The WAN Show - Twitter Vs. Threads Is Not The Big Story - WAN Show July 7, 2023

Starting point is 00:00:00 everyone and welcome to the WAN show we've got a great show lined up for you this week at least we hope we do you might have noticed that we are also live on the channel with our 24 7 LTT TV stream I have no idea how those two streams are going to interact with each other YouTube assures us that it's fine to have two live streams going from the same channel at the same time um we currently do i just loaded it up what i suspect is that basically nobody is going to watch wanshow and they're going to be like wtf what the heck happened to wanshow and we're going to be like this happened to wanshow got a lot of great topics for you guys today the big ones are of course threads launching this is a new twitter alike from meta parent company of facebook and instagram and uh

Starting point is 00:00:47 elon musk was salty he was a salty baby oh but that's not really what we think is the biggest news google has been accused of misleading advertisers which when your entire business is advertising, basically amounts to your business being like kind of fraudy, allegedly, allegedly. So these are serious accusations. We're going to be digging into them a little bit later. What else we got today? We have tons of great topics. Seriously?

Starting point is 00:01:23 The one you submitted that has an entire page of notes? You're not... The one you submitted that has an entire page of notes? You're not going to go with that? Oh, okay. Yeah, sure. Why not? The CEO of a alleged rug pull game is suing Goatmoth,

Starting point is 00:01:35 a creator that we've mentioned a couple times on WAN Show in the past for his exposés of cheating in Tarkov. So that'll be a little spicy. We'll talk about that in a moment. And the next one, I can't decide between the end of GiphyCat and the fact that apparently emojis can quite literally

Starting point is 00:01:50 be legally binding. You picked those over EVGA potentially going out of business. It's a potential allegedly, maybe, maybe, maybe. That's true. Yeah. Okay. Right into Threads or right into Google? I think you can actually just choose this time. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:02:25 Because the title was kind of both. Yeah. Which one do you want to do? You said you had a lot to say about Threads. I just have some claims to make. Okay. You know what? Some gotchas.

Starting point is 00:02:35 No, I want to do Google accused of misleading advertisers. Yeah. Google has been accused of misleading advertisers about their TrueView in-stream ads. And this is according to advertising research firm Adlytics. Adlytics, excuse me. So for those of you who are unfamiliar, TrueView ads can be skipped after five seconds, and advertisers, hence the name TrueView, right? It's supposed to be an actual view.

Starting point is 00:03:06 hence the name true view right it's supposed to be an actual view advertisers are only supposed to be charged for them if the consumer watches 30 seconds of the ad or if it's shorter than that the entire ad with audio playing the ads are supposed to be in stream which means they play before during or after video content now when you think of Google services that have video content, what's the first thing that comes to mind? YouTube. I thought you were going to go with something snarky, like duo video calling or something. Neat.

Starting point is 00:03:37 Yeah, exactly. Thank you for that. Yeah, YouTube. But analytics found that 42 to 75% of TrueView ad spend was allocatedView ads were run not only in small video players that were just in the corner or the side of the screen, some of which were fully muted, but in some cases on sites that contained content that would violate Google's terms of service. This is a huge deal because have you ever bought online advertising before technically yes it was a very long time ago but yes there is a high degree of trust associated with it absolutely i don't know if you guys have done this before but i've done it a couple of

Starting point is 00:04:40 times and basically what you do is you kind of pick what you want the the most recent time i did it was on facebook but i'm sure the process is relatively similar yeah uh you you kind of pick what you want to target you choose what you want it to say and obviously like where you want it to direct to if anybody clicks on it and then you set a budget. And it's basically on them to decide algorithmically, right, where to spend the budget. And in some cases, you don't even set an exact budget. So sometimes they will spend less or they'll spend more. And there's just the expectation that you're going to trust that they're going to spend it in a way that is algorithmically optimal because, well, otherwise, I guess you could take your business elsewhere.

Starting point is 00:05:29 Except that online advertising is essentially a duopoly at this point. Is there another major player outside of Meta and Google? Nowhere near the same scale. Functionally, not really. And so if Google is saying, hey, this is going to be played on content that is verified brand safe on sites that are controlled by us, like when they say TrueView ad, I had never even heard of those running anywhere other than on YouTube. You have high expectations. But you know what's funny is as soon as I saw the article about this, as soon as I saw the report, I went, yeah, I have seen the five second countdown click to skip on other sites.

Starting point is 00:06:17 You saw an ad. I had always just, I don't know what the ad was for. You just saw the skip button. I saw a skip button for an ad. Fair enough. But I always just kind of assumed that it was someone cloning Google's interface, because that happens all the time. Yeah. Where you'll see something that looks like reCAPTCHA, but it isn't.

Starting point is 00:06:38 Or you'll see something that looks like ad choices or whatever, but it is something else. Yeah. The research. And to defend that assumption, there are players that have done that for advertisements that are not Google ads. Right. They have the five second skip. It's in the same spot.

Starting point is 00:06:57 The box looks almost identical. And I guarantee you it's not a TrueView ad. So like that was a decent assumption. The research also identified ads in which the skip button was hidden or obscured to make it difficult for users to skip after five seconds which means google was basically just like i mean if this is true google was fraudulently charging their advertisers for ads that were supposed to be seen by a pair of human eyeballs, but probably never were. Which you might not actually necessarily care about. But if this goes through legal action, and it's true that 70 up to 75 percent of these were screwed, that might impact YouTube or Google

Starting point is 00:07:45 in like an actually very significant way. Which, you know, they have coming if this is true. But man, this raises some serious questions about the viability of Google's platforms. Like if this is what they have to do to make money, I'm sitting here going, is YouTube even less sustainable than I thought it was? Because I kind of, I don't know, man.

Starting point is 00:08:17 Like just looking at the sheer volume, not just of viewers on YouTube, but ad consumption on YouTube. Like it's kind of, it's unfathomable. I wonder if it's actually almost reverse. Really? Sorry. Because if you put these ads on these random websites where they're like out of the corner

Starting point is 00:08:36 and then you're selling like the effectiveness of these ads versus YouTube ads, I feel like they would be more effective when they're on YouTube. Well, that's true. So I feel like they're taking more volume, but the effectiveness is probably going down, probably comes out in the wash as a positive for them. But YouTube might actually do better if you're able to buy an ad

Starting point is 00:08:56 that was specifically only on YouTube. Interesting. Yeah, yeah. So then they have less inventory, but theoretically they can charge more of a premium for it because it will drive better conversion. So that's screwing you over. No, because it actually benefits me directly

Starting point is 00:09:15 if CPMs are higher on YouTube. That's what I'm saying. Oh. Oh. By doing this model. Yeah. Hey, yeah, we're... By doing the volume decreased value model yeah by using a bunch of

Starting point is 00:09:28 junk sites to pump the volume where's my piece of this you're getting screwed and by extension everyone else in this building yeah that's that's that's linus media group incorporated's revenue yeah hold on hold on a second google gets worse other ads were reported appearing in Android apps that were not even available in the Google Play Store Including from developers based in countries that are sanctioned by the US government such as Iran By the way small update seems to at least somewhat be working. There's currently six point four thousand on YouTube watching land Okay, so I guess two live streams um double the fun yeah cool i don't know that 30 more fun there is notably less people watching the

Starting point is 00:10:11 24 7 stream okay well that's fine yeah they don't need to watch that um now google is not just going to take this lying down google's director of global video solutions, Mark, excuse me, Mark, Marvin Renaud wrote that the report's findings are, and this is in quotes, extremely inaccurate, that advertisers are only charged for ads when they are viewed, and that the majority of ads are served on YouTube, not on third party sites. He likewise said that Google monitors adherence to its policies and last year stopped serving ads on over 143,000 websites that were found to be in violation. Renaud's blog post also claims that Google allows advertisers to opt out of running ads on third-party sites at any time. However, this is actually contradicted by Google's support page that reads,

Starting point is 00:11:03 as of September 30th, 2021, new video action campaigns that you create in Google ads use Google Video Partners automatically. So you are getting screwed. I mean, what's really interesting is this isn't in our notes, but it was in one of the articles that I read about this. Apparently, since 2016, there's been less transparency in terms of like something to do with the way that your campaign runs. I don't want to say anything because I will get the exact details wrong because it's just based on memory

Starting point is 00:11:34 for an article I read like three or four hours ago. But man, I will be keeping an extremely, extremely close eye on this over the next little bit, because this is kind of a bombshell. Like we're not just talking about millions of dollars or tens of millions of dollars. We could be talking about billions of dollars. I also saw a list of the brands that were allegedly affected by this.

Starting point is 00:12:04 Let me see if the verb as the original Adlytic yeah here it is so here's the original article from analytics But a YouTube channel valid true view web page valid true view Invalid true view whoops Here's an American Express. So they've actually got, like, they've got receipts. American Express YouTube TrueView ad serving on a third-party website.

Starting point is 00:12:32 What the heck is the news lens? I've never heard of this before. Video player is muted by default. Video ads autoplay without consumer initiation. Here's another one. JPMorgan Chase YouTube TrueView ad. Just, like, casually sitting here on whatever the site is um multiple kayak youtube true view ads playing in different wonder how much of this is like text-based websites abusing how the like player works

Starting point is 00:13:03 and stuff like that to try to like trick it into giving them more ads. Because that is, we've seen that strategy for years. That's possible. So Google might need to step up. Like they're like, oh, we blocked 143,000 websites. Like maybe you should do more. So like that website sounds like a lot in a vacuum or sorry, that amount of website

Starting point is 00:13:22 sounds like a lot in a vacuum, but it might not actually be that much. Man. Um, yeah. lot in a vacuum or sorry that amount of website sounds like a lot in a vacuum but it might not actually be that much man um yeah so it's not like they're just coming out of nowhere saying this but google says it's not true i of course they do though like i will be very interested well okay fine do you want to jump into our our next topic then? Sure. Allegedly, this is according to a recent forum post from Korean overclocker Safedisc, the entire EVGA motherboard team in Taiwan has resigned, which could force the company to leave the motherboard market.

Starting point is 00:13:58 However, this is very contested. In fact, I personally reached out to EVGA and you can go ahead and read the response for the good people here. Just the big one at the bottom? Yeah. All rumor, Kingpin still with EVGA, still focused on other product lines, and Taiwan office still open, here to support our customers. Now, what's curious is that while there has been some speculation

Starting point is 00:14:24 that the Taiwan office is closing or that Kingpin is leaving EVGA, and this is based on an offhand remark he made in an interview with Gamers Nexus where he basically was asked, what's your next big project? And he said nothing. Yeah. The one thing that EVGA's message doesn't contest is the motherboard team. Yes.

Starting point is 00:14:49 And if Kingpin said, I don't have any other projects, that doesn't necessarily mean that he's leaving. So all he said is Vince is still there, but that doesn't necessarily mean he has any projects with the motherboard team if they're gone. He might have also interpreted it as like, what is your next project within this team? Because if I remember correctly, he looks at the other guy and says nothing. I don't remember. I don't have it right in front of me.

Starting point is 00:15:15 I don't know. Workers at EVGA Spain told TechPowerUp that it was business as usual at their branch, and EVGA has denied accounts of mass resignations and leaving the motherboard market to both TechPowerUp. Oh, and EVGA has denied accounts of mass resignations and leaving the motherboard market to both TechPowerApp, oh, and apparently to us as well. So this didn't contain a denial of that, but maybe to someone else here. Part of what made these rumors seem plausible, though, is that it's only been a year since

Starting point is 00:15:36 EVGA announced it was leaving the GPU market, and some forum users have noted that the company's Supernova XC power supplies come with only a three-year warranty, which is two to seven years shorter than what is usual for EVGA. I also noticed, completely independent of this, that EVGA's site has basically nothing in stock. Interesting. And the reason for this is that we have an upcoming budget power supply roundup. I know, right? We're doing a budget power supply roundup. Can you believe it?

Starting point is 00:16:13 The power supply tester is up and running. Hey. Yeah. So anyway, the winner was an EVGA power supply. We'll get that video out to you guys as soon as it's through the editing pipeline. But what I realized was that it wasn't available anywhere. So in the time between a few weeks ago, us buying it and testing it and sitting down to review the script with Alex, it had completely disappeared from the internet. It wasn't available at any of the major retailers you would expect to

Starting point is 00:16:42 find it at. And it wasn't even listed on EVGA's website. I then started going through EVGA's site, which it looks like you're doing. Don't look at GPUs, though. They're out of that market. Just power supplies. I started going through EVGA's site, and what I realized was they don't have a single power supply in stock.

Starting point is 00:17:02 Seriously, click on anything. Wow. So I called them because I was like, hey, this is going to be pretty embarrassing if we, you know, do a... It's a small roundup. The process is very manual right now. We tested five power supplies, only three of which were actually really budget because all we wanted was a good recommendation. And we basically stopped as soon as we got there because it is inordinately time-consuming

Starting point is 00:17:31 and there's a lot for us to figure out in our workflow, which we will, but this was just a good test run, basically. So the only things they have in stock on their website are B-Stock. There is B-Stock, but it's only B-Stock. So it would be pretty embarrassing if the winner of our roundup of three items didn't exist anymore. So I called up EVGA and I went, hey, what's going on?

Starting point is 00:17:52 Do you still make budget power supplies? Also, are you going to have any stock? What's the deal here? And I was assured that there is inventory incoming and that it might be a little while after the video comes out before you can actually buy one, but there are more coming and you will be able to buy one. Um, so I had already had some questions about what was going on over at EVGA

Starting point is 00:18:17 because even if they do have more power supplies coming, that doesn't mean necessarily that things are going great if there's nothing in stock on their site. Yeah. No motherboards. Outside of B-Stock, no motherboards and no power supplies in stock at all is a little fishy. With that said, there were some power supplies in stock at third parties, and my understanding is that EVGA stocks their site before retailer sites.

Starting point is 00:18:42 Oh, wait. Do you mean the other way around? Excuse me. I mean the other way around excuse me i mean the other way around they stock partner sites before their own site but i am uh i don't consider this matter to be entirely resolved is what i will say about all of this yeah a little sketchy yeah hey you can also buy a lanyard. They have those. Okay, thank you, Luke. That is very helpful. And a mouse badge.

Starting point is 00:19:12 I mean, don't forget about the case badge. The metal case badge for a dollar? That's not too bad. As long as you don't want to buy more than 15. Start melting them down. That would be a problem. Hold on, guys. We've only got like three things left in stock.

Starting point is 00:19:31 15 per person maximum. We don't want to completely run out. That would be embarrassing. All right, why don't we jump... Speaking of embarrassing... Yeah. Threads? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:19:44 Threads has been launched. Meta's new Twitter competitor, Threads has been launched. Meta's new Twitter competitor, Threads, has reportedly accumulated over 30 million users within its first 24 hours. The app is not entirely polished and lacks support for both emojis and hashtags. Quick update to that number. It's apparently over 78 million now. Cool. There is no dedicated chronological following feed though one is planned i'm sure hashtags and emojis will be as well uh the app requires an instagram account to

Starting point is 00:20:12 join and offers new users the option to follow everyone they already follow on instagram there is currently no method of deleting the threads account without also deleting the attached instagram account though they can be independently deactivated whatever that means i yeah i don't fully know i think it means your data is not gone but like you can't log into it anymore i don't know okay um this may violate a consent decree placed by meta by the fcc because it misleads the user about the degree to which they can control their own data. All right. Some of this stuff's getting into the weeds a little bit. Can we just sort of generally talk about how utterly remarkable it is that Elon Musk has gone from being the technology industry's poster boy for how to be like uh an awesome you know billionaire innovator to being so hated that

Starting point is 00:21:07 people are actually cheering for mark zuckerberg yeah yeah in multiple ways because they also want him to fight like two years that's how long that's how long that fall from grace i just want to say i've been pointing out for a long time i don't think it'd be that hard to make a twitter competitor and people keep on telling me that i'm nuts they've only been working on this since like january they have over 70 million users i mean i think it was kind of a really smart move like i'm annoyed i don't have a threads account because I actually do not have an Instagram account because I just, I had the work one and I used that as my Instagram account. Oh yeah. Yeah. And when you did your split thing back in the day, you just didn't make

Starting point is 00:21:54 an Instagram. I just didn't bother making an Instagram account because I'm sitting here going, well, what is Instagram? Yeah. It's Twitter. I think I uploaded a picture to Instagram like three years ago and it was just, I was on a hike and it was just a picture of the burrito that I was eating while I was on the hike. Yeah, that should have been a tweet for sure. That's actual garbage content. Yeah. And so I just, I didn't really understand the point of Instagram and like

Starting point is 00:22:15 our former cinematographer Brandon tried to explain it to me. He was like it's like better and I was like, what does that even mean? He's like, when you're scrolling, it's better and I'm like, it's, it's like better. And I was like, what does that even mean? He's like, like when you're scrolling, it's better. And I'm like, I, I, I'm sorry. I actually have, I actually have no capacity to understand what you're talking about right now.

Starting point is 00:22:33 And I'm not going to scroll either of them. So it doesn't really matter. Um, so, so anyway, I don't have an Instagram account and I just, it was like, it took longer than like three seconds to, uh, you know, I would have had to log into my password manager in order to, you know, validate my login with Facebook or something,

Starting point is 00:22:57 something. And I was just like, ah, forget it. But to their credit, I think it was kind of genius to tie the branding and everything into instagram instead of gives you more confidence instead of calling it threads by facebook or something like that oh yeah no definitely because the brand cachet of instagram is obviously you

Starting point is 00:23:18 know way better than boomer facebook or whatever and what's kind of interesting about this is i feel like what they're doing is they are acknowledging um indirectly that every social media platform kind of has a a cycle i think they've just accepted at this point and this is something i didn't really catch on to when they rebranded to metaa. I think they have accepted at this point that the Facebook brand is basically like done. Yeah, it's it's annihilated. There's nothing left of it. So they are slowly but surely just kind of going, OK, well, I don't know, use it for marketplace or whatever. We'll happily take your data about what you're selling and buying in the second hand or whatever. And if, you know, people want to post pictures of their, you know, family

Starting point is 00:24:10 outing or whatever on Facebook, and they can like it or whatever, sure, fine, go do that. But we understand everything's moving to Instagram. And we understand Instagram ain't going to be around forever either. And so by migrating, you know, remember the the instagram branding changed to like instagram by facebook for a long time there build build build build build build okay uh this is this is threads by instagram and then they they migrate a bunch of people who are interested in changing like that's the thing is i'm getting to be all boomery like i don't i i just why do i why do i still use twitter at all honestly just like out of habit. Whereas it tends to be people who have a little bit more time,

Starting point is 00:24:51 a little bit more elasticity left in their brains that are just going to try to jump onto something new just for the sake of trying it. So they jump onto threads. It's going to naturally have a younger, more vibrant user base. And eventually Instagram will turn into like for you know millennials or you know geriatric gen z's or whatever and this is going to be the this is going to be the new meta haha very good um i like i i get it i get it now and it's like kind of genius um

Starting point is 00:25:18 i'm surprised it worked this well it's a lot of self-awareness. Yeah, it's... I think when I jumped on it, because why not? I was interested. I wanted to mostly just reserve my username. I haven't threaded anything. I hate it already. Yeah, that's terrible. I've never actually said that out loud before.

Starting point is 00:25:40 That sounds horrible. Sounds like hair removal. Yeah. I haven't threaded anything yet but uh the the follow everyone you follow on instagram thing was smart because it it immediately makes your your threads experience feel vibrant because a bunch of these people that you probably follow on instagram are already on there so instead of like oh i'm gonna follow the like few people that i don't care about that twitter makes me follow when i sign up um it's like oh these are people that i already know

Starting point is 00:26:09 and hey look they're already on threads there's actually stuff happening here one of the big problems that i think a lot of the other like twitter clones that have popped up have is that it just feels dead when you show up yeah i also noticed at least when I started using it. I don't know if this has changed or not yet. Because it sounds like a decent amount has already literally changed. But they were hiding certain metrics. Which probably made sense in the first like few hours. Now that they have 70 million users.

Starting point is 00:26:40 Maybe they need to start making that stuff more public. But you couldn't see like how many people liked something but you could see the people responding to it and stuff which if people are responding to things which they're likely to do on a new platform because they're actively trying to use the new platform it's going to make it feel a little bit more active than it might actually be and i think that was a good way to get people into like yeah i know this is real this is real things are happening this is okay this is real. This is real. Things are happening. This is okay. This is good.

Starting point is 00:27:06 Yeah. Apparently Mr. Beast has more followers on there than Zuckerberg. That doesn't surprise me. Does that surprise you? No, but it's just funny. I mean, the Zuck is just sort of like, oh, man, you kind of reluctantly, like you have to pay attention to him.

Starting point is 00:27:24 I mean, it really, realistically, I realistically, it's no different than Musk. It's no different than Bezos. It's not like... Musk is just more public than all the rest of them. No offense to any of them. I actually... I don't need to have dinner with them. Like, I just...

Starting point is 00:27:41 You know? But I work in the tech industry. I do have to kind of pay attention to what the crap it is they're doing this time yeah um mr beast is doing a tesla giveaway on threads or are you sure that's not a bot yeah i know he is oh wow because he's like whatever it's jimmy right like he's just memeing. Yeah, he just does things. Apparently, we have a thread something. I wanted to look at it. Yeah, but it's not official. Yeah, it is. It is now?

Starting point is 00:28:08 Well, I don't know. What does official mean? Apparently, we didn't have an official account on Instagram. Oh, you mean like a verified account? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry. Oh, okay. So they're working on it, I guess.

Starting point is 00:28:20 Okay. We should have official accounts, except for when you have to pay for them, and then we shouldn't have official accounts. Do I even? Okay, I do have official accounts, except for when you have to pay for them, and then we shouldn't have official accounts. Okay, I do have Instagram on my phone. Okay, I can log in another account. Oh, God. I don't even know the password for our places. What are you even trying to do?

Starting point is 00:28:34 I want to see our thread. I haven't even seen it yet. Hold on. Oh, you have? Oh, right, right, right. Yeah, you have it. Okay, cool. I get to see our threads presence. The social team was telling me that apparently interaction is pretty similar on threads to the other major platforms right now.

Starting point is 00:28:51 Just because everyone's, it's the new hotness, right? So people are just checking it out. Oh, hey, they have one of the tweet size threads that I suggested today. Someone pointed out, I've barely used the the app but someone pointed out that when you go to sharing you can tweet threads oh really which looks really weird because now there's like a tweet button in threads which is like that blows my mind what's happening right now okay people are asking what is threads threads is instagram or metas or Facebooks, whatever, response to Twitter, effectively. It is their version of Twitter.

Starting point is 00:29:29 Yeah, they've been working on it since January, and now it's released. That's how you know something was really, really hard. Well, apparently my idea did not perform very well. Get on. Liked by the Bradfad and others. And then the one under it is oh no okay Apparently some of them just see some of the metrics are like not weird yeah view likes Something something, but then you have to like scroll through all of it. It doesn't show you the number thing

Starting point is 00:29:57 Yeah, like it's it's oddly obscured Which I feel like my gut is telling me was a was a choice for the initial launch so that it wasn't the focus right okay yep I uh I I have no idea and anything I can only access on my phone just doesn't exist to me yeah there's no website what the heck I remember people telling me when when TikTok was popping off I remember people telling me when, when TikTok was popping off. I remember people telling me how many, actually for that matter, when Instagram was popping off, I remember people telling me how amazing it was. And I would go to Instagram.com.

Starting point is 00:30:36 The desktop experience is terrible. No, I'm talking before that. When it just re when it was just a link to the app store. And I was like, I'm not going to do that. when it was just a link to the app store. And I was like, I'm not going to do that. Realistically, most of what you're doing is probably web-based anyway. Just put it in a stupid vertical window.

Starting point is 00:30:56 I don't care. I feel like how much web browsing I do in a browser on a desktop is probably the boomerest thing about me. Yeah. I just want the website to be the best version. But for a lot of the like hip young, you know, apps and experiences and products and whatever,

Starting point is 00:31:15 they're like, isn't even a website. Or like you were just talking about, it's just a link to the app store or it's an afterthought like Instagram's currently is or something like that. It's just like, oh man man. Like, oh, well. Websites work better. I mean, sure, when they do, they don't for everyone. Yep.

Starting point is 00:31:35 Yep, that's fair. Man, I, okay, let's take bets here. Who emerges here? Because Blue Sky hasn't gone away. Nope. They're, they just seem to be still wrapping infrastructure. I don't think it's going to be blue sky personally.

Starting point is 00:31:51 Yeah. Okay. That's fair enough, but I think threads will beat blue sky. I feel like right now I would be making a complete up in the air guess based on nothing to say whether it would be Twitter or threads. Really? Yeah. You think Twitter has a chance i do i i do i would absolutely not at all be surprised if threads just completely took their lunch either like i'm not i'm not i'm not really in any camp here i have experienced a significantly degraded experience on Twitter over time. Yeah, but Threads is currently like

Starting point is 00:32:25 very lacking in features. That's fair but look at what freaking Twitter was up to this week with rate limiting on scrolling posts. Like that's embarrassing. That's like rolling blackouts. I thought it was hilarious. This is like... Obviously you think it's

Starting point is 00:32:42 funny. I think it's so funny. I thought it was good even. Because like whatever, get off this garbage app. It's great well right, but we're talking It's not good for the app. Yeah, that's what I'm saying screw. Like it was But okay, there's a discussion question here. How do you choose which dumpster fire to cheer for? That's the problem Burn burn burn burn more than the other guy I just want them both to burn yeah I want them to competitively burn. The discussion question on this topic is,

Starting point is 00:33:08 the world needs another Twitter, but should we really want another meta-run social media platform? And that's it. It's like, really? This is the one that's going to do it? Man, I didn't really think Blue Sky had much of a chance, but I thought maybe because there was nothing else. And then now there's something else.

Starting point is 00:33:29 And now I think they're screwed. And for as much as like... This is a lot of momentum when Blue Sky is still limiting signups because they can't build infrastructure fast enough, I assume. That's my guess. That's my guess. Otherwise, why would you limit signups if you can just have momentum on your side?

Starting point is 00:33:46 I am blown away that Meta managed to pull this out of complete stealth. Yeah. I don't know a single person that saw this coming. No idea. Nope. Like, okay, they probably could have seen it coming. Yeah. But I don't think anyone knew it was coming.

Starting point is 00:34:02 It was informed. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. But I don't think anyone knew it was coming. Yeah. Yes.

Starting point is 00:34:03 Yeah. Yeah. How is a company the size of MetaFacebook working on a project like this? I wonder how big the team was. Okay. Well, let's get to that. One of the major developments this week is that Twitter, upon seeing the launch of threads threatened a lawsuit on the grounds that meta allegedly hired ex-twitter employees and misappropriated twitter's trade secrets and

Starting point is 00:34:33 other intellectual property a meta spokesperson responded that no one on the threads engineering team is a former twitter employee which i don't think is a sicker burn on elon musk or a sicker burn on the former twitter employee base we actually literally uh didn't need any of you to make this like kind of less feature they wouldn't have again i'm going to say it it's not it is not very complicated if they can build Instagram they can build threads can I just say that it is absolutely hilarious that you would go in

Starting point is 00:35:15 acquire a company fire the majority of the employees there and then be surprised if there was some kind of like knowledge like brain drain that occurred that enabled And then be surprised If there was some kind of like Knowledge Like brain drain that occurred That enabled a competitor

Starting point is 00:35:30 Yeah It's not what happened So what if it had Like What do employees owe you exactly If you sh** on someone Like What they're gonna pretend they never worked there? This is part of, like, non-competes and intellectual property, though.

Starting point is 00:35:51 So if they did use, like, Twitter proprietary stuff. Sure, but clearly Threads is not running Twitter code. And wouldn't need to. Yeah, so, like, I don't know. It's clearly a lash out. Yeah. um yeah so like i don't know it's clearly a lash out yeah just it it comes across pretty sour grapes and i just i i i'm sorry but i can't feel bad for someone who goes in and half arbitrarily just like destroys the livelihoods of thousands of people oh yeah Was that ship sustainable? No.

Starting point is 00:36:26 No, probably not. Oh, definitely not. Then you shouldn't have bought it. Yeah. The time to do this correctly was before you actually wrote the check. Yeah, I think the only thing that doesn't bother me quite as much about it is that I am rather certain they were all losing their jobs anyways i mean we talked in the early days before elon bought twitter about how insane twitter was as a business just burning literally billions of dollars a year ever with with no plan to

Starting point is 00:36:58 profitability with no like it was actually one of the like one of the most dumpster fire businesses i've ever seen like it made no sense at all so like it was not going to be sustainable and the the the the reapers coming for a lot of these types of companies that just make no money and have no plan to ever make any money and just lose tons of money that was a thing for a really long time but you're seeing uh you're seeing that kind of end. So yeah, I don't know. Makes me feel less bad. It still sucks that they're out of work.

Starting point is 00:37:33 But I don't think it's actually really that much different. Helix919 in Twitch chat says, Non-competes are hard to enforce when you broke contracts and didn't pay the severance to the employees you fired. Yikes. That's a pretty good point. Yeah. Oh, that's epic. Someone in chat said,

Starting point is 00:37:53 how would you design a Twitter clone is an extremely common tech interview question. Yeah, it is. I actually didn't know that. Yeah. Just why? Because it's like... Because it's like an early university level project.

Starting point is 00:38:08 The difficulty is the scaling, right? Okay. I was going to say, I feel like every time we have this conversation, I have to point out that serving a text post to one person is easy. Serving a text post to a hundred million people is actually not that easy yeah okay all right then we're on the same but we've had dig and reddit forever we've had twitter forever like this the knowledge around that type of tech has been around for a very long time and the amount that something gets easy over time in the in the development space is is like quite rapid when something is first created it might have been extremely hard to create that thing but three years later six

Starting point is 00:38:49 years later nine years later more and more on it gets imperator in a float plane chat says threads probably started as a hobby project by some of the facebook engineers well i i think is it in here? I think it was genuinely January, right? It's not in our notes. I'm not sure. No, it's Insta. Yeah. Coder Goth says the hard part of Twitter isn't the UI. It's the scale and the content moderation.

Starting point is 00:39:16 That's another big one. But with that said, I mean, Twitter has basically abandoned all pretense of content moderation at this point, as far as I can tell. basically abandoned all pretense of content moderation at this point as far as i can tell meanwhile meta is saying that they are going to take yeah they want it to be the friendly platform i which is actually very attractive to a lot of brands for advertisements which sustain a platform i wish them the best of luck oh yeah it'll be tough because the problem with having a friendly platform with a lot of users is that users is just another word for people and people are f***ing assholes yeah especially when they have anonymity and so imagining that you're gonna somehow have it's it's like saying i'm gonna i'm gonna make a multiplayer game one with a non-toxic user base it's like well i was with you up until you're gonna make a multiplayer game that sounds

Starting point is 00:40:13 good um that second part though that's why it's why online play is is never rated right uh yeah yeah okay yeah i guess that's fair enough so a couple things here yes development did start in january too it was called project 92 internally and i just googled uh project 92 rumors and there's stuff from like june rumor has it meta is making a comeback writing a virtual wave of blah blah blah something project 92 meta versus twitter posted in june so there's like there was some people that were like something's happening but uh yeah interesting top gear 1224 and floatplane chat asks us where's the line between advertiser friendly and censorship yeah i don't know that's why i

Starting point is 00:41:08 don't work in i hate that stuff our our thing on the forum was always like this is a tech site just stop yeah the line is that it's a completely optional service that you don't need that is run by a private company yeah like and that's that's honestly it too like with threads that's not government censorship that's that's that's that yeah thing if threads the line is don't use it you don't get to talk about politics ever well that's that's their that actually might be a good thing it might be are they saying that no i'm just saying like i was gonna say now Maybe I will... Maybe I'll take another crack at this. I would legitimately be more interested.

Starting point is 00:41:48 But yeah, like if they decide to say that, it's a private platform. This is not a government funded thing. This is not public property. Like they could do that. The forum is exactly like that. We're like, yeah, we don't want you talking about a bunch of stuff. Why?

Starting point is 00:42:00 Because we don't want to deal with it. This is not the right place. And this is absolutely not the right time. Go somewhere else i don't know that's it it's gotten phenomenally stupid to me though the kinds of things that have become political like remember when gas ranges turned into a political issue for like everything's weird for like six minutes but this is why neither of us do this and this is why this too nuanced weird. I'd rather just do other stuff. Content moderation is such a nightmare. Like no interest at all.

Starting point is 00:42:30 When we started doing this like the 24-hour live stream thing, we were just responsible for like the tech side of it. So I wasn't really thinking about much else. Once it went live, I was like, oh, oh there's gonna be a chat oh no and then went to go see that at that point in time we had it disabled and i was like okay this makes sense it's kind of a weird viewing experience let's have a let's have it let's have a little debate here sure i personally intervened and had the chat turned back on yeah no it should be okay so hold on hold on because that's. Because that's going to sound

Starting point is 00:43:06 weird considering my previous reaction. I am going to be very surprised if there are no issues with the fact that there is a live chat on there. And I hope people understand that a 24-hour live stream is going to be impossible to perfectly moderate

Starting point is 00:43:22 the chat. So there's going to be some stuff in there that's going to be garbage. Sorry, it is what it is. I expect it to be basically all garbage. Yeah. Hopefully auto-moderator tools are able to do a pretty good job with it. But I expect nothing. I expect it to actually be garbage.

Starting point is 00:43:38 That is my personal Linus Sebastian guarantee to you that every message, even the one that you are furiously typing right now to demonstrate how galaxy your brain is and how amazing the quality of your of your post is going to be is garbage everything in that live everything in that live stream chat is garbage that is my personal promise there rebel against him by saying nice things to people um but yeah no i without the live chat that thing is literally useless yeah you are actively on youtube so youtube has autoplay features i don't know how much i am supposed to say or not say about it but we are trialing a new betas thing uh do you know what i am and i'm not allowed to say i don't

Starting point is 00:44:34 at all but when i google it nothing comes up i see uh okay so that's where I'm at right now. Give me a sec here. Where do you find the 24-hour live stream? If you go to the Linus Tech Tips channel on YouTube and then you click on the live button in the top banner thingy, you will see two live streams. You'll see what you're watching right now if you're on YouTube. Well, I mean, you're going, so yeah.

Starting point is 00:45:02 You'll see the WAN show that says, what happened? A big bold text at the bottom. You can see these two guys there. And then to the right so yeah, you'll see the WAN show that says what happened, a big bold text at the bottom. We see these two guys there. And then to the right of it, you'll see another live stream that just says LTT TV is the thumbnail. And yeah, LTT TV, 24 seven tech tips with a thousand people watching. Okay. Well, they didn't specifically say that it's NDA'd.

Starting point is 00:45:25 Yeah. I didn't find anything saying that either. I just thought it was really weird that when I Googled it, I couldn't find it. And there's no like, you know, like Google knowledge-based documentation for it or anything. All the documentation is literally that that you're looking at right now. That's the PDF, right? I can only sort of see your phone. And yeah, that's everything I can find. Okay, screw it. I'm just going gonna say what it is then oh boy uh we're

Starting point is 00:45:48 participating in a in a trial that they're doing where it's it's i'm not gonna i'm not gonna say what it's called or give a ton of detail but okay it's designed for tvs yes so the point of this is for us to do the curation rather than for YouTube to do the curation and for us to basically go, okay, here's some content that we think represents the best of or like things that our audience loves about our brand. Encode it all together. And then anytime on your TV, you'll just see like ltd tv and it's just it's more like a channel it's like a station yeah yeah and less like uh an algorithm because it's not algorithmic which kind of surprised me yeah me too like what that's that's like the anti Google thing to do. That's weird.

Starting point is 00:46:48 And so obviously, yeah, I was, I was really interested in participating in it just to kind of see, you know, what does that look like? Is there, is, is there, is this a potential funnel to bring new people into LTT content is to, to expose videos from the back catalog that haven't been picked up algorithmically, at least not recently, right? Like I don't know. So we actually, it was a ton of work for the team, everyone from the editors to Luke's team to the business team to the writing team, like getting every getting all these videos selected and originally we were actually going to cut them together

Starting point is 00:47:25 with baked in, we recorded the business team, including Dennis recorded like some new spots. Oh, those are in there, I think. Yeah, yeah. But how do those work? Do they just randomly play once in a while or are they encoded with video? No, I think it's each individual video

Starting point is 00:47:39 has it slotted into that same video. Okay, so we took- We had proposed an idea oh okay where we were going to have those ads go between the videos but it was brought up by by james that like the float plane audience is used to the ads being removed so sometimes you'll do you're like we're going to segue to our sponsor thing and then the video will just keep playing and there's no ad the float plane audience is used to that because they're like paying for the bed and that's normal and stuff but average viewers might think that's a little weird and a little jarring so we want he wanted the ads to be slotted in there so each

Starting point is 00:48:12 video on there is actually edited with the ad slotted in oh okay that sounds like it was a lot of work yeah which is why we recommended just putting it in between but if the viewing experience is better or whatever it's that's j. Shout out editing team for getting that done. Dan, you know we've done three topics already, right? It's just based on the time. Really? I'm not supposed to have explained merch messages yet? Are you sure?

Starting point is 00:48:43 That doesn't seem right. Haven't we been live for like half an hour? Time flies when you're having fun. No, we've already done too many topics. We're going to explain merch messages now. For those of you who are new to the show, the way to interact is not via Super Chats, not via Twitch bits, not via thread bobbins. I'm sure there will be some kind of monetization on threads at some point. It doesn't matter.

Starting point is 00:49:09 The point is it's merch messages. So if you want to send a merch message, which could just be a little thing down there, you know, a question for our producer Dan, or it could be a little shout-out for your friends, or just, you know, lots of people just talk about how much they love the products. That is something I actually kind of, okay, I didn't get mad, but I got a little impatient with the team today. Our site has literally like tens of thousands of positive reviews for our products. We don't use them in our marketing at all. Not at all, not even a little bit. And to be clear, I don't blame the team because I know there are some technical challenges that prevent it right now. Like the, um, the S I know this, you were saying the system that we use

Starting point is 00:49:56 for reviews on the site is like super limited. Oh, like we can't even sort them in, in any meaningful way or something. I remember you telling me you can sort that it's it's closed So we can't change it right and you can sort them But some of the sorting is really weird like you particularly hated this one if you sort by most helpful Yeah, all it does is sort it by total likes. Yeah, it doesn't consider the dislikes at all so something could have like 300 likes and 78,000 dislikes and I'll be like this is the most helpful one yeah like which is very very bad that might actually be helpful now that i think about

Starting point is 00:50:32 it but but that that math often doesn't work yeah sure um any any any who the point is um what was i gonna say something something right right right so some people just like shout it out other times people post questions and luke and I will address a limited number of them during WAN Show After Dark. And the best thing about all of it is that unlike those other ways of throwing money at your screen at streamers. You get stuff. If we don't get to your question or your comment, well, hey, you get your order in the mail and the quality is great and all that good stuff. Sorry, it's not Shopify. So the way to send a merch message is by going to lttstore.com.

Starting point is 00:51:09 And in the cart, you will see a box pop up if we're live. And it'll say, oh, is that going to always be there? Because of the 24-7 stream. No. Oh, good. Okay, so you will see a box. Oh, is it even going to be there right now? It is.

Starting point is 00:51:25 Conrad actually reworked this for a completely different reason. Oh. And it's... Oh, no, it wouldn't have done it anyways. Okay. Well, anyway, in the cart, you'll see a box where you can type a merch message, and then all you have to do is complete checking out, and you will send your merch message.

Starting point is 00:51:42 It was based on Twitch being live not youtube so it wouldn't have done it in the past but conrad has we reworked how it works anyways so regardless it's good it will it's not automatic anymore you like tell merch messages to be live or not okay all right i have a couple of updates for you guys on the store first up up, reminder that our PCMR collection is live. I'm just going to show you guys that real quick here. Linus laptop, the PCMR connection, connection, collection. So we've got the hoodie, which I think the team did a just great job with the design for, includes our phone pocket because of course it does. There's the one that keeps it from coming out. Nice embroidered logo. No low quality, okay?

Starting point is 00:52:29 You know, just like iron-on logos for us. I mean, okay, this one's screen printed, but that's on a shirt, okay? All right. It's different. PCMR t-shirt, PCMR water bottle. We've got a desk pad. Simple, simple, clean branding, just PCMR on the top.

Starting point is 00:52:44 And then it's got the yellow accent forcmr on the top and then it's got the yellow accent for the stitching around the outside and then an enamel pin so you guys can check that out and the other big thing to talk about this week is that if you guys are waiting for an update on the stubby screwdriver we have one for you all you've got to do is go to lmg.gg slash stubby it will land you on this page, and you can be the first to know once it comes in stock, which is hopefully going to be sometime in the next month or so, actually. We're pretty excited to launch it.

Starting point is 00:53:15 Last but not least, we have a big deal event coming next. Oh, my God. Is that coming next week? Good gravy. Okay. We have a big event coming next week we almost never discount things but we have uh oh we've decided to take a page out of amazon's book and uh ride on the coattails of their completely arbitrary shopping holiday prime day um so we're

Starting point is 00:53:40 gonna have lime day you had to work Day, which is if you have to... I didn't even name it! I didn't even name it! I do believe the chief vision officer would have accepted the name. Well, I just think it's funny. You know, if life gives you dead stock, make limes. That was honestly what was in my head at the time. Oh my goodness.

Starting point is 00:54:06 Yeah, so we do have some slow-moving items that we are going to absolutely, like almost like T-shirt cannon, firing them into the crowd, be doing some deals on. Heads up that on this one, you are likely to get a few emails each day during the three days of the event

Starting point is 00:54:26 that will be the best way to be notified of new deals as they go up but it will be a bit spammy so bear that in mind you have to specifically sign up for it by going to lmg.gg lime okay okay uh lime lmg.gg no no, no. So we're using a different email for this. I guess so. I certainly hope so. This is a Lime Day. As long as people are manually signing up for that amount of emails, we're probably good. It's the LTT Inventory Management Experience.

Starting point is 00:54:58 Fail run July 12th to 14th. Sign up to get first dibs. Even though some of these deals are going to have hundreds or even like a couple thousand units available i am expecting them to sell out extremely quickly i've heard some of the have you seen some of them no but i've i've i was informed of one or two of them but i haven't actually seen them yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah Yep. And hopefully our email will still work. It's make some lime juice. More liquid. Oh, that's pretty good. Merch messages. They're in the cart, so when you buy stuff, they're there. Sounds good. Alright, cool.

Starting point is 00:55:55 Oh, are you gonna stream Lime Day? Stream it. You do a stream for Prime Day, don't you? I don't even think we're doing a Prime Day stream this time. The community hates it. We almost never find any good deals. Why does the community hate it? Just because there's no good deals? Just because

Starting point is 00:56:11 what's there to not hate about Amazon? I legitimately don't shop on Amazon, so I don't... Is it like the Steam sale? Where the first few were sick and now all of them, they're just all the same as they were before? I don't even know if the first Prime Day was sick. Okay.

Starting point is 00:56:28 Rough. I mean, it's one of those things where from time to time, there are good deals. Oh, that's a really good question. Oh, what is it? AJ in Floatplane Chat said, if we place multiple orders, can we combine shipping? I don't think we have a way to do that.

Starting point is 00:56:43 I don't think so either, but I wonder if it's a good idea to talk to the people that do shipping and be like, yeah, there's likely a lot of same customer, multiple orders over the next couple of days. So I'm going to be honest with you in a way that, um,

Starting point is 00:56:59 I'm sure our new CEO would actually not really appreciate because this is pretty inside baseball. Our intention is to combine shipments if we can and pocket the difference because we are going extremely aggressive on these deals and you're still getting a good deal. Okay. That may be one of the few ways we actually make any money. I choked on my own laugh there.

Starting point is 00:57:25 Wow. I mean, so there you go, buddy. I choked on my own laugh there. Wow. I mean, uh... So there you go, buddy. I-I-I mean, this is a thing that places do. I mean, I mean, in the interest of protecting the environment and consuming less jet fuel, I mean, it is literally just better for people, right? We have made the difficult decision to not bill you any differently

Starting point is 00:57:43 and combine your shipments. You don't have to have a delivery person show up to your house and fake knock on your door and then leave multiple times. Now it's only once. Now it's once. So you only have to go to the post office one time. I don't think it's that bad. I think it's fine. In other news, the goat story, I think it's fine. In other news, the goat story, I think. You just don't want to do any merch messages?

Starting point is 00:58:10 You just explained the whole thing. No, it's explaining. Your note sucks, Dan. Yeah, get a better note, Dan. Yeah, if we were to do merch messages, it should say explain merch messages plus do three. I can't work with these people. We normally do two merch messages. How long i can't work with these people uh we normally do two merch messages we've how long have we been doing this together now a thousand years hit me dan always

Starting point is 00:58:33 feels like the first time hi dll love the show apple grew into nearby buildings in its early years like ltd and eventually built a unified campus. Do you think LTT can get there? And what's your dream of LTT under one roof? I think that sounds like a problem for our incoming CEO to deal with. I have actually explicitly already talked to multiple people internally about our space constraints, including Taryn, and said that I do not intend to deal with it. I don't think it's realistic for us to keep buying buildings I mean we've talked about that on the WAN show before it's just reached the point now where um we're in BC man it just like doesn't work yeah the costs just go up higher

Starting point is 00:59:20 than you can save up money at a certain point it's like how real estate works in BC and And how much space we would need. Like you could even look at the badminton building and go, well Linus you could have just bought us the badminton building. No I couldn't. The badminton building would not be enough to accommodate LMG in its current state. It's also not like zoned for office space and stuff right? Yeah. Yeah. Like it's exactly. It wouldn't really work. And office is even more expensive so we would have to be getting an office zoned building it would have to be like we're already

Starting point is 00:59:52 we are already occupying something like 55 000 square feet or something like that i don't know what that is in like real units but because i'm canadian um but but it's a lot it's a ton and so for us to move everything consolidate everything and then also have like a reasonable amount of room to grow we'd be basically looking at a hundred thousand square foot campus there is a solution what just a company town you're pitching this because you can't move you can't convince everyone we're bringing back linus bucks like if if you tried to move the entire company to somewhere a little bit you know further away from vancouver it's going to be really hard because every single person in the company is going to have to figure out housing at the same time

Starting point is 01:00:40 what if you just provided that solution for them at the same time guaranteed renters internet would be sick you might as well just provide free it services because the hilarious the hilarious part of this is there are legitimately like in bc in the province where we live towns where you someone like me could realistically roll up and actually just be like i'll take it yep um because not because i actually not because i have like billionaire money but because they are actually worthless yeah the best part of the joke is how realistic it is yeah that's that's not happening. That's not happening. No one would want to live there, Luke. Speak for yourself. You two are not...

Starting point is 01:01:30 Luke and I living in the woods. Yeah, that's it. Let's go. Yeah, let's go. Oh, yeah. The opportunity to own a significant amount of land for this many people in BC

Starting point is 01:01:41 would probably be cool. My favorite part about this is I know it actually annoys you. Jaden in full-blown chat, we live in Vancouver. Obviously we would. See? See? Hey. Hey! Okay, but I get to be the cult leader and and I have, like, sex slaves, right? This is fine.

Starting point is 01:02:07 It already is. That's basically... That's probably already happening there. Yvonne might take issue with that. Maybe. Yeah. I mean, not if they're male. I don't think she'd care about that.

Starting point is 01:02:21 Okay. Yeah. Well, we know. We do? Oh, my God. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Why we know We do oh my god You're not a slave You get paid Anywho yeah one more for you here I guess Unless you'd like to move on

Starting point is 01:02:48 Both would be okay No we can do one more Hey LLND Linus why Why do most people prefer Nvidia's DLSS Limited to Nvidia cards over the more Accessible FSR

Starting point is 01:03:03 Which is universal and open source, like XESS, despite not working equally on competitor products. Because it's better and people like things that are better. Yeah. The open source community. Loves to be like, okay, we've got a comparison matrix. Okay, feature one, check, check. Feature two, check, two check check feature three check check

Starting point is 01:03:27 feature four is it open source check not check not check bad it's really not that black and white guys that has some legitimacy to it can be great especially if you happen to have a development team that can massage that open source thing into something that works really great for you or if it's a security project so you want the transparency yeah absolutely um but no fsr is it not as good as dlss at least not at this time and there's a there's a there's a subset of people out there that actually will pay more for an experience that, in some cases, is just one that they perceive to be better. It doesn't even necessarily matter if it's actually better. People don't mind paying extra for something that they feel is better. And in this case, they're right.

Starting point is 01:04:25 It is better. So that's why. That's the answer. And I would love for FSR to take off to the point where it really is a legitimately feature-complete equivalent solution. But as far as I can tell, didn't AMD have an FSR update or something

Starting point is 01:04:48 that was supposed to add AI or frame generation or something? Wasn't FSR supposed to get an update in Q2 that it is not Q2 anymore? And AMD FSR Q2 update or something. Hold on. And then they just went went quiet on it. Guys, let me know. Let me know.

Starting point is 01:05:10 Rayok says, yet again, AMD FUD and pro NVIDIA statements getting tiring. No, actually, you're getting tiring. We literally didn't say anything about. We literally only said things that are just objectively true. I'm so sorry you're upset. This is another consistent thing. There's positives and negatives and there's personality types in all communities.

Starting point is 01:05:33 I love a very large amount of the open source community, but that's another problem. If you don't like it, it's just like, oh, you are now automatically evil. It's like, oh, hold on. Someone in chat said... Yeah, I can't find it. It's like, well, hold on. Um, someone in chat said, yeah, I can't find it. It's not FSR though.

Starting point is 01:05:49 The town would obviously be called LMG, also known as Linus municipal government. I mean, we wouldn't call the town that, but, uh, the government, that could be on my business card.

Starting point is 01:06:01 Yeah. Linus municipal government. Sure. Yeah. Omnipotent God power at Linus Municipal Government. I think we still have to follow federal and provincial laws. Ah, darn. Not with that attitude.

Starting point is 01:06:18 We just got to move further out. But my understanding is the way the cult towns get around that is all the local law enforcement just doesn't talk to outsiders. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's that's apparently the move. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:06:32 Yeah. Yeah. No one in chat has told me what that what that thing was that we're supposed to get like an update on some feature. Come on, guys. Forget it. I give up. All right, Dan. get like an update on some feature come on guys ah forget it i give up all right dan oh you want us to do two more topics we have a ton of topics today so i guess that's good luke you want to pick one uh do you want to do the goat one yeah let's do the goat one all right ceo of a parent or alleged while you do this i'm gonna go game sues goat goat moth a

Starting point is 01:07:02 youtuber that we have featured on WAN Show in the past, as he exposed The Wiggle, also known as Cheating in Tarkov. Goat, a YouTuber... Yep. Okay, cool. The opening line is exactly what I just said. That makes a lot of sense. Good job. He is being sued for a more recent video about Terrasynth, a game developer that Goat claims has used shady behavior to promote its realistic flight and war simulator, Track While Scan. Just a quick summary of the video. Terrasynth's teaser trailer, released on D-Day, received backlash last year due to the fact that the gameplay, well, clearly fake, uh, or sorry,

Starting point is 01:07:46 the gameplay is clearly fake. According to a source who left the project, the gameplay footage is actually just static models of planes on tracks that just go around these invisible tracks. Yeah, not, not, not great. The teaser likewise uses footage taken without permission. This is, Not great. The teaser likewise uses footage taken without permission. This is honestly the part that kind of bothered me a lot. The teaser likewise uses footage taken without permission of actual soldiers in Afghanistan, many of whom died two days after the recording was taken. And that was used in the trailer.

Starting point is 01:08:20 Most of assets used in Terrorist... Allegedly, most of the assets used in Terrorrasense game roadmap and trailers were stolen or purchased assets that the company tried to pass off as their own. Including, if I remember correctly, a picture of a radar screen just taken from like Creative Commons off like Wikipedia or something. They were like, this will be asset for game. But again, allegedly, allegedly, allegedly. CEO Ali Mavan, I hope I'm saying saying that right has no prior experience with game development and is allegedly ceo ali mavan has no prior experience with game development and is alleged to have exaggerated significant portions of his resume and to have seriously misrepresented the game

Starting point is 01:09:01 to potential early adopters whom he was asking for money. Allegedly, Terrasynth has continued to release trailers, including for a supposed AI traffic controller. Mavan has allegedly likewise claimed to be bidding for contracts from the US military, for what I do not know. Allegedly, much of this evidence is publicly available, but Goat likewise interviewed insiders to the project mavan is now suing goat and his insider uh contractors for defamation defamation and violating an nda contract in the state of ohio neither mavan nor goat allegedly live in ohio

Starting point is 01:09:39 and mavan doesn't allegedly own or operate any business there. Ohio lacks anti-SLAPP laws, I think it defines this afterwards, which punish frivolous lawsuits intended to silence speech that the filer disagrees with. GOAT denies having any NDA with Terrasynth at this time. Allegedly. Oh no, this one's actually, yeah, no, I'm still going to say allegedly. Allegedly, Mavan appears to have sent at least three DMCA requests to a Reddit user who posted screenshots of Terrasynth's Discord in an apparent attempt

Starting point is 01:10:17 to get the user's name and personal information. Mavan has likewise attempted to do a copyright takedown of Goat's video, which YouTube just categorically denied. They didn't even involve Goat. They were just like, nope, that is not legit. So yeah, that's going down. Maybe throw Goat some support. Check out the video. And we'll have to see how this goes moving forward. This is far from the first time we've seen a

Starting point is 01:10:46 youtuber doing some form of investigative journalism get attacked and sued by the company that they were doing the investigative journalism on um yeah slap stands for strategic lawsuits against public participation so it's using lawsuits to crush people from dissenting but yeah it's currently at 205,000 views I watched it it was quite interesting pretty much the whole way through and I suggest you check it out and throw a ghost in love that's about it next topic you shouldn't defraud yeah that's my. Yeah, it's um we've seen it a bunch unless the one to whom you are performing The defrauding against is in fact a fraudster themselves Okay, oh he's practicing. I like this. I think I think on legal levels that's still a no

Starting point is 01:11:39 But then you just sit in that like are you okay with it range? Yeah, cool sounds good And I helped. Yeah. What else do you want to talk about? Nice. Maybe that'll be legal in Linus town. It could be.

Starting point is 01:11:52 Yeah. Like if you fraud me, I fraud you right back. Eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth. And it's just, everything's okay. It's going to be biblical, baby. The end of GiphyCat. GIF hosting service Giphyiphy cat which has around 220 million I'd like to interject for a moment what you're referring to as gif is actually jif or as I like to refer to it

Starting point is 01:12:13 jif plus a Quick call it Jiffy cat just to like butcher it as much as possible Snap parent I wonder yeah, I wonder, yeah. I wonder what the official pronunciation of Jiffy Cat is. Jiffy Cat sounds very 1940s. Cat in a hurry, I like it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Snap, the parent company of both Jiffy Cat and Snapchat,

Starting point is 01:12:41 has no apparent plan to archive any of the material, leaving it to users to download whatever content they wish to preserve. Oh, wow. JiffyCat, which I'm going to call it from now on, has been running poorly for months with users experiencing failed uploads, extensive downtime, and complete silence from the service team. On May 18th, the site's TLS certificate lapsed, and it was only renewed four days later. Wow. Jiffy Cat, I forgot how I was saying it, was among the first web services to allow video encoding to GIFs,

Starting point is 01:13:16 GIFs, whatever. And it is one of the few free services, I wonder why, that supports high-definition short clips and animation. Discussion question. What madness convinces a company to offer high quality video encoding? What can we possibly do without that kind of madness? Yeah. So, um, bummer, I guess.

Starting point is 01:13:41 Darn. Yeah. I mean, no, seriously. It sucks. I like using it. This does totally suck. You know, whether, seriously. It actually sucks. I liked using it. This does totally suck. You know, whether we're talking about, what are some of the other, Imgur, Photobucket, just image hosting sites.

Starting point is 01:13:54 Free to use? Yeah. We just took them for granted for so long. And them being free never made any sense. No. Ever. Nope. What possible means could they have to to recoup their revenue

Starting point is 01:14:09 snap starting to charge people snap still exists like do people use snapchat huh i'm sure someone does hold on i i think i have their stock ticker in my just like i'm i'm curious how tech stocks are doing list. Good gravy. Snapchat monthly active users. From a high of a share price of almost $90 back sometime in like late 2021, they are down to about 10 bucks. And they've been flatlined for basically a year yeah yeah

Starting point is 01:14:50 when you google snapchat monthly active users uh at least my autofill only autofills for 2022 and 2021 i was searching for monthly active users in this current year people are like you know people are still horny so snap exists but can't can't you do that with, like, WhatsApp now? Send ephemeral pictures? Ephemeral pictures are also stupid. I mean... Okay. Well, let's talk about that.

Starting point is 01:15:20 Okay. Okay, you... If something shows up on a screen. Oh, I see what you mean yeah well yes you're like it's not actually ephemeral like what's the point i've never never understood okay that's fair because i i have literally talked i actually think it's almost a negative if anything because it gives you this false confidence if you're not very technical it gives you this false confidence that it's going to go away.

Starting point is 01:15:46 Especially when they add that feature that's like, oh, they took a screenshot. Because that's the only way to capture a screen, right? So now you're like, I will know if they did it. It's like, well, that's not true. Like, it's just not true. Yeah. False sense of security. It's a stupid feature.

Starting point is 01:16:07 That's it. I don't know. I just, I am very much not a fan. I've always thought it was dumb. Yeah, that's it. All right, fine. See you later, Jiffy Cat. Bye.

Starting point is 01:16:21 It does actually suck. I actually did like using it. I like sending gifts. This is one that we're probably going to have a bit of a longer conversation about. A new French law allows police to spy using consumer devices. That's right. This is actually happening. This is not in Iran or something. This is not in like Iran or something like this is in this is in Europe. OK, French lawmakers have agreed to a bill that allows police to spy on suspects.

Starting point is 01:16:51 Remember, the word suspects is important here. They are suspected of something. They have not actually been tried. They're not they're not guilty yet. um they're they're not they're not guilty yet um allows police to spy on suspects through remotely activating the camera microphone and a gps of their phones and other devices including laptops cars and phones holy shit um but it's okay they say because this only applies to offenses punishable by at least five years in jail use of the provision must be approved by a judge and the surveillance cannot exceed six months the provision cannot be used against sensitive professions such as how convenient is this

Starting point is 01:17:45 doctors journalists lawyers judges and members of parliament oh well that covers all the bases then we're definitely not worried about like billions of dollars worth of ip being able to be accessed by anyone that does this uh the french justice minister has said that it would affect at most dozens of cases a year. The new law has been widely criticized as authoritarian. Because it is, yeah. Holy crap.

Starting point is 01:18:15 Yeah. Absolutely mind-blowing. So if you are suspected of a crime that would be punishable by five years in prison, but you happen to be a member of parliament or a lawyer, then they can't surveil you. So many times said,

Starting point is 01:18:34 so a warrant. So it's a warrant. I don't think that's the same because you have to be served with a warrant. Don't you? No, I have no idea. No, you never,

Starting point is 01:18:41 never been warrant searched. Hmm. No, I have no idea. No, you don't have to be. Never been warrant searched. But the fact that they can execute this remotely and like, okay. You won't know. The bigger issue is what happens to this data who has access to it, right? It's going to leak at some point. Yeah, of course. Everything leaks at some point. Of course it will.

Starting point is 01:19:00 Or I mean, nevermind leak. Like what is to prevent someone from using these mechanisms oh yeah if they exist a couple weeks ago we talked about how amazon shut down that guy's um like devices because of an alleged incident with a delivery driver or something like that and i'm sitting here going the fact that an amazon employee can even do that is is mind-blowing it shouldn't even be possible and here we're sitting here going yeah we're just

Starting point is 01:19:30 going to remotely activate your camera microphone GPS of like we're actually headed into a dystopian future sir yeah you mentioned the car smart cars have always been a little weird for that. I don't know.

Starting point is 01:19:48 Like, there's something to be said about having a car that is just a car. You know? Dark24 asks, how is this any different than me surveilling all of the employees in Linus town? Well, the difference is that they're all going to know that I'm sitting around with my pants off, enjoying, you know,

Starting point is 01:20:12 the voyeurism of watching their daily lives. These people don't know. Yeah. Consenting adults. Exactly. Yeah. Obviously. consenting adults exactly yeah obviously i feel like just in case someone didn't get it that was a joke we are joking about something that was previously brought up on wan show which was talking about linus town none of that was

Starting point is 01:20:40 serious just before we get some message from someone who super did not get it who actually doesn't understand that i do not think that that's okay we don't have any net nanny on people's work computers or like you know we do screen monitoring or anything like that we are implementing uh stuff that will show like like remote management tools and you like shouldn't do personal stuff on your work computer and things like that um so there's that oh what are we monitoring for i actually don't know about any of this so i guess i'm getting my briefing it's mostly management so like we can make sure that people are getting certain updates to browsers updates to browsers, updates to Windows, things like that. If a security breach is detected, we can remote. I hate this term so much, but we can remote.

Starting point is 01:21:31 I've ranted to him before. That's why he left. We can remote air gap computers, which is not air gapping them literally at all. I hate that term, but whatever. Hey, we can also request remote into people's computers using this um i think there will be a certain tier where we can remote in without requesting but if i remember correctly the goal for that is computers that are not individuals machines okay where it's like oh this is like the stream deck pc or the sorry the stream cart pc or something like that type of stuff

Starting point is 01:22:05 if it's an individual's workstation it won't be a uh non-request whatever blah blah blah blah there's there's a bunch of we went through it with avon okay all right yeah that all sounds fine um question for you ninja yes there you go question for you. Would you have any interest in a network switch that can be remotely configured to completely like physically disconnect a port? Yeah. Okay. Cause they, they reached out, they like wanted to work together or something like that. Oh.

Starting point is 01:22:38 So like, is that, what kind of machines would that be useful for? Cause I don't think we'd be able to use them for everything. Cause they're not 10 gig or whatever. They wouldn't be for performance applications. But that's their whole shtick, is that you actually physically disable the port. But then the question I had was, if you can remotely disable the port...

Starting point is 01:22:59 Can you remotely enable it? Can you remotely re-enable it? And then is it really air-gapped? I mean, it's probably better than... If you can remotely enable it, it's just irrelevant in my opinion. Okay, so you... And then if you can't, then it's... Then it's irrelevant because you might as well just go back there and unplug it.

Starting point is 01:23:14 Like, if you have to have physical access to it. Well, no, not really, no. I'll send it to you. Yeah, it could be interesting. Yeah, I'll send it to you. People are probably curious. I'm just going to, if I don't find it immediately, searching for air gap.

Starting point is 01:23:29 Oh, here it is. OSI Layer 1 Network Kill Switch slash air gap system. We're a small cyber hardware startup based in the UK. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So it's the literal equivalent of having someone at your rack physically pulling or unplugging your LAN cable. So how, how, how so? How does it work?

Starting point is 01:23:51 They have remote triggers in development, such as, uh, LoRaWAN and ZigBee. So it would be separate from your LAN network. That's actually more interesting. If someone, if someone had, was on, like, if someone if someone had was on like if someone managed to get into your zigbee controller and also coordinated a cyber attack on a computer that they wanted to make sure you can't have a lot going on yeah it's it's it's another factor you know nothing is bulletproof but what you can do is you can add factors so it's another security factor um yeah so that's that's kind of that's kind of cool anyway it looks like that it's a network switch all right

Starting point is 01:24:31 that's a network switch yep can confirm so yeah okay but sorry how does it do it because that that that just sounded like fake air gapping again. I didn't read it. I haven't looked at it. I don't know. I'll forward it to you. Okay. We'll figure it out.

Starting point is 01:24:55 I just don't think things should be called air gap if there is no gap of air. Technically, there's probably a very small gap of air oh my goodness technically we're just a long tube I really thought we were going to talk about that French law a lot more than we ended up doing but I guess I don't think there's a lot to say it's just kind of

Starting point is 01:25:23 other than very bad reprehensible you can never imagine when you make something like this that the tools are not going to end up in the hands of someone that you don't want them to be and anytime there's a back door that means there is a possible door for someone else to find and anytime you make a lot like this you should assume that someone will use it on you someday and then you should not do that yep like i'm not i'm not i'm not pro you know i'm not pro people not i'm not pro people getting away with breaking the law you know like i'm i'm sure narrow do wells had similar objections to street lamps when they implemented them in the 1800s or whenever street lamps showed up. Apparently the reduction in just sort of general street crime was like enormous just from lights.

Starting point is 01:26:16 Let me see if I can find the... Oh, wait, hold on. A little rigorous evidence exists to support this contention. Hold on. Man, now I can't find it. In the UK, an average of 38 fewer crimes were observed in areas with improved street lighting based on five studies. Man, I was reading a thing a long time ago, so I'm not going to be able to find it again. I don't think, but it was something to do with like when street lighting was first implemented, it had like an enormous impact or something like that.

Starting point is 01:26:51 But, uh, apparently I just am completely off base on all of this. So there you go. Sweet. Um, yeah, chat street lamps, basically the same thing as pointing cameras at everyone in their own house. No, no, it's, it's not the same thing as pointing cameras at everyone in their own house no no it's not the same thing i'm just saying like we're on i feel like we're on this slippery slope right now where we're just kind of like yeah what's another camera what's another microphone and at a certain point it's like no actually it that that's actually bad um yeah um like there's a there's

Starting point is 01:27:27 an old picture of uh zuckerberg sitting at his laptop and his camera's taped over and you'd think like this this person should have substantial security right so it shouldn't be a problem so why does he care maybe because it like is a problem anyways you are never fully secured out right and like the fact that these things have cameras on both ends of them i never use the selfie cam literally ever i i don't know if the selfie cam on this phone has actually like ever been used i just flip it around and take the picture that way so like because it's a better camera no scope yeah like whatever i don't know i don't care i'm not taking pictures of myself that often so like i've thought about just covering it up before but then i'm like well there's still the camera on the other side

Starting point is 01:28:17 and microphones and everything else and all the other cameras and all the other everythings it's like i don't know never a video call not off my phone no no never i don't generally like being on my phone i especially don't really like video calls yeah actually kind of i kind of hate them like if i want to pick my nose or something then yeah speaking of which i saw some speculation that uh i'm a cokehead because i like oh no i just have a lot of nose hair yeah me too and it grows into the it grows from the one side and then it kind of like tickles the other side it's like you have to scratch it all the time yeah um that's that's the the less interesting but far more based in reality explanation for that by the way. We're aging

Starting point is 01:29:07 Yeah It's pretty awesome. Oh Man Time to talk sponsors. So someone in chat. Why take a picture of yourself and you take a picture of a burrito exactly the burrito exactly I guarantee you there's more pictures of like food in my phone than pictures of myself food pictures yeah sometimes what do I take pictures of here why don't we play categorize the picture oh god we can't look at the pictures on my phone though, but I'll tell you what they are. Oh my God. I don't even, I don't need to know that

Starting point is 01:29:51 Okay, my family My family again. Floatplane My kids petting a goat. Merch messages. My cat. Waits Me and Yvonne in the badminton building A picture that I needed to figure out some networking stuff at my, my partner's parents' place. Yvonne in bed, but it's safer work. Uh, a bottle of mayonnaise that I wanted to see if my parents were cool with, cause I needed to bring mayonnaise over to their place.

Starting point is 01:30:16 And it was like weird cause it was Japanese or something. Picture of a kid at a dance recital. A book that I want to buy for someone for Christmas. A shot of the green screen upstairs i don't know why i needed that uh my my notes because i take paper notes when i'm working out because i'm weird and old but i wanted to send a picture of it to someone so my notes the scoreboard after i absolutely annihilated yvonne at bubble hockey that was kind of brutal 14 to 1 yeah it's no wonder she doesn't want to play games with me.

Starting point is 01:30:47 My bird? A paint deficiency to send to the painters. We're pretty boring. Yeah. Actually. That's why you were aging. Oh, okay.

Starting point is 01:30:59 This was with the other camera though, but my mustache. So there is actually a selfie, but I only took the selfie because I thought it was- I looked stupid. Not because I was trying to look good. And you didn't even bother to wipe your lens. That looked awful. Yeah, because I didn't care. Terrible.

Starting point is 01:31:18 Oh man. Linus takes pictures, Luke just screenshots life. That is honestly- that is mostly what the camera's for, is effectively that. You don't have to save that stuff to your camera roll, though. If you take, well, okay, I don't know. I primarily use WhatsApp for personal communication. So if you just use the camera icon in the app.

Starting point is 01:31:42 Oh, no, no. It doesn't go to your gallery gallery it just sends it to the person and then you never see it again i think i have every single messaging app a person could possibly have because everyone wants to use something different so i don't necessarily know which person i'm sending it to and i know the that version of that camera thing at least the last time i used it which has been a while so maybe it's better but the one in discord which is my most commonly used messaging app is trash it doesn't show you the whole camera so when you take the picture there's extra stuff that it sends when you send the picture that you weren't able to see when you were taking the picture which is like the worst thing ever

Starting point is 01:32:17 people want uh bird pictures I don't I don't I don't know how to... I can't do this well. Oh my. I don't know what you're talking about. I just sent you a picture. I told you, it's been a long time. It might be different now. Yeah, it doesn't go to your camera roll. It does save it locally though.

Starting point is 01:32:40 So it probably just saves it in another folder and then I don't bother backing up those folders. I only back up my gallery gallery folder like my cam call i call it camera roll because fun fact my first smartphone that wasn't a blackberry was an iphone so i have some like old iphone user habits all right well there you go. Oh, right. Sponsors. Thanks to Hacked for sponsoring this episode. If you like The WAN Show, you should probably check out Hacked. Hacked is a tech show about cybersecurity, Internet grifters and people using technology to do something unexpected. Hacked was revived after their TV deal fell through due to the collapse of a certain cable TV network. On each episode of Hacked, hosts Jordan Blumen and Francis-Winder dig into new stories or questions like,

Starting point is 01:33:25 How did the legendary hacker Joe Grand hack open a crypto wallet with a lost password and millions trapped inside? This is Hack's first time running real ads and they're running them exclusively on The WAN Show in a frantic bid to cannibalize as much of our audience as humanly possible. The call is coming from inside the house and the caller's name is Hack'd. They even share friendly Canadian accents. Wild, eh? Thanks to Best Buy for sponsoring today's show. Best Buy recently launched their new membership program, and we're here to tell you all about it. Free to sign up, the new My Best Buy membership nabs you free shipping with no minimum purchase. The My Best Buy plan gives you even more, such as exclusive member prices, free two-day shipping, and an extended 60-day return window

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Starting point is 01:34:53 and only 4 to 5 net grams of carbs per serving. And how do they do this? Magic? No! They use a blend of monk fruit and alolos, which sweetens like sugar without increasing blood sugar levels. Milk, no milk or water. Magic Spoon is great for anytime you need a quick bite.

Starting point is 01:35:08 Check them out at lmg.gg slash magicspoon and use code WAN for $5 off. What do you think? Anti-telemarketing bot gets upgraded with AI? Because this kind of sounds awesome. Anti-telemarketer service Jolly Roger has upgraded its... Oh, wait. We're supposed to do three merch messages. Okay, Dan. Sorry, you hit me.

Starting point is 01:35:28 You could... Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. You're allowed to be in charge if you want to go with your own flow. I don't want to be anymore. That's why I hire people to be my boss. Okay, then pay attention. Hey, DLD. First merch message to the Dan Show. I was just wondering how you built a startup from the ground up, how did you avoid burning out during your growing period? Uh, when you had that dragon energy?

Starting point is 01:35:51 Oh, what a good question. How I built a startup. You can't stop. I mean, I got a little lucky. I had a great team. I worked really hard. And as for how I kept the energy, um, well, I was always in debt. So if I didn't keep going hard, then I would never pay off my debt and I would have to be bankrupt and lose my house and my family would be on the street. So if that's not a strong enough motivation, um, I don't know what is that's, uh, that's how to do it. Also, there were other ideas. In a potentially negative way, you've kind of used that against yourself before.

Starting point is 01:36:31 Like, I'm not feeling energized. Let's get myself in some more debt. I've seen it. Let's go double down. I don't know. Yeah. I don't know how great that is. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:36:48 A ton of stress. I'm probably going to die much younger than I would have otherwise. Yeah. All right. We're kind of like competing on which one of us is going to expire first. Yeah. Like I'm, I'm older than him, but like, I'm pretty sure he's actually going to beat me. Yep.

Starting point is 01:37:03 He's bigger than me. That's a big thing too. That's actually a thing. Yeah. Yeah. Tall people are all like, yeah, I'm pretty sure he's actually going to beat me. Yep. He's bigger than me. That's a thing, too. That's actually a thing. Yeah. Yeah, tall people are all like, yeah, I'm tall. You know, what's up? And I'm all like, yeah, I'm short. And how many, like, tall 95-year-olds do you know?

Starting point is 01:37:16 Boom, got him. Boom, roasted. Hi, DLL. How do you think Matter will change the home automation environment? Will we actually get better compatibility and interoperability between devices and systems? I hope so. But honestly, it's the whole XKCD standards proliferate comic strip all over again, right? Theoretically, Matter has enough momentum behind it that it's going to basically allow for consolidation. So everything will just kind of be interoperable. In practice, even some of the more open and interoperable standards in the past have struggled with either compliance from the companies that are building hardware for them, or they've struggled with a lackluster ecosystem

Starting point is 01:38:06 because of all the certification involved. There's always challenges. There's no perfect solution. I hope Matter wins. I give up though. Like at this point, I accept that there's gonna be a ton of disparate ecosystems and I'm gonna have to rely on Home Assistant or

Starting point is 01:38:25 similar to just try to tie them all together somehow. Okay and last one. Hello hello for tech news that is only somewhat gaming related how will you decide between game linked and tech linked? Most news is pretty obvious but I feel like some stories could go either way. I don't know. I would assume that game-linked would be pure gaming, and tech-linked would be where something that's kind of on the edge would fall. I think it's going to get really interesting, you know,

Starting point is 01:39:07 when maybe we have other verticals that we also cover that tech link kind of touches on once in a while and we break those out into their own thing and then all of a sudden um there's like nothing left for tech linked anymore it's i i mean it's happened to a degree to ltd do you know how much harder it is to come up with an idea for an ltt now that tech quickie and short circuit and tech linked exist yeah like people even complain when we do something that's too similar to what should be on those other channels this just felt like a short circuit it's like well it would have been an ltt like six months ago yeah yeah sorry yeah yeah i don't know i i think there's also a way that you can approach the topic um like i feel like there could be a tech linked approach to a certain topic that goes into both categories and a game linked approach to that topic like the gamers view on it versus the techies view on it

Starting point is 01:39:58 i mean that was kind of the idea with a channel like mac address is that there would be kind of the pc guy perspective over on LTT and there'd be like the Mac perspective. But I feel like people will often see us upload a video covering the same topic on two channels

Starting point is 01:40:12 and go like, why'd you guys do this? And the reality of it is it's like a different editorial team. I think that's less of an issue with linked because it'll be part

Starting point is 01:40:20 of a video that has like 10, 15 other things in it. I don't know. I don't think it's going to be that big of a problem i think the writers over at linked will take care of it i think it'll be fine go team all right one more dan sure uh hi linus and co your philosophy on only making things you feel can improve on is inspiring is there any product that you can identify that needs improvement that you wouldn't want to tackle gaming games i actually had a game developer reach out to me today, sort of asking if we want to partner to, to make a game. It's very hard. And, you know, I'm basically sitting here going like,

Starting point is 01:41:13 um, you know, here's, here's pretty much the thought process that I went through, because if you go back to WAN show five years ago or something like that five six years ago Luke and I would talk sometimes about you know ideas for games or you know the the desire to to make a game or something like that like I feel like I feel like anyone who plays games probably thinks it at some point like man how cool would it be if it was like this but not quite like that oh man I should just should, it'd be so cool to do my own game. And I do it exactly the way that I think it should be done. But the reality of it is that the genres of games that I'm most interested in are just not profitable. Like I, you know, I looked at something like YouTuber simulator, right?

Starting point is 01:41:58 That PewDiePie partnership with some like gotcha game company. I don't, I don't know who made it. Yeah. Maybe they're super reputable. I don't know. The point is it was a microtransaction game um and i i look at something like that and i go okay so the one side of me like the business side of me looks at that and goes wow that was a lot of money that would have been pretty okay right and then there's the like the more creative side of me that looks at um it looks at a gameCode, I think is a perfect example of the game that I would make if I was smart enough and talented enough and had the vision to make.

Starting point is 01:42:35 Like, it's so good. But I can't imagine that it made them the same kind of money as YouTuber Simulator. And I'm sitting here going, where's the ground here i actually i actually don't i don't know like theoretically episodic gaming was supposed to be it that it was ongoing revenue so that you can not just you know push and release and then lay off everybody and just have this toxic cycle right like it was supposed to make things sustainable but in the longer term, it ended up being microtransactions, cosmetics, and then, you know, ultimately performance advantages

Starting point is 01:43:12 in many games, because that's the way to best motivate people to just keep putting money into the machine, right? So with all that in mind, right? Like, obviously I recognize issues with the gaming industry, but I want no part of it. Yeah. And a lot of those issues are not to be that guy, but a lot of those issues are because of the community's behavior.

Starting point is 01:43:38 Like if people didn't buy excessively microtransactions to insane amounts giving companies millions and millions and millions and millions of more dollars than they would have otherwise gotten they would not make games entirely based around microtransactions like it works because the community embraces it and people are gonna be like oh i don't embrace it it's like yeah good but other people do and it only takes a small number that's the thing that was really surprising to me when i found out what percentage of the revenue of the mobile gaming industry comes from the the whales and how few there are like the fact that that you'll have artists sitting designing specific items for a whale who you know is going to buy it like according to their tastes luke blew my mind when he told me

Starting point is 01:44:25 this like like some 500 cosmetic item that they don't they don't tell that person they don't like write them a letter but they know that they're not going to be able to resist you know that one and they will someone will sit and they know when they red things or like they they really like large uh gratuitous swords that are shaped in a particular way and look really aggressive they buy just all of them so it's like okay we'll just make another one of those guaranteed sale yeah my my something that's been kind of worrying me um is the loss of i i know i always find ways to tie it back but whatever is the loss of bethesda style games because there are very few other companies that have really tried to make the really actually same type of thing um there's games that get kind of similar

Starting point is 01:45:21 but there's kind of a bethesda ID. This game where it's completely open. You can just never do the main quest ever if you don't want. It's more about constructing this interesting universe. You can do whatever you want in it. I think their biggest departure from this was Fallout 4. That has me a little bit concerned about Starfield, but I'm sure it'll still be a good game. Whatever, it doesn't matter. But yeah, I'm a little worried about that.

Starting point is 01:45:44 How did you never get into Breath of the Wild? That still blows me away. Yeah. That's like the whole thing is you just get dumped into this world and you just go exploring. I should probably just emulate it because I really didn't enjoy playing it on a Switch.

Starting point is 01:45:57 Yeah, just emulate it. It was mostly the like... It's really easy now. Like stupid easy. Like I could just set it up for you. No, I'll do it myself. But like, yeah, maybe I'll do it myself, but okay Yeah, maybe I'll do this one time. I've had a ton of gaming time

Starting point is 01:46:07 I mean unless you're planning to actually dump your own ROMs and your own firmware off of your switch I Could help you set it up. I will do that Okay I have pictures of birds people were asking for pictures of birds here are my birds There's one of my birds his name is Wally Cute boy here is other bird his name is Scoopy or just scoop also cute boy There you go no pirating done here just birds No privateer might as well have it on your shoulder Luke it's

Starting point is 01:46:48 a parrot that is specifically why I chose that timing I have been waiting to waiting to do it but I did want to do it right then because of that but yeah those are those my birds scoop and wally um okay should we talk about how emojis can be legally binding yeah this is pretty funny no no i wanted to talk about the anti-telemarketing bot ah yes okay okay jolly roger has updated its bots with chat gpt and ai voice generation the service is designed to waste telemarketers' time through meandering conversations with a variety of bot personas,

Starting point is 01:47:30 including an overwhelmed mother, a rambling drunk, and an elderly man who just woke up from a nap. When a human telemarketer connects, the bot spends a few minutes giving generic pre-programmed responses, like rambling about needing coffee, asking the caller to repeat their name, telling them they sound like a former classmate,

Starting point is 01:47:50 and interjecting with the occasional mm-hmm and uh-huh in the background. ChatGPT assesses the telemarketer's spiel, then outputs relevant responses in the bot's chosen persona. This is apparently particularly effective given that the primary tactic of telemarketers is to keep their target on the phone as long as possible. Likewise, malicious scammers prefer to prey on people who don't seem totally mentally with it,

Starting point is 01:48:16 especially seniors, making this a pretty effective counter. Now, what I want to know is how do you actually implement this on your phone? I want everyone who calls me to talk to Jolly Roger. Oh, man. Get started for mobile and landlines. Okay, what am I even looking at here? Thank you for signing up.

Starting point is 01:48:42 If you want to know how to set up a mobile phone, hello. Jolly Roger Telephone. Download the Captain's Log app. It's fun, free, and makes it really easy to set up your phone to forward unanswered calls to us for screening. Ooh. So it doesn't happen locally?

Starting point is 01:48:58 Apparently not. I mean... So you upload your phone contacts into an allow list. You can have a personal greeting. Who are you people? I would have liked it more if you chose to send the phone call to it.

Starting point is 01:49:18 Then I don't care if it's happening remotely or whatever. Robots available in US, UK, Australia, and New Zealand. Service available to Canadians, but requires long-distance calling to the US. Okay, I think I'm out for now. But overall, it sounds pretty funny. I just don't know if I'm going to use it. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:49:40 Okay, what were we going to talk about? Emojis. Yeah, emojis can be legally binding. A Canadian court has ruled that an emoji can be considered a binding signature to a legal contract. In March of 2021, Kent Mickleborough, a Canadian grain buyer, sent out text messages to several farmers in the vicinity talking about how he was looking to buy 86 tons of flax at a price of $17 Canadian per bushel. Chris Actor, a Canadian farmer, responded to the text and both got into correspondence on the phone. Mickleboro then proceeded to send a picture of the contract

Starting point is 01:50:21 to Actor asking him to confirm the contract actor responded with a thumbs up emoji but did not otherwise follow up by november the time when the contract was supposed to be fulfilled flax had risen to 41 a bushel yikes over twice the amount yeah mickleborough then sued actor for failing to provide the requested flax arguing that the emoji was an agreement to the terms of the contract actor argued in turn that he was merely confirming that he had received the contract not that he agreed to it and that he assumed that uh another contract would be sent more formally through fax or email now according to the terrible argument i i think that's actually a pretty good argument now according to the courts... That's not a terrible argument. I think that's actually a pretty good argument. Now, according to the courts filing, he will be required...

Starting point is 01:51:07 Really? Yeah. No, this is done. That's garbage. This is confirmed. According to the courts ruling, he will be required to pay $82,000 Canadian dollars, so about four bucks American, plus interest for failing to deliver the flax. Discussion question. four bucks american plus interest for failing to deliver the flax discussion question should something as ambiguous as an emoji really be considered a legally binding statement um i mean

Starting point is 01:51:32 if he put the emoji in the signature section of the contract like maybe but then that's not what happened but verbal contracts are binding here so that's something an emoji is a lot more documented than just a verbal agreement you know about how we like don't actually really have any rights right have i talked to you about that before yeah yeah canada's canada's sick um yeah that's really stupid because the way that actor i hope i'm saying that name right i'm pretty sure about mickleborough but actor i'm not certain um the way that they they they said that they did this or they said they confirmed they received the contract that's a very normal way to do things see a message give it a thumbs up is like i i've seen this whatever

Starting point is 01:52:17 it's a little bit of a stretch i think the judge said it appears the deal was at least verbally struck according to the documents wow is it is it the emoji that won this court case then or no the judge wrote i am satisfied on the balance of probabilities that Chris okayed or approved the contract just like he had done before, except this time he used a thumbs up emoji. In my opinion, when considering all of the circumstances,

Starting point is 01:52:56 that meant approval of the Flax contract and not simply that he had received the contract and was going to think about it. In my view, a reasonable bystander knowing all the background would come into this and come to the same objective understanding I don't agree. Like they had done on numerous other occasions, though. That's something that we're missing here. So that's an interesting one.

Starting point is 01:53:17 Yes. So this is not some rando contract from some rando you've never dealt with before. If this is how they've done it in the past? This is, hey, have we got a price if the only item was price and you're basically like here's the contract with the price we discussed and someone's like yep depends on the wording a bit a bit um it also depends on precedent like if if they have done a if they if a contract has been sent in the past and he thumbs it up and then they followed through

Starting point is 01:53:48 and that contract was fulfilled, then I would be like, absolutely, yes, it completely is that. But I have absolutely thumbs things up as like I have received this. You know? I was hoping to get screenshots of exactly what the texts were,

Starting point is 01:54:06 but none of the source articles here appear to have it. Yeah. I'm assuming it's, um, tied up in court or something. Yeah. Yeah. I, I, I, I, what I, what I hope is that if we saw the actual exchange of text messages, it would become very obvious that they were agreeing to the contract. But otherwise that's

Starting point is 01:54:25 That's pretty freaky man. Yeah, like if you well We have we have issues here We're like someone will digitally sign something in like a font that doesn't really look like a signature and we'll be like ah It should probably look more like it was properly signed and then this dude send an emoji What is that an issue we have? It has been before. Oh, okay. Signatures are the stupidest.

Starting point is 01:54:50 They're just so dumb. The stupidest possible validation of anything. Absolutely. If it's witnessed by a notary or whatever, like that's at least something. But just, man, have you ever had a cashier like not accept your credit card because the back isn't signed i pretty much guarantee mine isn't right now like don't don't pull it

Starting point is 01:55:10 out on stream i wasn't gonna oh okay i was gonna do it on the table but it doesn't matter yeah but i don't think i've ever signed a credit card okay have you ever had them ask you to sign it before i know people that have had that before. What does that prove? I used to be a stickler. When I had my first retail job ever, I would check ID for every single credit card because I was told to do that. So I was like, okay.

Starting point is 01:55:39 Yeah. And I just did it. I checked ID every single time and I would legitimately actually try to pair it that was ncix policy yeah some people would get really mad they'd be like i don't want to show you my idea i'd be like then i don't want to take your credit card i don't yeah i would do the same thing yeah and then i i don't know if i've ever been id'd for using my credit card for any value amount. Yeah, but it's pins now. You're a young boy. I got ID'd.

Starting point is 01:56:08 I was older than you, so it was still... No, no, I was IDing people when they were putting in pins and stuff. Oh, you don't have to do that. They told me I did at the time. Where was this? This was Best Buy. What? I don't know.

Starting point is 01:56:24 Yeah, that's stupid. I well pins are not very secure They're a lot more secure than like no this is like definitely has a signature on the back for sure yeah Yeah, no we know I absolutely I absolutely had to Like Conrad and Chad just mentioned he taps things up to $400 that's the other thing. Conrad in chat just mentioned that he taps things up to $400. That's wild. Tap doesn't take a pin. Kumo Star says, all my credit cards say CID. That's something I used to see a lot back in the day.

Starting point is 01:56:53 People would write that in the signature thing because they understand that signatures mean absolutely nothing. And if someone steals their card, they want them to. Then again, if I stole someone's credit card and it said cid on the back i'm sure i could come up with a creative way to use some isopropyl alcohol to remove it just sign over top of it with some kind of chicken scratch signature or whatever like i really why are we still using pieces of plastic to move our money around i don't understand it all the tap limits i'm seeing i don't know how conrad has one for for uh 400 bucks someone else in chat says they have one for 600 though so this is apparently a thing mine's 200 i googled it they're all saying 250 but there's

Starting point is 01:57:34 multiple people in chat saying that they have one for more than that so what you can this this person tapped uh i tapped to pay with my phone at a micro center for 600 bucks. So you don't need ID for a $600 transaction. That's wild. That's a lot of money. Like we're going all the way back. The pins are like useless now. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:57:57 Like how many times are you going to process a transaction for more than your tap limit? I like never have it happen. You know, I, I would, I would say that it would okay i i would far be it for me to just far be it for me to just come up with you know a security best practice live on the wan show but i'd say it's probably not unreasonable to just disable

Starting point is 01:58:21 the taps on your cards just gouge the chips out. And then if you want to tap, then you should ingest your card into your phone and use your phone for tap payments. And then you'll still be able to use your card. I never use my phone. Do you have to unlock your phone to tap pay? Yeah, you have to unlock your phone. So then at least you're adding some amount of validation

Starting point is 01:58:42 to any kind of contactless payment. And you can still use your card with a pin. Like you can still insert it. It's a separate chip. It's not the RFID chip that is used for... Oh, apparently there's no tap limit in the US. There can't be no tap limit. Someone in the chat said,

Starting point is 01:59:01 I tapped without ID for a $1,200 chair. That's stupid. I've tapped a different person i've tapped 1200 in a foreign country a different person i tapped to pay 1700 at a micro center that's actually completely bananas this is this is like going back to checkbooks except people can just write checks and they don't even need to sign the checks. They just hand checks to people and they just use your money. That's wild. Elon tapped to buy Twitter. Okay.

Starting point is 01:59:41 Elon tapped for other reasons. Help make sure we don't run out of people. It's a major concern, Luke. I regularly charge people $3,500 and they can tap no problem. I tapped to pay like $2,500 for my PC build components last year. Oh, it was on my iPhone. That's a little different. Yeah, that's different.

Starting point is 02:00:09 That's validated. That's not a tap. Yeah, you're signing into your phone. That is definitely different. Yeah, no, when we're talking tap, we're talking when you have just the card, just the credit card or the bank card and you just touch it on something.

Starting point is 02:00:24 WhiskeyNerd88 in full-plane chat said, I work for Capital One Bank credit card or the bank card and you just you just touch it on something whiskey nerd 88 in full-plane chat said i work for capital one bank and yes you can tap for up to five thousand dollars for your card that's stupid you can tap for what my my gut is going to tell me has got to be more than most people's credit limits i have no idea what the average credit limit is. Not a clue, but I can't imagine it's more than $5,000. You know, I had a really funny conversation with Plouffe. We were discussing just like, you know, credit card usage and, you know, frugal lifestyle. I was talking about how someone was like complaining about how out of touch I am because I'm always saying don't buy cheap garbage. Buy used good stuff because it costs the same and it lasts longer and performs better.

Starting point is 02:01:12 And that's not out of touch. And if you think it's out of touch, you're actually stupid. Yeah, no, it's the thing that comes up like quite often, actually. You'd be surprised. Yeah. Well, all you got to do is go read the comments on any of those don't buy cheap GPUs videos. Like you remember that, right? Yeah.

Starting point is 02:01:27 Yeah. Oh, how elitist Linus. Some people can't afford better. That's not the point. Then you, oh my God. We have been there. Go buy used stuff. It's better.

Starting point is 02:01:36 So we were talking about sort of like the frugal lifestyle because I was saying like a lot of the way that I look at used versus new products comes from not growing up with money. And he was talking about we actually drove the same model of car at some point. And he was talking about how like, yeah, he uses his credit card for everything. But he was always just like completely anal about paying it off. And he said that a big part of the reason for it was actually that he had a fundamental misunderstanding about how interest works on credit cards. And what I realized is that a lot of the anxiety that I had about carrying a balance on my credit card, I started out with a $500 credit limit. And the reason is that, and look, I don't care. People who are morally opposed to credit ratings

Starting point is 02:02:31 or who think credit cards are the work of the devil or whatever, in North America, it's not how it works. It's really important to have a good credit rating and having a credit card that you pay off all the time is actually not detrimental. It is actually beneficial to you because there are benefits of paying with a credit card versus paying with a debit card. I really don't feel like debating it with you.

Starting point is 02:02:50 You're wrong. So I had a $500 credit card, and one of the reasons that it was so low was that I wanted to make sure that I never, ever carried a balance on it because I thought that the 23% interest or whatever was immediately owed if you carried your balance to the next month. And it wasn't until he told me that that was a big part of why he was so on top of his credit card all the time that I realized, holy crap, I thought the exact same thing until sometime into my adult

Starting point is 02:03:26 life. I don't remember exactly when I figured out that it was an annual interest rate, um, but then like billed monthly. Um, so I thought that if I spent a hundred dollars, I would, and I didn't pay it back by the end of the month, I would owe $123 123 so i used my credit card like cash and it and it baffled me that anyone ever lost track of how much they owed on their credit card because oh my god every five dollars is six dollars who could possibly lose track of that um oh this is great flow plane chat it's not I'm 20 and this is news to me. It doesn't mean you shouldn't treat it that way. Yeah, the best advice I can give you is treat it like that.

Starting point is 02:04:10 Yeah. Because that's exactly how you fall into the trap. Yeah, no, stop thinking you're dumb. There's all these people who are like, I'm a moron. Stop. Like, actually. Yeah, you're actually doing it good. There's huge benefits.

Starting point is 02:04:23 Again, I don't feel like debating this with Europeans. I don't care. What you think about it doesn't matter right now. There's huge, huge benefits to North Americans for using a credit card regularly and always making sure that it's paid off. If you don't, you can't buy a house and stuff. And stuff.

Starting point is 02:04:41 It's actually extremely important. We're not going to talk about it. Yeah. But that's how they get you. As soon as you start carrying a balance, it creates that bad habit, right? So, yeah. Treat it like this. Oh, man.

Starting point is 02:04:56 Oh, man. People in chat, why did you tell me this? I would have lived better without this knowledge. The way that people are reacting actually has me actually concerned. I didn't see this coming i didn't see people reacting this way there's also a component of like usage limit as well so if you have like five hundred dollars of credit you can't have five hundred dollars on it otherwise you also get impacted like there's a there's a point you can't use all of your allowed credit otherwise it also negatively affects your credit. Like there's a, there's a point you can't use all of your allowed credit. Otherwise it also negatively affects your credit rating.

Starting point is 02:05:29 Yeah. It's a whole, it's a whole like black magic to figure out exactly how the math works. But the best thing is to use it regularly and pay it off before the end of every month. I remember someone tell, because one of my genius ideas was like, oh, well, I only have like a crappy savings account anyway, with like 0.8% interest or whatever. So just to make sure that I never go over my credit card limit, I'll just dump my savings into my credit card and then it'll always carry a positive balance. And so I'll just never have to like worry about accidentally whatever.

Starting point is 02:06:04 And then I can spend more than my $500 credit limit on a single transaction as well because I have like but then I was told that that's bad having it like overpaid all the time is like bad or something yeah I didn't actually know that part yeah I that might not even be true or it might not be true anymore um I remember Yvonne was telling me something I often do that before trips on purpose just in case like massive emergency. No, a little bit's fine. Okay.

Starting point is 02:06:27 But yeah, just like always having it. I don't know. It looks weird or something. Anything that's like weird is bad. That makes sense. Yvonne was telling me that like having, this was for like a line of credit for the business or something like that. I'm like, I don't know, just get it.

Starting point is 02:06:39 And then if we need it, then we have it. And she's like, no, no. If you like have it and don't use it, that's bad. And I was like, why? Then that just means you're a baller and you like you know can handle your bills or something She's like no no, it's not how they see it sure This is for the business, I don't know if personally

Starting point is 02:07:10 I do I do use yvonne for financial advice i thought he had a messenger a couple months ago i was like what credit card do i get i don't know disclaimer yvonne is not a financial advisor no no no no no oh lordy hey she knows some stuff she's smart and things they should public publish the algorithm yeah that would be good for us wouldn't it um okay moving on do you have any other yeah nintendo published their annual report for the last financial year and they don't pay their executives completely asinine amounts of money. Yeah, I talked about this in GameLint. Go check it out. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know.

Starting point is 02:07:50 I'm going to butcher all the names, so I'm not going to say them. But the top five are essentially $2.5 million, $2 million, $1.5 million, just over $1 million, and just under $1 million. A year. Yeah. Does this include stock value? This seems to be total compensation. Wow. Yeah, this is the total pay of their highest compensated employees.

Starting point is 02:08:12 And apparently this is just relatively normal in Japan. The CEO of Sega gets about three million a year and the president of Square Enix receives four million annually. Actually, it sounds like Nintendo's kind of cheaping out a little bit there. This is significantly below the total compensation received by game company CEOs elsewhere in the world, even if the base salaries are not dissimilar. So Andrew Wilson of EA has a salary of $1.3 million,

Starting point is 02:08:37 but made $39 million in total compensation in 2020. EA's net income for 2021 was $837 million, while Nintendo's was $4.37 billion. Now, it should be noted, shareholders have since voted to reduce Wilson's compensation package, but he's still expected to make $20 million in 2023. Discussion question is, is there a diminishing return in terms of incentive when it comes to absurdly high bonuses is having high but extremely unstable compensation a problem for long-term thinking and leadership yeah that's absolutely a problem like i uh oh man executive pay if you have you ever have you ever looked at

Starting point is 02:09:20 the line divergence between like median worker pay and executive pay in north america it's like actually ridiculous over the last like 50 years yeah um it's kind of cool it's kind of cool to see nintendo not lose the plot here also i do have to kind of wonder a little bit how they retain top talent when you know nintendo's kind of the envy of the gaming industry when it comes to just consistently delivering gaming experiences that delight their customers year after year after year after year work culture in japan is very different i do know that company loyalty culture in japan is much bigger i was reading an article about um someone who runs a business um helping people quit their jobs so they go in and represent them to to go and quit

Starting point is 02:10:14 the job and they just like the person just like sits there while the representative explains that they're not going to be working there anymore yeah it's like in like it's like a really big smooth and tactful way and i was like what yeah yeah which in some ways i can respect a lot and in other ways i think is rife for potential abuse but honestly from what i've heard over a bunch of years of not paying very much attention it usually goes pretty well like i don't know i don't know it's scary if that happened here i do not think it would go well i think that's pretty weird yeah like i just don't even i don't i don't mean here as in linus media group i mean here as in north america oh no i just mean personally if someone i don't even I don't even think we'd let the stranger into the building. Like, why are they?

Starting point is 02:11:08 Oh, oh, I don't even mean that. Oh, sorry. No, that happens in North America. That's the thing. Really? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. That's the thing on both sides, too.

Starting point is 02:11:17 You can hire an outside person to fire someone for you, and you can hire an outside person to quit for you. Really? Both of those things are a thing. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. How about that? I meant the like absolutely immense amount of the, the like social expectation from the country that you are loyal to your company. Hopefully I'm describing this properly. I do not mean to offend, but yeah, I yeah, I think that would be abused if it was here. And as far as my understanding goes, it doesn't really get abused there, which is cool. Mudoru says, work culture in Japan makes it really hard to get rehired if you are, for whatever reason, let go or even quit of your own volition. That's unfortunate.

Starting point is 02:12:00 That's, wow. It's potentially really rough. Huh. Okay. Yeah. unfortunate that's wow it's potentially really rough huh okay yeah okay well um yeah here's good relatively speaking i mean we have our problems um yeah tiktok tries a novel approach book publishing sorry i just really thought this was funny I know let's go ByteDance appears to be ramping up its new publishing arm Eighth Note Press which started approaching self-published writers earlier this year this might be an interesting opportunity for some authors as TikTok has become an unexpected powerhouse in catapulting below the radar novels into smash hits it has also raised concerns that ByteDance might use TikTok to squeeze out

Starting point is 02:12:48 user-driven viral book recommendations through promotion of its own publications. Yep, that makes sense. Discussion question here is, I love this, are you more worried about ByteDance promoting pro-China books through their platform or about vapid nonsense written by thirst trappers? Yeah, just both. I don't know. Are you actually expecting an actual answer? Yeah.

Starting point is 02:13:18 Oh, man. Honestly, probably the second. I'm not going to tell you why i know about them but there are some very low quality high volume ebook platforms out there that are basically just like garbage for people who just want to read romance books i i knew it. Yeah. I was going to ask you if it was specifically. I'm immensely curious. I can tell you that it is very easy to spend a lot of microtransaction money

Starting point is 02:13:54 on said platforms. Very easy. That is a thing that can happen. I just, I know. There are things I know, Luke. Sometimes I know things. Huh. Huh. Yeah.

Starting point is 02:14:09 Huh. Well, I know he will tell me no more than that. Yeah, it's going to be about it. In other news, the 12-volt high-power connector has been replaced with a new standard. CI-SIG will be replacing it with one called 12 volt 2x6 oh good good name um the new specification lists no changes to the header meaning that the new standard should be compatible with existing 12 volt high power headers the changes are expected to prevent power from flowing if the connector is not fully inserted something that apparently

Starting point is 02:14:43 wasn't a huge priority before um notable. The depth of power terminals has been increased from 4.2 to 4.45 millimeters. Okay. The depth of the sense pin terminals has been decreased from four millimeters to two and a half, and the support card's up to 675 watts, up from just 600. So there you go. Hopefully we won't have any more burned ones but also who knows and i think that's pretty much it yeah we could talk about fair phone coming to america that seems pretty good that's about it fair phone is coming to america five-year warranty pay fair phone sick yeah why don't we do some merch messages dan what do you got for me it's time for when after dark when now

Starting point is 02:15:24 after dark. When? Now. After dark. So I'm looking at potential. Are you going to try to defeat me at bubble hockey after WAN show today? I'm still undefeated. Yvonne got close. I can, I can try.

Starting point is 02:15:48 I think I'll only have one game in me because my back is very tired. And that machine is short. I discovered that people actually build platforms to lift it up because they're my height. That makes sense. Yeah, that's the thing that definitely makes sense. I actually can't play too many games in a row because the tight... I wonder if part of it is just the tension. Oh, very possibly. Because if you're just like relaxed and playing it should be fine no i'd have to squat to do that like i can't i can't use the controls properly really i don't think so

Starting point is 02:16:16 i think you probably or or i'd be cranking my neck like crazy which is just going to create a new problem like there's no yeah yeah basically i bought a super checks machine because I am an idiot. It's fun. It's a ludicrous game really fun I love it's very it's a lot Deeper than I would have expected They're like a lot more like yeah Assume the sumo stance you have it for how long like these aren't even that short of games it's like three minutes no no no let's time it i don't think so okay we can time it we can time have you done that before i well i know i just looked it up it's apparently the default is three minute periods oh yeah but there's like pauses okay all right all right okay so yeah let's get

Starting point is 02:17:04 into this there's uh there's also one person has to score at the end. Oh, yeah, the final puck. Yeah. That can last for a long time. That's true. That's true. Yeah, true. Anyways.

Starting point is 02:17:15 We got a lot of potential, so... We're just going to get right into the curated with some horrible ones. Pool updates. Oh, we talked about that, didn't we? No, we didn't. You and I did. We weren't live? Hold on, hold on.

Starting point is 02:17:28 No, you're having a friendly chat. Ah. Can't tell the difference sometimes. Basically just blurs into one continuum. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Dan, do you want to flip over to my thing or my doodle? Not right now. Hold on.

Starting point is 02:17:47 Can you relax for a second? No, not really. Not when you're talking about sharing your screen. Okay. All right. There's specifically a point in time I cannot relax. Okay. All right.

Starting point is 02:17:58 Oh. Oh, I see what you want. Camera. Line of scan. There we go. Oh, yeah. I could have done that. So theoretically, it is what you want. Camera. Line of scan. There we go. Oh, yeah, I could have done that. So theoretically, it is full of water.

Starting point is 02:18:10 There is still plenty of time for things to be screwed up. But I will say, to their credit, since I called them out on social media, they have had a fire under their butt and have actually done work. Oh, this is the original contractors? Yeah. Oh. There's still time for it to be screwed up um like it sort of potentially already is yeah i had already talked to luke about how yvonne specified and i i look i have to i have to it's still incorrect

Starting point is 02:18:39 it's a first world problem it is still incorrect yvonne specified that she would like the water to be cool blue that is green you might need to explain how that makes any sense yeah so the the plaster that they line it with has flecks that are supposed to reflect and color the water um and it is not the color that she specified, which means it doesn't match the tile. Eggshell Rant V2. So it just honestly looks kind of stupid. But like...

Starting point is 02:19:18 Got him. At this point, I think I'd take basically anything. At this point, I think I'd take basically anything. Yeah, so there's just been, you know, one thing after another with it. And there's still time for the equipment to, like, not work properly. I don't know. And it's possible that this is just from schmoo in the water from the plaster. Like, they just plastered it and polished it.

Starting point is 02:19:46 So maybe it's, like, maybe it's schmooed or something. Potentially. I don't think so. That's a lot of water from the plaster. Like they just plastered it and polished it. So maybe it's like, maybe it's schmood or something. Potentially. I don't think so. That's a lot of water in there now. How long was it sitting before they filled it? It can't be that much schmoo. It wasn't. They polished it and then filled it.

Starting point is 02:19:58 Yeah, no, no. Yeah, no, no. No, it's green. So that's cool. Yeah, it's just frustrating because yes, first's green. So that's cool. Yeah, it's just frustrating because, yes, first world problem. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. But on the other hand, they asked us what color we wanted. So don't ask if, yeah, you're not going to do it.

Starting point is 02:20:22 Someone's like, I would ask them to change it. No, we're not doing that. They would have to, like, what like what Like jackhammer out the previous plaster Like it's not Could you just do another layer I don't know we're not doing that So that's the colour that it is now And I wish we had a different tile colour

Starting point is 02:20:38 Or something because they really Don't match at all but yeah it is what it is And even though it is now Full of water it's not actually full It's filling right now even though it's filling with water right now um it's still going to be a month before we can swim i think why is this pissed at the minimum viable product and people are surprised that's well that's not it's it's like incorrect. Yeah, if someone asks you what color shirt you want,

Starting point is 02:21:09 and you say green, and they say okay, and then they send you a red one. A plain blue shirt. Yeah, you're going to be like, well, what the fuck? This isn't what I paid for. Yeah, like you have a shirt. He has a pool. The pool is the wrong color.

Starting point is 02:21:24 The shirt is the wrong color. The shirt is the wrong color. Like, is it? Like, that's stupid. Yeah. If you weren't able to control the color of it, why'd you ask me then? Yeah. Like, it's... Guys, why are you trying to be dumb?

Starting point is 02:21:39 Oh, he's saying, I don't really understand. It's fine. It's okay. Whatever. Pool wrong. Moving on. Next message. The real question is, can we land a float plane in it? he's saying i don't really understand it's fine it's okay whatever pool wrong moving on next message the real question is can we land a float plane in it i mean yeah courtesy of legendary rust here we could the model one yeah yeah they like actually could oh man model float plane man that's

Starting point is 02:21:59 a product that i wanted to do not not a not a float plane that that's a product that i wanted to do um like a long time ago when my kids were little and they they still like took baths together and stuff like that and i was like man how cool would it be to do like an rc an rc boat but that's like i don't know three inches long and that has like a water resistant remote that you can just like rip around in the tub and i know they they exist, but like a good one. A good one, yeah. You know, one that is actually good. Man, how cool would it be to just have like

Starting point is 02:22:32 little six inch boats that you can like rip around in the pool? I'd be so into that. Freaking awesome. Hi, Linus and Luke. Linus, how can I start badminton if I have zero friends? Maybe at your upcoming place? And Luke, when you, how can I start badminton if I have zero friends? Maybe at your upcoming place? And Luke, when you started badminton, what was the hardest thing you had to get used to?

Starting point is 02:22:51 You first. The hardest thing he had to get used to was sucking so much. Wow. Compared to someone who is obviously so much weaker and lower testosterone. Wow. Because he sucks compared to me like so much ass And Linus how about that's why I have to clean out his mouth get the ass taste out Couldn't get him

Starting point is 02:23:27 I'd like hold the water in the front So I could breathe behind it I'm lucky I didn't have too much I'm gonna get water all over the front of that laptop one day You mark my words Not yet Oh my goodness Sorry, the question for me How to get into it with zero friends It's really tough You mark my words. Not yet. Oh, my goodness. Sorry.

Starting point is 02:23:49 The question for me, how to get into it with zero friends, is really tough, especially because most of the centers don't do drop-in anymore these days, not since the COVID shutdowns. Also, when you go play drop-in as a novice, it's really hard to get people to play with you. I found that more casual groups tend to show up at, like, school gyms and church gyms i i have no idea how to find them though i know in taiwan i'll just like go on meet up or and then once you get into like one group you find someone who's kind of at your level and then you like network through them

Starting point is 02:24:21 that's kind of the best way to do it. But yeah, our place will have drop-in sessions. But like, again, there's nothing we're going to be able to do to force people to play with you. And if you're a complete novice... You have to be social and ask people to play. Yeah, it's tough. For me, it was a lot of the movement is very unnatural to me. There's certain like stances and things you do with movement

Starting point is 02:24:48 where in contact sports, it's like a big no-no because you're putting yourself in a fairly unstable position if someone was to become in contact with you at that point in time, if that makes sense. It's not necessarily super unstable, but if an outside force like pushed you, you'd fall over. So things like that, my brain is like telling me no no no no don't don't do this but then everyone watching me is like okay the way you're moving sucks and is dumb and you need to do this other way um also like hitting the birdies my brain wants to like club them

Starting point is 02:25:22 and you're supposed to do this like wrist turn thing more and stuff like that like a lot of it just doesn't really a lot of sports come fairly naturally to me and badminton does not come very naturally to me yeah okay this one might get a bit spicy oh lord do you agree with lewis rossman's take that Google is going to war with ad blockers, is nickel and diming, and a sign of YouTube being on the verge of monetary collapse? I mean, I don't think it's a particularly hot take that YouTube is in a video that YouTube should charge for 4K is that the 4K users are by far the heaviest users. They are like in terms of placing load on the platform. be they're also the most discerning users and the ones that should be most willing to pay for the uh the storage and especially the bandwidth cost associated with high resolution video um i i don't consider it to be nickel and diming to expect people to um compensate the platform and

Starting point is 02:26:40 the creators for the content that they consume. No, not really, actually. So that's the one part where, yeah, I don't know that I can necessarily agree with Lewis 100%, but I definitely do agree that it's clear they need to do something to remain viable because neither Luke nor I has been able to figure out for all these years how any of this makes any sense. And at some point, things have to make sense. And if they don't make sense, then they go away. See Jiffy cat, um, see Twitter, right? Like it's, if it's not sustainable, then it won't

Starting point is 02:27:12 be sustained eventually by definition. Yeah, exactly. And so, um, I don't know, would we, would we say that theaters are nickel and diming because they prevent people from sneaking in? I mean, nobody was going to sit in those seats anyway. Like that often that's the argument for ad blockers is I wasn't, I wasn't going to pay for premium and I wasn't going to watch that or I wasn't going to buy anything anyway. And it's like, okay, but, um, like that's the, you're, you're taxing this service. Yeah. That's the price of admission. It costs money to give this to you. I mean this service yeah that's the price of admission it costs money to give this to you i mean in the case of the theater actually like there's a marginal cost

Starting point is 02:27:51 your hvac has to work ever so slightly harder to account for your approximately 100 watts of heat and they might have to clean up after you if you make a mess the average technically wearing the chairs that's true that's true those chairs are actually very surprisingly expensive um there's also opportunity cost linus is wrong 4k was a free option then youtube wanted to charge for it you can't charge for something that was free previously you absolutely can unquestionably you can absolutely do that wow wow wow Questionably you can absolutely do that Wow Wow The community might not like it you you will pretty much always get negative sentiment in response to that But you're X you super definitely can do that Correct.

Starting point is 02:28:43 You super definitely can do that. Hey, DLL, I've always wondered how much creative influence the editors have over videos. Is there an editing Bible that you try to follow? Thanks for all you do. If there is, I haven't seen it in a long time. I think Ed probably has some guidelines and stuff. There's definitely rules that we have overall. I mean, it's not necessarily the editors, but like I had to remind people recently of our policy for gross out content. And I had to clarify it a little bit. We had a video recently that had someone flossing

Starting point is 02:29:14 their teeth in it. And I was like, Hey, can I just remind you of the no gross out policy? Because I saw some comments about it. Ever since we did that channel super fun video where people were eating without their hands like SpaghettiOs off of a piece of plexiglass that had a camera under it, we basically, like, we thought it was kind of, like, funny and it would look ridiculous, and it was kind of funny, and it did look ridiculous, but it was unsettling. And if you get even 3% of people who tune into a video

Starting point is 02:29:41 immediately navigating away when something grosses them out, that's going to hurt your channel's recommendation. Disgust is a powerful emotion. Yeah, your recommendability. And so I sent out a little memo being like, hey, no, remember? And I got a bit of pushback from people saying, well, where's the line? What grosses out one person doesn't necessarily gross out another. And so I kind of had to think of something. And I basically said, look, if it would be considered rude in mixed company at the dinner table, then it doesn't go in the video. And so that's kind of our current line on it. So any, you know, biting fingernails, flossing teeth, you know just anything basically anything where a body fluid

Starting point is 02:30:25 is involved is probably over the line um so there's things like that um you know there's definitely uh guidelines we have in terms of we never like to see just you know jump cuts you know just just like crappy you know 20 2010 era youtube uh, where you just like take out every tiny gap and the, the host is just constantly jump cutting. Uh, I've never liked that style. So that is always supposed to be covered with B roll or with a website capture, just anything, anything to mask a cut. Um, so there's things like that, but, uh, in terms of like the content itself, I mean, that's mostly between the writing team, me, and then the editor adds their special flair, and then it gets a final review from someone up high, usually Nick Light. I think Colton's been doing some of them.

Starting point is 02:31:17 Theoretically, I should be doing them, but I never get to it. I'm just doing so much stuff. Quick question. All the LTX land computers are are brought by people right we're not providing any uh as far as i know yeah cool yeah that answers the question um aggie says biting fingernails is not gross out lol um it would be considered it would be considered rude at a dinner table with mixed company. Yeah, so then it is. That's the line. People are replying.

Starting point is 02:31:50 I bite bad and I know I'm gross. Way to go, Bordaga. Okay, moving on. Hey, DLL, but mostly little L. In the Framework Factory Tour, you mentioned that they assemble the DIY kits to test them. If they assemble them, how and why are they cheaper? Also, big and tall sizes win. I didn't want to say this incorrectly, but I'm pretty sure it's because the DIY editions come, the lowest tier comes without stuff, right? Yeah. No memory, no storage. Yeah. So then you can save a buck if you can get a good deal on some memory and storage somewhere else. Or if you already have

Starting point is 02:32:24 some. So that's really the main benefit. As for big and tall sizes, man, they're working on it. One of our fit technicians who's been off for a while is back now. So hopefully we'll have a little bit more resources to dedicate to that. We get questions about this every week. I promise you, when they happen, we will let you know on WAN Show and I will be wearing one. I am very excited about that. Yeah, it'll just be tall by then, but he's going to do it.

Starting point is 02:32:51 Yeah, hell yeah. Hi, LLD. We'll be listening on Spotify on Monday. Has there ever been a time you've been tempted to stray away from the prosumer mindset LMG is known for? Pro-consumer mindset. Come on, Dan. That's a very different word. Oh, pro-consumer. I mean, yeah, sure. Like I think any business that looked you in the eye or any business owner that looked you in the eye and said, I have never once been tempted to make more money in a way that uh benefits me selfishly um either is like some kind of saint or is not being honest with you like remember when we well i think just not

Starting point is 02:33:37 being honest when we would talk about l uh l ltd coin or like a rug pull coin or like all that kind of stuff. Like it's, you know how, yeah. How, how cool would it been? Would it have been to just like make $10 million by just minting it, farting out some garbage. Yeah.

Starting point is 02:33:56 Um, and, and we even like, we talked about it. We were like, we talked about it publicly on WAN show. So none of this is a secret, but we,

Starting point is 02:34:03 we talked about it. We said like, oh man, we could even just be, we could even just be totally upfront about it publicly on WAN Show, so none of this is a secret. But we talked about it. We said, like, oh, man, we could even just be totally upfront about it. Guys, this is a rug pull. So if you're not in, if you're not on it. If you time it right. Yeah, right when the rug gets pulled, you're going to be the one on your butt. And, you know, this is our cynical, you know, money fabrication endeavor. So let's go.

Starting point is 02:34:28 Like we just decided not to. And we were just like, ah, fine. I guess we just want, I mean, NFTs were another example of just a way that we could have made some easy money. Instead, we did still make some easy money, but not nearly as much. And we did it by just mocking NFTs. We just sold pictures of potatoes. We actually sold like $8,000 worth of pictures of potatoes. It's kind of obscene.

Starting point is 02:34:53 Let's go. Hey, I'm sure there's people who printed out their potato and put it on their wall. Dude, some of them, okay, some of them were legitimately kind of cool. The people, those potatoes, okay, were minted on, you know, LMG dime. And I say dime, you know, sort of. Fairly accurately, it was about $22 if I remember correctly. Yeah. Something like that.

Starting point is 02:35:16 Yeah, to generate. That might have actually been something else. I don't remember. It wasn't very much. It was extremely low. Yeah. Yeah. If I remember correctly, there's a free amount that they give you.

Starting point is 02:35:25 I think it's like 20 bucks allowance before it starts costing you money. Oh, wait. Yeah. No, the 22 was for something else. I'm pretty sure we didn't even breach the free allowance. I think it costs us like nothing, but I don't, I don't really remember. Ghost Robless on Twitch says integrity is much more worth than $10 million. You would be surprised.

Starting point is 02:35:45 You'd be surprised how many people... There is a massive amount of people that would disagree with that. There's a massive amount of people that would agree with that, and then given the actual real opportunity in front of them, actually in real life, would go the other way.

Starting point is 02:36:02 $10 million is a lot of money. Like there is a, there is a changes the life of you and everyone, you know, amount of money. Oh yeah. It's crazy. Yeah. There, there is a very disappointingly large percentage of people that will verbally stand behind ideas. And then the second, even a single dollar comes into question they will immediately crumple those ideas like just

Starting point is 02:36:29 Yeah, anyways, we should probably move on Will there be any plans to make floatplane merch like Luke has also when are the tech pants going on the store? You can't take my shirt Yes, we have a blue blank It's a very dissimilar color to that one, but it's blue. Flowplane, it turns out, doesn't have a Pantone for its blue. Oh. So that's inconvenient.

Starting point is 02:36:57 Ah. Yeah. So the design team, you know, put some blues in front of me, and I was like, that doesn't really seem like Flowplane. And they're like, well, it's not. And I was like, what do you mean? Well, it doesn't's not and i was like what do you mean well it doesn't have one it was like what do you mean it doesn't have one what about that one they're like yeah that's not like a real color that's just yeah so anyway um we're working on it sweet this is pretty close

Starting point is 02:37:19 how did they do this that's from american apparel so they can't print colors no no it's the it's the base like the actual shirt yeah yeah they can't create a shirt that isn't pantone well it it's a melange i don't i don't know how any of this yeah no no okay yeah no all right so like there's a there's a reason people use pantone because it allows you to communicate color across devices across oceans and like we could send them that shirt and be like make this but they actually wouldn't be able to do that particularly because this is a melange so first they dye the blue what does that mean it means it's got blue and white fabric in it look look closely oh my god your eyesight is so bad you never noticed that's not like a uniform color?

Starting point is 02:38:07 I honestly thought that was just the pilling. Because it's really old. I also don't really care. Okay. Well, anyway, there's two different colors that are, I'm going to get this wrong. It's either woven or something, but they're put together. woven or something but they're put together and so what you see is partially some partially other as they you know weave in back and forth oh yeah replicating that exact look very difficult without knowing exactly what weave and exactly what colors and ratios and blah blah blah blah blah so no we have to basically do our own shirt and it's um yeah it's a lot lighter like it's fine that jayden revealed the fun secret oh what's this the shirt isn't one of the full

Starting point is 02:38:50 paint colors either yeah yeah no because there isn't one so yeah it is a color that was just an american apparel shirt that we picked like it yeah it was whatever they had in stock because they never had anything l plus ratio plus not a real panto sorry that was that was good that's uh devin the dev in flowpoint chat sorry go for it no it's great hey dll for lime how's that how's that not the best name ever for a developer devin the dev yeah like uh, what are you up to? I'm just Devin. My best friend when I was growing up was named Devin, and he is currently a Dev.

Starting point is 02:39:34 Nice. And I used to call him Dev growing up. Nice. Yeah, Dev the Dev. It's all your fault. Yep. Hey, DLL, for Lime Day, would we be able to pick up our order at LTX?

Starting point is 02:39:45 No. No. That sounds really complicated. It does. Is Microsoft Projects Volterra worth buying yet, or are there still no good consumer options for ARM desktops outside of the Mac bubble. I'm an open source developer and I want to start porting. I haven't played around with Project Volterra.

Starting point is 02:40:18 It appears to be a dev kit so I would say no. If it's a dev kit so i would say no if it's a dev kit they're literally telling you that it is not for you to buy um i haven't seen any great options for arm windows pcs yet so i'm gonna go with uh if you want something that actually like works good then no works good, then no. Linus, as a smart home user burned by Instone? Instone? I'm not entirely sure how to pronounce that. Inston? It's got too many consonants. Insteon.

Starting point is 02:40:53 Insteon? Going defunct, I've recently settled on IP Wi-Fi based switches that support HomeKit as a replacement. How has your Z-Wave system issues been going? I just haven't touched it. I just accept that my house is stupid, not smart, and I will deal with it when, what's their face,

Starting point is 02:41:15 actually delivers Project Linus. Hi, LLD. This question is for Luke. As we know, you're a wonderful bird dad, but does your love of birds extend to bird watching as well in the millie uh not with bird watching not with like intention like i don't go out to go bird watching there is an app that uses ai to id birds from their sounds that'd be pretty cool i did want to get a uh one of those little smart bird feeder things um but i have wizened in my years and it

Starting point is 02:41:47 was a kickstarter so instead of backing it i just favorited the page and it's been like four years and as far as i can tell it does not exist so dodged that one um but yeah i wanted like a bird feeder that would take a picture of the bird when it came to get some seed and would try to ID what type of bird it was because I thought that would just be interesting to see what's in the area. What I have found is I just kind of like try to make friends with random birds that I find. Like when I was in Taiwan I was stuck at like a transit station for a while and there was some bird there and I just like talked to it because they like noise right so i don't know like if i'm coming into work and i park and i'm like walking up to the building and there's some bird there i'll just like friendly yell at it because they like loud noises so i'll be like hi bird

Starting point is 02:42:38 and they just walk by i don't know i notice them more but no i'm not going to go out intentionally bird watching hey dll in the past you no, I'm not going to go out intentionally birdwatching. Hey, DLL, in the past you have said you didn't want to go into PC retail because the margins were thin on selling parts and computers. What changed to consider it with labs tested? Oh. I am considering it just because I'm considering it doesn't mean that it is likely to ever happen. Um, and as for why I'm motivated to do it,

Starting point is 02:43:24 it's the same reason that I'm motivated to do anything that something sucks. And I feel like I could do it better. Right now, the state of shopping for PC hardware online is deplorable. Like I said, we did that video with the budget power supply roundup. I couldn't figure out how much it cost because everywhere it was out of stock people don't list pricing for out of stock items anymore when did that go out of fashion that sucks okay so i couldn't i couldn't find any pricing for this stupid thing and i couldn't find it actually in stock at a real store anywhere it's all just like shipped by jimmy jimmy john pc inc limited through new like i don't want to deal with that i want to know like with some reasonable markup based on the actual cost of the

Starting point is 02:44:14 item what is this thing worth and can i get it in a reasonable amount of time so it's just the fact that it's so hard to find stuff these days that is trustworthy, it's inspired me. It's made me think that there's a gap that didn't exist before. And maybe there's room for margin for a site that is trustworthy. like if you knew that whatever 65 or 150 power supplier whatever was the best one for that price would you shop on that site instead maybe not maybe you would just go to that site find out which one is the best one and just leave and buy it somewhere else but then you'll probably get frustrated trying to find it somewhere else with from like a seller that's actually reputable and maybe you'll just come back or maybe you'll never leave in the first place because you'll probably get frustrated trying to find it somewhere else from like a seller that's actually reputable. And maybe you'll just come back.

Starting point is 02:45:07 Or maybe you'll never leave in the first place because you'll appreciate that someone's actually doing the work to curate this stuff. I think there's room for that. I don't know. Linus, would you ever consider buying EVGA, either with a partner or as an Umbre umbrella corp company run by its existing staff no if uh if i was worried about the margins in pc and like uh in uh computer component retail i am even more worried about the margins in computer component manufacturing. It's an extremely cutthroat business. IDLL, greetings from Taiwan.

Starting point is 02:45:56 Such a shame we didn't run into you guys at Computex. What happened to the AMD GPU challenge? Switching to the 7900XTX, and I'm having visual bugs. I'm still waiting for Luke to put it back in his computer and send his notes so we can do the third part. No one told me this. I emailed. No. I did. You didn't email me that. You emailed that. I emailed asking if you were going to do it again and you said yes. Mine's never left my computer. Do you have notes? Yeah. Because last I heard you didn't have notes

Starting point is 02:46:29 and you told me you were going to do it. Hold on, hold on. Okay. So I sent a follow up on, okay, May 15th. I said, I can't play Tears of the Kingdom. I want my NVIDIA GPU back. Shared you all on my notes.

Starting point is 02:46:46 You said something, something. I'm pretty sure it was still occasionally snowing when I took my card out. I replied with, do you guys feel you have enough to say? Luke, do you want to put it back in for a week? You say, that's probably a good idea. Yeah, I'll grab one. May 17th.

Starting point is 02:47:00 Yeah. So you never did it. There's an email thread after that. And then I replied, Jake, you down to compile and write this biz? He says, yeah, but probably not feasible until we're back from Computex. I say, copy that. You say, just checking. Are you guys actually doing this?

Starting point is 02:47:11 I reply, yeah. Yeah, did you do it? What do you mean do it? It's still in my computer. I never removed it. Did you write the notes? Write what notes? Did Jake write his notes?

Starting point is 02:47:18 I shared you on my notes. Did Jake write his notes? Because this is the same problem we had in the past. I installed it. I wrote all my notes. I did everything. You guys said you were going to and didn't do Jack. So we're in another situation where you're saying that you're going to. I didn't have time to game! I don't care.

Starting point is 02:47:34 My life is busy! That's not my problem. I've got as many notes as I'm gonna have. It's gonna be mostly based on yours and Jake's notes. Oh my- See? Oh my goodness. My note is that I wanted to emulate Tears of the Kingdom and there's visual anomalies on our DNA3 cards.

Starting point is 02:47:53 That's my notes. This is high school class projects all over again, says Mystical in floatplane chat. Well, we're in the same spot that we were in before. We didn't get any further. Yeah. So now it's just on me to do the testing again. Yeah.

Starting point is 02:48:13 Because I already did it, but because you didn't do it the first time. I have gamed. I played Slapshot Rebound. Yeah. And it ran fine. Very good work. Thank you. Flapshot rebound.

Starting point is 02:48:21 Yeah. And it ran fine. Very good work. Thank you. You're all getting to watch how our production schedule works every single day. It's just this for 40 hours a week. Okay, up next. Love GameLinked.

Starting point is 02:48:41 How did this video style come to be like with TechLinked? The off-the-cuff style with background interjections is very engaging. Was this a specific decision? I didn't care. I was completely checked out. And so I, because I was only paid based on the video quantity that was uploaded to NCIX Tech Tips, I basically stopped reviewing any scripts from the team there. Like this is a couple of years into the contract with them when I didn't even want to renew it anyway. And so I basically said, well, I'm going to read whatever is on the prompter. And if you guys want any notes on the script, then I'm just going to be providing them live. So when you look back at old episodes and I'm just like,

Starting point is 02:49:25 ah, it's not a very good opening joke and I just like make up my own on the spot. That is like actually training. And then the objections that they had were because they actually wanted to reply to my commentary on their writing. And thus... A whole style was born.

Starting point is 02:49:48 TechLinked was born. Yeah yeah so then when we brought riley in to do tech linked instead of net linked which was on the ncix channel we basic i was basically just like yeah i love that irreverent kind of style that we developed um unintentionally and i i love that kind of adversarial back and forth that we have between the off-camera writer and the and the host and i just i think it's really fun and it's funny. And so we're just going to basically do what we knew, what we did together before that we know worked and was, you know, it was, it was obviously like, you know, lower quality, but in a way that I always thought was really engaging. And so we're just going to do that. And so that's what we did. And it turns out it's really good and um we're gonna keep doing that looking for some advice i am a content creator who has made content for the likes of tesla

Starting point is 02:50:32 and google the bulk of my work is stuck behind an nda i need to update my reel but struggle to get man that's tough this is not advice I would just show it to people anyway but what I'm assuming is that the NDA'd component of it is just that you were the one who worked on it not that it's actual not that the content actually contains information that is bound

Starting point is 02:51:06 by an NDA, but I w I would never share it digitally. I'd just be like, okay, like I worked on this and not let people like, look at it too closely. That's I'm sorry. I'm sorry. If I, if I had no portfolio as a creative, I'm f***ed. What do they do? Sorry, I missed the very beginning of their message.

Starting point is 02:51:30 They've done, I'm a content creator who has made content for the likes of Tesla and Google, but the bulk of my work is stuck behind an NDA. I'm assuming they mean like video content or like graphic design and stuff. I'm assuming they do not mean content like engineering documents

Starting point is 02:51:47 and they're struggling to get work outside of that yeah this is not legal advice to be very clear can you yeah it really depends on the type of but it's like it's that's a huge that's a huge issue, right? Like if you can't show anybody your portfolio. I mean, it's pretty normal for developers. Again, though, so again, my assumption initially was that this is content that will be shown somewhere at some point, but just their involvement might be under NDA. Like I'm making a lot of assumptions here.

Starting point is 02:52:22 Weird NDA, is it not? Not necessarily. I don't know I guess I need more details but it really depends on the type of content I think yeah people in chat are saying like just say you worked for Tesla and Google like yeah like you don't you don't expect people to show you the code that they worked on at Google when you're hiring a developer no it wouldn't be development yeah but like they could show you the finished product like i worked on this often no oh yeah i guess there's tons of internal projects yeah okay that's fair enough oh yeah that's tough

Starting point is 02:52:59 ah that's what i'm saying like what kind of content is this i don't know see i i have to confess my initial reaction was it's like ads so if it's not though like if okay so say for example uh when we were at the intel fab um i was shown a hololens project that allows you to like repair the machines in the fab as someone who absolutely doesn't know anything and someone can provide like remote assistance and it's like augmented reality showing you what to do. If you created that and you like tried to show that to someone, you're obviously going to get your butt sued. So that's content, but I didn't really think about that kind of content. So you know what? I take it back. Um, you're boned.

Starting point is 02:53:47 I don't really know what to tell you that's really tough yeah can you give more thoughts on if you're switching to ios i can't i talked about it on one show last week i had to sideload an app a little while ago and it's like how can i live without being able to sideload apps? That's ridiculous. I'll install whatever apps I want on my phone. That's my damn phone. So, um,

Starting point is 02:54:11 no, I don't think it's happening. Good take. At least not now. It's my favorite take. Love the show. Keep it up. Any updates on the release timeline on the NAS product you are investing in?

Starting point is 02:54:22 Nope. They're very much in stealth mode right now but what i will say is after a recent collaboration with a content creator they cannot come out of stealth mode soon enough for me because we ran into some stupid thing in true nas with stupid sharing permissions and the interface is obtuse and it's like the fact that they don't have a one button like yeah i just want like a completely normal nas that just has guest access in a windows environment is absolutely mind-blowing to me so i can't wait for these guys to just have something that is not just stupid to use.

Starting point is 02:55:06 You don't need to be an engineer to just set up a basic NAS. I think a lot more people would just grab an old computer and huck some hard drives in it if it was as easy as what they're aiming to do. Okay, this is a really interesting one. Where can I learn to build infrastructure with enterprise specifications but a jank budget? We're underfunded biologists and deal with multi-TB, 5D, 3D color plus time, movies of embryos developing and brains firing. There is a massive community of of homebrew enthusiasts um there's also a ton of open source stuff in that space yeah i mean if if what you want is just sort of that reliability um

Starting point is 02:55:58 like you could learn it not necessarily the name of the i mean level one text yeah this might be a little deep for like the very basics it really depends where you're starting yeah i don't know there's a lot of information here that might be lagging i honestly would go to the forum i can tell you that stuff's definitely out there like you can get decommissioned servers for next to nothing that are still perfectly reliable and especially can be configured with often open source free software to be very resilient. But this is like, you're answering that. Some people in chat are saying buy on eBay.

Starting point is 02:56:34 They're asking where to learn. Yeah, that's a tough one. Yeah, we're trying to answer the like easy answers. Yeah, someone's saying r slash home lab. So yeah, there's Reddit. I honestly would genuinely suggest ltt forum there are some extreme storage nerds on there i know there's a lot of storage nerds on r slash data hoarders as well yeah and they're it's more just like storage porn

Starting point is 02:56:57 i know but like yeah you might be able to pick up some stuff level one forum yep yeah so not not just the videos but also the forums definitely yeah ltt forum level one forum there's there's a lot of knowledgeable people out there and if you ask in a way that's not obnoxious you may get some legitimate help especially if you describe what you're doing yeah i mean that's that's awesome i think everybody would pile on top of that yeah 5d videos that's okay, uh, last one I have here for curated. Hey LLND, I've had my LTT screwdriver for a month or so now and have never been so in love with a tool. Can we have a reminder of the ETA for the stubby? Can't wait to add it to my toolkit. Uh, one month-ish. Ish. Ish. Fake.

Starting point is 02:57:48 Okay, now let's move into potentials, I guess. You're the boss. Okay, I'll just start at the top. Good evening, DLL. Question for all of you. Is this where you thought you would be in your 30s? In life, work, etc.? Oh my god. I never thought about being 30 someday now i think about being 40 30 is like i don't know it's like the in between i guess i don't

Starting point is 02:58:20 care about the age at all the only thing that annoys me is just how constantly broken slash tired i feel if it wasn't for that i wouldn't even slightly care i don't care about the age lines i don't care about the gray bits that are showing up in my beard i don't care about when my head hair will go gray i don't care about getting wrinkles would you care about losing the head hair no to be honest i could go without it my dad's not had it the entire time i think i've been alive i was expecting it to happen and then i figured out that you get it from your mom's side not your dad's side and i was like oh i guess i'm good then um yeah i'm not worried about any of that stuff i just don't like that like if i go do a physical activity

Starting point is 02:59:00 i'm like sore for a really long time it's like well that that sucks um and like if i get sick it feels like the recovery window is much longer if i get injured the recovery window seems a lot it's getting to the point already where i feel like injuries are like semi-permanent like if i get injured in a certain way it's like oh okay this could be it like i i hurt my thumb like months ago. Yeah. My thumb is still in pain. As far as I can tell, my thumb is going to be in pain for the rest of my life.

Starting point is 02:59:32 And it's just like, all right, like I'm going to physio for it. I'm working on stuff. It's function is improving, but the grip in my left hand is still significantly worse than my right because of this weird thing that's going on my thumb. And it's just like, I don't even know how it happened like there's just uh yeah things are just kind of you know falling apart the the uh the current status of the ship is uh it is not improving over time anymore you know yeah there have been a lot of fairly janky and surprisingly robust projects we've gotten the chance to see from LMG. What projects have been your favorite to film? Any projects that we never got to see? I always like building stuff that I know we don't have to take apart immediately after.

Starting point is 03:00:31 Oh, something we haven't filmed yet is there's a new 1U gaming design, like gaming machine design for the LAN room at the new house. The labs engineers did a fantastic job of the design for this thing, and no longer need like 700 each custom cases for it so uh that video is probably going to get shot in the next couple of weeks here i'm super excited oh that's what they're working on i saw that too that looks sick hey guys i work at best buy and have seen almost every rog ally we've sold get returned the reason seems to be buggy software and lackluster battery life what did you guys think of it now really that's kind of surprising i guess i just knew what i was getting

Starting point is 03:01:11 into whereas the more average typical best buy customer might be expecting a more cohesive switch like experience i'd be interested to know if that's just something that's unique to your store. Like maybe you're in a not as tech savvy area. I don't even know how to how to generalize something like that. That's really interesting, though. No, I think we're kind of just relying on the rest of the community to be amazing and creative. I had tried to come up with some stuff when Nirav, the CEO, was here, and everything I said was already being done or had already been done by someone. So I was just like, okay.

Starting point is 03:02:02 You were muted. Watch it. Yeah, I know. Oh, should I say what the question was? Yeah, yeah. Custom modules or customization items for the upcoming Framework 16. Yeah, and the answer was, no, I'm not even going to try

Starting point is 03:02:14 because you guys are collectively much more creative than I could ever be. Hello, LLD. You guys are known for your tech tips, but have you made, sorry, but you have made a successful business. Have you ever thought of sharing business tips or advice or do you have good resources to share? The business team has been bothering me to do a book or like a course, like a video course or something for many years.

Starting point is 03:02:41 And I, I don't know, there's some stuff that i could talk about but realistically i think the vast majority of anything i could possibly write would be in a wan show somewhere already anyway like i i'm a pretty open book with you guys for better or for worse sometimes and we're gonna take the extra on the shipping what i gotta eat. Dan's gotta eat. The book... Your shipping pays for my

Starting point is 03:03:17 food. The book's pretty open. I don't think it has a spine. It's just pages. Linus, take on lots of debt so you feel pressured to work hard. Get lucky. Yeah. Hey, DLL.

Starting point is 03:03:36 This question is for Linus. I'm a new father and I worry about responsibility introducing my son to tech. Where do I draw the line between protecting and sheltering? I don't know. Sometimes I feel like my kids are not protected enough. And other times I feel like they're too sheltered. I think the best thing if you're a parent is to know you're going to get it wrong and just try to get it a little more right next time. And if you do that for 18 years, then hopefully there'll be functional adults. But if the general population is anything to go by, they probably won't be. So don't feel too bad. Hi, LLD.

Starting point is 03:04:14 Have you guys received any feedback from Microsoft regarding the Windows sleep issue on laptops where it would drain all the battery? No, not that I'm aware of. Good question, though. Hey, Dan and the talent what's the craziest thing you've gotten to do through youtube that you would never have guessed you'd do go to nasa so sick definitely the intel fab that was on my bucket list that's so sick too i vaguely remember a wan show where linus mentioned an LTT desk that they couldn't figure out how to stock and distribute. If such a thing exists, what about releasing the plans for a fee even?

Starting point is 03:04:51 The problem is that the plans for it are like rudimentary and only good enough for us to use as a reference to do something that is pretty much in our mind. So I don't think we're going to be releasing those because they're not in a usable state. So I don't think we're going to be releasing those because they're not in a usable state. As for whether we would ever do a desk, I think we'd need to find the right partner for manufacturing and distribution. It's not something that we would want to figure out on our own. It's definitely appealing. Like there's good margin in it, good ASPs. I think that it's a market that is not actually very well addressed, you know, in terms of building something that's both quality and really functional. But no, we're in no hurry to get that going anytime soon.

Starting point is 03:05:33 Hello, future me. Linus, I want to start a company. Quality appliances that don't suck is one of the many ideas I've had, but I don't know where to start. Any tips? Start with something much smaller than an appliance. I think that's the best thing. Find something that you, you know, you think you can really add something to that's simple. I mean, it took us three years to build a screwdriver, and that's not because we're idiots. It's because to build something quality is way harder than just shipping something. Um, so I would say

Starting point is 03:06:10 start really small and, um, you know, don't overextend your finances. Those are probably the best bits of advice that I can give you if you're trying to start a business from scratch. Hey, LLD, can I get a hot take on the printer industry from overpriced ink to mandatory software downloads and more framework printer i don't even think it's a hot take to say that the printer industry is a giant steaming pile of garbage um i think we're at i think we actually bought like 15 printers and we're working on like a like a which printer is the least horrible video oh is that what that shelf is i think it's been stalled for quite some time though yeah i can see that and last of my curated i have here what is the labs purchase that got you the

Starting point is 03:06:57 most excited p.s i brought my ltd backpack to the south pole but due to NSF rules, couldn't get any good pictures to share. All right. Well, that's cool. I'd say the most exciting purchase, it's kind of irrational. It's like so nerdy, right? But I really was excited about the power supply tester. Most excited, though. I mean, the robot's really cool. Maybe the theater room i think because we're going to use the theater room for all our display testing and it's going to be like designed

Starting point is 03:07:33 for for viewing displays and they're the most optimal conditions i think that that's going to be amazing because as much as i love the setup i have at home, I imagine some stuff is going to roll through the lab that is way beyond what I would consider to be practical or even affordable, depending on what we can get our hands on. And so I think there's going to be some experiences to have in there. Okay, two more here incoming. Hey, from the UK, watching live, you must be running late. Is there any chance of women's hoodies? Oh, yes, there's a chance. That's good enough for me.

Starting point is 03:08:10 And the last one I have for today, any chance of getting merch message transcripts after streams? So many interesting questions get answered, but I can't split my attention between the video and messages. Would love to read them later. No, probably not. We have thought about potentially having it email the question asker the response.

Starting point is 03:08:33 That might be something that we implement later, but not right now. And I think Linus is replying to the last one boom got him that's all i got for you thank you so much for tuning in we will see you all again next time same bad time same bad channel bye we're gonna end up doing one show for long enough that nobody is even gonna understand what reference that is anymore at some point god willing then again you and i are both in a race to die so understand what reference that is anymore at some point. God willing. Then again, you and I are both in a race to die, so...

The WAN Show - Twitter Vs. Threads Is Not The Big Story - WAN Show July 7, 2023

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