Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Jack Rabid: Toronto Mike'd Podcast Episode 1526

Episode Date: July 29, 2024

In this 1526th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike chats with Jack Rabid about The Big Takeover and 10 Canadian bands he loves. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Ridley Funeral Home, The Advantaged Investor podcast from Raymond James Canada, The Toronto Maple Leafs Baseball Team and RecycleMyElectronics.ca. If you would like to support the show, we do have partner opportunities available. Please email Toronto Mike at [e-mail]

Welcome to episode 1526 of Toronto Miked, proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, a fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. Palma pasta! Enjoy the taste of fresh homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. The Toronto Maple Leafs baseball team, the best baseball in the city outside the dome. Join me this Sunday August 4th at Christie Pitts. I'm recording live at 2pm. I'm just beyond the left field fence.

Drop by, say hi. RecycleMyElectronics.ca, committing to our planet's future, means properly recycling our electronics of the past. And Ridley Funeral Home, pillars of the community since 1921. Today, making his Toronto mic debut is Jack Rabid. Welcome Jack. Hi, thanks for having me. I was telling my kids Jack Rabid was coming by and nobody believes that's on your birth certificate. Nobody believes you're Jack Rabid. I don't believe it either. Nobody believes you're Jack Rabbit. I don't believe it either.

Too good to be true. So at what point in your life, Jack, do you become Jack Rabbit? 1978. Okay, you know what? I spent 16 years as my normal surname because punk rock hadn't been invented yet. Right?

Well, listen, Jack, I love it, you know, Jack Rabbit, love it, and we're gonna learn a lot about you because I'm very curious about your origin story and of course the big takeover magazine. I've got some songs we're gonna hear, but the focus of today's episode Jack will be, how do I describe it, like the Canadian artists that you love? Is that a good way to describe it? Sounds good to me. So I'll be here. I'll be the judge of whether this is true CanCon or not. But may I read,

Jack, before we get the origin story? May I read an email I received? Certainly. All right. So this is I'm going to read a verbatim here exactly as it came in. Hey Mike, that's me by the way. Bob Ray in mid year within a two week span. Wow, I like it! Exclamation mark. The Joe Carter golf event podcast was interesting too. Well done.

I know I ragged you about Jack Rabbit of the big takeover magazine in the past as a potential very interesting guest on your podcast. You basically told me to back off lol since you have no idea who he is and it's unlikely he would make an appearance in the basement unless he makes the trek in from New York. Now, since you recently asked for guest suggestions, I decided to nag you again. Seriously, I believe Jack would have some very interesting insight, even over Zoom, about a number of great Canadian indie rock punk artists over the past 40 plus years from his American punk

perspective. He also reminds me a bit of you, as far as being a truly independent businessperson in a rapidly changing media landscape. You both found your niches. He placed two of your favorite artists, Ron Sexsmith, number 18, and Art Bergman, number 70, in his top 100 albums of 2023. He could turn out to be a nice contact person to secure some interesting musical guests in the future, although it appears you already have good sources for musical podcast talent.

Anyway, I will stop nagging you about this for now. Keep up the great podcast work. Enjoy the summer, Jim Romanco. What do you think of that, Jack? That's actually my wife. I told her to stop sending emails like that. No, I think Jim is actually a subscriber of ours and that's extraordinarily kind and gentle and friendly of him. So thank you very much Jim. And my apologies to Jim

that if in the past, I don't remember this, but if in the past I don't know, I get a lot of guest suggestions right Jack And I'm really big on the guests being in the basement and then I find out where are you by the way? I'm in Brooklyn and and that's not Brooklyn. We have a Brooklyn near like Whitby or something. This is like Brooklyn, New York That's correct. Yes. There's only one The one and only the og yeah, it's famous all over the world I've found. I was in Manhattan for 25 years though so. So are you born and raised New Yorker? I'm a born and raised New Jersey guy but I try to say that in a real saddo voce you know. But the second I turned 18 and graduated high school I moved to Manhattan because I couldn't wait to get there. Okay and we're gonna

I'd pretty much been going there for two solid years by then like every weekend and even some weekdays so it was a foregone conclusion. But Jack who are you to become Jack Rabid into and we we're gonna get some details here on the the big Takeover magazine and I got the jam that inspired the title here I want to play in a second but like I gotta know like so you loved music like what's the deal one day you said like I'm just gonna do this because I love it like give me that story well I joined the Beatles fan club when I was six in 1968 so I think it's fairly safe

to say I've been a pretty big music fan my entire life and I mean my absolute entire life since I was able to speak and walk and chew gum. So that's fair to say, although apart from the Beatles, I just listened to Top 40 radio in the 60s and early 70s because it wasn't bad. That was actually not a terrible thing to be doing, buying early Elton John singles or something like that.

terrible thing to be doing buying early Elton John singles or something like that. And then around 1977, some friends of mine got me into David Bowie when I was 15. And I resisted it for a long time because I thought he was just this weirdo. You know how you are when you're 15. I don't like weirdos. I'm a suburban kid.

What do I want to have anything to do with this weirdo? And they were right and I was wrong and And within a week I came to my senses and my entire life has been changed since then. All I've liked is a succession of what a lot of people think are weirdos. Starting with, you know, people that Bowie was associated with like Iggy Pop and Lou Reed and Brian Eno. And from there it opened up the entire can of worms

that there was this new punk rock scene that had just begun And we're like well if this is this is what they've inspired we ought to check that out I mean before you could even hear this stuff. It wasn't on the radio Nobody you knew had it so it was kind of like this giant plunge into the deep end of the pool without learning how to swim first and It's great. Is this where the big takeover, you know what? I promise I'd play some music. Listen, I'm gonna play just a bit of music to warm us up here. Just a little bit here. Horse code.

Can you translate that for me? I'm gonna go get some food. No one gave you the best hour, for the very first thing What's not even if I don't wanna talk You better know that I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit

I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit

I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I'm not a piece of shit I think it's called the Big Takeover. more or less him and his best friend. My best friend had a lot of best friends, I was one of them. Anyway, Dave Stein was his name and he came to me right after we started our band even worse and said I've got another idea. I'm like oh you're just full of ideas aren't you? And he said I want to start a fanzine because we've been buying other fanzines like Back Door Man and Flipside and Sniffing Glue and stuff like that and it seemed like you could just put together a couple of pages with a staple or something like that and just talk about stuff you like but he wanted to do a David Johansson fanzine and I talked him out of it I thought that was really stupid. He had turned 18 like that week and I was two months past 18 and we were still both in high

school so we weren't like the biggest geniuses on the block in Summit New Jersey or anything but I said you know what I don't think David Johansson needs a fancy and he's a famous rock star is at that time he had you know hits in the charts doing animals covers believe it or not and Funky, but she can stuff like that So I said well, why don't we talk about these local bands that we've been seeing in New York Well, no one writes about it all that might make more sense. He said say you're right and So he and I produced a one-page non double-sided

That's how dumb we were. It didn't occur to us to type on the other side too. We wouldn't have known how to do a double-sided one anyway because in May of 1980 there were practically zero copy shops anywhere. Like Xerox was not a big thing yet. Right. And we just gave it away to all of our friends at Max's Kansas City that night, our favorite nightclub and put a stack at like bleaker Bob's record store and a few other record stores. And, and basically he went like, we're done here. You know, called it a day, printed up exactly 100 copies on the, um, I guess it was about 45 seconds, a copy copier at the summit public library

for 10 cents each. Cause it was the only copier at the Summit Public Library for 10 cents each. It was the only copier that we knew existed at that moment in time. There was literally like four copy shops even in Manhattan back then. It's really an infant technology. But it was typed, you know, on my mother's Selectric. And he wrote half and I wrote half.

And I thought that would be the end of it, to be honest. And that was 44 years ago. And here I am still doing it. Dave bowed out after one issue that was it for him. He wrote probably about 250 words and that was the extent of his contribution other than founding it really and asking me to help him. How many issues in that 44 years? Well we were quarterly more or less once I decided that issue two should begin in the later part of 1980 because so many people asked for one. It was like really you want another one or you gluttonous for punishment? So for a while it was quarterly and since 1983 it's been

semi-annual every spring and fall. So we've done 94 issues in 44 years and never missed missed a period. Wow that's amazing. Now back to Jim Romanco who may or may not be your wife but Jim says... Mary cut that out! Jack congratulations on 44 plus years of publishing your excellent indie rock music magazine. That's a very long time recent covers have included because you know Jim knows I'm all about the can con over here. That's why by the way yeah, we got the songs we're gonna play like we're gonna kick out some of your favorite, but

Sloan was a cover for episode 92 he has here always All how do you what? how do you say them again? Always, do I put a V in? It's always, just taking the two Vs as a W. Okay, very clever. Sisting together. I love that Marry Me Archie was a huge jam on my playlist for a couple of years there.

Or was it Archie Marry Me? Do you know which one it is? It is Archie Marry Me and it's the finest teenage fan club song they never wrote. Oh yeah, well that's why I like it so much. Alright, that was episode 83. And not to mention Toronto expat Joe Pernice of Pernice Brothers. Pernice or Pernice?

I apologize, Jeff. Pernice. Pernice, okay. That was episode 87. Maybe see if you can convince Joe and Molly Rankin to pay a visit to Mike's basement, LOL. But seriously, here's your question. How do you discover Canadian indie artists in a very crowded American, British, Australian,

New Zealander indie rock universe? So before we kick out these Canadian jams, and I have a note from a great Canadian artist actually when he heard you were coming on to make your Toronto Mike debut, but how do you discover these great Canadian artist actually when he heard you were coming on to make your Toronto Mike debut. But how do you discover these great Canadian indie artists? It's for me it's a reflex to be honest because no one realizes this these days unless they're my age. But in the late 70s there were very very few punk rock scenes in the entire world let alone North America.

New York was obviously the first one in North America that had that tag anyway, the demarcation point where you decide something is a movement. And then very soon thereafter, there was one in Toronto. They were one of the earliest adapters, probably around the same time San Francisco and Los Angeles got going and what Boston was doing. earliest adapters probably around the same time as San Francisco and Los Angeles got going and what Boston was doing and eventually like Austin and Texas and Vancouver and Seattle and Portland had national scenes as well starting around 77, 78.

So there was, you know, there were ones forming and they were producing some really extraordinary bands, but outside of New York, you didn't hear about any of those bands unless you live there. And Toronto was an exception. Those bands like made a point of coming to New York. Like I did see the B Girls, and I saw the Diodes, for example, and they would play Max's Kansas City and they'd play CBGBs and they would tell us about the other bands that were there that never came here like the Scenics and I simply saw Sir and I guess the Vial Tones

certainly played here although they came just before I was old enough to see gigs and then stopped. So I never did see the Vial Tone sadly but also what else Teenage Head was another one I guess that's Hamilton but yeah I got I just want to shout out because the current drummer for Teenage Head gifted me the Teenage Head drumstick so if you hear this during our chat it's because I got to do something with my hands over here so that's erotic neurotic right so yeah when we kick out jams when we kick out jams from some of these

artists, we'll dive deeper. So spoiler alert, but he does... No, that was it for Jim. I told Jim he's cut off. But I gotta say, I'm so psyched about this and I went on Twitter and just said, hey, Jack Rabbitt's making his Toronto Mic debut. And Ian Blurton, who fucking I love, he's been over here, love Ian Blurton. I loved Change of Heart. But he says, it's amazing fucking I love, he's been over here, love Ian Blurton, I loved Change of Heart, but he says, it's amazing, he wrote, he's been, that's you, Jack, you've been so supportive of Below the Rad. So Ian's just psyched to listen to this

and we gotta do this for the Blurton. Thank you, Ian. Shadow team. People are so nice to me today. Well, you know what, I'm warming you up and then I'm gonna hit ya, hit ya with the tough stuff coming up here. One last question and then we kick out the first jam. Who's this from here? Jr. Jr. wrote, please ask Jack. And again, we are kicking out songs from these

bands so don't actually answer this question till we get to those songs. But please ask Jack about DOA and Young Canadians. Maybe he has some pull to get Joe Keithly in the basement before or after DOA's show at the Horseshoe in September. Kind of like Art Bergman. So just so you know, before we get to this first gem, which it's going to be related, Art Bergman was here and it's one of the great episodes of Toronto Might because Art and I just got into everything and Art's still fucking rad himself so that's what he's alluding to. To get it back to Toronto, I believe he's also a Sloan Always and Ron Sexsmith fan. You know what, Jack?

Can I get to the first jam? So can I ask you one important question? Go ahead. You gotta say go ahead. Yeah, I'm waiting for the go ahead here. Okay. Are you ready, Jack Rabbit, to kick out the jams? Well, there's no more MC5 members to do it so I guess it's up to us now Get drunk in the sun I wanna lay on a wikiki Get a tan on my butt Running from the rain

Thousands on the run Make it like a wrench Heading for the fun It's for the fucken' jokin' Lounge on the beach Those native girls are such a treat Strange with the native beat Running from the rain

Thousands on the run Making like a wrench All right, Jack, what are we listening to? That's one of the greatest Canadian records ever made. Among many, many, many great records made by Art Bergman, my favorite stuff of his is definitely his band Young Canadians, who began life as the KTELs very briefly in like 1978, and lasted until like 80 or 81 and boy were they good. So when you hear it there can't you? Listen again big big Art Bergman fan and I fucking love this song too. I mean I've even played this around the kids they they know they can't say this word at school but Jesus that's a

great song. Love it so much but when do you discover young Canadians? It's funny you asked that because I was in San Francisco for the first time in a decade a couple weeks ago. And before that I'd been going to San Francisco every six months. And so this trip I got a chance to do what I'd done for 10 years before that every six months, which was take out the veil to dinner. He always offers to go Dutch and I refused to take a penny of his money because Search and Destroy, his magazine in the late 70s and Slash Magazine in Los Angeles in the late 70s were this massive window opening.

I mean, as far open as you could have a window of what was going on in the West Coast. And some of the LA bands and some of the San Francisco bands did make it to New York after I read about them and found their records but only DOA and the Subhumans came to New York Los Populares did later in the 80s but in the 70s all we got was DOA and then one one trip by the Subhumans in 80 and I owe Search and Destroy and Slash for letting me know that there was this absolutely stunning scene in Vancouver. I'm on record as saying that the Vancouver Complication compilation is the finest compilation

record in my entire collection out of, I don't know, five or six hundred compilations that I still held on to. I will never part with that. It is the absolute epitome of a scene document and a scene that was so varied It almost felt like what is really holding these bands together other than that or they're all just not commercial rock pablum they're all just really wildly creative and Young Canadians were among the stars of those scenes. Oh and to answer your question about Joey Keith Lee I can ask him for you because he's staying at my house this weekend.

Wow. He and I have been friends since 1979 and my kids and I stayed with him in Burnaby. He's a councilman now. He's councilman Joe Keithley. Right. And we stayed with him last summer and once again for like the 20th time, I'm going to return the favor so I can ask him for you. Yeah, let him know I'm in South Etobicoke

and he'll have a great time. Oh yeah, most definitely. And Joe likes to talk, especially if he's in Toronto and you apply him with a couple of really good, what's that beer called? Okay, this is Great Lakes Brewery. Tell him with no doubt, all he can drink Great Lakes beer, fresh craft beer brewed right here in South Etobicoke.

I think that might be enough to hook him because he and I have been having a beer together You know all these years and he's a wonderful human being to talk to But thanks to search and destroy and slash I suddenly had this massive want list of bands I'd never even heard all I did was read about them and you couldn't find any of their records in New York at all so I had to mail order them from Zed records in I guess that was Long Beach, South California, South Los Angeles and a few other stores that did mail order and pretty soon I even found some contacts in Vancouver and I ended up buying like 40 records from

these people and I just couldn't believe the quality of this these bands that were so good. Jack I gotta ask you about you, so I'm not quite as old as you, but I remember having to go to the record store and buy vinyl to listen to the songs I wanted to hear. But what do you think about today when everything's on demand? You can probably go to YouTube and find everything you'd wanna hear practically.

Do you think a lot of the fun was the pursuit, acquiring the tangible media? Oh yeah, but of the fun was the pursuit, like, you know, acquiring the tangible media. Oh, yeah. But, you know, probably the fun of the pursuit in 1880 was to, you know, acquire sheet music before Edison invented recording with his team. You know, the technology is going to change. I think it is a shame that people don't have the zeal that we had to have in order to find music, but I'm also a musician quite obviously and I do like that the music on the five albums I've been a part of is easily accessible to people anytime they want

it was so frustrating being on tour in the early 90s and We'd show up at a club and people would seem really excited to see us, but they knew two of our songs, you know, the two that they'd heard on the radio and we were grateful for the radio air play just because without them we couldn't have toured. But it was like, we've released 25 songs and now people go to gigs and they know every B side. They sing along with the most obscure tracks of my favorite bands. And I have to say from a musician standpoint

I think I prefer that but it does I mean Your listeners can't see it, but I'm sitting in front of a whole bunch of CDs and this is a joke I've used a few times recently because I find it very illustrative, but we had a electrician come in Maybe four or five months ago because we had an electrical problem. And as I was paying him, you know, he's this like 20 year old Russian guy named Igor and he's looking around and he goes, you have lots CDs, you have lots vinyl. And I was like, yeah, yeah, I do. And he goes, why you have so many I'm like staring at this 20 year old electrician

who's like right off the boat from Russia, right? I'm like, you're just not old enough to realize that this was the only way you were ever gonna hear these bands. So if I wanted to hear, let's go to fucking Hawaii by the young Canadians, there was absolutely zero, I mean, less than zero chance that I could hear it

unless I bought it, let hear it any time I liked and Nowadays I can hear every obscure track. I can hear the demos the entire young Canadians catalog Even I watch live videos of them that I never saw until like five years ago It's a totally different world. No question about it. It has good point and it has a bad point to it All right, Jack before I kick out the second jam, loving this very much, I'm going to take a screen cap of us so everybody can see these CDs behind you. Okay. So I'll count you in here. Look, we're doing, fuck it. We're doing a live. Okay. Hold on here. Okay. Three, two.

There you go. We took our screen cap. So I'll be sharing that. Let's kick out another jam. Give me just, give me this, give me this feel Give me just, give me this, give me this feel Keep me hot, keep me hot, feel our feel Keep me hot, keep me hot, feel our feel Waste our wisdom, tell me more Waste our wisdom, tell me like the fox Give me juice Give me juice

Give me juice I scream and dance Give me juice Jack, what are we listening to? Give me juice Well, I did mention the violetones earlier, didn't I? Oh, I wish I'd seen them. You know, I've taken my kids, they're 12 and 16, to like 40 or 50 shows. Neither one as old as I was when I saw my first gig, you know, three months shy of 17.

Parents wouldn't let you go see rock and roll shows until you were like 16, 17 in those days. Very different times. So I just missed the violotones but that is actually one of the two two-chord covers that my band Even Worse was covering in the year 1980 and 81. And you can't even, you don't even notice that it's only two chords the entire song. But talk about a song that a beginner could play, and yet those were not beginning musicians. Those people could really kill it, boy. It's kind of like the Ramones with one less chord. And of course the crazy maniacal vocals of Nazi Dog, who also I might add was not his real name.

It's not on his birth certificate. Not on his birth certificate. Just like Jack Rabid. Not me and Nazi dog have this in common. Too good. Pretty much nothing else. Too good to be true, man. I got to say, what I dig about this episode is you're born and raised in the US of a and with an American perspective.

And I feel like because we're, you know, we're your neighbors, but we're one tenth your size and population and we have no nukes and we're you know your little your little I don't know little brother what are we but I feel like we sometimes judge ourselves and our output on how you in America perceive our artists and bands you know I love a lot of great Canadian music that Americans I don't think they give a fuck about it and that's fine by that, but it's something about hearing praise from an American aficionado like yourself that sort of feels good I've never been interested in hype or Coolness or hipness or any of that stuff?

I'm just interested in the music and the great thing about Vancouver and Toronto punk in particular Was that you just put on the record like okay I read about this band I don't know what they sound like they're not on the radio none of my friends have a copy although in the Vile Tones case my very close friend Nick Martin turned me on to them thank God for Nick Martin he had all these obscure records in his collection when I met him he's John Baez's nephew. Get out of here! That's a fun fact right there.

He's a lovely human being too and he's still alive in the same place. He would play us bands like Legionnaires Disease from Texas and the Violetones and we would add them to our set. He was our bass player. But I think in the case of like Screaming Fish, you put it on once and you start jumping around the room if you're 16 years old like I was. Yeah. And just amazed that there's like this punk rock thing happening. Again, much like Vancouver, all the bands in Hamilton and Toronto did not remotely sound alike. They all had their

completely unique conception of what they should be doing that was supposedly called punk rock. And the viol tones were the most intense and directly in your face of all of them. I guess like Simply Saucer and the Scenics would be the more esoteric, more like television, art rock sort of end of the street, talking heads kind of end of the street,

Velvet Underground. And all the stuff in between like the diodes who were a little more melodic poppy but also hard hitting and wow you know it's like every time you buy another record from the scene and it knocks your block off you're like wow there's really something happening up there and that's not a coincidence all the bands are feeding off each other they're like you know competing quite openly with each other in a kind of positive way and playing with each other on bills at the horseshoe Tavern or whatever it's just like heck this is really something and that catches my my interest as well as my fandom did I hear you say the diodes I certainly did them I did see

boy were they good all right well on that note, let's kick out. Let's kick out I'm tired of waking up tired, waking up tired, yeah waking up tired I'm tired of waking up tired, waking up tired, yeah waking up tired Too much time to kill is killing me It's killing me Tall bracket explosion A walk like heart attack Generated motion After midnight I landed in the ground mission

We'll make them see the light I'm tired, waking up tired Waking up tired Yeah, waking up tired Hey, before we get into this great jam, where did you see the diodes? Max's Kansas City. They came fairly frequently, you know, it's not that long a drive really. Not like Vancouver. And the club bookers Peter Crowley in Max's Kansas City, and I guess it would still be Hilly Crystal and CBGBs at that time, were very supportive of the Toronto bands. You know, there weren't that many bands

from out of town coming. There were some from Cleveland, obviously, which was another kind of nascent scene of that time. But very happy to host them here and kind of hype the shows and talk about them. And they'd get a whole bunch of write-ups in the New York Rocker, which was a place you could read about the Toronto bands, unlike the Vancouver bands, for example. And even Trouser Press would mention them and you know it's a really kind of an interesting press ecosystem between the fanzines and the more established magazines and the kind of like places in between like Slash and New York Rocker and Search and Destroy kind of like half fanzine half regular magazine. Well can you elaborate on that?

I'm very curious. Well like Trouser Press they probably sold like 40,000 copies and they were kind of a I wouldn't say slick but they were obviously a glossy well distributed well well produced magazine even though at their heart they were really a fanzine they were run by fans and they covered really great music that they personally loved and then there was a like a level above that like Cream and Hit Parader that really were commercial magazines that always had some articles, every issue of bands I really liked. Hit Parader,

not so many and Cream, lots. So, you know, there was whole gradations of this. And then you went down from there, Search and Destroy probably sold like 15,000 copies and it was like a tabloid style newspaper, but it was really well done. And Vail was just a genius and the people who wrote for him really knew what time it was. And down in Slash, you know, same thing, it was a tabloid, but the people writing for it, they just made me feel the music before I ever heard it. I just had this idea of just how vital it was and how viral it would feel in my life, how vivid the colors they painted. I never wanted to be a journalist. It was just by reading these people that when I actually accidentally fell

into it, thanks to Dave Stein, that I naturally was going to write like those people because I wanted other people to feel music the way they made me feel just writing about music I'd never heard. And the diodes, you know, here's another perfect example of what I was talking about. This is when punk rock didn't have these ghettoizations and terminology like these days we would consider them more like a power pop group and other bands would be called psycho Billy and other bands would be called like art rock or noise or avant-garde or stuff and 77 78 79 the best part of it is if you weren't foghat and

If you weren't like ario speed wagon or foreigner or sticks or something that automatically or punk rock and that was very sustaining for three or four years there automatically you were punk rock and that was very sustaining for three or four years there. Is the big take over like the the oldest such like uh I don't know indie magazine like last one standing? I guess that's a very awkward way of saying like is there any older publications that have continued to publish until today? None I can think of. There might be just because not everything rises to your radar. You could well get an email this week saying like where does Jack get off claiming that 44 years is now the current standing record? I went through a bunch of

ones I know about and they either they're long most of them are long gone and then you hear about yeah get cream, cream shut down in 89 and then it sort of reappeared I don't know if it's active today but that doesn't count like you can't yeah I wrote for their reappear of reappearance for a while so I remember that well I had cashed their checks so you got some that might be around I don't know spin or whatever I don't know when spin launched but like the big takeover mid-80s okay so there's none as old as the big takeover as far as I know yeah Rolling Stone has been going longer but they're obviously corporate mag yeah that's a different category I think

yeah I don't I don't I don't know of any there may be one and if so kudos to them because it's absolutely Quixotic Quixotic how you pronounce that? I know it's derived from Don Quixote's name, but it's spelled Quixotic. It's a Quixotic thing that I've been doing all these years, and I should have quit long ago. The intrinsic rewards are so lovely. Absolutely so lovely that I don't feel compelled to stop as I probably should. And how many subscribers are we talking here? Like we got you got thousands of subscribers, right? Like you can't go in. only about five or six thousand. So that's the only like listen you like six thousand people are like like Jim Romanco are waiting to hear what you have to say next and check out your publication. Plus about four thousand store sales Yeah, we do about ten grand. And if you love what you do, why would you stop?

I guess that's why I stop if you it? In part because for a while there we were up to 35, 40,000 right after the internet first hit and it was a boon instead of a bane for independently produced print journalism. Right. For the first time a lot of people could find me after I'd been doing what I'd been doing for 14, 15 years already.

And so our circulation went up from like 8,000 to like 40,000 and now it's gone right back down to where it was. It's quite funny in that regard. But on the other hand, I'm competing with, you know, literally thousands and thousands of pages of free content and you can't do that with print. I've gotta cover a $30,000 printer shipper bill

every six months that I don't incur with our website, for example, where it's literally pennies. So it does require people to reach into their pockets and pay seven or eight bucks, or if they subscribe, slightly less per issue. So you're pretty much down to just the real diehards in that sense. Well if somebody listening is like, that's my bag I want in, where do you give us like, what's the website or where should we send them to subscribe? It's bigtakeover.com and shop.bigtakeover.com. I make it really

super easy to find us. And the new issue, speaking of punk rock here it's been 44 years one of my favorite bands when we started this damn thing was the damned and they're on the cover of the new one which is just hilarious to me see now you I've been doing this 44 years they've been doing it 48 right you know what I mean like if you really have something good and now that you share it with people and they come to you and say well I really like what you did that's the loveliest feedback you know it's like and they come to you and say, well, I really like what you did. That's the loveliest feedback, you know? It's like, it's sincere.

I really love the new Damned album. I don't have to sit around listening to, you know, a record they made in the late 70s. I can just listen to their recent record and I'll play it over and over and over and over. That's all I'm looking for where it comes to art and cultures, something that completely rocks my world. Well, here's a band that rocks my world

and I'm glad they're still doing their thing. Let's kick out another jam. ["Jumpin' Up the Roof"] It all seemed to happen so fast Will you ever believe the way you passed away? I saw a widow speak on her fortune She was feeling pretty athletic Coke sweet, Kajolmi Coke sweet, Kajolmi Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the stage Sloane. Loved Coke. Sloane! Love it, Kokesy. Sloane!

You know, the guy whose voice you hear on that opening cut there, welcome to the stage Sloane. That's Brother Bill, and Brother Bill is a good listener of this program, so shout out to Brother Bill in White Rock, British Columbia. He loves his Canadian punk. But tell me about Sloane, not exactly a punk act. Well, you know, I was a teenager when I got into punk rock. I still like punk rock. Get excited when you play these tracks for me, Mike. That's the goal, Mike.

If you're trying to make a 16 year old out of me again, you're succeeding wildly. Okay, quick on that note. So Friday night, Friday night, I'm under a beautiful Toronto sky. It was a great summer night and I'm watching Cypress Hill at the CNE brands grandstand And I swear to you because my wife is younger. She doesn't really know Cypress though, but I'm like

I'm fucking right right now. I'm like 19 years old again It's like this miracle like I'm just singing along to Cypress Hill like it's 1993 Yeah, a lot of people would they use music because they hear a song and it reminds them of like having a date with some girl or like the time they went on the road trip and listened to that tape. For me, I still hear the music. I don't even have to put it into any kind of context of anything I ever did in my life. And I still remember hearing that song like 30 years ago and going like, whoa, that, you

know, Sloan are already really fine songwriters and I really like a lot of their songs. But that one is just like one of the best melodies I've heard in years. And the 90s was such super abundance to me. Now listen to a lot of shoegaze and dream pop and kind of like underground indie rock all at the same time that they get a song that good from Sloan was just a real eye-opener and I've been a massive absolutely massive Sloan Diehard ever since. I don't want to embarrass him

because I've gotten to know him a little bit in the last few years oddly but I think Chris Murphy in a band with four extraordinary singers mind you has probably the best voice in rock and roll. In the last 10 or 20 years, to me he's up there with like John Lennon and some of those people who when they sing a song, just the tail of their voice, like the way it lingers in the mic without overdoing it, he's just got this depth and richness to the sound of his voice that reminds me of like Chris Bailey of the Saints, who I thought was like about the best singer I heard when I was a kid.

Well, Jack, you know, I'm I'm pretty tight with Chris Murphy. I'm absolutely pulling that clip. And next time he's sitting down in this basement, I'm playing that clip for him. I think he knows what a big fan I am. Well, actually, I'm the third biggest Sloan fan in my house, which is just hilarious to me. My son is like chiding me because he plays me some B-side from 1998 and I kind of vaguely know it and he's like singing along to it.

I'm like, you bum, I was seeing Sloan before you were born. What was your jumping like? What was your, were you into smeared before you heard Coke's me? Like, were you into like Underwhelmed and the stuff from smeared? I loved underwhelmed That was the first song of Sloan. I really did love yeah me too I thought it was I thought lyrically it was wonderfully inventive and melodically as well It wasn't like pure pop like the song we just heard but boy, you know, it was very convincing My problem was Sloan had nothing to do with them. It was really again an over an overabundance. I was going crazy over Swerve Driver at that time and my bloody Valentine

and Sugar and oh my God, people don't realize they act like the 90s was some kind of wasteland, but for me it was just, you know, like almost a rebirth. I was in my 30s. I was touring the entire North American continent in Spring House. We played Lee's Palace and we played the El Macombo for example. So we actually made it up to your way and enjoyed the splendors of performing in Toronto. I was going to ask you, so which band is this though? Spring House. Okay.

Yeah, I have a poster somewhere of our Leeeds Palace show and the picture of us on the second album of All the pictures we could have chosen is us standing in front of Leeds Palace in front of those funny like murals Of course. Yeah, of course iconic of caught iconic. Yeah. Well, we didn't know we'd never been there before and I've never been there since You know, I've only been to Toronto four or five times. So I I've never been there since. I've only been to Toronto four or five times. So I have absolutely stunningly wonderful memories of doing that and I was so busy playing in my band and rehearsing three days a week and making albums

and touring and recording in Los Angeles and stuff like that. It's almost like I didn't realize that Sloan was gonna be one of the greatest bands of all time. I would have equated them at that time with like the Poseys or some of the other bands whose albums I was listening to quite a lot. But Sloan proved their metal by longevity and quality, endless quality. I mean, I don't know which album to reach for

most of the time. Should we go back to the 90s? Should I play their new album? How about Never Hear the End of It, which just completely floored me when it came out. Like really a double album that good? I may have five double albums in my collection that I don't think should be paired down if that. And that's one of them. Wow. I love the Sloan chat here. I know you are, but have you seen the Trans Canada Highwaymen? I saw them a month ago.

Okay. Because, of course, Chris Murphy's in that and I think that's a fantastic group of Canadian musicians. Again, my son Jim, who's 16, I caught him playing the Trans Canada Highway theme on the piano and singing a couple weeks ago so because I brought him to the show and we were both struck by that that being the one original in the set that wasn't you know from their past right yeah that's fun there at a Stephen Page on lead on that one and a lovely tune yeah Really funny too. Yeah, very funny. And speaking of funny, since we're both fanboying over Chris Murphy, super funny dude. I want to say sneaky funny, but it's just...

He's always on, always witty, always funny, just a great conversationalist. I think the three or four times I've interviewed him and Jay together are some of my favorite interviews because Jay is one of the most knowledgeable music fans I've ever met and he's just as funny in a very different way as Chris and the the very natural and kind of unforced and a Comfortable humor that they do both self deprecating and the opposite as well. Yes people can often do one or the other they do both really well. Both self-deprecating and you know.

And braggadocious. Yeah, it's just really great. And they, because they get my references, I mean like, like me they grew up punk rockers. Later of course, because they're not my age, but when I regaled them with stories of them, the guy who got the Nils, their record deal and stuff like that, we have something to talk about and I'm friends with the descendants and that was like their favorite band, you know, there's no shortage of things we can talk about without going back to the Beatles and you know, the Kinks and all their favorite 60s groups too. Amazing, loving this Jack. By the way, if you do make another trek to Toronto, not only will I get you some of the

fresh craft beer from Great Lakes Brewery, but I have delicious, authentic Italian food from Palma Pasta. If you like lasagna, I'm your dealer. My real last name is actually Karate. It's not rabbit. C-O-R-R-A-D-I. My grandmother and grandfather were off the boat from up near Milan so you don't have to invite me twice.

This thing of ours. Okay, let's kick out another. One, two, one, two, three, four. I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy

I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm against the enemy I'm a legend, you're my thing You're right I'm not against you I'm not against fame

I'm the only one We are the last team, we're the last team, last team Alright Jack, what are we listening to? Well you mentioned Joey Shaddeh. That is the incredible era of DOA. They've had many good ones, many good eras and they've always been fun to see live. But when they had Randy Rampage on bass, Dave Gregg Greg on guitar may he rest in peace may Randy rest in peace And Chuck biscuits on drums. They were the American clash or North American clash Them and the Dills both of them when they were friends those two bands

so Jesus Wow, I mean just Knock your socks off. I saw them open for bad brains in 79 like I said, they were the one Vancouver band that got here in the late 70s. And I saw them do their own gig as well and then they came back in I guess that would have been the spring of 81. So I got to see that lineup maybe four or five times all told and they always just completely floored me. brains and doa were probably the finest Musicians in North American history to be playing punk rock

They did because they just you just stand there like with your mouth open going. How do you do that? You know, I got to let the listenership know so I forgot you weren't sitting right here Jack I'm like you're in Brooklyn. I thought you were right here. So when I figured I was fading down the Big Takeover and it's faded you down too. So I don't think the listeners have heard, some will know but most won't, that that was Bad Brain. So that so you took the name of your publication from a Bad Brain song. Yes and it wasn't released at that time. I think that was part of the the fun of calling it Big Takeover. For a while we were kind of like a stimulators oriented magazine as well, so we had a couple of editions

as Cradle Robber, but Big Takeover was just what we were trying to do. You know, what would the music business look like if me and Dave Stein took over, what would things be? It would no longer be the Eagles and Steely Dan and stuff like that. It would suddenly be, you know, well, the Diodes and Pointed Sticks and the Avengers and the Weirdos and, you know, the Damned and the Buscocks and some of the more esoteric bands we were listening to too. I was a really big Talking Heads fan. I can still remember the first gig I ever saw was Talking Heads and XTC in 1978. So it was a good time to be 16 years old. Let's put it that way. Born at the right time. And digging this very much, quick piece of

advice for the Canadians listening, most of the people listening are Canadians. If you have any old cables, old devices, old electronics, maybe it's in a drawer or in some, you know, your attic or your garage, don't throw that shit into the garbage because those chemicals end up in our landfill. Go to recyclemyelectronics.ca, put in your postal code, and you'll find out from the good people at recyclemyelectronics.ca where you can drop that off to be properly recycled so those chemicals don't end up in our landfill. That's for the Canucks out there. I don't think that'll work in Brooklyn, buddy.

Hot tip. Hot tip. Hey, yeah, go ahead. I wanted to say that one of the big pleasures I had throughout the 80s was DJing a lot of DOA shows because I was the Rock Hotel DJ and that was the one booking them and So every time they came since they were the one Vancouver act that would come before they would play I do a set entirely Of Vancouver punk rock so I would play private school an active Active Dog, the You Jerks, the Dish Rags, the Pointed Sticks, the Modernettes. And I would play Kill Kill Kill, This Is Pop by DOA, because that's the one Chuck Biscuit had sung. I was kind of having a dig at them.

Plus it's a fantastic song. And stuff like that. And they would go a little bit crazy while they were setting up their gear, you know, hearing the stuff out of this massive PA at the Ritz. So the fanboy in me still exists for that stuff too. When I saw Pointed Sticks in Vancouver in New Westminster in 2016, again, I was invited by Joe, so I stayed at his house and we went to the gig and between him and my friend Alan McGuinness, who writes for Big Takeover, they introduced me to two dish rags and a wasted life and I probably was more excited to meet those people than anybody in all of the United States could be in the year 2016. I'm like wow two dish rags and a wasted life. I love it. I'm scoring here big time plus hanging out with the pointed sticks.

I have pictures of me as the sixth pointed stick that night fucking love the passion now that begs the question on the 44 years of doing this like Who is the artist you interviewed that you'd put in number one and like I can't believe that happened This is the dream come true. Like is there a is there a number one there? Yeah, Ray Davies Brian Wilson too, but of course Brian Wilson was kind of mentally, you know, challenged, I think is the polite way to say it, whereas Ray Davies is quite the opposite. He's as sharp and funny and witty as he ever has been, and I got him to talk about so many kink songs that

weren't like hit singles, and he was absolutely really really in love with talking about those songs because no one asks them about Wicked Annabella or something like that you know what I mean? It's almost like I was acknowledging the rest of his family. Wicked Annabella, yes there's a story about that song. So this is a recorded audio or was this a comedy? Oh no, it's for the magazine. Eric Idle was another one. I couldn't believe I was interviewing him. Jesus, big names you're dropping on me here.

Massive names, wow. Yeah, because I mean, in a way, it's not surprising I'd do a cover story on Joe Strummer, you know, and I would fight with him on who was gonna pay the check at the Broom Street when it was over. I won. It was like this five minute brawl, but who was gonna pay?

And he kept insisting and I kept insisting It's just like V Vale all over again and like like V Vale I actually said look Joe there wouldn't be a big takeover if there wasn't the clash I think I got you on that one and he had to concede the point but that that surprises me less I mean Johnny Rotten was a surprise because I had to do that through spin But I got two hours with Johnny Rotten and that was something that would have shocked this 16 year old me to no end That's amazing. But they just so let's not brush by that too quickly So obviously you've been writing for the big takeover for over 40 years now

but you also write for places like spin and I don't know cream and village voice and Yeah, how'd you know that? I did a little homework, did a little homework. Did a little homework. And I just want to point out, you're not, you know, you, yeah, the big takeover is your baby there and that's amazing, but you're also writing for, I don't know, you name it, Old Music Guide.

In the 80s, I even snuck in a bunch of really interesting bands into Interview Magazine, you know, Andy Warhol's thing. Like I interviewed Who'sker Dew for them. You know, when they were still kind of a younger, more fledgling band. And oddly, you know, to bring this back to Canada, one of the things I was talking about with Bob Mould in that interview was our mutual love of Canadian punk

because I hadn't realized, it wasn't known at that time that he wasn't from Minneapolis, he was from a New York town on the border of Canada and was listening to Canadian radio. And in a way we're back to what makes Canada special to me is that because Canadian radio plays underground, supposedly non-commercial Canadian acts, they give the band a rationale to continue and gig and expect some, you know, they give the band a rationale to continue and gig and expect some, you know, support from the community. We've never been good at that in America. So here's Bob sitting there listening to the diodes on the

frickin radio and it wasn't like, you know, some real obscure college radio station. It was like the CBC or something like that. Well, shout out to the CanCon regulations. Absolutely. The only problem is when bands like, I don't know, Rush and Nickelback take all that oxygen, right? As if they need the help, right? You can't really banish bad taste. And by bad, I mean kind of like, I'm not trying really hard here, so I'll just accept whatever

lowest common denominator problem is shoved down my throat by mass media. Yeah, most people don't really care enough to find out what's really going on in the arts, you know, whether it's film or books or music or anything. They just, you know, whatever they hear about in the osmosis is enough for them. I've never been like that. And fortunately, there are some Canadian acts over the years that have really benefited from a little boost of that sort. And I really wish we'd done that

because as I said, my own band Spring House, we did get some MTV video play and we did get some commercial radio play but always kind of like bottom of the barrel, three in the morning kind of thing, you know, occasional track here or there. And we just couldn't really get a toehold to continue our band, which we would have if we could have been sustained in that way. Fascinating. Hey, I'm going to ask you about a band that I always consider like if you

merge bands like REM and Bruce Springsteen and like certain American bands, if you can merge them all, you might end up with the Tragically Hip but I'm wondering if Jack Rabbit has any thoughts on the Tragically Hip. They're the band that did that song Jane, right? No, no, that's Bare Naked Ladies. Okay, yeah. I wasn't following those bands that closely actually.

I respected them and when I heard songs on the radio, I did like I'm an adult now, although the first time I heard it I thought it was I'm on the dole now. I'm like, this must be an English band. That's funny. He's 65 years old now, by the way. Mo Berg looks much younger. I spoke to him very briefly at that show last month and he seemed like a really sweet guy

actually. He is a sweet guy. Well, he's from Edmonton, Alberta. They're all sweet from there. But the, so the Baredeket Ladies, which is a Toronto band, they did like, of course they had a number one Billboard Hot 100 hit. So they, that's a whole different, you know, ball of wax. Yeah those bands were not rush and, and you know. But, but that's the number one, and not to mention like the theme song to the Big Bang Theory, but the Tragically Hip seemed like they were ours. Like they didn't seem to have,

I mean they did play, Dan Aykroyd got them to play a Saturday Night Live one night, which was wonderful for me as a big hip fan. But the hip never had a US hit, whereas Bare Naked Ladies went to number one on the Billboard Hot 100. Yeah. But hey, let's get back to your jams, my friend.

I just wondered if there was any... I really respected those bands, so it was quite pleasurable to me to go to the show. And I knew almost all the set that they were doing, apart from the Sloan songs. The fourth guy's music, I wasn't that remembering. Oh, Craig Northy? From The Odds?

Yeah, I didn't remember The Odds quite as well. Maybe a couple of tunes. But the other two bands, I did actually know all the songs they were doing in their set. So at least I wasn't a complete novice. Well, listen, that's how you discovered. And that song Jane is really awesome, by the way, even though it's not the tragically hip. Well, I used to live near that intersection. So it's named after the intersection of Jane Street and St. Clair. And I used to live near Jane and Dundas

Which I could throw a rock and hit Jane St. Clair There's nothing at Jane St. Clair by the way, if you go there, you'll be underwhelmed, but that's a Sloan song I read that see this is still the way I am, you know I loved the version I heard at the gig and I decided to play the original version on my own podcast I do a radio show every Monday for 10 years now and so I fished out the original version of that song and I looked up on like Wikipedia or whatever little tidbits about it so I did still I'm still discovering even

about music that I've heard all my life I still like look up tidbits about it and I want to know everything there is to know about a song that is really genuinely interesting and I came across that very factoid you just mentioned. It sounds, Jack, like you want to know the, you want to see the big picture. The factories have been talking for me They've been talking among themselves Trying to get me for their shells There's a 9 to 5S spot empty for me It's the best one they have got But it's not right for me

I don't fit in the big picture I don't fit in the big picture Alright Jack, what are we listening to here? Oh man, Subhumans. Thank God they did make it once to New York. I was the doorman to their only Manhattan show. My only stint as a doorman at any club on any night in my life. It was $2, it was an unannounced show, it was a Bad Brains and Subhumans, and my good friend Jesse Mallon had a dollar and I let him in anyway so I clearly had no talent as a doorman. But man, that band just completely rocked.

They were super hot and they were super friendly. They couldn't have been nicer. Just like DOA, they just like were these really great big lugs, you know, like these really imposing punk rockers who could literally beat the living crap out of you if you were really, you know, one of these punk rock hater people who wanted to start something with them. It was very helpful to them. But they were just a great, great band. And the night before at Maxwell's in

Hoboken, they even stopped their show because Nick Martin lost his contact lens. So all four subhumans and like 20 of us in the audience are all like on all fours in front of the stage looking for Nick Martin's contact lens. And we couldn't continue with this until Nick had his contact lens back. And that continue with the show until Nick had his contact lens back. And that was, you know, punk rockers really, people had the wrong idea about us, you know? We were really just having a bang up time and trying to actually have some genuine substance to our culture and some black humor and the rest of it. Fucking love it. Oh, you hit the, you hit the post there too. Okay. Amazing. The sub

humans, big picture. Now this band, you, you, you hit the poster too. Okay. Amazing. The sub human's big picture. Now this band, you, you, you re you reference this compilation. So I want to kick out this next jam cause I want to hear more about this Vancouver complication, if you will here. So let's kick this one. The Like Germany in 43 while everyone was telling me a piece of clothing in All my ideals, all my dreams breaking out at the seams of that discipline No one wanted to believe me, I was up against the wall when she came marching in to save me like a guardian general She had it worked out to and on

Now she's in command of my heart Let the boots ring by time on a cold and wine I should sew military I was broken, I was dirty, but she promised nothing Her distance humanity I know I never understood me, I had visions, I had plans She mapped out the way it could be, offered me a script by hand She had it worked out to an arm

Now she's in coming to my heart Vancouver centric playlist that I picked today. That's okay. But these bands they you know even in in Eastern Canada a lot of them are not as properly recognized perhaps as they should be apart from like record collectors who spend $150 on one of their records or something. But that's the opening track on Vancouver Complication really sets the tone. I think it was the finest pointed sticks recording ever, you know, considering how many great records they ended up making. And again, the energy just leaps out at you. And different types of energy. I mentioned the Ujerks, they

were really completely like a harsh synth band in the mode of like suicide or the screamers right they didn't have a drummer or a guitar player I don't think and I think I almost got to see no fun that was one of the bands on that compilation they played last year when we were in Burnaby but I had my two kids with me and they I really had plans to take them to Stanley Park you know I'm trying to be a dad of course you got to do that yeah they wouldn't know they wouldn't known a single no fun track it would have been a little weird, I'm trying to be a dad. Of course, you gotta do that, yeah. They wouldn't have known a single no fun track. It would have been a little weird, but I'm kinda kicking myself.

I probably should have just made them go anyway. It was a gig in New Westminster again. Yeah, what an education, man. You're doing them a great service here. But yeah, we got the dish rags again, the wasted lives, active dog, private school, the KTELs before they became young Canadians. So that is the very young Art Bergman, probably his first released recording at that.

The shades, E with a question mark, you know, kind of the weirdo aspect of the record. Who else? Exitone. And of course, DOA. Kill Kill Kill, This is Pop, and I Hate You. Just really raw, really exciting, you know, complete punk rock to the up the wazoo factor and with the original trio DOA. So when I see DOA play on Saturday night, I'll remember, you know, how that record just completely floored me finding

a copy at long last. It was probably out two months before I could get one and now it's a massive collector's item mind you. And Jack it's kind of amazing and awesome that Art Bergman has the Order of Canada and that's like such a prestigious you know recognition you get in this country and he's in the Order of Canada. I got an email from Art about a month ago I'd never spoken to him before you know after being his fan since 1979 so it's always kind of like I see it in my inbox I go Art Bergman wrote me an email you know what oh I'm gonna enjoy reading this because we just had a gigantic feature in our magazine

about art that the aforementioned Alan McGinnis did and covering all aspects of his career and his most recent albums, which have been fantastic. Again, you don't have to go back and listen to Let's Go to Fucking Hawaii or the KTEL's track on that compilation which was I Hate Music if my memory serves you could just play his recent record like Christo Fascist or something like that from his second to last album or one of the tracks and he'd be like this guy still really has something to say and he still has an edge to his playing and I really really like it. I could tell you because I've seen him in the last I think it was last year I saw Bergman at the Horseshoe Tavern here in Toronto on Queen Street and he

doesn't touch the young Canadian stuff like there is no Hawaii or whatever on the play. It doesn't have to be about nostalgia no. He just did a gig this weekend in fact in Vancouver. Alan blogged about it, which is how I know about it. I wish I'd been in Vancouver, I could finally see him play for the first time in my life. Because as I said, the Los Popularos did make it to New York in the 80s, but I was in California. So I never did, I've never laid eyes on Art Bergman

and I've had one email from him in my life, like a month ago. Finally, an artist I've met that you haven't. That's the one for me. Good. Yes. Okay. So before I kick out this next jam, I would just like you to know and everyone listening that there is awesome semi-pro baseball happening at Christie Pitts in Toronto. High calibre baseball, no ticket required, man. The city can just come and fill the hill at Christie Pitts, watch some great baseball, grab a beer. You can drink the beer in the hill at Christie Pitts watch some great baseball grab a beer

You can drink the beer in the park. You don't have to worry about The fuzz man because it's completely legal. It's all good. You grab a hot dog, whatever and this coming Sunday, which is August 4th 2024 yours truly for some reason yours truly is throwing out the first pitch So I'm just gonna let people know come watch me. Maybe hopefully not embarrass myself and then I'm just going to let people know, come watch me, maybe hopefully not embarrass myself. And then I'm going to record live from the ballpark. So jump on a mic and say, hi, it'll be fun. So Christie Pitts for Toronto Maple Leafs baseball. It's a good time, man. See all the stuff you're missing living in Brooklyn. I don't know. Maybe you got something going on there, but you want to kick out. This will be the anti penultimate jam. Let us kick it. Walking down the stage of the empty hall, noticing the traces of their last appearance When they saw me day or night

No other guy who never missed a battle He is I To make up a mind Sitting on a bed with nothing to fear I've seen the traces of their last appearance When they saw me day or night Jack, tell us what we're listening to here. Well, that's the Nils. One of the greatest bands ever out of Montreal. Not often the one that people mention when they think Montreal

because they think of like Arcade Fire or something like that. But for me, that cassette when it came in my apartment in the mail in 1983 was another one of those things where it just totally floored me. I expected nothing, I'd never heard of the band. They just stuck a tape in an envelope, not even a padded envelope. Like it kind of got beat up on the way from Montreal. Like these clowns, they don't know what they're doing, right? And haven't they ever heard of the Dills? This is ridiculous.

So I put it on kind of to make fun of it, you know what I mean? One of those moments, I was like 21 years old and this the song scratches and needles hadn't gotten my I don't know 40 seconds in I went like what the hell is this this is extraordinary that that song we heard though that one is called give me time and the third of my three bands last burning embers covered that on a a compilation coming out of Canada. Nils tribute album from 1998 was called Scratches and Needles, a tribute to the Nils put out by Woody Whalen of Magwheel Records. I've never actually met Woody but I've been talking to him for like 25 years. He's a great Canadian record label guy and music fan and helper to the Nils and record label guy and music fan and helper to the Nills and he put out a compilation of theirs called Green Fields and Daylight that includes that

now cassette they sent me in 83 and to me that's still the finest nil stuff the only thing I should say is we weren't called last burning embers on that we were called worship gray very briefly when we began that's what we were called but it has like down By Law and Punch Buggy and New Sweet Breath and Stan GT. It's a really interesting compilation and I'm really glad that Alex, the singer, Strongwear and The Knills were still alive

so he could hear all of us bands doing those songs. I'm pretty sure he was still alive, I'm almost definitely sure. Because Alex was a friend of mine, I got to know that band. They stayed with me every time they came to New York after I wrote them back breathlessly saying, you know, your cassette is just extraordinary.

We need to bring you to New York ASAP. And then as I said, I got them their record deal. It turned out to be a real lemon, but at least it got them their album out and nobody had been signing them. They'd been going for like, I don't know know three or four years and all they could eke out was to really barely 12 inch EPS and that cassette so they really really needed an album So at least it accomplished that before it all turned sour

Now we didn't really establish this but in all these bands bands that you're in, you're the drummer, right? Yes, I'm the drummer. It's true. Just to... I don't write songs. I write lyrics. What is your... Oh, you write the lyrics.

Okay. What is your... A lot of them, not all of them. What is your active band? Like, if you're going to play something now, what band are you in right now of all these bands I've been hearing about? Technically none of them. Okay. Spring House broke up in 93, even worse in 84. Last Burning Embers, I'm guessing around 2004. But Spring House keeps doing a reunion tour every

eight years. We're like cicadas. Yeah, right. Every eight years we seem to get a really great offer that sounds like it'd be mad fun and the three of us have stayed really close friends all these years. We did not break up because of any schisms in the band or lack of desire to play music. It was just impossible to sustain a working band. We don't have to be a working band to do reunion tours. We do like three or four rehearsals,

and then we go out in the road, and we're having a grand old time. Unfortunately, our last tour four years ago was opening for The Chills and Martin Phillips died yesterday. So all of us in Spring House are mourning tremendously. We played with The Chills in 1990 as well. Martin was our really close friend.

So shout out, as you say, to the late Martin Phillips for all the incredible Chills music over the years years and then another band that we did two tours with after we'd broken up the Chameleons they're playing here in New York next week not not to transition so quickly from somebody dying but we don't need to bring people down on the pod well look I'm sorry for your loss you know losing these are you it's a moment or you can have a friend? Yeah yeah, and friend right and friend, but even yeah, just from the artist perspective, it's sort of a Very sad thing but we're an opportunity to sort of recognize

I always feel like we should do this before they pass away But what happens to be an artist will die and then I'll be like, how did I miss these guys? These guys are fucking awesome I'm like like why didn't I discover them like when they were here like it's like this phenomenon where it's like you you dive in why didn't I value them more while they were here which is mistake people make right you've hit on a absolute ironclad piece of my philosophy which is that the time is now the time to appreciate things is while you have them one of the absolute

worst tendencies of human beings And I'm trying not to be like you know Mad at anybody or putting anybody down. It's just human nature. We tend to value things when we lose them absolutely My philosophy has always been the opposite like girlfriends movies movies, a gift somebody gives me, staying at somebody's house, a visit from Joey Keighley this weekend.

To me, you just gotta grab it and appreciate it and really value it while it's yours, because you won't have these people forever. We did get Martin for an extra seven or eight years because he was supposed to die eight years ago and he was saved by a miracle drug. But we always knew he was living on borrowed time with 20% of his liver function.

But yeah, I mean, this is what I've been doing. I've been making magazines, I've been DJing for years on end. I've been playing in bands. I've just been hanging out with people enjoying their company. Just, you know, someone who tries to follow his passions. I have a great interest in economics and early

American history and lots of other things as well. So it's part of being a vibrant human being. Music is really reflective to me of all of life. So it's not like geeking them to me. Do you watch any sports? I'm a tremendous sports fan. Every Sunday I play a double header and softball at shortstop and often Wednesdays as well. And my father bequeathed me all four of my main teams,

but I follow all four of the major sports, mostly baseball and ice hockey. You know, I can still remember names of like Toronto Maple Leafs and Montreal Canadians from the late seventies and stuff like that. Shout out to Darrell Sittler. Yeah, Darrell Sittler or Yvonne Cornway or something like that. That's the stuff I grew up with. I think my first game in 1968 was the Rangers against the California Golden Seals,

who are the absolute last franchise over the last 80 years to fold in any of the four major sports. They moved to Cleveland for one year, became the Barons and just folded. Well, hey, since you mentioned Cleveland. No Cleveland, no Bowie. Just got to play that. Shout out to FOT and Michael Williams. Hey, let's play something more recent. Some of these songs have been around a long time, but here's something more current.

Let's kick out your penultimate jam. Can't explain my close brain, I didn't really feel it But how long till we're really in paradise? And I find myself paralyzed, knowing all too well The world behind me, I didn't really mean it Circumstance we call collect to see if I would keep at their doors And if I myself am lost, going on to a dark far away When I find my way I'm moving to the country Gonna have that baby Wake tables in town I know where it gets around

Moving to the country Gonna have this baby See how it goes, see how it goes Didn't want to find myself there I was Going on too well, terrified But I'll find my way. Didn't want to fade it down, Jack, always. And you made it to the key change, well done.

Couldn't help myself. Okay, this is Belinda Says. So how did you discover Always? We were right on them, right from that Archie Marimi song. We're really big teenage fan club fans for example. We knew a kindred spirit and sure enough they knew like every obscure New Zealand and Australian and Scottish and English band there was that me and my friend Jeff Kelson liked and you can hear it in their music. They're really consummate

music fans and they're really talented musicians and she's an awesome vocalist so. We've been talking a lot about Sloan. Chris and Jay keep reminding me that my I just met music fans and they're really talented musicians and she's an awesome vocalist. We've been talking a lot about Sloan. Chris and Jay keep reminding me that my two favorite Canadian bands these days have utter and total Nova Scotian and Prince Edward Island roots in them, don't they? They just moved to Toronto. You are 100% correct. I know Chris Murphy is from Prince Edward Island, but they all meet up in Halifax.

And that's definitely a Maritimes band, Sloan. But now we took them, you know. We end up... I don't know if you know Biff Naked. Do you know the artist Biff Naked? I've heard the name. Okay, so she was forever a Vancouver gal, but she now lives near me here. And it seems like a lot of these great artists end up in Toronto at some point. I only mention Biff because she's going to be here later this week, so if people want to hear Biff naked, she'll be in the basement though. I don't let her zoom in because she's local here.

But loving this, I just want to let you know, we talked a little bit about death earlier and loss and how that can trigger different responses and we should appreciate people now. Like don't wait, don't wait till you're reading an obituary. Like appreciate this art now, appreciate these artists now. But I just want to let people know that Ridley Funeral Home has a great podcast called Life's Undertaking. And Brad Jones, who's the funeral director there,

he's the host and we talk about themes like this. We talk about like, you know, well not only what is it like to be a, to own and operate a funeral home where you and your family live on premises. Like that's wild in 2024. But we talk about, you know, you know, celebrations of life

and what happens when people pass and how we remember them. And it's very interesting. So people should subscribe to life's undertaking. Yes and certainly Molly Rankin is not no stranger to being scarred by sudden death and obviously her dad was in the Rankin family and was killed in a car crash something we talked about in the cover story we did with with her and the guitar player so you know it's it's true I think she really liked her dad an

awful lot and she ended up going on tour with the Rankin family they kind of took her under their wing after her dad died you know to kind of give her something to do and you know kind of mourn with her so that's you're absolutely right you know life is just what we have of it while we have it and we ought to fill it with as much good stuff and stuff that really turns us on as we can in an intelligent manner anyway. No, absolutely. So before we end this with one last song, we talked earlier, I was curious about the Tragically Hip, but there are a few huge bands, artists, I should say, that I just want to get your thoughts on these artists before I kick out the final jam here.

We recently lost, speaking of loss, we recently said goodbye to Gordon Lightfoot. Just curious your thoughts on Gordon Lightfoot. Gordon Lightfoot was one of the few artists my dad and I agreed with. There may have been four or five. My dad was kind of like the great American song guy. He really liked like Perry Como and Frank Sinatra and oddly Herb Albert and the Tijuana Brass, definitely the jauntyest stuff I heard in my house as a preteen. But the stations he listened to, the adult listening stations, it was all this really

kind of like airy, you know, inoffensive kind of, you know, non-challenging stuff. And then they would play sundown and my ears would always prick up and say, who is this guy? Who is this? This is good. I like this. What is this? And then, you know, I heard the wreck of the Edmonds,

Fitzgerald, and I was completely sold. And then I did a little, my own research back in those pre internet days when I was doing my own research. Back then it was a good thing. And I bought like a couple of his records and ended up being, you know, a substantial fan of his. From there I went, this is the sort of rabbit hole thing I do. From there I ended up at Ian and Sylvia.

Well, okay, that's a teaser. I will say this. So yeah, Ian's no longer with us. Shout out to... Yeah, but Sylvia was just on Toronto Mic'd within the last six months and we had a good chat and we're gonna... That's a teaser for the final jam, but two more big artists, two more massive Canadian artists, internationally renowned artists, I just want to ask you about.

One is Neil Young. That's funny you mention him because that was the biggest mistake I've ever made as a fan was discounting him as a teenager. In my early 20s I realized the error of my ways and recounted you know and I didn't take Tworkamata to threaten any kind of punishment on me. I was like, boy, I really missed the boat on that. And oddly, the way I did it is I became a really big Buffalo Springfield fan. And then when I bought those three albums,

it all clicked to me that the solo Neil Young was a genius too. So of these days, I have probably about 30 or 40 of Neil's records. And I have a tremendous respect for even the bad records he made that he made them you know like insisting on constantly challenging himself is to me the definition of an artist just because I didn't like it you know doesn't mean

it isn't valid art if he was doing it for the right reasons and soon enough he got back to doing stuff more in my personal taste right up to the more recent records he's made, I've enjoyed those too. Speaking of Ian and Sylvia, I saw a video on YouTube of him appearing at like a logging strikers thing, like him and his wife playing for like, I don't know, 250 people on like the Madison Square Garden shows I've seen him at. he was singing Four Strong Winds I think was one of the tunes that he did. He definitely does that one absolutely. And endlessly moving I mean the guy's in his 70s now I guess he's pushing 80. Pushin 80 I had tickets to see

him in early July and he canceled because of I don't know who was unwell somebody somebody was unwell and I I hope it's nobody to be honest but I so I didn't get to see him but I have seen him before just worship this guy Neil Young like a living legend. Yeah I mean Ray Davies Neil Young I never got to interview Neil Young he's too famous in a way can't get anywhere near him But the people who made music because they really loved it, you know, could make hit records. It was never a dichotomy like that.

When I was a kid, you could have hit records and they would be incredible. And you could make albums where the rest of the album wasn't filler, they'd be some of your favorite all time songs. And that describes the Kinks and Neil Young and Buffalo Springfield and the Hollies and the Who and all those people to me,

just endless delights with their music. Last name before we kick out something that we've alluded to just moments ago, but Joni Mitchell. Joni Jams. Yeah, I mean, how many people come back from losing the ability to play their instrument? I think it's a great story that she actually had to watch videos of her playing her own songs to not only learn how to play her own songs again, but how to learn to play

the guitar again. And if you don't respect that, you not a music fan because how I I've never learned how to play anything But but drums because I don't want to suck Okay, it's really a failing of mine I should just be modest and suck and learn an instrument like guitar or piano or something But I can't imagine what it'd be like to learn the drums again from start You know like having absolutely no ability to play it. I just wake up one day and I can't play a lick. That would be so strange to me.

I don't know if I could do what she's done. And of course her back catalog is tremendous. One of my favorite interviews was interviewing Graham Nash and we talked a lot about the two albums that each of them wrote about the other, you know, after their breakup. And he said, he said, yeah, I know I have a real weakness for really smart, beautiful women. And then I added and talented. That is a pretty good triumphant for any boy or girl you want to date in your life, I think. Absolutely. Really nice.

So Jack, I want to say thank you to Jim Romanco who made this happen with the email I wrote off the top. And I'm glad he did, because I really enjoyed this chat. So here is- You're a gent, I owe you a drink. Well, get your ass over here. I'm gonna check. Well, yeah, he'd cover that.

I know, what did we learn from another, someone else wrote in, said, DOA is here in September playing the horseshoe or whatever, so you got to get your butt up here for that maybe and then we'll take care of everything. But hey, let's kick out that final jam. It's a Canadian classic, could be our national't change come what may But our good times are all gone And I'm bound to moving on I'll look for you if I hand ever back this way

Think I'm going to go out to that home Never to leave that home And I'm going to go out to that home And my punk rock fandom as a preteen really was looking up all the influences on the Beatles, buying records by like Larry Williams and Little Richard and Chuck Berry and Arthur Alexander and God's Gene Vincent. I went crazy on 50s rock and roll and R&B. And I think if that's not the original punk rock, then folk music was certainly topically and lyrically. I almost picked Buffy St. Marie's The Universal Soldier instead, because that's obviously more punk rock in terms of lyrics, and I came at that song originally from Donovan's cover

as a kid. But folk music, even if it's about romance or about a song like that, where if you're missing someone and you're not sure it would really work if they ever got back together with them anyway. It's really affecting, it's really moving, whether the original version or Neil Young's current covers of it, let alone the ones he's released. It's a quintessential Canadian song to me because he's lonely up in the Canadian prairies

in Western Canada, you know, and he's kind of mooning over this romance that fell apart and not sure whether he should send for her. And it's, it kind of illustrates that whole Canadian American like conversation we've been having for years, also between urban and non-urban places, even within countries. So it's just a really moving and stirring song to me and it kind of says Canada. I have to be honest, I also almost picked

the Trans-Canada Highwayman theme because it's the most recent Canadian song I've fallen in love with. Oh man, you can't go wrong with that, but I'm glad you clipped that. Hey, just keep yelling, hey, hey. It's super funny those guys are funny together too damn it if you're looking for a Toronto

Mike episode to listen to Stephen Page and Chris Murphy in the basement from I don't know when that was last winter I guess was amazing and you would love that but I loved this very much and then let's not bury the lead you're still going you're still rocking the big takeover. People can subscribe today. It's been whatever, 44 plus years. And it sounds like my cup of tea, man. So keep on rocking in the free world, Jack.

It's only because people like you are nice to me that I keep it going. I probably could have had a much more fulfilling living and at least monetarily doing something else, but this is a really fulfilling living and just the way I spend my time. So thank you very much. Money isn't everything, Jack. No, it's not. You're dead right about that. And that brings us to the end of our 1,526th show. You can follow me.

I'm on Twitter, BlueSky, I'm all over the place, at Toronto Mike. Go to torontomike.com. If you want to subscribe to the big takeover, the big takeover.com is where you'll find that. Subscribe to Jack Rabbitids excellent magazine. Much love to all who made this possible. That's Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Recycle My Electronics.ca, the Toronto Maple Leafs baseball team and Redlee Funeral Home.

See you all tomorrow. Drink some goodness from a tin. It's my UI check, ask, just come in. Ah, where you been? Because everything is kind of rosy and gray.