We Might Be Drunk - Ep 176: Rafi Bastos [Dueling Jean Jackets]

Episode Date: April 22, 2024

Episode 176, WInnie is back on the couch and the guys are hanging solo until Rafi shows up about halfway through!  Great conversation with Rafi about international comedy scene, Brasil learning comedy and Rafi getting sent packing. Sam Morril: https://www.sammorril.com/ Mark Normand: https://marknormandcomedy.com/ Rafi Bastos: https://rafibastos.com/ Support the show and get 20% off and free shipping with the code DRUNK at https://www.manscaped.com Shop: https://www.wemightbedrunkpod.com Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/wemightbedrunkpod Bodega Cat: http://www.bodegacatspirits.com We Might Be Drunk is produced, recorded and edited by Gotham Production Studios. Head producer: Matthew Peters https://www.gothamproductionstudios.com/ https://www.instagram.com/mrmatthewpeters/ If you want to start a podcast contact [e-mail] for a discount on services when referred by WMBD! 

Here we are! We might be drunk, it's a beautiful sunny 70 degree day in New York City! Nice out. Very nice. Loving it. Loving it. Clavage popping out. Some dude back too.

Yeah, that's so good. You see that dude tank top back? I hate it. Yeah. Sometimes I gotta work out more. God, it's gotta suck to be a woman Yeah, women get less clothing on it's it makes your week. You want to have a parade? It's exciting men get less clothing on and everybody's bummed out. Yeah

I'm happy about the women though. They're very happy Dick dick's getting stronger who the dick the dick's getting stronger? Yeah, when you see more cleavage the dick gets stronger. Oh, what do you mean, like, you plump up? More alert. Yes, that's true. You think so? Yeah, I think that's why in warmer climates there's more children. That makes sense. Less clothing. Yeah. Alliance. And crime goes up, by the way, in warmer climates. Is that true? Yeah, because you kind of that you see like a winter crime You're not doing oceans 11 in the snow Exactly carrying carrying a TV when it's snowing your hands are cold. It's not as easy

Yeah, summer your your agitated molecules are moving They did notions 11 and then like Alaska all the all the you know, Danny Ocean the whole crew. They just be fat 11 and like Alaska all the all the you know Danny Ocean the whole crew they'd just be fat Like I don't want to do a heist. I'm fucking fat. Yeah, and the Sun goes down at you know 1 p.m.. You live in an igloo Alaska seems weird seems awful. I know people live there isn't like a crazy Male to female ratio yes a lot of men a lot of dudes. That's tough. I think it draws oil workers in, and that's why there's more men. And fugitives.

I always say Alaska is the homeschool of states. Weirdos, they do their own thing. Nut jobs, a lot of guns. Ugh. Just saying. Yeah. I'm not going, I mean, I'll go to Alaska to visit, but that's where grizzly man happened

Oh, that was a good doc. Oh Man, her dog man. That was that was some sad shit. Yeah, cuz I thought you know cuz you get those people You don't know the movie It's like a guy who he was one of want to be actor goes to I guess it was Alaska I forgot it was that but goes to live amongst the Bears the grizzly Bears yeah, and but goes to live amongst the bears, the grizzly bears. Yeah. And obviously things go wrong. Yeah.

Like that's not a recipe for success. No. Just hanging with bears. So it's working for a while for him and then watch the doc. But anyway, you know, I've talked to people that are like, he's a fucking idiot, you know? I was like, no, it's like a sad story. Yeah, he loved bears.

Yeah. Clearly a gay man, by the way. Was he? Had a girlfriend. Well's like a sad story. Yeah, he loved bears. Yeah, clearly a gay man by the way Was he had a girlfriend Wow so does Peters? Oh, but I'm just saying clearly gay I think he just needed I don't even know about gay. I think he just needed like a connection I think he was like that lonely Lonely, that's what LA does to people. Oh was he LA? Yeah, isn't that I want to be actor Oh, I didn't know that's what Los Angeles will fucking it will make you He like bears huh big burly men all right, but I was I was I want to be actor. Oh, I didn't know that that's what Los Angeles will fucking it will make you

He like bears, huh? Big burly men. All right, but I was I was working on a bit about Early to a bit, but you made me think of a bit about how like people will brag about New York It's a city that never sleeps. I'm like, yeah, that's not a good thing. That's a torture tactic That's your bragging. So I was thinking of other angles like Los Angeles, the isolation will make you wanna kill yourself. But the line is like, it's Guantanamo Bay, that's what they're known for, sleep deprivation. Oh yeah.

So Matt Boussard watched me tell this joke and he goes, you should say Guantanamo, the bay that never sleeps. Oh. That's kind of a good line. Didn't hit last night, but the other part did. I like it. But I kinda like the Bay that Never Sleeps. Oh. That's kind of a good line. Oh yeah. Didn't hit last night, but the other part did. I like it.

But I kinda like that line, there's something about it. There's something there. The Bay that Never Sleeps, where is Guantanamo Bay? I believe it's in Cuba. Yeah. Oh. It's like the tip of Cuba. Well it sounds nice.

Guantanamo Bay, like Aruba, Jamaica, ooh I wanna take you to Guantanamo Bay Hey, baby, okay. Yeah, I'm gay It sounds kind of nice, but it's not really not Not a good not a good vacation destination. No pick sandals Panama Canal sounds nice too. Yeah, is it I don't think so. I think it's a shipping port or something It's a lot of controversy with the Panama Canal. Is that Pele? Yeah, I'm putting it up for our guest Brazilian way to give it away. Oops. All right, we have I don't know a famous Brazilian we got a

Pele. Bolsonaro is coming through Pelle. Polo's coming through. Yeah, there we go. Senna's dead. But yeah, who'd you say? The old president. Oh, nice. Nice pull.

Pelle. They might be more racially diverse than us. Yeah. Brazil? Yeah. Beautiful women. Beautiful. I went to Argentina.

I did too. And I was talking to my host there and they said, oh, I never saw a black person until I flew into Miami to come to America. I didn't do. And I was talking to my host there and they said, oh I never saw a black person until I flew into Miami to come to America. What? Really? In Argentina.

Interesting. It's a lot of ex Nazis and stuff. Yeah, the Nazis really ran through there and whited everyone up. That's the Hitler conspiracy theory, right? That he made it to Argentina. Oh, is that right? I know a lot of guys did.

They made all these like Hitler, they made like that Amazon series, right? about like what would have happened if Hitler won What if they just did like Hitler in his later years just showing in Argentina? Just like a drama has nothing to do with the Holocaust right? He's fighting with his wife you bitch He remarried. Maybe that's the thing. He killed her. That's he wanted to remarry Maybe got like a like a gold digger, like a younger lady.

Sounds Jewish. Fucking racist, dude. Good slur for Jews. What, money? Gold digger, how'd that, no one ever put that together. By the way, gold digger, have I done this before? It doesn't feel like a good term because gold digging actually requires work. That's a good point These women are just marrying a rich guy. Yeah, there's work though. I guess you gotta blow them You got a suck an 88 year old off and there's a lot of work. I mean, there's even work to get the dick hard

That's you got to take a pill. Now. We're doing like a dirty Seinfeld bit Gonna take a pill. You got to wait for the dick, then you gotta suck it to completion. But a gold, it's gold digging. But a gold digger is like a prospector with a long beard and dirty fingernails who's out there panning and digging. These are women who are aware. It's hard to work for sure. It's harder, I'm just saying. Gold digger to me is too hard of a job.

Maybe gold, what do you call the guy with the loop? Like a. Telescope? No, the diamond guy. Oh yeah. You know they like appraiser or something. I don't know. You're a gold waiter.

Gold waiter? Yeah. Uh-huh. Or gold. Gold stocker, gold pile, like gold counter, something, I don't know. Really gold user. Gold user. gold you just a user right yeah Goldie hon

Go I'm a building apply Who is gold in my hair she was the first president of Israel no not the first Maybe she was the first the first president of Israel pull it up pull it up first female or first president. I think it's first Wow, that's very progressive. Interesting. Okay. Probably the only, uh, was the Israeli politician who served as the fourth Prime Minister of Israel from 69 to 74. Those are some bad years. Those are some bad Israel. No, not a lot of good years. Yeah, that's true. That's true.

Right now is pretty good. Seems to be going well. Goldie Hawn, you a fan? Oh yeah. By the way, got breast implants later in life. Did she? She was flat chested for most of her big career and then I think she got them later. Give that a go.

It's a weird move because it's when your back is probably weak Oh good point. I mean that's where people get reductions. Yeah Look at that now what you can we get a year on the breast implant? It cans. Oh Goldie Goldie Hawn is very sexy to me. She's got the huge mouth. Yeah, buddy Love I find her a hot a waste on us. What's that? There'd be your waist on us what's that there'd be a waste on us that's true oh man look at a young Goldie those eyeballs yeah I think she's hotter than Kate Hudson yeah cuz she's got the funny thing going yeah and funny counts for something I the original is kind of

hotter than the that's true the. The child of Hollywood is never like I don't know A little too young there What the hell are you doing? Good Lord Sally, how'd you even find these? On my hard drive. Well, yes, you got the cute face. I like a little bit of weirdness Yeah, a little lack of symmetry is kind of hot. Yes Yes, like what's it? Uma Thurman. Yes, something's a little lack of symmetry is kind of hot. Yes. Yes, like, what's it, Uma Thurman. Yes. Something's a little off, but it works.

Although I love that we're just like, yeah, I like when something's a little off. Who do you like? Uma Thurman. One of the most beautiful women ever. We're acting like we're quirky. Well, Heidi Klum, eh, too plain, I think. She's pretty. I'm weird.

I like women like Salma Hayek. Oh, yeah. And Penelope Cruz. I'm weird, like like women like Salma Hayek oh yeah Penelope Cruz I'm weird though something's off the Hispanic I don't care that's like that's a peeve when people go like I'm weird and then it's just like the most generic how about this guy I'm weird I like cold pizza shut up everybody eats cold pizza you're not interesting yeah a cold fried chicken that's another one that people think. Man, that cellar party, General So's, that fucked up my stomach for a hot two days, I'd say.

Yeah. Can't be drinking hard liquor while you're eating Chinese. I know. It's fucking, that's like wild man shit at this point. Like I used to be impressed by skateboard tricks, but now I'm like, now I see someone pounding whiskey and General So's, I'm like, you're fucking insane. Yeah in general so I'm like you're fucking insane

That's it's gonna end horribly. That's what I did taking your life in your hands. That's so true Why why did they do that? I mean it's I love Popeyes, but you can't get shit-faced Annie Popeyes It's too poised like a speedball. Yeah, but in the moment is a good man. Oh, it's great doing Beer and Popeyes is fine. It's when you start throwing the hard liquor in. Yeah. It's just too whiskey's bad on the stomach. Not our whiskey, Bodega Cat whiskey. Yeah, take that Rogan, you fucking snob. It almost is like, has like a chamomile tea effect

on your stomach, Bodega Cat. BodegaCatWhiskey.com folks for more. Hear, hear, we're almost sold out. Yeah. And we're almost in bars. We're getting there. Oh, yeah a lot of red tape But yeah, what the oh yeah general so's I stopped eating a Panda Express in like 2009. Yeah, it was a fucking me up Cuz New York is a thing

It's like you know if you're in a big city You can you're in like a you know a city that doesn't have a lot of Chinese people Panda Express is pretty solid But sure city you got options. Oh yeah, oh. You got good options for Chinese. I mean, we used to go to those like, real like Hunan type fucking, those were good spots. If it has bulletproof glass, that place is good. Yeah.

What's that one downtown, Chinatown, open 24. WoHop. WoHop, woo. It's a dumpling spot? No, it's just straight up Chinese, but it opened 24 hours, is it downstairs? Oh, I've heard of this spot, never been there. Oh my God dumpling spot? No, it's just straight up Chinese, but it opened 24 hours as a downstairs. Oh, I've heard of this spot, never been there. Oh my God, I think COVID fucked it up a little.

They're not open till 24 anymore, but man, was that some good drunk food. No shit. I mean, those some great nights. Just shithoused with eight guys at WoHop going, ah, you fucking bad man, you're throwing low-main at each other, good times. Take your shirt off, start making out,

turn into a gay porno. That's not an egg roll. We ate there after we shot your Chinatown rooftop. We ate there? Yeah. Oh yeah, ate up. A bunch of guys have been there, I remember, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Man, I was looking at pandemic pics. It's just weird that that happened. The empty New York, every single apartment was filled with the owner. It's just weird that that happened the empty New York that every single Apartment was filled with the with the owner. Those were bad times. I think that aged all of us. Oh, yeah Oh, yeah, I think that age is every everyone just got fucked up from that. Well think what we have to tell our kids 9-eleven pandemic Riots like we got some good stuff to tell the kids.

And they're not gonna listen to us. That's true. They're gonna be on their phone. Oh. They're playing some shape game. We'll be past phone. They're gonna have a chip in their asshole. They'll be fucking a robot at age four.

Damn. Look at that, that's insane. We lived through that. And we fought and we yelled and we screamed and we posted and we tweeted. Those were weird nights man, those like late nights doing roof shows. Oh yeah. You did a Fallon set on a boat. Oh my god, yeah well there's the naked cowboy.

He never left. No he never will. Ah fucking, you're on every roof, I'm on a boat. I'm in a park. I'm on a parking lot Crazy good times though. Yeah, I mean good bad times Yeah, not I would never want to do it again, but we made the most of it man Holy shit, New York was just shut the fuck down. You couldn't do anything crazy. How did restaurants survive that? Not a lot did yeah wait go back up Have you heard about this? Keep going keep keep going, keep going, keep going.

Right there. You know about this thing? What's that? The vessel. The vessel? Yeah. I think eight people jumped off of it. Oh, okay. And they had to shut it down. Oh, was this in Hudson Yard? Yep. Yeah, we did the show there, remember? They were explaining that to us. You did a show here. No like right next to it. Oh Why did anyone jump? I almost did It was rough. No, that was a good crowd actually we did that show you remember that one Maureen? Oh of course yeah Yeah, they kept saying like yeah people kept jumping off Imagine you have to close down a piece of art like because people keep yeah committing suicide on it Do you feel guilty if it's your art? Oh, yeah, like this was a cool thing to kill yourself on all right

Well, it's also where the amount of people who went walked by went that'll be it That'll be the thing that that I do it on and multiple people had that exact thought do you think it's like looking for a home? You're like this is perfect. Yeah Yeah, it fits all my needs. It's tall easy to get up. Did you watch that documentary the bridge? Yes I heard about it. I think we talked about on this. Okay, I'll just write briefly everyone regrets it though, right? Well the ones that survived to tell the tale instantly. Yeah, there's gotta be a couple people who are about to hit They're like perfect. Yeah but they said they used to publish the number of people who died jumping off the bridge.

And when they got to 500, they stopped doing that publishing in the papers because people were showing up with shirts that said 500. No! Yes! And they're like, wow! They got shirts made! That's crazy! The sad day at the printers. What's this for? Yeah. I love that the bridge should have a, hey, two days till someone killed themselves. Remember that at the warehouses? Like no one got injured. Hey, we've had 80 days till a person get injured.

No? All right. You don't remember that? I remember that. Sorry, I was distracted with the photos. He's scrolling here. Sorry, man. Man, you know what dog I just watched?

BitCond on Netflix. You watched that one yet? No, but Crypto? Yeah, oh my god, these fuckers are so unlikable. Yeah. Has there been a less likable group? They make Wall Street guys seem charismatic. Well, they mixed finance and tech.

Two of the biggest douches coming. And shit that doesn't make sense. Yeah. It's like gym guys hustling you on money. That's like the vibe. Right, right. And I still don't understand it. You could explain this to me for five weeks,

I still wouldn't get what crypto is. This guy is soulless. He's awful. Oh really? He just flipped on everybody and he's the only one who didn't have to do prison time and he was maybe the worst of all. I mean, dude, he's like, he's like dumb, dumb Jordan Belfort.

Wow. He's like Billy McFarland. Who's that guy? Oh, he's at the FireFest. Oh, I remember that guy. Yeah, he's so- Although he went to jail. Yeah, this guy is like, I mean, it's just so funny the shit you get away with.

Like they made Bitcoin credit cards and they just put a fake visa on this so the idea is kind of good they're like okay you can spend your Bitcoin so they actually could have executed this it's kind of an interesting idea you can spend your Ethereum or whatever the hell it is yeah but the card they have no deal with it was hilarious there's only one New York Times reporter who took it seriously everyone else was like fuck that he's like no. This is like a thing people talk about we should report this yeah, so this one guy I'm slipping on his name here, but he calls. It's a pretty easy reporting you call visa

You're like hey, do you go? Do you know these guys are like we've never heard of them ever whoa? Yeah, so they're not working with visa and he's a piece of shit. And you know, he used like, they used to made up, cause they thought it would look weird if it was all young guys on a financial website. So they just added a guy they found on the internet, an old guy in a suit like this. He didn't know who they were.

So he's in the dock and he's like, yeah, I'm a professor. Like this is pretty weird. Whoa. To be used for this. So then he used his grandpa. His grandpa was dying of cancer and he's like clearly one of those guys who's like, yeah, I love you, whatever you want. But this kid was soulless, just like an empty guy

who like only cared about money. And it's like, you know, I think everyone else is like, other guys who went down, it's like, yeah, there's more to life. And this guy's like, no, I will do this. I would do this again. I hate these docs about people who are like proud of the shit they did where you're like,

you're the one who should be in prison. You have no remorse. You'll do this again. It's like those Brooklyn seven five guys, those cops who are like, they're looking back on just like ripping people off and fucking everyone over and being like man those were the days yeah fucking we were didn't that McFarland guy do that like

he did his time for a fire fest and when he was like out for a bail or parole or whatever some other thing he was like selling tickets to the Oscars like yeah you just doing it again it's like pedophiles they go to jail and they come out they're like this is all I know this is my thing I fuck kids don't cut that don't clip that but that's what they do they go right back it's like a beaver they go right back to dams it's a funny thing to describe fucking kids being like it's my thing I'm sorry you get handcuffed I'm sorry it's a passion it's a passion project you don't know me ask anyone about me this This is my thing

They're like we know we asked everyone You're your neighbors your nephew. That's the guy who should say I'm weird. I like fucking kids. That's the weird guy Yeah, not the guy who thinks Old pizza. Yeah I'm weird. I like Scarlett Johansson. Oh, yeah But it sucks You know when you see an old Asian lady with 30 bags of cans and you go, if you applied this much work to a regular job,

you'd probably be a zillionaire. It's the same with these guys. You might not go to jail if you applied this to stocks. I know, but I think those plans would be long game plans that got them rich. We even see it with Bodega Cat, this is a a long process we're doing it the kind of slow way yeah but then I think these guys just want quick they want it's a dopamine it's like a dopamine rush they just want the money and they probably get off a little on scamming

and I think they just want to post like a fucking Bugatti on Instagram yeah I think it's all about like image I mean the second I said these guys were in like Miami I was like I mean that's where you go image. I mean the second I said these guys were in like Miami. I was like I mean That's where you go if you want to be a piece of shit. Oh, I'll be at the Miami Improv in Just added that I Had a couple days cuz I was like fuck. I can't do that. I gotta I gotta get back out there I added Brea Miami and shit. Yeah good. I gotta. I gotta get back out there. Buy a ticket with Bitcoin. Rochester.

Oh, hey. Weird thought based off of the thought you just had. Do pedophiles fantasize about celebrities as kids? Like I'm thinking about Scarlett Johansson as a child. And that, like that. Probably. Well, if it's anything like you're Googling, I'll pull that up immediately.

But I would say so. I bet they're already on it. Probably. Well, if it's anything like you're Googling, I'll pull that up immediately. But I would say so. I bet they're already on it, because she was a child actor. So they probably caught that early. Her. Or how about Mel Gibson as a kid? Now I'm into kids, male kids. Yeah, that's a good point.

I don't know. Like, what is he, a hot kid, you mean? Yeah, when I fantasize about Mel Gibson, is it about boy Mel Gibson? Probably. Yeah, and can you get yearbook access? These are the good questions. Ah-ha, that's a playboy to a pedo. A yearbook. Yeah.

I'm just thinking out loud here. Yeah, the thing about it, the only person who's happy to sit next to a kid on a flight is a pedo. That's true. The only one. That's a perk to being a pedo. Yeah. I would change seats Hey pedo you want to sit next to this kid cuz he's killing me video game ding ding ding ding ding the pedals like you got it everybody wins the guy with a

Pencil thin mustache like you want to switch He's like do I? Screaming around him. He's like I did that once too I had a friend on a flight and Wanted to sit together and I the person next to me smelled so fucking bad Hmm, and I got up and I was like hey do you mind switch with me? That's my friend right here, and he was like yeah sure and the second he got over. He just looked back Like what can you do? I mean you're fucked. I got you. That's great, but that's that does suck. I did feel bad

I did that, but I was like, man, survival to fitness, you gotta survive. Yeah, well, that's the only time you're happy about the long COVID. I got no smell. I know. I can sit next to a shit-stained hobo and I won't even notice.

I had a lady on a flight, she had the worst BO in history, and I'm not a squeamish guy, I'll put my face right in the ass. Oh yeah. Oh yeah, but I got a napkin on, fork and knife, but this gal had the worst scent that I asked for a mask. Wow. I was the mask guy, no one on a plane had a mask except me,

but that's how bad it was, because it was like a soury, milkish, is dairy said what is happening what happens with those people that happened to my friend and though stewardess brought him coffee grounds and was like whoa so if you're sitting next to someone holding coffee grounds you got to get your shit together that's a bad sign that is fucking crazy yeah some people just smell oh she when he said about Yeah some people just smell, aww, she's when he's sad about that. Some people uh. See how I can handle this was beyond. I know I know what you mean we've all been but then you hate to be that person like you know like all the the fucking taxi drivers smell bad

and you're like yeah he did 18 hours on the shift probably you know. Yeah that I can take. I can take that also the windows go down it's different different a flights different flights different concealed air, you know recycled air Yeah, that's tough and you're you're right there. You know, you're right next to this this gigantic human I wish I had the They'll put that goo Could I use some of that goo that smelling goo? I don't even know what that is these that went for cadavers like when you're working around cadavers He put the smell right under your nose. Why do you know shit like this?

for cadavers like when you're working around cadavers he puts a smell right under your nose. Why do you know shit like this? This is a weird random thing. I'm just you know on like Dateline and whatever. Oh okay. Just put it on? Yeah you put a little dab will do ya and then you can't smell the rotting corpse. Dateline's good stuff man. Oh yeah. It's a good like you know sometimes like you get a cold you're almost like yeah right I'll fucking I'll watch some true crime. Oh yeah. It could be worse. Could be worse. Yeah, I got a head cold. I could have been pushed down a flight of stairs for an inheritance, you know?

It always could be worse. It's always like 30 grand too, they did it for. I know. It's never like this crazy amount. Goes a long way in some parts of Kentucky though. That's true. You think about 30 grand here, you're like, yeah, it's fucking gonna get eaten up on some cray-

Oh, New York will find ways to fuck you. You got that right. It's amazing the hoops you have to jump in to live here. It's fucking- Oh, it'll eat you, spit you up and eat you out. Wait. Eat you up and eat you out. Thank you.

It'll eat your ass and spit you out. You know what, whenever I wanna feel better about New York, I just turn on the Baltimore News. Anytime you wanna feel better about New York. I just Turn on the Baltimore news Anytime you want to feel better about your town just check out Baltimore. It is a mood razor I mean the bridge fell down the crime the whole thing You turn the news the bridge falls you're like good I'm doing all right this city's all right Yeah, the National Guard's in the subway. Our bridges are up!

That National Guard in the subway shit is interesting. That's a bad look. We said in the Yang episode We're like that's not a thing and then we got on the train together and we saw and we're like, alright. Yeah Hey, how about this for Yang's followers? Yankees That's an idea. I went to a Yankee game last week. How'd they do? It was the only really bad game. They looked awful. They've been great otherwise, but it was still fun. You're living your life.

I like that one. Yes, you are living. I'm having an alright time. Hanging out with athletes, you're at games. You're doing stuff. You too. Oh yeah. I'll take it.

Yeah, man. You're buying apartments, you got a dog. I'm trying. Yeah, you're doing great. Special cooking? Hopefully soon. Are you on the editing process? Yeah. That's tough. It's alright. I mean it's pretty much done.

Okay, good. I mean it works. Great. That's exciting. It's not totally done, but man fucking, you're just like, you're done with the jokes, you're like, I don't wanna even think about these jokes again. Yeah. And then you're like, I got to a little longer.

You gotta watch that edit, you gotta watch this version of it, then that version of it, and you just go, I hate to see it. How about you, you're cooking on the road. Cooking on the road, I finally got a good 40 that's really popping. Oh, I'm jealous. I'm in the best stage like with it

I have some time left to write the rest of it, but this 40s working so it's a nice Do you have to say where obviously but do you think you know your next special is gonna end up? I I get it's between three Wow that's nice. Yeah, I got some options good options see so no We'll see what happens. Yeah. Good time for comedy. Good time. You can cut this, but I think that outfit's making her uncomfortable to lay down.

She keeps laying down and then standing up. Oh, good eye. Now that's a father. Hey, there we go. Uh oh. PETA calling in pedophile That's someone who loves Peter yeah, yeah, you love dogs in oh, I love Peter so much

Holy shit What about this to get rid of pedophiles? pedicure There we go nude beach hello, you might still not go down Everyone loves this fucking dog dude. Oh, yeah, how could you know who would hate the dog? There's probably people out there don't like winning yeah, I can a piece of the shit, dude. Oh, man. I send you I send you the That's walking through New York, baby Oh, man, I send you I send you the That's walking through New York, baby

She fucking runs this town story my life staring at a bitch's ass walking down a New York sidewalk I got a good one for you, Sally All right, get off the the beehive Kardashian sex tape again, where the hell is it? Oh, you couldn't see that be whole for a mile with all that shit Where the hell is it? You couldn't see that bee hole for a mile with all that cheek she had Where the hell is it? Trying to find one to send. Oh, here we go. I'm sending you one dude in text or Instagram, which is okay All right, I'm sending you one right now. Cut the dead air. Sorry about that.

Well, we got the power of editing Yeah, oh Big moan from the dog. Yeah, she even when he's bored right now. What the hell? Yeah, yeah, I just sent you one. You'll play this. You'll listen. You'll love this shit There's a good one. We've become obsessed with this guy Yeah Meeting Winston Churchill. Oh, wow Of course, I was immensely impressed with Churchill.

But he was quite another thing, you know. He was, he had great humor and great irony. I happened to be in Venice trying to get some money for a movie. And there he was in the hotel at the Lido with Clemmie, his wife. One day at lunch I came in with a Russian businessman. I was trying to hustle for some money for this picture.

And as we passed Mr. Churchill's table, Mr. Churchill saw me and made that little gesture and the Russian went out of his mind. This is a white Russian, not a red Russian. When he saw that Mr. Churchill not only knew me but gave around a special acknowledgement. It was clear to me that I had the money for my picture. So the next morning I was out swimming in the beach and I found myself paddling in the water

right next to Mr. Churchill. And I hadn't gone up to speak to him, but there we were in the water. And I had known him on and off during the war in a humble capacity, and I said, and he had come backstage to see me, and I said, Mr. Churchill, I think you ought to know what you did for me.

And I told him about how this acknowledgement had meant so much to me with my financier, and that day at lunch, I came in with the financier again, and Mr. Churchill rose from his chair and bowed. That's fucking good. Wow that's a great story. Yeah crazy. I want to be in that point of my life where I'm like so I was in Tuscany for my next special and then I popped over to Lisbon some fucking Stepanopoulos and he nodded at me and then I went to look.

If you look through that character but it's just bad people go, yes sir, there I was, I was in Fallujah. Osama bin Laden walked over to me and he nodded and he. He interrupted my dinner with Putin. Wow, these guys get so international. You know, they're just like, oh, I was in Milan talking to my ex, you know, trying to get the child support lawsuit fixed

or whatever. We're like, ah, I was in Hartford. The other day. You know, it's a different life. It's a different life. I was thinking about that whenever musicians will release a, like, this is the never released recording. You're like, oh shit, what would that be for comedians?

You're like, here's some dick jokes that I sat on. Right, that I sat on. Yeah. Here's the B side of my queef chunk. Or you, or the, you know, like they give you the story behind the song and you're like, this is where I, this gave me the inspiration, you know, for us it's like, yeah, I had diarrhea to rest up

and impop that thought. Yeah, yeah. Well, that was on my third hook or a lakinty. Yeah, that's true. And the songs, people will look for the meaning. They'll go, oh, this song's actually about his dead son who died in childbirth and ours. They go, I didn't get it.

That's just it, you didn't get the joke they will deep do a deep dive on a song there's got to be some subtext and what do you call that uh what's the word not meaning symbolism what's what is this symbolizing or whatever with us it's just like I don't get it that joke sucks. What about is it more impressive if it takes longer to write the song or the bit or is it more impressive it just came to you that quickly? It came to you quickly I like it when they're like I wrote the song yesterday in 40 minutes. Yeah that is impressive. I love those. If it's a good song. That's true. The song has to be great. Yeah.

And it came to you. I watched the Oasis documentary. Love them or hate them. I think they're great. I think they're great too. But they fist fight, they drink, they fuck, they smoke. You know, they're like rock star types and they're brothers. So they're always fighting. And eventually the manager goes, guys, you're killing it.

You're doing arenas, but you haven't had a new album in eight years. We need a new album. And they were like, all right. They put the cigarette out. They chug a beer they go Wonder wall Write that down. Okay, and then like a day later. They had a they had that album crazy I might be the best album watch the doc. That's crazy. That's crazy. That might be the best album. I know one That's crazy. They were ready in arenas before that album. They were huge Yeah, their first album was like a runaway hit. I mean give all this a go. I'm talking out of my ass here But crazy. Yeah, they were just one of those throw it together

And I think the fact that it was so easy for them made them quit Does that make sense? I think if it's if you got to work at it, you'll probably stick with it longer That's that's a fair point. Yeah. I heard a story about Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen sitting down and Leonard Cohen's like, man I forgot what song was, like I love this song you wrote it's so good and Bob Dylan goes yeah I wrote it in 15 minutes and then Bob Dylan's like I love Hallelujah and he goes took me five years. Oh there you go. But it's like to me they're both I mean that's impressive but it's kind of impressive that you just kept chiseling away at,

you know, to make it perfect. They're both, I mean, look, five years is not a good, but he made a classic. Yeah, and it was sung by, re-sung by so many different people. But it's like, yeah, you want, you do run the risk of overcooking your work. Yes.

I mean, you can make something great, but you could also, you don don't be one of those people that just sits on an album for 12 years we know those types we know those people and especially for comedy comedy doesn't last 12 years like stuff You wrote 12 years ago might not play today. That's true I know so many comics are coming up now Who there's a lot of comics who rush it out and there's a lot of comics who sit on stuff We're like dude. You got to have something out here. Like you got a great hour who there's a lot of comics who rush it out and there's a lot of comics who sit on stuff where I'm like Dude, you gotta have something out. You're like you got a great hour put it out right in the middle the sweet spot of those two

Well, it's kind of like Johnny Manziel That guy was like a phenom didn't have to train did blow every night drank every night. We'd love to have you on Johnny Johnny football But He was a piece of shit, he got wasted. Anyway, we'd like to extend an invitation. We're immense fans of your work. He's an entrepreneur at the end of the day. I mean, he sold his jersey illegally.

This is not helping. Alright, well I'm a fan. But he was also like smaller and you know, so it worked at that level, but when you get to the pros, everyone's so fucking good, you can't like riff. That's true. You gotta know plays. A lot of guys who are great in college

and all sports don't translate. Well, it's kinda like the peaking in high school. You know the guys who peaked in high school and they're like, I'm great, life is good, and then you don't keep going, you don't progress. And I think, that's my point about the old- So far not a great pitch to get Johnny on We love you Johnny people who don't get better at a certain age

Anyway, we hope to hear from you soon. He's found something. He's killing it at I'm sure he's doing right All right now watch that doc on it was so do I loved it? You know, which one was really good the the man they tail one. Oh That one fucked me up that one fucked me up. That guy just seemed like a nice guy. Sweet dude. Got, got rooked. Right, that guy got catfished? Catfished? Yeah. That's before catfish was a thing? Or it was after? I don't think he was aware of, he was too sweet.

He had a heart of gold and he bought it. Hook line. I think guys like that, you're just playing football all the time. He wasn't going out. He was the opposite of Johnny. He wasn't going out meeting chicks. I think it's just like, you know, you're at home, you're talking to people online. playing football all the time, he wasn't going out. He was the opposite of Johnny, he wasn't going out meeting chicks. I think it's just like, you know, you're at home, you're talking to people online.

Think about how much now, like, you have a kid, his generation's probably gonna be like, we would meet women less in person. I mean, we meet them, but like, you're, you do a lot of the groundwork now on the apps, right? I mean. Of course. It's considered weird to not on the apps, right? I mean. Of course. It's considered weird to not do the apps now.

Remember the app used to be weird. I remember we had a friend, a good friend of ours, who he would just like talk to women on the subway and that's a tough out though, man. I don't wanna be like. I respect that, that balls. You get shut down and then you just have a long stop with no door open and you're like,

oh, I watched it happen. He would just get shut down and it's like, you know, at least a bar is kind of like yeah You expect to maybe get right hit on you don't want to get hit on your commute I know, you know, although it's how Vitor met his wife. That's a great bit You know Gary Vitor's joke about that met his wife cuz she she sneezed on him and he said God bless you And he goes because we've been together he said God bless you and he goes because we've been together ever since you know and he goes about a week ago a woman on the train sneezed on me and I said fuck you bitch I'm not falling for

that a great Gary Veeder joke who we will have on this very soon yes he's putting out a thing or two he's been sitting on this fucking podcast and special I always tease him I'm like like, you don't have a podcast. But he's got one coming out soon. Here's the thing, if you don't put it out, you can't fail. I think that's not what's happening. I think that's not, I'm not saying with Veeder. I think Veeder's a talent.

First guy I ever met in comedy. But. He cursed me out in an open mic. Did he? Yeah. Oh wow. Cause he, I wasn't paying attention. He's like, this asshole's not paying attention.

Oh wow. And then I saw him, he did my show a night later cause I ran a show with Harrison and he- He didn't know you were a comic. No he did. Oh he did? Okay. He just snapped. Everyone snapped at open mics. It's funny, he's picking on a guy twice his size. Oh he didn't- This fucking asshole.

And then you stand up and he's- We were at Maui Taco. Like if you didn't snap, you were fucking, everyone snapped at open mics. Everyone snapped at Maui Taco. And then we saw him a night later, he goes, I'm sorry about that, I go, I get it. It's like we all snapped, you know?

And we've been together ever since. You can take a Zen Monk, Dalai Lama, put him at the Maui Taco, and he'd go, you fucking cum guzzling piece of shit. He was in a Michael Richards. Yeah, exactly. He'd put the robe off. I was watching that Michael Richards clip where Seinfeld's trying to help him on Letterman and everyone just keeps laughing. I'm like,

this is insane. That was so awkward. It's so weird. Respect to Jerry for sticking up for the friend like that. But also, Letterman was also persecuting those residuals. Oh, I didn't even think about that. That's a good point. No one did that for Cosby. They have Cosby zoom in, they're like, he made a mistake. Yeah, yeah, you didn't see, uh, Theo. I don't know when it happened, but. So this happened, so the interesting thing about this clip, if you want to watch it, is the thing hit TMZ, and this crowd was locked in that theater and didn't know about it.

Oh. So when the crowd sees Kramer and they're laughing. Is this pre-Twitter? Oh yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. That's kind of crazy. So it was like, it went viral. I mean, this would be fucking.

I think it's pre-iPhone. You know what's funny? I don't know if this would be worse or better now because now there's so much shit that maybe it would have been cycled through more quickly. But back then, I don't know. What do you think, it would be worse or better now? What do you mean? Better for what?

If a comic blew up like this. There's so much, this was like one of the first cancellations I remember. Definitely. Cell phone camera. Exactly, but it was like bad footage. That's how long ago it was. Yeah, way, way shitty. Real low, low res, but you got it. Yeah, the message was delivered

But this I thought he was trying to help him here. No, I think he's definitely trying to help but it's just a weird It's a weird setup with a laughing crowd What's especially weird is that they see Michael Richards face and they think this is the funniest guy I've ever seen and then he's apologizing I'm so sorry for the insensitive things I said and people like don't laugh yeah that's it are you there yeah I'm right here I'm Michael welcome to the show hello hi are you doing I'm not doing too good yeah why do you explain exactly what happened for the folks who may not know I I lost my temper on stage I was at a comedy club trying to do my act and I got heckled

and I took it badly and went into a rage and said some pretty nasty things to some Afro-Americans. A lot of trash talk. I got a juggle. Stop laughing, it's not fun. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. He's just so much better as Kramer. I know. It's just weird to see him be serious.

Yeah, 10 years we watched him be funny as hell. You've met Michael Richards as Kramer, now meet Michael Richards as the guy who feels really bad about calling a bunch of people the N word. By the way this is better than any zoom gig I ever did. By the way he's already got more laughs than anyone on a zoom show. And he's got his pants on. But you know it's weird it's a weird moment. That's it's crazy, right? Yeah, what about that's supposed? It's this been posted 17 years ago. It's happened longer than 70 Wow. I think was 99 Well, that's when the show ended I

Bet it was just funny to watch Seinfeld and then you see like, you know Kramer just like drinking his milk out of his fridge and then you cut over and this is it. Yeah, yeah. Weird shit time, you know, shit happens. Well the crazy thing is he has he done a thing since? No. He did Comedians in Cars and Herb. Oh well yeah, he's done Friends. Guess who booked those too? 2006 it says on Twitter. Oh wow, that late. Okay. Twitter came out in 08? Yeah, around time of... 09? iPhones, yeah.

Damn. So I wonder if it would have been worse or better, but. I'd love to have him on if he'd be willing to do it. Would you have him on? Sure. Yeah, we'll get him on with Miss Pat. Just don't talk while he's talking. Yeah.

Make sure to hear him out. Yeah, well what's he gonna call us? You fucking crackers? That'd be a great uh That'd be a great clip. Yeah, that'd be huge. Are you anywhere from the guest? Oh All right What he needs? Yeah, I was gonna say a story about Vita and I it went over yeah, I got cut off

It's over Mike his wife She hadn't sneezed ah shit. I lost it. That's gone. Oh, it's a jean jacket show hey hey Bostos yeah, leave it there Our friends at manscape want to talk to you about the boys Yeah, leave it there Our friends at manscape want to talk to you about the boys You men got two boys that follow you wherever you go trust manscape to give your below-the-belt twins The spa treatment your balls are talking about there your your ball sack their lawnmower

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Hey, Rav. Good to see you, man. How are you? Hey, what's up, buddy? Nice jacket. Where do I sit? Right here. Sit there? Yeah, you don't want to say when a Hey Apricot two bucks your car. I'm a co like apricot And that means wait, yeah, okay I was just watching one of your bits that I know has been

stolen to death, the pronouns one. Oh yeah. People just steal that bit, right? Do you have that bit, man? Look up the pronouns bit. So many views. Yeah, it's really funny. It's a really good bit. But here's the- are we on already? Yeah, yeah. Because here's the thing, when we post something, we are going to their world. I complain a lot about people stealing my stuff, but at the same time, they don't necessarily have to know that there's an ethic in comedy, that this is our show. I don't think they do.

They don't know. So yeah, sometimes I get like frustrated, but at the same time, I know where they're coming from. That's what they do. That's what they still think we have this ethic that we have a material so very mature way to look at it yeah but I complain more for the views then I actually understand what they're coming from you want to play this yeah yeah This is a killer bit. I am, you are, he is. And he told me, I invited a friend to have dinner at my house the other day. And he was like, oh I'm bringing a friend. And I said, of course, bring him. He was like, no, no, no, no, no. Bring them.

And I went home and I remember, oh no. And I packed a photo of them in my house. Please come, come with me. So I said, we're running. And he said, they are shooting me. So you tell them, that they are going to be falling for this. Now the beauty of this bit is the, I came here and I had to learn I am that you had to learn all the conjugations that's a unique perspective that we couldn't do yeah because we know all the the pronouns and all that shit so that's what's so cool about that bit and Marina had a you know Marina Franklin she's a different angle

on this where she's like you know they I have to say they now and you're gonna make me talk like a runaway slave that's's her line. They went that way. That's another great cheers A great angle we couldn't do. Yeah Hey, what do you got here? Aperol? I don't know what this is. Apricot pug Pretty good. Oh, baby. That's really good What is that like grapefruit and stuff? That's good. Very is that like grapefruit and stuff? That's good, very good. Vodka, grapefruit

juice, Aperol, that's it? And lemons, good. I'm a, the jokes about the language are the ones who actually helped me reach so many different people. Not only in America, you know, cause there's people like learning English all over the world so they can see that joke and like it because they're also learning, they know how this can be confusing. And it's very difficult to be creative in this subject because every foreigner that comes here, he has the instinct of writing about the misunderstandings

and how can I do a joke and don't play too dumb? This is a joke that I would never do now. Because I know what is this. I know what is day and day. I would be lying. It was confusing at first. It was actually confusing.

It came from an honest place. Now there's jokes that I do with the language and being this fish out of water in America there is jokes that I do with the language and and the being a little this this fish out of water in America that I don't feel are too honest anymore you know it I think that comes through in that bit you can tell it's real that's that was a real struggle the language was a struggle at that time but now doing that joke is me basically blind a little I don't know I don't know I mean this conflict I get that I don't I think I don't know. I mean, this conflict. I get that.

I think you outgrow a lot of jokes always you do comedy. It's not just something like that, but I guess that especially, because you've assimilated more. Yeah, when you come here, you have similar angles, but how can you be creative in that place?

Being a few shot of water and don't point at the same thing like the bus and the airport because yeah it is weird yeah but how can you be creative that's the challenge that I feel now that's a struggle as an international comic I bet because I get the I went to did a European tour I did Berlin I did Lisbon I and I got to go what's up with this that's weird with the grocery stores fucked up and they're like, ahhhh! And I'm only there for two days. You live here. So that's, you gotta really play it on the line. Yeah, but it's crazy because imagine if you were there for

five years. Exactly. Then you would be lying, pointing, oh the convenience store, it's so crazy. No, it's not. No, but you gotta do it in the beginning. I mean, how many... I've done a lot of all-black shows where you go up and you go, I could just play the, Whoa, I'm a fucking honky. You guys scare the shit out of me. Where's your dad? There's a good career in that too, actually. Yeah. But...

I pay taxes on time. Like, oh yeah. Like that. Whoa. Like a bad actor. I take care of my kid. Yeah. Diabetes. I don't have it. But that's something that I did the first time, but I was like, that was too easy. Let me see if I could really be a funny comedian.

And then it's harder. Do you feel when you go, you went overseas already, Sam? I've done it a bit. Yeah, I did Australia, I did England. I'm doing a bigger one, I believe in September in Europe. Do you feel that you have to change a lot when you go to those places no I don't actually don't really change anything I look I had a bit where the punchline was a

commercial in America huh I can't do that no oh there's a couple so you just find one you're like I could change it up maybe he wasn't a specific commercial or was about commercials the debate the joke, I had a joke about sex robots and like how, you've heard this bit about how you fuck, like you fuck a robot, but like maybe in the future it'll be like, you know, there's gonna be ads, like while you're fucking them, so, you know, that's for like, you know, you're fucking a robot, all of a sudden you hear liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty, and you're like, oh fuck, I gotta get the premium subscription, you know, it's like Spotify.

I'm butchering my own fucking joke. You know the joke. It kills. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that joke, you know, like, do I change it to ba-da-ba-ba-ba, you know, McDonald's overseas or whatever, but that's like a better joke for just America. But then that was kinda it.

I think I had a joke where I Talked about Panda Express. I compared it to You know like it was like bad sex Panda Express, but then you just like whatever Fast food you have you just ask them. What is a shitty fast food? Yeah, I Google it You feel like oh, I asked a guy like would they get this right? But then it's like McDonald's is like it's funny We labor over word choice and McDonald's is like too broad, it doesn't feel special. No, it's not funny. Wendy's is funny.

McDonald's is not funny. Yes, specifics. They have a different name in Australia too for Burger King, it's called like Happy Jacks or something. That's it, Hungry Jack. Hungry Jack. So, I don't know. How about you?

Did you have to change a lot when you came here? I feel- You're from Brazil originally. Yeah. How long have you been here? I feel. You're from Brazil originally. Yeah. How long have you been here? I moved to LA in 18. Okay. And then I moved to New York in 19.

That's. Wow, LA sucked that much. You were like, I gotta get out. Yeah, yeah, I left. Did you not like LA? No, it's, I feel like LA is. I mean, we don't either. You don't?

Okay, I don't. Nice for a week. I don't like it. No, the thing is, I feel like I came to America to do standup. There was no other reason for me to come here. There's nothing else. I don't love the country.

I love the scene and standup. I wanna challenge myself and come here. So New York was the place to do this. I feel like in LA, there's a lot of, a lot of dancing. Yes, yes. a lot of dancing, a lot of performance, a lot of faces, a lot of models on stage, because I think producers wanna fuck people, so there's a lot of models on stage.

I don't know, there's a lot of weird shit happening. A lot of marquees in comedy clubs, like the marquees is what's matter. Right, bits. So coming to a place like The Cellar or other comics, mainly The Cellar, you don't know, nobody knows. Nobody goes to their website and see who's playing. I think there is a marquee.

It's a blackboard right out front. Oh yeah, yeah it is. That's a great observation for the difference between LA and New York. You ever see The Laugh Factory? Yeah. Fucking digital thing on Sunset and we got, we got a fucking whiteboard that'll just be a race.

Laugh Factory, big tip model tonight. A man with perfect jawline. Yeah. Yeah. And black dude with bulge in his pants. Off tonight. Comedy seller, almost homeless Jew. Funny, we all know who that is.

Yeah. We love you, Attell. It's a bad guy. Almost homeless Jew Funny we all know who that is We love you hotel It's a bad guy eight bags with him, but that's it. That's why I think like New York was a Was more challenging and also everybody who do comedy outside of America They know this stair the stair of the sailor. Yeah. They kind of see that, you know? So that's the challenge is to, for me, it was not to come here and become famous or get money. It was like, I wanna be there. I wanna learn, and I have the chance here to watch

and to see people that I think I'll never be able to see if I wasn't here. Yes. Which kind of people like Lenny Marcus and Andy Haynes and Rosebud, you guys are more famous, you have your specials on Netflix and everything, but those people who have their careers and they're building their career, I would never have a chance to see if I wasn't here. So many funny people. So many.

Unsung heroes. It's very common for me to just mainly in the beginning now I know everybody but in the beginning to just go up and see a guy and I'm like who is this guy what is that oh yeah he had a sitcom in the 90s it didn't work now he's murdering for 25 years and nobody's see if he's happy yes getting 25 years and nobody's seeing. He's happy, he's getting enough money to do this. This is what he wants to do.

So it's not like he is a failure. No, no, that's the life he chose. It's almost like I look at the beauty of in baseball, you got the minor leagues, and a lot of these guys are making shit money, living in their car. They just love baseball. Exactly.

And it's like, I would have been this if it didn't work, I'm this if it works, you know? So it's like, you're right, it's like a beautiful thing that these are just like a lot of purists at the comedy stuff. Purists, yes. When I was broke, I'd have interviewers be like, you got a day job and you do comedy at night,

how do you do it? I'm like, well, it's better than just a day job. I could have a day job and do comedy. I'd rather have a day job and do comedy than just a day job. And also if you're not searching, I'm not saying that being broke is awesome, but if your whole search is success, there is a place where you want to go and as soon as you get to that place, things are not as happy as they were in the area people don't enjoy the the path as much as they they have to yes and I came here to search for the

path because I had the I had I have I wouldn't say there was a gazillion there but I had money enough to not don't work anymore. I had TV shows and got some Brazilian TV? Yeah, yeah. And lights. We have light. Yeah. We have soda, Coca-Cola in there last year.

It's amazing. Bananas. It's amazing. I met a Brazilian. They described him as the John Stewart of Brazil. Wow. Like that big. Like his show was that big.

Really? We had, I had a show with a few other comedians. There was like the comedy show in in in Brazil, but it's such a unique thing because we speak Portuguese It's not even Spanish so Brazilian comedian can only perform in Brazil Portugal and in other countries with Brazilian communities, but like it's such a Portugal and other countries with Brazilian communities but like it's such a specific thing and I was the first one to cross over to because we have a good scene there. It's crazy to not see a trajectory in front of you to not be like here's a guy I can look at

his career yeah I want you kind of would just you went there blind almost right come here yeah and also when I started there because there was no comedy when I started there yeah so the beginning no comedy when I started there. So the beginning was the thing, also like end of 2003, beginning of 2004 I think, that's when we started stand up. It's pretty new in Brazil. So can you imagine when we started,

there was no way for us to watch other people. Because YouTube became a thing in 2006. Yeah. So for like two years, the only reference that we had was the opening of Seinfeld. Wow, that's crazy. It was nothing. The only thing, and then I think in 2004, we got a CD that had like four or five Comedy Central presents. And they made it into Portuguese. No, no, no, no, no, we watch it in English. We watch it in English.

Our English wasn't that bad. We were able to understand. When did you learn English? I learned, it was more like 99 when I came here to play basketball. I played one year. Also, he's on the traveling Brazilian. What team are we on?

Like their NBA or their national team? No, no, no, it wasn't that good. That's what I tell people. So what level were you? Keep telling me. What level were you? I played pro for a little bit. Jeez!

A good three or four years. What was your game like? I was just getting offensive fouls. I was a good defender. I wasn't, my shoot sucked. I had a lot of heart. I was like a shitty Dennis Rodman, how I was. That's pretty cool.

So when we started standup, we watched, that CD I remember, we had Jim Gaffigan, Brian Regan, I think was Ted Alexandra. Ted Alexandra. Oh, okay. That's great. And I think it was Louis C.K. I think. Four or five.

No diversity. No diversity. But those are great comics, all great. So that was the only thing that we had until stand up. Wow. So even- Do you think, I think we talk about this a lot. When you start comedy,

you're kind of doing another comedian at first, you're kind of doing it almost like a bet. I feel like we can tell you who we did, but I mean, I was probably a bit of like, a tell and dame. Okay. Norm, a lot of Norm, a lot of Seinfeld. Yeah, is there someone you felt

like you were kind of doing? But how could I do it? Cause I couldn't watch people. You had no reference. So that's a good thing also. It really is a good thing. I felt like I, the rhythm that you see right now in that video,

if I see old videos, I'm happy to say that it's a very similar pace and rhythm because I performed more than I watched so I kind of found a voice I would say soon of course the content was completely different the jokes were we didn't have references so how can you say if a joke is good or bad because of the reaction of the audience? We know now that sometimes it doesn't matter if the people think it's funny.

You know when something is funny or not. It doesn't matter. I don't wanna stick with it. You trust yourself at a certain point if it's not hitting, but there's definitely that thing where like, there are comics who came in from like the Midwest, and they're like, shit, I got some roadstank on me. Like this is not working in New York. To me, it's even more impressive when people come from another

country and English is not their first language. There aren't that many of them that have passed through. I mean, how many comics work the seller who English isn't their first language? When I arrived there, it was the only guy there. I think what we passed at the same time was Simonson. Daniel Simonson. Oh, Daniel Simonson, he's great. Me and him. Very funny.

And now the last few months, Fabrizio Copano from Chile. He also got passed. I think it's like three. Wow. Probably ST has other. Got him a lay works there as well. I don't know if you yeah massive in France Yeah, big in America, too. Yeah, you know yeah, but that's you know the

He he's a guy that I I saw his trajectory when he came here to see how How how do I do it? But the good thing and what I try to do is I try to come here without telling people immigration. This is this is Gad. He hates when I talk. I try to be as nothing as I could to come here. I never did a show like oh look at how many followers. Oh, look, I have a special on that list. Because I felt like the challenge wouldn't be fair if I just come here having opportunities because of the numbers I have.

So that's why also LA wasn't as fair with the thing that I was searching as New York. Because people couldn't care less. Actually, Esti, she said to me, it was like, you know, when I see someone with huge numbers, I already step back a little, because she said that. I was like, wow, that's great.

Esty is the booker at the Comedy Squad. You probably know this if you listen to this podcast. And LA would be the opposite. No, it's the opposite. You got big numbers, come on in. We don't care how funny you are. You can have shows, so I feel like Gad was already huge in France France and everybody knew that he was huge in France

for people to Michael Richards ended up at the laugh actor Exactly so when people ask me here in the beginning like so who are you? I was like I was trying to be good at this before I be good at this before. I loved integrity. I didn't even, I didn't as many like podcasts and stuff. Yeah. I was like, let me tell my story when I feel that I'm comfortable doing this, you know? When I feel that I am in a good place

and I feel that I'm traveling a little, you know? There's a guy, Ethan Simmons Patterson at The Cellar, he kills it every time. I've never seen him bomb, he rips it, has no social media, doesn't do podcasts. And I I'm like that's so cool to the seller has this guy Literally only based on his on merit on his merit. There you go. Yeah, it's killing Well, we started working there. We didn't have shit. Yeah, that was a different time When was it when was it when we 13 I got passed? I think I was 2012

Maybe 11. No, you might have been 12 and I might have been 11. Whatever it was, it was a long time ago, but it was, yeah, I mean, we didn't have shit. No, I had one Conan, I think. I think I had nothing at the time. Don't you feel that you have more Mary's on? Yeah, it feels good. You do, I mean, I kind of was sick of seeing on the lineup,

you know, from Comedy Central's Comics to Watch. Yeah. I was like, oof, I mean, I kind of was sick of seeing it on the lineup. You know him from Comedy Central's Comics to Watch. Yeah. I was like, oof, I gotta get something better than that on that wall. It's something. It's something. TV. Yeah, I don't think it was.

No, it wasn't technically, but it says Comedy Central, so the public doesn't know. Yeah. But I mean. Yeah, we were just desperate to have something. Yeah. Well, you mentioned Comedy was new there for you as a comic. You only saw a couple of guys.

What about the audience? That must have been new for them too. They had to learn what stand-up was. They had to get savvy to hearing jokes. Yeah, the beginning, in the beginning, every MC would explain to people what stand-up was. Whoa. So, oh, there's no impersonators, there's no costumes, because that was the type of comedy we used to have.

We still have it. But there's those comedy that you see on Televisa and Telemundo, those guys screaming with wigs and doing impersonation. This is an uphill battle right here. Can you imagine going to a movie theater and like, all right, there's gonna be moving pictures. There's people on a screen.

They're not coming out to grab you yeah this guy's gonna talk about his dick a little boring yeah you gotta stick with it you don't yell at him so the MC would have to explain to people there's no light there's no music wow we and they are themselves because the first thing that other comedians to do before us was like, ah, hi, I'm the drunk Sergio. And Danny, he was a drunk guy. And oh, hi, I'm the drug addict.

And so that was characters. But also with a microphone, the same format as standup. So that was why a little confusing. And I'm telling you, the confusion was not only with the people watching, but for years. And I would say, even now, it's confusing for people to know if what I'm saying is actually my opinion or is my joke.

I had so many controversies with jokes because people was like, what is this guy saying? It's clearly a joke, but when it's take out of context and you put it in the news, it's horrible. Every joke is horrible. Of course. Anytime it's in text, you're missing the sarcasm. I remember Louis used to have a bit where he's like,

we should never rape a woman, unless you wanna have sex with her and she doesn't want it. Well, that's clearly a bit, but it's like in text, that joke doesn't work. It's horrible. The face, the delivery. It's horrible. I think, did you watch Lenny, the movie Lenny Bruce? Yeah, I've been a while.

There's a scene there that is really good. Like the judge is saying his joke, and he's like, let me tell my joke. If people laugh, you just, let me go free. And that's a real story, I mean that really happened to Lenny Bruce, I mean it's like crazy that they're reading his material. Yes.

Like yeah, I can defend my material, I can't defend it when he says it. Yeah, well Bill Burr had that great bit in Paper Tiger where it was like the height of me too, and he's like me too sucks for women who like it rough. Because that shit on paper at the courthouse, it's like no, no, stop, you're a bad boy. And he's like, no, that's not how she said it.

He's doing the stenographer, it's a great bit. But yeah, so you had some, I don't know if we're allowed to talk about it. No, anything. A little bit of a hiccup in big Brazil that made you come here? I wouldn't say that it made me come. Oh, I figured that was the reason you left. A little bit. Okay. But we don't have to talk about it. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no and we showed an image of this singer, she's pregnant, she was pregnant. And I said that she's so hot that I would fuck her

and her baby. I know it's not my Mona Lisa. I'm not. You know what's funny, I read about this, and in the text it wasn't nearly as funny as the way you just, shows the importance of delivery. Delivery, yeah. Exactly. So. That's it? Yeah, but it was like, it was, it wasn't nearly as funny as the way you just Shows the importance of delivery

So that's it yeah, but it was like it was I would say added to some other things that I said but that one was like I Felt I felt that it was important for me to explain to people what comedy is Yes, because that would be important only for me before all my peers. There's a lynch mob. He wants to fuck a baby They don't get it. There was that bro. There was like senators going on Congress to call to say like pedophilia It's an important issue that we have to talk about Getting me as an example, and I'm not I'm not I'm not gonna say that they were looking at him Like this guy is crazy. They were looking at me like this guy's a psychopath they were wow people pointing fingers at me that's the price i also paid for being one of the first ones doing it i'm it's true i'm sure that now people would look at something like this differently this was

2011 when i had a live audience when you made this joke or was it just a live audience and you got a laugh a lot i mean that's kind a lot point you like well it worked It was a joke work and also the two guys were hosting the show with me left But when the controversy happened, they just fucking jam My fucking they get you Yeah, one of them are like yeah, I am a father I know how this can be offensive and I know if he was my kid I don't know what I would do turncoat and the other guy was even worse because the other guy said

oh well I just think it wasn't a funny joke ahhhh instead of I think that's the the I think the saddest part in a controversy is when it's about a shitty joke like I'm not proud of I think I don't like the joke I don't like the joke yeah if at least the press would put a good joke. But they are like fucking repeating a shitty joke.

I have better ones, just get. It was a good cuff. Better ones and even more aggressive cause this is nothing. Yeah, it's a riff. You're getting killed for, at least when there's a joke that you can defend. Yeah.

I mean, I get it, it's not your favorite joke and it's getting, even with Rock, when he got hit by by Will Smith He's like, you know, that wasn't his favorite bit. Oh You know, he's one of the funniest guys ever and he's and it's like a throwaway line He gets slapped in the face for reference people don't know that if they want to hurt a comedian Instead of saying that you suck that you're a psycho. Don't give the people on YouTube ammo. No, no, no.

Go ahead. I think what really make us think is like, when someone go and say, that wasn't funny. Yeah. That hurts. When I see a comment on YouTube with people saying, yeah, I like you, but this one is not for me then it's like oh fuck what did I do then I think that it makes me like green to be better

oh yeah oh yeah that's when they're not trying to be mean like don't be mean but I don't get it you're like oh it's better when they're like you gay weirdo like all right that I get that's just mean how do you see? when you when you see a comedian doing something that Turns into controversy and that person apologize I think depends on what it is I think you should apologize if you feel that you should apologize and no other reason I think I think it is also dangerous So to apologize because you're giving in To people who aren't your fans. I don't think your fans want though to apologize because you're giving in to people who aren't your fans.

I don't think your fans want you to apologize. I think it's usually people who never would go to see you, would never support your comedy. And these are these people being like, apologize. I'm like, you didn't know who I was yesterday. Right, right. It's weird to just demand an apology like, you know, from someone you don't know.

Yeah, and if I'm demanding an apology, if you're demanding an apology from me, I'm demanding a accepted from you. How come you get to demand and I can't know? Yeah, and if you're demanding an apology from me, I'm demanding a accepted from you. How come you get to demand and I can't demand? Also, I'll apologize to the person that I did a thing to. I'm not gonna apologize to this grand camera TV land. Well, what's the point?

I didn't do anything to you. Yeah, that's what I did, but it didn't work. Yeah. You apologized? I sent an email, like next day I was like, oh, if you feel, if I. Did you feel sorry? Well, I didn't want that person to be hurt.

You don't want people to be hurt. You don't want people to be hurt. Sure, that's how we're doing this for. You know what's cool though? I saw there was a thing about Jimmy Kimmel at the Oscars. He made a joke about Robert Downey Jr.'s, his drug addiction, and they asked Downey Jr. and he was like, I think he's a national treasure

and I had no problem with it. I didn't think the drug was that bad. I didn't think it was that bad either, but I think people read into it if the person doesn't laugh, like fake laugh hard enough. They read into it like he fucked up, this is the news story. I don't know man, I think, I remember Joan Rivers

just would never apologize for a joke and I really admired that about her. Cause I think she really believed like You're you don't it's not about the apology. It's like it's about the comedian groveling That's what it is and I think that's where I kind of found issue with it was you know I got a lot of shit for a rape joke like 12 years ago and Still upset I'm sorry about the rape.

But you know the people who were really coming at me like were just not never would have been fans of mine they were happy to take things out of context and they were happy to like it felt like it was a hit piece and I think when people do that, they're trying to get engagement and attention for themselves, that's an addictive drug. They're not trying to have a dialogue with you or have a real conversation. They're trying to ruin you and then, in some self-righteous rant, show how great they are.

Prop themselves up. So I think some of those people were comics who came after you. Now you've changed, you're 12 years past it. Is it fuck them forever if they come up to you in the club? You're like, hey Sam, I love the new stuff. Or do you make amends? But I never forget.

So I'm like, I'll never, I won't be a dick to them, but I also am like, I don't think that's a person I would be friends with. No, you definitely look down on them. Like, oh, you're easily manipulated, you're kind of a loser, and you just kind of go with the flow. And now you're okay with me because time back?

I had a guy go real hard about me. Really? Yeah, you know who it is. And he went real hard at me. And then years later, when his career was in the toilet, hit me up to apologize. And I just didn't respond. Michael Richard.

And then he, I think, tried like, and I just was like, but I just don't, I don't wanna give you the satisfaction of it's all good, because I thought the way he went after me was pretty, pretty, was he close to like a close friend? No, we were never close. But if we were close, maybe I would have heard him out. But the fact that we were never close, I don't really need the opportunity.

But there's two things, the context has to be analyzed. For example, I don't think a joke would kill your career in America. Because people already know stand-up for the past 60 years. If something happened in another country where comedy is new. It's very confusing for everybody That's it like they're like can feel like why would he say that? Why would he say that? I like him so much How can he do a rape joke cuz I got a huge trouble with a rape joke that I did like is he like that was People protest I used to have a comedy club. There was like people protesting like a huge In front of my car. I become knocking at my door

I have like they became fans you and then they'll turn on you like that like you haven't built up enough goodwill Will's out goes out quick people like you to Humble yourself. Yes, they don't do that You are an asshole and I didn't do that because I thought it was important for comedy I think people had to know what's comedy is But I paid oh my god. I lost events. I lost money. I lost gigs. I lost a movie I lost so many but I felt there wasn't I wouldn't be real apologizing or

Playing the game, but here's the thing when you are a comedian on stage like you were apologize you are not apologize is your choice you're not hurting anyone that's why context sometime it has to be analyzed when a guy like Jimmy Kimmel has to apologize there's so many things involved with his apology if he doesn't do it if he doesn't play the game, so many people are gonna be hurt. So many people are gonna lose their jobs. If he just quit the talk show, the networks, there's so many responsibilities around this guy. So he doesn't apologize because he feels sorry.

It doesn't matter. It's Disney, he's with Disney. Yes. Yes, they be saying that. You know, that's so, so when I see a big guy apologize I know how much I lost being true to myself and I I'm like I know I know the game yeah but if you decide not to play the game you are fucked you are you like I rarely well I would say temporarily yeah it's a long but you lose a lot

but your mental state? I mean you must have that must have fucked you up pretty good I only when he when it happened was the first case of cancellation. I would say maybe in South America wouldn't I wouldn't even say Brazil it was 2010 2011 should have sent you some videos of people getting canceled here so you could watch yeah, you know This is Louie. This is you know, this is Louis, this is, you know. But that all happened after. I know, I know, I'm just joking.

You know, the thing is, there was nobody that could advise me. There was nobody for me to talk to, like, what do I do? So I just, the only thing that made me sane during that period was being funny. Wow. So I made a lot of jokes about what's happening to me. That's what you do. I did videos, I did a whole thing. I created, I was having so much fun.

And I felt that when those things happen, if you feel, and if you go down the drain, everybody around you goes with you. You bring your family, you bring your son, you bring your wife, because nobody wants you to feel sad and depressed. And I was like, I already have some money. I do what I love. I have to put in perspective, like the noise and who am I? I never raped anyone. I never

Cheated on my wife nothing and I did anything There was nothing wrong with trouble for jokes for jokes, which is my job and I have been doing this for a while Nobody said to me I needed to put in perspective or I would get crazy and people people Get crazy. They get crazy. You lose a lot. I was doing show for like 5,000 people on an arena and all of the sudden, those people are like, this guy's a fucking asshole.

People who paid to watch me, people who are my fans, stop being my- Do you think they've come back though? They've come back around? No, I don't think they did. I don't think they did. I don't think they did. What I think is that I got a very loyal fan base now. You know? Because they understood my choice. Yes. They understood my choice. It was like, okay. You lost a lot. Oh, I lost

so much. But why isn't that a struggle? We talk about like mental hurt and compassion. If Salakus calls a guy the N-word, you you have he just did just did before the show heard what you say about Pele but you know we go this this is so horrible happened to this guy fuck you and you're like yeah it is horrible happen to this guy but this guy is gonna be alright he's gonna get through it he still has a job but people still feel bad for the guy who got called the n-word You got fucked over a joke I'm painting a picture Bear with me my point is if you if a guy gets called the n-word we're like oh my god think about the mental

Anguish she went through you get canceled for something stupid that was not true and not real or it's a joke. What about your mental anguish? Why is there no pity for you? That's what I don't get. I think that's a great point. Thank you! No one cares. No one cares. Oh, we talk about his compassion. I think the N-word example was a little too radical. The N-word was bad. But they go, they go, Rafi's a millionaire, he's doing fine. But what about the mental? The black guy who got called an N-word is a millionaire. We feel bad for him, why don't we feel bad for you? Yeah, yeah. That's my point.

The N-word was a bad example. I know, I know, I'm just kidding. It was a poor choice, but it was a well-made point. Yeah, what an analogy. You made a good point. I completely understand. Yeah, why don't you get any sympathy? No sympathy, no sympathy.

No sympathy. Not at all. And you had to push through on your own and figure it out for yourself. I did have to figure it out for myself and I think I didn't hurt my own case doing jokes about it. It made it even worse. Fuck them, good.

But I was happy. I think history will show that it was the right choice and I think looking back in like 20 years or something you'll be like, man, I'm glad I did that. I think you're right. But Sam is kind of insane, he's saying that I'm doing this, what I'm doing right now, I'm glad I did that. I think you're right. But Sam is kind of insane. He's saying that I'm doing this, what I'm doing right now,

I'm performing all over the world. I just came from Europe. I'm doing something that nobody did. My people are with me. They love, they see my journey. But bro, I have nobody in the press, nobody on TV, nobody's talking about it. You think they're scared?

Nobody's talking about it. Still. Nobody're scared? Nobody's talking about it. Still. Nobody supports, no fame. How about your comedian friends? No, my comedian, but comedy in Brazil is seen as this underground movement. Unless you are a famous person, you have your talk show. I was a mainstream guy for years and years, but I wasn't happy. It's a very lonely place to be.

If you're a funny guy and you like to do comedy, as soon as you become famous and you have those responsibilities, you lose track of, you lose connection with what you love. I agree. It's amazing. I'm sure Jimmy Fallon has some very dark ideas that he wanna express.

Of course, he's big. And he can't. He can't. You live on a leash and you're not happy. So also doing a choice to like just not playing the game was me ripping up the leash. I didn't wanna be there. I wasn't happy there because fame is more.

Because you felt like you were being, it was like clean and you weren't allowed to be the real you. People are like, you cannot talk about this or that. Be careful with this or that. But here's the thing, comedy is so broad that you don't even know what is right or wrong. Because sometimes you create something.

You don't know if that thing is like, is this the one that people are going to be mad at? Right. Where do I go? Or do I just write the best bit of my career? Yeah. You don't know. Exactly.

There's not a book saying, don't talk about this. The line is invisible. You create your own line. You know? Yeah. So sometimes you like the baby joke. I would I could never imagine that that would be a problem because I did like if you see my first special and second special which was already on air at that time. It's much worse. Really? Yeah. And nobody cared about that but they chose that one. The intro is him fucking a baby. That's a crazy. I what let him talk about if you messed up, but then when I was when But then when that thing happened I felt I felt I felt free it was like a chance for me to be like

You know, I already got the money. I'm I'm I'm okay. I'm not a Millionaire, but I have enough to live. My kid is okay, he's in a good school, my wife. Where does your kid live? He lives in Brazil with my ex-wife. Were you with your wife at the time this happened? Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's stuck with you.

Yeah, she was with me. That's cool, that's huge. She was with me. Because it is very tempting, especially when you're one of the first. It's just this shit storm on top of you, and I could see a lot of spouses being like, I'm out. You're ruining my life because you're one of the first. It's just this shit storm on top of you and I could see a lot of spouses being like, I'm out, you're ruining my life

because you're fucking dumb zinger. Well, I think that's what's fascinating about what happened is you taught Brazil what a stand-up comic is and also how to stand by the courage of your convictions as a comic through a very tough time. Yes. So you taught them two things, like how to deal with the scandal as well as a comic.

Yeah, I never thought this is gonna be a lesson for the future. It was more something like, how am I gonna feel comfortable now? I'm gonna feel comfortable being funny. I know that I didn't do anything wrong. But I think the most difficult part was what Mark was saying. I even get emotional when I talk about this shit. Because my family was really, was really worried about me. Yeah.

And that's not good. When you see your father calling you and it's like, are you gonna go to jail? And then, you know? Yeah. Oh fuck, I knew that. So I get emotional when I talk about this every time I brought it up so baby

It's it's difficult is very difficult when your people around you but at the same time what an hypocrisy I am Worry about my family, but I just said that I would fuck this woman's baby so I got emotional but at the same time, she was crying. You know? When you pull out of it, you're like, this is all so fucking dumb. I know, there's nothing here.

But you gotta pull back, but it's hard because we're so insulated with it, like the Shane Gillis shit. He was on the cover of Newsweek with Harvey Weinstein and whatever, Epstein. But I'm telling you, it wasn't even about the jokes. When that thing get huge.

I think you're right. It's not about the joke anymore. It's about who is this guy that is not gonna apologize for something I think is wrong. It's more about pride. And even for that lady, cause her husband was a very important figure in Brazil. So I mess with the power. People wanted me to apologize because the guy was a very important figure in Brazil. So I mess with the power.

People wanted me to apologize because the guy was important and so he ruined my professional life in different TV networks. He would go to TV networks to say like, fire this guy, the sponsors, and they'll be like, no, so many things. I got the, so all of the sudden it's not anymore about what you said, it's about

who you're messing with, you know? Yeah, that's a whole other layer I never knew about. It's a lot. Yeah, well we sympathize and I'm glad you're okay and I think you got tougher on the other end of it, which it sucks to go through something like that and your wife's a fucking champ too for hanging in there your kids fuck She divorced me, but it's okay After a while she got tired. No, no, it wasn't because of this. Okay, okay joined a cult, but that's What about um and filmmakers are held to these standards, you know Like you do a video of a movie about a guy getting murdered or a lady getting raped

That's okay, but we make a joke about it and we're fucking probably gonna be number one. That's a good point too I mean I mean exactly I mean I love Tarantino but like no one's doing that to his movies. Yeah. They do it to comedians. Exactly. So here's a question too have there been comedians since you in Brazil who have dealt with similar stuff? Not the same but yeah. Do they reach out to you? Usually I reach out to them. Good for you. I do, I try to be like, just relax and be okay.

Everything's gonna be fine. But I think now what happened with standup is Brazil has a very left wing press. And it's kind of crazy to imagine that usually the left get more annoyed with those jokes than the right. I'm talking about politics because that's important. Well that change happened in America as well I think. It's kind of crazy that like the right wing they get, the old people get annoyed with what you're saying but at the same time he's free to do whatever he wants so the press is kind of run by the left the big networks are gonna run by by the left a little so I feel like comedy became this very

underground movement I wouldn't say underground because we are doing like 2,000 people but nobody actually openly talks about what comedy is what's happening there so that's a why another reason why people don't talk about what comedy is, what's happening there. So that's another reason why people don't talk about what I'm doing here. It's because they kind of put us in this place that is very unique. It's like you are you, and you're not part of the mainstream.

Well you know what, if anyone listens, Jason Zinem in New York Times, I don't know if you listen to this pod, but you write some good stuff, maybe you got a good opportunity for a piece right here. True. That'll be good. I think that it's easier for me to have those opportunities

like talking with the New York Times or having Dan actually make some noise in my own country now. Wow, so sad. Which is- How often do you go back? But also I wanna be a complain, like I have an amazing audience there, you know? I'm talking about the publicity and power. I lost that thing, but it was a conscious choice.

I knew that that would happen. Once I didn't play the game and apologize. It's also on me. I knew how the game worked. I decided not to play and I'm paying the price But also brought me to this amazing challenge that I'm doing right now Yeah Putting myself in the place where I'm sharing the stage with guys like you that I admire that I watch and I'm like this is so Good. I'm going to different countries. I'm building it. I'm going I'm building on this in fucking Europe

When a guy from my country will have that chance when would that happen? Yeah, no, I think it's beautiful. I think it's a great story the way you kind of came out of it And I agree with you. I think you want more mainstream success, but I don't feel like I I want it I like I want mainstream success. I want to make a show at some point that sure No, I mean look I stand up is all that matters at the end of the day. Yeah, but look at Shane, I mean this guy went through hell, he went through a similar thing, maybe not as bad, but eventually he came out the other end, now he's got to sold a show to Netflix, Tires.

So if you do you long enough, I think they'll come to you, but I'm sick of doing the let me play ball, you know, because I'm a piece of shit, I'm fucking around, I say horrible things and I don't wanna change that just in this maybe this dangling carrot of a sitcom. And isn't that the comedy spirit? I'm sick of like getting in line. A sitcom would actually, you'd make less money if you had a show. That's true too.

I think we would take a pay it. That's the funny way the way. I know. I would lose, I wanna make a show because I love the idea of making a show. It would actually hurt. Hurt your act. Hurt my act and hurt my income.

And your income. But I wanna make, I wanna do something else. I remember Chris Rock once said like, you gotta reset it, you can't only do stand up or you'll burn out. That's true. I agree with that. You gotta reset it and have a stand up. I don't agree, I don't agree with that.

Oh. I'm sorry, who am I to not agree with Chris? I understand you wanting to do that and that's amazing. You have to do whatever you want. Yes. This is a goal, you have to do it. In my experience, for a while I didn't do stand up because I was getting so many different opportunities and I ended up disconnecting with who I actually are.

That scares me too. You know? I wanna keep doing the road work. No, yeah, so don't stop doing what you do to actually go and do a show, because then you're gonna be like, all of a sudden worry about the costumes and fucking, and all of a sudden you're like,

yeah, but I wanna talk about this, and this happened on the news. You kind of disconnect from what you really want. You have to do different things, all of a sudden you're like, yeah, but I want to talk about this and this happened on the news. Yeah. You kind of disconnect from what you really want. You have to do different things. But in America, you can be huge doing standup, not necessarily doing other things. I don't think you have to do other things in America to be big. Wait, but my point is it's not about doing other things and doing standup.

I don't want to not be me. Yeah. I'm like, when I say you want to be mainstream and you're like, but I'm gonna still do stand-up, I'm not even talking about that. I'm talking about censoring myself and I'm not trying to say horrible shit. I'm not trying to sell a show to CBS.

I'm trying to sell it. I'm just saying I just, I don't want to like curb as funny as you can be, I want to be that guy. Well you just said curb. Curb myself. Okay, man. Curb your enthusiasm. If you feel like he's reeling it in,

I think you could be yourself. Yeah, he can do it. But did you ever feel that you have to pull back a little? All the time. When, when, when? I mean, every, like what you do on the morning shows, I'm like, that's comedy. You're doing comedy.

You're put in this little box and you completely break out of it at their expense and it's great. To me, that's what comedy is. And I think the more you do some mainstream stuff, the more that layer some mainstream stuff the more those that layer gets taken off of you and then you become just this cog and like a less creative thing.

Yeah. Okay you've done it so you tell me. Well yeah I mean look. I caught myself wearing a suit interviewing someone that I couldn't care less. And I'm like I'm spending my whole night talking with this person. Amazing person, good person, good heart. I couldn't care less about her life.

And I'm here wearing, I wasn't even wearing a suit. I was wearing that one piece. It was, I look like those group, those guy who works in casino. It was horrible. And I felt like, who am I? That's all I'm saying. Like Jimmy Fallon, I mean,

imagine sitting next to some two bit actor and you gotta go, ah, get outta here, we're gonna play beer pong, you fuckin' homo, or whatever, oh, I put a gun in my mouth. The whole reason we got into this is to cut loose. Not be that. Not be that. The thing about this show is we have people on

we want to have on. Yes, yes. It's a different thing. Except for Al Franken. That was rough. What? But uh. That's a different it's a different for a Franken that was wrong yeah let the guy do the show then let Sam do his show no no I'm not sure your show my mark's trying to kill the idea because it's gonna for the podcast he's thinking about himself because if he do the show, the podcast is over. Let it go, Mark.

What a selfish piece of shit. I'm doing the pod no matter what and I'm doing standup no matter what, but we'll have to backlog it if I were to do that. But yeah, I grew up loving sitcoms and stuff and if I can't do it my way, I'm not doing it. All right. Because I love standup.

So that's the thing is we have to fall back on our favorite thing. Yes, yes. I just don't want to burn out I'm on the road I agree five weeks a year for I know the last 12 13 years yeah no I hear you it's like at a certain point you're kind of like you kind of like I like the road at a certain point you're like yeah I love the road but at a certain point you're like this is gonna be my whole life no you're right and my agent hit me up a month ago I was like you can't do this when you're 66.

Like you gotta have something to fall back on, and he's right. And you wanna have, I like when musicians have a catalog and have done different types of shit. I wanna do different types of shit, but I only wanna do, like if I can't make it my way, you know, I'm trying to make a show with Mike Lawrence right now, and I love it.

I love what we have. If I can't't sell it just gonna line up the whole year, so right right we're in a good place But but you're doing it your way, and that's the key We'll see we'll see what happens. Well. That's what they do guy. Who's on When the whistle blows Ricky Gervais remember that? I'm on the worst show of all time. Don't do a multi-cam. No, I won't. I have no, I mean, can you picture me in a multi-cam? I don't know.

Honey, I'm home. Ah! And to each camera. Where's Wengie? Ah! Ah, Bunsen. Say it into each camera, please. Yeah, oh.

Ah, yeah. Oh, I'm glad you're at least, you're doing what you wanna do. No, I wanna do it, yeah, but like, so you're like, I mean, can you go back to Brazil? Yeah, I go that a lot. Do you get recognized like crazy though when you go back? I do I do Yeah, I do. What's that like? I mean for a while it was good. I couldn't I I don't I don't I don't care that much anymore I like the people now

I feel like I have a new appreciation for the people who like me because it's like oh Because every time that someone see me is not like oh, I'm a big fan Now I feel like I have a new appreciation for the people who like me, because it's like, oh, because every time that someone see me, it's not like, oh, I'm a big fan. It's like, bro, I'm your fan since they say the date, because they're like, I've been through all of that. And I'm with you. So I feel a new appreciation. But it's kind of annoying after a while.

I don't have the same fame as a guy like Jimmy Fallon has in America. Sure. The TV station that I had, my TV shows were not the biggest one, so I'm not this guy who just cannot walk on the streets. But being in another country comfortable with like, you know that nobody's looking at you at the restaurant, it's pretty sweet. Anonymity is underrated, but you're 6'5". No matter where you go. No, he's 6'7". I'm 6'6". 6'6", 6'7". So people don't mess that much. Yeah, yeah. It's a little more comfortable. But I like to be here because it even withstands the

fact that people don't know me. It's great. One thing is going on stage with people knowing who you are. OK, when Chris Rock step on stage at the cellar or in another comedy club just to do a pop-up or he just showed up, I'm pretty sure at the end of the day, he wanted to be just play for people who couldn't care about him. That's why he's testing his material there, not in an arena. He wants to have an honest reaction. Yes. I Reset my whole life to have an honest. I love that. That's a real comic

I went here I came here and Stepping on stage without people knowing who I am It's the best is the best because you you know if something is funny or not you know they're not left just because it's you I think you guys are in this place right now when you go on those in this place like if you go to the sale people know who you are yeah at least I would say at least 50% of people there kind of follows comedy watch one special or another one depends. 30, 25 percent I a did a theater in Knoxville and my opener goes

there's a bar show down the street if you want to get on I can get you on I go yeah fuck it I'll drink at the bar uh-huh I wanted to get a drink anyway so it's at a bar let's go they didn't know who I was and I'll tell you when you go on in front of people who don't know you you don't realize how dark you are compared the other comics are like, so my dog is cute and all that, and I went up there and I was like, what's going on with the pedophile? And they're like, what's this guy's deal?

And I'm like, oh, you don't know I'm not a psycho. My audience knows I'm not a psycho. So when I do the pedophile chunk, they're like, that's a funny take. But these guys are like, we should arrest this dude. Pays this motherfucker. But Knoxville, great crowd, right? Great crowd, great crowd.

That's like a fucking great city for comedy. That's good. Yeah, but I got them, but it was like a splash of cold water. Like, oh, I gotta play ball, I gotta tap dance, I gotta get these people on my side and then do the pedophile thing. Oh yeah, I can't open with an abortion. I opened with a pedo out of the gate. I was like, this is an idea I thought of, and they're like, who?

What? I've done that before too, the heat check. Where you've had a few good sets in a row, and you're like, let me open with a kid fucking joke, and then just silence, like, oh yeah. I gotta earn these. And everybody's in the back like, this guy's doing the theater? This one sucks, this guy should be in jail.

That's good, that's funny. So speaking of, do you guys working on any bits? We do a thing like working on bits. Oh, you watched the show. I did, I did, yeah. Do you have a bit you want? I have, I'm trying for a few weeks already this joke, which is my wife, she got, when we moved to New York,

she got really depressed and she lost 20 pounds. Nice. Never looked so hot. Ha ha ha ha ha ha. And now I'm in this conundrum where like, I want her to get better, but not really. That's funny. Cause you know, so. You're trying to weigh the pros and cons,

you're like, I mean, look, when she was happy, her tits were bigger. You're weighing the pros and cons and her. Yeah. She wants to go through therapy, I'm like, do you really need therapy? I feel like I kind of lose half of the crowd when I say this. Even if I find the...

I need to be really loving with my wife before I start saying this. That's when I kind of found something, you know? I really love my wife, but I am living in this moment which is really, really difficult, I wanna share with you. And then people are like, okay, he loves his wife, but there's something that annoys him. Even that is not enough.

You know what you should say, in some way you should say, well, you know, she's happy now, she gained the weight back. She divorced me. Oh yeah, twist it on him. Yeah, twist it, maybe. Yeah, yeah, it's weird how sadness makes you lose weight. You know, there could be something in that too, just exploring that whole thing.

It works both ways, you didn't get sad and get fat. Oh, that's true, you're right. You can go both ways. Yeah, see that's worth it. Most people after divorces and stuff, they lose weight. Go to the gym. Yeah. They know they gotta get out there.

Maybe that's another path that I can go like when you people just care about their bodies when they don't have a partner. It's kind of crazy. Yeah. Isn't it weird like I love you, I'm getting fat. But no, you should be thin now because you love me. Yeah, yeah. You know?

So that's a whole other angle. There's something there. And then maybe you could talk about how that happened to you so now you take it off her. Because if you make it about women, it would be weird about weight. What do you got? Oh, can can I ask him can you do one in Portuguese because they're trying to go viral in Brazil ah you pointed us when you want us to laugh just like now and then we'll start laughing I want the the joke that I would say that a fuck her and the baby in in Portugal oh yeah yeah Point it at us when you want us to laugh. What I said was, what I said was, eu comeria ela e o bebê.

Oh! Sure, you gotta go. That's not funny. It sounds even less offensive when you say bebê. Bebê. It does. Bebê. I got one I have an idea about.

So I was reading a thing about Ted Bundy, who's the serial killer, which I said that on stage, I said, oh, the serial killer, that gotta laugh too that on stage is there the serial killer that gotta laugh, too I was like Yeah, so but uh You know he was technically adopted as he was raised by his mom who remarried so this guy adopts Ted Bundy Which like man talk about like a bad adoption Like you either it's like winning. That's like the opposite of winning the lottery. You're like you got a raised Ted Bundy

Yeah, you're just like you're just trying to fuck this kid's mom, and then you have to look in the other room You're like can you stop strangling that cat? Something about that and it's horrible PR for adopting I know I'm not adopted this kid got fucking gasey got Bundy. Yeah It is hilarious that you adopt and you get a serial killer right you, you do the, no good deed goes unfunnished. You can try to be a nice person. But maybe- But maybe-

But maybe- Yeah. I just understand. Oh yeah. David Burtwoods, yeah. But maybe, but maybe when he grows up, the guy just get the good parts. Like my kid became a celebrity.

Oh, that's funny. He doesn't talk about what really happens. Like he's a celebrity, everybody, he has a series on Netflix. Yeah, that's good. He's big, he's doing well. That's great. I had an old bit about like being bitter,

about like, you know, you think like serial killers are bitter about the, like when they're on, they're like three murders in five years, I could fuck it. I should be the one on Netflix. That's great. I have this joke about serial killers saying that we have the same dream, comedians and serial killers, which is having a special on Atlas.

You don't wanna be a serial killer with a documentary on peacock. You know? Oh, you killed one guy with a knife, you're going on Hulu, you piece of shit. Put in open mic'er? Yeah. There could be something too about just saying the best parts, like, oh, Ted Bunny, that

guy's killing it. Yeah. You're not lying. You're just saying all the things he's doing, but you put a positive slant on him. Yeah, what do you got, Mark? All right. This is, I've never talked about this, never tried it, so this is real raw. But I went on a safari with my wife.

We went to South Africa. In a safari you get the jeep out in the jungle with a tour guide who tells you everything and a tracker which is like a dude who sits on the hood and he's like tracking the animals footprints and what they're doing and the tour guide was a woman and the tracker was like this African guy and I'm like shouldn't the woman be the tracker? I know anything about women they know where everybody's going who they're looking through your phone their whole thing is tracking you know they're like where were you last night I saw you here I checked your photos can you play it now that's that's funny but okay can you play with the type of animals and what they do and gossip yes you can go on. So the giraffe doing this, like gossip.

Yes. And going the gossip way. Like a different leopard. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Yeah, the woman shouldn't be driving. She should be tracking. Could be something there. Yeah, there's something interesting about,

I mean you have such a good version of this bit with like the female detective. Oh yeah. It's just I feel like you've done bits like this that are so fucking good. Too similar. No, it's not even too similar, it's just you gotta find the perfect angle. Oh yeah. I feel like you've done bits like this that are so fucking good. Too similar. No it's not even too similar, it's just you've got to find the perfect angle. Right.

You're now in the area where all are, we're ripping off our own old bits. Yeah. There's only so much shit you can joke about. But there's something, say the tracker part again. Well there's a guide and a tracker, and the woman was the guide. I'm like, she should be tracking, because women are great at figuring out where you were and they know footsteps and who did what. They shouldn't be telling you where you're going, because women are great at figuring out where you were, and they know footsteps and who did what. They shouldn't be telling you where you're going,

because women are always like, where's this going? Oh, yeah. Something like that. They should be the one, I like the idea about the animal, like gossip. Right, right. All right, let me try a different one. This one's quick.

Me and the wife are trying to have a baby, and some of these attempts, because you're really trying, so the passion is gone. You're just trying to have a baby. And doesn't it seem like the better the sex, the better the kid? Like doesn't it seem like if you have hungover, sideways sex, this kid's gonna be fucking,

this kid's gonna be an idiot. Like doesn't it seem like they should correlate? Like that was some great fucking, that's gonna be a genius. Instead of like, ah, we banged in the bathroom for four seconds, that kid's gonna be a genius instead of like ah we banged in the bathroom for four seconds that kid's gonna be in a wheelchair. You're in rehab and you're like you didn't happen to fuck on a Sunday morning. Yeah right right. So there's something, there's some idea there. That's a funny angle. Correlation. It doesn't seem like it's a good way to go into it.

Doesn't seem like good sex really equal a good kid. Don't you get annoyed when you see like an asshole with a kid. I see that when I see that, I'm not an asshole, like a lazy slob with a beautiful kid. I'm like, how can this guy have a good kid? And me, I'm young, I have so much testosterone and nothing's happening Nothing that's love have this this bread beat of a kid

The hottest ever I'm sorry another joke about babies Sightfully you talk about the Ted Bundy, you know the murderers I feel like great, but he's like, you know, Bozo the clown Do we really need the clown? Like Bozo the district attorney That was from the beginning of the show by the way, that's good. Yeah old school I saw cypher the goth in the other day and he saw and I was doing the the juice the comedy juice and uh Which is also a great show on Tuesday at Gotham,

people should check. But. Great show. That is good. And he did a chunk of a stand up that was in the pilot of his series. The pilot, the in and out and out and in and at. And I'm on the subway, I'm in the car, I'm in the,

I was like this isn't the pilot of the he didn't it two thousand and twenty nineteen ninety nineteen eighty nine nineteen eighty nine and then every time I see him talking he's like you gotta write you gotta write I write every day I'm like where is this writing well maybe open with an oldie and then you I don't know but, but He's also a guy who like, he doesn't believe in retiring jokes That's true He's also one where he's like, no you're always working on a joke But if I had a joke that was 25 years old, I think I'm done with it I don't even remember it

Yeah I just forget that shit I did some old shit at Benefit recently, but like, you're just like, what's It's funny, the oldest shit you have is sometimes the broadest Uh huh, uh huh, of course You're just like, let me the oldest shit you have is sometimes the broadest you're just like let me throw this in like as a crowd pleaser if it's like a corporate or something yeah of course but like so do you go there and study those jokes again you try to put rehearsing on the front of the mirror or something or just i will literally go to my phone and try to find old footage i do that and i'm like i'm like trying to relearn old bits of my act

but like no i mean look I'm on the road. I'm doing either new stuff or the newest stuff for the most part, but like yeah, it's nice to have those weapons when you're going into a hell gig. Oh yeah, I'm doing a corporate gig tonight and they're like clean. What gigs are you doing tonight?

Five. Oh my god. Jesus Christ. Seven o'clock Gotham, so I guess it's not comedy juice, but they're like, I got the email today be clean I was like now you tell me so now I gotta go watch some old Conan's and Falon's just to like get back in there I hate a last minute be clean. Hey the last minute That's like the hey, I'm on my period now you tell me

Do you feel like you're always working in your new hour? Always okay constant although he just put one out so well always working in your new hour? Always. Okay. Constant. Although he just put one out, so. Well, I didn't put one out, I taped one. Oh, sorry. Not until July. And how much you have in the new one now that you recorded the one now?

Well, I'm not doing, I'm trying to do like none of it at the cellar, but if I'm on the road, I'd have to do some of the old stuff just to survive. I don't wanna put on a cellar, but if I'm on the road, I'd have to do some of the old stuff just to survive. I don't want to put on a bad show. But also you're on the road doing a new hour? No, no, no, no. If I'm at the comedy cellar, I'll do all new.

But I just taped this, you know, last month. Okay, so it's still performing that hour. You're still performing the hour that you just recorded. Yeah, but I mean, you keep, you know, the new keeps coming and you keep overtaking it. Like you keep shuffling out, you're like, oh, I didn't love that one from last time, I'm sick of that one. That's like the oldest, that was the first one I wrote.

That's out. Yeah, yeah. Nice, okay. Yeah, cause I've been asking myself, if clips and little pieces are working so well, what is the real importance of having a special now? Because I know, well you guys have a whole thing with like big social media and an hour is important and it became, it becomes more like I want to

just have this hour so I can start fresh but also like clips and stuff are working so well that sometimes I'm just thinking, am I gonna throw just an hour in the wild? I think the hope is that someone watches the whole thing, the whole show, and that it's a thing, but you're right, I mean, yeah, clips are kinda taken over. But there is a theory that these clips will fade. This is like a clip boom we're in, and it will fizzle out.

Yeah, but I don't think so, because that's the way people are consuming content right now. It's not that we are jamming clips and nobody cares. No, no, no. That's the way people are consuming. I was able to build an audience just with the clips because nobody was searching for me. The clips, it's a good way for every performer, not only comedians, to just pop up in people's

lives. Of course. So when people are swiping, if I have a good hook in the beginning, that's why sometimes I see comedians and friends posting things that I think are so good, but sometimes it's starting a funny way, it's starting a crazy way, like the first sentence doesn't make sense because- I have age, like what? Gotta watch the whole. But that's good. That's a good hook, that's a good hook.

That's a hook, that'll grab ya. But sometimes I see clips starting with, and also. So I can see that he's cutting for a special. There's a whole story. So sometimes if I wanna post something real quick, like a 40 seconds, it's better for me to just put it in the middle of my set at the village underground. So I can, sometimes I write the joke in a way that I don't do it on stage. Just for the clip. Wow.

That has a good hook. I rewrite just to make it interesting for people who don't know who I am. Well, the problem is clips can be misleading. Anybody can have a funny minute. He's not even a comic. He could figure out a funny minute, clip it, and then is he going to sell out of the club when he goes viral and he has no hour? So you still need an hour. It's nice to show you got a good hour.

I think, yeah, it's like you promote an hour. I think for me it's like, that's the process. You tape the hour, you start fresh. Tape another hour, you start fresh. But that's just, you know that because that's the way it's been that's the process. You tape the hour, you start fresh. Tape another hour, you start fresh. But that's just, you know that because that's the way it's been done for 40 years. But they benefit each other. The clip can benefit the hour,

the hour you can get clips out of the hour. Yeah. So I think they're- There are people like, oh, he has a full special, we should watch it. I think you might, your friend might send the clip, but I think it's like a thing. People are like, we should watch this special together.

You know, you see it on Amazon or Netflix or HBO or whatever. Yeah, that's good when it's when it's when it's in a in a big platform that works even if it's like you have big channels on YouTube. Yeah, that works. You already have people there that are going to watch you there. You have in your Netflix. Sometimes it's like number four and then people watch because they don't know what it is, right? But on Netflix, it's an active process you click you have options Yeah for you to click on the cell phone people are swiping all of the sudden you are invading their lives

Yeah, so it's an easier way for you to become For them to become your fans because it's an easier way for you to become for them to become your fans because it's like you're surprising them with your content and the craze is when I hit the for you page and it's tits tits tits new comedian whoa that made my for you page so I will watch it and it really kills a boner it's you know John Panetta or whatever, but still You're right. They they I wasn't asking for it and I got it and I watched it. Yeah, but he's got the best tits anyway Do you have any you have any dates you want to plug? Are you hitting the road coming up? Well, I have it on my website

I'm doing LA. I don't when we're gonna post this cell, you know, no, it's our date two weeks two weeks So I'm LA just focus on LA. I'm trying to do a good show at the Netflix Festival on the sixth, yeah. May sixth, in Los Angeles. May sixth, and I'm doing Cleveland, Buffalo, Philadelphia, Raleigh, Charlotte, Miami, Austin. All over the place.

In Portland, I am doing it. I'm trying to build an audience in America. It's not the easiest thing. No, but you're doing it. Because I am an immigrant, so I feel like in every show, it's my people, it's Mexican people, it's Latino people, it's a lot of Eastern Europe people like Croatia and Slovenia, those people love what I do,

but I really wanted to build an audience of American people because I perform for Americans every night and it works so I wish I could have more of an American audience but LA, May 6th, please come. Go see Rafi, he's very funny. Pillar Act. Thank you very much my friend. These are Mark's dates.

Oh geez, sorry. Buffalo, Minneapolis, Madison, we added shows there. Evansville, Bloomington, I'm doing with David Telkals at the Connecting Flights Tour. I'm going to all these weird little towns. LA, I'll see you there, fatty. Coachella at a casino, that's gonna be tough. Victoria, Vancouver, we added shows.

Royal Oak, Fort Wayne, West Palm, Fort Myers, Bean Town, Boston. Wolf. Yeah, Pittsburgh, or is that Philly? Where the hell's Munhall? I don't even know. It's close to Pittsburgh. Okay, Seattle and Spokane, Mark Norman comedy.

Or Punch Up Live, Mark Norman. There you go, go to Punch Up. Follow us on PunchUp.live. Mark Norman and PunchUp.live. Sam Morell. You know, I added shows that aren't up there yet. Ooh, here we go. Back at it. Nice. Yeah, we added, we got Atlantic City, June 22nd. We got Brea, June 7th through 9th.

I don't know why they're out of order. We got Rochester, June 27th through 29th. And the week, I believe it's the 13th through 15th of June, Miami Improv just added. So I'll see you there. Nice, and just follow me on Instagram, raffycomedy.com. Lots of good clips, follow raffy there. Rye Bodega Cat at bodegacatwhiskey.com. Gonna be very close to being legal. We love you and I don't know how you got there but I love it.

The worst photo of me in all time but thank you. I love you, thanks guys. Thank you, comedy! Up on the roof like a cop's comin' And naked Samuel is feelin' dangerous I'm out to lunch here in New Orleans This woman doesn't look like I remember her And I get down in the same way We might be true