, I went to the part of the coast as my start point that was closest, but still far away, a few hundred miles away. And I took a whole bucket of sand and then I went to this place, which is in the county of Derbyshire on some guy's farm.

And I said, oh, your farm over there in the paddock, in that point there is the furthest you can get from the sea of all of England. And this guy didn't know that. He was like, oh, that's really interesting. And I said, do you mind if I go out there and build a sandcastle? And I built a sandcastle on the point in England that was furthest away from the beach. He let me do it, just a little one. that was furthest away from the beach. You let me do it. Just a little one.

He's probably built a theme park there. Come to the place that's furthest away. Yeah, there are. There's lots of things. Going for a bike ride. Yeah. Big exploring, exploring bike ride, riding around. I wonder if people would listen to this.

And I wonder if the podcast could be true to itself. Like, could it be truly wholesome and have integrity? Or would it be like tongue in cheek, wink, wink, aren't we wholesome? With like jokes or- Gambling ads halfway through. Well, yeah, but would there be like a double entendre? Like if it's aimed at adults, because you know how like children's films that appeal to adults like Shrek and things like that, they have like this adult streak through them that the adults get that the kids don't.

And like they work on two levels. Would this podcast have to be operating? Because it's only aimed at adults. This isn't a podcast for kids. Yeah. Would this podcast have to work on two levels? Or could you just have the integrity to be, no, we're just going to be wholesome. For the next hour, we're just going to be two guys baking a cake and feeling

the feeling the love and just being happy or would there have to be like a not a mean streak but like a cynical streak yeah yeah would it have to do that i don't know you're doing it in an ironic way yeah no no i think you could do i think it would work best to do it straight and i think the context if you say look if the context you gave, as in there's lots of full-on stuff and life is complex and difficult and all the rest of it, do this. This is a beautiful, just for an hour, just like you said it, I think that would work. And I think you do it because I think there's something refreshing about it. And you'd listen to this podcast to be refreshed, to be reminded and refreshed and be immersed in it. You could also reflect on why is this wholesome? Why is it interesting?

And it could motivate people. Yeah, let's do this more often. I'm going to take my kids to do this or me and my partner. Hey, let's go and have a picnic rather than just going shopping. It's not that it's ethically minded, but it could, you would, I think it would be appealing because there's something inside of us that wants it to be uncynical and pure and wholesome and knows those things are refreshing when they're re-engaged with and introduced into our lives again.

I wonder if people would listen to it to inspire them to do wholesome things like you just said, or it would become like your wholesomeness replacement. It would become your wholesome activity. Like vicarious wholesome. Yeah. Yeah, well, I'm never going to actually bake a cake. You know, I'm too busy working the stock market, you know, and things like that. But I'll listen to those guys bake a cake for half an hour.

And that's my good deed for the day. Listening to someone else do something good. Well, it depends. If you're going to go and rob a bank and then come home and listen to the wholesome podcast to try and redeem yourself. Yes, I don't think it's quite going to wipe the blemish. No, it's not confession. No. I like this idea.

I like the idea of doing it really well as well. Like being well produced in an understated kind of way, you know, with some nice music. And it's quite evocative. And, you know, here we are and you can hear the wind and, you know, we're flying the kite. The birds are tweeting. Yeah, and you're laughing. Oh, it's falling over again. And, you know, there's that sense of I feel because there is,

there's exhilaration. I like to think every episode would be like the last chapter of an innard blight and magic faraway tree book because, like, obviously those books are incredibly wholesome. Like the kids always go for picnics and go and visit Moonface in the tree and stuff like that. But there's occasionally magical lands at the top of the tree that are a bit sinister and a bit scary. But every book ends with, oh, guess what the land at the top of the

faraway tree is today? It's the land of wishes or it's the land of birthdays. And it always ends with a really happy land where everything is just wonderful. So, every episode would be like when that land comes to the top of the magic faraway tree, that's like a nice land. Maybe you could name it or give it a theme. Today we're up the faraway tree and we're going to the wholesome land or something. We're in the land of flying a kite, yeah. The land of go fly a kite.

Do you remember the land of take what you want? Yeah. Which is one of the early ones. That had a negative side to it though, that land in the magic faraway tree. That wasn't a happy land. But they didn't get- why? They didn't get stuck there. They got in trouble.

Didn't someone take something they weren't supposed to take? I remember they go and get some really practical things, like Dad needs some hammer and nails or something like that. Yeah, because they're wholesome kids. They can take anything they want in the world, and the thing they take is like a hammer for Dad. Baking soda for Mum. You know, it's like really-

Yeah. Now to be an iPod that's right it's like i'm taking these yeah 10 ipads that i'm gonna unsolder the kids at school or no it's really a key of cocaine land of take what you want is basically vegas or something there's such good books that they are the images like when you just say The Magic Faraway Tree, the image comes to mind in my mind that's always been there since I read it as a kid. Like, it's just so imprinted and I can picture Moonface's house

and the slide and- She didn't need to write that book. It's such a great title. She could have just said The Magic Faraway Tree and I would have gone, oh. Like, it's magic and it's far away and it's a tree it's like it's the perfect name like the book is just like superfluous after that time that's right you could just go the kids are going to sleep and you could just walk in and say

the magic faraway tree they'd be like thanks dad or the folk of the faraway tree i think is the first one. Yeah, that's like, that's the Afghanistan forgotten book. The Enchanted Wood is the first book. The Enchanted Wood. And I think The Magic Faraway Tree is second and Folk of the Faraway Tree is third. Okay, I'm remembering that. The Enchanted Wood is definitely first. Okay, okay.

Just the word enchanted. It speaks so much of the English countryside and a wood and, you know, all the things. Do you remember there was a Magic Faraway Tree chapter? I can't remember. It speaks so much of the English countryside and a wood and, you know, all the things. Do you remember there was a Magic Faraway Tree chapter? I can't remember. I think it was in the Magic Faraway Tree. I can't remember. But there was an episode where Moonface and Silky and Saucepan Man go home with the kids to the parents' house and the parents meet Moonface.

I do. And they help in the garden and they like- Like, wouldn't the parents like just have like completely had their minds blown when these like mythical creatures, like it was always supposed to be the kids went away to the tree and played with them. And like, it was almost like, you know, Mr. Snuffleupagus or something. You don't actually. Don't see that he's there. Yeah. But like. I don't remember why that happens, but I do remember that it does happen.

They came and like helped, helped out in the yard and do work. And something like Mr. Saucepan knocks over things or something happens that I don't quite remember. He's clumsy and stuff. So that's like breaking the fourth wall, isn't it? Like they all go into the real world. It's not the enchanted wood. Now it's just the enchanted house. It's like, no, they're just people.

Sitting around watching movies, ordering pizza. They're just weird people that live in a forest that are playing with your kids. Like, yeah, that's it. Because a part of it is the imagination, isn't it? Anyway. Well, there's always maybe the sub, yeah, that's it. Because a part of it is the imagination, isn't it? It's the, anyway. Well, there's always maybe the subplot too that the kids are imagining it. Like, they're going into the forest and playing and imagining all this stuff. And then they come home at night and like, oh, what a day we had. And they're telling mum and dad, oh, we went up the tree and we played with Moonface and Silky.

And like, the parents are like, yes, darling, that sounds great. But then when you bring Moonface home and now he's out in the yard digging up carrots, it's like, oh. Yeah. He's gone now. Pushing it a bit far, going a bit off the rails there. Do you remember the wishing chair and the wishing chair again, which was sort of-

My sister was into them. I never got into those ones. I read them as well. They're not as strong in my memory in terms of love. It's a similar premise. They sit in the chair, wish they were going somewhere and it goes fly off. Yeah, she was just like reformatting the same idea over and over again by that point.

Inner Blight, you cheap hack. She's got like seven or eight other full series of other characters. Famous Five, my butt. Famous Five. Gee, they're cool. Now, how did we get onto that Oh yeah wholesome Oh yeah inner blight

Oh yeah that makes total sense That's not even a segway How did we get to slag off inner blight We were talking about wholesome or something You need not have called it said wholesome You should have said this is called inner blight Oh right this is a podcast about wholesomeness Yeah

Anyway there you go Wholesome This episode has been brought to you by Audible, the world's leading provider of audiobooks. They've actually got a special deal at the moment they want to tell you about for Amazon Prime members. Amazon Prime members can get Audible for $4.95 a month for the first three months.

That's like getting three months for the price of one. And after that, it's only $14.95 a month. This offer ends on July 31st 2018. If you're interested go to audible.com slash unmade or you can text unmade to 500 500. By the way non Amazon Prime members can use that same code to receive the usual 30-day trial with your first audiobook for free audible what what a great time during the lovely summer here in the northern hemisphere and you now are in the northern hemisphere i am we are in the same hemisphere so in this lovely weather people can just go out sit in the sunshine have a picnic pop in their earbuds or earpods or airpods or whatever they're called listen to an audiobook hopefully

they're wearing sunscreen at the time i've been wandering around the town and i've had my earbuds in and listening and enjoying it it's wonderful you're walking around see the sights it's a perfect time of year for an audiobook what a wholesome thing it is to listen to an audiobook and for that reason we are going to recommend a book that I have just downloaded onto my phone. I know you already have this. And it is The Magic Faraway Tree by Ennard Blyton. Oh, what a classic. Is there any more wholesome book? Do you know what? I was reading a review of it on Audible and the person wrote underneath, this was the book that got me into reading. And I think that's true for me too. Like, I think The Magic Faraway Tree is the book that got me interested in reading books.

Like it was my first, it was the first book I read multiple times and was excited about reading on my own. And having it now as an audiobook, read by Kate Winslet I might point out. So very English. Perfect, the perfect voice. You already have this audiobook, don't you? I do, I do. I've had it for ages. voice you you already have this audiobook don't you i do i do i've i've had it for ages and we've had it as a bit of a family trip holiday car audiobook which is a perfect idea very wholesome

oh yeah no so it's it's popular with all members of the car the front seat and the back seat you do it like on a long drive do you like if we're driving like interstate or something it's all right we'll pop on the magic faraway tree for a few hours yeah yeah i mean we have it we we've got several audiobooks but this one we've done a couple of times it's a bit of a favorite with everyone really and that's this is it for me is those characters are in my mind so crystal clear moon face and silky and it's like you're right there again like you are this i read these over and over and over again when i was a kid and now you can listen to them over and over and over again yeah with audible just to remind you again,

Amazon Prime members, $4.95 a month for the first three months. That's a great deal, like three months for the price of one. Go to audible.com slash unmade

or if you're in the US, you can text unmade to 500-500 and our recommendation today is the very, very wholesome Magic Faraway Tree by Enid Blyton. It's read by Kate Winslet, the Hollywood star. It's a good time to read this book at the moment as well

because I've heard on the grapevine that they're making a Magic Faraway Tree movie, which I'm not entirely happy about. But if the movie's coming, you want to be up to date with the book and this is a good way to do it. All right, you're up. What do you got?

Last idea of the show before we do our Patreon idea. This is something totally different to the things that we've talked about so far. If there is any thread running through the previous ideas. I tried. This is an idea from the plane and I spent some time, I can remember, just looking down the aisle and trying to think, what's a good name for this? And I haven't come, but I'll just go with this, best and worst investments. All right. Ordinary people, but people who have good stories to tell, come on the show.

They're usually the best guests. Yeah. I'd invite to someone who can't speak onto the show. Who doesn't, can't think of anything to say. Welcome, bro. It's great to have you. Thanks. Who talk about investments, personal investments, that is things they've bought that have been worth enormously more,

but probably more than that, not just luck, but just like I invested in this and it did really, really well. Well, this was my worst investment. Now, their investment advice, I'm sure podcasts and TV, I mean, goodness gracious, you know, those sorts of money managing kinds of ones. But I think a podcast idea that's just cool stories about the best and the worst investments that people have made. As in like professional investments, like I bought, you know, I bought a thousand shares of Apple when it was like $1 a share. Or is it people who like accidentally invested in something like, oh, I bought this Star Wars

figure because I was just really into Star Wars and now it's worth $10,000 because I didn't take it out of the box? Like all of the above. There can be the big ones. It's like some of them are a bit like that Forrest Gump moment, you know, where he, you know, invests in Apple and whatnot. But I'm just, there could be the big stories, like the biggest and wisest investment of all time was when so-and-so bought this at this amount, or the worst, when his friend sold his shares in this at this time, and a month later, this happened. And I think those stories are interesting anyway. But there's also small stories as well from our lives. And you'll no doubt ask me, give me an example, Tim. And I'll tell you. This is an interesting one from our perspective in that we bought a VW Beetle on the side of the road. It's an orange Beetle, and we really love it.

It's like a 1972, I think, or 3 Superbug. So we bought it, and we bought it for $3,000, which is a very fair price because it's pretty bunged up and all the rest of it. And then after I'd had it for a few years, I go to have it insured again. And the insurance company tells me they're insuring it for $12,000 because they're worth $12,000 to replace it. I'm like, are you kidding? And they said, oh, yeah, they're going up. Had it gone up or had you just been sold it too cheap?

No, no, no. She said, well, a matter of years had gone past because I moved insurance companies. You know what I mean? And a matter of years went by. And the lady told me, no, look, we specialize in these sorts of things. And if we're going to replace this, this is what it's going to cost. Now, that's not, you know, life-changing investment. But it was one of those ones.

It was such a curiosity. It definitely taps into that part of people's brain and greed that makes them watch shows like Antiques Roadshow when it's, yeah, I bought this thimble at a market for five cents and then the expert tells you, oh, that was the one that Abraham Lincoln was wearing when he knitted a jumper and it's worth a hundred million dollars or something like that. I enjoy Antiques Roadshow. And on that, while I enjoy regular episodes, I have to admit, I've gone on YouTube and looked at Antiques Roadshow, you know, highest price, highest valuation just to go, oh, wow. And it's intriguing because you're- It's a lottery ticket. It's the payoff is every time of the show. It's like interesting to hear about it, lovely to see it. What's it worth? And you're always a little bit more excited when it's worth a whole lot more. Another twist on the investment thing could be someone saying, you know, oh, I sent young Dwight to have piano lessons and it cost me $400 to teach him to play the piano and now he's Elton

John, you know, like, so things you invested in that paid off in a different way. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, yeah. You know, I sent little Bill Gates on that computer course. That was, you know, the best 50 bucks I ever spent. That's right. Says the mum living in like a mansion or something. Yeah, yeah. But the other side of it, of course, is the worst investments.

Not just as they missed out on a great investment, you know, oh, the day after that and so forth. But also people, this was an amazing investment. It was all hot. Everyone got into it and then it absolutely tanked. Yeah. And there's some interest in that into it and then it absolutely tanked. Yeah. And there's some interest in that, particularly when it's done by experts. That one is less fun to hear the common person sharing their story. It's a bit sad.

But hearing the experts and everyone believing, like the dot-com boom and so forth, and then something happens and it changes. It's intriguing to see why they were taken in or misguided in what happened there. And you could unpack what happened. And particularly around some of the big floats and the big companies, there's a myth that's created, a narrative that's out there. A PR is working heavily to perpetuate it. Someone mentions it in a column. And yet, you know, if you look underneath it, in retrospect, there was not a whole lot

of foundation as to why the company would succeed and my favorite thing about investments is how spouses usually husbands from my experience use the word investment to justify outrageous purchases like a watch it's not it's not a waste of money it's an investment that's right that No, no, no. That's not an investment. It's a Star Wars figure. That's exactly right. Well, I mean, that's not a bleeding edge original idea you've come up with there. And I think a lot of things like that exist. But I see what you're doing with it and how you're trying to twist it around a bit.

And I think that's solid. I'd have a listen to that show if it was well done. We got time for an idea from one of our Patreon supporters? We do. All right. Let's have a look here. You if it was well done. We got time for an idea from one of our Patreon supporters? We do. All right, let's have a look here. You can support the Unmade podcast on Patreon by going to patreon.com slash unmadefm. Not only do you help us make more episodes like the one you're listening to at the moment, and hopefully more that you're going to hear soon while Tim and I have some adventures around the UK, but you can also be part of the show in various ways,

one of which is suggesting a podcast idea like our good friend, Paul. Paul is from... I want you to guess where Paul's from. Where's Paul from? India. No. No. No.

Paul is from the United States, San Jose, California. Oh, right. I've been to San Jose. Yeah. There you go. He's a teacher. He teaches high school social studies. Like you, Dr. Harron, I have a PhD. I suspect he actually earned his PhD. Here's Paul's suggestion, which I think has quite a cool name. I think an interesting idea would be a podcast called Hall of Very Good about people within their fields. I'm thinking sports here, but it could extend to other areas as well, who are not Hall of Fame worthy, but were part of the next tier.

So, sort of people who didn't, like, reach Hall of Fame status, but, like, you want to talk about them for some reason. The Hall of Very Good. I like the name. Oh, yeah. So, I don't know whether or not, I don't know. Hall of Very Good. Often people's favourite players aren't the name. Oh, yeah. So, I don't know whether or not, I don't know. Hall of Very Good. Often people's favourite players aren't the greatest.

I mean, often Michael Jordan is everyone's favourite player for many people, but then there's interesting reasons why another person may be their favourite player who's not quite in that league, but there's a personal connection to them somehow. I have one of those. I'm quite a big fan of Formula One motor racing. And my, like, favourite driver growing up, I think, is like kind of whole or very good worthy. It was a driver called Stefan Johansson.

I've never heard of him. Nah, well, I think he must be Swedish. And he drove for Ferrari for a few seasons, and he was driving around the time that the Grand Prix was in Adelaide. So, it was when my Formula One interest was triggered. And to be honest, I think he became my favourite driver because he was my best friend's favourite driver. So, I just like said, okay, that's my favourite driver too.

And then as I started getting into Formula One and getting all the Formula One magazines and stuff, I just fixated on him. And he was never like, he never won much very important he was always just like the second driver at ferrari and like a bit middle of the road and he's obviously good enough to drive formula one so it's obviously a very good driver but he was like my hero growing up in fact the other day on instagram someone who i used to work with who i'm friends with but have sort of you know don't have much contact with. She posted something on Instagram saying,

my biggest hero when I was growing up was the Formula One driver, Stefan Johansson, and I nearly fell out of my seat. I was like, me too. I didn't know anyone else knew about him. Unfortunately, Paul didn't list an example. I would have liked to have got an example from Paul of who would be in his hall of very good, but maybe he can send another email later on. Yeah, yeah.

All right. Thank you, Paul. Thank you, all. All right. Thank you, Paul. Thank you, all our Patreon supporters. Thank you, Tim. Thank you, Brady. For your ideas. Thank you. You're welcome.

Thank you, man. You're welcome. From one hind dog. One hind dog to the harren dog. The harrenmeister. Harrenmeister. Yeah. Nicknames.

Just a very quick message here at the end of the show about a new piece of Unmade Podcast merchandise, which we're doing for a bit of fun because Tim happens to be in town. We're in the same place. So it means we can sign some things together. So we've had some postcards and posters made, and Tim and I are going to be signing them. And in the spirit of nicknames, which has been a theme of today's episode, we will also sign it to you and we will use your nickname.

Or what we would prefer, if you allow us to, is we will make up a nickname for you, which we're quite looking forward to. So go to the website in the show notes if you'd like to see a postcard or a poster. Fill out the form and all that sort of stuff and we will possibly devise a nickname for you oh that's the bit i look forward to to be honest they won't be mean spirited nicknames obviously they'll be no no well i don't know maybe no no that wouldn't be wholesome well if people go to the link they can see a um an example from a previous episode person who managed to have their nickname generated in our conversation a patreon supporter yes and it's a it's it's a it's it enhances the name if anything

it does now i think also this is a very rare opportunity to get tim's autograph and the reason i know it's rare is because when i asked him to sign a sample autograph for me for the photo i said tim can you just sign your autograph there you You like froze up. You were like, I don't know what to do. Like, what do I do? Well, I... Like you didn't know what variation of writing your name to do for your, like, you didn't obviously didn't want to use like your bank signature. So, you were like, I don't know how to write my name.

I was just getting the spelling right in my head before I went. Wanting to make sure I did it right. All right. So, Tim will sign at tim hein although if you make a special request on the form maybe he will sign at hindog are you willing to sign at hindog if people ask if people ask i am absolutely yeah all right so you can have your you can have your poster or postcard it's just a bit of fun and it's a way of supporting the podcast and supporting the things we're getting up to over the next couple of weeks but go and have a look it's a bit of fun there's a link in the all the usual places and how did you go on the plane coming up with ideas for podcasts for the next week or so

i did i did pretty well they all came on the second leg but i wrote podcast ideas on my hand as you can see so i didn't forget because i knew you'd be so annoyed if i got off the plane i'm taking a picture tim has podcast ideas written on his hand to remind him of the whole reason he's coming to england that's true