Trump's Trials - New evidence unsealed in federal election interference case against Trump

Episode Date: October 2, 2024

Trump's Trials, host Scott Detrow speaks with NPR Justice Correspondent Carrie Johnson about Special Counsel Jack Smith's January 6th brief. Federal prosecutors are providing the most detailed look yet — at their election interference case against former President Donald Trump. In court papers unsealed on Wednesday, the Justice Department describes how Trump allegedly conspired to overturn the results of the 2020 election.Follow the show on Apple Podcasts or Spotify for new episodes each Saturday.Sign up for sponsor-free episodes and support NPR's political journalism at plus.npr.org/trumpstrials.Email the show at [e-mail] more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

It's Trump's Trials from NPR. I'm Scott Detro. We love Trump! This is a persecution. He actually just stormed out of the courtroom. Innocent to proven guilty in a court of law. Federal prosecutors are providing the most detailed look yet at their election interference case against former President Donald Trump.

In court papers unsealed this afternoon, the Justice Department describes how Trump allegedly conspired to overturn the results of the 2020 election. The 2024 election is, of course, five weeks away at this point. More on that when we come back from NPR Justice correspondent, Keri Johnson. J.D. Vance and Tim Walz had their first and only debate on Tuesday. What happened? The MPR Politics podcast has you covered with all the news and analysis from the vice presidential debate. Listen to the MPR Politics podcast wherever you get your podcasts. So again, this is a case brought by special counsel Jack Smith. It is not going to trial this year.

So why are we seeing these court filings now? We're seeing them now because the Supreme Court ruled this past summer that Trump and future presidents enjoy substantial immunity from prosecution for official acts they take in the White House. This filing is the Justice Department's attempt to explain that Trump should not be immune from conspiracy charges because DOJ says he was acting as a candidate and not as president

when he advanced bogus claims about election fraud. Prosecutors say Trump was a private citizen, motivated by personal gain, and just like anyone else, he should stand trial for these alleged crimes. This is a 165 page document in the luxurious amount of time that you've had to read it since it since it came out to bringing it to us now. Have you found anything new? A few new things.

Yes. Prosecutors assert that on January 6th, 2021, as rioters were rampaging through the Capitol, Trump himself was personally tweeting from a dining room off the Oval Office. They mentioned a tweet that attacked his Vice President, Mike Pence. And within a minute of that tweet, the Secret Service evacuated Pence from the Capitol. Rioters actually got pretty close to Pence before he could be ushered to safety. An aide told Trump that things at the Capitol were turning dicey, prosecutors say, but Trump allegedly said, so what? There are also some new details about notes Pence took about his conversations with Trump and the fact that Trump spoke with podcaster Steve Bannon the morning before the Capitol

riot. A couple hours later, Bannon said on his podcast that all hell was going to break loose on January 6th. The Pence details are interesting because Trump's legal team has already signaled that they're going to argue that anything related to Mike Pence deserves legal protection. Why is that? Trump's lawyer John Laro recently said in court that Pence should be off limits because he was a government official having conversations with the president. He said if DOJ tries to include Pence in

any case, they're gonna appeal all the way up to the Supreme Court. But today prosecutors said they're leaving out some the way up to the Supreme Court. But today, prosecutors said they're leaving out some evidence they got from Pence. They're only gonna focus on Pence's very narrow role in charge of the certification proceeding on January 6th. They say the president and the executive branch have no authority to choose the next president. Nat. What happens to all of this as Trump wins the presidential election that's coming up in a few weeks? You know, it's pretty widely expected Trump will direct his next attorney

general or acting attorney general to get rid of this federal case in DC altogether. He said he may deliver pardons to many of the 1,500 people who've been charged with crimes related to that siege on the Capitol. The prosecutors have signaled they want to keep working through election day. And the judge in this case says she's not taking the election calendar into account. If Trump loses the presidency, it's possible this case could go to trial, but probably not before 2026. The Supreme Court is likely gonna wanna consider additional questions about immunity. This is, after all, the first federal prosecution in history against a former president. Right. That's NPR's Keri Johnson. Keri, thank you so much. My pleasure.

Thanks for listening to Trump's Trials from NPR. Keep an eye out for more episodes like this whenever big news happens. Fresh air, up first. NPR News Now, Planet Money, Ted Radio Hour, ThruLine, the NPR Politics Podcast, CodeSwitch, Embedded, Books We Love, Wildcard, are just some of the podcasts you can enjoy sponsor free with NPR Plus. Get all sorts of perks across more than 20 podcasts with the bundle option. Learn more at plus.npr.org. Soterios Johnson's presidential vote has often come down to less than 1% of the state's population. On NPR's Consider This Podcast, we'll hear what's keeping Wisconsin voters up at night. We need someone who's going to be dedicated to what's happening for us.

Wisconsin, where just 20,000 votes could swing a state of nearly 6 million. This week on NPR's Consider This podcast.