Was I In A Cult? - MLM LuLaRoe: “What’s Your Why?” (UPDATE)

Episode Date: July 8, 2024

**NOTE: This episode originally ran in 2022** She's a hustler, baby. And she just wants you to know. Roberta Blevins was taught to be a self-starter. Inspired by her self-made father, she knew that if you put your mind to it, anything can happen. And it's true. Anything can happen. But that's the problem with anything. Anything sometimes includes MLM's. Multi-level marketing (schemes). This is a story of a dynamite go-getter and how she crawled her way into a box of fart leggings and eventually... crawled her way out.  — Roberta hosts her own podcast: Life After MLM. Check it out! @lifeaftermlmpodcast —  Find us on Instagram/Tiktok: @wasiinacult (Instagram for the legging pic!) Help keep this show going by supporting us on Patreon  Have your own story and want to be on our show?  Email us: [e-mail] Follow Roberta: @therealrobertablevins

The views, information, or opinions expressed by the guest appearing in this episode solely belong to the guest and do not represent or reflect the views or positions of the hosts, the show, podcast one, this network, Cult. I'm Liz Ayakuzzi. And I'm Tyler Missom and on this show we give those who are in cults or cultic environments a chance to tell their story and take their power back and you know what? We like to do it with a bit of levity. We hope you guys all had a safe and happy fourth and today we are blessing you with one of our old favorites featuring our now dear friend and hilarious podcaster in her own right, Roberto Blevins.

Roberto was part of Lula Rowe. That's fun to say. Lularo. Lularo. An MLM that sells clothing. Not just clothing. The sexiest leggings you've ever seen. Oh, they're sexy.

And they're all so smelly. We'll get to that. You know, a lot of people write us often asking about MLMs and this episode does a great job of showing just exactly how MLMs are in fact cults. Roberta's podcast is named Life After MLM. It's great, she's great and we highly recommended if you like the show you will love it. Our show it does take a lot of time to make. If we could, we'd work on it full-time and still have more work to do. So we are taking this week to try to catch up and get ahead a bit as we are producing new episodes every single Monday. Yeah, and with that, we have a ton of really great episodes

coming right up. Like next week we have wea wea wea we episode featuring Ashley Teter Maddie is her youngest brother they're actually 14 years apart in age and were estranged from each other for almost 25 years because of their cult leader father. Now while Ashley was kicked out of the family when Maddie was just a young boy she never really knew what became of her family's life under the rule of her cult father. But Maddie will join us to share the story of his cult upbringing, and here's a little taste.

But from that point, something changed specifically with my dad to where he started letting everyone know that God was waking him up in the middle of the night and was just talking directly to him, revealing all kinds of things, and then it slowly starts to come out that there's going to be this new love move that God is doing. And the hallmarks of the move was lots of extended periods of touching and hugging and holding each other and stroking hair and holding faces and staring deeply into eyes during very long Friday night praise and prayer services. And in the weeks ahead we have great stories from many cults.

Including a woman who was in Beakram Yoga, a 30-year-old who was roped into an acting cult as a teenager, a meditation cult, an ex-Q andQ an honor, a psychedelic cult, a sex farm cult, and much more. Yeah, and your episode as well is forgetting all that. That's correct. My episode will be in the list. So while you get this treat of Verbarda, we are busy making all of these episodes to be able to deliver new fresh hot steaming content every Monday. Really from the bottom of our hearts we thank you all for supporting this show. It really means a lot to us. And to all our Patreon members, we do appreciate you and we'll have some fun Patreon stuff coming up as well. We really will. So stay tuned. Oh, some more fun updates. We are th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th th th th the the th the the the the the the the the th the the the the the theate the the to to the the the to to to the to the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their the, the, the, the, the the thr-s. teateateateateateateateateateateateateatr-upe, tfeateateateateate, theate. their up as well. We really will. So stay tuned. Oh, some more fun updates.

We are finally getting our act together on merch. So stay tuned for that as well in the next few weeks. Thank you to Stephen Labram for helping us get our act in order. And with all that, enjoy this episode from our very first season. We love bomb you all. Thank you for continuing to spread the word and we'll see you back here right here in one week. Don't spare my life. Crucify me. M.L.M. is a utopian idea. You put yourself in that utopian mindset. You're going to have your own business.

You're going to have so much more time freedom. You're going to be a better mother, a better wife, a better woman, a better partner, everything. None of this is real. Welcome to Was I an a Cult. I'm Liz Aikuzzi. And yet again, I am Tyler Missom. Now, for those of you who are new to our little show, we here tell tales of those who were in and left cults. And for those who need help understanding our format, we bring lightness and levity to intense stories for a

number of reasons, but mainly because we are showcasing the fact that people don't need to live in their trauma. Yes and everyone thus far we've interviewed has healed enough to be able to to to to reflect. to be a a a a a a to reflect. to be a. to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be a to be. to toe. toe. to to to to to to t. t. I I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. the. the. the. the. the. the. t. t. te. te. te. te. tel. tel. tel. tel. te. tell. tell. tell. tell. And, tell. And. And. And. And, tel. And. trauma. Yes and everyone thus far we've interviewed has healed enough to be able to reflect on their experience without retraumatizing themselves. And we use humor because a spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down. In fact, the guests are often the one who are laughing the most as they recall some of the absurdities that the cult they were in presented them. And they're thrilled to be given a space that human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human human, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, the, the, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, the. trilled to be given a space that humanizes them and their experience. Our guests appreciate that. It makes them feel seen and heard. Treat it as eagles, not as an animal in a zoo that everyone wants to look at, but it's terrified to touch. They also appreciate having the subject matter handled by people Liz and I, who have been through it ourselves. Our guests are strong, badasses who are brave enough to tell their stories.

And we give them that platform. But again, any time you try something new, i.e., blending comedy with trauma, there are some who just don't quite get it. In fact, some trolls have reacted poorly to our use of levity, thinking we undermine the guests' experience or make fun of them. But mind you, if you actually listen, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, the the to, to, the guests' experience or make fun of them. But mind you, if you actually listen to the show, we never make fun of the guests. We only ever make fun of Tyler. That's true. So today, we are going to try something new. Well, not new, but familiar, perhaps.

We're going to approach this episode about a woman who is in a cult with gravity and somerness. There will be no jokes, there will be no fun, there will be no light. Any uplifting moments of survivorship or transformation post-cult will be left out. We now present kidding with you. We're just joking with you. We love the haters, y'all! We love you, our listeners, and we love this show, and we will never, ever abandon it. Yes, and we are incredibly excited about today's quite wacky episode. Oh man, this little lady, she is a force.

We've been wanting to tackle this type of cult for a long time. Because this is something many don't assume to be a cult. Because it seems like a business. Tyler, I know you watch many documentaries about cults. Oh man, so many cults, so little time. And one that we both enjoyed was Lula Rich, a doc series on Amazon. Guys, if you haven't watched it yet, 100% check it out. You'll never look at stretchy pants the same way again. And one of the people that was featured in

that series, well she didn't stop talking after the cameras quit rolling. In fact, she's with us here today. She is the amazing Roberta Blevins, a San Diego girl born and bred. And a daddy's girl from a very young age. My dad was amazing. Amazing man. We lost him in 2013 to pancreatic cancer very quickly. We enjoyed those last couple months. I went over as much as I could. He always asked for a Big Mac and a Coke, so I'd bring him over a Big Mac and we'd sit

and we'd talk and you know I held his hand as he took his last breath and I leaned down and whispered in his ear and told him it was okay to go. He was my coach for everything. I was a total daddy's girl and so losing him so quickly was just Devastating the whole year after my dad died because I mentioned I would bring him big Macs I would equate the feeling of eating a cheeseburger with being with my dad I was in a very unhealthy place Emotional binge eating like dang that butter finger is the only thing that's gonna make me feel better right now I gained a bunch of weight and then one day her cousin reached out. the thi tho th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I tho tho tho tho thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the tho- tho- tho- thi the whole the whole the- the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole the whole tho thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi that thi that that that that that that that that that thi wo-y that thi thi that thi thi thi thi thi th butterfinger is the only thing that's gonna make me feel better right now. I gained a bunch of weight. And then one day, her cousin reached out. She was like, oh my god, if you're looking to lose weight, I just started with this company,

we've got these wraps. I'll send you one, see if it works for you. It's just this thing supposed to like I don't know make you skinny. Magic skinny lotion. I also have lotion that makes me smart. We better lather that one on Tyler because you're going to need it this episode. We cover things like math. Great. So skinny wraps and lotion may have sounded too good to be true, but it was her cousin whom she trusted. And the process makes for an exciting night's sleep. Oh, you bet it does.

You saran wrap yourself like your Kathy Bates overnight. Part of the deal was that she had to take a before and after picture. I even remember like doing my before and after pictures and just letting it hang out in my before. And like sucking it in in my after. I didn't even think at the time like this is deceitful. It was more like I didn't want to let my cousin down. And she's like, it worked. It's called, it works.

Just so we're clear about this company, it works. It's don't work, y'all. It's all bullshit. to be all of it. Instead, try healthy. wrap for leftovers. Buy the beeswax. Yeah we have that it's great. It's really cool and the way you get it to work guys is crumple it all up before get it nice and soft that's how it becomes softer. Oh I didn't know that. Yeah. Okay there you go. I learned something today. That's how you use the beeswack covers. When my cat's healthy he just one reason I use pretty litter.

Okay, so a few great things about pretty litter. One is it's ultra-absorbent crystals trap odor instantly, guys, so no more cat cat's cat bathroom smell. Second, it's got this great texture. It's like sand. So my cat, he feels like he's taking a trip to Honolulu when he's just taking a trip to the Lulu. The third is pretty litter super light crystal base also minimizes mess and dust.

Plus, the crystals last up to a month, which means less scooping and fewer trips to the old garbage can. Oh, and there's a fourth guy's pretty litter changes colors to help monitor early signs of potential illness in my cat including urinary track infections and kidney issues. It's uber important that our cat is healthy because he has many responsibilities around the house. Ah yes the day filled with purring, slinking around and looking pensively out the window at birds. You talking about your cat schedule or yours, Liz? Meow! Pretty litter helps keep tabs on my cat's health and keeps odors down.

You and your cat are going to love pretty litter as much as we do. Go to pretty litter.com slash in a cult and use code in a cult to save 20% on your first order and get a free cat toy. That's pretty litter.com slash in a cult code in a cult to save 20% and get a free meow cat toy. Pretty litter.com slash in a cult code in a cult terms and conditions apply seasight for details. Oh look a bird. This message is sponsored by Greenlight. You know growing up there were so many important things that our parents taught us.

Yeah, though we shouldn't swallow gum. Yeah, it stays in your stomach for seven years, they claimed. Don't sit too close to the TV. You might go blind, they said. Don't swallow watermelon seeds. A watermelon will grow in your stomach. So they did. They did they taught us in things. But what they didn't really teach us was about finances. At all. I feel like our entire generation learned about the fears of razor blades and

Halloween candy but never the fears of high interest rates. That is something we are hoping to change with our respective children. Yes and we will do it with Greenlight. Greenlight is a debit card and money app made specifically for families. You guys, I love this app. Parents can send money to their kids and keep an eye on their kids spending and saving. All while their kids are learning to build money confidence and lifelong financial literacy skills. Which is huge, which I wish I had this as a child. And the Greenlight app also includes a chores feature

which I is my favorite feature you can set up at one time or recurring chores customized your family needs right so you can reward your kids with the allowance after they've done their damn chores. Which was better than when I was a kid and I had to work all day for one dirty nickel that you probably just tossed in your mouth. So many germs. Disgusting. But you know, I probably would have worked a little better

had I known that my money was going on a debit card and gaining interest. You 100% would have worked her. Millions of parents and kids are learning about on Greenlight. But that doesn't mean they should stop learning about how breakfast is the most important meal of the day. Although that's a little debatable now with this whole fasting craze. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, guys, go.

Sign up for Greenlight today. Get your first month free when you go to Greenlight.com slash cult. That's Greenlight.com slash cult. That's Greenlight.com. to try Greenlight for free. For Roberta, she found comfort in the product and in the camaraderie. So her cousin invited her to a Facebook party for the group and asked her to bring friends. And a ton of people were buying stuff, like a ton of people. And my cousin comes to me and she's like, look, you can either get free stuff

or you can join. All the stuff that you want is in the intro kit plus more that you didn't even know you wanted. So I was like, well how much does it cost? And she's like, the kids' 99, but like what you were planning to buy was like 130. So you're going to save $31 and you're going to get more. And I will put all of these sales and these people underneath you. You'll get a bonus check, you'll get paid, you'll do all these things. And I was like, duh.

Of course I'll join. And why shouldn't she? I mean, Roberta knows a deal when she sees one. And she was interested in extra revenue. Who isn't? I mean, those Disneyland tickets don't buy themselves, you guys. I was always the person that coming from the background it came from always wanted to make sure that my children never wanted for anything. My dad owned car dealerships in San Diego. I grew up very comfortable but there's a lot of naivete in privilege as well. I never would question people's motives. Like if you're nice to me, you're nice to me. I never ever thought nefarious things.

I'm also the kind of person that's always a perpetual people pleaser. I'm literally the perfect victim. But also, I've always been a hustler. Her husband had a good job that took care of the bills, but any additional income was up to Roberta. She was working as a hairstylist, but she's not the type to sit still. She was always doing side gigs for added revenue. I would make customized crafty things for my friends on the side. I had a blog that I was monetizing.

So joining It Works seemed like a good way to make a few extra bucks. But in order to do that, she needed to sell the product. Fat wraps, diet lotion, smoothies and other stupid shit that they claim makes you instantly skinny and healthy. Because as it turned out, it works is an MLM. A what? A multi-level marketing scheme or company. A bidness. A BNF?

When you join an MLM, the first thing that they're gonna ask you to do is they're gonna ask you to create a list of at least 50 people that you know. Write down as many names as you can on this list. We're also alternatively told, scroll through Facebook and you look for people complaining. I guess it beats the people scrolling through Facebook looking for news. They're complaining about being overweight. Our cellulite cream can fix that. Our rap can fix that. Our pill can fix that. You need to reach out to them and let them know tho tho tho tho tho th. And their their their their their their their their their. their. their. their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, to, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, th. We. We. I. I. I. I'll, toe. Wea, toe. Wea, toe. Wea, toe. Wea, toe, toe, toe, toe, their, the You need to reach out to them and let them know that you have the answer. You're not using their strife and grief for your monetary gain. You're blessing their lives because this company has changed yours." So she would try and sell these supplements and skinny wraps at craft fairs. I had like the little samples and these little cubs and everyone's gonna love it. People take a sample and they they th. th. th. And th. And th. And th. And th. they'd they'd they'd they'd they'd th. they'd they'd th. they'd th. they'd th. th. they'd th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. You're thi. thi. they're not, thi. You're not, their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You. You're th. You. You're th. You're th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. try. try. try. th. th. th. th. thi. th. they're not they're not it. People take a sample and they try and they go, oh thank you and they would walk away

and I'm like, I felt like an idiot. Felt inauthentic. I'm not a fitness guru. I'm not a wellness person. I was with it works for like three months. I made like 700 bucks. I was like, I don't like this MLME M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'mthing. I don't want to do that bullshit anymore. So a bit more about MLMs, guys. MLM stands for multi-level marketing.

You might know it by its many other names, direct selling, social selling, social marketing, social marketing, network marketing. You're basically a rep for the company, and you try to sell their products and make money. So the product-based ones where you're selling lipstick, clothing, shake, smoothies, that kind of stuff. I love your M-LM voice. I know, right? Clothing, shakes, smoothie.

Are you sick of living paycheck to paycheck and wish you could be bigger than you are in this world? I have the answer. It's in this bottle of pills that is $75 for two weeks. And you're going to be perfect for this. I can tell. And you're just like, oh my God, I want to join this. What is it? Sounds innocent enough, right?

And a lot of these companies have products that are tailored towards women. Some of the more commonly known ones are new skin, Amway, Mary Kay, Avon, Arbon, Tupperware. And then there are others with more creative names like Mona Vee and Manatech and Stamping Up. Sportron, Sensi, Univera, Usana, Vemma, Hygienics, Eureka, Plexus, Zango, and some names that read like a cult instruction manual. Nature sunshine, Sunriter. Young living. Festage. Forever living. Relive. Omni life.

Urban life. Japan life. Free life. Neo life. New life. And get a life. Those are real names. The ones that you would get caught up in if you were a man are going to be more

like the service-based. Primarica, ACN, which sells cell phones. Oh, I've never even heard of that one. Forex trading, which is like the foreign exchange and crypto trading and things. They're like training courses. So where does the deceit come in? The scam is within the selling of the course and getting more people underneath you to buy the course. And every single MLM will tell you that it's not about the product. The product sells itself. They don't sell themselves.

Just as a disclaimer, in my previous profession, I sometimes produced videos for numerous MLMs. You whore? You sell out whore? Called it. They are incredibly prevalent in my former state of Utah. So before you listeners do your research and write in to scorn me about being a hypocrite just know that I too was conned by the money but as Bob Dylan says I was so much older than I'm younger than that now. Are you though? Because I'm looking right at you

sir. There's no filters in real life. Sorry. And Roberta she too had thought that she had left the MLM world behind. But like a dormant herpes virus it crawled its way back up to the surface. the surface. the surface. the surface. the surface. the surface. to the the surface. the to the the the the to the the to the the the the the the the the their the th. th. th. th. th. th. t. thi thi's t. t. t. t. But t. But t. But th. But t. But th. But t. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But th. But t. But t. But t. But t. But t. But t. But t. But t. But. But. But. But. But. But. But. But. But t. But t. But t. But t. But te. But te. te. te. te. te. te. te. to. to. to. to. te. te. But. But. But. But t. thought that she had left the MLM world behind. But like a dormant herpes virus, it crawled its way back up to the surface. Taken directly from a page in Liz's memoir. They're called Cold Sores, okay? And you treat them the same way. So that next year, I heard about Lula Rowe for the first time. And it was in, oh my god those leggings are so cute. She's like, oh they're Lulao. Do you want to buy one of my use pairs?

And I was like, sure. She mailed them from Florida. I put them on. I was like, these are very soft and very thick and cute. These had huge lilies or flowers on them. Like Luau at the tourist shop, you know what I mean? And people are like, oh my god, your leggings is so cute. All right, just so we're clear, most of the leggings are not very cute. In my humble opinion, they are often loud and they have awful designs. But you guys be the judge, pause the episode and go Google Lularo leggings right now. It's a treat. Maybe you should wear sunglasses.

Because they are gonna blind you. So I'm thinking like, okay, I like him. I want to buy another pair. But I want to buy a fun print that I want now. The desirable prints are called unicorns. Because in Lularoaro everything is limited edition. A tried and true marketing strategy. Just look at the sneaker community. It's exclusive and creates a sense of urgency.

I want it now before it's too late. Operators are standing by. So I'm looking and I find this pair. And I'm like, oh my god, that's my unicorn. They were black with rainbow octopus all over. Beautiful. I loved them. Do you still have them?

I do. Do you have them with you? I do not have them with me. I have them somewhere. I want to try them out. Yeah, I should have brought you some leggings to try them. So I read this Liz and I was so sad, you didn't. So I got online. No, you didn't. Yes. And I bought. Mystery leggings. Stop it. Which I believe means you know you get whatever leggings you're supposed to get. But I think the real mystery is who the fuck would wear these ugly things. I got two pairs of mystery leggings. Come on, give me. And we are going to wear them for the rest of this show. Which ones do you want? I'll take the hideiest. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. the mystery. the the the the the the the the their. their. their. their. their. I'm. their. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. them for the rest of this show. Which ones do you want? I'll take the hideous ones on the left.

Oh my God. Can you describe those to the audience? They're kind of... Well, they're rather soft. They are actually really soft. Wow, I kind of get it. Mine are kind of red. Oh, the inside is soft. and flowers all over them. It looks like Rudolph threw up on these. Wow. We're

going to try these on and then we'll put a picture on our Instagram. Yeah. Okay taking a break. We'll go into the bathroom and put them on. Okay. What did you get it? Months ago. I have been keeping that secret for so long. Wow, they are really comfy. They are actually comfy. And these aren't normally leggings I would wear. In fact, I don't... Would normally ever wear leggings. But they're shapely. And I can see the allure. I suppose I mean they are hideously ugly.

But they're very soft. So you're welcome, Liz. Thank you. That was amazing. Hey listeners, if you're on the lookout for True Crime Stories told from a fresh perspective with nuanced depth and detail, we have a new show for you. Yeah, check out Murder True Crime Stories, a crime house original podcast. From the shocking Chandra Levy case and infamous Tylenol murderers, to the tragic deaths

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get your podcasts. Hey, girlies, I'm Cody Rigsby. And I'm Andrew Chappell. We're here to announce our brand new podcast. Tactful pettiness. Now on Podcast One. We have a lot of opinions. Flip Flops in New York City, you don't love to to to to to to to to to to to to to to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. their. thoen. thoom. thoom. to. to. to. to. to. thoom. thoom. their. thoom. thoom. thoom. thoom. thoom. thoom. their. their. I'm, their. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. And. And. And, their. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And, to. And, to. And, t. And, t. And, t.. And, t....................................... New York City, you don't love yourself. If I'm not seated, I'm not tipping. Do I want to see a picture of your baby?

No. If I have to scroll more than 10 seconds, he's not cute. Settling gets you an ugly boyfriend. So we're going to help you out. We sure are because we have the life expertise. We have mastered throwing shade. With intention, we are in the business of helping you find and keep your man. And we're here to teach you the fine art of tactful pettiness. Join us each week as we traverse the world of pop culture, chat with our celebrity friends, and show you how to accept yourself without taking life too seriously.

Get new episodes of tactful pettiness with me, Cody Rigsby, every Thursday on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, and anywhere you get your podcasts. Stay Petty Bestie. Um, okay, where were we? So if I'm willing to jump through all these hoops to get these pants, there's a lot of other people that are willing to do it too. For two to three months, Roberto was a customer of Lula Rowe, working with 10 to 15 consultants

to help her find rare exclusive items. And occasionally she would get on the Lula Roe website to find clothes. And treat herself to a few fantastic propaganda videos, like this one. I've cried like six times. It's the community. It's just everybody saying, like, I miss you, I love you. Daniel Delgado's speech of we don't sell clothes You know we sell community. We sell empowerment Totally true. Absolutely true. You are not selling clothes. You are giving people freedom. You are giving people life. You were giving people hope you are giving people

confidence people confidence. Now as a customer she would be part of the consultants sales groups. And every so often the consultants would just slide in a little pitch. You know you might be really good at this. Do you want to hear more? Would you like to hear how you too can become your own entrepreneur? Sure. Yeah well you know what you should join us this Wednesday for an opportunity call. All you had to do was dial in at the right time. After all, it's just a phone call, right? And so Roberta, she innocently dials in.

And lo and behold, guess who's on the call? It was Dan, the owner, on the other end of the line, this really important company who's taking an hour out of her day every week to talk to us about how amazing this company is. She is referring to Deanne Brady, the founder of Lou LaRow. Quick rundown, in 1998, Deanne Brady was a mom on a budget looking for a way to clothe her daughters. She found inexpensive dresses that she bought wholesale and started selling them to other moms at selling parties. Eventually, Deanne started making her own dresses and selling them. And in 2012, Deanne and her husband, Mark Stidham, founded Lula in Corona, California.

The company's name was derived by combining the names of Brady's first three granddaughters, Lucy, Lola and Monroe. Mark and Deanne are also Mormon, which I could say a lot about it being the the names of Brady's first three granddaughters, Lucy, Lola, and Monroe. Mark and Deanne are also Mormon, which I could say a lot about it being my former religion slash cult, but I'll leave it aside for the sake of time. Gosh damn it, I wanted to hear about your crazy people. Oh, you will. Dan and Mark elected not to start a regular brick and mortar business, but sell their products through individuals or sales reps. And these sales reps actually started selling a shit ton of dresses and leggings.

And by 2014, the company had 750 of these distributors and Lula Rowe did 9.8 million in clothing sales. By 2016, it sold a reported 1.8 billion. That's B billion dollars in clothing. These distributors, i.e., regular people selling leggings on their Facebook, were making money in the early days. And some of these women would be on the opportunity call and would tell their stories. And I would listen while I did dishes and made dinner. It's like, I just heard about this woman who was on food stamps for 10 years,

and then she joined Lularo and now she has a lake house. It made me feel really good to hear these success stories. And it allowed me the freedom to dream wildly. If I had that lake, she was talking about, oh my god, and we could have like a dock and we could get like a pontoon boat and then we could like spin the summers on the lake. They're separating me from reality from day one. A popular cult tactic. And Roberta becomes obsessed with the idea of living the life of her dreams. I'm doing that for months and months right? It consumed my every thought and I'm watching people sell Lulu an and it is flying off the shelves.

I'm watching people buy the ugliest things I've ever seen in my entire life and they are squealing over it. She just wanted a taste of whatever it was. But in order to start selling and working as a self-empowered entrepreneur, you had to first buy the product. $5,000 worth. I mean, but all these other women did it, and look at them now. They're sunning on their lake house, Liz. They're lake house.

These women claiming to go from stay-at-home moms to boss-ass bitches. I said, I've got good credit, I can get a business credit card. I can put it on there, I can sell it, I can pay it off. And my husband keeps going, no, it's too to to to to to to to too much. But that didn't stop her from investigating. At least once a week I was on an opportunity call. I'm listening to these women cry about, I had nothing and now I have everything. And I'm looking around going,

I want to have everything too. I can sell leggings. This is way better than weight loss pills. People don't need to wear fat wraps, but people have to wear clothes because it's the law. You can't just be naked all the time. They don't let you do that, right? Tell that to my three-year-old.

And I start thinking, and now it's consuming my mind so much that I'm like, I'm just going to reach out to somebody who's successful. And I start looking on YouTube. to do this but I have a lot of questions and she asks me immediately where do you live? San Diego? I've got a girl in San Diego. Let me add her to our chat immediately. Hi, oh my God, this is so amazing. You should come over and try on some clothes. She had set out an entire spread of clothes for me. I ended up buying a couple things and we talked about the opportunity. She's like I've been able to quit my corporate job and I do this full time. This woman sat her down, held her hand, and asked her why she would want to join. In MLM you have this thing called a Y, and it's your reason for doing it.

My Y is my children. Why? Because I love them. Why? Because they're everything I've ever wanted in my life.. And it. And it. And it. And it. And it. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to their ti. ti. ti. ti. their their their their their their thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. And I this this this this this this wi. And I this wi. And I this w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I th. I thi. I this this this this full this thi. this thi. thi. thi. th? Because I love them. Why? Because they're everything I've ever wanted in my life. Why? To the point of tears. Roberta leaves without signing up, but the woman didn't leave her. Hater's going to hate. Recruiter's going to recruit. She's messaging me every day. Hey, and I'm like, my husband's still on the fence. And they're like, well, he just doesn't see your potential. Potential is a dangerous word. Never fall in love with someone's potential. And if a person starts talking about your potential and how you're falling short of it without their help, run. Run. Run. Run as fast as you can. Don't look back. Don't look back as you can. Don't look back. Don't look back as you can't. try. to. th. th. th. th. th. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. Don't. Don't. Don't their. Don't their. Don't their. Don't. Don't their. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't their their. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't their their their. Don't their. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. their. their. their. their. their. their. to. to. to. to. to. tooo. toooo. tooooo. tooooo. the the their. the are. But also don't look back while you're running.

Right, because then you might hit a bear or a tree stump. Where the hell are you running? I don't know, I'm in a forest. You're going to make more money than him, and he'll be jealous. They're turning him into an enemy so that anything he says, I'm already going to be skeptical about what he says, and not, and not, their, and, thia, thi, thi, to, to, to, and, to, to, to, the, to, the, to, the, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, tho, their, their, their, or, or, or, or, or, their, or, or, their, or, their, or, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, thi, thi. thr. thr. thr. throwneean, throwne. Where, throwne. Where, throwne, throwne, throwne, thr. Where, throwne, thr. basically me trying to convince my husband this was a good idea and I eventually broke him down. He goes if you want to do it Then just do it. So I joined now again to get started you have to buy the product that you were going to turn around and then sell. These products come in various packages called kits and the biggest and most expensive kit comes with free stuff snacks snacks. Snacks. Snacks. Where they're snacks. I am vaxed. I. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I thed. I thed. thed. thed thed thed thed thed thed thed thi thi th thi thi thi thi thi tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho. He tho. He th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th the the the the the the the the th the the the th th th th thi thi thi thi thi thi the the the the the the the the the the thee the the the the thea the thooo tho tho tho tho tho And the biggest and most expensive kit comes with free stuff. Snacks? Snacks, tellor. What were there snacks? I am vaxed and ready for snacks, Liz. They always were like,

you're not just Roberta, the mom, you're Roberta the business owner. What would Roberta the business owner do? She'd buy the biggest package. Which is what she does, and she signs all the paperwork, but she is told by Lou La LaRoe that that that that that that that th. th. the th. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their's, their's, their's, their's, their, their, their, their, their, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, where, where, where, where, where, where, where, where, where, where, where, where, where's, where's, where's, where's, where's, where's. We's, their, where's. We's. We's. We's. We's. We's. We's. We's. We's. We's. We're. What, their, their, their, their, their, their, their. We're. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. We're their. We're. their. their. We're. We're. We're. We're. We're she signs all the paperwork but she is told by Lou LaRowe that there's a six week wait because there's not enough clothes we just can't make it fast enough because it's so popular. More enticing and disgusting marketing tactics to create that feeling of FOMO. So in the meantime they told her to focus on the prep so as soon as the product arrives you're ready to hit the ground running. You're going to need racks and a printer and a shipping area. You're going to need bubble mailers because you're now a full shipping facility too.

Hangers, a desk, a computer, iPads. Because the app, it was only Apple. Going to home goods and be like, look at this sign and says she believed she did. I'm going to get that. Ridiculous. Ridiculous now, but at the time, it was exciting, empowering. She was becoming her very own CEO. That's a real word they use. She-e-o. And after her agonizing six-week wait, one day, the phone rings.

Getting that call and seeing it and being like, oh my God, what do I do? And my husband's like, answer it. And I answer it. I pick the package. I give Lachey all my info. And she's like, welcome to Lula Roe. Welcome to Lula Roe. After much investigation, dreaming, pleading with her husband, putting money on a credit card, setting up an office and waiting a month and a half for product, she was ready to put that office to work. She was on the road to making millions. But first, my mom and all of our friends were like, we're going to go camping. And I knew my inventory was coming,

and I was like, this might be like last, quote unquote, vacation before it gets really busy. Knowing that her kit was set to arrive any day, Roberta heads to the mountains, but their campsite had no cell service. Which is ideal for a digital detox when the goal is to unplug. But less ideal when you're expecting a box full of stretchy pants that proclaimed to hold the key to the universe. And so every day I would drive to this one spot to check my email and be like, nope haven't gotten it yet. I remember. I I I. to. to to to the the to the to to the the to. the to. the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. the. theck, the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. te. tode, tod. I, the the, the the the, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the they. It, they. It, they. It, the the. It, the. It, the. It, the. It's, te. And, tea. I's, tea. I'm, tea.a.a. And, tea.a.a.a.a.a. And, tea. And, tea. And, te. And spot to check my email and be like, nope, haven't gotten it yet. I remember driving up to the top of this hill and getting it and freaking out and coming back down and being like, I gotta go. I don't even know why I did that, but it did.

Leaving vacation early to go open up boxes of polyester. But turns out this box of schnazi street to lounge wear to the I was holding something else. So I opened up these boxes and I start feeling really lightheaded and sick and I'm like cold sweats and I was like throwing up. I'm thinking I ate bad camp food. But as she learned later it was likely something else because I'm not the only person that experienced that when opening up their luero I think I got mold poisoning. Mold poisoning from leggings. Yep. Oh and don't worry Tyler there, Lulao? I think I got mold poisoning. Mold poisoning from leggings? Yep. Oh, and don't worry, Tyler.

There is so much more on this later. But as soon as Roberta recovered, she threw a big home launch party, and she invited all of her friends. Like, it was insane. I was selling out of things. thin, thin. thoe. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. th. thoooooooooooooooooo. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. that th. thi. that thi. thi. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. that that th. that that th. th. that th. th. that that th. th. that tooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. th. tothen anything that didn't sell in my in-home party, the next day I put it online, and that was my online launch. I made like $6,000 in one night.

Which was amazing. She was already able to pay back the $5,000 she invested, right? It did like $2,000 on the credit card. Everything else went back into buying more inventory because you can't sell it if you don't have it. Of which she was having no problem doing. It was just so easy to sell. In the beginning I could open up a box and I could sell 90% of that box within 24 hours. Not a problem. And it's true. People were possessed by these leggings. I know I am. The exclusivity factor worked magic. Every print was one of a kind and Roberta had people salivating out of the palm of her hand.

I would have people that were like, I just need that. I'll pay double triple. I'll give you $100 for that. I just need those pants. I need those squirrels. I need those clowns. I need those puzzle pieces. I need those whatever's. Humpty dumpties. It's like playing the Lula Rowe world. I'm the kind of person that like if I want to be at the top of something, I'm going to surround myself with the people at the top. So I really wanted to get in good with Deanne and home office. At its peak in 2017, Lula Rowe had hundreds of employees, a large corporate office and 80,000 independent distributors, mostly women. And this made the former struggling single mom Deanne a millionaire and a pseudo-celebrity.

She relished her role in the company. She would create videos, preach her Lula-Ro religion on stage, all while wearing multiple layers of Lula-Roe. In fact, she was known among Lula Roe circles as, quote, the layered one, because for retailers, it was demanded that you wear multiple layers of Lula Ro. Which is why, Liz, I got you. No, I didn't get you another one. How's your leggings feeling? They still... The waist isn't working for me? Because? The top part of the waist is cutting into me, whereas the second bottom part of the waist isn't? Well, why is, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, their, th, the, the, the, the, the, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, the, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, th, their, th, th. th. their, th. the, the, the, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, lea, lea, lea, leaerlaerlaerlaerlaerla, their, lea, their, their, their, the waist is cutting into me, whereas the second bottom part of the waist isn't. Well why is that Liz? Why is your waist so big? Can you just...

They're gonna see on the Instagram? Because I'll just tell them, in case they don't get on the Instagram or don't see it. I'm pregnant. I'm pregnant. I'm pregnant. Liz is pregnant. I'm with child. You've heard it here. thr. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz, Liz, Liz is that. Liz is that. Liz is that. Liz is that. Liz. Liz. Liz is th. Liz is that. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. Liz. th. th. th. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. th. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. Liz. Liz. Liz movement that happens from here on out. Anyways, so back to Roberta. Deanne, she was the consummate pitcher of rags to riches. She was the vision of what these women could ultimately become. Deanne was overly loving and overly affectionate and love bombing all the time. You're so amazing, you're so beautiful. Look how cute you are. You're such a little firecracker,

you're my rock star. Lovebumbing, love bombing, love bombing. She was like my second mom, and I never in a million years would think that she would ever do anything to hurt any of us, intentionally. And for Roberta, the money kept it rolling in. So I had the the th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thuu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, tho, thu, thu, thublea, thu-a, to to to to to to to to be to be to be to be thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, th. th. thu, th. th. thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, thu. thu. thu. thu. thu. thu. thu. thu. thu. thu. to to tooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooom, tooe, to I had left the salon, it felt like I was a millionaire. And so I just continued to do what I was told because it was working.

But the hobby still wasn't on board. Because he was like, it takes you away. Like, this is a lot. And I was like, I know, but I'm doing everything right now. Eventually Lulao will take over. So he goes, okay, okay, fine. I remember going to an event and talking to Deanne in person and being like, my husband doesn't want to be involved. And she looked at me blank and she goes, maybe you just need a new husband then. Get a Lula Roe husband.

It would be easier to find a husband who's just supportive of Lularo. I mean, obviously I didn't do that, but there was a thought in. Yet another huge cult tactic isolate the followers from any their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their from any of their loved ones that aren't in. But he wasn't out for long. Roberta eventually persuaded her husband to attend a Lula Roe event. Once he got love bombed, he was like, oh my god, we have to tell everybody about Luro. I even remember there was this sweater thing that came out called the Mimi.

It was like this horrible heavy shawl. Ridiculous. And he goes, use my credit card and buy as many as you can. We can do this. And I did. We sold every single one of those Mimi's. And she kept climbing the ranks and bringing in new people. At the peak I had 75 women underneath me. Sounds like one of your weekends in college Liz. Oh boom sex jokes. It's a good one isn't it? That's a good one Tyler. No but actually I really did do something in college with all my best friends called a naked steamroll. You know I'm not gonna let that just sit hanging please. My friends would be in bed and I would surprise them naked and I go naked. Naked steam roll them naked and they'd be like, get off of me! Get off of me! And I. And I. And I, and I, and I, and I, and I, th. And I, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, that, that, that, th, th, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, that's a that's a good that's a good that's a good that's a good thi, that's a good thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th then I'd run in their bed and I just steamroll them naked and they'd be like get off of me! College. College. College. But unlike typical cults where you actively have to recruit, Roberta

she had a different experience. I never recruited one single person. Everybody came to me and said I want to do this and I want to be on your team. And anybody that would reach out to my their. I. I. I. I. I. I. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. th. th. th. I. th. th. I. th. th. th. I. th. th. th. the. the. the. I. the. I the. the. the. I the. th. th. th. th. th. Get. Get. th. Get. I'm. I. to get. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I'm th. I'm th. I'm t. I'm t. I'm t. I'm t. I'm te. I'm te. te. try. te. te. te. te. te. try. te. te. on your team. And anybody that would reach out to my upline, they would put them under me because they were building me to rank, because once I hit my rank, my upline above me ranked up, and then her upline above her ranked to the top. We call it stacking. It happens in all MLMs. Upline and rank are common to have your own lingo. If it's not clear by now, MLMs are the legal loophole jargon for pyramid scheme. And the reason it's a pyramid is that you are directly connected to the person who brought you in,

aka your upline, as they are above you in the pyramid. We'll give you a little bit more on pyramid schemes later, but this. All MLMs are different, but in Lula Row, with no one underneath you, you're just like a fashion retailer. At least one person underneath you, you're a sponsor. When you have at least 10 people underneath you, but three of them have to be personally sponsored by you. The other seven can be anywhere. When you have 10, you become a trainer, that's what I was.

To hit coach, which is the next rank is three trainers on three separate lines. So you couldn't have a trainer that had a trainer underneath her. That wouldn't count us two. You'd have to have three separate women on like their own pyramids, basically as trainers, and that's to hit coach. And then mentor. That's the highest rank in Lulor. You need three separate lines, three trainers and

three separate lines with three coaches. Did you catch that? I'm pressing the back 30-second button. To hear it one more time. Yeah, because I really, I did not catch all of that. There's just recruitment ranks. It's like any colt and any rank, it's the same. It's a total hierarchy. But it was because of her team, the people in her downline, that she started to get monthly bonuses. So not from the sales. Nope. The extra money, which was the real money, has nothing to do with the selling of the actual product.

And it's literally from the people underneath you. The biggest bonus I ever got, I think was like $3, the $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $3, $3,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, $ $1,000,000,000, $1, $1, $1, $1, $1, $6,500. The smallest bonus I ever got I think was like 350 bucks. That's the reason leggings cost $25, right? Because three dollars of that goes into my bonus. So the bonus checks you'd have to qualify. My whole entire team we had to sell 1,750 pieces a month. But most MLMs, there is no distinction between you personally buying it and you personally selling it. So a lot of times you'd be like, hey, just letting you know there's five days until the end of the month and you haven't qualified yet. I don't want you to miss that on that bonus check. You're gonna get a thousand dollar bonus, but you're three hundred dollars away from getting it. And people are like, you're thrown. the thousand, to thrown. I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I'll thiiiii. I'll thi. I'll thi. I'll thi. I'll the thi. the the thi. thoes, the $ $ $ $ $ $3. thoes, thoes, thoes, thi. thi. tho' tho' tho' tho' tho- tho' tho- tho' thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. their their their thi. their their their their th. their thi. th. th. th. th. the. the. the. the. the. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. the. the. the. thousand dollar bonus. It's a vicious cycle. But then now you've got a garage full of leggings and we call that garage qualified in MLM but then also

the product started becoming bad. The material was so thin they would just rip. They would buy the cheapest, most discounted, out of season fabrics because these women are going to buy it anyway, side-on scene. I had a woman who a teacher and she bought a pair of leggings from me and she was wearing them at school and she sent me a message. Oh my God Roberta, I literally put these on today for the first time and she sent me a picture. It had literally ripped in a straight line right under her butt cheek. An hour later she's like now the other one is doing it. She's like I'm a schoolteacher and my ass is hanging out of my leggings. Then there was other stuff that came soaking wet, not just damp, soaking wet, soaking wet. I would get boxes that smelled like literal death.

I've called it so many different things, pooping a wet bathing suit, dead fart leggings. Death and Chlorine is what it smelled like. I was like, why does the studio smell like farts, Liz? Women don't flatulate, Tyler. Phrr-prrr. Excuse me! Really? You are seven years old. Wait, I got something better. No.

I do. She's got a fart out. Phr. Oh. Hi, quality programming here, folks. Get back to the fucking story. Please. Hi quality programming here, folks. Get back to the fucking story. Please.

So Roberta, well, she was curious as well about the fart smell. So she asks Lula Roe about it. And they're like, put him in the freezer, wash them and sell them at a discount. You worrying about why your leg stink is not an income-producing activity. You need to set it aside and focus on your business. And you're like, okay, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, to, to, to, to, to, to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the fa, the fa, the fa, the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking the fucking to to to to to to to activity. You need to set it aside and focus on your business. You're like, okay, you're right, I'm so sorry. I should be photographing pants. Thank you. I was making money, but there were other things that didn't make sense. As a company, Lula Rowe had grown very fast, some say too fast, and they weren't really cut out for that kind of growth. To say the least, few, th, th, th, th, thi thiii thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the thi, thi, the thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, tho, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th. th. th. th, th, th, th, thi, their, their, their their their their their their their their their their their thi, thi, thi, thi, thin, thr-s, thr-s, thr-s, to throoooooooooo-s, too-s, thr-s, thr-s, thr-s, thr-s, weren't really cut out for that kind of growth. To say the least. Few of these executives had actual business degrees and Deanne and Mark

had placed their inexperienced children in important leadership positions. Nepotism, nepotism, nepotism, say that three times. You couldn't even pull it off. Nepotism, nepotism. Very well done. At Lula there were problems a plenty and it was apparent to many of the distributors. So Roberta would ask questions, sometimes in an online forum. I would ask about the moldy stuff, why are there bugs in the bag? So for me to be having questions is very bad for the cult. I was a very heavy load-bearing brick in this pyramid.

And then my upline reaches out to me and she's like, hey, I just want to let you know that I have an extra cruise ticket. A cruise ticket to the Bahamas. Now normally this is a cruise for those who qualify, meaning you sell a lot of shitty leggings. But Roberta didn't actually qualify that month. Hmm. Suspect. It was a love bomb cruise. I make sure that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that th you th you th you th you th you th you th you th you th you th you th you th you th you th you the the th you the the. I the. I the. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have th. I have the. I have thea thei. theiii theiiii theii theiiii theii. thea thea thea thea th month. Hmm. Suspect. It was a love bomb cruise. I make sure she brings her husband because he asks a lot of questions too. Some MLMs will do an all-expense paid trip and some don't. Lula Road just gives you the room and

says, hope you can afford to get there. It's in Florida. The free trip probably cost me three grand. There was events every day. Hey, you know see us at 8. the the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. A th. A th. A th. A th. A th. A th. A th. A. A. A. A th. A th. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A.. A....................................... A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A. A.................................................. There was events every day. Hey, you know, see us at eight o'clock in the main hall to learn about blah blah. I was like, I ain't doing that on vacation. The vibe on the boat became way too much for Roberta with everyone walking around wearing the same dumb clothes, the over adorning followers, revering Mark and Deanne and her entire family. The fawning over the executives, the large crowds, cudd and chanting, and the Lula Roe name and colors plastered everywhere. Barf. And we were like, is this culty? She's like, this is weird. The cruise was the first, like, what the fuck is happening?

And like most cults, as they grow and evolve, the leader becomes more and more unavailable to her peoples. They used to like their, the their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, to, their, to, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, tho, and, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi. And, thi, thi, thi, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. the, the, thi. the, thi. the. the. toe. the. the. thea. thea. thea. thea. thi. thi. the. tha, tha, the toe. to her peoples. They used to like go around town and they'd spend the whole day in San Diego at this training and you could stay lay and you could get to know them and it was awesome. But the last couple times that I interacted with Dian, she was a completely different person. They would fly in on their private jet, do their little hour-long speech and then get on the next place. At some of these Lula Roe events, you could get a brief moment with Deanne. At a cheesy fucking photo booth. You could get your photos taken with Deanne.

I said, is this not a business training? This is so far away from what we originally were two years ago? Like why is there a celebrity meet-and-greet for someone who's not even a celebrity? And the line was insane to get a picture with Deanne. She's not the Messiah. She's just a regular lady. That's a little coltie. Remember how Roberta felt about Deanne when she first started? I felt like a personal connection to Deanne.

And I never in a million years would think that she would ever do anything to hurt any of us. Intentionally. she would ever do anything to hurt any of us intentionally. But the whole thing was intentional. It was a scam from the beginning. 99 lose. Only 1% succeed. Statistically. That is a genuine stat. According to research done by the late Dr. John Taylor at the Federal Trade Commission,

quote, the vast majority of commissions paid by MLM companies go to a tiny percentage of tops, TOPPS. That's top of the pyramid promoters. This comes at the expense of a revolving door of recruits, 99% of whom lose money. So if only 1% can succeed statistically, and that is the only way that this works is when 1% succeeds, then only way that this works is when 1% succeeds. Then 99 has to fail. That's gambling. Here's an odd statistic though. Gambling has a 95% loss rate.

MLMs have a 99.7% of people lose. And that's not just money, right? That's we're talking about the opportunity costs, right? Anything that you're not doing because you're doing this. Right. You're not getting an $18-dollar an hour job. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to to fail to to to to to to to fail to to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail to fail. to fail. to fail. to fail. to fail. to fail. to fail. to to fail. to to to to to to to to to to fail. to to to to the talking about the opportunity costs, right? Anything that you're not doing because you're doing this. Right. You're not getting an $18 an hour job because you're shilling it works in your living room. Okay, so you may be asking if the people selling these products weren't making money, but the company was making billions, well then where did all that money go? Well, if this podcast has taught you guys anything. Other than fart jokes, it's that the money goes to the leaders. Yes, Mark and Deanne lived lavishly with a jet, a massive California home, a $7 million ranch in Wyoming, and Mark, well, he bought a slew of

sports cars worth millions. Including not one, but two, custom-made Koneg-Syg ghosts at a price tag of over two million dollars each, th.. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. It, th. It, th. It, th. It, th. th. thi, thi, th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th, th, th, th, th, the money, the money, the money, the money, the money, the money, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, the money, the money, the money, the money, the money, the money, the money, their, the money, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, thi. thi. thi. thi. throooooooo. thr-i. thr-i. thi. throooo' thi. thi. their, their, their, thetwo, custom-made Koenig-Sig Ghosts at a price tag of over $2 million each, one of which recently set the World Land Speed Record of 277.9 miles per hour. And after the record fell, Mark was quoted as saying, it feels like winning the Olympics. You are the gold medal winner for that day. Well, you're a gold medal loser for every other day, so have your day, Mark. Here's another fun statistic. 90%, 90% of product that is sold from an MLM remains in the MLM. Between consultants, sales to buy ranks, sales to help each other out. How is that a profitable business model?

It's very obviously not a business. It's a pyramid scheme. Defined as a form of investment in which each paying participant recruits to further participants, with returns being given to early participants using money contributed by later ones. Yep, it's similar in fact to a Ponzi scheme, which is named after Charles Ponzi, an Italian-American businessman in the 1920s who was taking money from investors with a promise of a high return, but paying earlier investors using the investments from later investors. His scheme ran for about a year before it collapsed, costing investors $20 million. That's a cool $258 million in today's currency.

But that's nothing compared to Bernie Madoff, who was arrested in 2008 for running a Ponzi scheme that cost investors an estimated $65 billion. Wow. But Madoff and Ponzi were supposedly selling stocks. Roberta was selling Mimi's and moldy, wet, ass-ripped leggings. But the money-making aspect is similar. And this is where the pyramid aspect comes in. The boutique kept itself afloat.

You know, sell $5,000 and I'd buy $5,000 worth of stuff. It was like $78,000 I had bought, and I had sold like $83,000. That's only $5,000 in the green. And that doesn't include include thinkink made nothing. All of my money came from my bonuses. Right. From the pyramid scheme. But Roberta, she's one of the lucky ones.

She got in relatively early. Placed her proverbial brick near the top of the pyramid. And by hustling and sheer gumption, she actually made a profit. I probably made like $60,000. 20 months, something like that, like $40,000 a year a year a year a year a year a year,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, which, which, which, which is, which is th, which is th, which is th, th,000, which is th, which is th, which is thi, thi, thi, thi, thage. thage. thage. thi. thi. th. th. th. th. th. th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.that, like $40,000 a year, which is less than I was making at the salon. But a vast majority of those who sold Lula Rowe don't come close to that figure. And how do we know that?

Because their 2020 income disclosure is on their website. It's required due to a pending lawsuit against them filed by the state of Washington, which accuses Lula of of being what, th, th, like, th, th, like, th, like, th, th, th, th, like, th, th, like, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, like, thi, like, thi, like, like, thi, like, thi, like, like, like, like, thi, thi, thi, thi, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th.. th. th. th.. th. th, th... th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. thiii. thiiiiii. thiii. the thi. thi. thi. thi. thi, them filed by the state of Washington, which accuses Lula Rowe of being a what? A pyramid scheme. And looking through their numbers, it's not good. Yeah, according to the chart, over 85% of distributors did not receive any money from the leadership compensation plan. And the scant few individuals that did see revenue only averaged $8,567 per year. A pittance. Yeah, could you imagine going to work for a company and on their website it actually says that you have an 85% chance of making nothing.

And a 19% chance of losing money. Astounding. So, Roberta had given years of her life to selling Deanne and Mark's clothing. So, Roberta had given years of her life to selling Deanne and Mark's clothing. And as we mentioned, she was one of the lucky ones in Lula Rowe, or in MLM's a job. So Roberta had given years of her life to selling Deanne and Mark's clothing. And as we mentioned, she was one of the lucky ones in Lula Rowe, or in MLMs in general. Because she was earning money. But it came at a cost. And I was consumed, even 11 o'clock at night. Do you have any T.C. leggings? Do you have any large carlies? I was irritable all the time. I was upset, stressed, angry, always sleep deprived.

Too much stuff to do, not enough time to do it. I remember in the beginning, I'd get the box, I could not wait. At the end, I would have stacks of boxes sitting in the entryway of the house. They'd sit for days. Toward the end, the boxed was true, towards. the end the boxes were crap. I said I could sell 90% within 24 hours. The opposite was true toward the end. I could sell 10% maybe. They would say, your inventory isn't stale, you are. Why aren't you getting more customers? My children were like, mom can we please go swimming? It's 95 degrees outside and we're so hot. I'd be like, I've got a photograph 50 more things and then we can go swimming. I'd be like, who am I? I'm yelling at my children because they're hot and they want to go swimming. Watching my husband be like, is this worth it?

My mental health is off the rails. I couldn't even look myself in the mirror because I knew that I had to lie and do horrible, deceitful tactics to survive. But despite all this, she stayed hustling. I didn't want to admit that there was a failure within this company that I had fought so hard to be a part of, and I didn't want to admit that I was wrong. I wasn't ready.

I remember sitting down and being like, I just need a break. I'm going to watch me some Leah Remini. Scientology aftermath had just come back on. And I sat down, and it was like a survivor episode. This is not the life that I want to live. I wanted to end my life. Some people that takes a year, some people that takes 10 years of just peeling that onion of how you were manipulated

and made to think. Thank you Leah for saving my life but it was a survivor episode and every single person that was talking I had an example I was like Lula did that to me too. And I remember looking at my husband and he's like, why are you crying? And I was like, I'm in a cult. I'm in a cult. I'm experiencing cult tactics, cult behavior, cult indoctrination, cult abuses. And I said, I have to get out now. So the next day she calls the San Diego lady who initially got her in

We had like a 45 minute conversation and I remember crying and I was like I can't do this It's changing who I am and it's not worth it. The woman heard her concerns, but then responded with a reminder from her past Well, Roberta I sat there with you in that inspire tour and we held hands and we told each other our wise and you? then then then then then then then then then then then th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thin thin th the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the thi, thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thea. thea. thea. thea. the thea. the the the the the thea. the the the the the there with you in that inspire tour and we held hands and we told each other our wys and you cried and you said you were doing this for your kids. I don't understand why you would leave if you really want this for your kids. So they go after your why. The same thing that you used to get in and it's very manipulative. And then as soon as I got home I was like, dear everyone, I am done. The end, sent.

She sent this message to her group via Facebook that included both her uplines and her downlines. I could feel the tingles. I had about 15 minutes of freedom before the text messages started rolling in and the voicemails and the phone calls and the face times and that how I didn't know you were leaving oh my god why is there something I could do but of course it didn't take long for them to shun her. Oh cults. If you leave Dan tell's people to block you.

That comes straight from Dan. Oh you don't have money. We can help you make money. Oh, you don't have any friends? You're going to have a team full of sisters. But the second you leave, Bye-bye, sisters. Block. Oh my god, she's such a bitch.

Of course she's a failure. Ha-ha-ha. It's incredibly cul. Now, Roberta had moments to herself and her family. She could take her kids swimming. And without all the constraints of taking pictures of pants and shipping shuls, she had the time to read blogs about MLMs and to talk to others who had left theirs. And she learned that Lularo was just a pebble in a very large and scummy pond. Lularo was a very, and so was Arbon, and so was It Works, and so was Modair, and so was all of them.

And Shakeley, and Miranda, and Otera and Lioness, and Vaisalus. And Ponzi. You made that up. Yep, but it would be the most fitting. It's like that kid in the neighborhood who's trick-or-treating at your house, and then he's going into your driveway and he's changing Galvitz and he's going and ringing the doorbell again. It's the same. The only thing that changes are that company's names, the victims, and the fucking shit they're selling. But Roberta did miss the community she found while in Lula Roe. So she joined another group. It's an anti-Lulae group. Lots of survivors. We all have this trauma bond of like we all thought

this was great. We all got fucked. They share experiences and commiserate about the important questions of life, like, did anybody else get stinky leggings? Hundreds of comments. Oh, I had this one that smelled like death. It was so bad. I just had to throw them away. Anybody get wet ones? Oh my God, I got wet ones. I got wet ones. I got a whole box full of wet ones one time. One wise sage even had the answer to the age-old questions of, why were the leggings wet? She goes, I went to the Lulero head office to pick up something.

And there's all these metal containers with taking pictures. And it was the inventory. I was sitting outside in California. It's the desert, and the desert gets very cold at night, and we wake up to dew on everything. And that do just soaked into those pants for days and days and days. And then another woman had the key to the other plaguing riddle. She goes, but I know why your stuff might smell like dead rats. It used to be my job and my boyfriend's job in the morning to go out to those big metal cages. I have the tarp on top because the holes in the cages or a couple inches square, right? She's like we would have to pull out all the dead rats out of the leggings. Of course you did. That makes so much sense. We get stories like that

all the time. But mostly, these individuals keep their stories within XMLM or groups. There's not a lot of people in MLMs that are willing to speak out. One they think they're stupid. They're like, I'm never going to tell to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their th. Iuu. Iu. Iu. Iu. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm their. I'm their. I'm their. One, they think they're stupid. They're like, I'm never going to tell anybody that I was scammed. We have to make it okay to say I was hurt and not come back with, well you were stupid and you deserved it. We have to stop shaving victims because that's not okay. Of course I made a stupid decision with bad information, but there's nobody in this world that hasn't made a bad decision with bad information, but there's nobody in this world that hasn't made a bad decision with bad information. If you're a victim of anything, you're a victim. The lack of compassion and empathy in the anti-MLM community was shocking to

me. It was devastating. It makes you not want to speak out. And this is a problem with any cultic or abusive behavior, people not wanting to speak out, admit they were taken advantage of. And same is true for tr true tr true tr true tr true tr true tr true tr true tr true tr true tr true tr th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the their their thi, their thi, their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their thi. thi. thi. thi. the, the, the, thea. thea. the, thea. the, thean. the, the, the, the, were wrong, admit they were taking advantage of. And same is true for victims of sexual abuse. The way rapists and sex predators continue to get away with their behavior is to instill fear in their victims. Sadly, many of the threats are financially based and unfortunately the predators often have the money to keep their victims silenced.

Yeah, Harvey, we're talking to you. So, just how does the cycle end? We don't exactly know, but we think it starts with one brave individual at a time. Willing to risk retribution, paving the way for others to feel emboldened to do the same. And when you don't speak out and share your experiences, no one can learn from your mistakes. And MLMs survive that way. And MLMs look like a business. And a business can't be a cult.

I'm selling something, Roberta, and then I'm making money when I sell it. That's not a cult. I'm like, sure, cool, yeah, your cult sells stuff. Look, we're fine with business founders making millions of dollars for generating a wanted service or product and distributing it in a proper manner. But what burns my ass is when you don't pay your employees living wages and MLMs do this. They pray upon the vulnerability, the labor and the dreams of want-to-be entrepreneurs who toil

for no wages to sell their shitty product, all on the false promise of easy money and independence. And people just keep chasing the dream, listening to tales of the large revenue being made by the top 1% and hoping that they too can get there. And it's tiring. And that's why Roberta now has a mission. And she's not hawking horrific leggings, but she's doling out knowledge. I will never stop telling people that this is a fucking cult.

And I will make it my life's work to get out as many people from Lularo as possible. So she started a podcast called Life After MLM. It's informative and helps people. I have a lot of people that are MLMs that listen. I know they listen because they email me later when they leave. And they say, I listened to your podcast for six months. And in the beginning, I hated your guts. I thought you were so stupid and you were so bitter. And then you talked about my MLM and I was like, thi and now I th. And now th. And now th. And now thi, and now, and now, and now, and now, and now, and now, and now, and now I thi, and now, and now I love I love I love I love thi, and I love thi, and I love thi, and I love, and I th, and I th, th, thi. I thi, thi, thi, thi, they they they the the the they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they the they. I they. I they. I'm they.. I'm they. I'm they. I'm they. I'm theymea. I'm that. I'm that, that. I'm told told told told told me me me told me me told me tolu. told me me told me me thea. thean. the an thean. I'm out of my M-LM now because of your podcast. I wish I found you a year ago because now I'm $40,000 in debt and

I have a garage full of lipstick and they're going oh my god it is a cold I wasn't a cult. How did I get in a cult? Very slowly is how very slowly. Exactly the same way everyone gets manipulated into cults. And Roberta she took that same passion for selling and community and she th th th to th to th to th th to th th to th th th to th th th th th th th th th th th th the the the I the I the I the I thoes thoes thoes tho I thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes tho I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I th. I I I th. I I I th. I tho I tho I tho I tho I tho I tho I the I the I the. to to tho to tho to tho tho tho tho thoo thooo tho thoo thoo tho tho tho took that same passion for selling and community and she now uses it to better the lives of victims and to keep people from jumping back into this world of MLMs. It feels like a calling. It feels like I had to join Lularo and go through all of that so that I could help others not have to do that. And today she's kicking names and taking ass.

She's actually doing fantastic today. To be able to look myself in the mirror and be proud of who I am and to love myself, I wasn't there four years ago and I left Blue Ro. Roberta was an absolute pleasure to have on this show. She was a perfect guest to answer many of the questions we get are MLM's cults. Well folks, I think you now have your answer. I reached out to her after seeing the Lula Rich Doc on Amazon because I distinctly remember she was the only person in the series to verbalize, this is a fucking cult or something to that effect.

She may not have dropped the F-bomb. But after she said that I was like, her, that's who I want to be on our show. And she just so happened to be able to join in studio for to be. And if you want to hear more about Roberta and other crazy MLMs, you should totally check out Roberta's podcast Life After MLM. There is a link in the show notes. There is also a link to our Instagram so you can see our fantastic photos of Liz and I in this sexy leggings. We loved this episode and we hope that it helps people who are considering an MLM life. Just don't. Next week, we'll be back with another great story.

Was I an occult is a production of IHart Media and his story produced and written by this guy, Tyler's sexy leggings. And Liz Ayacuzzi, that's Ayacuzzi with Tuzzi's because she puts me to sleep. Not in these leggings, I don't. I keep everyone awake. Executive producer is Maya Cole Howard. Supervising producer is Ari Basile. Audio editor and engineer is Chandler Mays. Publicist is Lauren Dutton Green.

And our studio engineer is Clay. Welcome to the team, Clay. And our fan of the week is Kelly Branch from Missouri, who said on Twitter that our podcast is a good disconnect from the education world. Yep, she's a teacher. Thank you, Kelly, branch. And Kelly, if you want my leggings, DME me, I'll give them to you.

Just don't wear them to school because they will rip and the the the the th and th and they will rip and th and their they will rip and show your ass. And then you'll be the coolest teacher around. All right, let's never take these off again. Thank you. me Don't spare my life crucify me