Trash Tuesday w/ Esther Povitsky & Khalyla Kuhn - Call Him Zaddy w/ Dr. Drew |Ep 60| Trash Tuesday w/ Annie & Esther & Khalyla

Episode Date: April 12, 2022

Tickets to Trash Tuesday Livestream! https://www.momenthouse.com/trashtuesday Thank you to our Sponsors: Nutrafol - Go to https://nutrafol.com and enter promo code TRASH to save $15 off your first month’s subscription + free shipping Liquid Death - Get free shipping on all water and merch at https://liquiddeath.com/trash Magic Spoon - Get your next delicious bowl of guilt-free cereal at http://www.MagicSpoon.com/TUESDAY and use the code TUESDAY to save five dollars off Truebill - Cancel unwanted subscriptions with just a tap at https://truebill.com/trashtuesday Trash Tuesday Merch: http://slugfam.com Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/itstrashtuesday Subscribe to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/HitOurButtons Official Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/trashtuesdayclips Listen to our other Podcasts: TigerBelly - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/tigerbelly/id1041201977 Meanspiration - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/meanspiration-with-annie-lederman/id1475056491 Esther Club - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/esther-club-with-esther-povitsky/id1494518220 Follow Us: Khalyla Kuhn - https://www.instagram.com/khalamityk Annie Lederman - https://www.instagram.com/annielederman Esther Povitsky - https://www.instagram.com/esthermonster Produced by: George Kimmel & Bryce Hallock - 7EQUIS Podcast Producers: Pete Forthun & Carlos Herrera Editor: Andres Rosende --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/trashtuesday/message

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if you guys miss this live stream you're an idiot listen you're an idiot i i fucking flogged myself punished myself no no we're getting covid right before the live show. No, we're glad you got COVID. It's going to be even better. Don't make us sad. Because you know. Why are we so depressed now? Well, here's what happened. We had all of these plans.

And part of these plans were highly sexual activities. Don't flog yourself. Don't flog yourself. We'll do it to you on the. We're now more prepared than ever. Everyone. Is that river dancing? What is flogging?

Flogging. I'll flog the shit out of you. By the way, I'm bringing the butt tape. So it's going down. Please bring out the butt tape. And also this. I need every. I'm going to do an enema prep before the show.

Because I need you so far up my ass. We are inserting. Esther's already there. I'm going to go remove Esther from Upside Your Asshole. You guys, April 13th. This is tomorrow. Tomorrow. You only have a couple hours left to purchase tickets. You will not regret this.

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don't watch the fuck out. Did Carlos surprise a plan for us? momenthouse.com slash trash Tuesday is where you'll get your tickets. We'll see you at momenthouse.com slash trash Tuesday. Get your tickets right now. It's going to be chaos. It's going to be so good.

We'll get to the bottom of their COVID's real or not. See you guys. You guys, if you haven't heard about anchor, it's the easiest way to make a podcast. Let me explain. It's free. Shocking that Esther,

that's what you were about to say, right? Yes, it's free. Uh-huh. It's always number one on our list. It's free. Everyone wants to freaking start a podcast. This is the easiest way you were about to say right yes it's free uh-huh it's always number one on our list it's free everyone wants to freaking start a podcast this is the easiest way we're about to tell you there's creation tools that allow you to record and edit your podcast right from your phone or computer and and and they will distribute your podcast for you so it it can

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This weekend, you can see me with one of my best friends in the whole world, Josh Potter in San Francisco at Cobb's Comedy Club. That's going to be April 15th and 16th. Then I'm going to be here in Los Angeles at Burbank and Flapper's Comedy Club, June 18th for one night. I'll be in New York in April, Syracuse.

I'm going to be in San Jose, California, May 6th through 7th. Dania Beach, Florida, May 12th through 14th. Omaha, California, May 6th through 7th. Dania Beach, Florida, May 12th through 14th. Omaha, Nebraska, May 20th through 21st. West Nyack, New York, June. Austin, Texas, August. I'm going to be in Pennsylvania and Pittsburgh. I have a million other dates.

I can't even get through all of them. Tempe, Arizona, Kansas City, Missouri. A bunch of places. Just go to AnnieLetterman.com slash shows. I'm coming to you, baby. Listen up. D.C., Brooklyn, Minneapolis, Chicago. Those are all coming up very soon.

Get tickets now. Esther on ice dot com. Don't wait, you guys. It's so fun. It's an experience. It's we are so excited to meet all of our sluggies. It's like unbelievable. Have a special night with us and we'll see you guys.

Enjoy this episode um esther you came in with wet hair but that was such a cool girl move when i was growing up in the philippines really because it meant you had like indoor plumbing oh i love this bra i like this bruise the break that someone just fucking gripped your ass up and was that carlos get in the car were you trying to take a second bite of a cupcake carlos came and beat you yeah we have eating disorders bitches no we don't well yes we do yes we do if i have it it's none of your business yeah here's my thing here's my thing if we learn your triggers baby girl that's on you okay you look at us because we do our own thing

and whatever we want that we don't just do what you want us to do that's why you like us so learn to control your triggers and I'll eat one half of a fucking

bite of a cupcake if I fucking want were people pissed about yes they were so everyone was so mad at how we handled the food it's just learn your own triggers

learn how to manage yourself they're like it's your birthday. You can't eat the cupcake. I'm like, it's my birthday. I'm going to do whatever I fucking want. Yeah, I don't want to eat a fucking cupcake. Also, I just inhaled a whole pound of hash browns

before I got here that day. I had eaten breakfast. I had already done yoga. It's so disgusting, actually. It's actually disgusting that our fans would ever dare put that on us. You would dare put on your own feelings about your own body and your own eating on us we you know how we lead by example we do whatever the

fuck we want whenever the fuck we want and that's why you watch us i we i had i could eat celery juice all day if i want it's none of your fucking business hi dr drew do you have any celery juice for us good timing come on in celery oh celery juice any celery juice for us? Good timing. Come on in. Celery. Oh, celery juice. Yeah, celery juice. Celery juice. It's like VeggieTales, but with Jewish.

Hi, Dr. Drew. Hi. Looking very fit. Huh? He's always looking very fit. Thank you. I forgot that I was going to be on camera, and I just threw on. It's hot outside. It is so hot outside.

I was like, oh, boy. No, we're always on camera. We don't want to waste our youth. Apologies. So. So what's up? What's happening here? Where do we start?

We want you to tell us what's wrong with us. I mean, I can tell you. I feel offended that you think you need a doctor. I can tell you, bitch. Go ahead. Let's hear it. Okay. Esther has control.

But listen. Esther has, Esther idolizes wealth. Wait, that's literally you. No, no, I am wealthy. And you idolize me. I don't idolize wealth. I just enjoy being rich.

But I have a subconscious belief that I deserve money now, but it took me a sec. That's beautiful. I lived in my car. Yeah, you're changing. You're an edible girl now, so I don't know. Dr. Drew. I have to catch up to you guys. I feel like we're hitting the ground running here. We were having a rant.

We're so happy you're here. Guys, let's introduce the guest properly. When I was a very sad immigrant coming to the United States at the age of 15, I didn't have any guidance about my body, sex. There was nothing out there. Our, this week's guest was my North Star. You taught me everything.

I would have been so dead on the side of the road, a big bag of bones if it wasn't for you. That's very kind. Now, if Adam Carolla was here, what would you say to him? The opposite. No, no, but he was part of the reason it was all digestible it did work perfectly yeah yeah and you know we're under attack now we're for being creepy and for you know not being sensitive to issues that everyone's so sensitive to now and you're in the right show i know the thing is look what's

motivating me to do in the first place was speaking of north stars anthony fauci pounding on us young physicians to get out there and educate about AIDS. Oh. And that was really my original motivation, one of my original motivations to doing it. And he was a big, important person to me during AIDS. I took care of probably thousands of AIDS patients over my entire life. I didn't know you were an AIDS guy. This is cute.

I did lots of that, lots of AIDS. Pounding out the AIDS. I like that. It was hard, man. I did lots of that. Lots of AIDS. Pounding out the AIDS. I like that. It was hard, man. I know. That's wild. Now I'm saying, look, there's nobody around to tell the tale of how dark that was, how awful. Well, I remember in elementary school, we read like Ryan White's story and stuff.

It was like, it was top news. But this was hundreds of thousands of really talented young men just destroyed. And this thing would just tear people apart it was it was a terrible illness 100 fatality not a one percent fatality 100 fatality different thing than than this last pandemic yeah you don't know it was 100 fatality you look shocked i didn't he came in hard with aids i like that before azt which got us over towards the antivirals and before we came up with effective treatments for 10 years it had a 100% fatality rate. Wow.

And it was fast back then too, right? And I was a third-year medical student. It could be. I was routinely telling people they had six months to live. What? We were never wrong either. They come in with their first episode of pneumocystis, and that was the trigger that you had six months.

Wow. The clock is gone. We don't know what's going to take you. It's going to be a lymphoma or a CMV or coccidio-mucosis in the brain or whatever. A CMV. It's rough. You know, it was so bad. But it wasn't a, and it wasn't like you have six months to live, so go enjoy your life.

It was like you're about to get really sick too, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Esther, we love to open with AIDS on this show. We do. Well, I was going to say I loved you on celebrity rehab because i knew that was gonna be the one you liked the most i love i love mary carrie on that show and i thought like it was

really cool mary is doing really really well really yeah she she's uh had a couple more treatments and really got into sobriety yeah really good how many of the celebrities after shooting are like please cut me out and are just begging? Or are they interested? Like, do they feel like so vulnerable? It's so vulnerable to be on. Having been on the show? Yeah, like afterwards.

All right. So I'll tell you some interesting stories. When we first did it, I was very nervous. It was not my idea. Somebody came to me and I was like, you can't do that. And we sort of kept thinking about it and solving problems. And all of a sudden, we were doing it. And I was like, you know, I just need to be sure these cameras aren't harming you guys.

You're okay. So the groups we would do every day, I'd start the group. I'd go, you all right? Are you okay? It's okay? You still want to do this? You should feel good about it? And I was doing that for about two weeks.

And finally, Mary Carrie leans into me and she goes, Drew, I've done just about everything in front of a camera. I understand what this is. This is no big deal to me. And I thought, oh, I've done just about everything in front of a camera. I understand what this is. This is no big deal to me. I thought, oh, good for her. If people don't know, she's an adult. She was an adult entertainer. Yeah, she still does a lot of stuff online. She's Benjamin Button.

She's now young. She's a, sorry, okay. So unknowing to me, there was a wonderful transition that happened to every single patient. Most of the people came on the show to fuck with me, to mess us up, to get paid, to be on TV. And a small percentage also knew us because we treated them before or something, and they wanted to get some treatment for free and to get paid for it. They were getting paid. All of them went through this transition where they came in being problematic and trying to screw

with us, us taking the treatment very, very seriously, them recognizing that, participating in that, getting something out of it and feeling good about it. And every single person by the end of treatment was like, oh my God, you're really doing something important here. I want to be a good example for other people. I got to make sure I really take this seriously. It was uncanny. Every single one of them went through that transition. And I was so grateful for that. I didn't know that was going to happen, but it did for everybody. And so that was good. And a lot of them, we had to treat them long after, right? Three weeks of treatment is not, you're not done. That's what I was going to ask. So there is a continuation of treatment. Oh yeah. I made them put aside lots of money for

ongoing care for people if they need it. From you or no? Well, I did some of it. Well, you're like the cameras are on. I did it for free because I felt like it was my obligation to fill these guys out. But we would put them in halfway houses and I'd psychiatristy them. We had lots. And some of them refused it. Some of them refused it. But we gave it to them if they needed it. Did you ever think any of them were kind of like faking having an addiction?

There was a few things that happened that weren't on camera, thank God, that were like confusing to me. There was a few things that happened that weren't on camera, thank God, that were confusing to me. Some people, I still think I can't talk about it. Yeah. Where people didn't belong there. But we didn't put them on TV. That's all. Esther, maybe we can get you high enough to go on celebrity rehab.

You have to have addiction. You don't have to be high. No, she actually is one of the very few examples I've seen of like weed really being medicine and working. Working? Yeah. My daughter's cannabis was her drug of choice and she's in recovery now. Really? You will not be.

Don't worry. You have to be careful. Okay. What do you mean? Thank you for saying that because I think that's exactly what happened to my partner, Bobby Lee. Yeah. You know, when he- You know I sat there and told him there was a problem.

We all did. But that was before anybody knew, including him. Yeah. And I was when he- You know I sat there and told him there was a problem. Do you remember this? We all did. I just, but that was before anybody knew, including him. Yeah. And I was like,

dude, something's not right. You remember that conversation? Yes, I do. And he's avoided me ever since. Yes. And I'm like, what the hell, dude?

He's doing so much better by the way. I'm sure he is, but he's avoiding me for some reason. I'm going to see him in Austin, by the way. Oh, you will, next week.

I'm going to go to the Chito Santino event. Oh, good, good, good. Yeah, and I, don't tell him. I'm going to bum him in Austin, by the way. Oh, you will? Next week? I'm going to go to the Chito Santino event. Oh, good, good, good. Yeah. And don't tell him. I'm going to bum rush him. Wait. But I need to ask, how do you know if it's like a problem?

Consequences. If you're having consequences. Okay. And there's three sort of hints. A, family history of alcoholism, if you have that background. Okay, I have that. Oh, come on. B is you'd like to stop. you try, you can't stay stopped.

She's never tried to stop. No comment. Yeah, never tried. And then three is consequences. And by consequences, work or school, finance, health, legal. What about this bruise? Okay, that was from a massage. Relationships. Relationships is often where it really comes down.

Were they massaging a blunt out of your mouth? Relationships. Yeah, if your relationships are fucked up. But because that's like it's okay to use we're on yeah right but that's the thing it's like everyone anytime there's a conversation about um you know weed it's always like oh but it's just weed it's just weed and that was perpetuated and bobby said it is just what he would justify it i'm like look at the consequence there's literally he's a consequence it is just weed in the same sense that it's just alcohol. Yeah. Right?

Because if you have the genetics for these disorders, nothing's just whatever. Whether it's alcohol or weed or benzodiazepines, whatever, you have to be super, super careful because you have this genetics. If it's the average person who likes to drink two glasses of wine and smoke some indica at bedtime, fine. Yeah. Fine. I can't even imagine drinking two glasses of wine what the hell would that be that's how my fiance is he literally can just have like a little bit of wine in that he can have a moderation he can do moderation 34 yeah so so the fact that so the fact that that looks odd to you you know what i mean what I mean? I would just go, I would just go,

hmm. But Esther, there will be consequences if you stop taking edibles. We will whip your ass. And I'm not advising you to do anything. No, I know.

I think everybody's got to do what's right for them. That's all. Yeah. And I keep telling people, people think I'm like the party pooper or whatever. I'm the dark one.

No way. My thing is like, if you have trouble stopping and you can't stop and you want help i can help yeah that's it that's it that's my thing i'm also i've never tried alcohol and weed i just discovered it like six months ago you've never tried alcohol no because of your parents because my grandma grandma yeah my parents don't drink either but um well yeah it's a weird situation situation i'm we're figuring out day to day but do you feel like is there is there like a problem where you're like i fucked up well one of the things here's one of the trick one of the clues i'm not saying it's a categorical clue but one of the clues that there

could be a problem is usually when people are first exposed to cannabis they're like no big deal and then like around as though there's some priming effect of this drug, like the second or third or fourth time, all of a sudden it's like, whoa, this stuff is awesome. And the thought that comes into your head is, I love this stuff. I'm like better on this than off of it. No, I love it. I love it. Do you love it? Why? Because that's the thought that people have when they have this biology. It's that you could be heading for trouble. What if it was, I loved it on the first try, though? It happens that way, too.

Oh, okay. Did you have a lot? Like a kettlebell or something? I'm going to. I have a question about weed. Usually people don't take enough to get that. I'm going to tell her, too. I'm going to jujitsu.

I'm not telling her. You are, everyone around you is happy, too. It's like you are, and I used to go on. I'm not telling her to. You are, everyone around you is happy to. It's like you are, it's, and I, I used to go on. So it's working for you. But I used to be on record saying like, weed fucking,

because for me, it's like has a, it has a bad addictive effect. Right, you're not going to be an addict ever. What's that? No. You're never going to be a weed addict.

It feels shitty when you take it. Well, I know. That's never going to happen to you. But it still feels shitty. And then I take it, and then I take it and stuff. I have a problem with weed.

I don't see it with her though. It's hard to have a problem if you feel shitty on it. Well, I feel not enough, but I like the being bad part of doing it. That's different. I used to smoke a lot. There's a lot of information packed into that statement. Oh, there's a lot. Do you remember when I did like a very

quick sit down with you on your radio show? You did the, it was the comedy store had like an event at the Fonda Theater. Yes. Yes, I do remember. Vi was there too. I bombed so hard.

I bombed so fucking hard. And then they're like, go talk to Dr. Drew. So I sit down. I'm like, my face is, I'm spinning. Like I bombed so bad. We're outside. Like we're getting heckled by helicopters. Like planes were going by.

I was like in hell. And then Brody had just fucking crushed. It was like, Brodydy you fucking scumbag. You fucking just made us all. I think I just talked to Brody too, right? Yes. And then he was like, I gotta get off this earth once he talked to you.

Annie! I'm just kidding. Oh my God, I'm joking. I talked to him more recently than you did for that. I promise. If we're gonna blame anyone, I talked to him literally the day before, so. Oh, that's a very sad story.

But no, it's really sad. Dr. Drew's like, there's too much going on and then i saw someone crushing so then i couldn't blame like the audience or the circumstances so i was like in my like you were fine you were fine i was in my shame and i sit down and you and you said something along the lines of like so what like you know i this i'm not quoting you but it was something like what fucked you up to get here and i was like you want me to tell my rape story and you were like oh that's where we need to go and then i was like and then i was like uh i just told it on mark maron's podcast and you're like are you promoting another podcast my podcast and

i went yes i am i just couldn't i was like i can't bear to tell it again but i do remember so dr mature annie and i were um diddled lot. Molested in every hole. Just about. As children, as tweens, as teens, and young adults. Young adults. There were some drinky, shmappy times too. And we have a lot of similarities. Like we have excessive, like we have hyperhidrosis. Sweaty armpits.

Interesting. There's certain. Jaw, TMJ. Yeah, like a lot of parallels between us. Like physical manifestations. You've read the book, The Body Keep School. Yes, yes. I haven't read it. I physical manifestations. You've read the book, The Body Keep School? Yes, yes. I haven't read it.

I've heard, people have given me like readings of the challenge. I've seen the cover of it. I was getting jizzed on by my teachers not taught to read, so. Your teachers? Yes. Really, me or you? Congratulations. What age group?

What age teachers? Well, I was, I was when my. Oh my God. Is it bad to say I have FOMO right now? No, it's okay. I have FOMO right now? No, it's okay. I'm jealous of that bruise. Mine was in high school.

It was my high school teacher, but I took him to court. Good. Good for you. Yeah, I got his ass. But I really feel like the lesson that I'm learning now is it was good that I did that because the reaction was not positive when I went to court. I just telling you you saved other people I know that's how I feel too I mean he didn't he got like three years probation but then when I told it on Mark Maron's podcast again I was very scared I'd still have PTSD around it yeah I was really scared to tell the story and I didn't want to get like sued or anything like I just didn't know so I didn't say

any names but people figured out who he was and then I got dms from people and they're like he was about to start working with at-risk kids again. So I fucking got his ass again. What is that about people that work with at-risk kids? Because I was in, I won't say the hospital, but it was somewhere in Torrance. And I was there on, I had attempted suicide as a teenager. And I was put there for three weeks. And sure enough I

Got into a relationship with one of the counselors. Oh But it's like it's that it's you always hear that with like people who like seek out to work with well I think it's because we're less credible like they can be like oh you're like Or maybe our parents maybe the teacher part of it, but on it. But on the treatment side, it's usually people that are injured, right, themselves, haven't spent enough time in proper treatment or not being properly supervised. I mean, I've had it happen to drug units where they go out and do drugs or they have sex with patients. It happens to a lot of drug units.

And that's just gone for good. I'm only laughing at you white knuckling the chair. You came in hard. Even for you, we thought you might be it. So Dr. Drew, one more hard-hitting question. I was fisted by my family doctor. I think I was fingered on the way. I came out breech, and I think the doctor fingered me out.

So when I first came from the Philippines, we're dumping really all our bad stuff on Dr. Drew. I know. We've been waiting for this day. OK. It's all good. It's all good. I'm a little short of breath. it's okay esther's short so that's okay the opposite of annie where

like i didn't know um the protocol of how to report someone as a team and he was our family doctor in fact he was our doctor until my dad passed away you know he was the attending he was everything and so like we would go in for let's say, oh, because I was a swimmer, I have a shoulder injury. And somehow I always had a finger up my ass that appointment. And in my head, I was like, oh, this is just how American doctors do it. This is the head-to-toe physical. There was a lot of training in my era to always do a rectovaginal, they call it this procedure.

What? We didn't do it. We didn't do it. We were like, we're following the attending's directions. So you do a pelvic exam, right? You feel the uterus. That's what we're doing. For the shoulder injury?

I'm just saying. This is the procedure. I don't know why he was, the fact that he did a pelvic is like, but, and then you're supposed to do this till you feel the septum between the vagina and the rectum. But then he would do this and he would pull out my discharge and say things like, oh, you're a healthy girl. And then.

Yeah, they call it spinbart kite. This is a generation of physicians. But I'm glad that you're saying this too, because I went to a gynecologist who was he was an older he was like maybe in his 60s yeah this was like and he just stuck his finger in my asshole and i was like i've never had a gynecologist not so those were the guys who were training my generation they were like just you have to do this every time you're not completing the pelvic exam if you don't really yeah yeah so i stopped doing that a long time ago but i did it i just got a warning i just was like i think you're in the wrong hole, sir.

I've been in this situation before, never with a doctor. No, it's their feeling. And they're checking for sulfur blood and other things. They feel like that was their response. Well, part of it was gynecology from like 60s, 70s, and 80s was misogynistic, like severely misogynistic. It was all men. That was the first thing I noticed when I went to my first gynecology training.

I was like, well, these guys hate women. Yeah. Really? Yeah, before, these guys hate women. Yeah. Really? Yeah, before women infiltrated the profession. But even then, some of the women were sort of tough on the patients. That was really odd. It was very odd the way they treated the patients. Yeah.

That's terrible. So I – It's gone now. It's not like that. It's not like that. While I think that might have been part of how he learned to do like just like that he did it every time you came in it's crazy

yeah and so but I never reported him but then you know my sister and I during the pandemic we she was having a lot of like

problems dealing with with being like touched in that way oh she was affected too by him yeah

and so was my mom and so but we didn't know any better we were just like this is how doctors in America do it that And so, but we didn't know any better. We were just like, this is how doctors in America do it. That was the thing. But we looked him up and sure enough, like he had lost his license.

I guess like he would grope women during a stress test. Like he would just like do these weird things. But I always have that guilt of what you don't have guilt about, which is you saved a lot of people. I was so silent. I didn't know what to do. I got called a liar is you saved a lot of people. I was so silent. I didn't know what to do. I got called a liar. I had a lot of trauma around that.

So it's really interesting, but let's examine what you're feeling. Can we talk about Truebill? I can't wait to talk about Truebill. Truebill has my number at this point. Okay. And I did sign up for an automatic spray tanning thing. And I know-

Listen, I know you guys have seen me the past couple episodes i've been pasty white you look beautiful but i'm just saying there has been no spray tan but i have paid for it really it's an automatic payment you know what i've paid for an app that identifies insects for two years i paid 1999 did it identify this one can we see what this one is? little baby spider I'm a critter you guys Truebill is a new app

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spelled n-u-t-r-A-F-O-L.com slash trash. So, so much of being traumatized is shame and guilt, right? And you're taking that shame and guilt and you're making it explicit which is i should have saved people also don't don't do that yeah you were a kid you what do you you come on it's you cannot you had a you had a dude that was doing some very strange victimizing that you'd have you'd have tar difficulty identifying as an adult as a kid it's like no don't do that yourself and that's shame from whatever it came before too it's all connected it's all it is all connected and also

shame is a horrible emotion it's just the most important thing is to like get yourself healthy and stuff too because i i mean i do really think most of the trauma was around the coming out about it was just the reaction to people yeah for you yeah of course well you but you you got explicitly shamed you know not only that was but you you got explicitly shamed you know not only that was a fucking crazy thing yeah and had you been abused before that too uh-huh oh my god so oh we cry and we laugh on on trash tuesday because it was while we were all getting molested we were we had solace in listening to you and adam carolla and how many trauma victims we were dealing with i know but that's a a thing. And I think we went through a pandemic of trauma from starting in the 70s.

I blame the 70s. I really do. Literally, people would say things like, you know, children are just little sexual beings or whatever. Whatever you're into, man. You do what you act it out, whatever. And they did the same thing to women, too. Yeah.

So the reason you have a Harvey Weinstein is because that era was raised on women want sex as much as you do. And you know how much you want it? They're suppressed by society. You got to bring them on, be as aggressive as possible to help them. That's the bullshit that was going on in the 70s. I'm telling you, that's what was going on. Children are sexual beings. Women need help by being aggressed against. It was the worst decade of the American experience. My high school had started out in the 70s as a Montessori school, and then it turned into like an alternative school.

We called our teachers by the first name, which if you're calling your teachers by the first name, they're fucking you. There was just no boundaries in between. Boundaries were blown apart in the 70s, and then, hey, whatever you're into was sort of the cry of the day. And then kids that were sexually abused have a certain probability of becoming perpetrators, too. Oh, yes.

Only to Esther. Because she wants it. She feels left out. We have to give her a little slap. Okay, I hear you. And then people that perpetrate don't perpetrate on one person they do it to many many many and so this thing grows fast well that hurts the most because it's like you're not even special you weren't even act out against you you were left out no like would you like there's still time there's still time no no and I have my own traumas that I'm not fully out with like they are because they're brave.

Your traumas. Your traumas. I don't think you're not brave. Oh. Let's do it together. I have loads of trauma in my childhood. Yes. I want to know your traumas, Dr. Joe.

I had a mother that was nutty, super crazy. In what way? Mommy dearest sort of way. Wow. Like a Munchausen? A Munchausen? No. Just think. Not Munchausen. That's Mommy dead and dearest. Yeah. Mommy dearest sort of like a munchausen no not just just think not munchausen that's mommy dead and

dearest yeah mommy dearest joan crawford yes yes yes okay no wire hangers but really significant emotional abuse yeah sorry esther what well let me let me let's go let's go on the on the success side i've had lots and lots lots of treatment and. Yes. And what I've been left with, you know, trauma leaves you with a certain amount of some assets too, right? So one of the reasons I'm good as a clinician is I had to tune into my mom all the time and make sure she wasn't losing her shit because that would come at me. So I got very good at tuning into other people.

Now that I have boundaries and that I can regulate my emotions, that's a significant asset. I mean, I can feel what's going on without even looking at you I can feel it but isn't that um that's sort of talking about yeah so like that's been my um kind of I feel like it's a curse is that I've had to be so fine so so acutely aware of my mom's little switches because there was an implication for myself you got to get treatment have you had treatment i've been in therapy since i was 14 on and off i have had um brain spotting let me get you some emdr going oh my god but see the first time i was so freaked out after brain spotting that i didn't because it was during the pandemic what is brain spotting it's basically like you have so you have have like binaural beats in your ear.

And then based on where you look, it taps into either a memory or a trauma. And it is so, for me, it was really overwhelming. I didn't have anyone at home to kind of decompress with afterwards. And it fucked me up. I was so freaked out and scared and like spooked for three weeks after that that is more of an anxiety treatment specifically um not spec it works for trauma as you get into it but it does make you feel up yeah i mean but my really good emdr therapists

will all say that after after somebody really first couple sessions they will it's like purging it right they will accuse the therapist of having broken them like you broke me oh i didn't go see i didn't see the therapist again because she felt like she did something to you she broke you yeah like i remember was that on the valley um no it was well i did it from home that was the problem no no no and then i i remember vomiting yeah yeah i it was just so yeah jarring you find delight in yourself i'm just so excited no i'm just so, yeah, jarring. You find delight in her suffering. I'm just so excited. No, I'm just so happy you're here. It's like, I really like, I'm like about to cry because it's just like, it's nice to have

someone that like understands what we're talking about. And you can see it in her. Yeah, it was like a lot of the shit. And we joke about it and it's like funny and I'm glad, but it's nice to have someone who's just like, but it's so nice to have you. And it is like, it is like a nice like you have a good energy it's like not it just doesn't feel we don't feel judged we don't feel no you shouldn't feel shame you shouldn't feel good shouldn't feel judged yeah and you shouldn't hold back yeah

this is the this i see this as the problem of our time i really do and the more you can joke about the more you can talk about you've talked about it with me on podcasts and stuff before and you've been very open about it. And I firmly believe that helps not just you. It helps you to be that way. It helps other people. There, you've done it. You've helped other people.

Right in front of me, I've seen you help other people. It's so cool. And when we go on the road and all these people come up and they're like, I was molested too. It's so common. It just feels so like what we're on this earth to do. It just feels really good. You can't just go. Part of it is acknowledging and opening it up. I don't want to say normalizing it, but bringing it into the room, so to speak.

But you've got to get the body right. Yeah. Because the body is what is fucked up by it. Because I think that TMJ and I feel like our bodies are in fight or flight with the sweaty armpits and stuff. You've got to read the book. Yeah. How do you know how to treat yourself like how do you know what to do to get

better it's a really good question right and how do i know what's the right kind of therapy and that kind of thing it really depends on the case okay uh and you kind of have to find your way sometimes like if you're on five milligrams of lexapro and you take an edible at night after your set like and nobody you're not hurting anybody like is that cool are we cool you and i are cool you are very cool you're doing good esther i'm proud of you i have a feeling yeah and i don't know you very well at all but but but but because we've sort of you know i we've all done all this stuff together um i'm gonna bet you know cognitive behavioral therapy would help you which is an easier kinder kind of okay cbt okay yeah cool i like i do want

to give you that like a quick recap of what basically last year i had a miscarriage and it was a really traumatic post the dnc like i had it was in a lot of pain kyla was helping me through that and i i never have like i told you i've never tried drugs or alcohol like i've been sober my whole life because i had a like a addiction to food i was a binge eater i did a 30-day treatment program like eight years ago, whatever, in recovery for that and doing well. Do you talk about your substance use though in those groups? I haven't done, I don't do, I'm not in groups for that anymore. I did OA, but it wasn't a fit. But anyway, so I had the miscarriage, was in crazy pain, and the doctor had prescribed me hydrocodone

and I would normally never touch anything like that, but I was in so pain and the doctor had prescribed me hydrocodone and i would normally never touch anything like that but i was in so much pain i was like dad give it to me totally appropriate yeah but then i really liked how i felt that night and i called two of my guy friends carlos and our other friend john and was like i like a couple weeks later i was like i actually really like that like i think i want more of that and they were like don't do that maybe try weed and that's how i well it's a lesser problem that's for sure okay do you feel like it's a problem or do you feel like you like have heard it being a problem with other people and you're afraid it's going to be a problem? Good question. I feel when I think about that honestly I'm like it's not interfering with my life but I love it so much. Be careful. That I know that that's dicey.

That's dicey. That's not that's not a normal relationship with a substance. Okay. I've had patients tell me I've had patients with guns in their mouth and who tell me they couldn't pull the trigger because they love their drugs so much they couldn't do that to the drugs. That's how much drug addicts love drugs. They're like love, like love them. And so that's part of the addictive process. Look, there are plenty of alcoholics.

So that's a plus for drug use. That saves a life. So there's some pros and cons. There are plenty of alcoholics that still drink and do okay. They manage to control it and whatever. There are people that do it. It's just if you get to a certain point, then you gotta do something. That's so weird. I quit drinking when I was 25, right when I started comedy. And I feel so lucky because I replaced that drug with my career. So I never

feel like I'm going to drink again. But I definitely like, I'm not like Bobby level, like smoke weed and it can unravel. Is he sober right now? He is sober now. He's doing good. Bobby's a serious drug addict. I know. Like a hardcore. He told me his stories.

I was like, dude, I didn't know. With his mom chasing him through the fields with the car bouncing up and down. It was like, oh my God, he's got stories that are wild. And it's never just like right now. It's very apparent because even if he's sober from alcohol, sober from the drugs, really cutting down on his quote unquote process addictions, now we have bags and bags and bags of sunflower seeds showing up. It's going to be something.

It's going to be something. It's always something. It's going to be something. But you see a different, you're a different flavor than Bobby, right? Okay. Bobby is like, he has got to do something.

Yeah. There's no, his life is in jeopardy if he doesn't. You're in this sort of contemplative bad relationship with a thing that's odd, not right. And you're just, you know, you're figuring it out. Okay. So I can rock on.

I'm not telling you anything. I'm just saying that your thinking is good and you're trying to figure it out and you will. Okay, Drew. Yes, ma'am. If I lean forward, is that okay? Yes. Am I still not in front of anybody's camera or anything?

I think you're good. Oh, he's such a pro. What is, because of your relationship with your mom when you were younger and the trauma that you endured like what how did it manifest that way no one's ever said that to me that way how did it manifest in your life either as a teen and what are some things that um you kind of um know about yourself now where you're like oh shit like that was very um there were two two big themes i'd say uh one was uh like in high school when i finally got a girlfriend i clung like my life depended upon it like i couldn't deal with the breaking up and forming relationships i couldn't do it i just once

once i got attached i was like oh i couldn't let go and that poor girl was was object of that for many years. I feel guilty about that. I have that. Oh, you played to people. Yeah, it's hard. It's really painful. It's really awful. Well, do you think it's because they're the ones validating your feelings? So then you're like, if I don't have them, then what am I?

You know, when you have, it's sort of a, I know if I can put it in a rational context, but it's not uncommon for emotionally abused males to get love and sex addiction. It's just sort of common. And I just was just, you know, clinging to these things. In what way were you clinging? Like she wanted to break up and I was like, no. Why don't you talk about it? I'm confused.

I've also done that. That's very, that's an Esther move. What are you talking about? I've also never broken I'm confused. I've also done that. That's serious. That's an Esther move. I was like, what are you talking about? I've also never broken up with someone. I've only ever been dumped. You're still in a relationship with all these people. So that's codependency, love addiction, that kind of stuff. It's that stuff.

And that's your alcoholic family and all those things. Esther, so you're telling me if Tony Hinchcliffe never broke up with you, you would still be with him today? That's a great question. I don't like The answer is yes. The answer is yes. Dave this is in your hands now.

Do you want to marry her or not? It's up to you. I have no idea who that guy is but I can tell you it would have to get very bad before she would leave. He's gonna Tony's gonna have to come see you

to deal with the fact that you don't know who he is. You're gonna send him to a spiral. That says something, again, you pack a lot into what you say. That's our Ani, yeah. Nutrient dense information. Very quick, in the middle of your sentence.

So the other thing was, oh, when I was dealing with patients later, so I started working at Psychiatric Hospital in 1985. And I would just get cleaned up by drug addicts and borderlines, people who could manipulate really well and with bad boundaries and stuff. Because I would go, oh, I literally would go, it's comical now. I was like, you were sexually abused as a child. I feel that. I could see the pain in you. I see it. I'm going to fix it. I'm going to make it better. And the drug addict goes, yeah, you are. You're going to give me some morphine.

That's what you're going to do. So I didn't understand. Is that what Esther's doing to you right now? She's like, it's cool if I eat edibles, right? It's kind of what she's doing, right? It is a little bit. Well, I just think she's looking for some papa to tell her it's okay. But that's my guess.

I think I still have a little bit of that. Yeah, yeah. That big desire to be like, let me be your person. Let me help you. Yeah. And so that's an asset. That's a good thing. You've got to have really clear boundaries with that.

Clean boundaries. Because our job, this is back to the body keeps the score, right? The job is to be present for that person, not to catch their feelings, not to rescue them from their feelings, just to be fully attuned and available. And I'm very, very, very good at that now and it helps therapeutically so so i think that's why i'm like feeling from you so much it's like so amazing you're present yeah because you're not like there's no like leaning in to do anything no no it's just we're here with it and uh and i have some suggestions and things but it's it's in back in the day like i'm talking 30 40 shit how long ago was that i was born in 83 so it was 30 i'm so excited to talk about liquid death it's actually

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me honey nut it's not always a good idea to retrace or to kind of, you know, I'm saying it's generally not a good idea. But you can get to it without like. Correct. So to some extent, you're trying to, for some people with certain symptoms, you're trying to get to the point where they can think of an accident, say they were in and not have the bodily based reaction. Right.

So, so really what it's about is not about revivifying experiences or clarifying memories. It's about regulating your body and learning to regulate. You said right now you feel it, you know, then that's because there's a part of your brain that's like not with us. Now strangely, one of my talents is I can tune to that part. I can.

And so I can kind of bring it into the room. And like when I do, I like feel really intense stuff right here with you. Is that your spot? Yeah, I have. I shit blood a lot. Yeah. That's how we bonded. So that's it, man. And it does. This is not. And so the reason I know it's hers and I get chills from it too. What's that? Dr. Drew, you're're gonna make me have a breakdown right now i honestly think that my biggest barrier in my life is i'm able to intellectualize everything that has happened to me because i'm like these are things that happen to me we gotta stop that but if for some reason there's a disconnect with my somatic like my body that's normal that's what trauma does and

so i'm feeling it right now as i'm sitting here i know it's my hands they're so cold because i'm yeah yeah that's part of the dyshidrosis and stuff right right right and i as i And so I'm feeling it right now as I'm sitting here. I know it's- But touch my hands. They're so cold because I'm dying on the inside. Yeah, yeah. That's part of the dyshidrosis and stuff. Right, right, right. I forgot when you said that. You're dead inside. I hate that. I do. I am kind of.

Whatever just happened just completely went away. So I don't know what you're doing, but you're doing something, right? I gaze into Annie's eyes. She's my soul. No, like you're running away from all this. Right, I am. And so, but the feeling I just had a minute ago was nothing ever ever really felt and so i know it's yours because of that and it was cold and weird and scrambly and

how are you feeling that good question he's not wrong touch my hand sister he's our shaman but how are you it it's this weird thing that you that humans do we can do. If you open to the information, we communicate in ways that we just don't all even understand. And it's all bodily based. It's through the vagus nerve. It's called a socio-emotional. We saw the biology has actually been kind of worked out. But if you're open and you have good boundaries and you say, well, what happened in the past, I would feel the pain from your injury.

I'd feel that and I go, I got to stop that. Now I feel your experience coming through me and being sort of somehow being reflected in my body. I don't know how, but I've had, when I sit with patients, I'll have, hear weird music, have strange smells, pain in certain parts of my body. For me, is it a smell?

Why do I smell potatoes? Lilacs. Floral. Floral. X-Lax. But anyway, it's weird. But what it does is it brings that part of her in to a safe connection. And if I were working with her, I'd stay with that.

And I'd go, what is that? Who is that? What's going on there? And she would naturally go more into that material. That's different than what I'm telling her to do with EMDR. This is what I would do with a drug addict who needs to, like, very, very quickly, we need to get all of you here and trusting. And if that part of you is not trusting, that part of you will pull you out of the process.

That part will be stronger than the rest. She won't be able to control it because it's there demanding attention and she doesn't even, you can't control that. And then that shows with people like looking away, stuff like that, or it's just a feeling. It's even more uncanny than that, right? It's just, it's about being everyone present, fully present in the room. Am I fully here? I think so.

I'm not sure. Maybe a little phantom version of you is here. Your emotions are high. Let's have a banana. Dr. Drew, we have a segment called Banana Break. Oh, do I have to have banana break? You can just hold it. You can just hold it.

Just be present. I'm going to be present. Dr. Drew, seeing as how you're a man of science, do you believe in- I'm afraid where she's going. Where is this? Do you believe in paranormal ghost stuff? No, I don't believe in ghosts. My wife does very much, and we fight about this.

No, fight. We joke about it all the time. She's going to haunt your ass if she dies first. Well, then I'll believe in it. She's going to haunt you. Then we'll know. I, you know,

she, we were interviewed by, or we interviewed or whatever. We sat with Tyler Henry, you know, the psychic. The medium, yeah.

And the medium. And at the end, they go, what'd you think? What'd he do? And I go, all I know is he's not talking to dead people.

No, no. It was my wife goes, how was this? She goes, well, he's great at talking to dead people. I go, all I know is he's not talking to dead people. She goes, he's talking to dead people no no it was my wife goes how was this she goes well he's great at talking to dead people i go all i know is he's not talking to dead people she was like he's talking to dead people i'm like this is back and forth so i do believe that much because of these strange experiences i have sitting with people tuning to their experiences and receiving them

i sort of feel like the like there's something happening. There's a lot of stuff we're not aware of, right? Our brain has evolved in an environment of evolutionary adaptedness with very specific qualities, and it doesn't perceive everything by any means. It's the most elaborate thing, the best thing in the universe we've ever found so far, but it misses a lot. Just infrared light. It just misses tons of things.

So whatever's happening when you send information to me and how you send it, how I experience it, I don't think we really fully understand what all of that is yet. But I think my suspicion is that a lot of the self and consciousness is a shared experience. And I think we leave somehow parts of ourselves on each other. And if it's a very, do you get what I'm saying? A little. A little. And if it's a very important relationship, naturally it's a big imprint on us. There's a lot there in our brain left over.

And I think that psychics tune into that somehow. Much the way I was tuning into your traumatized self, they can tune into people that are- Do you feel me trying to break your boundaries and get in? Break my balls without my boundaries. Don't be scared. Happy place. Happy place.

I don't- Esther is our- She's an anti-ghost lady. She doesn't believe in any of that. And it's interesting to me how mostly women are the ones that believe in all that stuff too. It fascinating to me i think you have your brain is you know your brain is better than ours right you have this big corpus callosum you can tune into your your the right side of your brain the left side of your body tunes into bodily based

experiences so that's what i have to call on when i tune to you but i have to work very hard at it because i'm well that's because they didn't stick their finger in your vagina maybe that's part of it maybe that's the tuning process they tuned yeah they tuned us but but that you have really you have a great instrument for all this so it's interesting to me that you guys more more seemingly seemingly more naturally believe in that emphasis on the seemingly because she's very i don't and i think my reasoning is like kind of almost you're not a idiot i think that's what i heard that's what you said yeah are you a fucking idiot but i was also i was raised with absolutely no religion and i think you kind of need to buy into that to believe that like there's spirits and stuff maybe yes

and i for me i don't have that but i'm starting to like try to believe in like spiritual yeah it seems like it seemed to nice, isn't it? It seems like a good thing. Yeah, especially because like I grew up in the same house that my dad grew up in, which it was, so it was my grandparents' house and they passed away before I was born. And so like, I want to like believe

that their energy is there. I get it. Well, certainly they're in you. Okay. That's what I was going to say. And maybe having that there sort of fills whatever's in you or triggers whatever's in you in some way. Okay. Because we leave, the sense of self I think is far bigger than the reality of what we do with and amongst each other.

Like for instance, I think a collective something is for sure. I don't know what it is, but it's something as humans. a collective something is for sure. So I don't know what it is, but it's something as humans. But that what we do, what we become and what we feel and everything we experience is really interpersonal.

It's all about other people. But is that just a basic as like, I used to hang out with a friend who would always tell me that I was stupid. And then like, I woke up one day and was like, I believe I'm stupid because I hung out with this person. Like, is that?

That's a little more cognitive, but that's an example of that kind of thing. But wouldn't it be like the tracing back to like, what is it that happened before that that would let you hang out with someone that because you're stupid? Right. Why would you be attracted? Like before that even. You know, one of the things no one ever talks about is attractions. Why would you be attracted to somebody like that?

Yes. Because there's something in you, like you're searching for someone to like solidify some negative thing that you have in your head, maybe. Or something about trauma and unpleasant experiences in childhood sets up attraction. That's sort of why Bobby and I always ask, when Bobby and I first met 10 years ago,

there was always like, why do we feel like old comrades? Like that's the thing we're like, we should see this relationship through do we feel like old comrades like that's the thing we're like we should see this relationship through because we feel like old like vets who were in war together but then i'm like now that i understand it all and i understand his background i'm like we are old vets like we have a very similar traumatic childhood and story and you know what we search for and what we're attracted to our baseline is very similar as well is that what i've heard about on tiktok called like a twin flame relationship where you're like

the same and you connect no that's when your best friend who's a twin doesn't show up to your party and you go light her house on fire i don't know what that refers to really like the twin flame is like it's like you know chakra type stuff people who are dating and they're like so the same and like so deeply like trauma bonded and sometimes the trauma bond is a real thing for sure yeah yeah for sure if you if you look why do the classic is a woman who keeps going after abandoning men when dad was never in the picture when she was a kid that's sort of the classic thing. Men do the same stuff.

But sort of the more visible one is that one because it happens a lot. I don't have that one. I had a friend that pointed out to me that I would go, each guy I would date would either be like super hyper masculine and verbally abusive or feminine and very avoidant. So it would go like dad, mom, dad, mom, dad.

And now my boyfriend's securely attached therapy yes um yeah self-work yeah because some some secure attachment is a hard thing to come by yeah i can't believe well i went younger he wasn't taken yet younger ladies but uh yeah having an alcoholic parent will make you see yeah but that's gonna come through well for me the grant the alcoholics in my family didn't traumatize me in the i think like a traditional way because it wasn't in my like family unit it was my grandparents and like extended relatives for me what it did was we me, my mom and dad and sister bonded over how we don't do that and how that's bad.

So that's why I feel like I don't have traditional like alcoholic trauma. Interesting. Yeah. Do you think that's why you're asking for his approval? Because your family unit who you relate to, you guys are sober. And then now you're doing this thing that they don't do. Maybe, yeah. Because my parents.

Oh, you're letting down the whole chain. I know. My parents do think it's shady that i'm doing it but they're also they're gonna start smoking eating weed soon too they always have for you eventually i have a question about your relationships i know that you don't end them but uh do you start them or is it someone because i know that you know like we're dating our parents kind of so is it like someone that comes in and takes care of you the way your mom does but again happens. But again, but to your point though, you tend to go all one way or the opposite. That's the flip side of the same coin. Yeah, same thing, right?

Yeah, but now that's why down the middle is good. I feel like I'm always the pursuer. Like even every guy I've dated, I feel like I've gone after them. But like non-romantic relationships, you're making me think of something which i wanted to ask you was like i have this pattern where i meet people and i think they're so funny and so exciting and so intoxicating and i become almost like obsessed like obsessed with that person

what's that about she has a tattoo of my name and she doesn't have one of my and that's the big concern so it it again it's i don't know the depths of what's going on but but it's that you idealize right so idealizing de-idealizing that's what that is are you also for yourself you're a perfectionist no but i feel like i hear things about perfectionism and sometimes i identify with them but i don't i'm pretty sloppy my my mom and my sister were always like when we did like crafts together like i always just remember like everything they did was so perfect and so my instinct was to be like i'm gonna do bad and like mess be messy but i mean more in terms of what you demand of yourself.

Oh, yeah. Hard on myself. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That kind of goes together. Why?

It just does. That's why I've noticed it. But the idealized, because then you have an idealized sense of what you need to be. And then you'll have an idealized union with these idealized people. And if I'm not my idealized self, then I'm so mad at myself and hard on myself. Yes. And you're doing the same thing with others, which is sort of the common thing. And you get sort of all blown up about those people. Maybe you have some magical thoughts about what they're going to do to help you be your idealized

self. That feels like an... I feel confident I don't really do that anymore, but I do know that sounds familiar for sure. Like just, yes, like a person is magical and like almost an addiction. Yeah, yeah. This may sound like a funny question. Is it fun? Yeah. So great.

What do you mean? It sounds fun. It sounds like if you're able to play with it and not be really destroyed by it if they don't reflect your needs perfectly and you can have fun with it. So it's almost just like that's how I make friends and it's okay? I don't know you will have to say categorically that's true, but it just occurred to me that it felt like you're having fun with it. Yeah.

And that's okay. Maybe you're right too because in this business, it's like I get to meet new fun people all the time. Like I was just on the show Dollface and like got to hang out with Kat Denning, Shane Mitchell, Brenda Song and was like,

this is so fun. Yeah, so fun. Have fun with it. I mean, it's this feeling I get as you have fun with it. It doesn't hurt you. So yeah,

if you were like a, like even with your friend Christina, who's like your best friend forever, she's, I'm a twin and then Christina, her best friend is a twin. And who lit the house on fire.

I have been very close friends with twins a lot. I don't know if that's odd. But if you were psychotically attached to Christina, which I know you joke about, but if you really were, you wouldn't have moved away from her. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, you're right. That's a good point. Do you know?

You would have stayed by her. Right. That's why it's fun. Do you have these identical twins or fraternal twins always? No, I've just always fraternal twins. Fraternal. Did you lose a twin in utero when you were? No.

I like to think that she's a hemorrhoid though. We call her our resident teratoma. Oh my God. I came across this TikTok that kind of made me feel a certain type of way, which was the girl at a grocery store was asked, hey, what's your name? Like out of nowhere, just somebody coming through and saying, hey, like, what's your name? And her feeling immediately like, I don't want to give this random person my name. I feel that a lot.

Oh, interesting. And I want to ask you, it's like, why do we have an obligation to tell somebody who we don't know our name you do not but let's sort of examine the interaction so um people love it when you use their name that's just a normal human thing and so when i meet somebody for the first time i always ask them their name and i try to use it because Because I feel like it's polite. But if somebody felt like you're taking something, you've had stuff taken away from you by random people. It's just that. You're guarded.

You don't want people to take, you know, it's your name. Fuck you. You're the first person to say that I'm guarded because no one, usually because I give so much information about myself, people would not. I'm one of the most guarded people ever. And most people don't catch on to that. I could see that. I could see that. But I couldn't see how you couldn't be guarded with that history. You'd have to.

So my name is just an extension of that feeling. Something people taking something from you. And also like if you think about it, it's like the girl's like grocery shopping. It's not like she's in like an interaction where she's meeting someone. It's like she's just like going about her day. And then someone comes in and is like, give me your information in the middle you know one of the things i want to caution this more for the audience everybody you know we when you talk about traits and characteristics and stuff i can't think of any trait that's all bad you know what i mean

they all have adaptive qualities now you may not like it and they may interfere with relationships and you need may need to change it. But if you were a fighter pilot, I want the most narcissistic assholes sitting in that F-18. That's who I want. That's who I want in there. I'd like an alcoholic too, because they really get off my throat.

And they're loose, they're loose. Yeah, and so that's who I want sitting in the pilot seat. If we're in a relationship and you're guarded, that could become a problem. We're gonna have to kind of work on that. But if you're in a grocery store and you're guarded, that could become a problem. We're going to have to kind of work on that. But if you're in a grocery store and you're guarded, maybe good. It's going to be okay.

Yeah, it's something that like protected you. It's your ego protecting you. I was sharing a lane line the other day with a guy. He was like, hi, I'm Joe. And he was asking me about the long fins that I was wearing. And he was like, what's your name? Is it worse with men than with women? It is.

Yeah, definitely with women, you know, but he, this is how he said, what do you do that you're able to do to lap swim at noon? Immediately I was already like, why do I have to tell you that? And I was like, oh, you know, I just do, you know, things here and he goes, what's your name? And immediately I was like, oh, you know, I just do things here. And he goes, what's your name? And immediately I was like, I just could not.

It sounds to me like he recognized you. No, he didn't though. And what did you do? It's this common thing. I said my name reluctantly. See, the interesting part to me. And then probably you sold yourself out. And then I felt like, I didn't need to give my name. The interesting part to me is that in spite of you

having such a strong emotional feeling to the contrary, you still went along with it. Yeah, but that's me to a T. I really betray myself a lot. The more problem part of that whole interaction was the self-betrayal. Yeah. Yeah. If I had been there, I would have yelled it. I would have been like, she's not going to fuck you, dude.

I love jumping in and just fucking getting a man away from a girl. I'm like, this is what I do. Yeah, I'm super codependent in that way. But I need an Annie in that situation. But you know what I mean? Like where you're like, you can just sense like you're in a swimsuit. He's just trying to fuck. It's like, get the fuck away from me.

But you know what I look like in a swim cap. It's not hot, Annie. You are so delusional. I can't stand you. You're so hot. Well, that is bringing up something interesting about, I think, our dynamic, which is I feel like Annie and I, in particular, are people who will, we need to be told no. And I feel like you're someone who you might want to say no, but for some, you like, you

don't like. Overextend, yeah. Yeah. And I feel like. Tell me more about that. What do you mean you need to be told no? Give me an example. Okay.

So like, if I'm. Say it. Say it. I'm like not quite thinking of a specific, but it's more like. Yeah. Go ahead. I need to be told. If I'm annoying you, like I don't want to annoy you.

You would rather be told than be doing the act. You're not doing it to annoy someone. Yeah. So that it hurts your feelings if someone doesn't tell you. Exactly. Like I don't ever want. You would rather someone tell you. I don't want someone to sit and hang out with me if i'm being just i would be so much more soothed if you're like i'm i mean i've had enough of you and i'd be like i would just i wouldn't be offended by that i'd be like oh great and i could never say

that i i'm someone who was like i wouldn't dare hurt her feelings in this moment right and so that's why you might get mad at her but- But you might get mad at her later? No, not get mad at her later, but- If you guys were romantically involved, it would be- I'm so sorry. I'm romantically involved. You know what I mean?

It would be bad. He finally said that. Someone said that. It would be- You would get turned off all the time is what would happen. Let's take it back, Esther. Let's take back the words.

We don't mean what we just said. So my clingy self as a 17-year-old or whatever would have driven you. You would have been like, that's disgusting. You sing it across the room, it would have bothered you. Why? Because it's the opposite of what you want somebody to be. Oh, because I actually, I'm learning here. So I want someone to say no to me.

You want somebody to be honest. Yeah. You want somebody to be present. And you know parts of yourself that are real that can be irritating you want to hear when they're irritating yeah so then why would a clingy person not because i would never tell you that i would tell you i'd be too afraid to rock the boat which is ultimately me yeah i don't want i'm so afraid of um my parents fighting or my parents you know like i don't want to. I'm so afraid of my parents fighting or my parents, you know, like I don't want to ruin a moment, cause a stir. So I just, you know, yeah, I'm kind of spineless. Bobby and I talk about this all the time.

You are not spineless. Oh, thank you for saying that. I'm not spineless. You're codependent. Codependent. Those are different things. And I think that's. Because I think if somebody, if you really needed to stand up, you would. Yes would yes i do and i think that ultimately like push to the corner i'm like all

right and you'll protect other people too vigilantly yes you'll do it for other people just not so for yourself that's right not you're right and just not for myself a lot um i think it's confusing for you it's interesting i'm like she can't believe it it's interesting i to me it's like how are you saying we're not dating we That's what I'm saying. We're not in a romantic relationship. No, no, no. It would not work. It would not be good. Or maybe it would.

I don't know. It seems like it would not be good. But we'll try it out. It's like joy. But I relate strongly to what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm recovered from that.

And I'm telling you, it's a lot better. I'd like to get there eventually. I think that I'm- I think EMDR would get you off the ground really quickly. recovered from that and i'm telling you it's a lot better i'd like to get there eventually i think that i think iam darrow would get you off the ground really quickly do you think it's like a black and white thinking too where it's like if if it's like if we assert our boundaries it's going to be like this very negative thing i wasn't allowed to assert my boundaries as a child and then if you were to then it's like it would be this huge thing rather than just being kind of like a it's it's that's a really important. What she's going to do is build an internal boundary around her emotional self, which doesn't require doing anything.

It's just there. You understand? Right, because she could give her name without it being an issue. She will feel whole and not intruded upon in those moments. And so she can react in a regulated fashion. She wouldn't go, you girl, stay away from me. She'd go, you know, right now I'm busy. I'm so sorry.

It should be appropriate with him, I should say. Be able to be fully there. Right. And I am not. I am so dysregulated to where even a tiny interaction like that throws me off completely. And then I'm spending the next 30 minutes breaking it down of how I could have done it better,

why I felt. Ultimately, it's shame. Yeah, it's the shame cycle over and over again. So you got to regulate all that so the shame goes away and she's connected to those parts of herself. So that part is there with her when she's interacting with people. So it really isn't about, hey, don't do that. That's a different kind of boundary.

Right. This is the microsurgery of building. So that it doesn't even matter like the external locus of control is not as important as like. It's the being whole and being regulated. And it's funny that I keep pointing at my stomach for you, right? I think I had some of that too is probably why I'm going here. But for you, it really is here. I gave myself basically like I have colitis.

I bet it goes away when you get properly treated. Yes, it really does. Unless it's like inflammatory bowel disease. Like ulcerative colitis or like um i have flare-ups here and there it's not like a you know chronic thing that i deal with every day but the higher the stress i take um a suppository called misalamine yeah yeah can we insert that for you on the live show oh my god yes it's essentially an honor oh my god yes i want you guys to actually learn how to insert a suppository.

It's the easiest thing ever. I would love to. Yeah, absolutely. You're doing a lot of really important work here. It seems like God's work now. It's really getting to the meat of it. We're going to be fingering our ass a little sooner than ever.

Some is selling me his ass for instance. In a safe place. I have to say my mind is blown still on the concept of like you you couldn't net you wouldn't be like could you ever see yourself telling me like i'm in love with you let's kiss like could you ever see yourself being like esther like not now or like um the one thing that i i i've seen her do that by the way at an airport but but it would come out wrong it would not make her happy if she did it correct really so here's the thing on

during the times where i've been like i cannot do that or i'm putting my foot down i still throw myself into a shame cycle i don't feel it and it will come off a little aggressive yeah when she gets to that point where she has to do that, it'll feel like she has to be kind of angry. Because you've been like waiting to, because it was like maybe like there felt like a natural time to do it before that she ignored. She doesn't feel it. She doesn't feel it before.

Right. Yeah. And when she feels it, she's angry. And then all of a sudden. It really for me is, it is a lose-lose. I'm so dysregulated in that way. So it's either I betray myself or I betray myself. You know what I mean? Like those are my two options because I am unhealed in that way so it's either i betray myself or i betray myself you know what i mean like those are my two options because i am unhealed it's a really powerful statement but i

get it what wow i find it so fascinating this is all a bewildering territory for you really that's like a cute part about esther things are like bewildering a lot i'm like what do so what would someone like me do who wants to have a relationship with kalilah and wants to like travel with them and like exactly what you did which is you told me i like being told when i'm being annoying and i receive that exactly as as you said it which is I'm going to try to do that from here on out it's going to take some effort on my end but still confusing it's so funny yeah tell her more tell her more often and more frequently exactly that you guys are brilliant with the use of humor use lots

of humor and practice it yeah but also like Esther is like triggering to some people on vacation not I swear to God, it's not me, but like Eric Griffin was talking to me about how annoyed he was that you stayed in the hotel. She's like a potato. She's a potato vacationer. She likes to sit and she was watching the news. It is annoying.

You're like, okay, this is annoying. I'm just very used to it. It's probably there's a friendship, but so Esther. So then when we talked to you about it, you,

what you said something to me about, cause I am just at peace with that I just didn't expect anything different from that and I think it's hilarious it was a school shooter day too she was literally in Hawaii watching a school shooter news it was a school shooter day Carlos it was a school shooter day I will

say it was a school shooter day she's blocked it out that was not what I was focusing on I was on my phone but you but but you said that you would have liked someone like a producer to come and like drag you out and force you to do the activities if that if it was for work right we're shooting stuff and yes like that is i would have liked that so you want someone to is that mom or dad like not come to my dad always even still to this day like threatens like he'll grab me by my ankles and

pull me out of bed if i won't get up to go i can target with my mom i can take that role but you know esther when i see you being that way and you're a little bit defiant in some situations i really respect and envy that about yeah because i don't have that same defiance i couldn't stand up to my parents i had to just say yes to everything that they demanded out of me. I was a racehorse. Like I had no autonomy. I had no like identity. Who I was was what they told me I was.

So then I get jealous of that because I'm like, you're a hard worker and you know how to do things. And like you can, if someone says do this, you can do it right away and get it done. Like, that's what I hear. So isn't that back to that point of none of these things are all liabilities. They come with assets. Everything comes with assets and liability. Everything. Everything.

But is it true? Because I feel like any fight I've gotten in with Esther has always been me mad at your boundaries. And then when I think about it, I go like, it's actually very impressive. Like, you really like, if you have a boundary it's like there's no i'm like but what if this is easier for me you're like no bitch and i'm like you know and then my pattern is to like you know hold in and try to people please and then i get so pissed but when i think about it it's like i do really like what kalilah's saying it's like i do really like admire that in you it's like

wild i've like never seen someone just because we don't have it literally and it is i do feel like there is a similarity because i i have a specific memory of a time where i remember i texted you if you wanted to go walk and you got mad and i was like why is she mad at me i just invited her to something but then i like look back at it and i was like you felt like because i asked you that you had to yeah because i think what was going through my head was like, you would go, can you come at this? And it would be like an impossible time for me to get there. And then I'd be like, no, I'm rushing. You'd be like, why aren't you here yet?

And I'm like, because it takes me longer to get ready than you and it's at your house and I'm coming all the way to you. But it's like in my head, I'm like, should you just say no? But I wouldn't have even dared invited you to my house. Do you know what I mean? Like people pleasing wise, I wouldn't have even invited you to my house because i would have been like she's gonna say no or whatever i mean i have dreams where you like leave me like places like you're in my life you are tied in wait i have dreams like that not about you but i have i know they're not about me i know esther no my

childhood best friend like where i'm always like trying to hang out with her and she's off back to school or missing. But sometimes like, is it a dream or I was at the comedy store and you've left when I'm on stage and I get off stage to take a picture with you and hang out with you. Do any of these. And you're literally not there, but I don't know. And I would wait four hours for you, but it's okay.

Do any of these issues get in or how does how do these things operate in your intimate relationships great question i feel like i accidentally fell for a guy who's very healthy how dare you you went through some shit to get there yeah you went through someone else but like literally just got accidentally lucky that the guy i thought was attractive happened to be like really secure and so i feel like i've almost grown and changed through being with him for so long but certainly not without it's like i we joke he's always like i should have broken up with you years ago because I would like I was like the queen of ultimatums the ultimatum goddess but we're like better now and he's really

happy that I'm on lexapro because I had really bad anxiety and cannabis yeah he's like thinks I'm overdoing it with that the anxiety can get worse over time with the cannabis be careful that's exactly what happened to me. I called 911 on myself. And I used to be just an avid smoker. And eventually it started to have the reverse effect. I started to become paranoid. And what did you do in response to that when it first started happening? I don't remember.

Smoke more. Oh, yes. That's it. And then I started really loading up on the edibles. I used to say that weed makes me doubt my Leo. So then I go into those shampoos. Every time I was big, like if I went on a podcast or something and I'm in a time period where I'm smoking a lot of weed, I would come on and be like, why did I say that?

Oh my God, I was too much. I was too this or that. You were too big. Yeah, I was too big on a fucking podcast. Which is like, the only way to bomb a podcast is to not talk. But really like, yeah. And then- Where'd you guys grow up?

I'm Philadelphia. Philadelphia. Twin brother. Skokie, a suburb of Chicago. Highest number of Holocaust survivors in the country. Winner, survivor. Is that your family too? Well, we don't really know.

I was raised Quaker, lightly raised Quaker. What's your ethnicity? I'm just curious. I'm sorry. Stop the podcast. Ashkenazi, like 20% Ashkenazi. From part of the Holodomor Ukrainian thing? I don't really know. It's just through

23andMe. I've completely blocked out the war, so I hope it's not Ukrainian. I'm being a bet. I'm Ukrainian. They're coming for me. Annie, imagine if you were actually Ukrainian. I just wake up every morning and I go, I'm going to choose myself today. Were you told you were Russian? Yeah, people speak Russian to to me constantly but i'm not but i'm not russian they don't say you

have russian descent your family doesn't say that no everyone was that my mom was adopted which is a lot of stuff happening from that and then um and then my dad's mother was adopted so the 23 and me said that were um like 20 ashkenazi and then the rest is like British I think hmm cuz a lot of Ashkenazi was it was a exodus from Ukraine but people speak Russian to me a lot like in a distressed situation people always tell me that my because I'm half Ashkenazi and I'm half Finnish and I'm always told that the Ashkenazi the Jew side is the juice I'm Russian I must the Ashkenazi, the Jew side is- The Jew side. I'm Russian. I must be Russian because my last name is Povitsky

and it ends in a Y. Oh yeah. And I'm just going based on that. Come on, keep Russian. Let's finish it up. And usually when they say Russian, Ashkenazi, they mean Belarus or Ukraine. Okay.

Which is probably what, maybe we're cousins. Probably, we must be. You were born with my mom. Maybe you are related to my mom somewhere. And you were raised in Philippines. Philippines. Yeah. Yeah. And why'd they come over? So my sister and I were part of the Philippine national team for swimming.

And it's very limited, the support and the resources to become a… You trained here. Right. So my dad was like, also my dad had lost all his money all of his money back home so he was like fuck we gotta go and also we gotta you really gotta step it up and be the price goats because oh boy um we don't have money for college so you better get into d1 school and we did and we're gonna take you to a doctor that fingers your ass and yeah on top of that we're gonna get you rectally uh raped and we're gonna take you to a doctor that fingers your ass. And we're, yeah. On top of that, we're gonna get you rectally raped. And we're gonna make sure that you have

three suicide attempts before the age of 18. That's why I ended up in BHC. I ended up, I'm very familiar with the- BHC down in Alhambra? Alhambra, twice in Alhambra. Alhambra. And then one in Torrens where that counselor- That's a good hospital hospital i'm sorry that happened

i don't know about the adolescent program but you know yeah i mean it was i mean overall i thought it was a good stay i remember singing casey and jojo a lot there and like he wasn't supposed to sing the other fucking part he wasn't supposed to be jojo yeah i really do feel like my like reason for being alive is to talk about trauma in a funny way and help people get over it. I really love to do that. It's where I feel really most aligned.

And I talk about it in my set and I pound people that were molested. We have a fun moment. I do this whole set. And then a comic, I'm not going to say his name, comes up after me and goes, wow, how many people did you fuck in that set and called me a whore on stage i was like i had just gone up after chris rock had done an hour of comedy i like smashed doing this stuff had this like exchange of energy

with people and he said that and i was so upset and i like said something to him afterwards but it's like i know that like i can't like teach someone this right teach i can't teach this man that he can't like i told him i don't like that he did that did he respond yeah but he's been talking shit on me and stuff about it and it's like it just was like to me it was like so hurtful that that's like what he got out of my set when it's like there was like this underlying message but that says more about him than exactly yeah i've noticed uh jen kirkman lately railing on male comedians. Yeah. And it's like, there's something going on. I don't know quite.

That your story is very vivid and not okay. Yeah. And it just, I guess to me it was like, but what I'm trying to sort of reframe is I think it triggered something in me where I was like, am I coming off like a slut? Or like, is that what I'm sounding like? And what I realized is I'm like, I could literally like heal people

through jizz jokes that's a gift i don't know what i mean like i can tell a little joke but you know what i mean like i can like get these messages across while telling these jokes and so i'm kind of like reclaiming that and not but i was so like fucking i'm trying that that is that story is shocking it makes me so mad and then he bumped me the next night and like like i was punished for telling him dr drew after an hour of sitting with us, are you experiencing compassion fatigue? Yes. Is that a lot? I know.

We came on strong. Yes, I am. I feel where I felt that right here. Yeah, I noticed it. I noticed it. I normally don't. And I thought that was interesting. No, no, no.

It's something that some people do to me. And I was trying to figure out which one he was doing. I'm sorry. I apologize. I don't think it was you. I'm something that some people do to me. And I was trying to figure out which one of you was doing it. I'm sorry. I apologize. I don't think it was you. I'm not sure. Because it was odd. I felt like, oh, I need a coffee.

And I thought, why? I'm into this. It doesn't have a book in it? Because it's Esther. Yeah, I'm sure. That's your codependency. And I wondered, is that just me didn't sleep enough last night? No, I think I did.

You came in and we were all pushing each other. But I have trauma, trauma, trauma, trauma. And Esther's like, I don't and we were like all pushing each other like but i'm like and esther's like i don't have trauma and then she's like but i did have a miscarriage like you have trauma bitch but i learned from esther though to say yes i did feel some trauma no no everything's fine yes we need esther to give us more esther well on that negative note we'll let you go, Dr. Drew. Thank you so much for this. Thank you. Do you have any closing words? You guys are great, and I enjoyed it. It turned out to be much. I mean, you exceeded all my expectations.

You too. It was so fun. I know. Please come back. We'll need it. Love you. Once a year. If you do the work, and we'll see how it goes, and you give me an update, I'm trying to motivate you.

Yes.