The Unplanned Podcast with Matt & Abby - Josh & Sav on Racism, Childbirth & Raising 2 Under 2

Episode Date: September 27, 2023

This episode is sponsored by Jenni Kayne & Hello Fresh Find your forever pieces @jennikayne and get 15% off with promo code UNPLANNED at http://jennikayne.com/UNPLANNED #jennikaynepartner Go to http://HelloFresh.com/50unplannedpodcast and use promo code 50unplannedpodcast for 50% off plus 15% off the next 2 months We had our friends Josh & Sav ​⁠​⁠​join the show to talk about their experience getting canceled on TikTok, raising 2 under 2, and life as an interracial couple. Make sure to rate our podcast and leave a review if you can, it really helps us out! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

being like an interracial couple that comes with just a whole another layer of unnecessary hate. People think that we're like not together. Like we're on the train on the subway and this African-American lady, she said, oh you don't like chocolate. We made something that could have been controversial. I'm tick-tock, you can see like the message request

and you can see the block comments and stuff like that and I'm looking at those and I'm like, why do I keep looking at these comments? People were really trying to like cancel us. Every day is different with 200, and I know I didn't push out the baby, I know you guys are going through so much Why do I keep looking at these comments? People were really trying to cancel us. Every day is different with 200, too. And I know I didn't push out the baby. I know you guys are going through so much,

but I want her to get older like now. I want them both to be tallers. Yeah, I want them both to be tallers. Thank you to HelloFresh and Jenny Kane for sponsoring this episode. What's up dudes, and welcome back to the unplanned podcast. Give it up. If someone was turning this on, like as their first thing is, dudes and welcome back to the unplanned podcast. Give it up.

So what was turning this on, like as their first thing is they're getting ready in the morning, that's a little too much. That is. Can you calm my down? We are joined, we are joined today by content creators, Josh and Sav. Let's give it up for Josh and Sav.

So happy that you guys made the trip out here to Arizona. After you just moved across the country to Oregon with two kids under two. I don't know. You guys are insane. I can't know how, and I don't know how we're doing that, honestly. Still, are we doing it?

Yeah, I don't know. We literally just moved two weeks ago now, or three weeks ago. Yeah, two weeks ago. And our house is still in shambles right now. We still have boxes and stuff, and we were packing. I was like, what are we doing? Like packing is the case, but still not unpacked.

That's something we would do. Yeah, it's like, but I don't know. We were excited to be here though. We were like, we were gonna miss this for anything. So let's make this trip Arizona, take a little trip, a little vacay, even though like, we just, we just, it's so hot. And we can't breathe.

What do you think about the heat? It's like 115 out today, and it's September. But oddly overcast. Yeah, right now it is. I think what got me was the wind hit me and I was like, oh my goodness, it's nice breeze, but it's so hot. It's like, it's like worse than just still.

Yeah. I walked out of the airport with the hoodie on and I was like, yeah, I had to change both of the girls in the bathroom into like different outfits because I'm like it's so hot Like you guys can't go outside and leggings and like a onesie like you need to yeah, so anyways, but we love it. It's great Yeah, yeah, I think this was the last summer that we are going to be here for the months of July and August because oh my gosh Like September right now. Yeah, I mean, it is September, but it's a little bit better right now

than it was in July and August. Yeah, it's better. You just can't go outside with your kids. That's the way it gets worse. No, it's way worse than it is right now. It's 110 today. What's worse than 120? Don't get a 125 or something.

No, it doesn't get up to 125. I think that's... Are you even supposed to go outside? Is it considered unsafe at all? I mean, you just sweat a lot. You kind of just deal with it, but I can only, when it's, I mean, the hottest, I'll really take my son out on a bike ride will be like a hundred

and we're only out for like 15 minutes because he's just the poor thing, it's so hot. So I mean, but I want to take him outside. I don't want to be him to be inside all day. He gets so sweaty under his feet all day. Yeah, he gets sweaty. But he loves it. He loves to just wave at the birds.

And just, oh, he doesn't do anything. But enough loves it. He loves to just like wave at the birds. And just, oh, you have to do something. But yeah, enough about us. I'm so curious, how are you guys handling two under two right now? Has it been good? Has it been bad? Has it been everything in between? Like, what's the low down on that? Go for it. You started off. I feel like we have different answers. Like, I, for me, two under 22 is definitely like, it's tough,

but it's a lot easier than it was. The transition from zero to one was way harder on me than the transition from one to two. Night and day different. I really struggled postpartum with our first, but this time around, I think my postpartum, like experience, my hormones, all of that has been so much easier.

So I think all around the experience just feels, I'm like, oh, this is like, fine. But I feel like you have a different. It's not that I have a different answer. It's just, I don't know, both of our, I love our daughter so much. I feel like I have to preface that sometimes because I just get attacked because our second one, she's just totally different than the first one. She's like, sassy. Sassy. She is very sassy or whatever. And I just, I'm at a point where I just think

I'm okay with having two kids. And only just because, and I feel like that's okay to think, right, you know, but only just because of her temperament. Is that the right word? I feel like I should've used the word temperament with a three month old. But like, with just, no. We call our second, what do we call them?

We say it's temperamental. Yeah, tiny is temperamental. Okay, we call them tiny is temperamental. I think comes up with these nicknames for our kids. It's so funny. Yeah. Like for a little bit, we call our oldest, Griff, and we call them Bob. I don't even know why. And then we call them the governor. The governor? We would call it. Hello, governor. We call our kids like completely different names. Like even boy names sometimes. Go ahead and tell them. Like we would call it. Hello Goughnut, we call it, say that to our kids. We call our kids like completely different names, like even boy names sometimes for the girls. Go ahead and tell them. Like we'll call them like, like, what, woo. I don't know.

I can't imagine. I'm more so embarrassing. Um, I literally can't think of you. Like Dante, we call him real like Dante. Our girls Dante. Like where is Dante? I don't know what that is. Yeah, no, yeah.

Yeah, no, where is Dante coming from? Like, come here Dante. But we used to call each other random names. It's like really strange, like just any old name. Like not like a cute nickname, just like, like, like, what's your nickname? What, yeah, what's your, what do you call Sav? What's like the weirdest nickname you've called Sav?

I've been calling her Cheryl lately. Cheryl? Cheryl. Wait, let's, let's, set up this debate right now. Wait, Cheryl, is that, is that a man or woman's name? I don't even know. It's okay. her Cheryl lately Cheryl Cheryl wait let's decide on this debate right now wait Cheryl is that is that a man or woman's name I don't even know it's okay no it's okay you guys pronounce it Cheryl Cheryl he's trying to say Cheryl you got an ant Cheryl it's Cheryl it's Cheryl he says he says he's

Cheryl okay it's shirl. I literally said that. Not even my nose are that crazy. It's like Darryl and Dirl. Okay, but I feel like I know a Dirl. And right now I know someone I've known Dirl. You know a Dirl?

I think I know a Dirl. Or maybe I just call the Dirl. I'm really crying. I'm like, okay. I can't. Anyways, two under two. Okay, I think it is, I think this is harder for me., I can't. Anyways, two under two. Okay, I think it is, I think this is harder for me. And I know I didn't push out the baby.

I know how you guys are going through so much. But for some reason, I think a newborn is harder than a toddler. And that's just that. I don't know what it is, dude, but like, I can sit, we were talking before the podcast about how we're both like, you know what, like I think two kids is great, whatever. And our wives are like, let's keep making, baby.

I like your job, I'm like, I can like them all. I like you. Yeah, I know this is like, this is not true for every couple, this is like, I don't know. But I just feel like, I don't know, there's, has to be swing in the biology there. Because I just watch her go through all this pain. I'm like, surely she's done with all that.

Like that looks, that was not fun. I would do it again. Thank you for having our kids by the way. Like I appreciate that. I really look at it as bad. Like I'm like, yeah. And I'm like, let's have it up for more time. Whoa, whoa, whoa.

But yeah, I think it's just, it's so funny how that works. I think they're just, they're just built for this. Like literally. And like you guys even having that attitude and like wanting to do it that's just goes to how super super uh Hitman you guys are that's what I was trying to say Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but Thank you for everything

No problem, but yeah, no it's definitely different and we're learning as we're going to like every day is different with 200 to our Yeah, I guess she's just turned three months yesterday. Our oldest will be two in a few months. And just like there's wins. Like the wins are like seeing our oldest being so cute around her little sister. And now seeing our three month old, she's starting to smile. And like, you know, starting to do a little chuckle. So like, and then like she'll sleep through the night

every once in a while. And we feel like we're the coolest when that happens, but then she doesn't do it for a whole month. What happened? I punched the microphone accident. Nice. But yeah, no, there's give or take with it. Yeah, I feel like we have a lot of friends

that have newborns right now. All their newborns are so good. They don't make it peep. They can't let you set them down. They literally set them down. And they don't cry. For hours. Okay, whenever people around us,

they're like, she's such a good baby. And I'm like, I feel like she shows off. Which she's around other people. In front of people. Because I'm like, she is good. Like she's not like a bad baby or like super hard, but I don't know. I feel like whenever we're around other people,

both of our girls are like, just little angels would like amazing. And then everyone's like, they're so good. I'm like, well, yeah, you're seeing like a fraction of what we experience all the time, you know? But yeah. There's just such a range to what people experience with the newborn stage.

And because it's like, he's not bad. He's the best little baby ever. He's just having a hard time getting adjusted to the outside world. Yeah, he's literally learning about something he didn't know about. Yeah, he's literally learning about something he didn't know about. Yeah, he's not loving it. Like he liked it better.

Yeah, it was way easier when I did that the word. And it's hard with two under two because I see my one-year-old and just how much freaking fun he is and how his personality is just coming out of nowhere and he just wants me to throw him in the air and like do like, I don't know, we just have so much fun together and I'm like, man, I just can't wait to, I can't wait for that with my youngest, but I also know I can't wish these years away though. That's true. That's very true.

Yeah, I feel like we're similar in that. Like right now, I'm in the phase of like, I can't wait till she's older and I can coach her soccer team and I can like, you know, take her to dance, like do all these things. And then like the youngest, and Savannah gets on me about this, but I want her to get older like do all these things. And then like the youngest, and Savannah gets on me about this, but I want her to get older like now.

Like I want them both to be toddlers. Yeah, she wants them to stay little. And I get it, I understand, because they're babies. And this is why you guys want more kids, because they grow so quick. But I'm just like, I need her to be at the same level as, right? I need her to catch up.

I need her to catch up. I need her to catch up. But she's slowing me down. I I truly enjoyed those. Before we started the podcast Savannah, you were talking about how you had this crazy situation with your placenta. Why? Straight to it. Like and and we're like wait, hold that thought. We got to we got to discover this for the first time when we're when we're just like chatted out. So what happened?

I'm so curious. So have you guys heard about getting your placenta encapsulated? Yes. Turn it into like, it's like, yeah, like a supplement or whatever you take it after birth and it's supposed to like help with post-posed hand depression.

I don't know. There's like a lot of benefits. I don't know all the ins and outs. So I was like, sure, like, why not? I'll do it. This is what's your first year second. First. Yeah. So I was like, okay, I'm going to encapsulate my do it. This is what's your first year's second. First. Okay.

Yeah. So I was like, okay, I'm going to encapsulate my placenta. I like, they send you everything you need for it. Like they send you like the freezer. They send you all the stuff. And then you take it to the hospital. Or like, if you do a home work. Oh, they do it all for you.

Yeah, they do it all for you. So they like, the doctor, you just have to let them know, like, I'm keeping my placenta. They'll like, pack it up for you, put it in the freezer, and then you take it and you ship it yourself. Like the way I did it, I'm sure there's like other ways to do it. But anyways, so I they'll like pack it up for you, put it in the freezer and then you take it. And you ship it yourself. Like the way I did it, I'm sure there's like other ways to do it. But anyways, so I told like when we got there,

I was like I'm keeping my placenta like just so they know because I don't know what they do with them. If you... Does anyone know? What do they do with it if you don't keep it? Abby don't eat it first. I don't eat mine, but the first, I literally think it just gets thick thrown away.

Yeah. Wow, okay. I mean, it is just like an organ after all. I don't know, like anyways, but yeah. So I was like, okay, we told them. We gave them like the freezer and everything. And then everything was done. And I think after a certain, like a period of time,

they can't touch the placenta anymore, right? Yes, because like infection or something like that. Something like, they can't be responsible for like handling it. And they forgot that they were supposed to like pack it and put it in the freezer. Yeah, I guess like it didn't get out to all the nurses. So they didn't like do what they were supposed to do with it in order for us to like take it home.

So it was just in this like plastic little like bin in the sink and the hospital in the hospital. In our room. Yeah, in our like in our deliver room. And so we're like, Can you see it? Was it a clear bin? Yes, clear hospital. In our room. Yeah, in our like, in our delivery room. And so, really. Did you see it? Was it a clear bin? Yes, clear bin.

Oh my gosh. Like, Savannah's laying right here, and the bin is just pretty. So they just had to tell you we didn't freeze it. We just left it out. They were like, yeah, they were like, we, I don't even remember exactly. I don't think they told us.

I don't think they told us. I think we just saw that it was there. And we had to get out. Yeah, we asked, we were like, can you guys like pack it in the things we can take at home or whatever. And then that's when they were like were after a certain period of time, we're not whatever supposed to touch it. And so we're like, okay, well,

so I was like, okay, babe, why don't you just pack up my placenta then? I looked at her and said, I just saw a baby come out and I don't know if I want to see anything or do anything else. And I was just like, are you serious? And I was literally about to go get a nurse

and be like, guys, I just do it. Like, I have to go- Like I know there's protocol, but just- Yeah, you have the scrubs on like just do it. And they will at least have that they couldn't. And so Josh put gloves on and like put, grabbed it out and like did it for me. Yeah, no, I literally felt like I was

on Grey's Anatomy. Where'd you get the gloves? That's a good question. I think I just found some gloves in the room. I was like so hot of it. Like I don't know, like I just gave birth for the That's a good question. I think I just broke some glasses in the room. I don't know. I just gave birth for the first time. I have no idea what's going on. Were we going home that day?

I think so. So I was like, okay, we got it. So wait, did my placenta sit out then? Was it like rotten? Babe, honestly, I don't know. Did you still take it? I took it. And you had postpartum.

And I still had depression the first time. How long did you take it though? I don't think it. This is a thing. I didn't really do it properly because I like forgot about it. And then I was like, oh, it was like three weeks before. I was like, oh, yeah, I forgot.

I was going to take that. And then I like stopped taking it. So I don't really, I can't speak to like if it works or not, because I did not do it correctly. But just the fact that like you packed it, I don't know. That could play a part in the fact that maybe something was right with it. Honestly, though, because like, guys, like I literally, just imagine you're in the hospital room

and you're just by the sink and it's just over there and Savannah's in the bed. And what was the problem was the fridge? Remember was across the room or what we had to take it in was it across the room? I carried it over and like, it was dripping across the room. Was it true? And I'm just like,

it's too much. What am I supposed to do? This is not my job. Okay, with birth, did it shock you at how much blood there was? Bro, like I wasn't expecting that at all. Both birth. At all, both births, I can't say that.

I didn't ever look or really know how much blood there was to be honest. Really afterwards, like when you had to, when I walked you to the bathroom, you can see all that blood. After like, yeah, it, like that, but like, Daryl, like I never saw what was going on. It did, bro.

I didn't think it was gonna be that much. I feel like it was gonna be some blood, like, but like, that much, that was a lot. I feel like I was a little traumatized in a way. Okay. Just because of how, just because of how, I kept telling Abby after the birth. I was like, thank you, thank you.

I was like, you were a superhero. Like, you were so strong. I don't know how the freak you just did that. You did, you kept saying. I was just like, thank you. And then she like, I felt so bad because she had to get stitches and tore, like, I we've all talked about this,

but I just was, oh my gosh, I was not expecting that at all. I didn't know what to expect. I think you just see so many, like, little like happy birth moments on TikTok and stuff and he's like, oh, it's so crazy. It's peaceful, but I did not expect for that. So yeah, it's wild.

Yeah, when you're in that room, it's just like, especially the second time when we were, it was like, not a war zone, but like, okay, so you see in the movies and like the TV shows to where like the mom who's pushing out the baby, she's like screaming yelling, maybe like super aggressive and like, and I feel like that's pushing out the baby, she's like screaming yelling, maybe like super aggressive. And like, and I feel like that's what you see on, and movies and stuff like that. Our first one, it kinda wasn't like that. It was more like, it was pretty peaceful.

She was pushing and like, that was at this one though. And we shared this on our birth story. I was in a chokehold. And now I was in a full chokehold while she was trying to push the baby out. She's saying like, I can't do this, I can't do thishold and I was in a full chokehold while she was trying to push the baby out. She's saying like, I can't do this, I can't do this, I'm whispering in here, no babe, you got this, you're super mute.

It was crazy. It was like, you got this, but like, I was getting choked out and I was like, this is actually happening. And then like, so we decided to not actually show like the birth this time on a social media or whatever. So I'm still filming it though for our sake or whatever. So I'm filming on my phone and my neck is getting like, push it. I'm like, I think it's a drop the phone.

I'm just kind of just, I have not watched that footage. We haven't watched it. I don't watch. I don't really watch hear any sound I made. Yeah. It's like low-key missing. Yeah, yeah.

That wasn't me. That was someone else. Right. And postpartum was it easier with the first, easier with the second? Like how did you guys navigate that as a couple? And I don't know. Yeah. What was your experience with that?

Yeah. The first time was way harder for me. And so like, they say, you know, like if you experience postpartum depression or anxiety, it's like, it can happen again, but it can also like not happen again. Or you could experience it with your first and like not your second or like vice versa. And so I was just prepared obviously

because I did experience it with our first. I was like, I wanna be prepared and know that it is a possibility, but also not live in fear, thinking like, okay, this is gonna happen to me again. So I actually had a lot of peace about having our second, and I've had no postpartum depression, no postpartum anxiety. It's a night and day experience.

I had no idea about, you just mentioning postpartum depression, seeing your videos, seeing your TikToks, and how fun and silly you guys are, like, I would have never guessed. And I think that just goes to show that literally anybody can face any sort of challenge and you just, you don't know. But I'm like, I'm so happy that this, this, this, like, other pregnancy,

this second pregnancy has been so good. Yeah, definitely. Yeah, no, like, with, even with our relationship, it was especially the first time around, like we would have only been married for two years. Yeah, we've only been married for two years, had our first baby, and God knows, like we don't know what we're doing with this first baby.

Like we can read all the books and like go through all the classes and stuff like that and baby comes and she's the most beautiful thing in the world. But like, oh, we gotta take her home and take care of her. Okay, cool. What about our marriage? Because we're not seeing eye to eye with certain things right now. And that took a lot on us. I feel like, and we've said this in private, but I feel like that contributed to her depression a little bit because I'm over here trying to figure out what she needed and I'm first time dad or whatever and what I was trying to do for her that wasn't what she needed or whatever and it was super tough for me to try to figure that out and that

was just causing some strife sometimes in our marriage and we saw you guys talk about like the sleep divorce and we definitely went through that and I'll be real it wasn't good for us. Really? we definitely went through that. And I'll be real, it wasn't good for us. Like really? We, it caused like a lot of like division. And I don't know if that was the reason why, but like I was sleeping in the guest room for people at home. I was sleeping in the guest room.

She would sleep upstairs. You would have, right? I forgot. Yeah, you would. That was when she started sleeping in her room. Oh yeah, she was starting sleeping in her room. So, and I was closer to her room if I slept in the guest room.

So I would go do the nights or whatever. And I like couldn't sleep if the monitor, if I could hear the monitor, I really, yeah. No, even if she was asleep, I think so that was like a lot that contributed to like my anxiety. It's because you're waiting to hear something

and then you'll keep yourself up all night when you're in the room. Yeah, and I just hear the white noise. I hear this shh, shh, shh. And that's like all over here and I can't sleep. So, I had you keep the monitor, but anyways, yeah, you were saying. Yeah, no, yeah.

It wasn't good for us. Yeah, it wasn't, and we would wake up, and we just wouldn't be on the same page. We would just like kind of sense just like a weird vibe in the house or whatever, with, right, and then it could have everything to do with just us not sleeping, like being sleep deprived, and all those things.

So it took a toll on us with that in communication and just like other marriage things that are just natural without having a baby, just having little things, like not sharing how you truly feel when you're in an argument or something like that or what else. Just like communication things that problems

that we just had before having a baby. So it was tough. This second time around though, where are you gonna say it? I was just gonna say, I feel like postpartum, like the first time around was like the hardest thing we've ever been through, which is crazy because I feel like sometimes women, like obviously I'm the one that, like, directly was experiencing the, like, depression and anxiety,

but like, the person you're married to is also experiencing it. Almost just as much, even, you know what I'm saying? So like, it was like both of us, that really, not that like he had depression or anxiety, but you see what I'm saying? Like he was in it with me. So like it was just like really hard on both of us, but the second time around,

it like if I describe it to people and I'm like, it's just the night and day, like it's 180 from what I experienced the first time. Thank you to Ginny Kane for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. And fall is coming up even though it does not even slightly feel like it and Phoenix quite yet. What it's had been like a hundred really,

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Get your cash mirror met. I feel like you could be the happiest person, you know, just the silliest happy-go-lucky personality. And yet you just get smacked in the face. So quickly, so hard. Yeah. And it doesn't help that you're getting no sleep. And it doesn't help that like Abby was telling me, I still should look this up if this is true. But she told me that it's like, I saw this on Instagram. It was an Instagram fact that she saw that it's the equivalent, the hormonal change postpartum for women after they have a baby is taking 100 birth control pills.

I don't know, don't quote me on that. They said, a fact check us in the comments. The hormone shift that any human will ever go through ever. Yeah, no that meant it. And literally, I'm like, man, you did not understand. I am sweating right now. And I don't normally sweat like this. Like, I'm sweating a lot. Like, not now, I'm getting better, but like the first week.

And then like- And then you wake up like in a puddle. Like, I'm literally like, the sheets are like soft. It's disgusting. It's horrible. I'm like, I, my boobs are not right. Like, everything's disgusting. It's horrible. I'm like I There's my boobs are not right like everything that I emotionally feel like I'm on the craziest roller coaster I just like I'm I'm hurting. I don't know what's going on in my life I don't think I'm ever gonna do anything I want to do again like yeah, and we'll never understand yeah like they really can't and it's crazy

Because as much as you try to understand, like they like simply cannot, because you'll never feel like what we felt. Yeah, it's one thing for you guys to tell us. And you get empathized with us, but to actually like be able to experience it, just it's just they can't. And then, apart from me, it's like kind of mad about that. I'm like, you want to take one day?

Like just one day like this. No, that's so real though, because like literally, there would be times if, like Savannah would always always say I like to play basketball as a hobby So like Savannah would be like yo go out go play basketball, you know I got the girls or with fry our first born. I got it. It's fine, but I've known this girl for like five years and I'm like I can see in her eyes She actually does not want me to leave and I I still leave. And now I'm hooping, playing like, bro, I should have stayed home because she actually didn't want me to leave her or whatever, but it's a tough situation because then I come home

and maybe she was sleeping and it was a rough situation and I'm just like, okay, now I kind of know for next time. I don't know, those are things you just learned. It's because we want to be the chill wife, but then yeah, then I let you do it. And then you get into it. You get too far before you get back out. It's like, oh, and he's actually gone. You're like, I'm not over committed.

You're like, no, I'm not. Right. It's just, yeah, no. It's, yeah, yeah. But literally happened last night. I was like, Matt, you want me to feed him? Because you were not like hopping up for the night. Well, okay, I, I had a migraine, so I took to feed him? Because you were not like hopping up for the night next to the evening.

And then? I had a migraine, so I took an excedrin migraine PM. Oh, I was zoned. I was zoned. Okay. But it's like, but okay. I was totally going to change his diaper and feed him. But then Ag was like, oh, you want me to do it?

I was like, okay, I'm making a little help. And I'm like, no, I can do it. And she's like, no seriously, I can do it. And I'm like, are you sure? And she's like, yeah, and I'm like, are you sure? And she's like, yeah. And I'm like, are you sure? And then sure enough, this morning, we're getting some coffee at Dunkin' Donuts

and it comes up. And I'm like, you offered. Like, why? Why are you just, I was willing to do it, you know? There's an issue lies is that you did not also do the morning then. I was like, you don't get to do both. Oh my gosh, we need to talk about this.

We're gonna talk about this off-the-run. I was the double whammy. We're gonna talk about this on-the-run. And now We're gonna talk about this off-double whammy. And now I got a headache. I have a headache thinking about it. Keep in mind, I did do the first night feed. You slept through that one and I wanted you to. You did 10 feet.

I actually, I tried to get her, I actually. I was freaking a cake watch. I was begging Abby to sleep through the 2.30 in the morning feeding and for me to do it. And for her just to get to like, you know, non-stop sleep. But she wouldn't do it, because I think, it probably is partially because you don't want to get mass-ized.

You get massed out as a wife. But, yeah. You don't play with stuff like that. But I really want you to get good sleep. Like, I really do. But that first. Oh my gosh. So this time I'm like, it's not happening.

Like, I will do everything I have to do. Sorry, a question I want to ask is, you mentioned you guys were on like separate pages. What were you, what were you on separate pages about, or like, what was causing the underlying issue? Yeah. Um, well besides the fact that I was trying to understand my wife when she's going through all of these hormonal changes, especially for the first time, um, I had no clue what she was actually going through. I'm thinking she's gonna push up this baby. We're coming home. All right. Like the hardest

thing is gonna be just like your,- Like you're thinking like the hardest thing probably was the birth. Yeah, exactly. And for some it may be, but like that just wasn't the case for us. Yeah, so besides me not knowing how to serve my wife in times of where I felt like she needed me, I don't know, like what's some other thing?

Yeah, I just, I think it was really just like him not being able to understand what I was feeling. And regardless of like depression, anxiety, even just like you were saying, like the hormones postpartum, just what we have to like physically go through, I think that caused a lot of like, I felt resentment because I was like, well, you don't have to wake up another night to feed her, like I do.

But it's like, you can't, I mean, you can't feed her. So I can't be mad, but it's just like, that's it. You're breastfeeding. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so just like things like that. Yeah, no, definitely. I think another thing was I have kind of not pressured, but kind of been like, especially when I see her going through tough times with the breastfeeding or whatever, saying like,

hey, babe, why don't we just like try some other things, babe, why don't we just try some other things? Like, why don't we just figure this out? And I start to make recommendations and things like that. And she's like, I can tell in her eyes, she's like listening to me, but she's also like, babe, this is what I want to be like. Look, it has to be my decision. Yeah, yeah, this is like the plan that I want to go with.

And in my head, I'm like, but it's so easy. Can we just like figure out a different plan? I feel like you would be happier. I feel like this. I feel like that and I literally have to learn and like tell myself like yo Stop it's not your plan like at all like you literally just listen to your wife Just like listen to see what what she's actually feeling what she's actually going through and then like go from there So I like I've learned like some things. I just need to just let her tell me and then I need to get better at this I see people do this. I don't know if you guys do this, but like ask Your spouse. Do you need like a hug or do you need? Like what do you need? Yeah, like what do you need in this moment? Like do you need an answer? Do you like need the problem to be solved?

I'm like yeah, like I've seen people do that and I'm like I need to get better at doing that because sometimes I feel like I got the answer. Right. Especially during plus part of them and I know absolutely nothing. Yeah, and that's the thing too. Like I feel like I sometimes wouldn't even voice

what I needed because I wouldn't even know what I needed. And even just like an everyday marriage too. Sometimes I'm like I just need to tell you everything that I'm feeling but like I don't want you to give me a fix. And we've struggled with that, like he'll try to make it better. And I'm like, obviously, that's the goal. I wanna feel better.

But sometimes I don't want you to say something to make me feel better. Just hug me and just let me vent out all my thoughts and that's what I need in this moment. So I feel like just communication, we've gotten a lot better with that over the years. I'm sure you guys know just like daily things that you learn about each other You can still after knowing each other for like ever. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, cuz how long have you been together? We've known each other for six years. We're coming up on four years of marriage next month. Yeah, okay

Yeah, but you guys have known each other for a really long time, right? We've known each other for like 10 years Oh, we only have been like together together for like seven. Oh, okay, so Well, you guys are you guys some skin in the game Yeah, cuz that goes back That's sure we went to high school. Yeah, I was starting high school Yeah, we went on our first date on my 18th birthday Abby was 17, okay But the 18 teams come old honestly It's not so but we were like, that was

rather junior year of high school. He just did kindergarten twice. So it's just kind of like, yeah, hey, watch it. It's the 80, my mom's story. My mom's still, my mom refuses to believe that I have ADHD still. Like, I'm like, mom, I promise you, I have it. My first kindergarten teacher told my parents, she was like, I think you might wanna get him tested and they were so offended by that. And like looking back, I'm like, I probably should have, which my parents are, okay, I'm sorry. My parents are amazing by the way.

They know that they want it, they're so good. They also want my mom. I'm a dad. No, they truly are amazing parents, but yes, I have it. Why do we get on topic of kindergarten? We're talking about how you were 18 when you were in different years. How old were you guys when you met?

How old were we? We were 20. Yeah, we were 20 years old when we met. Which feels so crazy, because we're 27 now. And that feels like a lifetime ago. But then 20, it's like we were still adults when we met, but like how I am now compared to when I was 20 is like a whole different person.

Like it, yeah. For both of us, it was just totally different. Okay, so we met, I don't think we ever shared this with you guys. So we met in Los Angeles and I was filming a dance class and she was dancing in the dance class. In LA, that's what kind of like the dancers do. They go to dance classes and they get filmed

and it gets on YouTube or whatever. I saw her, I noticed her in the dancers do. They go to dance classes and they get filmed and it gets on YouTube or whatever. I saw her, I noticed her in the dance class. And there's like 150 girls in this class. And he noticed me, he says. I did. We're here now. I know. I know.

Because you're the only guy with the camera in the room. So like, I mean, that's what I do. But I'm just like, I don't believe it. Did you slide in the DMs? I was. I was in the DMs, bro. Okay, so here's the thing. I don't believe it. Did you slide in the DMs? I was in the DMs, bro. Like, okay, so here's the thing. I don't know how I found her.

And like, to this day, I still, I think we had mutual friends, and I think I had to do a little bit of Instagram stocking. I mean, I really was in, That's good, that's sweet. Thank you. Okay, because I mean, it sounds crazy now, but like, I had to like go find like some tag friends

and like find her and stuff like that. So anyways, slidding's her DMs. I said, hey, I noticed you in this class the other day. And a super long story short, she gave me her number without me asking for her number. Let's go. You know what I'm saying? So I didn't even make a hint or nothing.

She was like, hey, yo, here's my number. If you want to just hit me up off of this, I was like, actually, you know what I said? It's actually, it's embarrassing. What'd you say? I said, I don't really like get on here that much. So if you wanna text me, get on like, I'm in like Instagram.

I was like, I don't really get on here that much. I'm like, looking back, I'm like, I literally like, it's Instagram. I mean, I guess back then, like we were obviously doing social media or anything. Yeah. So maybe it wasn't that weird for me to say, but like now think about me saying,

I don't really get on Instagram that much of my life. That was so obvious that I just... Back then, I feel like people were not, I don't know, at least I wasn't. It wasn't as big of a thing, yeah, that's true. So maybe it's not that weird. You didn't think it was weird? I don't think it was weird. Okay, I thought... Or you thought, like I thought...

I just thought I was the man if I'm being honest. I was like, I just bagged this girl's number without even asking. No. So what was your first date? I'm so curious. What was our first date? So our initial, you told my initial first date.

You told it. Okay. No, we went to Shake Shack. Well, I brought Savannah to Shake Shack. It was, I was a part, I was a part. I was at a church out there in Los Angeles, and we were like breaking a fast, and everyone was breaking the fast at Shake Shack.

And I've been with this church for like a few years. It's like my second family, all those things. And I just bring this like random chick to Shake Shack, and everyone's like, oh my gosh, who is this? And like, I'm his second mom, and like, saying all these things, and like, oh my gosh, who is this? And I'm his second mom and saying all these things and like, do you were a little nervous? Well, I remember someone like texted you, like a girl texting you and say like, who's that?

Like all this stuff and I'm like, okay, I- Wait, the web? Someone texted you. While we were there? Yes, I remember. You were looking over my shoulder? I, yeah. Oh, I never knew this.

I didn't even know that. Yeah, I'll tell you, I don't wanna say about telling you who texted you, but anyways. Yes. And I'll tell you, I don't wanna say about telling you who takes to do, but anyways. Nice. And so it was just, I'm meeting all of these people that are like huge and important in his life. And I'm like, I don't even know you, so that was. Yeah, you don't even know me.

It's like me and the family on the first date. Pretty much. Yeah. But that wasn't like our first official day, I guess. Our first official day? Which is the movies. Okay. We did a dinner in a movie,

and I guess I could have been more creative with it. I did that too. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to offend. I'm really hiking too. We went hiking. Okay, that's good. I feel like a movie. I'm sorry this is just my opinion. A movie for the first day is not right. We kissed though. It was perfect. Okay, so that was good. Yes. Well, we kissed in the car afterwards, so maybe I would have liked the movie more if like you would have kissed me on the movie Well, I didn't think I didn't want to go that route. Oh, so yeah, okay I was actually relieved because I was so nervous. I was like you like two hours where I do not have to talk That's true. That's true. I'm just gonna say maybe first

I'm like it takes the pressure off but I feel like you just can't get to know someone that's true in the movies Yeah, you know and you also fell asleep in the movie. I did not fall asleep. You fell asleep and you were twitching. I did. I'm taking this story to the end. I did not fall asleep. I was just rubbing my eye.

You were resting your eyes. I had something in my eye. Savannah guys will sleep. And I like, and the only reason I knew she was asleep is because. No, I wasn't. I felt this. I was like, is she twitching? I did not fall asleep. You make that story. I is she twitching? I do not feel this way.

You make that story. I don't do that. Don't do that. I'm not making the story. She was twitching and I was like, she's asleep. But I didn't say nothing. I don't want to embarrass you on our first date or whatever. When did you ever say anything?

I don't know. I feel like years later. Now I'm saying it. This is you made this up. I promise you I'm not making this up. Anyways, that was our first day. Then we went to dinner. She ordered pancakes. I ordered chicken wings

and we kissed and looked in the car and that was it. That's what we ordered. I know, I just, it's just like a big part. But wait, wait, you guys ended up breaking up though, right? 100%. We broke up so many times. Like broke up. Yeah.

What does that mean? We thought about it a few times in our dating, you know, years, but like we never officially, we never took that club. No, we never, yeah, we never broke up. Yeah. But like, what was that like? What is breaking up for us? The thing is, so we did long distance for a year and then like part of a year, half of

it we were engaged, half we were just dating. So like the first half and we were just dating, not engaged yet. Long distance was like the first half and we were just dating, not engaged yet, long distance was like the hardest thing on us ever. And so I feel like that is where we broke up, but we still talked every single day that we broke up. Like it was never a time that we like broke up and I say broke up because I feel like

we never actually broke up. You know, definitely. I mean like breaking up when we were like dating and living in the same city was me like, that's like storming out and leaving and like going somewhere for hours and- And there will like take each other and then we're fine. It was never like you were like, this is final.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't think hasn't ever been, I think only one time and I was during long distance and with long distance have you guys ever done long distance? No, we lived two hours apart. It was long distance, this is though. I take that like I feel like if you can't physically see your significant other, whenever you want, it's so tough because like you're going,

this was my point, you're dealing with thinking about what the other person is doing and not even in a negative way. Just like you just wanna be around them. Cause it's used to and it's like easy to happen but you're just so in the unknown, and I feel like that can just cause so much division, and just so much, just unnecessary,

just anger towards each other, and that was our whole thing. Like, I would always, like just want to physically be with her, and like, we would get into a little itty bitty arguments for no reason, and just starting to break up with each other. And it's like, you're literally 2,500 miles away, like we're get into a little itty bitty arguments for no reason and just starting to break up with each other. And it's like, you're literally 2500 miles away.

Like, we're not breaking up. Yeah, we were across the whole country. Totally, yeah, yeah. It was like, that's legit. It was tough. And we tried to see each other like every single month and sometimes that didn't work. And it was, the breakups weren't like legit breakups,

but I don't know, marriage is much harder though. Like, definitely. Yeah, I don't know, marriage is much harder though. Like- Been dating? Definitely. Yeah, I think so too actually. I mean, because you're choosing your spouse through everything. Like, before like when you're dating, you don't see everything. You don't see all this stuff that- Bro, and the infatuation is so crazy.

Oh, bro, it's like- It takes- They're the perfect person in the whole entire world. There's no, they have no flaws. They can do no wrong. And your parents who you hear, you hear, maybe Bickery here, and they're like, look, my person is actually perfect. And I found the perfect person in the world.

So it sucks to be you guys. Thank you guys, because we are never gonna fight. Yeah, never gonna happen. That's what you think. I remember when we were first dating, I was like, well, I will never fight. I remember you said that. I think we got to fight into that night or something.

Probably. I remember. Yeah, no, it. I think we got to fight until like that night or something. Probably. I remember. Yeah, no. It was, what are we gonna fight over? We got into a fight. I went to Vegas and this sounds, like I didn't go to Vegas and like go party with you. But it was, no, I didn't go to Vegas.

Okay. But no, I was like, I was underage anyway, but it just seems, it was the worst situation. We got into an argument and then I go to Vegas with like my friend and then we're just like arguing and I'm trying to enjoy my time and it was over. What was it over? I don't know, I don't remember.

You used to tell me the story. I thought you were gonna take that one. It's okay. Anyways, that was like a first big fun. That's the thing you never remember. Yeah, exactly. Because obviously it probably like did it better. It just shows you how like there's so much

that you should just move on from because you're not gonna care, you're not gonna remember what it was a day, and one day, just like what was that fight about? Actually, I remember, I won't remember. I remember for a week and then I forget. And then you're like, I don't know. You guys opened up on your podcast about getting canceled,

and when I saw that title, I immediately was just like, oh, you're the same. I was like, no, I hate when I hear about other creators getting hate because there's nothing worse as a creator. Obviously, there's so many perks. I don't wanna act like it's, I'm sure there's people in much worse situations than getting that hate, but when you do get it,

it feels horrible. And so, I don't know, if you guys are comfortable sharing about that, I was just curious how you navigated that. Because when you get a lot of people just coming for you, it's not fun. Because you've been on the internet for a while. Yeah, we have.

Since 2017, you know that. Do you wanna tell a little bit? I feel like you are better. Yeah, no. So like, because we've been on social media for, yeah, for so long 2017, like we start off with doing YouTube when it was like Pretty I would say like kind of easy to kind of grow on YouTube back in the day like 2017 So we were around like the prank and challenge day you guys are doing the prank. Yeah, we were doing all the fake pranks

I'm on our channel by the way. They are great. Yeah Did you guys fake any pranks? Oh, we fake majority of our breaks. Like they were majority scripted. Would get the views. Yeah, we've definitely like. And everybody, here's my favorite thing. It's like you tell people that they're fake and then people like, no way.

No, they still don't believe. You know what's crazy? Before we started though. I would watch these pranks because I was like, this is like what we were trying to do or what I'm doing. And I would be like, okay, babe, like this one's real. And he's like, Savannah, no, they're not real. I'm like, no, this one has to be.

Yeah, it's like no, but I think I've tried like one, like maybe throw like a spider in the shower and like, scare, but anyways, the ones that like, went viral and did good, they were scripted. Thank you to Hello Freshresh for sponsoring this portion of the episode. Something Matt and I have been talking about a lot recently is decision fatigue.

I feel like I'm educating him on this because having 202 has made my brain kind of short circuit in a way it never has before. I'm trying to be better at about like looking for things. Like if she put the diapers somewhere and I'm like, hey, babe, where the diaper is, I'll try to look for them first. Yes, and making some decisions yourself, right?

Yes. Yes. And one last decision we need to make during the day is what is for dinner. And that is why HelloFresh is great because they've planned the meals for you, and not only that, but they've already shopped for the ingredients and pre-portioned perfectly

for you and your family. And they taste so good, you guys. And if you're like me and you are not very good at cooking, I've actually made Abby these meals before and it's really nice, it's just a step-by-step process. I'm just on the pan. I'm just on the pan. Honestly, yes.

And the great thing is, is that they don't just have dinners, they also have breakfast and kid-approved lunches and snacks. Our toddler, he has an eating machine and he can eat these meals and loves them as well. I didn't know they had kid-approved lunches and snacks. Is that like a new thing? That's pretty cool. I think that's fairly new.

Ben, less time, shopping and cooking and spend more time with your family. That's why we love HelloFresh mostly. So go to HelloFresh.com slash 50 unplanned podcasts and use code 50 unplanned podcasts for 50% off plus 15% off the next two months. That's 50 unplanned podcasts for 50% off. Gosh, we are just rolling with the deals today.

That's a really good deal. My mom would be all over that. My mom loves to save money, so she'd be like using our use-n-r. In the code to Theresa. I should send it to Theresa, I feel the best one. I'll text it to her, you never text mom. Okay, we'll send it to Theresa.

And back to the episode. Because we've done social media for so long and we've seen the ins and outs and with us even being like an interracial couple on social media, that comes with just a whole another layer of unnecessary hate that we feel like we just were just like, oh, okay, this is gonna be our life, whatever we get it.

And just in the world that we live in now, it's just a thing, you know? So we on TikTok, this was like a couple years ago or whatever, there was just a TikTok, I won't go into details of the TikTok, I don't know if it's still up now, but it's not up on our page, it got taken down by me, but I think people stitched it or whatever. We made something that I guess could have been

controversial for us as an interracial couple and a lot of people from both ethnicities didn't like that and just Start stitching it and just like start coming for me a lot. They came for like yeah It was more so you just basically saying like you know you're with this African-American black guy just for like clout just for like the babies and like all these things A lot of people were saying that like I was racist and I'm like, how does that work? But yeah, so getting hate publicly that way,

but then like getting the messages in the DMs and like this is when we already knew about the hate in the DMs and the messages and comments that you get. But for some reason this affected me way more than it affected her, because I'm like getting, like, called out my name crazy. I'm getting like my character,

my character's being jeopardized, or like you guys are talking about me and like stuff that's so not true. And stuff that I've never heard before, especially when it's talking about like my wife. When it comes to like my family and stuff, now and even just like you guys are parents, you guys getting, when it comes talking about like my wife. When it comes to like my family and stuff, now and even just like, you guys are parents, you guys get it.

When it comes to your kids, nothing's on the table. Like it's totally different. So I'm getting messages like this in comments and people are stitching and like saying this about me. And I'm like, I gotta like get off TikTok. And what's crazy, I was in like the silence about it. Like Savannah didn't know that I was dealing with this low key, kind of depressed and kind of like really down on myself

because I don't want her to get affected by it. I'm like, if she sees what these people are sending, because you're like on TikTok, you can see the message requests and you can see the blocked comments and stuff like that. And I'm looking at those and I'm like, why do I keep looking at these comments? They are literally...

And you can't stop. You can't stop. It's just in your brain, you're like, you cannot get it out. Bro, and I'm like, getting crushed each comment that I'm looking at. People were really trying to cancel us. It was to a point where,

and I think it's still there, you can search Josh and Sav on TikTok and you will probably see some stuff but the third one down says canceled. And I'm like, what, like off of a TikTok that we didn't even do anything. And then it like, that word canceled is used so much. And it's when you're under a microscope on social media,

it's just like, people are just looking for like you to do something wrong. Like they want to find something wrong that they can like flip it, even if there isn't anything, obviously. So yeah, eventually, we talked about it and it got taken down. Like for me, I couldn't deal with it. I started to report it. I started to get our management involved. Trying to, like, can this stop? Because it is literally affecting us. And we just have to just like keep going and just like literally just know

who our identity was in. I think what these other people are saying, even though like every now and then I still do look at those comments and like, it doesn't get on me now as much as it used to, but it's tough sometimes when people are like coming for your character and things like that. It's like almost frustrating like how tough it can be because you're like, I'm an adult, you know, like

Yeah, I'm a grown man. I don't know these people and so then that's just what reminds me I'm like when if our kids ever want to create like their own stuff online that's where I'm like, no Me too. Because if it's hard for me, imagine how hard it be for a kid that doesn't know their identity right now. They are trying to figure it out. And we didn't have this social media

when you were going up a page. So it's like, oh gosh, imagine. And I'm so curious as an interracial couple, has that only been isolated to social media or has there ever been something like in person where someone's like said something rude or mean or something to you? Yeah, what?

I was just gonna say like, yeah, sometimes, like actually, I think this just happened the other day when we were, we went out to eat or something and like people will think that we're like not together. You're kidding? Oh yeah, yes, yes, yes. And stuff like that. Oh, yeah, we're aware of it. Yeah, we were, we went out to eat or something. And like people will think that we're like not together. Your kids. Oh yeah, yes, yes, yes. And stuff like that. Just like little.

Yeah, we were in our new city. Is that a spaghetti factory? Yeah, nice. Yeah, I think so. And they, I think I came in after the fact that I think I had the stroller something like that. And they said like table for three or something and we were with her mom.

And I'm like, hmm, I'm back here. But I don't know sometimes, like I can't read too deep into things like that. Another example I do have though, we were in New York one time and there was this, like we're on the train on the subway and this lady, this African-American lady was just kind of just staring at us, older lady. And I was just like, maybe she's staring because she likes my shoes or she likes her shoes or like, I lady. And I was just like, maybe she's staring because she likes my shoes or she likes her shoes or like, I don't know.

I'm like, I only think the best of people. It's time for us to get off the stop. And she kind of like ups and downs, Savannah walks off the train. She kind of like ups and downs me and says, oh, you don't like, she said, I think she said, what did she, she said, oh, you don't like chocolate? Oh.

And like, look at her. I didn't hear. She't like chocolate. Oh. And like, look at her. I didn't hear. She was like, oh yeah. I was like, look at her and like, look at me. And they didn't hit me because I smiled. I'm like, why don't I just smile at that? But it hit me like a few seconds later. They'll see you hate that when you walk away

and then you're like, what's happening? I would have said this in the moment. Like, I should have said something at that moment, but a few seconds later I was like, hmm, that makes a lot of sense. Like the whole train ride, she was kind of like up and downing us and not really, you know, not looking that friendly and then I get off

and she says that and it goes back to show like, because like we see the comments on social media. Like those are just gonna be there. We get it, like, oh, why aren't you with a black girl? Oh, why don't you just date your own race? Like we see all of that and that's just whatever because comments are just whatever. But when you say it in person and it happens to you in person,

it's honestly, it becomes more real because it's like there's actually hateful people out there. That actually feel like that. And I think what blows my mind is, I'm so naive, like I grew up, had no idea. I just thought racism didn't exist. I just thought, I just thought it like growing up, you just don't even, I don't know,

in school you read the books about like the Civil War and stuff and you're just like, wow, that's horrible. That happened back then. Right, right. I'm so glad there's not even a tiny inkling of that anymore in our society. And then you get older and you realize that there's like, it's like, no, it doesn't just go away

in 200 years, less than 20 years. It doesn't just like, I'm magically disappear. And I feel like if you just talk to somebody who's in an older generation, those ideologies are still present in little ways, I think. Yeah. So that's just, I'm glad that you guys, it seems like you haven't had a lot of incidents in person.

I'm surprised you get those comments though, even. But the comments are crazy. It's insane. And it's just, I mean, they're just, it's just because. I don't know, like I don't really understand the reason behind it. You can say it's, you know, like we have like a large following and things like that and people just want to just do

the negative comments just to do it or whatever, but I don't know, like to your point, Matt, like even like we've had conversations just because about race and the things that happened and the world and stuff like that, just because she's been interested and wanting to learn about it. And I think that advances the conversation

when it comes to racism in America and Caucasian people, why people not really knowing and understanding about it. I love that. You know, because when I can have that conversation, like, okay, baby, yeah, like this is how I felt before or not from her, but like in general, this is how I felt before. This is how my people feel, my culture feels about certain things. It's good to have those conversations. And like you willing willingly wanting to have.

Yeah, it's actually crazy too. This is kind of off topic, but both my parents are cops. And so that aspect, I never saw the whole side of what you can feel about cops and the difference. Because I grew up both my parents are cops. I'm white, I don't experience racism. Literally, it's not possible for me.

I would say that I was uneducated just because I was unaware. As a kid, I didn't know about it. You did obviously. Just things like that we've learned each day. But yeah, in person to see that people still, like you said, you feel like it's just something in the past, but people still to this day,

like racism is such a real thing. And they'll go out of their way to say something. It's so big. Like, it's like a big thing to us only because like, when we found each other, that's we weren't thinking about race. So like, in our brains, in our heads, it's just like,

you know, just another person, and then when we see the comments, we're like, oh wait, you guys are thinking that, and we're not thinking that at all, like that, it doesn't make any such a difference. I'm curious how that was like, when you guys first started dating, and like we're gonna get married,

like with your families and your close friends, like was that even a conversation amongst them? Right, I don't know. It's funny you say that because, well, I don't know when the podcast with your dad that we shot. It's going up tomorrow, so it'll be up before this, yeah.

Okay, because he actually just said the first time that he met me over FaceTime because we didn't live near our family. And he said that when he saw that I was white, he was kind of shocked. Because he'd never seen you date a white girl. I've never dated a white girl in my entire life. So like for And it was nothing to and I've said this so many times. There's nothing to white women I think I almost got canceled for this too. I said this on our podcast. Yeah, it's on TikTok right now

But I it's nothing to white women like I love my wife is white. I love every woman. I love that girl. I love that girl. Pink turquoise, whatever. I just never dated or had a preference. Like I never just chose to, like the people that I dated were black. That's literally that simple.

So my dad, and I did it so random too. Like I was on FaceTime with my dad. We were on a date, and I was just FaceTime, and I'm like, hey, dad, we're out right now. He's never met or never seen her. I say, so random too. Like I was on FaceTime with my dad. We were on a date and I was just FaceTime and I'm like, hey dad, we're out right now. He's never met her, never seen her. I say we're out. He's like, huh? And then I was like, oh yeah, there she is.

And I showed her and then like that was that. And now we just found out we shot a podcast with my dad the other day and he said he was like, yeah, well when that first happened, like I didn't, I wasn't expecting her to be. And we never knew that. Like until just literally the other day that he was like shook to see that.

I was like, why are you whatever? Right, so yeah. But yeah, just little things like that. I don't think there was ever anything, like thank God, in our family directly, that there was a racism issue or, because there is, it's such a real thing to where some parents will not allow.

Like I've even gotten DMs of people being like, my mom doesn't, or my parents, or whatever, doesn't approve of me dating like a black guy. Like, do you have any advice? So it's a real thing, so like, we are so grateful that that wasn't like the case for us, but it really is a real thing. Have you guys seen that YouTube video?

There's a YouTuber in the UK that flew to America to make a video called, I pranked them on this much racist man. I know, it's that much racist. We went to college like two hours north of that town. No. And we went hiking like in that town. So like I grew up in St. Louis, like St. Louis is a city, like it's just like I was a city

boy, okay? Like I don't know, like I didn't't know, St. Louis is not the South, but Southern Missouri starts to become more South. And if you dip into Arkansas, because we went to school and spring from Missouri, and if you drive like an hour South, you're in Arkansas, and you see Confederate flags. And I'm like, no way.

I'm just like, there's no way, this is real. Like there's no way that in 20, I mean, I guess we were in college in like 2020, but I was like, there's just no shot that this is like going on. But yeah, that was that was that. So I wanted to ask like, so now you're raising children together. And I'm sure that's been a conversation too with like parenting. I don't I guess like what that experience is like,

definitely I've even gotten like comments or questions. Like obviously we've talked about like regardless of like social media What I have to say but I get like the question of like well? How are you gonna know like how to do your daughter's hair and just stuff like that? And I'm like I just find it honestly so like ignorant I guess yeah because I'm like regardless of like how my daughter's hair is I am her mother so like I will learn how to do her hair no matter what it takes. You know what I mean? So for someone to just like those kind of things are silly, but for us, we know that, especially for me now, to know that racism is a real thing, and that we will have to raise our children

with a different, especially for me, different ones than if I would have married a white guy and had white children. Yeah, no definitely. I just know like, when they get older, like right now they're super young, but as they're getting older, having just those conversations of like, hey, having those real conversations with your kids,

you know, like when there's no cameras, like no one's around and no one's forcing these conversations where you're just talking just like, hey, it might be a little different when you go to school. Like people might wanna touch your hair and let's talk about boundaries and let's like, you know, things like that, like that's what we're gonna be implementing in our daughters as they get older.

Because like she said, unfortunately, it is a real thing or whatever. And if they see like a mixed looking kid or whatever or like, you know, they say like the light skin kids or whatever, they could get picked on. Or just because of their, like, I got picked on in elementary school because of, because I was black or whatever,

like they would call me brownie just because I was, and fourth, fourth or fifth grade, and you was crazy, I thought it was funny until I went home and like told my parents they're like, yeah, hold on, like something like that. So like, it's a, it can happen in elementary school. And Grana, I went to like an all white school too. So like I stuck out like a sore thumb,

but like it shouldn't be the case though, when your kid is going to school, they shouldn't have to think about that. So I think starting super young, if we even decide to put our girl in public school or, you know, our girls, what else is there? You said girl. I know I do that because the oldest is or, you know, our girls. What does that say? You said girl.

I know I do that because the oldest is like, she's the closest one to you. Yeah, okay, I get that. Free school, okay, both of our girls. Yes. If we put them in public school, we'll see if that ever happens. But yeah, just talking to them at a young age,

letting them know their identity, like building them up, affirming them, saying like, it's okay to look how you like, this is how God made you, like this is it, and not having them think anything else. If you could please share this podcast with your nanny that you had as a kid, I don't know if you did actually have a nanny,

but that would be great if you could just share it. Or maybe if you know someone who's a nanny. Yeah. Or what about the nanny's son's dogs cat? Yeah, they listen to it. Like if they're lonely by themselves at home. I can't make really like this. That's my favorite person to share it with.

I feel like cats could really get something out of this podcast. Especially in conversation. I can tell that you guys are definitely cat people just from you bringing that up. Yeah, that's wild because I'm not a cat person. I feel like the cat will leave the best review ever. She's a good girl. Yeah, but if you could just share it with your nanny's cat, that I feel like the cat will leave the best review ever. She's a good girl. Yeah, but if you could just share it with your nanny's cat,

that would just mean the world to us and share the podcast, now back to the podcast. We love having these conversations too, because we have friends just like you guys that are in this space that show their kids and then there's some like you guys who don't show their kids and we are part of the crew or whatever

or couples that we do share our daughter when it comes to social media and like Instagram and things, but our only thing is our content isn't about them and it'll never be about them with us we started you to just us. Obviously like it was just a couples channel. And till this day I consider our channel a couples channel. People can put family on there just because, you know,

we have a family now, but I think a family channel, this is my opinion, is like a channel strictly about your kids and kind of just like their lifestyle and like the family range or whatever. But right now, we don't feel, I don't know what the word is. Like, convict that I guess, if you will, with showing our kids on social media,

mainly because of just how we're doing it. Literally hit me up in like a couple months or so, my answer could change. Like right now, we don't see anything. We don't feel like the need to like change anything about what we're doing, because like we said our, we always have just made sure that it's centered around us.

We don't want to be centered around our children, but that's not to say there are people that do, not like center their content around their children, but they do feature their children a lot. And that's fine. Like my thing is, I'm like, you make the best decision like for your family. But yeah, right now, I do think we are kind of navigating

that more. I don't know if it's with having our second, but just thinking about maybe not showing them, like, how do we navigate that if we decide to stop showing them? Like, I will say, I feel like if we ever make that decision, we won't make it like an announcement, I guess. That makes sense. It'll just be like a personal decision. And honestly, like, people may not even really notice. Yeah. But maybe they won't. Can I say that about you guys? We didn't notice a big shift.

That makes me really happy in this content. Yeah. Which I think is great. Even I'll just get super specific, because I'm a study YouTube. I know YouTube. I can't see though. I just love everything.

I'm the same way. I see you guys thumbnails, and I just love everything. So like, I'm the same way. I see like you guys thumbnails, and I see like your recent thumbnail with your son in his birthday party, and it's like the, it's him in the thumbnail, but I think it's the back of his head or something like that. And it was about your son in a sense, like, or you guys were wanting to show like,

to celebrate your son, but like, it wasn't. And it's not like, oh, look at me guys, we're not showing our kid on social media. It's just more like, I don't know, it just, it's just natural. Yeah, you're just a document, show your life without, if that's what you want to not show them. Yeah, and what it is, is I think some people,

I think it's so easy just to have the camera on your kids, because like, you love your kids, and your kids are so cute. They're so cute, yeah. And like, people, even people that don't do social media, want to like show their kids anyway. But I think it's like there's like this slippery slope that you can go down because it is so easy

just to vlog your children, where like you might end up in a situation where they get a little bit older and they're like, I hate this. I don't want to do this. This isn't fun for me. I don't want privacy. And so we didn't even think, like there's so much going on that,

we just started to really think through all of that. And we made the decision not to show our kids faces on social media. But yeah, I'm glad that you guys are thinking of it from that perspective because it's crazy. I read a book actually recently, Jeanette McCurdy's book, you guys heard of that.

I've heard of that. I'm glad my mom died. And it was just about her experience in the industry as a child actress and how unfortunately for her, she was taking advantage of by her mom. And it just really opened my eyes to like what can happen. So yeah, it's wild.

Yeah, no, and even, oh, you go mad. No, you go ahead. No, Abby, go. I wasn't gonna say anything. You're mad. You can call me mad. It's fine. What are you gonna say?

I'd say like, it's important, I think that like, if you want to show, like, it's good to see parents like showing their parenting experience. Yes. It doesn't necessarily have to, have to or not show the kids involved. You know? Yeah, I love that. I really don't.

I really don't. I think the majority of people, we have so many friends that show their kids online. Yeah. I don't, like, and they're great people. I don't think, I really truly think that the majority of people have no ill intentions, but it's that, like, select few that do have ill intentions and that are just trying to, you know, make money off of their kids. I don't want to sound. No, I hear you.

But it's just, and that's where it's like, okay, this is weird. And that's why for me, I was like, okay, I want all of our stuff to be about us and to tell our story because I never want to get close to that. Like how you guys do that. Yeah, no, yeah. So, I think even like having the conversations between you and your spouse and like, like for us, like having those conversations behind closed doors,

like, okay, how are we gonna do this? So you won't go down that slippery surface. Yeah. Because if you go, like, if you're like kind of unsure and like say I'm like filming our daughter and deep down inside, she's like, I don't wanna do it. We've had like this moment, I don't know if we'll ever share it. This like, we've had a moment when our daughter was like super young

And I think she was trying to hit a milestone or something Yeah, we wanted to highlight that milestone. Yeah, we wanted to just show everyone that she's I forgot what it was That she was doing something and she wouldn't do it on camera and we literally were like it was probably like five minutes of us like Having the camera on her face like saying like hey like Let's try to catch her doing it. Like it was like blow kiss, there's something. Yeah, it was like something so simple. And we looked at each other and we're like,

we're like, what are we doing? Like literally what are we doing? This is not okay. This is not, like we had a real moment, we were like, no, we are not turning into that type of channel, that type of, those type of parents in the first place. Yes, it's cool, because like we always have our phones out.

We're always filming at our end. Yeah, I can't stop taking photos and videos all the time. Yeah, that's something totally different. But like, the fact that I was gonna go and edit that and post that on YouTube on, you know, the day that we upload, I was like, oh no, this doesn't, this doesn't make sense. You guys also, I mean, you guys really blew up

on TikTok this year. Congratulations on that. Like, I know that's like, it like, it's not easy to do. I thought your videos were super creative and love the interview style that you guys had with taking this thing that had been a thing for a while interviews, but then doing that as a couple. Was that your idea, Josh?

Like who came up with that? Who was it, my idea? Yeah, it's been. I don't know what. Was that your idea, Josh? Like who came up with that? Who's my idea? Yes, babe. I don't know what to say as my idea, but like you said, interviews have been on social media. Yeah. People are doing them just going like in random and public and just interviewing people and strangers.

And I don't know what it was. I just had the idea of, all right, let me just interview my wife and just see what happens. If you guys go back and watch the very first interview, Savannah was like not on board, not that she wasn't on board, but she was like, I didn't know it was going on. Yeah, she didn't know it was going on.

I was like, what are you doing? Stop, you already know these answers to these questions that you're asking or whatever. Like, let's stop doing this. It's weird or whatever. And then I'm like, babe, just like, go with it, just like improv. So like, I'm a theater guy.

So like, improv just comes like, I'm just natural to me and I'm like, for Savannah. I'm always teaching her, yes and, you guys know yes and. Yeah, I like to teach. I try to teach Madeline. You guys are good at it though. Like the videos are really. It takes practice because you can say sometimes

and I'm like, I'll like, rebuttal or like, go the opposite route. I'll be like, no, and he's like, no, like just agree with like what I say. I'm like, I'll like, rebuttal or like, go the opposite route. I'll be like, no. And he's like, no, just agree with like, what do I say? The fourth wall. I literally have my big like, don't break it. But, so yeah, like I was like, okay, let's just see what this does.

And she was pregnant at the time, which I honestly think kind of helped people love pregnancy content. They do. They eat it up. And like, we wanted to navigate pregnancy just a little different this time or whatever because like, there's just ways to do it.

And like, you guys do it a different creative way and another couple will do it. Like, so we were just like, all right, let's just try this and give like updates or whatever. And the first few were on accident, and then people start catching on, and we were like, these are fun. Let's just keep going.

And like, she's just hilarious. I literally just like, I'm like, I say babe, I'm just gonna turn the camera on. I'm gonna ask you what your name is, and let's just see where this goes. And we did that, and she just goes off the rip, and like her thing has been been her flirting with me. That was another thing.

It was an accident that that happened, I guess. The first time, because I was actually flirting with you. And then it became a storyline and everyone loves that I'm coming onto you. And now people actually, some people actually think that I'm just an interview guy. That's really funny. People don't actually know that we're together.

They'll see us probably just for you page and they're together. Like, those kids probably just on there, like, for you page, and they're like, wait. Like, when we had our second daughter, they were like, wait, you guys are married. Now you guys are married. Like, you bet, do we interview her? Yeah, sure. So then we did an interview on our love story after that.

So we're like, we just kept eating it up. So, so yeah, I mean, it happened on accident. It's just something just so fun and like creative. I feel like as creators, we're always trying to like push the envelope and just do something different, but not too crazy or different or whatever. Something that you know, people have done and probably we can borrow it and see what happens,

but they're fun, they're super fun. You guys interviews are hilarious. I just think it's like a way. I really wanted to make sure that we were making ours different, by the way. And I always tagged you guys. Yeah. Because early, okay, we were on TikTok early on

where everybody would copy everyone, verbatim, and not tag. It was like the thing to do. And it was so frustrating because Abby was, especially Abby would come up to these really, really good ideas. And people like word for word would copy our video. And just like not tag.

And then everyone would do the trend. And then no one, and it's just like, okay. It was only annoying when other people would come and be like, you copied this first. No, they would tell us that we copied this. Wait, wait a minute. We're like, shut up. You're like, hold on.

So I saw, you guys started a trend. Like everyone started doing these interview videos. I have a trend. And I'm like, okay, I guys started a trend. Everyone started doing these interview videos. I've been trying to do it. And I'm like, okay, I think this is hilarious. I really like this idea. I want to do it, but I also don't want to just copy your idea. So I tried to make it different. I really hope that I did it like.

Yeah. One thing we'd love to see is just like, it just shows everyone's personality in a different way. Like, you're interviewing someone that you love so much and you probably know all these things, like especially like the pregnancy interviews. Like I know the stuff that she's saying or whatever, but like it's just so curious to see like

how she's gonna phrase it and like for people to see her bubbly personality and things like that. So watching other people's personality different from like when you guys are doing like you're day in the life vlogs and stuff like that, I'm like, that's cool. That's different. It's just something new, you know Do you feel burnt out at all with those like have you done enough now? We are like okay. I want to explain different Loki yes, but at the same time

No, what do you think I? I think you well I feel I don't we've talked about you go. Yeah, you go. No, where are you gonna say well? I feel like for Josh't know. We've talked about it, you go, yeah. No, you go. No, what are you gonna say? Well, I feel like, for Josh, he's always like trying to just come up with a new creative thing. Yeah. So I feel like now that we've like done it for a season, it's like, okay, we can't just like keep doing this

over and over type thing. Like you want everything to be like new and fresh and fun. Right. So I think it's, I don't know, because now it's almost become like our thing. So it's like if we stop doing it, you know, like people might be like, hey, like why don't you guys do that anymore, but I don't. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know, because now it's almost become like our thing. So it's like if we stop doing it, people might be like, hey, why don't you guys do that anymore, but I don't know.

Yeah, I don't know. I don't, I don't feel like super burnt out with it. I do just like kind of want to throw some fresh things in there because if we don't then we're just, I don't want to just be seen as like the interview couple or whatever and as a creative, we just love to just spice things up in the first place, but I don't know.

I'm not burnt out just yet, but definitely just throwing them in there periodically. Like now, it's only for like, monumental things kind of like, we just did a moving one and we recently just did a, oh yeah, a moving one. That was it. Yeah, no, we did one like in our new house and stuff.

So like, it's just like has to be special to do them now, but I don't know. It's been, it happened on accident, and then we were just like, all right, let's just keep going. Yeah. You guys are funny. I love those. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, I just, I thought of super creative. Such a fun new take on something that's been around, yeah, and very relatable. Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. You have been. new take on something that's been around yeah and very relatable so yeah Watching people go through pregnancy and stuff too because then you're just right. That was another aspect of it Yeah, I feel like a lot of people could relate because they would hear like my symptoms or like what my cravings are like each week or whatever And I feel like they just kind of had like a reason they would know that like each week would do like the update

And so they would like come back and do what you get it like what's your craving this week? Yeah, if you're following someone that's in a similar stage to you're like, oh okay, like I'm gonna be like that two weeks from now. It's just fun. Right. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, because we were we're just two like two months apart. Yeah, exactly pretty much.

Yeah, because yeah, Starly was born on the 8th and then yeah, I was born on the 10th. Yeah, basically two months apart. Yeah, we were, Starly was born on the 8th and then yeah, I was on the 10th. Basically two months apart exactly. We were joking before this, we were like, wait, our kitchen get married because it's like you guys have two little rooms. Two girls and we have two boys and they're like the same exact age difference, which is so fun. You know what I thought about the other day though Matt?

What? I am gonna be like on the boys side of the family. Like, I'm gonna be the husband side. Does that make you sad? Whoa. Because. I thought about that same thing. Because girls really stayed tightly knit

with their family, but the boys don't as much. I have to remember to call my parents. So I'm gonna have to like, know my place, like step back a little bit, you know? I know, that is crazy to think. It's a little. Because I thought about that, like just the other day,

let me think about this when our kids are really babies. I was like, my kids are gonna move out. No, I was thinking. She cries about that. I was really thinking I was like, our girls are gonna like give birth one day. Like what are we gonna do? Oh gosh.

Like, oh my gosh. But it's so fun in the future, but I think about these things all the time. But yeah. Okay, that actually makes me glad that I have boys for a second. Yeah, you know, I don't want your kids to go through that. I know, right? But then it's so exciting. Yeah, because then you get to like Yeah, you know, I don't want your kids to go through that. I know, right? Well, then it's so exciting. Yeah, because in like, you get to like,

be there for them, I don't really. It's all like literally. It was really sad. We were in the hospital for my brother and sister in law's birth and my brother's father and law was there. And I could just tell he was just so worried about his daughter. Yeah. And that's not fun at all.

I can't imagine either. It's so hard. My daughter giving birth to her son or daughter. Yeah, it's crazy. Are you gonna be that intimidating dad? I was like, I have no boyfriend. No, the boy with type of dad, I'm gonna be like, I feel like I'm gonna have to be like both worlds.

Cause like, would you consider, I think Savannah's a little bit more strict than me. Yeah, I was gonna ask you was a strict, but you think I'm a strict? I feel like, well, if Ryan's like, like, cutting up or something, I feel like you'll, like, put your foot down. Oh, she pulls my hair.

It hurts. Yeah, like your kids pulling your hair and it brings out a different side. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. It's so new, I'm like, don't talk to my son. Okay, okay, yeah, that's how she is.

I feel like it's not me, not all, you're like, it's me, it's how she is. I feel like it really is not me, not all. You're like, you're like, you're sweetest dad. I do the craziest stuff. Like, I- Me too. You're dad. I think your dad went on a bike ride with me and Griffin. And then I think he told your mom he was like, I think my

might have been going a little too fast on the bike with Griffin. And I'm like, dude, Griffin loves to go fast. He's his favorite thing in the world. Griffin, like, 20 years. We're just guys being dudes. Okay. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Josh and Sav, congrats on your move.

Congrats on your babies. I'm so excited for you guys. Congrats on your like, on blowing up on TikTok, your podcast seems to be doing really well too. So just really excited for you guys and I think you're making the trip out to. I'm talking about their podcast. Yes, the four us podcast.

For us podcast, we're just, just on there just chatting about just stuff I were chatting about now. Yeah, conversation, life relationships, social media, all the stuff ends and out. So we love you guys. You guys are the best. You guys are the best. Yeah, this is really fun. It's crazy how much I can read, just like relate to, especially like the social media side of things like you. So yeah, I don't know. this has been really fun and I'm just excited to talk tomorrow on your podcast too. Let's go. Let's do it.

All right, and as always, this is where we say peace out. Okay, okay, okay, we say it with you. Three, two, one. Peace out, dudes. Peace out, dudes.