The WAN Show - Pretending I Endorse Your Product Is Fraud - WAN Show August 4, 2023

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Starting point is 00:00:15 And welcome to the WEN show! Really, Luke? Like, you can't text later? I was turning the ring volume down so I wouldn't bother anybody during the show. I was trying to be considerate, Linus! We have got a great show lined up for you guys today i mean one of the big topics is what is the deal with brands that we don't work with keeping my picture on their product pages we're gonna be talking about that because that is super not cool we're also going to be talking about the recent controversy with one of our testing guys from the lab saying something on camera, and then it kind of got, you know, spicy and, you know, something, something.

Starting point is 00:00:54 So basically, we're going to just talk through what happened, you know, what the best way to move forward is. What else are we going to be talking about today? Twitch expands gambling restrictions restrictions while another platform definitely does not do that um and another topic really luke uh weak uh absolutely weak uh balder's gate three now normally i would go right into the headline topic we'd be talking about how anchor is doing a no-no but instead we're actually going to jump to the one that luke ad-libbed at the end there i don't normally do this because it kind of comes across cheesy to me but i really want to thank But instead, we're actually going to jump to the one that Luke ad-libbed at the end there. I don't normally do this because it kind of comes across cheesy to me. But I really want to thank you guys for tuning into the show.

Starting point is 00:01:55 Because we all know that you would rather be playing Baldur's Gate 3 right now. As far as the world can tell. And you set aside your time and you tuned into the WAN show instead of playing Baldur's Gate 3 right now. Or its second monitor. What percentage of you guys are playing Baldur's Gate 3 right now. Or its second monitor. What percentage of you guys are playing it on a second monitor right now? Can we get a poll going? We can. I will do that.

Starting point is 00:02:13 Because I assume that we're the primary monitor. Is that a fair assumption? Should those be the options for the poll? Primary monitor, secondary monitor, not playing? Yeah. Okay, sure. I mean, you could have an option for Baldur's Gate is on their only monitor but that really raises a lot of questions about how exactly they're responding to the poll through their phone oh I mean that is

Starting point is 00:02:33 technically an option. Primary monitor secondary monitor slash phone yeah I believe in you. You got this. Uh. He's working on it. The WAN show is already a catastrophe this week, and we are, like, three minutes in. I absolutely love this. We were talking about it on the pre-show, and I was like, oh, this is a really good conversation. We should, like, have this be a topic. Okay.

Starting point is 00:03:03 Okay. Okay. We gotta pull. And then Luke and Dan completely shut down and stopped talking about it, and I'm sitting here going, okay, great. No, no, this is a really good conversation. We should have this be a topic. Okay, we got to pull. And then Luke and Dan completely shut down and stopped talking about it. And I'm sitting here going, okay, great. No, no, no, okay. I got some stuff. I got some stuff.

Starting point is 00:03:11 The third gate of Baldur has, at one point in time today, gotten over 520,000 concurrent players, which I find interesting. That is fantastic. It was midday on a Friday. No kidding. Yeah. What's going on? How is everybody playing this game? That's the 11th highest concurrent player count

Starting point is 00:03:31 in Steam history, and it was during the workday for North America. Okay, but here's the thing, Luke. You know how we always take Mondays instead of Fridays for stats? Have you ever gone to Costco on one of your days off that is not actually a stat? Like on a Monday that's not a stat?

Starting point is 00:03:50 It's always still full. And it's full of people. It's very confusing. I don't understand it. I'm walking around. I'm going, don't you people all have jobs? I mean, I know I'm here. I do understand there's non-standard shift workers, night shift workers, or on-call workers, stuff like that.

Starting point is 00:04:07 But I would always expect the population to be lower in areas like that. But it never really seems to be true. No, it's popping. It's interesting. Like you go in on like a Wednesday morning. It's like everybody's at Costco. That explains why there's no traffic. Because everybody's at Costco right now.

Starting point is 00:04:26 Filling up their gigantic parking lot. Eating all of their delicious samples. Okay, back to Baldur's Gate though. According to this poll, 17% of people watching on floatplane right now are playing Baldur's Gate either on their primary monitor or their secondary monitor. That is wild.

Starting point is 00:04:44 Have you played it yet? No, I've had no time. My labs people, some of them are actually watching the show live right now, have been here all week. So, no, I've had no time. Right, but it came out today midday anyway, so what difference does that make? I thought it came out yesterday. I don't know. Well, today is Friday, and you said it came out midday on a Friday. Well, I knew the concurrent player, maybe it came out at midnight or something.

Starting point is 00:05:04 I knew the concurrent player's count was today. Yeah, okay, that's pretty cool. I didn't say it came out todayday on a Friday. Well, I knew the concurrent player. Maybe it came out at midnight or something. I knew the concurrent player's count was today. Yeah, okay. I didn't say it came out today. Have you played the series? The series, yes, for sure. But the last release of Baldur's Gate was a very long time ago. Oh, I know. I think we're talking like Xbox original or something.

Starting point is 00:05:19 Baldur's Gate 2. Didn't Baldur's Gate 2 come out before Neverwinter Nights 2? Or was Neverwinter Nights 2 first? I'm looking up Baldur's Gate 2 come out before Neverwinter Nights 2? Or was Neverwinter Nights 2 first? I'm looking up Baldur's Gate 2 right now. I remember being in high school and buying Neverwinter Nights 2. Baldur's Gate 2, one of the expansions for it came out in 2000. Baldur's Gate 2 Enhanced Edition came out in 2013. Oh wait, that's not an expansion.

Starting point is 00:05:43 That's just the title of it. Baldur's Gate 2 Shadows of Amun came out in 2013. Yeah. Oh, wait, that's not an expansion. That's just the title of it. Baldur's Gate 2 Shadows of Amun came out in, yeah, 2000. Okay, Neverwinter's Night 2 actually came out after I was in high school. So this would have been once I was into PC gaming.

Starting point is 00:05:55 Baldur's Gate 2 then came out before I was into PC gaming. Yeah. I definitely played a bunch of Baldur's Gate stuff, but this was... You were a child. Old games, and I was a child. Yeah, for sure.

Starting point is 00:06:10 Okay. I got to confess, while I did manage to make a little Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights reference during the pre-show, I did not make it very far in Neverwinter Nights 2. I managed to get a couple hours in. It's heavy. I was a fan of... I played Neverwinter Nights 1 a lot, actually. But I mean, I didn't really make it that far.

Starting point is 00:06:33 I had more fun just like messing around in the game because they're very just interesting games. Like I remember figuring out in the original Neverwinter's Night that you could dupe gear. Okay, sure. Because you could export and import characters. So you'd have one game file, and you'd import a character, drop all their gear, delete them, import the character again,

Starting point is 00:06:50 drop all their gear, delete them. And I had more fun doing weird garbage like that, like messing around with the engine all I could, than actually really progressing very far, probably because it was hard and I was bad. Yeah, yeah, they were hard games, very unforgiving, very true to dnd rules which are ones which I have never gotten into and never really understood very well

Starting point is 00:07:11 I had a hard time back then they did like uh I don't remember the exact name of the mechanic but like spell slots so you could cast a certain spell like a certain amount of times like per day and stuff like that so I would like I'd have like a mage character and try to start a new uh playthrough and like immediately run through all my spells and be like that. So I would like, I'd have like a mage character and try to start a new playthrough and like immediately run through all my spells and be like, well, guess I'll die. I didn't do a very good job of like, you know, rationing these out through the fights. Games were pretty unforgiving when we were kids.

Starting point is 00:07:41 Yeah. Like I didn't really manage to get into that style of rpg until dragon age apparently it's still like that so in ball through skate 3 it works like that really so that's uh yeah i suspect that's not uh not the easiest game to play if that's how the mechanic works because people are used to like mana right and you can regen it and then honestly in a lot of modern games your man is like practically infinite anyways so you just free cast all the time and it's more like you know uh cool downs cool downs and and using the right thing to counter the other thing that's going on um then then trying to like ration things and and save

Starting point is 00:08:23 stuff right but i mean there's there's certainly strong immersion arguments to be made for like, yo, no, you actually can't cast that spell anymore because you're tired. Yeah. So people are saying you have free slot cantrips, which can be cast infinitely. So your major spells are the ones that are going to be a certain amount of times per day or whatever.

Starting point is 00:08:42 Yeah, it's interesting. People are asking if we've ever played D& have you i have played once oh we did that one shot and then that was it right okay that makes sense yeah we did that with um with uh oh what did they rebrand to so they used to be a filthy lot they rebranded from that? No, yeah, it's not anymore. Their D&D show changed. I don't know. They've apparently had some struggles or something. Their old CEO isn't there anymore, but I don't think it was kind of like how our old CEO isn't here anymore.

Starting point is 00:09:17 Like he's not there anymore. Quest Keep? That doesn't even sound right. I don't even know. This one has an upload from eight hours ago okay it's active at the very least oh it used to be called quest line there yeah but yeah it must be that okay anyway you know i wish we did the one shot there yeah we did a one shot there that's the only time that i have ever played dnd i meant to play uh the dnd football or no that's warhammer that's not dnd never mind yep nope that's the only time i ever played dnd

Starting point is 00:09:49 yeah yeah i played a bunch of dnd in like high school and a little dabbling after that but mostly the most recent one that i've played and enjoyed a lot actually significantly more than i enjoyed dnd is called edge of the empire it's very very cool. It's like a, it's Star Wars inspired. You're like scoundrels and bandits and whatnot from the outer rim. And what I really like about it is when you roll dice, it's not just like a pass or fail system. You know how in D&D it's like, okay, roll the hit, you go against the other person's armor class, and then if it's higher, you get it.

Starting point is 00:10:22 Or you roll one and then you just suck. Yeah, like something like that. something in the edge of the Empire one There's like advantage and disadvantage and the idea behind the whole system is like Han Solo Doesn't miss If he does miss he's gonna like miss the person but hit the control panel next to the door and that'll like open or close the door like it if You do things things will happen you have like narrative dice which is very cool no wait i've heard of this before but i edge of the empire

Starting point is 00:10:50 sorry edge of the um i've it's very likely i told you about it was it like a book thing or something what what is this star wars edge of the empire whoa why is this oh you know what i wonder if they reused certain element no wait what is there like an eu book named the same thing or something i am so confused right now because i'm having a weird deja vu moment or something like that maybe i did like a choose your own adventure book like as a as a child like as a kid and it had like something like that in it or something like you're just yeah you're ringing a bell that doesn't... People are saying that happens in D&D too. I understand that, but in Edge of the Empire,

Starting point is 00:11:32 it is a direct mechanic that is both GM and player controlled. Like the player has input on how these advantages and disadvantages go, which I think is super, super cool. It makes it very engaging, and it makes the combat and even social engagements really, really just gripping, I find. Because if you're having a social engagement in Edge of the Empire, it is combat rolls.

Starting point is 00:12:01 You're literally rolling combat dice throughout the conversation, and if you get a ton of disadvantage, maybe you say something weird and the other person doesn't like you anymore you're driving me absolutely crazy right now and you can do like like and if you try to force influence someone you can like okay no no hold on is edge of the empire the only thing that does this because i've never heard of edge of the empire before no there's uh are there other star wars like games that have dice rolling because I'm pretty sure at the same time as edge of the Empire I think a few other ones came

Starting point is 00:12:30 out oh man this is this is ringing long ago many is this thing that you I mean I couldn't have been passed I don't even know if I was in high school yet like and I feel like it might have been book based or something like you like you just play yourself or something oh interesting I actually don't know but this is this is like bothering me a lot right now is this a thing edge of the empire is a lot newer than that but it might be based off some mechanics from something that you did a long time ago people are like thinking of knights of the old republic I don't think so because I never played Kodor. Yeah. Star Wars D20, someone said?

Starting point is 00:13:07 What? Because that's this... Knights of the Old Republic doesn't use standard dice. It uses their own custom dice, and I think it's super cool. You have advantage, disadvantage, triumph, despair, and more number-based dice. Okay, this is bothering me so much. Star Wars D20 Saga Edition. Star Wars D20 Saga Edition.

Starting point is 00:13:32 Hold on. What is Star Wars? No, it's not D20 anything. I've never seen a D20 in my life before I was like an adult. I didn't know any D&D kids in high school. What about Star Wars Saga Edition? Star Wars the role playing game. This might be it.

Starting point is 00:13:45 Wait, no. Hold on. Stop it. No, not this. What is Star Wars the role-playing game? It's a role-playing game set in the Star Wars universe, written and published between 1987 and 1999. This is definitely the right time. It was slightly modified and re-released as

Starting point is 00:14:01 D6 Space, which used a generic space opera setting. Okay, what do you do? How does it work? Does this look familiar to me? I'm actually not sure. This was so long ago. I know the one that I'm talking about

Starting point is 00:14:17 is a Fantasy Flight Games tabletop game. I know that 100%. It's called Edge of the Empire. I'm 100% aware of that. We're trying to figure out which one Linus is talking about. Five game books. Oh, man.

Starting point is 00:14:31 I don't even know. Someone in Flowplane chat, I don't know how to say your name. Sorry. KWGriff2 said the last time they talked about D&D on WAN Show, Luke talked about this. I try to bring up Edge of the Empire every time D&D comes up in conversation because i think it's just such a incredibly fantastic system and i don't think a ton of people have been exposed to it and it's really really good um and i i just i don't know i think it's really fantastic i think it's also very good for getting people that might not be so into the storytelling of tabletop role-playing

Starting point is 00:15:03 games like if you play with someone and all they ever want to do is combat and just roll dice and have fun playing the rng game um you're going to get them more out of their shells including myself i feel that way fairly often you're going to get them more uh out of their shells by playing this type of game because you're you're like forcing creativity because you're going like okay you have a bunch of advantage on this role, but you missed. And if you don't do anything, it's very likely that this guy's going to kill you next turn. So you need to use this advantage that you have

Starting point is 00:15:32 to try to create an escape for yourself or defeat this enemy in some indirect way, something like that. I just think that's super, super cool. It makes it very dynamic, very interesting, very story-driven, but like role-heavy and high player engagement gameplay, which I think is just fantastic. Yeah, someone said it's fun. The players get to contribute a lot to the narrative.

Starting point is 00:16:00 Exactly. Okay, here's my problem, though. I don't think i played with anyone yeah i don't that i don't i don't fully understand i don't i don't either but i'm like i'm like sure that i did something at some point where i would try to force influence someone and I had to roll dice and if I failed, it was bad. Does Star Wars Saga Edition ring any bells? I don't know. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:16:33 What is this? Star Wars Missions is a simple solitaire adventure game. Solitaire adventure game? Each mission is a 74-page book, start of a story, mission briefing, and the rest of the story. You have to choose character cards, specified number of weapons and ability cards

Starting point is 00:16:46 will be required to use a weapon a vehicle and our ability to check against the skill oh this might be it what is this called again sorry it's called star wars missions star wars missions does that does those look right i don't know i just don't know it doesn't seem like people liked it it's very lowly rated uh i mean i was a kid right like i mean and it's star wars content yeah it was just like interesting and i was i was super into like i was super super into star wars click on the second last image the tin doesn't look familiar no okay i don't know but just because it doesn't look familiar. No? Okay.

Starting point is 00:17:25 I don't know. But just because it doesn't look familiar, like my aunt was such a garage sale lady. Right. I might have owned it with only like part of something. Oh, you know what? No, it has, it definitely had multiple D6s. This is never, this is not a thing I had encountered as a small child. again like i said my aunt was a very garage saley lady she may have just like

Starting point is 00:17:50 gotten different doesn't have a d8 well you're or d12 or whatever that was you're playing with you're playing with d6s kid you're just gonna have a harder campaign it's advanced difficulty it's a feature it's not a bug it's just what it is i feel like that was a scholastic book fair pickup yeah that that could be a thing anyway okay i don't want to i don't want to talk about this too much more uh i this is like driving me very crazy now though because like i have like these little snippets of memory from when i was like eight or nine ten maybe it's like uh like i tried to i definitely tried to like i don't think you play as characters you recognize i think you're like a nobody and you like level up and stuff that's exactly how

Starting point is 00:18:32 edge of the empire works yeah i feel like the designers must have been at least somewhat inspired by missions yeah it's got to be something like that but yeah anyways back to baller's gate yeah hope you all are enjoying it. Absolutely fantastic launch. Breaking 11th highest concurrent player count on Steam in all of its history for a single player slash co-op game is very cool. Like a lot of games that are going to hit that kind of player count is going to be like big, like not necessarily massively multiplayer

Starting point is 00:19:01 in the way that MMOs are, but big like, you know, competitive things like Apex I heard was one of the ones that they didn't quite beat out. Other things like that where, like, tons of people can play. It's not story-driven, yada, yada. Also, there's games like Apex that are ahead of it that are free to play. This is a purchased title. So, big news. Big news.

Starting point is 00:19:22 There's been a few games that have been coming out recently that like Final Fantasy 16, seeing the reception of that and then now seeing the reception of Baldur's Gate. Like I had been in this state for a long time where I was like, wow, gaming's like dead, dude. Yeah, but then it goes to show you it's like cinema. All of a sudden, you know, you put some movies people actually want to watch,

Starting point is 00:19:42 like the Super Mario Brothers movie, Barbie, Oppenheimer. And it's like, oh no, the cinema's not dead. People want to watch like the super mario brothers movie barbie oppenheimer and it's like oh no the cinema's not dead people want to go to the movies released 600 marvel movies in a row and people got a little tired of it eventually yeah it did take a long time it did and honestly i didn't even get tired of it until they started really sucking like some of those movies do not deserve even to have as good scores on rotten tomatoes or whatever as they do the eternals is garbage it is just four hours of absolutely who cares like i can't i just can't yeah um so but yeah i'm really happy to hear it because i had been doom and

Starting point is 00:20:21 gloom in gaming for a while now um and i mean battle bit coming out of like seemingly nowhere for me at least i know they're in apparently in a play test for a super long time but i wasn't aware of that um baldur's gate 3 coming out and just killing it i'm very hopeful for starfield coming up soon we'll see how that goes it's just like there's things going on it feels it feels okay actually for the kind of first time in a while, I think. But I don't know. But, yeah. Great launch.

Starting point is 00:20:49 Moving on, I guess. New topic. Want to talk about your face? My face. Yeah, we could talk about my face. Yeah. I'm pretty frustrated. We've tried dealing with this in private, and it hasn't really gotten anywhere.

Starting point is 00:21:04 So we're going public. A while back, we broke up with Anchor, who had been a longtime sponsor, over a scandal where they were collecting user... Well, I shouldn't say collecting user video, but they certainly had user data. Mishandling. Yeah, they were mishandling user data through their eufy sub brand of smart devices so particularly security cameras were the ones that were found to be very vulnerable to having data accessed or stolen and they they explicitly said yeah we don't we we don't um none of this is accessible online.

Starting point is 00:21:45 And then it definitely was accessible online. And instead of just coming out and saying, you know, Oh, sorry, that was an oversight. Um, you know,

Starting point is 00:21:53 our, uh, we will, you know, we will stop doing that immediately. And, uh, here's how we're fixing it.

Starting point is 00:21:59 They were like, um, um, no, no. But if we did, then it's because we had to. And if we did, then it's because we had to. And if we had to, it's because it's your fault.

Starting point is 00:22:08 Like they just, it was bad. It was really bad. So, so we cut them off. And, uh, what's really frustrating is that they don't appear to have gotten the memo, even though we've contacted them multiple times. So here's an X from Junal amit sorry i'm never gonna get used to that an x is that actually it says tweet on it i don't i don't know i don't know anything works anyway uh here's me still on a product page for them in spite of the fact that

Starting point is 00:22:38 we have told them multiple times that this needs to not be here anymore uh so that's pretty skeezy to me but luke brought up a good point in the pre-show if we endorsed it at some point is that technically incorrect yeah i don't i mean i don't technically know i think if you're not endorsing it anymore and you're specifically saying something that is different to what is set there i think that's extremely misleading and not okay i mean but i don't know if it's like illegal obviously the way that i feel about it is that if there is no ongoing relationship and we have unceremoniously dumped these guys for being skis balls that if they keep putting my face on their product pages that is extremely misleading about the current state of the relationship, regardless of whether I ever said that something was good.

Starting point is 00:23:31 And there are exceptions to that. If I were to publish an editorial piece of content and they were pulling a direct quote from that with the proper context, that's one thing. But I believe the quote that they've got in there actually zoomed in on this i don't know what it says i can't have uh it uses the latest gallium nitride technology yeah no i the quote in there is from a sponsored video so it's a completely different relationship we never really covered their products editorially because

Starting point is 00:24:01 we don't do reviews of wall warts or cables or battery banks. Um, it's just, yeah, they, they were a sponsor and we did sponsor reads for them, but that's about it. So I'm extremely frustrated. Um, I have, I have formally withdrawn any consent that I gave them to use my image in this way and um there you have it anchor if you haven't managed to get our emails which we know you have because you got our emails and said you'll deal with it it's time to stop the time to stop is well the time to stop is months ago when we contacted you about this but the especially time to stop is now. You guys actually need to stop doing this. Someone in the chat said Anchor is a Chinese company.

Starting point is 00:24:50 They don't have to listen to you. This is an American website. Website, yeah. So there actually are rules. And no, you're right. They don't have to listen to me. But if they don't, that tells you an awful lot about the way that they conduct their business and you probably shouldn't shop with them like just because legally nobody can actually arrest them if they if they don't comply with this they aren't they aren't marketing

Starting point is 00:25:19 honestly and so that should tell you if they're not marketing honestly, especially if they have a track record now of not communicating honestly about how their products are handling user data, this is going from a thing that happened to a pattern. They're not operating their business with integrity. So, yeah, guys, stop now. business with integrity so yeah guys stop now yeah that's all i have to say about that i think oh we're supposed to explain merch messages and do two merch messages hey why don't we mix it up luke why don't you explain merch messages well i figure out what the heck is going on with my youtube dashboard merch message is a cool neat and super awesome feature in the LTT store where when we are live, if you add products to your cart, as if you're going to buy them and check out, when you go to the cart page, you if it gets curated and thus verbally responded to on the show. Or if we give it a little text response and that will show up just like that one down below. Or if it needs to.

Starting point is 00:26:33 Well, actually, that's a perfect example. The we will follow up with you soon means that it was sent forward to either Creator Warehouse support or another inbox internally. So we can follow up with it later on, because it might be a question that the three of us don't necessarily have an answer to, but one of those people do. So feel free to use merch messages when you're checking out with cool products from LTT Store today, like water bottles and screwdrivers and new shirts that are on the store. But I think we're going to talk about those later.

Starting point is 00:27:06 Let's do a couple merch messages in a moment, but first I want to get out ahead of one that seems like it's probably gonna end up being a merch message tonight. Hmm. Yes, I have seen Linus Tech Tips Fly Me to the Moon AI cover. I've been linked to this like a million times. Yeah, why do people keep linking this to me? Oh, Dan, is there a way for us to play back audio today? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. One sec. Sorry.

Starting point is 00:27:31 How does this have a quarter million views? You're not sending me audio, I don't think. Oh, no, I'm not yet. Oh, there it is. Yep. Okay. Can they hear? They should be able to hear it. Okay, I can't, but that's fine. No, me neither. You don't get to hear. So a quarter million views on that, does that mean Christmas album two? Let me play.

Starting point is 00:27:50 No, Luke, it doesn't mean Christmas album two. Are you sure? You know, Christmas album one sold pretty well, and now we have an actual store. The world does not need Christmas album album 2 but they're gonna get it uh i guess you know i actually i'm sorry i wasn't actually supposed to ask you that question i'll make sure i ask the appropriate person next time sorry what question were you not supposed to ask me uh christmas album 2 no you know there business decision, right? So I'll ask Taryn. I won't sing. We don't need you to sing anymore!

Starting point is 00:28:35 Freakin' got him, dude. Alright, okay. Three merch messages? Two, two, two. Two merch messages? Read the sign. Okay. I'm so sorry. That's okay, I forget to. Uh, let's see here. Hey, Dan and the talent. I'm hoping to do a study in my master's program on standardization in the tech space. Do you guys have any nuggets of wisdom on why it fails or succeeds when attempted? Thanks. There's that XKCD comic. Yeah comic yeah 14 standards something like that and too many standards i'm gonna make one that unifies them all there are now too many standards plus one yeah so that's a big part of it and another big part of it is how fast technology moves i mean humanity is awful in some ways but it's also super amazing and inspiring in other ways

Starting point is 00:29:23 and incredibly innovative yeah innovation is one of the big ways that humanity is kind of the bee's knees, right? So when you build a standard based on the technology you have today and all the future ideas that you can imagine in this moment, you're going to miss something and there's going to be something new and cool that's going to come down the line, or some new use case that you're going to try to develop for, and new innovation will come, and then you're just ultimately going to need new standards. And there's also just the fact that one size generally doesn't fit all. I mean, I'd say a classic example of this that I've never quite been able to wrap my head around

Starting point is 00:30:04 is why HDMI and DisplayPort have not merged at this point but they each do have capabilities that the other does not and I'll also say that sometimes it does work it's not just doom and gloom like we've been kind of saying here like look at some of the stuff that the EU has done with phones over the last little bit Things are happening. For example. Did you know that while DisplayPort can Generation for generation generally carry more video bandwidth. It cannot carry Ethernet whereas HDMI can

Starting point is 00:30:41 But then HDMI is alt mode over USB type-c Did exist but was basically abandoned so it's just okay i guess we need two kinds of cables ah okay fine you know right like wouldn't it be nice if there was only one port on the back of the graphics card though no because i would want to plug in multiple monitors. Oh, my... I understood you. Yes, it would be convenient. I'm actually sorry that that USB-C output that NVIDIA did during the RTX 20 generation

Starting point is 00:31:15 didn't take off, especially now that we finally have a VR headset that exists that could actually use the bloody thing, the PSVR 2. By the way, I think that project to to make it pc compatible is is making at least some progress i've seen i've seen rumblings of it but that would be freaking awesome if you could just plug your vr headset takes power display it carries audio it does freaking everything like usbc that'd be really USB-C is that one standard to do everything. The problem is that even USB-C is not one standard to rule them all because there are so many different subsets of it based on what's necessary for the particular implementation.

Starting point is 00:31:57 For example, you can have a USB-C port on a phone that only carries USB 2.0, does no DisplayP alt mode it can only accept like you know five five actually i don't know how many usbc ports can only do five five volt two amp maybe i don't know because pretty much every aspect of the standard is optional because if on that budget you know 120 smartphone they had to implement the entire USB-C technology, like optional technology list, it wouldn't be a $120 smartphone anymore. And it's not always necessary.

Starting point is 00:32:36 Like on a gaming mouse, do you need it to run at USB 3 speeds? No, obviously not. So why are we adding all of this extra cost for nothing for literally no benefit to the consumer whatsoever so it's tough right like i don't have the answers but you have a lot of people who think they have the answers which is how standards proliferate the the classic xkcd comic all right dan hit me again okay last one here hey dll good afternoon from australia how important do you think a university education is getting into the it industry i am studying currently but all my employed friends seem to uh be so far in life uh yeah it's not

Starting point is 00:33:23 and i've got two people here one of them just shrugged what does that one think well yeah we got it we got one of these and we got one of these yeah it can kind of it can replace potentially having experience but the way that i've described it is if you can get a job without it, then you're getting paid to gain that experience. If you can't get it, if you're very, very much struggling to get a job without it, you know, this is the career path you want to go down, all that kind of stuff. You can essentially pay to get that leg up. A lot of positions will have like a four year degree or four years of experience. That's something I've posted a bunch of times. So you can kind of skip that bit.

Starting point is 00:34:08 But I mean, if you can get into the industry without it, then yeah, there might, there might be gaps in your background. Like for example, it's, it's always hilarious to me when I talk business with someone who has formal schooling because they'll use acronyms and terminology that I'm like, yeah, I have no idea what the you're talking about right now, but if you could speak in plain words, I probably understand the concepts and then they'll explain what they're talking about. I'm like, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. That. Yeah, sure. Yeah, exactly. Like I, cause I, it's, it was all school of hard knocks for me. I didn't study any business either in high school or in my couple of years that I lasted in university. And so you'll definitely run into situations like that. And there have been times when the kinds of things

Starting point is 00:34:51 that you learn in school, I'm just talking like my life, my family's life, when the kinds of things that you learn in school are things that you may not have encountered outside of school and that made you a more well-rounded person. Like my stupid sports psychology like 100 level course that i took in university changed my outlook and my approach to

Starting point is 00:35:12 a lot of things in life that i just wouldn't have thought of physics for me yeah if i if i hadn't done it like it's and i write like why sports psychology it was like the psychology of competing oh okay essentially and and so we we talked about a lot of basic stuff, like just, you know, how behavioral conditioning works. And it's, it's really changed the way that I parent because intuitively you would think that if someone does something bad, the most effective thing to do is to, uh, you know, tell them no or whatever, but that's just completely not how it works. What you need to do is you need to reward them without bribing, never promise a reward ahead of time, only just wait patiently for the right behavior and reward it, but not every

Starting point is 00:35:55 time. The least effective is no rewards. The second least effective is rewards every time. And the most effective is a reward once in a while so if my kids do something they're supposed to do once in a while i'm like great job let's all have ice cream and they're like yay i've seen people comment on our videos that you can tell from you know the look in minus his kid's eyes that he's like a a really mean dad or something and i'm like you can tell from the comment you left you're an idiot because that's really not actually how that works got him it's like man i i don't know it's just and it's it's a it's it's just a weird thing and like in in in high school i i took no free blocks i just anything. I would take anything that was available on that block

Starting point is 00:36:45 just to be more well-rounded. And so if I had made it through more school, would I be more rounded? Yeah, probably. Maybe, maybe not. Yeah, maybe not, right? Because part of what school is supposed to do is it's supposed to help you learn to learn.

Starting point is 00:37:02 And that's something that I didn't have a passion for at the time and no amount of doing it was going to make me want to do it. And then I learned it later when I had to. In saying all of this, we are talking about an IT degree, to be very clear. If you want to go into nuclear medicine, you should probably go to school. There's certain things. I want my dentist to have formal training. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

Starting point is 00:37:24 There's certain things. You should probably just go to school for that. But with things like IT, especially if you can get your hands on some stuff and you can do some home lab things and you can you can do some extra training. Like if you if you get your foot in the door somewhere and they kind of like let you have a job, even though you don't have a lot of experience or education, and you're able to retain that job while spending time outside of work, like grinding on a home lab, learning things, learning things, learning things, and then being able to step up and like treating that period where you're really, really early on in your experience, like you're in school. So like when you were in school, you'd be going home and studying. It's a very kind of similar thing. You're just being paid for it this time.

Starting point is 00:38:07 I think that can be very effective. So, yeah. Got a comment on float playing. Dads are meant to be the mean ones. No. No. Mom and dad need to be aligned. They need to be a wall that the kids cannot put a wedge between.

Starting point is 00:38:22 That is the most important thing. Neither needs to be mean. Neither needs to be the nice one. As soon as you've got a good guy and a bad guy you have lost the game is over because the thing about kids is they're just little adults and they are devious little f**kers they will get you all right we're supposed to do some more topics now i guess yeah someone in full plane chat said as an it manager one of the biggest things i look for is work ethic wanting to learn and being a team player school doesn't necessarily teach that yeah so like i don't know and it's gonna differ you're gonna run into the one person that's like no you must have exactly this precise amount of education

Starting point is 00:38:57 i don't care if it was 20 years ago you must have it um and other people are going to be like us and not care. So, yeah. All right. Do we want to talk about... Wait, what were some of our other headline topics? Do you want to talk about... The Twitch thing? Sure, yeah. Let's talk about Twitch expanding their gambling restrictions. Today, Twitch announced that it will be expanding

Starting point is 00:39:21 its ban on gambling live streams, adding two more online casinos to its list of sites that are banned because they feature games of chance, like slots or roulette, but aren't licensed as casinos. Quote, in jurisdictions that provide sufficient consumer protection. Twitch claims that gambling viewership has dropped by about by around 75% since it implemented its new restrictions last October, which was sports betting, fantasy sports, sorry, sports betting, fantasy sports, and poker are still allowed. Twitch will also prohibit all streamers from sponsorship and promotions of gambling sites that take deposits in the form of CSGO skins.

Starting point is 00:40:00 This coincides with the result of a report from YouTuber HoundGownGanya. We did talk about this last week. We couldn't figure out the pronunciation then either. Yeah, that's the best I'm going to do. Sorry. That suggested that over 70% of CSGO skin gamblers start before they are 18, and these online casinos are making little to no attempts to confirm the age of players. Approximately 75% of top csgo streamers on twitch

Starting point is 00:40:25 have taken sponsorships from yeah from csgo gambling sites i suspect given the dollar values that we were talking about last wan show like 120k a month or whatever it was this is basically what's keeping the entire csgo streaming scene alive just that i suspect these are gonna go undisclosed oh yeah so like just saying keep an eye out for it uh valve sent a cease and desist letter to 23 of these sites back in 2016 uh and has launched suits against many of them in the past but skin gambling remains a popular uh remains popular and five of that original list are still in operation gambling is also a bannable offense on Steam as of May of this year however

Starting point is 00:41:10 Houndgown Ganya has criticized Valve for the mechanical and aesthetic similarity between its loot box system and online slots yeah it's the same thing which is very valid you got Spider-Man meme right here like it's many players treat this system in a manner reminiscent of a slot machine caring more

Starting point is 00:41:31 about the resale value of their jackpots rather than the in-game value of the item or how much they would personally care about it valve does indirectly profit and you can tell because when people roll a knife and they freak out before the knife even shows up it's like because they're excited about the value um oh is that is that true are knives worth a lot oh yeah why are knives worth the most i'm sorry just because it's rare okay so knives are rare rare things are worth a lot in this context and knives are rare as far as my understanding goes i see i don't do any of this so i could be wrong but i'm pretty sure that's how it goes um yeah valve does indirectly profit from how skin gambling increases the demand for these items one self-admitted skin

Starting point is 00:42:17 gambler looked back at his steam history and found that he had spent over twenty one thousand dollars on the platform primarily primarily on CSGO. He described this realization as frightening. I don't... How did... Apparently, Elijah, like our Elijah, said that some sell for over $100,000. I think he's talking about knives in CSGO. What?

Starting point is 00:42:43 Is this in chat? Yeah. What? Yep. that's wild you're just gonna google most expensive CS go knife ah can we go to your laptop sure all right cool let's go the ten most expensive knives this is on Red Bull's website what the? What happens if I reject them? Nothing, apparently. Cool. Okay. Okay. Features Star Trek technology? What the crap is Star Trek technology? Stat track. It shows on the, on the, I think for the knives, if I remember correctly, it like etches into the knife how many kills you've gotten with it

Starting point is 00:43:26 This has like nine thousand dollars. I don't think this is uh Don't think this is legit. I Don't know they get really expensive. I'll say that much My brain hurts oh I might have actually gotten real answers here we go one second why are we all allowing this to happen wait a million dollars I think that's kind of the question

Starting point is 00:43:54 there's no way anyone spent a million dollars on a CSGO knife it says reported price yeah there's no way oh no apparently it happened what It says reported price. Yeah, there's no way. Yeah. Oh, no. Apparently it happened. What? Reports are that the rare knife's price came from OwnPixel, a famous CSGO YouTuber and trader who apparently served as a middleman for the expensive transaction, which makes me think it was a pump.

Starting point is 00:44:20 But I don't know. Right, yeah. Look how much value there is in this thing by the way sponsored by site go do it here yeah man have you seen the value of jack dorsey's first tweet nft oh is it worth like a dollar hold on hold on let me see if i can find it so jack dorsey's first tweet sold for i think it was like 2.4 million um okay 2.9 million okay. Now has a price of less than $2,000. That's a big yikes. Who would want it?

Starting point is 00:44:50 Why does it even matter? Oh, man. I don't know, dude. Rough. Yeah. Anyways, what do you think about Twitch expanding gambling restrictions? It's weird to me because if this was like 10 years ago, I'd be like, oh yeah, cool, okay.

Starting point is 00:45:07 But now like sports betting is advertised on the sports channels and like on all the boards around it. Like it's everywhere now. It's the right thing to do, but they're doing this at a time when kick is embracing gambling. And it's clear that there's a demand for this content. And I just, I,

Starting point is 00:45:31 I, I, I don't really know what to say because on the one hand it's like, yeah, yeah, we actually do need to stop. I, I personally appreciate it.

Starting point is 00:45:39 We need, we need to stop grooming young people into becoming like whales for these kinds of microtransactions turned into turned into gambling that has become so prevalent in gaming um apparently own pixel is quite against stuff like this so maybe that was legit i don't know it sounds crazy however you know it's um it's clear that they're going to be at a significant competitive disadvantage because of this. And I don't really know. And it's not just up to the platforms to care, right?

Starting point is 00:46:11 Like, it's up to the creators and it's up to the audience to care, right? Like, everyone involved in this ecosystem has to sort of decide altogether that something is not okay. And it's pretty clear that that's not going to happen. altogether that something is not okay and it's pretty clear that that's not going to happen i mean look at look at something even as okay fine we're gonna wade into this uh look at something even as black and white as the controversy right now over a react content that isn't react content that isn't fair use that just obviously isn't fair use afk from your computer while it auto plays kind of stuff or just like eating and not even responding and interacting in any way a big part of why it's blown up this week is dark viper and xk xk cd uh xqc are at it again we knew

Starting point is 00:47:00 dark viper was gonna be involved well yeah we knew he was going to be involved, but I'm surprised XQC is getting baited into this because he's been pretty clear about his la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la. If I can't see it, nothing's happening. This isn't wrong kind of position in the past. But he finally said the quiet part out loud earlier this week to the point where like... Is this in the doc or no it's not i

Starting point is 00:47:27 i read his tweet and my jaw just about hit my keyboard i went okay if you're gonna if you're gonna even pretend plausible deniability i'm just a dumb guy uh-huh this is my persona like if you're even gonna if you're even gonna play that game you you can't just blatantly say, I do it because it makes money. Right? Because that's, no one ever said it didn't. That wasn't anyone's point. Their point was that that's someone else's money. That was the point.

Starting point is 00:48:04 It was like broken on my computer. i'm trying to find these tweets but i can't even use twitter properly so i don't know and and and no in fact um it is it is not covered by fair use and that is that is pretty plain at some point somebody is going to figure out that he just signed a hundred million dollar contract and come knocking and i don't believe there's going to be any statute of limitations for this because it's never been dealt with at any point like if you if you robbed someone 10 years ago you're still culpable or five years ago i mean this is like it's happening daily now so um at some point someone's gonna go hey you know what this is a pretty big bag that we can get over this

Starting point is 00:48:57 but i'm abide my time i'm gonna let him keep doing it we'll let him build wealth Hope he doesn't you know lose a bunch of it In another failed relationship Or gambling And I'm gonna go after it I'm gonna get mine Yeah But then I mean I've been calling I've been making doomsday predictions For you know years that haven't come true

Starting point is 00:49:19 I mean where is the child YouTuber star apocalypse That I've been calling You mentioned that a long time that I've been calling for? You mentioned that a long time ago. Yeah. I've been calling this for years. I'm looking at it. All these family vlog channels out there and stuff.

Starting point is 00:49:33 At what point are these kids going to go, hey, yo, the millions of dollars that you guys made, putting a roof over my head is actually the basics. I need to be paid. Where is it? It still hasn't really happened. I don't basics. I need to be paid. Where is it? It still hasn't really happened. I don't know. I don't know, man. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:49:51 Someone in China is asking, how do you guys plan to deal with the React channel you were talking about a while ago? We just have it on ice. You know, obviously our intention was to do it in a way that was at worst neutral and that ideally beneficial to, you know, whoever or whatever it was that we were reacting to. But it's pretty clear that it's a minefield. And it's also pretty clear that we are, other than the la la la la la la la la crowd, we're

Starting point is 00:50:21 heading into people having, I think a clearer understanding or i shouldn't say a clearer understanding we're headed into people having a more negative outlook on react content regardless of whether it actually is fair use or isn't and that's the thing is where that line is drawn is super complicated because fair use is not a law fair use is a set of guidelines it's it's pillars it's an argument it has to actually be litigated every time and it hasn't really been tested that much in the digital streaming age so we're all kind of waiting for what's going to be the next h3 versus or xqc versus and we're kind of waiting for precedents to be set here and it's happening really really slowly but looking at how the networks are struggling if i'm them and i'm

Starting point is 00:51:14 sitting here going oh yeah you guys are watching you know iron chef or whatever on your stream or you're watching stuff or you're watching that um you know i if i'm looking for ways to supplement my income when i'm when i'm struggling i mean it just seems like such an obvious target yeah i don't know man good luck everybody I don't know, man. Good luck, everybody. Yeah. CR Sin Australia asks,

Starting point is 00:51:52 so if I did a React video on the WAN show and gave my two cents every couple of minutes, who owns that content? Really challenging. Until we sue you, sort of you do, unless we file a copyright strike, in which case when you file your appeal of that copyright strike, actually, I did not sue you. OK, so it's yours until we decide it isn't. We file a copyright strike and then you have to defend your use of it in court if you want to overrule that copyright strike and you have to prove that it is in fact fair use now it usually doesn't make it that far i think youtube does act as an arbitrator in some

Starting point is 00:52:30 of these cases sometimes just kick them out but in more complicated ones they will basically say yeah it's up to you to defend this in court you actually need to you need to make a fair use defense of your use of the content like this happened with uh goat when he was doing his thing on that guy that's making that game fraudulently or whatever I don't know all the details, but he got strikes thrown against him and YouTube just threw them out because they were clearly garbage Yes, so YouTube will do that which is nice Yeah, but yeah So it really it just depends on cuz cuz remember remember what the pillars of fair use are which I? Just going to look up so that i don't get any of them wrong uh so there's the purpose and character of the use

Starting point is 00:53:11 there's the nature of the copyrighted work the amount or substantiality of the portion used and the effect of the use on the potential market for or value of the work it's not just a matter of like well if you get three out of four pillars then it's definitely fair use if one of the work it's not just a matter of like well if you get three out of four pillars then it's definitely fair use if one of the other pillars is really really really really bad then that can submarine your whole argument so even if the purpose of the work is um educational for example which would be much easier to justify than you you know, for profit commercial use of the work. Well, hold on a second. What if it's educational, but you are profiting from the profit? Oh, well, hold on a second. Now it's getting somewhere into the grayer zone there.

Starting point is 00:53:56 OK, but what about the nature of the copyrighted work? was a selfie clip that someone took of them falling off their chair that they just uploaded freely to some site. Well, the nature of that work means that your copyright for it is going to be a little bit harder to defend if somebody is reacting to it. You know, Guy Fall Down, funny. You could argue that this reaction is transformative, especially if they were to do something like Guy Fall Down, and then they re reacting to it. You know, guy fall down, funny. You could argue that this reaction is transformative, especially if they were to do something like guy fall down and then they reenact it or something like that.

Starting point is 00:54:31 So that's where we get into the purpose and character of the use again. Sorry, I meant to get into the amount or substantiality. If they were to show only, you know, the very beginning and then show like where you end up flat on your face, well, then they haven't used the whole thing. And then that helps the argument that it was fair use. And then, well, that gets to number four, the effect on the potential market. If you're actually not showing enough that people can get the whole point and then not have to watch the original video, well, that helps a lot.

Starting point is 00:55:01 So, for example, something that we do often in our videos if we're reviewing a tv okay we will often just have a movie like a like a real movie just playing on the screen while we review the tv probably we will not get sued because the point or and we will not get copyright struck because the purpose and character of the use is to demonstrate the features of a product on which that content may be enjoyed. The nature of the copyrighted work in this case is super copyrighted, super high production value. Boy, if they ever put a lot of resources into making this very unique content. But that doesn't necessarily mean that ours is not fair use because factor three we have used a very small amount of it and factor four if anything our effect on the potential market for the work goes up because of us creating more

Starting point is 00:56:00 exposure on it using it as an example of the the kind of great content that you can enjoy on this television so probably no one would be stupid enough to sue us over that kind of thing and if they did I think we would have a very strong argument that this is fair use of this content because the the nature of of our use of it is purely like positive towards you now you might let's say we were trying to use a movie as an example of bad HDR mastering and how that doesn't look good on this particular TV well then they might get salty but that's in the interest of educating the public about this product but so our purpose is commercial but it could be seen as commercial. But it could be seen as commercial because we are making money on our production.

Starting point is 00:56:46 So the whole thing gets very hairy very quickly. What we know for sure, however, is that sitting and watching someone else's content while you shovel popcorn into your face ain't it. And it's a matter of time. I'm very surprised it hasn't really happened yeah me too but but they also might just be this might be tactical they might just be like all right well i'm gonna wait because a lot of the times you'll see this kind of lawsuit target every infraction and they'll

Starting point is 00:57:20 go for a much larger sum yeah and what's And what's really bad for these kinds of serial perpetrators is demonstrating any kind of self-awareness whatsoever. Because as soon as it's clear that this has been brought to their attention and that they knew, I mean, you're just asking for it at that point. It's obvious you knew. So since you knew and you did it anyway, well, it doesn't necessarily change a verdict. It doesn't change whether you're innocent or guilty. But what it does change is potential damages that might be awarded.

Starting point is 00:57:59 If you were like obviously knowingly, like you're not going to get leniency if you knew. And with how viral this is going, I think it's going to be hard for any major streamer to go, Oh, I didn't know. I didn't know. Yeah, you know. Of course you know.

Starting point is 00:58:16 You know that it's easier to make money by just putting someone else's content on the screen that they worked to create. Of course that's easier. And if it's easy well it means someone else did the work done it yeah so it's tough right yeah man i don't know and like with consent is totally different like i i've explicitlyoud, go ahead and watch my videos on stream. He's the only one who's ever asked. Marquez?

Starting point is 00:58:49 No, okay, that's different. I have not told Marquez, go ahead and watch my videos on stream. Marquez only streams the Waveform podcast, and he wouldn't sit and watch our videos on the Waveform podcast, so it hasn't really come up. But Shroud explicitly is a streamer, who I know does watch our videos on stream. And I explicitly said, yeah, it's chill, dude.

Starting point is 00:59:08 Go ahead. Whereas with Marquez, the agreement is more of like a trade. Yeah. We are welcome to use clips from his videos with proper attribution. And he's welcome to use clips from our videos with proper attribution. Neither of us worries about emailing the other every time. Cool. But there's an agreement there. A cross-licensing agreement doesn't need a fair use defense it just is an agreement

Starting point is 00:59:30 anyway sorry I talked about that for a lot longer than I expected to sorry I know it's like boring for a lot of people apparently it's not that boring people are very tuned into this okay well at any rate good luck everyone with your with your fair use drama and And meanwhile, we're just going to keep doing our thing, which involves actually hiring people and actually, like, paying them to write scripts and shoot videos and make real original content. Yeah. And it's really hard. And it's really hard. Yeah, it's really hard. Ch's really hard Choco Kaiser asked how about

Starting point is 01:00:08 Asmongold watching videos on stream how about it I don't think I've never given any of Linus's comments is about any particular streamer we're talking about the the nuances and complications of the space in general yep but but about, I've never given him permission. But with that said, as a prominent creator, it doesn't really affect me that much,

Starting point is 01:00:34 not in a meaningful way. So if, you know, Asmongold or Moist Critical or whatever were to just, and to be clear, some are better than others. The more commentary and the less of the original content you use, well, the more transformative it is and the less of the original content you used and the more of a positive effect you're having on the market for the original content, right? So not all of them are equal in this regard and not all of them are consistent in this regard. Some of them will do a really good job sometimes

Starting point is 01:01:05 and a really not very good job other times. However, for my part, we've never gone after anybody for it because of reasons that are actually nothing to do with fair use. One, I don't need the money that bad. If someone gets a million views watching my video on stream or whatever, it's not like I'm not going to eat this month i'm not a small creator anymore so it's it's it's like yeah obviously i wouldn't mind the couple grand right like i could i could i can pay for stuff around here with that but i'm also going to be okay but

Starting point is 01:01:36 there was no major utility in going after like every single person that reacted to like the hard r thing good gravy no no and it honestly just would have taken a lot of time the other thing too is that i have to consider sort of my own brand image in all of this right like i'm what do i do do i want to become that guy in the community that like goes after everybody for using his clips a lot of people legitimately do not understand fair use and think that streamers using these clips is totally legit and above board. And they're just, I don't know how to explain it other than, well, they've never looked into it or they're dumb or they just have like a super close parasocial relationship with their favorite streamers and couldn't imagine them doing anything wrong. Or like, you know, whatever it is, right? favorite streamers and couldn't imagine them doing anything wrong or like you know whatever it is right like it's they're wrong but they're confidently wrong which is a which is a scary

Starting point is 01:02:29 dangerous kind of wrong right and i don't i don't need to create that kind of drama where i'm where i'm like going after people legitimately enforcing my own copyright only to have the community turn around and like get mad at me like i'm the bad guy for doing what is legally well within my rights for the content I've worked hard and spent a lot of money to create and like you said at our scale it's not making that much of an impact anyways um yeah but it's smaller creators yes who are being hurt by this in a big way like I'll just sell more screwdrivers let's go come on buy some screwdrivers all I have to do is say that it really does work if I say buy screwdrivers especially on WAN show

Starting point is 01:03:07 you guys are like you guys are actually nuts you guys are just like okay let's buy more screwdrivers this week like there really will is an uptick I'm actually not saying that I'm actually going to say wait until next week and then buy some screwdrivers

Starting point is 01:03:23 oh is it next week it might be two weeks. But, yeah. Wait until sometime. Yeah, don't. Okay, buy a screwdriver eventually. Hold on, I got to roll my dice to see if my force works. Nice. Chad be like, too late, too late.

Starting point is 01:03:42 There's also, and I want to reiterate this point too, there's a huge range to this type of stuff um and it's all not only are the four pillars like kind of gray the huge range of different types of react content out there is also kind of gray some people do it significantly more transformatively i've seen people who have done react content to like a two minute video and the video is like 55 minutes long because they start going into whatever. And it's like, okay, that's, that's one way to do it. Another way to do it is to entirely leave the room for the entire duration of the video. And as it just auto plays on your stream or whatever else there's, there's, and there's everything in between.

Starting point is 01:04:21 So I don't know. It's not, it's not up to us to really decide, but someone's going to eventually and that'll be an extremely interesting day. Speaking of interesting day. Hold on, I was going to say, because so many of these people are live, like six, eight, 10 hours a day,

Starting point is 01:04:43 I'd have to imagine that when this goes down, like when the first one gets for real, like a $10 million lawsuit or something like that, or like gets served, I'd be, I'd be very interested to see if everybody's live and like figuring this out in real time, like, oh wow, I am actually next. And and oh wow if they win that suit there are so many other potential litigators that could be coming right after them like i am done i have a big feeling a lot of people just don't want to be the first like a lot of the litigators don't want to be the first one but yeah we'll see yeah i also think if stuff like this does go to court it's going to be some of the most viewed content like ever yeah because the streamers are definitely gonna find ways to stream it

Starting point is 01:05:29 Oh, yeah for sure It's gonna be and very interesting they're gonna find ways to try and weaponize their audience against whoever whoever goes after them Whether that's the right thing to do or not and the funny thing is like so many of the big copyright holders are definitely super evil even if oh yeah suing over very valid infringement of their copyrighted content is not a particularly evil thing to do yeah like it would be pretty easy to you know turn something around on disney and go you know yeah well you do whatever whatever and whatever how are how do you imagine yourself to be on some kind of moral high ground here or whatever oh i just i just it's gonna be a gong show the meta moment i can't wait people live reacting to people on stream reacting to live streamers who reacted

Starting point is 01:06:17 to content who are getting sued in court it's just gonna be the sickest like meta view ever. I don't know it's gonna be wild if it happens I don't know anyways New time love to see sponsors. I'd love to see twitch plays. Just a streamer. Oh, yeah, which plays defense lawyer So the argument is just this random Based on the first word of everyone's message in chat the lawyer just starts doing some random tick-tock dance and like them I'm gonna start doing it Stream court our LM a oh, that's well well Meadow weaponized reaction stop its is cluster speaking meta if oh

Starting point is 01:06:59 They'll meta that time a slur I'm sure at least one person the audience is like am I am I losing it what like? Why am I okay? Someone's too focused on Baldur's Gate right now, and they just heard that they're like Speaking English I need some water I don't know what's going on you know what's going on right now is telling you about our sponsors of the show let's go by the way apparently speaking of former sponsors uh someone posted this in twitch chat i haven't validated it yet um try hard film zeet said anchor removed us live lmao so can we validate this can someone in floatplane chat where people are more reliable have a look at this and see if

Starting point is 01:07:54 uh see if maybe that actually happened in which case hey that's uh that's a good thing to finally do the right thing and listen live in in float plane chat says yeah it's done that is hilarious uh living also says um we posted it earlier too sorry float plane chat sorry float plane chat that was that just happens to be where i saw it first i actually don't see it anymore the whole bar is gone as far as i can tell. That might have been easier. I think it was just one image. Thanks to Clyde for sponsoring today's show. If you work in security or IT and your company has Okta, this message is for you.

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Starting point is 01:09:30 work. Notion AI helps you work faster, write better, and accomplish tasks that would usually take hours in just seconds. Regardless of what you're working on, Notion AI allows you to skip to the most critical parts. For instance, Sven on the business team utilizes Notion AI to create more imaginative talking points and summarize lengthy meeting notes into a comprehensive list. This helps him save a ton of time so he can get to the deep work he's best at while leaving the rest to Notion. To use Notion AI, choose your text, click Ask AI, and see your productivity soar. Try Notion AI for free when you go to notion.com slash WAN. That's all lowercase letters, notion.com slash WAN to try out the incredible power of Notion AI today. And when you use our link, you're supporting our show. Try Notion AI for free right now at notion.com slash WAN. Thanks to Newegg for sponsoring

Starting point is 01:10:17 today's show. Whether you're a tech enthusiast, gamer, or just looking for the latest gadgets, Newegg is bound to have something to suit your tech needs. They offer competitive prices, fast and reliable shipping, 30-day hassle-free returns, and excellent customer service to ensure that you have the best shopping experience they can offer. As one of the largest online retailers of computer hardware, software, and electronics, Newegg has everything you need to take your digital life to the next level. Join millions of satisfied customers and check out Newegg today at lmg.gg slash Newegg. Oh, we're still there. We're on the Anchor site. The floatplane chat was highly investigative and found that Anchor's just really not that thorough

Starting point is 01:11:11 at the end of the day. Speaking of the highly investigative floatplane chat, okay, we're going to get to the merch messages in a second. Thank you, Marlop, by the way. We cover an incredibly broad range of tech here. Everything from, you know, doing tours of nuclear reactors and, you know, freaking quantum chip companies to, you know, the latest smartphones and tablets and whatever else. Hold on, hold on. Okay, there's even more.

Starting point is 01:11:44 Yeah, we need to deal with this um we had a situation with a script earlier this week where oh hold on someone's calling me now is this is this mr nick light yeah it's mr nick light why does that not surprise me hey um no i'm just correcting chat that you're it wasn't on amazon desktop to begin with it It was on the mobile app, and it's still there. So they haven't fixed anything. Anchor is still not, yeah, they're bad. Okay, goodbye. Thanks, Nick.

Starting point is 01:12:10 See you later. And there's a ton of different Anchor pages that you're on. It's all replaced. Look at this one. Apparently, they are the official charging partner for linus tech tips yeah they're not we don't have one right now yeah cool all right anyway so we cover a really really wide range of tech and we had a situation this week where i got up looking at a script that i hadn't reviewed i can't review every single one but i up, started reading off the prompter,

Starting point is 01:12:45 and within two paragraphs, I had found about, it was either three or four, not errors, but things that were left open to interpretation in a way that could have potentially resulted in someone coming away with the wrong impression. And it made me think, like, what is a realistic solution to this? Because we can't expect our generalist writers to know everything about anything. We can't take up the labs' team with all the data that they're busy figuring out how to build workflows for and generate. What is a solution to this? And it made me think, remember in the early days of Vessel,

Starting point is 01:13:32 where we would launch videos with early access, and so people on Vessel would have seven days to watch before the video would be uploaded to YouTube. And they ended up catching a lot of little things that like, okay, you know, realistically, if we were perfect, we would have caught in the first place. And we do catch a lot of stuff. And we do catch a lot of stuff and we mostly get things right. But you know, sometimes it's,

Starting point is 01:13:55 sometimes it's an editor interpreting guidance from a writer that was written based on a verbal conversation with me and things can get things can get lost in translation a little bit or we can or we can miss things or even problems where like if you put a graphic on screen that was generated in-house sometimes if the first and the last letters of a word are correct sometimes your brain will just like sort it out. So what do you think of the idea of recruiting like a community bug tracker squad? A crack team of investigators? What would a program like that look like to make sense to you? I kind of pitched earlier, I don't know if you saw that message, but a hidden channel on Flowplane.

Starting point is 01:14:44 That is already functionality that we have like i have a channel on flow plane that is not public it's like videos of my bird and random stuff like that that i use for testing uploads yeah um so we can have a hidden channel that's invite only that people could check out i don't know how you recruit for that community necessarily how do we make this make sense though make it like a worthwhile thing for them to do yeah like is this the kind of thing where it could be like a bug bounty style system how do you do that when because realistically our problem is that with the breadth of things that we talk about with the breadth of things that we cover like people are like you hire a fact checker it's like yeah i could i could hire a fact checker, but no one is going to know electrical engineering and mechanical engineering.

Starting point is 01:15:30 Literally every flavor of engineering. Some weird motherboard from 15 years ago. And all of the history of all electronics ever. And that time that Apple actually, they did do that thing you said they've never done like it's it's it's something that can be done but it's something that is not necessarily practically done it would involve probably doubling the size of the writing team which is not necessarily realistic um so how do we make a program like this make sense to everyone and people are saying yeah your fan base is is incredible and they would do it for free and it's like yeah we know that but

Starting point is 01:16:11 the point is not to be exploitative the point is to do it in a way that does make sense and if we had a bug checking program it's like what are we supposed to be writing like 50 cent checks to people who found one bug like what's what's what is a payment threshold for that even look like? Like, honestly, this is the first valid application of something like, like a Linus crypto coin that I know I'm serious though. Like some kind of,

Starting point is 01:16:35 some kind of token or something so that it actually, you know, gets, gets paid out at some point. Once you reach some threat, like I actually don't know the way to do this Yeah, we could we could have like people are talking about okay You could you could find a bug and you get a get credit towards your floatplane account or something like that But that's that kind of screws over float planes books

Starting point is 01:16:57 a Little bit. I just punched the thing that's on you though. I mean I really don't care That depends on what our new CEO sets all your KPIs as so that's on him then I don't i mean i don't really don't care that depends on what our new ceo sets all your kpis as so fair enough that's on him then i have nothing to do with that well yeah i'm just saying it could be on you is all sure i'm just saying it might matter yeah um i don't know like i'll have to answer for the previous ceo's business people are talking about like ltt store credits um you know like what i want to spitball this because the first reaction internally was let's hire a fact checker or a fact checking team. And I'm like, just the sheer volume they're going to have to look at because they're not just going to look at things once. They're going to have to look at it

Starting point is 01:17:36 at the draft stage. They're going to have to look at it again when I'm done with it because I might make changes that introduce errors. For the most part, I reduce errors in our scripts. You guys wouldn't believe. People can just have a bad day. Even really smart people on the team who are really knowledgeable can just f*** it up, like really bad.

Starting point is 01:17:57 And I'll come and I'll be like, hey, I don't actually know the right answer here necessarily because I don't have a background in this. But this ain't it. But this does not look right and we'll have to dig into it together and like that's why script review can sometimes take two or three hours right it's not because i just enjoy the sound of my own voice it's because i'm trying to make sure that the quality of the content is as good as we can get it and i'm pretty experienced at it and it's already not something that i would even

Starting point is 01:18:23 have time to do to look at every piece of content at remember stage and it's already not something that I would even have time to do, to look at every piece of content. Remember, stage three, it needs to be looked at again once it's been edited, because there could be visual errors. Sticker packs. Now, someone says, Bigfoot says, the trouble with crowdsourcing it is that you'll have to have an internal team to filter out the garbage reports you get.

Starting point is 01:18:43 Yeah, absolutely. But that's at least manageable. that's a manageable number of hires we could hire two researchers whose job is to take every report and actually find out like like be the gophers internally to okay someone said that display hdr 600 something something okay i'm gonna go talk to Brandon about this and verify it while also calling up a VESA and seeing what they have to say about it it would take you an astronomical amount of time to fact check every single statement ever made in every single piece of content that we

Starting point is 01:19:16 release but even if you're not a subject matter expert you could probably fact check one specific statement that was flagged by three different like red team reviewers and call up the right people like you were saying email up the right you could probably fact check one specific statement that was flagged by three different like red team reviewers and call up the right people, like you were saying, email up the right people, whatever it is, and get to the bottom of it. People are suggesting, you know, it could be like an intern team or something like that. And the counter to that is like, A, we don't really believe in hiring people just for being cheap labor. It would need to potentially lead to a full-time job. Yeah, like we're not about that.

Starting point is 01:19:46 And B, having junior people do this actually would be kind of counterproductive. I have found over the years that new people can be intimidated and can actually really struggle to bring up problems. And it's nothing against them. It's just it's kind of part of human nature, right? When there's a power imbalance in an interaction, you tend to shy away from being negative or negative or being critical whereas the audience doesn't which is one of the reasons actually that i want to find a way to do this with the audience because you f**kers don't

Starting point is 01:20:13 hold back oh man um yeah it's rough because like i i think I think it kind of has to be manual recruitment or else you're just releasing all the videos early to everyone. So it has to be manual recruitment. So then are you dealing with like applications or do you have someone internally like headhunting? I don't know. Do you just grab current like moderators because they'd be down. Yeah, but they're busy. But then you're putting more work on top of them. Yeah, they're already like they're already helping

Starting point is 01:20:45 us in a big way and we appreciate appreciate appreciate our moderators so and and you know those those guys are usually down for whatever i know so that's the thing putting it on them you are just adding work i hate asking people who are already voluntarily doing stuff because you know it's in their nature to to want to be helpful and you're like yo so you have to limit your ass i can't i don't want to put any pressure on you actually yeah yeah like i would never ask time stamp guy to do the time yeah oh i would never be like hey we've got a special stream planned on a tuesday can you make sure you can you make sure you make it yeah that's messed up on time that's messed up. We need you on time. That's messed up, right?

Starting point is 01:21:26 You can't do that. In addition to magically knowing that the WAN show is going to be four hours late. Yeah, shout out timestamp guy, floatplane chat. Love timestamp guy. And that's the kind of community interaction. You guys should be the ones who are reinforcing people for engaging in the community in a way

Starting point is 01:21:41 that is meaningful to them and meaningful to you. That's beautiful. That's what we want to see. We want to see you guys being cool to each other we don't want to like tell you to do stuff that then then you just should work here at that point right so i'm i don't know i'm i'm not saying how we're going to do it i'm not saying we have to come to like a final conclusion today for how this is going to work, but it's just something that I want to kind of float by the community and, um,

Starting point is 01:22:12 and see, you know, what they think of. And, uh, cause I don't know part of it. What I know is we can set up that hidden channel. We can do direct invites for it.

Starting point is 01:22:21 We can manage all this stuff that way, that way. Cause there was, there was a suggestion at one point in time to make it a sub channel uh for non-floatplane users we have like primary channels or creator channels and then sub channels so like the linus media group one has all of the different youtube channels under it plus like the lcx exclusives etc um i didn't like that because it was going to show up in people's feeds as locked all the time but there would be no way for people to access it.

Starting point is 01:22:45 Right. But now you've got the subchannels. They could not pay to access it. No, with subchannels. Oh. It would show up in their feeds. Oh, I see. But now we have hidden channels.

Starting point is 01:22:51 They wouldn't get notifications, but yeah. Right. So I like the idea of a hidden channel instead, but then people aren't going to see it all the time. Yeah. So like what's the mechanism for them to want to like apply to join or whatever mechanism? I think calling it out on WAN show is simple enough.

Starting point is 01:23:09 Like have a forum or something? Like this is what I know. I'm a mechanical engineer. I am happy to watch videos that could use that. I wonder if an easier way would be for them to just self-select and then, you know, in the videos that we publish because we wouldn't even necessarily leave them up like why would we so in the drafts that we publish we would basically just say um you know audio uh you know io technologies display and if you like know stuff about that then you dive in i almost wonder if we're gonna have to

Starting point is 01:23:46 switch to like google docs too so you so because right now we use microsoft for all of our internal script writing oh and for like um annotating and and all that kind of stuff so i don't know if you were in it there was a conversation today about doing that. Yeah, so maybe it's finally time to do it. And then part of the process for this is that we're publishing these drafts with people having comment access and letting them kind of have conversations and kind of go, okay, yeah. You know, when you said HDMI is ideal for 4K output, you really should have specified HDMI 2.0. And then someone goes, actually, I think they hdmi 2.0 and then someone goes actually i think they should specify hdmi 2.0 and up that's the most correct way to say it because that's the kind of little stuff that generally is slipping under the radar the only problem that i see happening there

Starting point is 01:24:37 so i i i like the idea primarily moving to google docs nice uh moving on from there the comment system thing the only problem i see is that there's going to need to be some amount of like moderation in regards to who can do it and there we run the the the possibility of like you know hurting some feels because it's gonna need to be focused. We also run the possibility of creating some negativity internally. I mean, one of the things that I had proposed, even though I had no idea how to administer it, was maybe we should take part of the writing team's bonus structure

Starting point is 01:25:19 and start paying it out to people who catch bugs. Just say, yeah, you guys keep all of this until there's like a hundred corrections in our videos this month from the community, and then it actually gets paid out to them instead. Now, obviously, punitive measures, all they do is create negativity, so we're not going to do that. But from my point of view, if I pay people to be correct, well, then I might as well pay the correct people who are actually correct about things. Do you remember earlier when you were talking about like how to be a good parent?

Starting point is 01:25:51 Oh, I know. I know. You can't do stuff like that. But there are definitely times I wish I could. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So then, you know, the question is. It's just a really bad idea. Oh, I know. The question is like, well, okay, where does that bucket come from then, right? Do we have a way of, that's where like the line, speaking of bad ideas, that's where the Linus coin thing comes from. Like what is our way of administering this? Like I literally cannot have Yvonne writing 50 cent checks.

Starting point is 01:26:18 That is literally. I think how most of these things would work is you would grow your pool up to a payout minimum. Sure, but then kind of like the same issue that you see with something like a Twitch, the vast majority of people will never reach that minimum. And then you have the potential to create negativity in the community. And that's even worse. I would actually rather have a tough dad conversation with someone internally where I can make it up to

Starting point is 01:26:46 them in some other way you know down the line but that's that's that negative negativity in the community thing is the thing that i'm kind of worried about the um on the like free comment thing on the sheet for sure because if if someone's like uh if if emily's working on a on a doc and sure someone sees that emily's working on the doc and they're like, like, I've always wanted to talk to Emily. I'm going to make a comment saying, hi, Emily. Like that's very distracting for people and actually like can't happen. It has to stay objective. It has to stay on topic.

Starting point is 01:27:16 It has to be exactly what you were kind of talking about, right? Uh, you should have specified 2.0. Uh, you should maybe specify 2.0 and above. Both of those comments are great great but when you get into like kind of off-topic conversational stuff or instead of identifying a problem and then research happening to make sure that they find the right answer and then plugging in right answer it's identify a problem and then discuss it for half an hour because that's kind of more entertaining like those things that's not going to be good you know jack ws3e says your staff doesn't have to be

Starting point is 01:27:47 an expert on everything but if you're going to be dropping information you should double check that information no matter what it's amazing how many things are common knowledge that are completely false in this modern age and it's just a good thing to work towards not letting that standard slip and bypassing it like a modern mainstream media organization that's exactly what we're trying to do we're just trying to cast the widest possible net because i think yeah that's that's been a real struggle is that one person or even a dozen people can't know everything about everything and you're going to have mistakes and we don't want them yeah so so atomic age ace said wouldn't this just create more work people can be confidently incorrect and you'll have to review every blah blah yeah i mean that's almost guaranteed gonna

Starting point is 01:28:34 happen there might even be someone who's consistently very correct and then every once in a while just tries to correct something and is wrong about it that's why you have more than one person looking at it yeah and we yeah yeah moderating it does sound like kind of a challenge i think we'd have to start with a pretty small cohort um and you know the like community management of this is just going to be hard but we also if someone is really genuinely trying to contribute and then we end up like removing them from the pool or or they contribute in a way that is really positive they they correct something and then i go through in my script review and i go this is entirely tangential to the point of this video uh this

Starting point is 01:29:18 whole section is out well then their work was like wasted it's like well no because you know part of this too is i've always seen it as a two-way street right like people learn from the videos and i also learn from reading the comments that's why i read them it's because i will often learn things in the comments right it's the classic what's the best way to learn something on the internet say something wrong and wait for someone to correct you right like i have i have learned more from reading comments in all these years than i probably have oh i shouldn't say that no i haven't learned more than i have firsthand but i've learned a lot from reading comments and then especially doing follow-up reading of my own to kind of broaden my understanding of why someone said the thing that they said um yeah well let's let's let's think someone said why not just make your writer cite their

Starting point is 01:30:15 sources and submit the sources for review doesn't really work that way yeah but uh doesn't mean that they quoted the source properly also the source like sometimes the source is us yeah like what if okay what if the writer were to say something like um display port 1.4 uh can't run at this resolution and refresh rate but what it turns out is that the particular monitor that they ran it on worked out before that. And they just had no way of knowing that that was, that that was not possible because like it was supposed to or something. Then if someone jumped in and went, well, hold on a second,

Starting point is 01:30:57 I'm actually running that, that resolution refresh rate on my monitor. So it's, so it can do it. Well then all of a sudden, Hey, at least we're investigating that and we're kind of going, oh, well, instead of us giving up now that we thought, oh, okay, well, it's a limitation with the interface. Now we get to explore why this monitor can't do it, right? Like it's making sure that we're not wasting our time going down the wrong paths as well. Like it's not that we're not willing to do the work.

Starting point is 01:31:23 We just want to make sure we're doing the right work. So let's- Bit of a community management minefield. Well, I mean, lots of options. Stephen's doing a great job so far. I think he's off his 90 day probation now. So I can,

Starting point is 01:31:35 I can talk about chewy. Um, yeah, he's, uh, he, we finally have a dedicated community manager person on the social team. So this is something that I could see him really sinking his teeth into is you know trying to get something like this going in

Starting point is 01:31:48 collaboration with james and jake and the rest of the writing team but we'll see you know and and and you know what he's been a really good advocate for the community internally so if he sees a way like i'm not slagging him at all to be clear this just sounds like a very difficult task for for him yeah but i think he's got a he's got a lot of experience not in this specifically but like like twitch moderation and stuff like that so he as an as a community member for so many years i think he understands that side's perspective really well a good i don't i'm not saying he hasn't been already to be clear but probably a good person to include in the ideation of this. Yeah. Oh, there's no way that I would just prescribe how we're doing this.

Starting point is 01:32:28 I don't do that anymore. That's actually not my job anymore. But it's just something that as the vision officer, I've kind of visioned that realistically, if we want to cast the widest possible net and want to make sure that we are investigating the right things, well, our community has always been our number one source we're just doing it before publication instead of after publication

Starting point is 01:32:52 which seems smart yeah seems wise yeah okay oh all right well why don't you pipe up then, Dan, if you know what we're supposed to be doing? You don't even have your mic ready, Mr. Three Merch Messages. Shake the sign. Don't make me tap the sign. I was gonna say, it's like he's tapping the glass. Uh, you want some merch messages, then? No. No, I don't.

Starting point is 01:33:20 I want to open this gift that I got at LTX. Let's open the gift. Just as an F you to Dan. The giver assured me it is not a bomb but i'm gonna have you open it anyway i'm going to step out for unrelated reasons thanks dan no he's still there wait isn't it a gift for you why do you want me to open it i don't know you want me to like present it just make sure it's not a bomb okay sounds good i'm down you'll check though right yeah i mean realistically a bomb that size it's not like i'm actually saving myself so yeah i know i thought you were being like I'd be fine. I'm like nah Well if you turn the other way that would help a lot actually. I'll do it like this, just meat shield

Starting point is 01:33:56 Okay, am I going for it? Sacrificial Luke. We need a shirt now. This is fine. I'm surprisingly comfortable in this position Just like Luke in fetal position crouching over and exploding bomb I got it guys get out of here Okay, oh I have no idea. What's in here a creator gave it to me at LTX It's not it's not a bomb It's a little I was a little surprised it's a fan um it's a heat sink maybe it's the box is sealed maybe it's in a heat sink box wait so

Starting point is 01:34:37 you haven't even shown the audience yet luke are you a professional video host or what don't worry he's good he's good at this we can't i can't like there's no like zoom but it's a heatsink yeah it's a heatsink well there is actually there's actually a zoom luke there we go don't worry dan i got it there you go ets f40 fs is this like is this uh so it's a heatsink but is there something else in it maybe it's it's a heat sink, but is there something else in it? Maybe it's it's sealed has it been resealed. I don't think so oh I definitely didn't just rip it. We'll just rip it. It's fine. Yeah, we're at the cardboard Is it because they're my biggest fan no probably not I think there I think Are you gonna name the creator? Wow you put me on the spot like that. I don't remember. Okay

Starting point is 01:35:26 I'm so sorry. Wow you just it is it is you made me say it. Okay. It is definitely just a heatsink It's definitely a heatsink. Not just a heatsink to be clear. It's a very nice heatsink. Huh, but it's not it's not like it hasn't been replaced. This is clearly an unopened box. A prime and floatplane chat. Did you just get re gifted? You might want to put the phone back in is this like like was this in an early video? No, this is new he uploaded a video of him giving it to you Yeah, okay. Yeah, did he like say it's meaningful for a particular reason Really?

Starting point is 01:36:03 Is it can I can I can I yeah? Yeah? Yeah? Is it what what does someone say there's people making let that sink in jokes? Like I don't maybe I'm not CEO anymore or like I feel bad Did I just get trolled? I don't know I was apparently supposed to open it there like on the spot but I was on my way into the BYOC to do I think the beat Sabre 1v1 challenge or something like that did you get a sticker back and you resealed it yeah so that you could regift it again oh okay yeah Merry Okay Yeah Merry Christmas Dan yeah

Starting point is 01:36:47 You're gonna count- No, no, it's heavy, it's heavy, it's heavy Do it you coward All right fine, we're going for it Alright Ah! Oh! Oh!

Starting point is 01:36:58 Oh ho ho ho ho ho ho! Oh ho ho ho! It smacked the monitor! It's okay, I got four, we're good. It actually- it shrank that one in front of you, you might wanna raise it back up. There you go. It hit the top of the monitor. I forgot, I've also got glass here. It's okay, we'll clean it up on Tuesday.

Starting point is 01:37:22 He Donald Dog dared me. Yeah, but that was such a bad throw! Well, I didn't want to throw it hard! It's his equipment. That's true. That's true. Were you gonna dent me? Come on, who cares? Yeah, what's the CEO gonna do? Get me in trouble? Tell my mom? Exactly. Tell my wife.

Starting point is 01:37:40 That's a lot worse in this situation. Wasn't a... The CEO might tell the CFO what the CVO did. To Dan. CEO. Chief Dan officer. So, yeah, anywho. He officiates the Dans.

Starting point is 01:38:03 Cool. I'm not even the best dan at this company what do you mean does anyone have the name of the creator that gave it to me i'm so sorry i feel absolutely do we know what this is or that no no you can open those now too we've got some other stuff for luke to. I don't know. I don't know. No one handed me these, so I don't have to, like, feel bad about having no idea why there was a fan in a box.

Starting point is 01:38:32 Okay. It's a mug. There's a mug. Okay. Here. We're going to Luke cam. There's a mug. There's a graphic on the mug, but I haven't been able to really make it out yet.

Starting point is 01:38:45 Oh. We love tech tips. And it's, I'm assuming them and their cat. Oh, that's cute. All right. Fantastic. It will live there for now. Okay.

Starting point is 01:38:59 Until it doesn't. Thank you for that, Luke. Here we go. Thank you very much. And there's a letter. It looks like a birthday card I do play sports that involve throwing by the way Straff. I played

Starting point is 01:39:10 softball on Wednesday night and I did great Okay this is actually great. This is fantastic. This adds a lot of context to the mug Who the hell sends a mug with their photo on it? I'm Ryu and I do. i also love the wan show only

Starting point is 01:39:26 lzt and paul's hardware have this mug now i don't sell these i'm just bored that honestly i i appreciate it much more now knowing that you were bored genuinely genuinely adds a lot to it's like oh i'm just gonna do a thing i'm feeling bored today i'm just gonna do a thing and you did a thing and i appreciate it very cool rod you are so welcome to join us for softball night if you email me um we would love to have you there we had a blast we had 17 people turn out this week we had a ton of fun we play a bit of a different format. So your team pitches. So the pitcher is actually on your team. Oh, interesting. I kind of like that. They lob it underhand.

Starting point is 01:40:11 And the idea is... Because if you all suck, it's like actually better that way. The idea is to have high scoring games. Yeah, exactly. Lots of offense. Yeah. So the pitcher gets only two throws. Period.

Starting point is 01:40:20 Yep, fair enough. Ball, strike, tip, doesn't matter. Cool. Two throws per batter. And then the inning is over once everyone on the team is batted i haven't been going because i don't want to blow up my shoulder so there's no outs it's just it's more like a pitch limit so you get however many pitches your team has players times two and then the pitcher swaps out at the end and so typically

Starting point is 01:40:41 your pitcher is your like your your slugger actually because you want them to hit clean up at the end and just kind of try and try and move everybody around the bases so it's a super fun format to play especially with novice players who aren't going to hit too far absolutely um tons and tons of offense so the game was like 24 to 23 after four innings because people are just like you know you guys like um man freaking uh elijah from uh logistics i'm pretty sure hit a pretty good dinger um i had a home run very nice very nice man oh man i jake belevance threw him for a loop because i hit a home run last time and so he was all like i'm gonna move way out into right into left field and I'm gonna be ready for this one and I was like oh you don't actually know how

Starting point is 01:41:31 good I am at batting do you because uh boom you said it right deep to right field see you later buddy so he had to run because we don't have enough players to have like all the outfielders playing yeah yeah anyways really fun maybe I could just go and just play outfield or something, but I can't yeah I can't I can't bat or pitch because my shoulders so yeah We did have someone who like wasn't able to run later on and they just had someone pinch run for them So like whatever like to come hang out we had pizza I could run for people. Yeah. Yeah, whatever. Yeah, whatever So yeah rod you are you are totally welcome just email me for those of you who don't know who rod is on floatplane he's rod like of bs mods like

Starting point is 01:42:13 helped us do scrapyard wars shows up for ltx literally every single time tirelessly helps us run the show uh one of our most amazing community volunteers. Super cool guy. PC modder. Anyway, we love Rod and he's welcome to join us for Softball Night. Okay. Oh my god. We have to talk about the merch we're launching this week, Luke.

Starting point is 01:42:39 How did you let me forget to talk about it again? I already mentioned it. I blame you. I already mentioned it. I'm throwing things at people today. Oh wow. No, I'll throw that at the float plane guys. He was ready. He was ready for it. And that's labs web. So let's talk about behavioral conditioning. The reason that everyone started flinching is because even though I joked about throwing things at people earlier, I actually did it once. I am unpredictable. No, you literally threw a thing at me.

Starting point is 01:43:09 I did throw it twice. You actually hit me in the face. But no, I threw a dangerous thing once. So now, when I have the mug, people are like, oh no, he actually might do it. He might do it. I still think he might. Yeah, it doesn't help that you're genuinely very unpredictable sometimes. Yeah, I do it on purpose.

Starting point is 01:43:28 Because if you're predictable, you're boring. And my job is to keep people engaged in our content. If we made the same video with the same formula every time, we wouldn't have the kind of staying power that we do. It matters. It matters. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. time we wouldn't have the kind of staying power that we do it matters it matters yeah yeah I already bombed my head real bad have a bump on it yesterday you might as well add another one just send it

Starting point is 01:43:55 I promise I won't sue you Dan I'll suit dad you hit me with that mug, I'll sue Dan. You'll sue Dan? Wait, what? I just... I don't make the rules. That's how it works. That's not what I meant. I meant, teams wanna actually throw something at. Well, I mean, with that throw, you actually just threw it at your monitor. God, I'll fu- I like to think I'm chaotic good, though. Oh, yeah. They're talking about this in the floatplane chat. There's too many staff in the float plane chat tonight It's making me unquestionably chaotic

Starting point is 01:44:27 Good. Yeah, but unquestionably chaotic. Yeah, I mean the way the alignment chart works though. It's not like Yeah, it doesn't lean more than yeah. Yeah, it's it's kind of like like binary what you are right or can you be Slightly good. I think definitely chaotic be slightly good I think you play your character yes okay but when you pick your spot on the chart I mean it's pretty when you when you write down what it is you're writing down those words you know so yeah you can say chaotic neutral yeah Dan did say do it coward yeah I mean this is it that's not it's literally my fault yeah I mean, this is... It's literally my fault. At that point, yeah. I mean, he is the victim, but it's pretty clear we have to blame him. Dan is also chaotic, for sure.

Starting point is 01:45:11 Oh, Dan's 100% chaotic. Okay, why do we keep not talking about the new merch this week? You're not allowed. Luke... Luke? Yes? I am allowed. Nope.

Starting point is 01:45:22 You can't tell... Luke? US government wants to ban itself from buying sensitive consumer data. A recently declassified report from the Office of the Director of National Intelligence confirmed that U.S. intelligence agencies are purchasing large amounts of sensitive data from private vendors as a loophole to acquire information that would typically require a judge's approval to obtain. They're just sitting there.

Starting point is 01:45:50 Why do you keep calling them floatplane guys? They're, this is Lab's web. I don't know who works for any company anymore. I know they've literally never been here before, but I expect you to know. I tried to meet you the other day. I'm sorry. Anyways, I will continue the topic, I guess.

Starting point is 01:46:11 Now there is a bipartisan effort in the U.S. House of Representatives to amend the National Defense Authorization Act to restrict U.S. military agencies from purchasing data that would otherwise require a warrant, court order, or subpoena. In a separate effort last week, members of the House Judiciary Committee unanimously voted to advance legislation that would place similar restrictions for purchasing data on all levels and sectors of government. There, I fixed it. No, we're done here. It's time to talk about the new merch that we have for this week. We're going to get to a few merch messages very quickly here. We'll go to the Luke cam where he is actually rocking one of the new products. This is, oh, good Lord. I don't even know what we call it, but it's really, really comfortable.

Starting point is 01:46:59 It looks super cool. And it's, ah, it's the RGB shirt in gray. He actually has the long-sleeve version of it. We have a short-sleeve and a long-sleeve version of this. It's just as soft and freaking awesome as the light version of it. It has the same little, they're called neps. There we go. It has the same little multicolored flex.

Starting point is 01:47:27 Your mic is still not plugged in Luke. It looks awesome in person. It's a little hard to tell in photos. Yeah. This is a much better representation of what it looks like at a distance, like between me and Luke. Yes. Then, hold on.

Starting point is 01:47:41 It seems like you'd have to be that close up to see it, but that's not true. Not even a little. It looks freaking awesome and is super comfortable. Yeah. And it's, uh, have to be that close up to see it, but that's not true. Not even a little. It looks freaking awesome and is super comfortable. Yeah. And it's, uh, what is it? Yeah. $24.99. We don't care how long or short you like your sleeves.

Starting point is 01:47:53 Either way, it's the same price because that's how we fucking roll. Yeah. Let's go. Yeah. And in other news, so this is an entirely new product or at least a new variant of an existing product. An old classic has finally made a return. The indoor hoodie is back, baby!

Starting point is 01:48:14 In two colors, gray and less gray. It's not inaccurate. It may not be the most accurate way to say that, but it isn't technically wrong. Okay, what's happening here? Hey, look at that. Got all these great pictures. Got all these great sizes.

Starting point is 01:48:37 This took flipping forever because we had to make it to the same standard of quality as the old indoor hoodie and keep all the things people loved about the old indoor hoodie, but we had to make it to the same standard of quality as the old indoor hoodie and keep all the things people loved about the old indoor hoodie, but we had to go to a new supplier because the old one was, anyway. We don't use them anymore.

Starting point is 01:48:53 And yeah, it's back. It is beloved. It's $49.99 and people, we had literally over 3,000 back in stock signups for this one and think about the percentage of people that have less of a strong intent to buy and go to a page and just like don't bother getting a back in stock notification but they're like yeah i'll just like check back at some point this these yeah these things are yeah a lion yeah yeah um all right so since we now know what people are checking out this week

Starting point is 01:49:27 why don't we do a few merch messages no we'll do the merch message in a sec first let's finish the thing because that's actually a really important topic uh the u.s banning itself from buying sensitive consumer data uh representatives of the nsa have apparently reached out to lawmakers this is great to express concerns about these changes where they're telling themselves, hey, we're not allowed to buy citizen information that would otherwise require a warrant, court order, or subpoena. The NSA has admitted to doing this, buying this data from brokers in the past, and its lawyers have reportedly created extensive internal guidelines for the collection of commercially available data However, some of those rules are classified This is great because I was always kind of wondering who is buying all this freakin data that everyone's click. Oh

Starting point is 01:50:19 Something that immediately lots of money something that immediately set up alarm bells for me on this one Yeah was could they still just work with another company? Um... Because, like, what if they didn't buy the data but they worked with another company that bought the data? I'd have to

Starting point is 01:50:37 hope that they would, you know, try to cover that loophole. Like, I feel like this is... It's a step in the right direction. Have you ever seen American Tax Code? Okay, can we just say that at least acknowledging that this is... It's a step in the right direction. Have you ever seen American Tax Code? Okay, can we just say that at least acknowledging that this is a problem is a step in the right direction? Yeah, I don't know. Between the amount of potential loopholes that I'm kind of sniffing out here

Starting point is 01:50:56 and also just like... If this level of... If information that would require a warrant is out there being sold, I feel like there's a root issue here that we should solve. I mean, there's a lot of information that requires a warrant that is stuff that people give away freely on the internet, right? Like it's... Yeah.

Starting point is 01:51:19 But you shouldn't be able to buy it. Well, I don't know. Maybe the more effective way would be to say you can't sell it. But then businesses would be unhappy. That's not allowed. All I'm saying is this is a step in the right direction. At least even saying, hey, this is a problem is something, which is more than we had before. I don't disagree.

Starting point is 01:51:41 I just got a sour taste reading this feeling like I don't think this is going to change anything. No, you're probably right. You're probably right. And it feels like one of those things, you know, like the problems with things like security theater, where like it doesn't really solve the problem, but it makes people think that the problem's solved. Which is kind of a problem.

Starting point is 01:52:00 It's a problem in and of itself. Yep. Yeah. Using taxpayer dollars to pay for stolen data. Yeah, I love it. Isn't that great? Yeah, it's cute. Very awesome.

Starting point is 01:52:11 Moving on. Moving on. Is it three merge messages? Yeah, that's what we are supposed to be doing for the last, like, 20 minutes. Hit me, Dan. Oh, man. Linus, you seemed nervous for the first bit last WAN show, but quickly seemed to be having a blast.

Starting point is 01:52:28 Okay, I saw some comments about this, too. I didn't read that at all. I thought you were fine. I thought I was, like, I took a few seconds to kind of get into the groove of things. Oh, see, I thought you did great. Oh. And I definitely felt a little bit off the whole time though i didn't feel like it was at the beginning and not at the end a little bit yeah like it's weird doing it live

Starting point is 01:52:50 we the biggest weird thing for me is we didn't have our monitors yeah like we had we had the mics mine didn't fit me at all so i was trying to force it onto my head the whole time that's hilarious but um but normally we can hear ourselves talking and like I can hear him talking through my thing. I can hear Dan talking. So I know roughly what the stream hears. Yeah. There I had no idea. And it's really challenging, too, because for the same reason that in person is much higher energy and more dynamic than when we host the show remotely. Live, I'd say, is another equal step down from remote and just the two of

Starting point is 01:53:27 us because we have known each other a long time we read each other pretty well and we will just step on each other when he's about to ramble he's gonna talk about ai for another 15 minutes and they don't care you know or you know it would be unfair for me to not give an equal um and opposite uh example um he's about to get the entire company destroyed I need to step on this before he continues talking okay there's also there's also yeah yeah yeah we're good we're good there's also like you notice someone kind of stumbling, so you just catch and keep going. Exactly. And so we can jump on each other like this,

Starting point is 01:54:10 and it's not disruptive to the pacing when we don't have to wait for a stream delay or when we don't have to wait for the audience to have a chance to hear clearly what we're saying. Audience laughter or potentially response because we would like ask a question, which normally is just you know each other yeah and then and

Starting point is 01:54:29 And then people in the audience would start yelling out answers which was like cool It was just different and delayed and delayed especially when someone will say something and then someone else is like haha I have something to add to that as well, so it creates this chain reaction Which we're not sure that you can hear yeah it's tough it's tough yeah but yeah i mean it's it's a really good energy though i definitely enjoy it but i don't know if it makes for a better show i got a lot of comments that people very much enjoyed it live uh and there was a bunch of comments that people very much enjoyed it live. And there was a bunch of comments saying that it was

Starting point is 01:55:07 very kind of fun and interesting to watch on the VOD. But I wouldn't be surprised if retention was like a little bit lower. I'm going to check because now I'm curious. But yeah, it could be one of those things that people think they prefer. But then when you look at the overall

Starting point is 01:55:23 numbers, most people don't yeah so yeah i mean we might as well do another merch message while i'm looking this up because i got to get into the sure sure this one's for luke anyway cool hey luke i've recently found myself falling into a vp of engineering position with my company i I mean, lucky. Just fell into it? Yeah. Man, I wouldn't have bothered doing all this. Anyway, carry on. How have you handled difficult or eccentric personalities in your new role as CTO? You tell me, Dan.

Starting point is 01:55:55 No, I... Badly. Wow! You need some training, bud. It's a good thing that that mic is on a stand, because otherwise it would be on the ground. Man, I don't know. I don't think it's really been all that different than the management that I do in other departments.

Starting point is 01:56:15 I feel like our entire company kind of attracts a relatively similar type of person. You're saying we have a type? Yeah, kind of. So like, yeah, I don't think it's been all that different. I know it's a very boring answer, but yeah. When you have, the type of people that we attract to this company, in my opinion, are very motivated, very curious, very driven. A little quirky.

Starting point is 01:56:46 Maybe distractible because they're add-ing onto every single possible thing all the time because everything's interesting and wow i'm gonna do all the stuff so you know it's a lot of trying to make sure that people stay focused on the the meat and potatoes the the things that we have to get done but also giving them some time to do the things that are fun so that they stay motivated and driven. It's not unusual in the tech space to find people who prefer computers to people. Yeah. So sometimes you got to... We got the devs nodding. Sometimes you got to drag those people out though, because it's also good.

Starting point is 01:57:18 And I don't want to force it all the time, but it is good for like team unity reasons and all these weird, boring manager things that I can say. And sometimes that can make really tough conversations even tougher um you know sometimes it can actually this kind of segues us pretty well into a topic that we do have to talk about this week but we'll we'll do it in a little bit but sometimes it can lead to communication challenges um because you know we don't we don't really have formal training on how to talk to people. Practically anything. How to talk to people internally, how to talk to people externally,

Starting point is 01:57:53 pretty much anything. We're working on it, okay? We're working on it. It's true. And so you end up with a really... I would say our team is the spice of life, you know, you end up with a really... I would say our team is the spice of life, you know? There's a ton of variety. We don't have any NPCs here.

Starting point is 01:58:14 No. Very true. Yeah. We have a lot of people who kind of look like NPCs, like the generic bearded white dude is very overrepresented here. Yeah. Dan, you didn't even point the camera to the guy next to you. Sorry, I don't have to. Oh, I get it.

Starting point is 01:58:35 But you should do it anyway, though. What is it? This one? Yeah. Look, more generic bearded white dudes. There's four of us in a room fantastic And it's a podcast The white perspective Okay, what are we talking about let's do literally anything else other than this

Starting point is 01:59:00 No, I'm just not gonna say anything Anyways, yeah management stuff really didn't change much. Same type of people in, you know, interests and skill sets and stuff like that. Just focused on different things. And it's been good. Next merch message, please. Yes, sir. Give me something controversial, Dan.

Starting point is 01:59:26 Oh, let's make him squirm Okay, was LTX as successful as you had hoped There you go. I don't know That is the real honest-to-goodness answer. I have the revenue numbers, but I don't have any of the expenses so numbers but i don't have any of the expenses so there's more revenue than i expected but what i do know about the expenses even if i don't have any numbers for them is that they were more than we expected how much more don't know however i will say that aside from the business side of things which is very important. Which is critical. Like that determines whether we can continue to do it.

Starting point is 02:00:09 The community side was absolutely incredible. Other than a couple of cranky posts the first day. I'm not saying the crankiness was illegitimate. I'm just saying it was present. Other than a couple of cranky posts the first day. The community reaction from creators and from viewers and from our vendors uh like like our commercial partners there has been overwhelmingly positive pretty much every major brand that participated that has talked to us

Starting point is 02:00:37 about it at all has said we want to double down for next year we are already thinking about budgets for 2024 and how we can come back way bigger because uh the vibe is just oh it was immaculate totally different than any other show and that is by design you remember the original pitch for this i shouldn't say the original pitch i should say because 17 was supposed to be just like a meetup to serve the purpose of meetups yeah so that we just like don't have to do them anymore. Do you remember what I called 18? It's been a long time. I called it a carnival.

Starting point is 02:01:13 Yes. Yeah, I remember that. And that was why we had like bouncy games. And that was why we had. 17 had games as well. I think you were calling it carnival back at 17. Was I? Okay.

Starting point is 02:01:23 Because it had like the bungee rope running game. 17 have that are you sure yep because that was at the langley event center okay i have photos of it so fine originally then it was a con-nival yeah so it's a convention slash but there has to be engaging stuff to do and we drilled that into the brand partners because if you leave a brand partner strongly believe in to design their booth they will have a little table with the table cloth and they will put their product on it and they will sit there and they will wait for people to ask them about their product or you get the like oh not to i i've i have lovingly gone to packs for many years um and not to dog PAX, but something that happens there decently often is you'll get this massive booth from this massive game

Starting point is 02:02:12 publisher that is used entirely as hopefully it's cushy, comfy carpet land because there's just like TVs playing YouTube trailers of their games and nothing else. Yeah. It's like, man, why did you even show up? So we told brands, look, as cool and chill as it is that you want to give us money to be here, that is actually not your primary main objective. Your primary main objective is to be interesting, is to have an activation that people can actively participate in

Starting point is 02:02:45 so that we have stuff for people to do. And so we were like, look, we're flexible about it. It can be as, it can be as on topic or as off topic as you want. So like Vesa was there and they had, can you spot the difference like HDR

Starting point is 02:03:06 versus not HDR and we had awesome we had Brandon from the lab there to talk people through you know what they were seeing uh Ari had a cool setup where you could like operate a freaking you know $80,000 camera or whatever that rig was actually probably that lens was probably worth $80,000 um and I forget you I forget if you could film something or like we uh we had a thumbnail booth where people could take assets and create their own thumbnail so we wanted things that people could sit down and and do and and be doing we don't want people walking around we want people doing stuff we want them doing stuff with other members of the community and most of the brands kind of got it um this year next year we are going to draw a much firmer line in the sand

Starting point is 02:03:54 if you don't have something cool to do in your booth you are not f***ing coming that simple if next year happens if next year, which is not confirmed because business things. Yeah. And I'd say that in terms of getting closer to what my vision for the event was, this year was a big step up. And I got to give major kudos to the team because I actually gave them far less guidance this year than I had in previous years. And we ended up with something that was far closer to what I wanted than previous years. So they had just nailed it. Um, there are certain things that I probably could have told them should have

Starting point is 02:04:35 been done a different way. There was a few things that like, uh, not to dog on them, but there was a few things that like, uh, if 2019 was last year, we wouldn't have made that mistake.

Starting point is 02:04:45 Totally. Yeah. Because it's, it's some of that, like, you know, top of mind type of problem. It's not just us, like the line management. Oh, I completely believe it. The line management on the first day, our spec was way better than what got laid out. Everybody's rusty.

Starting point is 02:04:58 Yeah. The whole convention industry was like off for three years. There was communication to, to at least me, that the event staff at the convention had been laid off during covid and it is a lot of very you know new hires that are not super experienced with cons with that level of enthusiastic attendance a lot of conventions that show up it's like industry events and stuff like that industry stuff people are just kind of cruising around this This was like, you know, a very hype event.

Starting point is 02:05:25 Yeah, and there's a... It's a different type of management. There's like a... Man, even attendees, I feel like, kind of bunged it up in a certain way. Like, I went through the line for the build-it-yourself screwdriver at the beginning of the first day.

Starting point is 02:05:39 And I walked through and went to a number of people. I was like, this is a really long line. There are lots. You should go do something else right now. And none of them left. They all just stayed in the line. And I get it. I actually get it.

Starting point is 02:05:55 Because you want to get it right away. So you can get it signed by people or whatever. I get it. But also, a lot of the complaints we got were about how long that line was. I'm like, yeah, but yeah, but if, no matter how many things there are to do in the hall, if everybody just goes to the same thing first and then immediately goes up and lines up

Starting point is 02:06:12 for the next thing second, there were things we could have, man, we could have processed the line faster. Same with like, oh man, pickups. We didn't even find out that the convention center had a special wifi network that's like more stable for POS terminals until late in the first day. That would have saved us so much freaking time.

Starting point is 02:06:32 Would have been pretty sick if they told us that. I am not blaming the community for anything. We play our own part. But also, I just think people are just kind of a little rusty about how to min-max this stuff from the convention center side, from our side, from the brand side, from the attendee side. Like everyone's just like, yeah, we got to get somewhere to go again. Yeah. My group that goes down to PAX, we used to like plan stuff out quite specifically around like line timings and all this kind of stuff.

Starting point is 02:06:58 So it is what it is. Yeah, Gats in floatplane chat says, yeah, it's been rough. Our community just, our company just did our first convention since pre-COVID. And I could tell we were all rusty. I mean, at least you guys still have the team, right? Like, at least we still have our team. It would be really hard if we just had all new people. I would have had to micromanage the bloody thing.

Starting point is 02:07:20 Something that I really, really didn't like. And I know this is like different people have different opinions on this, and I'm not judging anyone else's opinion on this, but for me, when there was the meetups, like the official scheduled meetups, when the time got down to 15 seconds, like, why are we even here? Well, actually, no, I'm going to counter that argument.

Starting point is 02:07:42 I think that for next year, with high volume meet and greet people we should actually have multiple lines so we should have like a literal selfie only line where people basically get like they hand someone their phone they go and get the hell out of here this is the and so on and so forth because oh sorry go ahead no this is the other kind of problem too is you need the person that's like doing the line management to be very like outgoing and on it and everyone was new this year because they're 100 and i'm not i'm not dogging anyone i appreciate the help there's a lot of volunteers it would have not worked at all without you so i'm not

Starting point is 02:08:23 digging there but like there would be times i have to like shout out to everyone in line like please it's a 15 second timer have your phone out and ready have the thing you want to sign ready let's do this like movement so my idea was put the thing you want to sign on the table yeah after you've handed off your phone line up for photo i immediately go to sign the thing afterwards ask me a question whatever don't or don't and then and then we're we fire off but then we'd waste the entire more than the entire time window sometimes just having people fold their pull their phones out get signed in oh sorry i'm not uh on the right oh oh i can take that picture for you oh thank you so much it and then the timer's and

Starting point is 02:09:00 then and then oh wait it's on the wrong oh i'm not familiar with your app oh now i have to change the camera because you were going to take a selfie. Okay. Okay. Click, click, click. Horizontal. Click, click, click. Vertical.

Starting point is 02:09:09 No. There's literally 80 people in line behind you. Take one picture. And I'm not, like, I get it. I get it. I felt really bad. But it's all the other people too, right? Like, it's not that I don't want to spend the next nine minutes with you.

Starting point is 02:09:24 I would actually love that. I would love to have one longer conversation. A lot of the interactions at LTX were fantastic. I'd love to have one longer conversation compared to a hundred meaningless short ones. But you got to also understand a lot of people are just there to get a selfie or to get something signed to, you know, collect all the signatures on their GPU or whatever. sign to to you know collect all the signatures on their gpu or whatever so what i think i'm going to propose for next year is we have a meetup line where you actually get at least 30 seconds to 45 seconds or a minute or whatever it is and then you have an express line for just signing a thing you have an express line for just taking a picture because they my my first day, they didn't cut off my line.

Starting point is 02:10:05 So I got to the end of my time when I actually needed to leave because I was at a prior commitment and there was a huge line left. And so I basically went, okay, I have three minutes left. What can I do? And I was like, all right, everybody get your phones out now. No phone out. You're not in selfie camera mode i can't stop i'm gonna walk through the line and so i basically just walked through the line it's a good idea click click click click click click click click click so i managed to hit like 40 to 60 people in like five minutes and so and for for a lot of them yeah they wanted to chit chat and i'm sorry but it feels bad yeah but if we could separate out the people who want to chit chat from the people who actually did just

Starting point is 02:10:50 want to get a picture then we could process way more people way more efficiently so it's little things like that that i'd like to figure out how to do better yeah yeah um oh it feels bad too when like when you get into the rush it's when you get to the back of the line so it's a lot of people that have been waiting the longest yeah and then you're like oh i'm completely out of time and i have to churn through this so you have like five seconds sorry you just waited however yeah i waited for half an hour or whatever like i always feel i hate wasting anybody's time one thing that I actually found pretty good success with was when I would just like not be scheduled for something and I'll just randomly have a line

Starting point is 02:11:32 form when I would know that I would need to leave soon. I'd tell the person at the front of the line, like just wait a second. And I'd walk to the back and I would deputize whoever would be willing to not let anyone else in the line and then just get through the queue and then take off yeah i found that did not work for me oh it did for me luckily i only ended up doing it twice because i only thought of it too late the first person i deputized was by profession a security guard hilarious so it just like was perfect i was like wow this works

Starting point is 02:12:02 really well and then i tried to do it again it didn't work You know quite as well, but it still sort of worked Yeah, I didn't do anything for me and I even had a rod following me around the whole time just like shepherding me to where I was supposed to go but like People will ask anyway, and I always just feel terrible if I don't Do you do that like if you can keep up thing yeah, I do okay? I do that yeah, people can you sign something something i don't know can you walk fast yeah and what i find is that if i am actively signing something for someone and moving people get the hint that i am actually busy uh i had dennis dennis i think was telling me oh i do the like on my phone thing and i walk really fast i'm like that does not work for

Starting point is 02:12:41 me at all yeah no people will people will interrupt me anyway i didn't know there was like a more staff area bathroom yeah so twice i found that really early on it was great meet and greet start in the bathroom yeah that was a little weird yeah don't do that yeah i would request to not in the future yeah great because you got to understand like we have a really hard time saying no no, because we know it's why you're there. And it's kind of why we're there, too. Not why we're in the bathroom, but it's why we're in the building. But yeah, overall, there's a lot of stuff that I think that we could do better. And I think that...

Starting point is 02:13:19 And it was a great show. Yes. And that combination is actually great. Yes. And the community was... It's a really good spot to be in. Amazing. show yes and that combination is actually great yes and the community was a really good spot to be amazing everything that we're saying right now even if we're like hey you know uh it's all we all super positive we know it comes from a really good place oh yeah we we we get it which is why we feel bad for not you know doing it because we know that you guys are cool and negativity in that action yeah

Starting point is 02:13:46 they're just excited yeah which is great like i don't know yeah it's just also awkward because it's like standing at a urinal it's like hey do you want to sign my right like it's you want me to sign it can you hold can you hold that for a second yeah while we're on the topic uh do you guys want some ice cream oh yeah that was kind of a thing that happened at ltx sure okay so yeah so i don't even remember the context or why i brought it up at all yeah can you do that too he's on it um arming the building on some previous wan show i mentioned that fruit roll-ups if you put ice cream in them get the really crunchy i have no idea why i mentioned this on the show i don't either i

Starting point is 02:14:30 don't remember me neither but i i did um and one of the whales that came up brought a 72 pack or something it's right there whatever that is of fruit roll-ups so uh the the wan show writer jessica has prepared us fruit roll-ups and ice cream, I guess. Is there ice cream or are we just eating fruit roll-ups? I think it's and ice cream. Okay, because I've never tried it. Neither have I. And this might be the most boring part of the WAN show we've ever had.

Starting point is 02:14:57 Or it might be interesting. Or it might be interesting. Yeah. You claimed I would be interested by it. Did I? You did. You said it's like surprisingly crunchy. Oh, it is.

Starting point is 02:15:06 But I don't know if that's like WAN show interesting. I don't know. I don't know either. And I know you like ice cream. I don't know what WAN show even is. Do you know how many topics we've done this week? I have no idea. Like three.

Starting point is 02:15:16 We started it by talking about Baldur's Gate with no actual reason for the topic. No, the reason for the topic was you and Dan and chat were talking about it in the pre-show, and I was like, this is really interesting. Guys, just do this during the show. And then I kicked off the conversation in the show, and you guys were all just like... Well, my whole thing is that on pre-shows, I just talk about video games. Okay. What is this?

Starting point is 02:15:43 We have what appear to be Fruit Roll-up ice cream pierogies. Wait, that's my old bowl. Yes, it is. This is the bowl that you decorated on Channel Superfun. You can tell because it has two L's on it. Yes. That's really random. Yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 02:15:58 I thought that was like gone-gone. Is it like stuck in there? No, no, that's a Tekken character. You're confused. No, I think it's just gone. Is it like stuck in there? No, no, that's a Tekken character. You're confused. No, I think it's just gone. I don't know if it's supposed to sit in the fridge. Oh, you got it. Freezer, you mean, I think, but sure.

Starting point is 02:16:14 We have a bunch if you guys want some. Hold on a second. Oh, wait, should I be waiting? I'll wait. I'll wait for you. Oh, there's a rainbow one. I didn't look that closely. Yeah, noob. Now I'm disappointed. The rainbow one is so delicious. Well, they're like kind of melting, so I guess we should go? Okay, I guess we'll just...

Starting point is 02:16:48 That is wildly less interesting than I expected. It is a weird kind of crunchy. Like, it's not hard, hard, like, ah, my teeth, like I kind of expected. When I heard it in the videos, it sounded like someone bit into, like, a stack of chips. Okay. I was watching the video and it sounded like someone bit into a stack of chips. And it is weird the way that it starts out... I wouldn't describe it as crunchy, it's more crispy. It starts out crispy... And then gets really chewy. There's no way that I'm eating the whole thing because I'm pretty sure this is about 4,000 calories, but

Starting point is 02:17:31 Yeah, it's very sweet. I will have one more bite though. I'm saying one more bite is calorie worthy Dan doesn't like it, I think Is it a little much for you, Dan? That's very strange. I don't not not like it. Mm-hmm. You get stuck on your teeth. Yeah.

Starting point is 02:17:59 I think that's just how fruit roll-ups work, to be honest. Here you go. Thank you. All right. Okay, well, that happened. It was a lot Thank you. Alright. Okay, well that happened. It was a lot less interesting than it is in the... video that I saw. Because when I see it, it's like...

Starting point is 02:18:12 Yeah. It did sound like that. Did it? Oh yeah, oh it sounded like that in the mic. Mine kind of felt like that. Mine didn't. Oh. Maybe yours like warmed up or something then.

Starting point is 02:18:20 I don't know. Like I was keeping my fingers off the like coldest part of it. Like I was trying to not warm it up. Yeah, I tried to only pinch like a corner. Alright. It just, I just, I don't know like I was keeping my fingers off the like coldest part of it like I was trying to not warm it up Yeah, I tried to only pinch like a corner all right. It just I just I don't know I don't know if mine really work. We did have strawberry ice cream in it night wheel That was strawberry ice cream apparently that's like the way to do it. I'm happy that I've tried it. That was cool Thank you for bringing the fruit roll-ups. Yeah My kids will enjoy the rest of those fruit roll-ups because there's no way Luke wants them nope

Starting point is 02:18:40 Yeah. My kids will enjoy the rest of those fruit roll-ups because there's no way Luke wants them. Nope. And we're moving on. All right. Should we do some topics like Kenya suspends WorldCoin eye scanning? Should we do this thing?

Starting point is 02:18:55 Oh, right. We should do that. No, first, let's talk about the controversy that came up this week over a Labs tour video. A summary for the people who aren't aware, someone who was here for a tour prior to LTX uploaded a video of their tour, which included Tim from our labs team, who had been asked several times throughout the day about how our testing is different from our peers in the industry like Gamers Nexus and Hardware Unboxed. He therefore proactively in this tour, which was later in the day,

Starting point is 02:19:26 made a direct comparison to them when talking about how we run our tests every time we do a new video. And the reason for this is if there's a new software update or a new driver that's in play, we always recollect our data for new projects. Unfortunately, the way that he presented it was not particularly tactful and I can see how while he was simply stating a fact it could have been interpreted the wrong way by Hardware Unboxed in

Starting point is 02:20:04 particular responded to this situation saying that they were they seemed I won't say that said they were I read all the tweets but they said they they seemed they I will say they seemed pretty upset however they also acknowledged that they do not in fact run new data for every project. So, strictly speaking, what Tim said was not true, but we don't want to be talking about it the way that we did. I don't think we should ever make a comparison that is, you know,

Starting point is 02:20:41 a good thing we do compared to those other guys. If anything, we should be trying to build each other up. Yeah, we respect Gamers Nexus and Hardware Unboxed a lot, which were the two particular outlets that were referenced by Tim. But with that said, you know, obviously, it's not like we aren't aware of what they're doing. And obviously, our goal internally is to try to take whatever bar has been set by our peers in the industry and try to do as good or better.

Starting point is 02:21:11 As it kind of is for everybody. Yeah. So back to Tim's wording, I didn't hire him to be a PR representative, which is good because clearly that's not where his experience is. I hired him to work on mechanical engineering and actually other engineering tasks as well, which is good because rightly, he's really proud of the work that he and the team have been doing, both publicly facing and behind the scenes.

Starting point is 02:21:36 He also is right that retesting every time is better, and it's something that we're putting a lot of effort and a lot of resources into doing, but that doesn't mean that, you know, other publications don't have things that they're doing that are better than us. So,

Starting point is 02:21:53 so that just shouldn't be the way that we frame it because obviously everyone is out there trying to do their best and trying to differentiate. So yeah, Tim shouldn't have said what he did and he definitely should have provided the entire context like for example um i know steve from gamers nexus at least used to maybe i think still does i haven't checked out anything recently but he would label uh data that was using older driver revisions when he was reusing it um and i know that Steve from Hardware Unboxed clarified that they,

Starting point is 02:22:28 okay, I'm trying to remember the exact wording. It was in a tweet. I'm not logged into x.com here right now. So you'll have to forgive me if I don't get this perfectly right. I think he said they mostly do except when they deem it's not necessary by testing it.

Starting point is 02:22:42 But then I was a little bit confused by that wording because if they did test it, why wouldn't they just use the new data? So I'm not 100% sure what he meant by that. I'm sure he'll probably tweet or something clarifying it at some point. So you can just check him out.

Starting point is 02:22:54 I think it's just at hardware unboxed, if I'm not mistaken, or you can just Google, I'll just Google it now. Hardware unboxed Twitter. Yeah, it's just at hardware unboxed inbox so i'm sure i'll have something to say about this later on anyway the point is that uh he shouldn't have said what he said and he should have provided the entire perspective um let me just say blah blah blah yeah anyway and

Starting point is 02:23:21 i've spoken with him about it personally. And as far as I can tell, he was just excited about our work and proud of the team and it came out. Um, the bottom line is that our vision from our chief vision officer, that's me is very clear here. We want to meet or raise the bar when it comes to consumer product testing, which I would hope we can all agree is a good thing we've definitely gone through some growing pains we have not shied away from talking about those we are we are happy to issue corrections we will not sweep things under the rug um but it's been a challenge like we're attempting to do this at a scale that as far as I can tell has not been done before. And the more cooks you have in the kitchen,

Starting point is 02:24:07 the more room there is for miscommunications. And we have, we're a really in the grand scheme of things, we're a really young company and we have a lot to learn. And I mean that both in the sense of that, the team here, like we don't have a lot of grizzled veterans from anything. And the company itself is,

Starting point is 02:24:25 has only just passed its 10th candle day, right? Like it's, we, we have a lot to learn and we don't shy away from that. Um, yeah, part of it actually is just like the kinds of projects that we have.

Starting point is 02:24:38 We haven't shown everything that we're working on. Like it's super ambitious. Uh, and the reason for that is partly because we want to focus on what's in front of us and partly because some of it is so ambitious that we don't know for sure how long it'll take or if we will get there at all. But again, this is a good thing. We want to be ambitious and you guys want us to be ambitious.

Starting point is 02:24:59 More sources for information means more perspectives. It also means that more consumers can be reached because not everybody is going to find LTT appealing and not everybody is going to find Hardware Unboxed appealing or Gamers Nexus or Jay's Two Cents or Paul's Hardware or any of the number of other fantastic publications that are out there, right?

Starting point is 02:25:18 And so the more people are doing a great job, the better. I don't know. I'm, I'm getting a little bit confused by some of the sentiment that seems to be spreading in the community, especially, I don't know, over the last six months, six to 12 months, it's hard to, it's hard to pinpoint it, but it kind of feels like there's like, uh, there's like an us versus them attitude that's brewing right now where it's like content creator versus content creator like i'm team ltd like i don't want that i'm not asking you for that or like i'm team jay's two cents or i'm team gamers nexus or hardware unboxed or

Starting point is 02:25:57 whatever like it's uh i'm just i'm kind of at a loss for how to deal with that, to be perfectly honest with you. I also don't think it's good. Well, yeah. I mean, for years I have worked to foster an environment where that is not the attitude. Like, let's look no further than last week. Last week. Not even a full week ago. We spent over $150,000 to Flytech creators from around the world to network with each other and to engage with the community.

Starting point is 02:26:38 Obviously, for us, they are part of the attraction of the show. But at that cost, that is not even close to a break-even proposition for us not even close we don't even ask them to do anything nothing is required meet and greets completely voluntary panels completely voluntary we don't even require them to be at the expo we fly them in we give them a pass no strings attached obviously like if they don't participate at all, we're probably not going to invite them again. But that's it. And it's like, that's just one of the ways that we do try. And we brought out really small creators this time.

Starting point is 02:27:18 We tried to just go for total scattershot variety pack to have there. And we got a lot of really great feedback from them about the networking they were able to do and from the community. And that's just one of the ways that we try to bring others up and build collaboration and community in the tech space,

Starting point is 02:27:36 particularly among our fellow YouTubers. Like I've gone to our community's defense over and over. Like whenever it's over anything that opposes our common goal i think is the best way of sort of stating it whether that's consumer rights like contributing to lewis rossman's right to repair campaign or going to bat for hardware unboxed when they were pressured by nvidia which by the way cost me literal years of relationship with team green and which by the way i would do again gladly in the same situation like the the number of people that call us nvidia shills these days when for many months

Starting point is 02:28:12 after that nvidia wouldn't so much as exchange a word with me like literally none nobody um i i don't know my battle lines are clearly drawn we are on the side of the consumer. We are working together to hold manufacturers accountable. And friendly competition between media outlets, that is good. That is what everybody wants. Competition is good. We don't get to say competition is good for manufacturers. And not us. We have also quite literally always,

Starting point is 02:28:46 since the dawn of at least us working together, said that you should seek out multiple sources of information. Exactly. You want people doing this type of stuff, a multitude of them, so that you can see all of it together and kind of mix it all up

Starting point is 02:29:01 and see what the good conclusion is. And anyone who thinks competition is good for someone else but not good for themselves doesn't really believe it. I believe it. I love it. I probably love competition too much. It's a lot sometimes.

Starting point is 02:29:19 But, I mean, how else do we all move forward, Luke? Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, we're not going to stop pushing hard. If Hardware Unboxed retests mostly, why shouldn't we try to do it every time? If they run at 22 degrees Celsius, why shouldn't we try to do at 22 and at 40, both in and outside of a case?

Starting point is 02:29:41 If they do 20 games at three resolutions, why shouldn't we try to do 30 games at five resolutions? That's healthy. And then when we do three resolutions why shouldn't we try to do 30 games at five resolutions that's healthy and then when we do that why shouldn't they try to do more that's to your benefit we're not playing dirty we've literally never done anything to disadvantage another creator i will not say a bad word i will not try to prevent anyone from moving up i personally stepped in to ensure that the fox for example got a steam deck at launch and he did there were two outlets on the list us and gamers nexus it could have been basically a semi-exclusive and i was like yo if you guys are doing anything else you have got to get this guy in the roster and they did

Starting point is 02:30:23 i don't talk about this kind of thing because I don't feel like I should talk about it. I should just do it. And my peers in the industry know it. They know I do these things. So if they can't see it, then that's kind of on them at this point. If my team doesn't know that this is our approach,

Starting point is 02:30:42 they need to get trained. That's on me. Or that's on our new CEO. But at the end of the day, like we're just going to keep doing what we're doing, which is we're going to go hard. We're going to make some mistakes. I'll be sorry for them, just like I'm sorry for what happened here. But at the end of the day, we're all aligned on working hard to create more tools that help people get into this space that we're all so passionate about, help them get the best for their money, right? Like I, all I ask is for everyone to try to remember as we move forward

Starting point is 02:31:10 that we are all on the same team. We are all on the side of the consumer and that's for both the folks outside our organization and inside it. Yeah. There's another thing that's like in the future of this company, it's very possible that something like in in the future of this company it's very possible that something like this might happen again um and uh an example that someone at flowplane chat brought up that i have brought up many times is the blizzard devs yeah i trash on blizzard as a

Starting point is 02:31:36 company all the time but something that i respect that they do at blizzcon is they put devs up on stage it's not just pr people and that has repeatedly over time been uh a bad thing for blizzard because the devs will say something that that doesn't jive super well with the community and the community will smash them for it and i think it's important to remember that uh we want those types of interactions i want to hear from the devs at Blizzard, not just the PR people. And I want people like Tim on our team to be able to speak directly to the audience and to be passionate and to be driven

Starting point is 02:32:13 and to care a lot about their work. And every once in a while, it's not going to go perfectly. And that's okay. We'll try to fix it. But yeah. I feel like some of you are not taking quite the right things away from what I

Starting point is 02:32:28 said by the way there's a fair number of people that are talking about the whole trust me bro situation where there were some creators that it seems like you guys are look It seems like you guys are... Look.

Starting point is 02:32:49 It's pretty clear that not everyone in the creator space handled that super professionally. I don't obviously agree with some of the takes that were out there. I don't think that it's particularly journalistic, for example, to ignore facts, to ignore personal relationships that you have every opportunity to take advantage of to get more information. I don't actually agree with that. I think that's objectively not correct, especially where there's a large conflict of interest. Correct? Especially where there's a large conflict of interest. However, the point is not to dwell on that. Like, good lord, that was like, how long ago was that?

Starting point is 02:33:32 It feels like it was quite a while ago. Who cares? A year? We've made mistakes too. We've made lots of mistakes. Everybody makes mistakes. I never even drew attention to any of that. Intentionally. Because it doesn't matter. I don't want to stir up drama. Well. I was like surprisingly accurate It's almost exactly a year. Yeah a year ago

Starting point is 02:33:55 It's fine It's over let's all just let's all just move forward it doesn't matter Yeah, all right now it's time for us to move forward to the next section yeah let's talk about Microsoft embracing repairable Xbox controllers oh cool yeah they sell replacement parts for Xbox controllers they have posted step-by-step repair guides and the parts include PCB a's that must just be PCBs that's gotta be PCBA? PCB assembly. Oh, that must be it. Buttons, top cases, and

Starting point is 02:34:28 motor assemblies with attached rumble motors. This is, I mean, on the surface, at least Microsoft following through with a promise to explore helping customers repair their own hardware from 2021. When they promised to explore it, I basically went, eh, we're never going to

Starting point is 02:34:44 see anything from this because i mean it's just explore in our defense we had just come off opening up some surface laptop or something or tablet i forget exactly what it was but it was like very poor repairability one out of ten repairability score from i fix it we could barely figure out how to get the stupid thing open um and here it is okay they actually did i mean there's still a lot of things that they could do in their designs to make them more repairable by their nature but this is something oh that's great our next talking point says many Microsoft products are still compromised by past design decisions yeah exactly two months

Starting point is 02:35:23 ago for example hardware technician the Coder criticized Microsoft for the design of the SSDs in their Xbox Series consoles, which are encrypted in a way that makes them impossible to replace independently. It's like, we harp on Apple for this stuff, so we're certainly not going to let it slide when Microsoft does it. That sucks. And it doesn't need to be done. With the kind of R&D budget man the apple ssd thing was

Starting point is 02:35:46 even like actually deeper than i thought i linked a really great forum post under the um starting at is is the biggest lie in tech there's a really great post on the forum that goes into how very different apple's ssd architecture is pretty much all of it is completely unnecessary like literally completely unnecessary but over complicates it and makes it proprietary because why use a wheel that exists when you can reinvent the crap out of your own and make it the wheelest wheel that is different from the other wheels this one's got spokes if the amount of resources that companies like apple and microsoft dedicate to making their devices less repairable instead went to making them more repairable how much better of a place would the world be a plug- PlayStation says, wasn't this just in a GameLinked video?

Starting point is 02:36:46 Yes. The WAN show is late news from white guys with beards. It's not even really news. I mean, it's right in the name, new. It's not new. The WAN show has always been like that. Yeah, I mean, they're probably right to trash on them for certain things but they did a cool thing thank you it's good this is cool all

Starting point is 02:37:15 right Microsoft also got called out for their negligent cyber security practices I mean is this is this that interesting this is kind of a readdress of a previous topic yeah ooh China proposes extreme limits for children's internet access though We've talked a fair bit about this recently, but the cyberspace administration of China appropriately named CAC has proposed new regular new regulations harshly limiting internet use among minors 16 to 18 year olds so barely even, would be allowed two hours of internet access per day, one hour for 8 to 16-year-olds, and 40 minutes for kids under 8.

Starting point is 02:37:53 Access for minors will also be banned between 10 p.m. and 6 a.m. Man, I wasn't going to bed at 10 p.m. when I was 17. Are you kidding me? In an official statement, the CAC said that the regulations are to help miners reduce internet addiction and the influence of bad information Oh man So yeah the stocks of several tech firms including Tencent and ByteDance fell sharply following the announcement and that's pretty uncool Oh, oh This is a really great video definitive mac upgrade guide is the name of this channel and he posted an absolutely

Starting point is 02:38:37 amazing review that's not it gosh darn it there it is amazing review of the ltt backpack not it gosh darn it there it is amazing review of the ltt backpack he doesn't say that everything is positive which he shouldn't because it's a review i want nothing more than actual honest impressions of it but he seems to be really happy with his and oh dan can you uh nuke us in the corner here for a sec just just very briefly and what i really love about this is he's actually been using the darn thing for nine months so he includes a lot of really good insights into what it's like to use the bag anyway that was all i have to say about that that's all the content that i'll be showing was that react content no i don't think so because we didn't even have the audio playing oh shoot dan was, Dan, was I talking over audio?

Starting point is 02:39:26 No. Oh, good. The video is funny. Thanks, Dan. Good job. And I'm saying, I think you'll be really interested in what he has to say, which I haven't shown you. So if anything, I think we are having a positive impact on the market for this content. Should we do more?

Starting point is 02:39:44 Oh, okay. Yeah, should we do that? oh okay yeah should we do that yeah we should probably do this we got we got called out a little bit yeah it's time for some oh this is so stupid like what a piece of crap site this is now i'm not signed in so that's probably why yeah but like really is that like i do is anyone signed into x.com wait what it didn't redirect to x.com hmm what the crap what if i just do this will it work what X is redirecting to Twitter did what is this it might it might get it wait did XCOM ever I don't know I know the app name changed yeah but wait isn't the app name not really no X but wait isn't the app name not No, XCOM redirects to Twitter is never the other way around. Oh, okay

Starting point is 02:40:53 Did you hear that Apple's apparently not letting them just they don't allow one? one One character app names, so they're just it's still called Twitter on Great that's pretty sick., Apple apparently made an exception. Okay. All right. I thought they did. Okay. But I wasn't sure if that was Google Play or what.

Starting point is 02:41:10 Well, at any rate, well, I kind of wanted to react to Ludwig's thing. Oh, wait. No, this is on YouTube. Okay. Ludwig responds. Let's get some audio. Are we going to be able to hear it? It's a really cool setup.

Starting point is 02:41:22 I frag on it. Can we? I can hear you, little bitch. Don't ever think you can see. Oh, okay. are we going to be able to hear it? It's a really cool setup. Can we? Oh, okay. See me in Counter-Strike. Nice computer setup. Dude, I would torch Linus in, I think, any game. I don't think there is a

Starting point is 02:41:37 game Linus gaps me in. Maybe I'm underestimating his boomer energy and he giga gaps me in like Civ 6 or some shit, but... Oh. Okay. He reacted to us reacting to his setup. And you know, he made some somewhat fair comments.

Starting point is 02:41:59 He made some somewhat fair points. We teased him for his giant key, which he apparently got for doing charity work. Which is like awesome and sorry is pretty cool but did he just call did he just describe me as having boomer energy yeah you usually say dragon how does it feel hearing boomer yeah i'm not sure i'm not sure how i feel about that um i'm gonna have to have a little nap um eat some eat some bran flakes some fiber have a little think about it while i'm on the can working on things for a while yeah yeah yeah yeah maybe come to conclusions when you wake up in the middle of the night and go to the washroom

Starting point is 02:42:40 yeah i um room yeah I um all right Ludwig challenge accepted sir I get to name the game you guys feel free to let him know I accept his challenge in fact in fact I will I would like to make it five games I will only take a small advantage since you said you could beat me at any game, and I will choose only three of them. How about that? He gets to pick two of the games. Oh. I mean, I want to make it interesting.

Starting point is 02:43:15 Yeah, but he's just going to pick things that he has, like, tons of experience in and just smash. So am I. Oh, that's an alarm to do something when I definitely will have to be for sure at home Haha, what time is it? Don't look nice sick. Okay, so are you gonna pick the games now? Ooh, that's risky because it gives them time to train up. Well, I'm risky obviously going to take beat saber because yeah It'll be funny watching him get absolutely fucking annihilated. I don't know if he plays. I mean, I don't know. Maybe he plays a bunch.

Starting point is 02:43:50 Am I good at anything else? See, this is tough. I mean, I could just, yeah, I mean, I could go full Boomer Energy. I'm not good at Civ, but you play Anno 1800 with me and I will wipe the floor with you. Can you play that competitively? Yeah, you can. Yeah, you can you play that competitively yeah you can yeah

Starting point is 02:44:05 you can play versus 100 that'll be a long game he could train for like two months and i would still destroy that is actually probably true um what about like uh mario what is that mario kart battles with the balloons oh like mario kart 64 battle mode? Yeah, I would wreck him. But, but, actually there's a lot of minor VGA. I would win at that, but that's a stupid game. We're not going to play that. We've got, oh, Supreme Commander. Okay, but I'm not going to pick two RTSs. Yeah, Supreme Commander, he wouldn't even manage to get any units built.

Starting point is 02:44:42 Like, that's... Maybe practice, he'd get some units built. You can build units very quickly. You know what? Subcom is a shorter round than Nano 1800. I'm taking Subcom. Okay, but it has to be FAF Subcom. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 02:44:56 Yeah, yeah. Yeah, Fortune Alliance forever. Okay, so my games. Beat Saber, Fortune Alliance forever, and some people are suggesting left for dead too do we each put together a squad and do we make one a team game because i'm super down i've got i think i could put together a pretty crack left for dead two squad i don't know that you'd be on it i know i'm sitting here thinking like i need to practice I know at least two one person for sure yeah is in I could I could put together a pretty good left 4 dead 2 squad

Starting point is 02:45:33 Chase like immediately in chat. I'm in and even though he's watching. I know you're in chase. Don't worry the in That's that's why I brought out my phone that alarm was fake. I was like texting Chase. I'm like, yo, dog. Yo. I need a ringer. Let's go. Yeah, but you got to be careful here. Because if you set up him to be able to form a team,

Starting point is 02:45:55 he might just get like pro players. I'm going to bring in Chase. I'm going to bring in Joe. Okay. Like, whatever. I don't know. I think he's pretty Okay. Like, whatever. I don't know. I think he's pretty good.

Starting point is 02:46:08 Okay, whatever. We'll have me and Chase. We'll figure out the other two. I also don't think he's even gonna take this seriously at all. He's probably gonna have, like, his mother on his team, so. I don't know, man. I don't know. I think you're underestimating the competitive nature of successful YouTubers.

Starting point is 02:46:23 Ah, yeah, that's fair hmm okay well I haven't finalized my third doesn't have to be people from your respective teams is that one way to do it ooh so mogul versus Linus yeah group yeah yeah that would actually make it more because then Joe's out he has an East no he isn't oh Oh, it's that Joe? Is that what you're thinking of? I actually didn't know that. Joe we game with is that Joe? You didn't know that?

Starting point is 02:46:52 No, I thought Joe was just a friend of yours. That is hilarious. Have I ever- Really? Yeah, all this time. Whoa! I thought Joe was just like your buddy Joe. And you also had someone who works on your team named Joe.

Starting point is 02:47:13 You've met him a bunch of times in real life and didn't put it together. Wow. Wow, that is the worst thing that has ever happened to me. That's very funny. That's actually, like, actually very funny.

Starting point is 02:47:28 We have gamed together for, like, tens of hours. Like, not an insignificant amount of time. Over the course of years. And when you consider, like, multiple, not two years. Like, years, years. When you consider how much I game overall it's a very he's one of my main gaming buddies at this point Yeah, and I had no idea he worked for me Our CEO everybody oh man

Starting point is 02:48:00 Wow, that's actually very funny Don't show Joe this okay. He's gonna see it. Dang it. Okay, so the mogul team has an esports team. So the one friend I thought I had is a paid friend again. Mogul esports, what do they play? Mogul games group? I don't think that's it. All right. Valorant? They play Valorant. They play a shooter game.

Starting point is 02:48:37 He has an esports team that plays a shooter game. Okay, that might be risky. What games did I pick already? I picked Supreme Commander, Forged Alliance. Subcom is a good one. And I picked Beat Forged Alliance. Subcom is a good one. Beat Saber is a good one. Okay, okay. Moist Moguls. Oh, right, because it's a collaboration thing.

Starting point is 02:48:55 Oh, okay. Oh, that's super cool. I don't follow stuff like this. All right, you know what? I think we do have to decide on a third. I think that if I just kind of go, oh, well, I'll decide later, that's going to be kind of cheesy.

Starting point is 02:49:09 Okay. Do I have... Okay, can you think of anything else I'm good at? I don't want to pick something from the same genre because I'm pretty sure that he doesn't have the attention span to play any RTS games. So, like, if I... I feel like you could do...

Starting point is 02:49:21 I can just pick something old. Super Mario Bros. OG speedrun. First five levels or something. It's gotta be 1v1. It can't be... I could probably win Super Mario Bros. 3 battle mode, though. You know, the one with the, like, POW thing in the middle? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 02:49:37 Like, I'm pretty good. I'm overall a pretty good platformer player, and he would have to play a fair bit against people who are actually good at it to like be good at it. There's no AI. Yep. And 64Gold and I say people

Starting point is 02:49:56 yeah sure let's do some pilot wings challenges. Let's play Wii Sports. I will f*** you up at Wii Sports. Like actually good. That could be kind of fun, actually. That could be kind of fun. We could play some Wii Sports.

Starting point is 02:50:11 Yeah. Some people said Halo CE, but you'd need, like, a large team to make that work. Yeah. That might be kind of annoying. Yeah, that, like, it's an old game, but it's, like, it's old in a lot of good ways, but it's also old in some bad ways. Like the netcode sucks. Yeah. We ran into that at the LAN, even though everyone's...

Starting point is 02:50:30 Skipping, teleporting flags, teleporting people. Yeah. Yeah. Especially teleporting warthogs that are flying through the air, which can be very disorienting. Yeah. Bubble hockey. Yeah. I fly them out here to play Super Chex bubble hockey for the last one.

Starting point is 02:50:45 That would be actually pretty great. Yeah, but that him out here to play Super Chex bubble hockey for the last one. That would be actually pretty great. Yeah, but that's not really a video game. Did he say video game? I don't know. Hmm. Did he say video game? Because, again, I would f*** him up at bubble hockey. The text in here says any game.

Starting point is 02:50:58 Interesting. Hold on, I'm going to listen to it again. You ready, Dan? I'm trying. Do you want it to go to stream no let's try that no you it has to go to stream okay fine send it to stream that's fine i would i would torch linus in i think any game i don't think there is a really oh well now things are getting really interesting super checks super checks bubble Super Chex Bubble Hockey.

Starting point is 02:51:26 Does he have a chance? If we do, like, a best of seven series, he would have to beat me four times out of seven. I don't think so, because there's certain tactics that Linus employs, which I don't feel like I have to mention, that are quite strong. Any game. Yeah, it could be badminton, for all we know. That's a sport. That's not a game. No, you know what? No, not badminton for all we know that's a sport that's not a game no you know what no not badminton okay i still have to play marquez he like challenged me ages ago

Starting point is 02:51:53 um well not challenged me but like said yeah that would be fun like his his community yeah yeah the uh the chat's like badminton badminton badminton yeah, that doesn't that doesn't really make sense PC building simulator what if he can't what if he count that's a little on the nose I think you think so what if he like you could do it, but I feel like it's a little on the nose Yeah, maybe as like a bonus round fun thing What if he counters the terms? Hmm, I think my terms are fair. He said he could gap me in any game. I mean, the fact that I'm letting him pick anything, I think is fairly magnanimous of me. Okay.

Starting point is 02:52:34 All right. Yes, I pulled out that word. Just- just whipped it out there. All right. Well, fair enough. Um... Is Crapyard Wars a game? Hmm. Interesting.

Starting point is 02:52:50 It's a game show. Worms Armageddon. Oh, that'd be kind of fun. I suck at it, though. I do kind of want to pick stuff that I'm good at. People are saying he's going to pick chess. Yeah. I'm going to lose at that.

Starting point is 02:53:08 I can barely beat my 10-year like for real we played twice and he won once and i barely like snuck a checkmate the other time just because it was a tactic he hadn't seen before um like you know when you castle there's that sort of problem with castling where if they can get their queen in there with anything backing her, you are done. You haven't moved a pawn up, so you don't have an escape route. Yeah, it's instant checkmate. He just hadn't seen it before, and so I, like, was way down. He had, like, three more meaningful pieces than I did, but I was like, see you later.

Starting point is 02:53:41 He immediately asked for a rematch and immediately annihilated me. See you later. He immediately asked for a rematch and immediately annihilated me. So you should play him sometime because you kind of know how to play. And he does the same thing as you where he just plays challenges. He doesn't really play full game. So you guys are both sort of handicapped in the same way. Yeah, neither of us know openings at all.

Starting point is 02:53:59 Perfect. We'll just like fumble our way into the mid game and then figure out how to do things. I'm going to go with Wii Golf we golf we sports golf okay you're not doing like a multi-sport challenge oh i'll do a multi-sport challenge i just figured we're already playing five games at this point like we sure we can do them i'll beat them at bowling i'll beat them at golf and then i'll beat them at tennis i don't care i there are a few videos that i've wanted to watch as much as what this one is going to turn into if it turns into anything I'm assuming it will all right that's my uh that's my gauntlet I'm actually pretty good at overcooked too but no no you you need a good team for overcooked that's not like yeah okay so what were what were the three? Forged Alliance, Beat Saber, and Wii Golf. There you go, Ludwig.

Starting point is 02:54:46 Gap me at any of those. I dare you. Are you going to practice at all? Knowing that I bet you he would. I have no idea, to be honest. I'm just saying that. I think the rule should be that you don't get to practice the games you propose. But I can practice the games he proposes and he can practice my

Starting point is 02:55:05 games that seems cool that I think that's kind of fair because it's basically supposed to be like I am like so good at this that you don't even possibly hope to beat me yeah and if you are in a position where you could gig a gap someone yeah you shouldn't need to practice yeah I don't need to practice

Starting point is 02:55:21 any of those you are going to like not even be close in fact I would say don't even't need to practice any of those you are going to like not even be close in fact I would say don't even bother trying to practice forged alliance. I was gonna say for sure Beat Saber, I think there's a lot of learning that could be done There's a lot. There's a lot actually beat Saber is a challenging one though. What maps would we play? Yeah Yeah, because I did have someone beat me at ltx on a map i had never seen i was gonna say there's a lot of like you need to be able to anticipate things barely beat me it was like

Starting point is 02:55:51 700 000 to 697 000 or something like that it was very close yeah yeah and i had never seen the map and it was their choice of map so i i i did lose the challenge saying crab rave but i feel like you would just get perfect um i don't think i've ever 100% of crab rave i don't actually i really enjoyed playing it earlier on when i was not very good yet and so i have never actually 100% at expert plus and there's more than just 100%ing you also have to slice in the correct direction and you have to slice right down the middle of the block so it's by score I could get a perfect crab rave that's probably not even double S. Because all that block combos do is they increase your score multiplier. You still have to actually score a lot of points when you strike the block.

Starting point is 02:56:38 Yeah. Caramel Danson would be my vote. Some people are saying LTT intro. Yeah, yeah, we could do Supernova. I'd play Supernova, no problem. I haven't played that in a long time, but I am familiar with it, so if he practiced up,

Starting point is 02:56:56 maybe there's a chance that he could not lose completely embarrassingly. All right, I think it's time to switch to WAN Show after dark. Is there any other topics we need to blast through before we go? I don't know. alright I think it's time to switch to WAN show after dark any other topics we need to blast through before we go I don't know particularly any that we called it at the beginning of the show yeah I don't know

Starting point is 02:57:13 I don't think so I think we're good Dan he's got this don't worry good old Dan he just called you old what what have I hurt my back and walk under the camera He just called you old What? What?

Starting point is 02:57:28 Have I heard my dad can walk under the camera? Let me go turn off the lantern Alright, goodbye Dave We had DMX control Was it 8%? Oh man, people have been People have been messaging me Nick says bring in Shroud as a ringer that's what

Starting point is 02:57:46 i'm saying like i don't think it should be able to be yeah that's stupid it's gotta be teams if there's any uh team games yeah just like hey cory remember that one time we met when we did that video um guess what you're on my overwatch squad now come on that's just stupid yeah Yeah. Okay. Dan, we got some stuff to talk about. Some merch messages. I think I got a couple here for you. Hit me. Let's get into position.

Starting point is 02:58:14 Here we are. Assume the position. I am assuming the position. Okay, here we go. LMG plus LDT equals nah. LLD equals yay. Luke, I hear you talking about all these self-made recipes that sound delicious would you ever consider making a cookbook full of them oh also the stick locks are good fidget toys luke's cookbook would be literally a one-pager it would be make chicken get laid

Starting point is 02:58:40 i mean that makes sensual chicken is part of the recipe okay you know so your cookbook is not actually how to make food made with love it's it's how to be like a toxic rephrase that sphere influencer with chicken there's food involved it's funny because I was trying to think if there's any like you know signature recipe things that i have that don't involve chicken but they literally all do are there any signature recipes you have no there's one there's one there's one okay yeah it's turkey it's a it's a blt oh my god i used to make high school. A BLT is not a signature recipe. No, it was cool. I put like probably eight times the amount of lettuce people normally do. Was it inside out? Okay. And it was on a blueberry bun. Does that make sense? No. No, that actually sounds horrible. It's what was available. I was in high school. Okay, that's not a recipe.

Starting point is 02:59:40 Yeah? And that definitely won't get you laid. Well, when you're padding out a recipe bun. recipe yeah and that definitely when you're padding out a recipe well we're at two pages you gotta why are you stuck up with four kinds of cheese an entire bottle of red hot mac and cheese with cheese and ketchup oh fancy fancy that's yeah no um yeah i really don't have enough to do that i have a short list that I continuously go back to, and that's about it. Okay. Oh, boy. Hello, DLL.

Starting point is 03:00:12 If direct storage takes off, do you think this will change GPU architecture, and if so, how? Man, the only thing I can really think of is them trying to get away with putting less VRAM on their cards. I don't think you can add less to them now. Yeah, so there's that. Do you see the rumors?

Starting point is 03:00:32 And they're very much rumors. But do you see the rumors? NVIDIA is basically not bothering to produce 40 series at this point. And they're just trying to shift all of their production, all of their fab time to AI cards. It's one of those rumors where it is not confirmed at all, but it's like... Yep. Hey. That makes sense.

Starting point is 03:00:51 This thing makes way more money right now. Maybe we should make more of it. And there is completely an unhinged level of demand for it. Meanwhile, your consumers in this business unit absolutely hate your guts and your products are lame. Um, yeah. Anywho. Yep. Hi DLL. I just finished an internship working on detecting and analyzing defects in transistors at NIST. Question. Any thoughts on Microsoft pushing ARM adoption faster to catch up to Apple

Starting point is 03:01:27 on battery life? There's only so much Microsoft can do, right? It's like developers, developers, developers. They're so reliant on the ecosystem and the ecosystem

Starting point is 03:01:36 has such a long tail. Like it's such a big ship and it's hard to move. I don't know how much Microsoft can actually do to incentivize developers beyond what they've already done, which is creating a platform for them to develop for, creating tools for them to develop,

Starting point is 03:01:52 and even in some cases, incentivizing them through partnership, through promotion, and through direct cash funding to develop for the platform. It's just going to be a slow, slow, slow move because Microsoft is a system integrator, but they aren't even a main, like they're not a main system integrator in the Windows ecosystem. So there's, there's just only so much they can do. Since Luke is getting invites to go to all of these cool places,

Starting point is 03:02:20 will we get a new series? Luke goes places? I mean, I'd be down, but like, I don't think it would make sense. It would be kind of sucky for him to like take vacation time and then have to make a video. I'd still be down. Yeah, I know you would, but it's like the volunteers in the community. Like, I don't want to, I don't want to ask you to do that. Although you will potentially be getting a series called Linus is on vacation and is doing stuff at

Starting point is 03:02:45 his house that he wants to do instead of going to the office and doing work things but we're going to point a camera at it I already have like three projects planned so because it's just stuff I want to do when I have my two weeks off and like you might as well just point a freaking camera at it I don't care so we're gonna get like maybe we'll release weekly or something like that so it's not just a bunch of days in a row yeah of like linus organizing his like tech room in his basement or whatever or like linus mounting all of his stupid sonos things to the wall but it means that i can get some help from work people to do stuff that i would have to do at my house anyway by myself and it means that the company gets content so everyone wins i have not cleared this with our

Starting point is 03:03:24 new ceo but hopefully he's fine with it. Dan, you're probably going to get recruited to help. I have a body bag of stuff for your theater room. A body bag of stuff. I don't even know about this project. So that's four. You asked me to do it last September. Oh, that explains why.

Starting point is 03:03:41 Wait, you have stuff for that? Yes. I thought we were waiting on more stuff for that. We are. There's a lot of stuff that has have stuff for that yes we're waiting on more stuff for that we are there's a lot of stuff that has to stuff for that project oh so are we doing any of it then or some of it or like what i think we need to talk about that i've got another project that i have to finish off for you probably next week that but the rest of it is a bit more complicated okay cool yeah i don't know i um one thing that i do want to do and did actually do this is when i do these weird adventure things i'm kind of scouting for video ideas um i am fully planning that the

Starting point is 03:04:14 i don't know which one i was thinking the artemis mission where they like actually land doing a video on designing the mission control center for that and like why they choose different like versions of these screen crazy screen setups that they have and how they're uh like how data is going back and forth between uh the rocket and how they're dealing with data once they land and all this other kind of stuff could be very interesting um i actually do think there's a video there i think a lot of the places that i would go to there really wouldn't be a video there though because we're like not gonna be allowed to film stuff so yeah I don't know

Starting point is 03:04:51 I'm always down for whatever I just don't think it makes a ton of sense all the time I just replied to a merch message where I addressed only part of it so about my current monitor which is the 144 hertz Hertz, 42 inch OLED that is a 42 crap. Now I forget. I think it's 42 inches anyway. The, the, the, the ROG one, um, the OLED, the big one, um, overall, I'm still really happy with it. I wish the refresh rate

Starting point is 03:05:20 was a little bit higher. One 20 is really really really really good um or 144 or whatever it is i think is it 120 i can't remember it's either 120 or 144 is super super awesome but having the uh the corsair flex one at the land i was like yeah 240 would be a little bit smoother and is is pretty nice um overall really happy with it haven't had any permanent burn-in yet, but hey, let's see how it goes. Linus has shared some notoriously bad takes about software, especially on feature development complexity. Luke, how often do you push back on Linus' feature requests

Starting point is 03:06:00 because they are unreasonable? I don't. Not to go after someone who sent a merge message, I don't think the initial statement is all that true. I think it happens sometimes, but you know. I push back on feature requests pretty often, but it's usually more of a like, okay, this will take X amount of time. Would you rather us do that over these other things? And he's oh no and then that's usually how it goes i mean like i've i've had some i've

Starting point is 03:06:30 had some not entirely accurate takes on like uh feature development complexity like like i've said i think someone could probably add t9 dialing to ios in a day and okay yeah you're right with all the various validation steps it would probably take more than a day. And okay, yeah, you're right. With all the various validation steps, it would probably take more than a day. But I also think that someone could hack it, like it like cheaply crappily put it in in a day. Yeah, I do actually, I do actually believe that. I also think that Google could probably figure out the, you know, taking whatever you've said phonetically and creating a phonetic library of all the people in your contacts list

Starting point is 03:07:07 to make local searching with voice and local calling a lot easier. I think they could do that very easily given the technology they have but that's not just me pulling something out of my butt that's that they obviously obviously

Starting point is 03:07:23 like have all this technology they just just choose not to implement it. And it's really frustrating because there's no reason that it should be this bad other than they just don't give a f**k. I don't know. But yeah, I do also understand that the software development pipeline is a lot simpler than a developer just being like, I'm gonna make this tool. A lot more complicated, you mean? What did I say? You said a lot simpler. Oh, make this tool. A lot more complicated, you mean? What did I say? You said a lot simpler. Oh, yeah.

Starting point is 03:07:47 Yes, a lot more complicated. It is very late, and this has been a very long week. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. As an engineering student, I'm always interested in the design process. Can you share some insights into how your team approaches designing and prototyping new products? Does any step surprise you? you should check out the newsletter uh there's a bunch of cool newsletters from the creator warehouse team where they've detailed like a lot of stuff i think there's a

Starting point is 03:08:17 lot more information i have never checked out another newsletter so i don't know but i'm just going to go on a whim and assume that there's more information in ours than in a lot of different uh brands newsletters it's it's good stuff it's interesting we haven't done too many of them lately uh they should be coming back stronger in the future but um another place where you'll find good resources for this is our floatplane exclusives hey uh the extras from building carl, $100,000 desk PC. Hey, speaking of Tim, there he is working frigging hard, making that thing happen. That was awesome. A lot of the tours behind the design, LTT stubby screwdriver. Let's see if I can find some more of the more like engineering focused stuff. I know RF chamber tour with Jake Danes from the labs team.

Starting point is 03:09:06 stuff i know oh rf chamber tour with jake danes from the labs team where's another product development one kyle almost certainly i'm not allowed to watch these but kyle almost certainly talked about product development in his working for lmg full uncut interviews video it's interesting because with with the watch progress feature we can see what things the ltd crew has watched exclusives of and how much of it they watched unless they finished them in which case do they show up full bar no it goes away yeah so i don't know pretty sure at least i'm trying to find uh oh yeah this was cool uh our injection molder test run so yeah it's not all the time like that's only four or five pieces of content over five months but it happens pretty consistently but it does happen and if it's something that you're gonna see we saw the monitor in half why is that's

Starting point is 03:09:49 tying in uh oh kyle talked a lot about screwdriver development in his 30 minute meet the team so yeah there is there is stuff in there and uh honestly i think floatplane has become a better value than the bar stays ever before. The bar stays. People also have personal accounts, though. Hmm. So, like... Yeah, you can see in the floatplane chat that a lot of our team has personal accounts. Yeah.

Starting point is 03:10:14 So, I don't know. Hey, DLL. I work at a startup company with 100 plus employees and no IT department. Nice. I'm working to build it from scratch. Do you plan to make more content on your internal IT struggles or best practices? Well you won't find any best practices from us right now. That's something we're working on. Is our plan is our guys still on 90 day? Yeah but it's like pretty close but yes yes the plan is eventually that

Starting point is 03:10:46 we want the infrastructure team to feed content to the video creation team yeah instead of the video creation team needing to try to extract content out of the infrastructure that we have um are we there yet solid lead no but that is the plan we will get there hello lld linus you're only allowed to play one game from snes for the rest of your life it can't be final fantasy 6 what's your choice oh come on i'm just gonna take the easy cop-out answer super mario world like that game is so i was gonna say good it no it's great it's almost perfect it's incredible it's an amazing game um nintendo for all their flaws boy do they ever have a long and proud history of just making the crap out of incredible games they're just so much better than what others are doing at the time um yeah i mean i could have gone i don't know

Starting point is 03:11:47 i haven't even played that many snes games most of them were garbage super mario world yeah because i i feel like it's one of those games where the more time you put into it the more you could get better at it whereas like something like okay like pilot wings is one i mentioned earlier in the show you could 100% it and then there's no much more better to get at it that's it whereas like super mario world you could always speed run it faster yeah yeah let's go with that do different weird challenge runs donkey kong country greater than super mario no no and super mario rpg yeah it's like a good answer for one playthrough it's a fantastic game, but the story is not very deep, and there's not a lot of variation in the gameplay.

Starting point is 03:12:29 There's no way I would want to play that game forever. Hello, LLD. I work in a weird subfield of IT, designing access control and VMS solutions for big companies and entire cities. What are some weird areas of IT you guys want to learn more about? I watched a, like, I don't know if it was a real doc. Real doc as in like, how do I say this?

Starting point is 03:13:01 I don't think it's less real because it's on YouTube. I don't know if it was a document documentary that was filmed for like TV and then brought to YouTube or if it was a YouTube creator that made the doc. Uh, but I watched a doc a while ago that was fascinating to me that was on like old school, uh, like, uh, what is it? AT&T and bell technologies running undersea cables for, for telephones. That was wildly, wildly interesting to me.

Starting point is 03:13:30 I've heard that there's like one incoming cable to Greenland and that's it. And there's one like station that deals with it. And if that station goes down, there's effectively one person that can fix it. So there's a lot of single points of failure there. Yeah. I don't know i think like big big very very very low level internet infrastructure would be something that'd be very interesting to learn more about from you rarely hear a lot about it really but like it's one of those things where like you don't really hear a lot about some of the that deep infrastructure stuff in a whole bunch of different

Starting point is 03:14:12 realms but if it was like ever a huge problem it would be incredibly catastrophic but it just never really is which is like wow i'm really happy whoever's doing that is doing a good job from an employer perspective as a female developer i am feeling discriminated and tempted to apply with a fake male name would this be a deal breaker on an interview for you any other thoughts about this i read this and i thought this was very interesting yeah very interesting i mean i don't do interviews anymore so i'm waiting for you to answer it yeah because like my my gut reaction was like no like if you feel like you're getting discriminated against get that interview you know but then i was sitting here thinking like would you hire someone who started their relationship with you by lying to you. Well, you did.

Starting point is 03:15:06 Yeah, but I have terrible taste. Yeah, and it's... I would be pretty concerned about... I have great taste. You thought that I would discriminate against you? But they don't know that it's you necessarily. Like, you think that of me? Yeah, but they don't know that it's you reviewing every resume. And it's not even.

Starting point is 03:15:28 It goes through a layer in HR. That is true. So who knows? It's like, but then you think that of this company. Yeah, but that's okay. You know what's really funny about this is we went through this whole thing with the Trust Me Bro ordeal. Where I went, we have a long track record of being pretty cool um also we're pretty not completely f***ing stupid so we know that if we were to ever mistreat our

Starting point is 03:15:53 community there would be a hell storm so we are a pretty cool and b not stupid of course we're going to take care of it we don't actually have a choice because the crap storm was either going to be over us not agreeing to address it or it was going to be over us not addressing it it was going to happen at some point if we didn't always put the community first and take care of our community but like it up like f***ing obviously right and yet look at how that turned out yeah someone in full plane chat said my wife has used her initials and got much higher responses in agriculture there you go i oh i could definitely see agriculture being a boys club yeah yeah i don't know i'm trying to think about what

Starting point is 03:16:38 i would think about it i don't think i would really care. But I might in the interview question the motive and see what the response is. Like, hey, why did you do this? Yeah. And you'd expect a good answer. Yeah. Okay. But if the answer is good, then I think I wouldn't care. Yeah. Okay. Next. Yeah. Luke, next. Yeah. Luke, have you tried the other two systems that use the same Star Wars mechanics once for playing rebel leaders and once for force users?

Starting point is 03:17:14 They're fun. No, I haven't. I've heard about them, and they sound cool. Having played the game, I find being, like... I think the idea of being a force user in that universe would

Starting point is 03:17:28 not feel as good, I think. I liked being like of the people and trying to scrap it out and make it work. But having not played them, I don't know. Man, now this is bringing me back to like, okay, what determined like force aptitude?

Starting point is 03:17:45 There was definitely a character sheet. Okay, and you had a certain number of like skill points that you could assign, but not digital. It sounds extreme. Well, it wasn't digital in the game that I'm talking about either. It's tabletop RPG. It's all paper. Yeah, but I played it with single player though. Yeah.

Starting point is 03:18:03 No, I think. Oh, yeah yeah you weren't sure if you found it i don't know ah anyway hey lld wondering if you know any games or companies who do legacy content right old microsoft versions are broken in the stock launcher and we all know how lacking nintendo's retro selection is whoever the heck was the original owner of what faf became oh yeah that's like that's a picture perfect version yeah because you you can't expect these developers publishers whatever to maintain these games forever you actually just can't. It's not fair.

Starting point is 03:18:49 But we have always said that at that point, if you're not going to maintain it anymore, you should release it to the community. And I don't know what their exact terms are, but it verifies that you own the game and the game is still purchasable. And then you can install it and use this community-ran launcher. And it's just awesome.

Starting point is 03:19:07 And the game's fun. So I don't, I'm not necessarily asking to get it for free. Like it doesn't need to be that I'm totally okay with it. Verifying that I own the game and it's great. So that's sweet. Yeah. I think you said gas power games.

Starting point is 03:19:20 Yeah. Sweet. That was the publisher. I don't actually know what the, I don't know who the agreement had to be with. Yeah, sure. Fair enough. Whatever that was, though.

Starting point is 03:19:30 Awesome. Convince the wife that the new office needs matching desk pads. What are some of your favorite small or even pyrrhic victories? Oh, no, sorry. Gas Powered Games was the developer. So I don't know who published Supreme Commander. Hold on one sec. Wait, what?

Starting point is 03:19:57 THQ? Actually, that does sound right. THQ. Yeah. Yeah, THQ. So I don't know how that whole thing went down exactly i'm sure those folks would know okay sorry what was that dan convince a wife that the new office needs matching desk pads heck yeah what are some of your favorite small or maybe even pyrrhic victories small

Starting point is 03:20:19 victories or victories that inflicted damage on the victor um fantastic word by the way good use yeah i know i knew that one actually um just making sure i'm sure there's been tons through work what's a small and meaningless victory that we've ever, that we've. Well, he said, he said, or right. Yeah. Small or, or damage inflicting victory. I feel like we kind of embrace the small victories though. And I'm just trying to think.

Starting point is 03:21:03 I also feel like both of us. Have we ever gone to war with a sponsor? okay uh yeah nvidia it's not really a victory um yeah i don't know no i see that's the thing is like there's so many different ways to define victory like if you're talking about the hardware unboxed thing like we were victorious in the sense that they got back re-engaged with nvidia and everything was fine and nvidia apologized and everything was fine yeah so we were not victorious in terms of making money yeah right so it inflicted damage but it's not like i wouldn't i wouldn't i wouldn't classify it this way i want like a a small or damage inflicting victory. What things have like damaged us over the years?

Starting point is 03:21:53 I feel like both of us are fairly rapidly willing to self-sacrifice if we can win something. So we probably have lots of examples. I'm sure we've done something. But I'm sure neither of us cared about whatever. Yeah, because there was some other goal. Yeah, exactly. Victory was worth far more than any damage could have possibly. So we just forgot about the damage and we're like, woo! uh by my team captain on softball night i got assigned to shortstop because he was just like yeah i love the way you just throw your body in front of the ball

Starting point is 03:22:13 with absolutely no regard for how hard it's going to hit you like yeah the glove is optional yeah yeah yeah and you'll forget about the hand pain oh, it was like I took one in the shins Right before that Because I was just like, well that's what they teach you I mean you don't go down You don't go down like this because Even a cup is not perfect You go down like this

Starting point is 03:22:35 So I missed with my glove and it wailed me right in the shins Made the play Which is all that matters Nothing else matters I feel like we're gonna forget all of those forms of victories um yeah i don't know uh i give up i'm sorry i don't know why this was so hard to answer but yeah it shouldn't have been yeah just is maybe we're just tired. Hi, LLD. Linus, during the sponsor shopping video, you made a point to call out Anker,

Starting point is 03:23:08 but in Yvonne's tech upgrade video, she had new Anker chargers. Is this a Linus versus LMG thing, or an oversight? We just aren't accepting any sponsorships. We're not partnered with them. That doesn't mean that they don't make

Starting point is 03:23:23 perfectly competent products that might suit our needs and we might buy them. I've never, that's not inconsistent. That's ever since we announced that we wouldn't be working with them anymore. That's a line that we drew at that time that there we, yeah, we still continue to use it. We're just not going to give them any free publicity or any paid publicity, actually, especially the paid publicity. We're not going to partner with them anymore so yes i guess free publicity is still on the table hello everyone do you know why when two people call each other at the same time the phones mark as unavailable instead of just connecting the calls to each other. I don't know, but I curated this because I want to know. Yeah.

Starting point is 03:24:07 Why is that? What? I think it's a holdover from when they were physical. Yeah, but if two people are calling each other at the same time, why doesn't it just connect the bloody call? Why do they both get a busy signal? Right? Isn't it all digital these days?

Starting point is 03:24:22 Oh, you mean like, why does that still happen? Yeah. That's wild, right? What the heck? Yeah, I don't know. I'm sure there's a very good reason for it. I don't know anything about that infrastructure, but I'm sure it's something like what Dan said,

Starting point is 03:24:36 how it's a bit of a holdover. I think it's called a PBX. Is that what it's called? Yeah, people are saying like race conditions. Yeah. I think there's lots of things that could be causing it. Clearly, we've solved that with digital stuff like two people can attempt to call each other on discord and it'll just connect it um i mean yeah i think they're

Starting point is 03:24:52 talking about like no i know yeah i understand yeah but i mean it's pretty much all voipo anyway like it's it's basically just international discord But with more money. Yeah, I don't know. Not sure. Okay, let's push that button. Oh, I thought of a good answer for this when I'm curating it. Okay, good. Is it going to push?

Starting point is 03:25:17 I don't know. Hi, LLD. Good day from Australia. Due to having better margins on your backpack and screwdriver, would you be more open to free shipping deals once or twice a year? Thanks again. We'll have to see. It's one of those things where, you know, obviously it all comes down to kind of figuring out how to balance your operational expenses and your cost of goods sold and your revenues and your margins and making it all make sense business-wise. And I don't want to care anymore.

Starting point is 03:25:48 I don't want that to be my problem. I want that to be our CEO's problem and our COO of Creator Warehouse's problem, Nick Light, and they'll figure it out. And if they decide to do something like that, then they will. And sometimes I might have a vision that we should do something crazy. I actually came up with a crazy vision quite recently that I have asked for us to try to find a way to do at some point.

Starting point is 03:26:13 But, you know, I don't want to come in and make final decisions. That is just not, it's not the role that I have and it's not the role that I want anymore. Hello, LLD. What was the coolest thing you got to sign at LTX sorry for helping lose the Halo game

Starting point is 03:26:30 my team I love my team but they were f***ing terrible they were awful I love you all you're f***ing awful I had like the highest kill count on my team like every time and I couldn't get anything done okay? Not every time they were actually the only reason why we let one flag through was because

Starting point is 03:26:51 You just would not give up so we were on like game like six or something and my guys were honestly just like kind of They got tired from beating them to a pulp. Yeah, basically In fairness to my team they didn't actually score much either. No, it's very, very hard to score in that game mode. In an 8v8 on Blood Gulch. With, with, there's no like, oh, you want to return your flag, you need to stand on it for like a certain period of time. It instantly goes back. So if you're able to kill someone one time you can immediately return the flag it's very hard to cap it's pretty tough of the various challenges and experiments you've

Starting point is 03:27:32 done on the channel which one stands out as your personal favorite i don't know if it's it's certainly not the best one we ever did but if i had to pick a personal favorite just for the sheer mirth that i felt and i think everyone involved felt when we were creating it i would say it would have to be the um electric shock dog collar challenge which wasn't really a challenge there was no objective there was no point I haven't heard that reference in so long Wow it was just me versus Luke who can press a button that inflicts pain on the other knowing that the other also has the same button And we just million views shocked each other Because I don't know you

Starting point is 03:28:31 And also I guess fuck me too because you're gonna do it right back For those wondering do you have it open on your laptop? Yeah here. Yeah for those wondering. Oh, yeah It's like flagged as an it was just freaking stupid, but whatever. It's kind of stupid. Oh. Oh, wow. Let's watch some ads for 10 minutes. Hey, these guys deleted their forums recently.

Starting point is 03:28:54 Yeah, that's pretty stupid. Yeah. We were supposed to talk about that on WAN Show last week, but we got distracted because it was live and complicated. There we go. Yeah, so. there we go yeah so oh wait I don't remember doing this why is the mineral computer there because I was wearing

Starting point is 03:29:14 because we were going to film this right after mineral oil and I was actually wearing the collar in the last part of mineral oil so we like teased it alright kind of it's just so stupid So we're both wearing Like dog training collars

Starting point is 03:29:32 That no one should ever put on a dog Because this is not how you train a dog But putting it on other people with consent I guess is fine Yeah Is this fair use? Is this channel? Are we authorized to use content from this channel? I don't know.

Starting point is 03:29:49 Okay, so wait for it. It actually hurts that much, in case you're wondering. But don't worry, I'll get them. Yeah, where am I going to react? I was pretty sure you got me pretty good. Am I not reacting? Hold on, is mine not working yet or something? Or am I just biding my time?

Starting point is 03:30:11 Okay. Man, we were not very good at making videos back then. No. Mine's off now. Oh, maybe we were troubleshooting. Okay. Clearly yours is working. Why am I the sub here?

Starting point is 03:30:26 That's normal I think we need to end the show. Probably. Oh, it looks like you got me right there Yeah, all right Ooh, yup, alright. Because you don't know exactly when it's coming, you don't know when they're gonna press it, right? So it's just like... Anyway. Apparently we take it off. That's the end of the video. I don't know. It was actually pretty fun. Yeah, it was definitely fun. It was- might even been super- It was super fun.

Starting point is 03:31:04 Ahhhhhhhh! Got him! Alright. actually pretty fun yeah it was definitely fun it was super fun uh all right uh uh okay where are we hey dll wild that baldur's gate 2 released before i was even born and now it's this popular any now it's this popular any games you're fond of that released before you were born or take you back? Tie Fighter takes me back, but that came out in like 1994 or something like that. Released before I was born. Yikes. Damn. I thought of one, but it was one year after I was born, so it doesn't count.

Starting point is 03:31:37 Chip's Challenge. I did play Chip's Challenge. I don't know if it really like... I don't actually know when that came out. No desire to play it again, though. Oh, no. Great games before... It was 1989 for Chip's Challenge.

Starting point is 03:31:54 Tetris. It's a bit of a cop-out. Yeah, Duck Hunt. Duck Hunt. Duck Hunt came out before I was born. Hold on. When did Duck Hunt come out? 1984. 1984? Yeah, Duck Hunt came out before I was born or hold on when did duck hunt come out in 84 1984 yeah duck hunt came out before i was born that's a super cool game from before i was born there you go nice got it nailed

Starting point is 03:32:14 it nice billionaires today buy super cars and yachts will the new billionaires of the next generation have super gaming systems and what what would they look like? They already have super gaming systems. They have giant Samsung, the wall things to play games or watch NBA games on or whatever. They probably have like personal, you know, VR arcade style set up. Yeah.

Starting point is 03:32:37 Multi-user backpack, VR, giant halls and stuff. And they don't buy super cars and yachts. That's like millionaire um they buy news outlets and they buy politicians that's what billionaires are actually buying they buy rocket ships if they buy a yacht they have to deconstruct a historical bridge to get it out or it doesn't really count to be honest

Starting point is 03:33:01 is it really that cool if you're not destroying history? I don't know. LLD, is there an ETA on the precision screwdriver? Linus mentioned it a while back. No, right now we're still in the can we make one good one phase? And then after that,

Starting point is 03:33:19 it goes into can we make 10,000 good ones phase? And that usually is much more challenging. That's all I got. What isn't challenging is ending the show. We will see you again next week. Same bad time, same bad channel.

Starting point is 03:33:35 Bye. Thanks for watching!

The WAN Show - Pretending I Endorse Your Product Is Fraud - WAN Show August 4, 2023

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