WTF with Marc Maron Podcast - Episode 834 - Rory Scovel / Maz Jobrani

Episode Date: August 2, 2017

Rory Scovel is from the South, he was born into a legacy of postal workers, and one of his first jobs was in production at a local TV station. It's all great background material for a comedy career, which is probably why Rory and Marc have such a thorough conversation about doing the job of comedy, from the grind of working on the road to the art of being a warm-up comic to the craft of making an hour-long stand-up special. Also, Maz Jobrani is back to talk about being a comedian and immigrant in Trump's America. Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer. I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category,

and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative. Lock the gates! Alright, let's do this. How are you what the fuckers, what the fuck buddies, what How are you, what the fuckers?

What the fuck, buddies? What the fucking ears? What the fuck, Knicks? What the fuck, Topians? What's happening? How are you? I'm Mark Maron. This is my podcast.

All right, so on the show, on the show, on the show today, I got Maz Jabrani for a little chat about his new special maz jabrani immigrant and then after that we got the long one with rory scoville about his new special called rory scoville tries stand up for the first time but before that before before those, I was very sad about Sam Shepard dying. It hit me when I saw it come up on the newsfeed. Sam Shepard dies. Horrible disease. That ALS.

I just. But Sam Shepard is gone. You know, these guys of his generation. You know, my heroes, many of our heroes. I mean, I'm 53 you know they're they're going and it's not like i've been up to speed it's not like i've been keeping up but i always like knowing they're here you know i like you know when they die i'm like oh then that guy's not here it's not that i'm thinking about him every day but sam shepherd's not here. It's not that I'm thinking about him every day. But Sam Shepard's not here.

Sam Shepard. That guy blew my fucking mind. I was trying to wrap my brain around Sam Shepard for a decade or two. I was in high school. I was working at this bagel place across from the college. This dude Judson. Judson Frondorf, hell of a name, was doing a production in this kind of like weird beat up theater space of Tooth of Crime.

Now, I don't remember if he was in it. I know this painter, I think his name was ray abeta played crow the the woman i lost my virginity to she was in it she was a waitress at the place um cheryl i remember that but i just remember going to this theater with all these college kids in this already fucking space and that play, which is nearly incomprehensible, sort of a sci-fi rock and roll. Uh, I don't know. It's a mixture of, you know, like fighting and charts and chart makers and rock. I, it was, I, I still don't know. I don't know. I've never gone back to read it, but I remember seeing it

and just having that moment where I'm like, what the fuck is going on? They're all talking and I don't understand any of it, but it's cool. It's cool as shit. The language is fucking amazing.

Everybody seems kind of fucked up and groovy and it's like it means something. It's. And it's like, it means something. It's got to mean something. This all means something. It's so far out of my wheelhouse as a teenager, but it just was one of those portals, man, was one of those portals into like, Oh God, there's something out there, something big. And then, you And then you kind of lean into it. You get the seven plays book. Try to read La Trista. Barry Child.

Try to read those early plays. They're just rich and dense. Sam Shepard blew my mind. I was obsessed. Then he shows up in the right stuff. And you're like, that's Sam Shepard. Not only is he a cool fucking kind of drug rock cowboy fucking hipster genius, he can act like an astronaut or a test pilot who became an astronaut on his own.

Yeah. That scene where Chuck Yeager pushes that new plane out and hits it, just barely got out to almost out of the atmosphere and into orbit. He was like, fuck you. I can drive my own plane into space. You assholes got a stick of Beeman's. Yeah,

man, Sam Shepard. I did that failed monologue for Yale from a stamp. Sam Shepard play. I don't remember what it was from angel city or something. I just love seeing him. He was so cool. So solid on screen in those plays.

Just spent like, it feels like a lifetime just trying to break into some of those early plays. I saw Barry Child on Broadway, Gary Sinise's production. Terry Kinney. And I tell a story about it. That was the night.

Such an intense, heavy play. And there's that scene where that character, Walt, comes in with all the corn he picked. And the night I was there, you know, he drops the corn. And one of the corns just rolled all the way downstage. Right to the lip of the stage. And it was a powerful moment because two things happened there was that you know incomprehensible tableau of everybody in the room and he walks in with the corn and you're like what the fuck is going on and in the meantime he's slowly being upstaged

by a rolling ear of corn well a lot like the the corn was like i'm gonna riff corn the corn rift and buried child on broadway didn't last so long it was a beautiful production but it's just one of those things man it's just like i know i i gotta you just gotta deal now with a shepherdless earth with a sam shepherdless earth and a shepherdless earth in a lot of ways let's read into it let's let's keep rolling with the metaphor right maz jabrani has been on this show several times i like maz a lot and uh he's got a new comedy special out and he said can i come on talk about it and i said yeah and we had some pretty relevant stuff to talk about he's

iranian he's been doing some stuff on stage about trump's policies and it was good i i wanted to talk to him and i'm glad he came by his new special uh, Maz Jabrani, Immigrant, is now streaming on Netflix. And this is a little shorty with me and Maz. Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly, host of Under the Influence. Recently, we created an episode on cannabis marketing. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. With cannabis legalization, it's a brand new challenging marketing category. And I want to let you know we've produced a special bonus podcast episode where I talk to an actual cannabis producer.

I wanted to know how a producer becomes licensed, how a cannabis company competes with big corporations, how a cannabis company markets its products in such a highly regulated category, and what the term dignified consumption actually means. I think you'll find the answers interesting and surprising. Hear it now on Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly. This bonus episode is brought to you by the Ontario Cannabis Store and ACAS Creative.

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Oz. So I saw you at the comedy store the other night, and so you're doing some stuff about being Iranian, Persian. I've always talked about that. No, no, no, but I mean just in relation to the new president. Yeah. And I was wondering because, you know, you do this thing about the cousin, the shitty cousin. Yeah, yeah. Not who you throw under the bus president. Yeah. And I was wondering, because, you know, you do this thing about the, you know, the cousin, the shitty cousin.

Yeah, yeah. Not who you throw under the bus in the second year. He's the real problem. Majid. Majid. Does that guy really exist? He exists.

And if you listen to the language of it, I'm not throwing him under the bus. I'm actually saying, because in the middle of it, I go, because what I try to do is, because here's the thing. A lot of people,

I'm guessing a lot of Trump supporters and the sort, they hear Muslim, Islam, all this stuff, and they stuff and they just they go oh you're all trying to bring sharia law to america i don't know what they think dude they just don't like brown people of any kind don't like brown people it's crazy and so then i'm trying to indicate that look i am i was born in a muslim country but i'm not really religious no right and i so i just say i'm muslim ish and then but then i go one step further and i try to indicate that there is this guy named majid who really exists yeah who is a muslim and he prays five times a day yeah and he fast during ramadan and he's the sweetest guy in the world

right but in the joke i go well you know he's gotta go he's gotta go and then i go i didn't say trump said he's gotta go um so yeah so poor majid yeah but i but i like the i think it's interesting though to you know because they're i think the bigger idea that a lot of them hold on to is there's no such thing as moderate Muslims. Yeah. But, you know, as I've known you and I hear you talk and I've known you for a few years now, there are such things as Muslims that just kind of give half a shit. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's like religion's not part of my life. Not at all.

Exactly. And it's more like a cultural, like. Right, right. You go to weddings. You go to the holiday thing. Yeah. You go eat the feast once in a while. Yeah.

And then you're like, oh, that's it. That's enough. That's it. Exactly. And it's like, and it's interesting because the reason I started really specifically saying that I'm not really religious is because I also didn't want people from the Muslim side to come see me and have a tequila in my hand and they're going, why are you drinking?

If you're Muslim, you shouldn't be drinking alcohol. Does that happen? No, not quite that far. I feel like I've done events that have been clean, meaning really religious, and I've felt a little awkward there because I feel like there's some jokes I can't even do. For example, the joke I do now where I say I'm Muslim-ish and I go, and then I go, the only time I pray is if I'm almost in an accident. And then I just go, oh, Jesus.

And you don't feel like you can do that joke? In front of a fully Muslim crowd? Like, you know what I'm saying? I don't know what you're saying. I'm supposed to do like there's like a. Like you're saying like if I were performing for Hasidedum exactly and i was doing like oh who doesn't eat a little pork yeah exactly exactly i think i just think that there's some but it's not like you'd be punished you just it wouldn't go over well it wouldn't go over well i think i didn't

i don't think they'd laugh you know i used to do a joke this actually i did this there was some muslim festival i think they would laugh at that one but that that's the thing it's the young guy the young people tend to laugh, but then you always feel like there's a big group judging you. But this is the interesting thing about being a non-religious, ethnically Jewish person, is that I'm never going

to be in a situation where I'm performing for a crowd, even if it's a Jewish crowd, where I'm like, too many Hasidim here. I guess the line is a little different. There's a whole crowd where I'm like, too many Hasidim here. Yeah. I guess that the line is a little different. Like, you know, there's a whole spectrum of Jews. Yeah. You know, you got Hasidim, you got Orthodox, you got ultra Orthodox, and you got conservative,

you got the reform. But like, you know, once you get to conservative, it's all just sort of like, yeah, I'm kind of Jewish. But there's never this situation where it's like these guys and those guys. Well, yeah, but see, that's the thing. The difference is, I mean, I agree. A lot of the shows I do, my audiences tend to be mixed. Once in a while, there's a couple of religious folks, but usually they're all very secular

or even if they're religious, they're not hardcore. Right. But I've been hired before. I got hired to do some Muslim fest a few years ago. Here? It was in Toronto. Oh in Toronto okay and it was a thing I suppose to go back again and and when I did that one just simple jokes that for example like in Islam if you convert out of Islam yeah that's one of the worst things right and so there was a joke I used to do about how when you have a when you have a taught a newborn you try to sing her I was trying to sing my baby to sleep and

she wouldn't fall asleep. Right. And at one point, I'm just going, Lord Jesus Christ, please put her to sleep. And then I go, I'm not even Christian. Jesus put her to sleep. And then I go, the first God that puts her to sleep, I'll convert. Now, that's a joke that normally gets a laugh. There.

But in that audience, the first God that puts her to sleep, I'll convert. He felt it. I feel the gasp. Like, what? Oh, my God. Convert? Did he just say convert? Like, you know.

Yeah. And I don't know, again, maybe, you know how comedians are. We're like, oh, my God, I just got judged by, you know, half the crowd. Yeah. Well, no, I know that feeling. But I just think it's interesting because in Toronto, there's, like, from what I understand, there's friction. from what I understand, there's friction. And here, I guess, but I think the thing that fascinates me is that there's a lot of people that come from a lot of Muslim countries

that just want to be American. Yeah. And it's not, you know, religious freedom is one thing, and they should have that. But ultimately, they're like, look, I'm just, you know, we do the dinners. Absolutely. You know what I mean? No, absolutely.

And that's why, like, I mean, I try to make a point now when I, even in my act, a lot of times I say immigrants love America. There's a reason why we can't. We are fleeing that country. Like when I was a kid and I came to America in late 78. We don't want Sharia law here. That's why we left. That's why we left.

That's why we left. We fled the revolution. We come here. Then the hostage crisis happens. And then they're blaming me for taking hostages. No, I don't know that guy. I don't know that guy. That's why we left.

That's why I left. We would have been hostages. We would have been killed. Whatever. I'm on your side. Yeah. So, but let me ask you, though, like, in relation to these limited bans that they've established, has there been any effect on people you know

or relatives that you have in Iran? Yeah, I actually, I have a, well, not in Iran. I have a relative right now who's sick and in the hospital in America. And then I have an aunt who wanted to come and see her. Where is she? She's in London. She's a British citizen, but she's visited Iran.

So she got put on this list. Now the list, by the way, the history goes back to when the San Bernardino attacks happened, there was a Congress passed a law that took this. It was a visa waiver that existed before that said, if you have a British passport, you come, you land, you come in. But Congress suddenly put, I don't know, 30 some odd 40 countries on a list saying that they don't get the visa waiver.

If you are- If your passport's stamped with those countries. Yeah. If you've visited those countries in the past five years, you got to go get a visa. So when my aunt wants to come, she's got a British passport. She wants to come from England to America. She needs to get a special visa because she had been in Iran in the past five years just visiting relatives and so on.

So, yeah, I got affected directly. Now, that was something that was done under the Obama administration. And that's an argument that a lot of Trump supporters make. They go, when you go, hey, this Muslim ban, this travel ban is stupid. Well, they go, well, these countries were put on the list from Obama. And then I go, well, then my answer to you is then why didn't you correct it? Why don't you really look at the countries where there's terrorists coming in from and correct that? Because a lot of Iranians that come here.

I can't believe you've had that thoughtful a conversation with Trump supporters. No, I think about it. I don't tell. You're making up a conversation. Yeah. Maybe you guys should do a little of work and correct it. Yeah, exactly. Well, I liked the new material like I saw the other night.

Well, I like the new material, like I saw the other night, and it's just, it's sort of, just the approach to it is sort of like, what are you doing? Absolutely. I mean, that's, listen, that's what's so, it is so confusing to me is that these people, like you just said, a lot of the people who buy the Kool-Aid, the Trump Kool-Aid, really don't, they really don't, there's no logic there. They don't step back and go. It's very black and white. Very black and white. Get out of my country. Why don't you go back to your country?

I left that country because I love this country. I probably love the American freedoms more than you love the American freedoms. Well, that's actually been, I think, historically true with a lot of immigrant communities. Yeah. That they're more patriotic and more grateful in a way that this country was their salvation from horror. Absolutely. I say like this. I was riffing the other night and I go, you know, make America great again. I'm like, America already is great, asshole.

You want to see how great America is? Go see Egypt. How about make Egypt great again? They used to be, you know, they had they had their own empire like now you could buy a house for a dollar i mean it's like you know and it's and it's and and the other thing is i i said this when he first started when he first started i said i said i feel like i could sit down at a dinner with him and have disagreements and then move on with my life oh yeah well he he'll waffle on anything yeah like he'll uh like there's a lot of comics that know him pretty well.

I mean, Jeff Ross hung out with the guy on his plane. Yeah, exactly. And he said he's like, he makes you feel great, that guy. I'm sure he's got some charisma and you feel good. But my worry was his supporters, and now my worry is obviously him as well, but his supporters. I thought that these people taking his words for face value. So then you hear the story of the guy in Kansas who takes a gun and shoots two Indian dudes

and then goes and says, I just shot two Iranians. He doesn't even know who he shot. And he's shit-faced and mad about something else. Yeah. And those two Indians, I read the whole story. There was a whole article on it. One of them died, one of them survived. There were Indians who'd come to America to be engineers and they were just leading.

They were trying to live the American dream. Yeah. And also, help America the American dream. Yeah. And also help America. Help America. Yeah. I mean, this is where smart, good things happen. Yeah, absolutely. We're putting an end to that.

Yeah, exactly. It's just shamelessly dumb now. Yeah. So I find myself sometimes in my standup having like serious moments now. I actually, I feel like I can get away from, like one of the things I say, I go, he needs to start taking responsibility for his words. He doesn't. He doesn't. And the next day he goes, it was just a joke.

I was just saying words. The generals did it. Like, you know, I mean, he's been sort of, we've all been sort of blessed that nothing horrendously horrible has happened where he actually has to lead and bring Americans together around a thing. Even the travel ban, what you just said, exactly what you just said. Because one of my arguments was why did they, if they really wanted to do the travel ban, if they didn't want to hurt regular ordinary people, they could have said, look, within the next 60 days, if you don't have a visa, we're not letting anybody else in.

Why was it immediate? Because he likes to, like like that's a authoritarian trick it's an authoritarian but then he's such a jackass that he turns around and goes well my uh my exactly my the the police the authorities told me that if we had warned people then isis would have had a lead time to then come in i go isis are criminals you can if you ban seven countries they'll create a passport from one of the countries that's not banned, a fake passport, and they'll still come in. And also, it had nothing to do with ISIS.

It had nothing to do with ISIS. It was just, you know, he's riled up, you know, a small percentage, larger than you want it to be, of this country's anger and fear, and he honors them. Well, you know what was sad was when I, because I talk about, again, going to the protest. I went to the LAX protest, and I was watching all the news all over the country. There was protests, and I felt like, oh, wow, Americans got it.

They realized what a sham this travel ban is. Then that night, I'm listening to the radio, and they go, a majority of Americans still support the travel ban. And it hit me that what you just said, listen, people have their day-to-day lives. They're busy, whatever, on Instagram or whatever they're doing. of americans still support the travel ban yeah and it hit me that what you just said listen people have their day-to-day lives they're busy whatever on instagram or whatever they're doing i wish they were more paying attention they're not paying attention so they go oh uh keep terrorists out

of the country sure let's do it that's good yeah i don't want terrorists here jesus christ yeah it's scary dude so what's going on with your aunt um well my aunt was was she's now she had to go then to a to a visa interview and she's waiting to find out i'm hoping that they let her in like i said you know it's uh it's the woman's sister no it's actually uh my sister who's not doing well i'm sorry yeah yeah yeah so yeah but but it's but but it just piggybacked on top yeah was this this thing that she couldn't get a visa to come here she needed a visa to come here. She needed a visa to come here. She's British.

She's a British citizen. Yeah. So it's just, it's angering to another level. And it's also bureaucratic. It's like, it's bureaucratic and it's complicated and it's, ugh. Listen, that day I got so many people hitting me with emails of their personal stories. There was, when the travel ban, that day that it happened, one guy hit me with emails of their personal stories uh there was a when the travel ban that day that it happened yeah uh one guy hit me up he goes my parents

were elderly they were one of the first couples that landed at lax when the ban took effect the the border patrol had them sign away they waived their visa right they didn't know what they were doing they were signed a paper thinking oh this will get us in but in reality what it said was we waive our visas. They put them back on a plane and sent them back to Iran. And they can never come back now. Well, no,

they eventually, because the courts then started challenging it, he got them in as soon as he could. They like came in. Yeah. But there's people in limbo, right?

There was another lady, she hits me up. This was crazy because when America did the travel ban, Iran reciprocated and said, we're not going to let any Americans into Iran.

Yeah. So a lady wrote me. She goes, listen, I'm an Iranian who was studying in India. I met my American husband in India. We're married now. Yeah. We got an interview for me to get my green card, so we had to go to Turkey to the embassy there. She goes, we landed in Turkey. We got another email saying that our interview had been canceled.

She goes, I'm Iranian. I'm not allowed into America. He's American. He's not allowed into Iran. We're stuck in a hotel room in Ankara, Turkey. Please help. And what happened with that? I followed up with her. And again, because these courts challenged this jackass, thank God, they were able to, a lot of people were able to get in- In the window that they had. In the window that they had. But now because the Supreme Court, especially were able to, a lot of people were able to get in. In the window that they had. In the window that they had. But now because the Supreme Court, especially with this guy Gorsuch or whatever,

the Supreme Court has said that we're going to hear the arguments in October for the travel ban. They said for now it's legit, but then they said close relatives can come. And then, of course, the administration goes right in and goes, okay, so close relatives are going to be mother, father, brother, sister, mother-in-law, but no grandparents. But didn't the court step in on the grandparents? They stepped in on that. And the grandparents are coming. Grandparents are coming. It's going to be week to week.

It's crazy. I mean, if you're working at customs, how do you do your job? I mean, what do I know? Every day someone's coming and going, oh. Well, they'll err on the side of being bad. Absolutely. Absolutely. You know, like, I want to take a chance and you can't come in.

I have my, in this whole process with my aunt trying to get the visa, my cousin was telling me that he talked to a friend of his who had come to America in the past. Again, a British guy who has been to Iran. He's come and gone in the past he said this guy was coming for like a wedding or something and he told my cousin he's like it took seven hours of interrogations at the at the border yeah i don't want to make you know imply that customs people are bad it's a tough job but you know it's like they err on the side of caution yeah you know uh you know they it's the first one was so fucking confusing. But, well, I hope that your aunt is able to get in.

I know, man. And when did the, so what's the special called? Special's called Immigrant, Maz Jobrani Immigrant. Is this, what is this, your third one? This is my fourth, fifth, hold on. This is my fifth. I had the Axis of Evil that was a group of us. Right.

Then I did Brown and Friendly. Yeah. I Come in Peace. I'm Not a Terrorist, terrorist but i played one on tv and now it's immigrant and this netflix netflix my first original netflix oh so this is the first netflix special yeah and and we shot it at uh kennedy center so i'm excited it's all you know it's i'm excited about and the reason i call it kennedy center in dc dc kennedy center and the reason i called it immigrant was because one of the things that really upset me you you know, I realized this. When I came to America, it was like, you know, when that hostage crisis happened, I remember getting bullied. Yeah.

And this guy, Trump, is a bully. And that's why I get so upset. First and foremost. First and foremost. And so when the whole thing happened where they're like, you know, keep refugees out, keep immigrants out. happen where they're like keep i you know keep uh refugees out keep immigrants out and i and i realized look what would have happened if this travel ban had happened happened when i was fleeing iran and the revolution with my family if we landed in in new york and they sent us back into the revolution what kind of psychological effect would that have had on me on my family could have

been imprisoned i could have been in iran a lot of stuff exactly i could have been in prison i could have i mean i just parents could i mean that's a lot of problems with a lot of the uh the latin countries as well in mexico they're sending people back into horrendous situations where they have no recourse they have no lives people been here for 20 years being deported to no sympathy whatsoever they just send them right back into this hell yeah and so i wanted to put a face like in the in the special i have a picture of myself when i was like in the third grade right around the time i come to america and so i, like in the special, I have a picture of myself when I was like in the third grade, right around the time I come to America. So I have that in the background to indicate part of the message is, these are the immigrants that you guys are sending back.

You're sending back kids. You're sending back grandparents. You're not stopping ISIS. ISIS will, first of all, the terror attacks we've had in America have been American born. Right, right. And secondly, they're criminals. They will find ways to get in. Yeah, those're criminals. They will find ways to get in.

Yeah, those people will. And also, I don't know why he's not. It seems like if I'm not misreading or wrongly reading certain articles, it seems like there's been some success in defeating ISIS in Iraq. Yeah, absolutely. I don't know why he's not. Why is he not saying anything about that? I don't because he wants to keep promoting this anti-immigrant agenda here and doesn't want people to separate the fact that the the actual organization the armed organization of isis yeah is on the ground fighting and they're getting their asses kicked in iraq but it's like no okay but we still got to get these guys out of

here well fear is good it's this new thing with the ms-182 or the the hell yeah whatever they are the the salvadoran gang i'm sure they're bad guys and horrible but but and they've been around but now again he puts this fear in people like this is who we're going after yeah so people go oh great and they're on your street right now yeah and imagine like now a lot of his supporters are probably seeing some poor mexican dude and going like get out of my country oh yeah definitely definitely it's like but yeah bring me my food first yeah bring me my food first don't leave until you finish in the kitchen bunch of assholes yeah man but uh but yeah it's good to see you and i'm glad that uh in the kids are all

right everybody's good white kids are good wife's good they're growing kids grow fast how old are they now they're six and ten dude it just goes? It's nuts. I don't have any. I'm just not acknowledging that I'm aging because I don't have the reminder. I'm telling you, man. My cats are getting old. Yeah. But they're holding up all right. Yeah.

No, it's kids really remind. I mean, I was watching videos of them when they were toddlers. I don't remember that period. I don't remember that. And I just go, what the hell? And it's like what you were just saying. It's kids or some gray hairs once in a while. Like when I grow out the beard and it gets gray, I go, holy shit, I'm old.

Yeah. I know I'm starting to see it a little more. It's crazy. It happens. How old are you? I'm 45. Well, I'm 53. And the 50s, really, there's a big shift.

I can feel it coming. Like by 55, 56, it's sort of like, yep, now he's old, Mark. Well, you know what it is is because when we were kids, like, I think once people hit 40, they had the briefcases and they were like, there was like, people were business. They dressed like grownups. They dressed like grownups. Yeah, no more. Now we walk around in shorts and t-shirts.

I know, life just worked out. No, it's fine. It's fantastic. I got sneakers on. You were on stage on shorts and t-shirts. I was. That was, yeah. But you were telling the truth, though.

You'd just come from the hospital? Yeah, I'd just come from the hospital. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I hope that works out. Thanks, man. I hope so, too. And it's good to see you the hospital, yeah. Well, I hope that works out. Thanks, man. I hope so, too. And it's good to see you. Thanks, Mark.

Maz Jabrani. His show, the new special, is called Maz Jabrani Immigrant on Netflix, streaming now. Dig it. So, Rory Scovel. Fun guy. Funny guy. Nice dude. streaming now dig it so rory scoville fun guy funny guy nice dude i was happy to talk to him i see him around kind of known him here and there for years but now he lives down the street from me so it was a easy commute for him to come over to talk about his new special that is streaming on netflix everything's on netflix it's called Rory Scovel Tries Stand Up for the First Time. And you can watch it right now if you want.

Right after you listen to me and Rory talk. So this is me and Rory talking. The one good thing about this job too is that you can easily go, well, I can get out of here. I can get out of here for as long as I want. Well, that's what becomes the indicator of whether or not you like your life as

much as you think you do or whether you know you do or you don't is when you go on the road and you're like, oh yeah, I'm out. I'm finally, I'm away from me. Yeah. I don't have to clean this room. Yeah. Yeah. It's true. Go downstairs and just tell the lady, hey, could someone do my room? All right, good. You start looking at your job as the vacation. Oh, no doubt. Yeah. Well, I mean, that's kind of a cool thing, too.

But then it is also kind of like, is that healthy? Is that mentally healthy? Well, I mean, a lot of people live out there. I imagine it could become sort of sad and stressful. But it's not as sad as it used to be. I don't know what level you're at with the road. But it used to be like as soon as you got out there, you'd be you wouldn't be treated well. So you'd be at the shitty hotel out where you can't drive anywhere. And immediately you're like, oh, God, it's just time for wrong things.

Yeah. I mean, there's still those places that are doing like the the condo or they're still doing like the shitty hotel. like the the condo or they're still doing like the shitty hotel but luckily that's now and and it's because of things like podcasts and blogs and anything that's like any kind of media to where comics can actually complain right so there's there's those clubs now going like oh at least the smart ones who are like oh i guess we didn't really know no we'll get you guys a way better hotel sure we'll make changes marriott courtyard yeah hell yeah they got breakfast courtyard that's the best. Give me that continental breakfast. Oh, it just made me think about that fucking condo in San Antonio, man. There's like, I feel like I've talked about it before, but it was just one of those ones

that had just been through it and there was just layers of bad decisions and sadness. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, like the furniture didn't begin as new and now it's just like generations. The furniture started in a bad place day one it was in a bad spot exactly because i'm in that same zone you were talking about like i just spent like three four months on the road hammering out like an hour plus to do a special and now i'm in that place where i'm like i don't have to do anything yeah and like i'm not even sure i want to like i always get to this place where it's sort of like i don't feel like i need to do anything yeah and like i'm not even sure i want to like i always get to this place where it's sort of like i don't feel like i need to do comedy and then like a week goes by you're like

oh fuck i know i gotta who am i yeah what am i doing yeah i haven't talked to people well that's what someone asked me they're like do you see yourself like uh getting to a point where you're just like i don't i'm not gonna do it anymore and i was like i feel like every time you do it you think maybe i'm not gonna do it anymore but then it like, you have that one show and you're like, what am I talking about? This is my, this is my high. It's like getting up here and doing this.

It's like the best thing ever. Yeah. You can't picture not doing it. It's one new bit. It just takes one new one. And not even like, like a minute, like a minute's worth of new words to say.

Yeah. Half a bit. Yeah. Like just, yeah, yeah, yeah. One half bit.

And you get that adrenaline again. You're like oh i can build off this yeah it wakes all the other shit up yeah and until that stuff just falls away yeah oh see now i want to let's go do a set let's go let's go do one of those daytime sets in the morning yeah just pop in somewhere do those coffee spots you could you could probably actually run a pretty successful 9 a.m coffee shop show do you imagine how crowds are coming in would be how they just that would be a hilarious idea propping up their laptops like a like a morning coffee shop you know stand-up show just to see the looks on their faces

yeah before they have their first cup of coffee just like are you fucking kidding me yeah it's just a needy asshole in the corner going hey how, how's it going? Yeah. How's everybody doing? Trying to get into my cortado and my puff pastry. I don't even know what a cortado is. I got this guy up here talking about his job, which he's at. Yeah. But wait, you don't want to go back down? You don't want to go back?

Where are you from in the southern part of the United States? South Carolina. See, I don't even know. Greenville. Greenville, South Carolina. Really? Yeah. I don't even know if I've been to South Carolina. What are the United States? South Carolina. See, I don't even know if- Greenville. Greenville, South Carolina. Really? Yeah. I don't even know if I've been to South Carolina.

What are the other cities? Charleston is probably the most popular. Charleston, that's by water. Yeah. I played at a nice theater down there. Charleston's great. Yeah, there's a nice little theater, and there was places to eat close by. Yeah, exactly.

And that's all that matters. Yeah, but it was definitely southern. Yeah, you're there 24 hours. You just need coffee and a place to eat. Yeah, I can't remember the name of that space, but it was a respectable little venue. But people came out. Yeah.

See, I romanticize the South now as much as I stereotyped it previous. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm in the second half of my life where I'm like, the South is a great place. There are misguided people everywhere. But the good ones are very decent. And there's true history there.

Well, I think, I mean, I'm sure you've played Asheville in North Carolina. Right, but that seems to be an outlier. That's kind of like your Austin. I know, but I worry about the survival of those places at this point in time. You know, like, it always felt tenuous to me. Look what's happening in portland i always knew there was something under the surface that was you know much older than that city's hipness yeah yeah and it's gonna resurface yeah yeah especially these times but ashville's kind of dug in you got a lot of off the grid hippies that there's a you

know there i think there is a southern uh disposition that isn't inherently political or wrong just sort of like you know we live up here yeah yeah just stay off you stay out of the yard yeah yeah yeah i mean that i south carolina and north carolina i mean they're they're great states they're they're they have their their pros and cons yeah but you know there is an element of like there is a younger uh more progressive uh vibe starting to happen but it's still drowning in a sea of like some i'm not saying all conservative ideas are bad but it's drowning in a sea of really bad conservative yeah ideas right people socially yeah can't get

wrap their minds around uh anything i saw a guy i was just back in my hometown i saw a guy get out of his car i was just driving past This all happened in like just a matter of seconds. I saw the guy driving past and he had a sign and I was like, oh, the guy looks like he's going to protest. I look across the street. It's like a women's clinic. I look back and I can now see the sign says abortion is wrong. Yeah.

And this guy, this guy's entire afternoon is, well, no, it's 11 o'clock. Yeah. I go down, I open the trunk, I get the sign out and I stand across the street and as cars drive by i'm just letting them know that abortion is wrong yeah and it's that that's his job that's his job he's doing it for god yeah those level of people a guy who could clearly go donate time at a soup kitchen or help orphans who do need some support yeah but no my thing is i need to go help the babies that did happen yeah i need to go stand on here with these yeah these women whose stories i can't possibly fathom or understand i have to stand here and tell them what i think yeah yeah and and in his mind it's he's doing the lord's work yeah

yeah well i mean this outfit it's it's tricky you know uh but it historically and not that long ago there was some you know very bad business down there. Yeah. And in some ways, I think it's bounced back. In some ways, people have progressed. But there are some holdouts. Yeah. I think we're seeing a lot of holdouts. A lot of holdouts.

A lot of people going, I like to hold on to a tradition, traditional stuff that makes no sense. Just good old American racism and hate. That's right. I mean, that's what we believe in it. Yeah. My parents did. My grandparents did. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So who's to say they're wrong? right. I mean, that's what, you know, we believe in it. Yeah. My parents did. My grandparents did. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So who's to say they're wrong? Exactly. I don't know. Everybody, the Constitution, things like that. Yeah. Yeah, well, what do they know? The hope is that there are people, when I go back, I do hang out with a lot of people who aren't like that, but when you see young people who carry those ideals, it's like,

oh, you truly don't possess the ability to think for yourself at all. Yeah. Like, you can't plug into anyone other than what your uncle told you at one point right well that's my identity too yeah and they well they'll accuse us of not being able to think for ourselves at all that you know we we've just let it go that you know that freedom was too much for us mental freedom look what freedom did to you right yeah you hippie right. Right. But when you do go back, I mean, what's your family like? Are they frightening? No, my family is, I mean, I come from the kind of family where I'm pretty sure a lot

of them, if they voted, voted for Trump. Yeah. But I can't say that with any certainty. They might have voted for. So they keep it to themselves. They keep it themselves because I think they're any certainty. They might have voted for. Oh, so they keep it to themselves. They keep it themselves because I think they're also,

I mean, if you bring it up, someone might be like, well, I couldn't vote for, they're like, Trump is an idiot. Like, oh, who'd you vote for? I'm like, well, I couldn't vote for Hillary.

And so you're like, oh, you're that weird between that I don't, I can't relate to. That's sort of like, I just couldn't bring my hand to, you know, it is that sort of thing.

Like, well, I wasn't gonna, I mean, come on. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, what are you thinking? Be think be a person what am i gonna i'm gonna vote for her and then live with myself um but there i mean i come from a family that's not like i ever i think everyone's probably got someone in their family who's probably said some racist stuff and you know some of them are yeah as some people joke, grandfathered into that because they're maybe specifically grandfathers. But I don't know. I think I come from a pretty normal family. What was the business? Do you have a family business? No. My dad worked at the post

office. Really? Yeah. My dad worked at the post office and my mom also worked at the post office. She passed away when I was really young. And then my dad, my stepmother, she also worked, we're a postal family. She also worked at the post office. But then after they got married, she was at home and they had five kids. So there's seven of us. So pretty big, pretty big family. The age gap between me and my, my next sister just below me is like seven or eight years. So they're like, how old are they now my youngest brother the youngest sibling uh just graduated high school uh on wednesday really yeah and i'm 36 going on 37 in like two months and you're are y'all close uh we try to be yeah i think the you're out of the house by the time i was way out before like a lot of the siblings were like while they were growing up the wandering

half brother yeah but i it's just sort of and they i i think the only reason maybe that i do i am able to have a connection to let's say specifically my youngest brother yeah is because of this job that we do i think it's it's you know if i was you know i don't want to shoot on people who are in accounting but if i was in accounting he would be, we have nothing to talk about. But like he can actually see you on television. He can see on television also because I'm telling jokes. He can kind of get to know my perspective through that. So he can go,

oh, while my brother is 36 and at the age of 18, he thinks that's 70 years old. Right. He can listen to my jokes and be like, well, maybe it's, maybe that's not 70 years old.

Maybe that's actually, he's still a silly. No, but that's got to be cool for him. Oh, I think so. I think it's salvaged any chance of having a relationship is the fact that this job kind of keeps us young, I think. Yeah, especially if you don't have children. Yeah. Once you start talking about children, then you're cutting off a few. For sure.

Yeah, yeah. I didn't do that on purpose, but yeah. then you're you're cutting off a few for sure yeah yeah i didn't do that on purpose but yeah i can now remain a perpetual adolescent and you know on an ideological level still be appealing emotionally to 15 year olds the dream yeah yeah i did it yeah i made it i never have to change emotional appeal to teenagers yeah that's all you that's what that's what business is that's when you know you've done it that's when you know you're good. Yeah, but for me, it's very specific, troubled, sensitive, aggravated teenagers. They're not having a good time.

They're into me because I sort of validate, like, oh, see, you never have a good time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's right. It's always going to be tricky. This is our leader. We've met him. Never have fun. He knows it's not going to be easy ever.

Yeah, that's what I did. That's what I cultivated. So the post office, so they're civil servants to a degree. Yeah. And for some reason, when somebody, you tell me that they work at the post office, I'm like, that's noble. That's a tough job. Yeah. I mean, at that time, and we're talking like the mid-70s, late-70s, when they started working there,

that was a time when it was like hey if you're willing to leave college and go get this job you can actually get a pretty good salary job and pension the post office yeah and it's like and it's off so you're a government employee so that goes with its own benefits and yeah i think at the time there was that appeal and then i think maybe the rest of the world around the post office and and a lot of government jobs uh was like no the inflation and the price of things is that but the post office and and a lot of government jobs uh was like no the inflation and the price of things is that but the post office and all government like no you guys still make what you made and you know 77 yeah and the world around you will change and then let's hope one day

let's hope you save money yeah it's it's a holdout like you know it's like this we yeah i uh i don't know who i talked to but there was i think maybe it was oh i used to do a bit about it you know when people would snap the post there was that trend for a while yeah yeah yeah i just like i just thought like just one day it was just sort of like this is never gonna stop yeah the letters just keep coming you know like there's like you're never done yeah and it just yeah if your ocd is like i start a thing and i finish it it's like no the day one you started it and even when you retire it won't have it goes on without you right yeah yeah kind of yeah so were they like were they post people did they walk

the beat i don't know what my my i don't know what my mother did or my grandfather who also worked there i don't no one was ever like delivering legacy yeah yeah yeah i that's what i'm supposed to be doing i think um that's And that's my true calling. You always have the post office. Yeah. Well, my grandfather said to my father, like, I don't remember. I don't remember whether he said it to me, but it was an idea he had in his head. It's like, you could always get a job at the post office. It must have been, like, at some point, a big push.

Like the perfect plan B at that time. You get benefits. Right. Yeah. So he retired from the post office my dad is still working at the post office we we just had a conversation uh recently where i was like i think it's time like he could have retired but it's the thing where it's like well you stay on for several years your percentage of your salary that you'll get uh continues to go up right so

he's been holding out to like get to a certain percentage And I was like, I think the time has come. He's going for the golden watch kind of deal? Like you're going to hit your points? I don't really know. I mean, I told him, I was like, look, I've been fortunate the past few years in what I do. I was like, why don't you let me chip in? Why don't you get out of there and we can figure out how to do it? And he was more than happy to be like, oh, great.

It wasn't even like, you want to buy a house you got a family he's like great yeah let's do that like instant instantly like as soon as i said it i was like oh he's been thinking about waiting yeah i've kind of done that with my dad a little bit but he's still too proud to do like because i didn't i didn't offer him a plan like it wasn't you know uh you know because i don't offer him a plan. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It wasn't, you know, because I don't know. My dad had money, and then he fucked it up. Right. So it's a different situation, you know? And I don't know, but I have these conversations with him,

but it's never like, let's just figure out where you're at monthly, and maybe I can chip in. It's more like, do you need some now? Yeah. Are you in trouble? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he's been reluctant, know so uh we send you a hundred dollars yeah you want is that gonna hurt yeah i'll get a walk around yeah i'll send

you a bond yes it's a check if you want to cash it some yeah yeah it's still like it's some you want a chore to do this me now you have to go to the bank oh i guess i gotta do it i guess it's hard you have to right you do well i i think uh i didn't do it. I guess it's hard. You have to, right? Well, I think I didn't do it before because... Well, you got to have it to do it. You got to have it to do it. And I've been trying to save. And I've also been in that idea of like, well, you know, I could, you know, the amount of houses I could buy in my hometown, I doesn't even get me the one that I want here.

And so you go through that thing like, what do I keep renting? Do I buy? All these things that I hate thinking about. And I hate that we're kind of forced to like, well, one day you got to figure out like, well, do I keep renting? Do I buy? All these things that I hate thinking about and I hate that we're kind of forced to like, well, one day you got to figure out blah, blah, blah. You do have to figure it out, but you can spend your whole life trying to figure out or at the exact same place you're at right now. Yeah.

I need to fix this house and I've needed to for a decade. Yeah. And ultimately it just becomes like, well, I guess I'm just going to wait until something falls off. And then do it. Yeah. When that thing, when the wall breaks. Yeah. I guess I'm just going to wait until something falls off and then do it. Right. Like when that thing, when the wall breaks, I better fix that. It's so stupid.

It's kind of like looking at insurance. It's like, well, you should go get insurance and pay it every month and then when you don't need it. Yeah. And then, you know, there was a time when I didn't have insurance and then I went to a dermatologist. I had to get some like moles cut off. And so I went to do it. And I told my aunt. Well, I told my aunt.

I was like, it cost me $700. And she was like, well, see, if you had had insurance you wouldn't have to pay that and i was like yeah but if i would have had insurance i would have already paid two thousand dollars to have nothing done at all so i was like i think i actually save money i feel like it's kind of like that with a house where you're like well hopefully when that wall falls off it's not one that costs right so much money rolling the dice on the insurance but all the pipes come along with it the house is gonna last longer than us, probably. Yeah. Yeah.

But I don't know. Like, you're married, right? Yeah. You got married not too long ago. Married about three years ago. I know her, right? I met her a few times. Yeah, yeah.

No kids yet? One kid. She turns two in July. You did that? Yeah, we had a little girl. You got a kid over there? We got a little kid over there. Oh, my God.

It's crazy. Is it? Yeah, it's definitely the oh see i thought you were on team no kids but no you're just i was on team no kids for a while i thought there's maybe a small percentage of me that's still on team no kids right now right right now yeah yeah whenever i want to go put something together and do it on my own i'm like ah team no kids really should have been here for this oh but that but that's exciting, right? It's the greatest thing. I've learned after having a kid that all the cliche things that people say,

you go, oh, that's why people say them, and that's why it's become a cliche is because it's just... It's just the most amazing thing. It's like when someone asks, what's the weather like in California? We all say the exact same thing. Yeah. Oh, it's sunny every day. It's usually pretty good. Yeah, and there's no different answer, but... But I've gotten to the point where thing yeah well yeah it's sunny every day it's usually pretty

good yeah and it's there's no different answer but but I've gotten to the point where I'm like it's creepy the weather actually it's it's yeah it's you know we go through long periods of dryness and like there was a period there where I didn't know whether or not the earth would survive I think yeah and then it rains and you're like oh my god thank god yeah when we had that like what two weeks of rain and you're and then you, well, wait, can our ground stay in this kind of? Is my house going to stay? Yeah, yeah. When does the mudslide start?

Yeah, and I was so happy about the rain. But so you're generally happy about the kid? Very, very happy about it. She's all healthy and good? All healthy and good. And it's, you know, it's that. I am already a paranoid, anxious person all the time. I mean, that's probably why we do what we do.

But this kind of adds to it a little bit where you're like, oh, it's probably why we do it but that's why it has to it a little bit where you're like oh it's even more paranoia and and anxiety because you're like what if something happens when anything happens and i go down the road of like all of the worst possible scenarios in every scenario uh worst outcome and it's i don't know somehow it's still all completely trumped by the idea of a kid seeing a brain grow. And you also realize, oh, if we actually put all our efforts as human beings towards children's health and education, we could actually save society and the planet because you watch a kid's mind go oh i'm like a computer i only know what you're going right to tell me yeah and then when i turn you know 16 and decide i want to learn on my own whether that changes or not you at least gave me the solid foundation of like right you

know right and wrong and blah blah blah sure and then at 16 they go fuck you exactly but you know i feel like the kids with that solid foundation they say fuck you and they go away for a bit. But then I think in their late 20s, they go, you know what? You were right about, I didn't agree with everything, but the core of it, you were right. Is that who you were? I think so. I mean, a little bit. I think I wasn't a bad kid.

I was like always afraid of getting in trouble despite being a class clown and like getting in trouble for talking and like minor stuff. I never did like a major. You't out blowing up cats never i never did anything that i was like oh this is gonna be i'm gonna get i was so afraid to get in trouble scar on my soul forever right yeah yeah i was with some bad people i was with some smokers some teens who wanted to smoke and then everything hell broke loose we killed some frogs. I was going through my greaser stage. We were racing cars. Well, that seems a little more exciting than herding animals.

I think we missed the greaser thing, the racing cars. But maybe in the South, it never goes away. You know, I feel like that. I don't know. Mudding, mud dogging. That was like the thing. What was that, with the big wheels? Big wheels, like a Jeep.

Go out and get stuck in mud and then get out of it, which I could not understand. I watch people with videos of them, and look at me go over this boulder, and it looks like my car's going to tip, but then it doesn't. And there's just dudes sitting around the periphery watching. Yeah, and loving. Like the one guy in a wheelchair. I used to do it.

I did it too, too. You know, clearly there's consequences. Yeah, I should have worn my belt. I thought I had the do it. I did it too until, you know, clearly there's consequences. Yeah, I should have worn my belt. I thought I had the boulder. I thought I had it, and it got on top of me. It's a horrible story. I still love it. I still love to watch.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Good for them. So that's a tragedy, you know, the horrible consequences of doing something for no reason. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And also the high of it when it all works out isn't very good. No, because you can't recapture it.

You know, at least with drugs, you're like, I'm going to put this in my body and there's a 90% chance it's going to be pretty fucking good. If it's not, I just do more. Yeah. But like to do whatever it is, like if I can just make that jump, it's like the odds are not consistent buzz. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I also have a kid. I think that's when the drugs thing kind of hits you where you're

like you know because i experiment with drugs but then you're like guys am i gonna have the kid who experiments and never comes back it's like well that's a big i just kept going i kept chasing the the high yeah and then you're like well talk to me like you again like no that person's gone yeah that person's gone i gotta go now because i'm a little i gotta go i'm late for fish so i gotta get out there get my nitrous on that's like so you're like 36 so you grew up yeah it's a little different but so the so what so you moved over here for the school or um not really i mean when we moved la six years ago we started in silver lake um just because

brendan walsh walked us around silver lake and he was like yeah you want to be over here kind of on the east side by his house all right great yeah yeah he's like be my neighbor let's drive to shows together um but yeah so i i so we like the east side and we just stayed over here but i i think my trying to slowly escape la oh yeah you keep. You keep going east. I was like, so, Eagle Rock, and then eventually Pasadena, and then I'll just- You're out in Sun Valley. Yeah, exactly. I'll be out in the desert. In a trailer in Joshua Tree.

We're in Vegas. I'm driving in for my 10-minute spots every night. I don't know how people live in Vegas, and I'm not saying that to upset people in Vegas, but I just can't get near the place. Yeah. I don't work there. My wife is from there. What?

So we go visit her parents. They still live there. I just see everything in Vegas being corrupted by what Vegas is. But I guess people have regular lives there as well. They do and they like it, but you have to like that specific lifestyle. I mean, her parents are in real estate. So they're doing great. They're in residential and commercial real estate.

I guess there's some people that are in Vegas and they're like, we never go to the strip. We don't go over there. Yeah, they don't. Right. And also, if they want to go gamble, they're not going to the ones on the Strip. They're going to those ones that are off the beaten path in a gas station. Joe's Casino. In the back curtained room, and it's just one poker machine.

Oh, you were just in that movie about a casino. Yeah, The House. Yeah, I watched it because I talked to Manzoukas. Yeah, yeah yeah well that was great he is great yeah he's a he's a good guy he's very he's very uh up front earnest dude right seems that no i'd have a good time yeah yeah yeah uh but yeah the movie was ridiculous but okay yeah it's funny you had a big part i was happy i was the whole time we were doing it i was in my, I was just like, all right, hopefully this doesn't get cut. I'm at that level where I'm 100% if they're like, we're long on time.

All right, we'll cut the guy no one really knows. I know where I'm at. But no, you had like three or four scenes you popped up in. That's a pretty big movie part. Oh, huge. Considering I saw a lot of comedians' faces in there that said nothing. Kyle had a little thing. Yeah, Kyle.

That whole cast it was great i mean the whole time we you know i i haven't done it i was in dimitri's uh movie i saw that too you were the roommate guy or the friend yeah the friend on la with the cat yeah yeah yeah that was good that was a good part that was both of those were things i had never done so i was like in that fake it till you make it mentality but you know when someone's like hey come and uh open for me, and it's a lot of people, and you gotta kind of lie and be like,

oh, yeah, I've done that before, so put your faith in me. Yeah, that's how you start. This was kind of this with that. I was like, oh, I can act. I know what I'm doing. Yeah, that's the only way to do it. Yeah, I mean, you can freak yourself out

and go take classes and stuff, but ultimately, as a comic, you're like, nah, I can't. Yeah, I think maybe as comics, that's what, if someone's like, we got this really dramatic role and it's all riding on you it's like well then i'm gonna go take it yeah so i'm gonna get notes you know can you have someone's business card yeah who might teach

me how to do this but when someone's like hey it's a it's a comedy and we're literally asking you to say the punch line you're like well i've i've done that enough i can and you knew everybody over there oh that's what made it great and the fact that it's like, it's Amy Poehler, it's Will Ferrell, it's like, you can immediately kind of understand, like, this is going to be a fun, like, tone to all of this.

It got a little over the top. Yeah. Yeah, it got a little messy. I haven't seen the total, the, the, I was out of town when they did, like, a screening for it.

One thing that happens very quickly in those kind of movies is like, you go like, oh, this could never happen. There's no reason for any of this to connect and make senseies where you're like well that wouldn't happen yeah yeah yeah but like i told manzuka so i said uh you know towards the end you know the good guys which are you

basically will and the parents like they've completely morally corrupted themselves to a point where they were unredeemable so there was part of me at the end where it's like they don't deserve to have the happy ending right yeah this is not how it's supposed to cross the line they cross the line they don't get away with that yeah and i i was overthinking it yeah but what was the scene like how when did you start doing the stand-up uh i started in 2004 in dc um i moved up there because my sister lived there, my older sister. But you never did any in the South? No. I mean, I did one show in the South.

It was the thing that got me started was like an open mic poetry night. And I asked if I could do jokes instead of poetry. And I brought the entire audience because it was all my friends. Right. And they were like, oh, let's go grab beers and watch rory make an ass of himself did they stay for the poets you know the poets asked there was only three poets and honestly it was a place called guitar bar and i was an awesome bar had a nice little showroom and the poets were like do you mind going at the end so people like watch and you know i knew to it you don't even understand that

strategy right so i'm like yeah i don't know what i'm doing so i'll you guys tell me when to go right because i don't know what any of this is i wrote down some things that i think my friends will laugh at but no one else can relate to right um and it was i brought enough people where the the guy running the bar i was like so how long do i go up there and he was like you brought everybody he's like i would love it if you just went up there for as long as possible because they'll just keep drinking like it's a monday night and you brought the entire audience right so in a way it looked good for me to the bar and to the poets because they're like oh we never have an audience this guy brought an audience and now he's going last and they're buying drinks it's a big night for them yeah so i didn't understand

any i just went up there and like fucked around and so they did it though the poets got their audience they got their audience and my friends all sat there, nice to be like, oh, this is- You probably have nice friends. What is this? Nobody heckled the poets. There's a poet somewhere in South Carolina saying, do you remember that night? Remember that night? That was the best night.

That was our Madison Square Garden when those 40 drunk college kids showed up to uh heckle their friend so you were in college it was just after college about a year out of college and you just did it because like you thought you could do it what made you think you could do that i didn't know uh i didn't know what to do i didn't i didn't i got i i kind of wanted to get into filmmaking since i was like 14 i was like oh i want to make movies and be an actor i think it's like fun but then uh you know my buddy in high school he was like know, a lot of the people on Saturday Night Live, he's like, there's a lot of them are stand-up comics and they're writers.

And like all of that, I was like, oh, I don't, I can't see myself doing that. Right. Because I didn't really know what stand-up comedy was. I wasn't one of the people that like, you know, snuck over to listen to Pryor or Carlin. Right. Like I didn't have any interest. I watched like the Marx Brothers and and Abbott and Costello. You went way back.

How'd that happen? Well, my dad, it was on AMC, a thing, and my dad was like, you should watch this. I grew up watching these guys. You watch this. And that was that time where, as a kid, I was like, oh, adults are silly. They do silly stuff. I can continue to just kind of be a jackass my whole life. Right.

And then I wanted to be a filmmaker, and then after I got out of college, I was like, oh, I have this thing in my head that I want to do and I've done nothing to do. And I don't know how to do it. I was like, and you start realizing like, oh, this is what people talk about when they talk about dreams and being ridiculous. Right. And never doing anything. This is why, yeah, they don't do it because they don't figure out how to do it. Yeah.

So I started running camera for a local news station. I was just in the studio doing like the the five o'clock seven o'clock eleven whatever all the times were they always kept changing at that time just running listening to the director being like i frame it up a little bit you're a little heavy on the right like just we got to get the car running move it over so we can get the image and like you know just doing that we're not where you were in college this was a year out of college i just stayed in my college town you got the gig at the local station? Yeah. With no experience? No experience.

I went up there and they basically were like, I was on a camera and they were like, all right, pan right, pan left. All right, you know the terms. Like if you knew pan, you were fine. So it wasn't a union gig, I'm assuming. No. I mean, it was like the bare minimum.

I think I was making like $6 or $7 an hour. But was that the first time you had that moment? Because when I go on the road, sometimes you do the local TV. local tv yeah you walk into a space and you know it's just a big empty space with the set and you're like this is it yes yeah the magic is immediately you go oh okay so there is no magic to anything nothing it's just these cameras have sold us a lie or frame it up and if you pull back, there's just two guys sitting there. One guy has a coffee. A raggedy curtain covering a window from the parking lot.

And then when they do those, like if you're doing local TV and you're following like a cooking segment from the guy who's got a restaurant in town, that kind of thing. And you're just like, oh, my God. It's so stripped down. It's so weird. There's nothing magic to it. The illusion of it. So you learned how to pan right and left yeah i was basically doing that and uh you know that was that was fine if

you're like i can i can still go out after my shift i can sleep all day and then go to work at you know five o'clock whatever it was and like nothing is expected of me but to like no but i need a two shot when do i need all the everybody when do i need just when are we going to sports yeah am i on weather if you're on the weather camera they're like all right this one's tougher because you have to make sure you see what the green screen's pointing at nothing yeah you get them pointing at nothing right so we can put the stuff on it yeah well so but in your mind you were like well i'm taking steps in my mind i was like oh okay instead of uh of becoming a filmmaker I'll go

down this road and try to work my way up and maybe I'll be a guy that shoots uh you know segments for Dateline or something like I kind of thought like I'm this I'm clear and I think it's because I I majored in journalism so my my my uh degree was communications journalism even though I had no passion for it I only took that because there were film classes you could take right if that was your focus. And you took those. So I took the film courses, the history of film, anything in film where you got to, some classes you got to be hands-on and actually make something.

But I like how quickly you just accommodated your dream to the job you got. No, I could do this for Dateline. Exactly. I could pan right and left for Dateline. Yeah, yeah. Well, I think that's what it was in my head. I was like oh i'm doing this and then maybe this all kind of contributes back to my mother passing away as a

kid but you die uh she had cancer lymphatic cancer so she hodgkin's disease when i was it was on my first birthday oh my god yeah so you have no real memory i have no memory of it and i've told people i was like it's one of those like you you can't you don't know if that's a better way to deal with it or like who would i be today if she died when i was 13 right right you have the memory and also i'm 13 horrible yeah so it's you look at it like your how old's your other sibling so my oldest sister natalie she was i think two and a half so you really neither one of you have anything really and how when did the stepmom come in? My dad remarried when I was seven. And so they dated, I think, for like two or three years.

And so she's your mom, kind of. Yeah. My aunt stepped in and took care of us. Oh, really? So that kind of became such a mother figure. And then at seven, when my dad remarried, it was like, all right, well, now you have to go. And this other person is coming in, which as i i get older and start to realize like how like fucked up i actually am i look back on these things like oh for a kid that that was

kind of crazy right your mother passed away but here's this person and now that person was gonna go away your mom's other person um no my dad says oh okay yeah but you still saw her yeah it just wasn't his hands-on well she also was trying to become a teacher, so she moved pretty far away, probably a three-hour drive away. So it wasn't like seeing each other all the time. It was like every now and then you visit, and it's truly one of those things you look back on, and you're like, oh, if someone was like, what will you talk about with a therapist? I was like, I think I'd start there, because that's probably the root of anything.

It probably starts with that. But you're not that fucked up. I don't think so. I mean, I think I probably have, you know, I feel like on the outside, I'm not fucked up. I think on the outside, I make decent decisions. On the inside, it's like, oh, there's these. I'm terrified all the time. I think so.

Yeah, I live in a state of paranoia. Anyone I get to know, I'm just like, all right, well, what will I wear to their funeral? Like, you're just immediately thinking about the are you leaving yeah when are you permanently gone um but uh uh I think kind of going back to that I I think the point where I was like uh why would I do that why would I try to become a dateline right you know segment creator I don't even that's how little I know but I don't know what the term is for what that person does. I think a segment producer. Segment producer.

I think I got out of that because I was just like, I was like, oh, that, you know, my mother passed away at 25 and here I am. Like, is this, you know, is this a life? Right.

Like, is this what I want to do? Like, not shitting on people that want to do that, but I clearly didn't want to do that. But also you're coming from a family of postal workers. Exactly. So you knew that. It's like, I knew my true calling but yeah but that but that's also one

of those things like well you know once you're in it that's it that's what happens yeah i think so like there was the creativity element was not necessary i mean i my dad would get up at like 5 a.m uh to i could hear him get ready and he would then go to work he was gone and the days that he worked he was gone before we woke up to get ready for school. And I really remember as a kid, like hearing that and being like, I don't ever want to do that. I don't want to wake up at 5am and go. In that weird zone where you're like, what? Yeah. Someone's doing something. But I think also looked at it like, well, that's what he has to do. That's what we all have to do. I think I was driven to say, well, I don't want to have to do anything.

I want to decide what I'm going to do. And at the end of the day, if I die because I have no money, I think I kind of thought, well, you know, my mother passed away. I think I should try to do something. And if I fail and die, I fail and die. Right. And so, I mean, in a way way kind of a great motivation to be like yeah drive to that fucking open mic you lazy piece of shit because this is what you're trying to do

right um and then i heard a david cross uh his first album he put out and i think that was the first time i heard a baby yeah i think it was the first time i heard stand up that wasn't in a suit very polished i think it was the first time my brain was like, oh, you can wear what you want, and you can, I loved it. I loved that album. It's great. But I was also like,

oh, you don't have to set up punchline. You don't have to have this well-constructed, it sounds like I'm shitting on his style of comedy, but honestly, his style of comedy inspired me to be like, oh, this is more personality-driven, and I think i relate more to that than this tight concise i've specifically i today i don't write jokes where's the fat like i don't care about the fat i like all of it i like having all that in there keep the fat

yeah and it's only now that i i at that point i was like oh if you can do it that way maybe i should try this i've been a class clown my whole life. I've always been like, you know, in any group, I'm like, try to be the funny person, you know, desperately. Yeah. And I was like, well, let's give this a try. So that's what led me to even think I'm capable of doing it as one. There's no rules.

Well, that's funny because Dave, like I started with him and, you know, it's always exciting to watch him and it definitely is, you know, unto himself but he used to do like because you do that southern character sometimes like for hours i love it i got addicted to it yeah he used to do one yeah he used to he used to go on stage as this gay southern guy nice back when he started right yeah yeah and and but he wouldn't let on like he they would bring him up with a fake name and he'd be like, hi, y'all. Yeah. And he'd start talking about his dogs. You know, like there's a little bit, you know, and he'd talk about their names and their

personalities. Right. And then people started just laughing at him. Yeah. You know, and he would push it. Like he'd stay in it until he'd stop. He'd go like, I can't tell if y'all are laughing with me or at me. You know, and he'd make it really uncomfortable.

Yeah. Like, and it'd make it really uncomfortable. Yeah. And it was great. He actually did Jesus as a gay Southern man was one of his early bits. I wonder if I've heard that. Yeah. I was just at Lazarus's tomb. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I've heard that. His hair is a mess. Yeah. I think, yeah, like that kind of stuff. Like when people are like, you know, I feel like it's always easy to go to like Seinfeld as an example because it's like, oh, here's a guy in a suit. I always thought, well, that's what stand up is. Oh, it's Johnny Carson. Look, he said a thing and then he got a laugh.

And he said a thing and he got a laugh. And it's just like, oh, this seems like a lot of pressure to play that type of music. You know, I feel like it's relevant to music. You see someone like, a lot of the guys, like all of you guys out of Boston, that was like very personality driven stand up. I think it was inspiring to a lot of people to be like, oh, that's more the music that I play. I like to say that's something more like jazz where it's like, oh, it can be anything.

You just have to know how to play it. That's right. You just have to, well, it's, you have to get up there and figure out how you know that how to make that your territory you know like you you can do whatever that's what compelled me is that you can do anything you want up there yeah i mean you should get laughs right yeah yeah at some point yeah but outside of that you know do whatever the fuck you want and that to me was amazing yeah it's just like you go up there and do what you want it wasn't until lately that i really got more disciplined like like i think i early on i wrote jokes and i could see them and they were definitely jokes yeah

but then i kind of broke it open and and you know and just kind of did the other thing but now like i've gotten to the point where if i'm working on a special there's like a bit or two in there that really require some focus on timing and the beats. And like, I'm sort of like, I force myself to do it and I am sort of like, oh, that's what that feels like.

Where you polish a thing. Yeah. You know, where you like, actually this, I needed to, I need to time that right. Right. And focus on it.

Like it didn't work at first. And I'm like, it's about this beat here. Yeah. And like, I'm glad that I can appreciate it at least now. I think that's what makes it so about this beat here. Yeah. And I'm glad that I can appreciate that, at least now. I think that's what makes it so fun, though,

because then it's like you, as the artist, having that revelation. It's like, well, then that's what keeps all of our albums sounding the same or talking about the same stuff. If the next thing comes out, I'm like, oh, Mark's way more polished. It's like, yeah, isn't that fun? Because maybe before he wasn't and it's not.

And the next one probably won't be right. The next one will be another thing. Well, I think I had this moment with I think it was with watching Shanling, you know, because like he was real kind of meticulous about timing. And his jokes are kind of challenging in some ways. And so much of it had to do with his personality, but also the way he you know timed things yeah and and all he for some reason he got through to me and this is later in life like in the last five or six years where i'm like that's interesting because because there's a part of me that thinks the same way it's like why would you want to just do these tight jokes like all the time yeah and just like it just becomes something

by rote yeah but then like i got to this other level it's like well i can like try to make things that are not easy work yeah you you know what i mean like they're not other level, it's like, well, I can like try to make things that are not easy work. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like they're not just the jokes. It's sort of like he's talking about some pretty hard, you know, heavy, dark shit, but he's balancing it with this craftsmanship. Yeah. I'm like, I'm going to try a couple of those.

Yeah. Yeah. That's what I love though. Yeah. I mean, even going back to as simple as like when I first started going on stage after hearing his out david cross album i mean i was going up doing my own jokes almost it would almost look like david cross was doing an impression of me doing like an act where i would go up and i was like well that's how you talk and then you know maybe that's how everybody starts or a lot of people and then you eventually go oh this isn't i actually don't move my arms like that and i actually don't

use that phrase and i'm not that person you kind of absorb your people for a while yeah yeah you kind of move through people but i think that that's what i love is that then as you you know as you progress through whatever the fuck this is you then start to break down handling and you go oh that's there's a style there you know i feel like maybe you start to understand it a little better and you can choose if you like wanting wanting to try differently i'm not a storyteller yeah but if someone's like hey your next album or whatever your thing is like why don't you try to be a storyteller like i'm not but that kind of excites me to be like how do i pull that off right as you yeah well yeah that's like you know the the last special not the one i

just taped but it informed that one too i'm like i'm gonna do like because i used to just like i always left a lot of room you know so i could just fuck off yeah you know and i'm like that's my style man i'm gonna bring a pad up that's my favorite right me too and i did a special like that and it was pretty good uh i liked it and it was this but the next special i'm like i'm gonna do a tight fucking hour yeah it's gonna have callbacks i'm gonna have fucking callbacks i'm special I'm like I'm going to do a tight fucking hour and it's going to have callbacks I'm going to have fucking callbacks and I'm going to know exactly where I'm going

and I just worked it like that and I thought it would be boring and it sort of wasn't because there was a distance you could get like when you wing it which is what I like to do and I always leave a little room for improv still but when I started to do these last

two specials i'm like why don't you just try to tighten this thing up and that becomes the challenge you're not sort of like i'm gonna leave some room yeah yeah you know what i mean yeah do you find though like when you do that when you're like i'm gonna tighten yeah do you then find like you kind of get something out of it whereas like when you go into a show you're not like well we'll see how this goes you kind of are like oh i i kind of know how this is going to go and that's exciting in its own way whereas before you maybe were like well if i already know how it's going to go then what is exciting about it but but you like what you're saying though yeah i guess but like what i realize is that like you don't ever know how it's going to go you know right yeah and a lot of the times

like when you say like i don't know how it's going to go, you know? Right. Yeah. And a lot of the times, like when you say like, I don't know how this is going to go, it's just to protect yourself from being scared. Right. Yeah. You know, like, and then you go out there and you just kind of like, and of course that's going to get a reaction. Yeah. But what you don't know when you do it that way is whether that's going to work again.

Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So like to make something like, you know, because I got more responsible just because I figured like I've been doing this half my fucking life. Yeah. Why not put the effort in to tighten it up?

Because I know guys that are professionals. And like Louie, he don't talk to the audience. He's not going to riff up there. Yeah, yeah. And he looks at it as this is my job. And every year I'm going to write this hour. And I'm going to polish it and do it. And that's the package.

Right. And I'm like, well, what know, like, what is that? But, you know, it's pretty fucking daunting. Yeah. And I'm like, well, I can do that then. So the satisfaction comes from actually making something, you know, ultimately we all have our acts and we're counting on it to work. Right. Right.

But to really sort of like for the excitement to be like, well, I really like this joke. And it works great. And like I have room in it. Like, you know, now I can deliver it without it being so immediate and like life or death. Yeah. Because I've built it out. Because I think even if you work like you and I do, you know the jokes at work. And then you can kind of go fuck off.

Right. Yeah. Yeah. But you don't I don't know if we appreciate them as much as we should right because there's something about callbacks and about packaging that putting the thing together where you know like i'm gonna bring this back later it's gonna blow it up i think my regret is i some of those jokes that i really love that i fuck off with i'm just like oh man who knows who knows where that could have actually gone right and i just fucked off with it so much that i finally got to a point where i was over it yeah you tired it out maybe actually crafted it yeah you know who knows maybe i would still get

tired of it but you never see the true potential i oh yeah i used to do that all the time i do conan they call me up to do panel back in new york when they'd like need when they had someone didn't show up like i get it and i go up there with half jokes like i just premises so i do panel yeah and like he'd save it or eventually i'd find something there's so many times i've been on tv where i'm like that joke's so much better now that's like half the joke right right so that used to piss me off but in this last special the one i just did i was working with an hour and a half hour 40 yeah and i really needed it to be they wanted it to be like 70 minutes max 65 70 and up to the two shows before the fucking taping i was still at an hour and a half yeah like i that last week i'm like well i gotta get this down yeah to 70 so i

had to do like i gotta go like that whole part of that joke is out that's hard to do i know but like i was surprised where at this point in my career where specials aren't necessarily that special and you know i got paid well they are for i mean right i know i'm here like talking about mine but at the same time there's so many specials you're like it's almost the wrong word for it right so it's just a job right so it's like what we it's part of what we do the product we make right and it's a great thing but like what it's not going to bring make or break me why not just make it good and like it i was so matter of fact about it i'm like this is going to go this is going to go and i you know i want i had

a through line i had callbacks you know i knew where i wanted to end up i wasn't sure if i wanted to move this thing to the end or whether that thing was going to go but in the last two shows before the special i i fucking made the cuts and you know i i got it in my head how it all fit together clicked yeah and i did it and i wasn't freaked out about it and i knew that the shit that i'd chosen worked and that was that oh that is that's huge yeah and it came in at seven like at 70 man that is what the fuck i that i had to like go back and in the edit take stuff out which is so painful i did that the last one and it's like were you doing like a minute that like anything yeah even like a pause that was too long yeah like well there's two or three seconds yeah you're just like it's the worst i

felt you feel like gary sinise in apollo 13 looking for any power he can find through his combination of buttons like where can i pull any amount of time out of the this this stretch of jokes it's brutal and but it's weird whether you do it in the editing room or whether you do it you know before you do the show it's usually better yeah you know what i mean like you're the only one that knows right yeah yeah you know and the audiences that saw the longer version that's the thing we always forget yeah you're like oh you're the only one who truly knows what you think it could have been and at the same time what you think was great like no let's put it out there at 80.

And then people were like, that was a little too long. Oh, shit. I could have. I could have not been. Yeah. I think you do. Is this your first one? This is the second one.

So the first one I was completely DIY, put up my own money. And I was like, pretty confident that I was like, if we don't go crazy with the budget and we're super conservative about the spending, that someone will, I can make that money back. And maybe I don't make money, but maybe it's whatever and we we sold it to cso and so it got however much attention right get with cso sure as much as anything can get right yeah and i but i think the the the cool thing about where i'm at now and having done the things i've finally gotten over the idea that anything is going to lead to some big thing. Yeah.

I think I now just look at it as like, well, if anything leads to one next thing. That's it. Then that's kind of the best you can hope for. And, you know, some people in this world, they do one thing and it leads to a super huge big thing. Right. I can't even in my own fantasies of my career. I can't even picture that happening or what that would look like. Exactly. What is a super big thing now? Yeah, even picture that happening or what that would look like. Exactly.

What is a super big thing now? Yeah, exactly. Who the fuck knows? Right. Yeah, yeah. If someone's like, oh, you put this one thing out and now you're selling out all these theaters and people are giving you offers for like acting and stuff. When you're starting out, you truly think that's how it works. Right. start to realize like oh it's and i i feel like i i feel like there's something that roger waters

was saying about uh pink floyd or maybe himself specifically where he realized everything we're creating this isn't the audition to eventually create this thing we're in we're already in the middle of it yeah we're doing i think i started to enjoy this a lot more when i was like oh every day even if i'm going up and someone's like, you know, go up and do eight minutes. Like even that eight minutes is, this is today right now with this crowd. And I don't know who's in that crowd. Right.

But it is an opportunity for someone in that crowd go, I'm going to, you know what? I'm going to invest in this dude the rest of my life. Cause I think I sync up with where he's at. And it's even at a shitty show with like, you know, 15, 20 people. Yeah, exactly. And I think I started to realize like, oh, quit downplaying stuff and quit thinking that the bigger stuff is big.

Like, who knows anything? Yeah, this is it. This is it. Yeah, you either enjoy it or you don't. And that made going into these specials feel so much better. Like, oh, yeah, there's cameras. But honestly, once we submit the final edit and people can see it, who still truly gives a shit? Because by the time the public can see the thing I created, there's no question I will absolutely hate it.

So who cares? Tonight with these cameras on, I like this. But by the time this is edited and there's coloring and however we finally sell it, I will 100% hate this. But it'll also be a year ago it's not even exactly exactly it's not even a matter of hating it you're like oh yeah i did that yeah i'm glad people are gonna see it but like i'm now you know i'm now working at the post office i have election jokes in my special because it was october 1st yeah and people were like you know by the time this sells wherever it sells and wherever it ends up you know that stuff's gonna be outdated and i was

like i've thought about it since day one i was like when i watch it i cringe but i gotta be honest the night that we recorded that that was my favorite thing sure and it feels dishonest to take it out right i was like i think i gotta leave in the thing where i was when i did it yeah i think that's good i tried to do like the last two specials i tried to i i don't talk about current i try to talk about anything but current events, but in the last one, just because like everyone can do those jokes. Right.

Do you know, it's very like, if you're doing specific jokes about things that happen in the world, there's a 98% chance that someone else is doing anything on that level of topical. Right. But this special, there was a couple of things that I did that were not,

they were not election jokes, but they were specific to what we're living in now yeah and i thought they'd hold like i i thought they were broad enough to hold so like unless you know he has a stroke or is pushed out of office or the world ends right i think this shit will still be okay in october september whenever the fuck they put it out right right right i think it'll still be relevant i think so too and even if it's not relevant there's no way anyone has forgotten what today feels like right but there but there is that thing that you do want it to be something fresh you like that you do want people well i don't want you to second guess yourself it's oh there's no way to avoid it no matter what there's no matter there's nothing that could be said that would make me

do or not do that but i think that's though, about the job and about the opportunities. It really isn't about the next big thing so much, especially if you're a comic, because one thing that we're afforded that other people in show business are in is we can just always work. We're not waiting for a role. We can go out tonight and get a spot and do the thing,

but there are jobs that we are able to do. I'm going to be on a talk show. I'm going to do panel on a thing. I'm going host this thing right you know yeah i'll do that goofy part in that thing and then i'll do my stand-up those are the jobs yeah so like as long as you can keep doing those jobs yeah you're good yeah right i think i i think you also get to that point where you start stop thinking about your perfect track record of the things that you put out there no one gives a shit like oh but i but i don't want to do anything until i have my own thing it's like well that's just not realistic and also no one cares and also no matter how big you think you are the majority of people do not know who you are well right that's the

fucked up thing about the way the media landscape works now it's like you know i've done like five fucking cds or like five or six specials yeah yeah i've been on conan 50 times letterman four times like all right you know like i'm like i fantasize like i'm gonna put it all in a giant box set and then we'll see i'll show you who i am that's exactly the train of thought that you do you're always the box set yeah yeah yeah there it all is i'm like i don't get i'll just youtube this shit i can get all this for free i'm'm not buying your $100 box set up. I used to talk to Swizzle about that. I'm like, let's just put my first four CDs in one box.

We'll do a cool box with it. You know what the risk of that is? Is that you do it and you sell 20. Right. Yeah, yeah. And you've manufactured all of this hard copy. You're going to fucking garage full of shit. Yeah, cool design.

That's great. Oh, no one cares. No, it's over. No one needs to hold anything. No one even has the machines for that anymore. That takes up too much space. That needs to be digital space. But you did, weren't you on a big,

didn't you get the sitcom shot? I did. I was on a show called Ground Flo floor on tbs and that was like probably that was my first and i think yeah first uh kind of like hey you're a regular on this thing and you have a job and that but how many episodes you do we did two seasons for a total of 20 episodes was that what's his name's producing uh uh bill lawrence yeah yeah like he likes you right yeah he's great i mean he he he saw my stand-up he was like i i have a role in this thing and you should come and do it so i got to go in and in front of him and the casting director kind of read the part and he was

basically like well i'm gonna try to get you to do i think you should do this yeah you know there was in this world of acting very few people are like, hey, I've got a thing for you. You think it's a door you can't knock down. And then someone like Bill comes along and he's like, no, I see the value in you and I'm going to put you on my thing and it's going to work out. And my character was just the goofy office weirdo. It's like, oh, I got it.

I can easily... Well, I mean, comics have always had a place in at least situational comedy on television a hundred percent they're like well that that's the guy he's already he's already fully baked yeah put him in the thing i feel like i feel like every show has you know and then maybe there was a different term before but i just look at like a kramer it's like every show has a kramer like oh you're the kramer of the show we're not you're you're probably never gonna have any a story yeah but we need you to deliver

the jokes when we go to you right oh yeah there's all that i mean i i i absolutely i used to make fun of like the multicam format and i used to be like ah it's so horrible and then you know i was working on a idea with bj porter and he was like you know well one of the greatest shows ever was a multicam so are they that bad and i then when i did this one i was referring to seinfeld seinfeld yeah i was like oh yeah you're you're right it was like multicams can be cheesy and horrible but they can also be good like there could actually be a style to it well yeah they are what they are i mean you're two and a half men and big bang theory you're just fucking vaudeville yeah yeah just like here's your stage and even as like uh the person showing up it's like well do you do you love that paycheck and that parking spot and that schedule and after

doing a multicam i'm like i i really do like that parking spot and that schedule i like how all this panned out yeah yeah i don't have to write it and i'm at home at a reasonable hour exactly and i and i like that show the cast i mean if you're on a show like that and you you like the whole cast it's kind of like uh i mean anybody who on a show like that and you like the whole cast, it's kind of like, I mean, anybody who has a job like that that complains about it, you must have had a pretty blessed life if you're complaining about this and this is your job. Yeah. I've never done one.

I've never even done, I don't think I've even done a guest appearance on a multicam. I've never been on a set like that to do a show like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like where you're on a stage and like I've done talk shows, but I've never done the guest spot where I walk in and I'm like, hey, how's everybody doing?

Right, yeah, yeah. You know, having the live audience is great because I was nervous about it as an actor, but then, you know, as we've had, you know, so much training in the idea of like, oh, if they're laughing, oh, yeah, I'll just hold.

Yeah, you know how to time it. Yeah, exactly. Because in our heads,'re like oh yeah sure you can you can act you want to be an actor to go ahead and act right i'm gonna wait until it's they're almost silent and then i'll say the next thing right at this perfect moment because i know it innately exactly it's what i do for a living yeah exactly for the laugh you're like well it's not a believable acting it's like well i wouldn't know how to do that anyways i just know when i should say this line and hopefully they laugh again. So getting that job and being like, hey, this is your first acting role.

I was like, oh, this definitely, even to this day, it's helped me be like, oh, I'm in this setting of acting. And I, oh, those are cameras. Those are terms. Those are people's jobs. To learn it in a setting that isn't so daunting and intimidating. Right. I think it has helped me that isn't so daunting and intimidating. Right. I think it has helped me as an actor to go shoot anything. It's like, I kind of know what everybody does now.

And I understand the schedule. Right. Yeah. Well, even when I did my own show, there was not a live audience. So like, I couldn't, I didn't have that luxury. I would like to know what that feels like. Yeah. To get the instant like feedback.

Well, yeah, to do like, cause like, I don't know if I felt that since I did a play in high school, like, you know what i mean like right that's really what it is is that you have the skill set and and you i guess in getting that job you realized you had the skill set it's sort of like oh they just wrote me this funny joke and like and even that like even just doing like i'm gonna do their joke yeah like i mean i did stuff that other people wrote but there was no audience there so you don't know how it lands right to actually have the script and be like no that I'm going to do their joke. Yeah. I mean, I did stuff that other people wrote, but there was no audience there, so you don't know how it lands. Right.

But to actually have the script and be like, no, that seems funny. Yeah. It's not my joke, but they have confidence in it. Yeah. You go out and you're just delivering someone else's joke and having it work. That must be pretty good. I think that's what people, when someone's like that,

and when an actor can look at something and they know why that is a joke, I think people are like, all right, well, this should land then. Yeah. Because he gets, just saying, I understand why this is funny it's like well then you should know how to say it yeah you know why it's funny you get the whole structure should be right there and it is right yeah a hundred percent especially in uh in that multicam the

joke the joke sit camp and you're doing so many takes in front of a live audience that if a joke flops you know it's unfortunate but someone can come in the writers all come come in, they go, all right, well, what's a better tag? What's a better line? While the audience is sitting there? While the audience is sitting there. And also they could have throwaways pre-written being like, ah, you know, in rehearsals that one never landed.

So maybe it lands and we didn't, no one was interpreting it right, but if it doesn't land, here's five other options we can like come in with. Well, that would drive me nuts, I think. That must get some getting used to is just knowing that the audience is just sitting there waiting. Yeah.

Because they know what the score is, but as a comic, you'd be like, hey, don't worry, we're going to, any second now. Yeah, yeah. Did you have to do that stuff? You know, we never had a, I mean, it was never on my shoulders to do that just because it wasn't like my show.

Who was the funny guy that was managing the crowd there? They had a, you know, a warm-up guy who was doing like, which is insane. You there they had a you know a warm-up guy who was doing like you could have that job oh man i that's a comedian's job i've done i did warm up on a uh on a on a game show that they were trying out it never became a thing i didn't know what warm-up was and i was like oh this is good money it was in new york i went into a studio i had no i didn't even know what doing warm-up was so i was like i guess i just do my act right and i went out and i it was jokes that i shouldn't it was like i was doing jokes that i'd be doing at like a bar show right and people are some you

know sometimes people laugh every now and then someone was like young enough to be like oh okay i get oh that's funny but most people being like well this is inappropriate like what the fuck is he talking about? And I just basically just kept eating shit to the point where they're like, yeah, anytime the camera stops, you got to go out and keep everybody alive. And sometimes the camera would stop and I'd be like, we're probably going to reset quick. I'll just, there's no need for me. I don't want to get in the way.

You guys are trying to get your thing done. You can tell people are going to be like, we're paying you to go do this. Yeah. And I was just like, I was, it was one of those jobs where I was like, you don't have to pay me. I'll just leave now. Yeah. And we both know this didn't work out.

Right. I won't care that I was here for free for a little bit. I got some chicken tenders at Crafty. I'm fine. I'll be fine. Your show will more than likely never become a thing because it's a game show. So it's already starting in a tough spot. because it's it's a game show so it's already starting in a tough spot but that's like such a unique job it's crazy there are guys that

have done it forever they're like you know i should talk to one of those guys like just the warm-up guys yeah i will say anytime i've done like at midnight or i've seen brody do it i'm like oh it's it's only then was i like oh you could enjoy the way that he does it. And I mean, it's his, his style of being funny anyways. But after seeing that, I'm like, oh,

if someone hired me today to go warm up a crowd, I would just try to do my best Brody impression for as long as possible, because that is perfect. Yeah. It's like energy, the way he gets it going and he's being funny, but he's also, Hey,

here's what you should be doing. And I'll make a joke, but don't fuck around and do exactly what I said. It's like, oh, that's perfect. Right. Sometimes you have stage managers that do it, but like shows like at midnight. So like Don Barris used to do Kimmel. I don't know if he still does, but like, it's definitely like, hey, where's the energy?

You know, you really got to be a coach. Right. Yeah. Like an audience coach. Yeah. It's a very specific thing. And every time I see it, I'm like, oh, this is a tough gig, man. Such a tough gig.

The warm upup guy and also you got to think for a multicam like like we're saying i mean you're sometimes there for six to six to eight hours imagine keeping an audience alive for six to eight hours you're like i've i've done all my my gimmicks i don't know what else to do crowd play music well then i guess they get locked into a thing they know that they can do for eight hours they find their eight hour act and they're rewarded handsomely yeah it's a it's a union gig yeah you know you get the full thing like eddie brill used to do letterman you know i i remember those guys i wasn't cut out for it because i would be self-conscious like they don't like me it's like it's not about you it's like

well and then i don't know how to do it i'm not even good at just hosting a mic i i go out it feels the same way i'm like i'm ruining the show every time i host a mic ever yeah the moment someone comes out and we're shaking hands i'm like i'm so sorry if you bomb it's my it is my fault i sucked the energy i ruined this i fucked it yeah sorry that you came down here tonight but you're one of those guys that like you know they're i've seen you a few times and like you uh you'll either do like there are guys that'll do their act or they'll do uh you know like a jazz set and just right now fuck off for god knows how long yeah yeah because it's fun so you you do that i try to do that i mean i prefer it that's what makes that entertains me right and then if if it's in front of an audience that gets on board

with it it's like oh great there's one of those nights it all worked out yeah yeah yeah but uh yeah sometimes if i'm trying to do something like that and it's not working i'll fall back into that you know the act and be like all right these things will work so i don't feel like i wasted too many people's time i used to do that to build the hours is like go to steve allen and rent it out for a night and just sort of like two hours of me rambling on finding it yeah yeah i don't know how to write other than that i i i can't i i always uh you know, when I started, people were like, I go to a coffee shop with my notebook and I write and I was always like, oh, one day I'll be able to do that because I can't do it now.

Me too. But I reflect back. I was a really bad student. I never wanted to put in the time. But I also think I'm a little bit better if my back is against the wall. And it's like, well, clearly when you're on stage, it's put up or shut up now. That's right. And there's no stalling. You either do it or you don't. Yeah. And it's like well clearly when you're on stage that's it's put up or shut up now that's right and there's no stalling you either do or you don't yeah and it's going to come from wherever that's like that's i i'm exactly the same way it's like you're cornered but you

corner yourself yeah it's like i'm a funny guy and i know that's what i have to do so it's going to happen right yeah yeah and it might not be an a plus i'll get out of it and i'll go to the next it might be getting out of it that's funny right yeah yeah oh i've i've built many jokes on hoping a joke bomb so i can do this other version right yeah well yeah because then you just like you put it out there but that's where the confidence comes in if you write like we do is that you know even if it's not working you can make light of that right and they'll be okay with it yeah and move on to the next idea you're not just going to go up there and tank right yeah yeah you know you're on to the next idea. You're not just going to go up there and tank. Right, yeah, yeah. You know, you're going to be able to.

Especially when you point it out. I think all you got to do, people always said, like, never comment on a joke. But I was like, you know, if a joke bombs and you comment on it, the crowd is almost relieved to be like, oh, good, he's not a psychopath. Who thinks that went well. Right, but then you get into that nuanced area of, like, being lazy or being disciplined or, like, doing your act or not doing your act. Well, if everything everything if every single

joke you're like well now i gotta talk about how that didn't work it's like well now that's either your act or that's right it's not going well you're not admitting it right yeah yeah i don't when i look at an hour i don't know i don't ever know where it comes from yeah like a you know there's no there's no paper trail right you know like wait how'd you write that like i don't know i don't know how it all happened yeah well people say like well if people are like well what kind of comic are you what do you do jokes about it's kind of like well i don't there's literally anything i think of that's funny i try to do that on stage as long as i can right until i hate it yeah well it isn't like i'm specifically like you know i got i don't have anything on the church. I'm not focused on any specific thing.

I try not to say that when people are like, what do you do jokes about? I'm like, I don't do jokes really. I'm not a joke guy. But you're a comedian? Yeah, but I kind of talk through some stuff. This doesn't sound like a good show. You're not really selling it. You're on one of those five-minute radio show phoners.

So what do you got for us tonight? I'm working on some stuff. I got some space. I got some space. I got some open space to fill. Yeah, I left a lot of room open for tonight's Saturday show. I'll see how they respond to the feature, and then I'll kind of guide it from there. All right. Well, it sounds like a good time.

All right. We got two free tickets tonight. You know why they're free, and you know why they're available. Oh, my God. tickets tonight you know why they're free and you know why they're available oh my god i don't know how much of that comes from like i still don't know what if the the root of it is insecurity like you're just protecting yourself from you know the inevitable possibility of failure like i'm gonna wing it yeah you know it can only you know so if you if you if that's the sort of bed you make you're like, Oh, who knows? Like anything could happen.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I think it's also to build a career out of it. Yeah. It's almost like, I think at a certain point, if you're starting out and you're like, I just go up and wing it and we see what happens. People are like, all right, so maybe you are protecting yourself.

Right. But I think if you can build your career out of that style, it's turns into, oh, no, I actually have the talent to wing it. Sure, right. Even though I do admit and know that it's lazy, and maybe I could do that much better, I am capable of winging it, and we all seem to go home happy. Right. It's entertaining. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I do the job. How much winging it is on the new special? Not a lot. This one, I mean, everything I've ever done started out as winging it right but this one uh because with my first special i did not prepare for it very well at all i think i went and did two clubs and i was like that's kind of the act and then we'll edit you know we have editing power right and it was lazy and was it was i i think that special uh a c plus b minus right at its best there's b minus moments and then that's worse i don't think i do as bad as a c plus right didn't fail

i passed the class yeah but with the second one i was like well we're gonna you know someone else is putting up the money you know third man records put up the money for it so i felt a little more responsible to really rein it in and i was like you know what let's tour all of september and i'll kind of have the hour ready but then that will really solidify it and so as soon as i got a laugh i was like all right i'm that urge to go ah let's maybe i'll say one more thing about it instead i was like don't you fucking asshole just say the next thing and i kind of got used to that style it's not i don't think it's so much me but i i left a little bit of room for for playing in the special but it was more like these worked and i did it the way third man was involved this new one yeah so they they produced it for netflix yeah yeah no kidding

so i we did it on our own and then we went to them and so this is the finished product we know you guys like to make your own but i just i i i i like the idea of artists kind of making their own thing i think it gives it more character gives it more personality that's why i did my first one that way and uh if someone said well so and so will give you this much money i mean one you probably never need that much money to shoot a special is this the first video film special they did uh third man yeah yeah yeah so i did a vinyl with them forever ago yeah um forever it's like three years ago and then i uh i went to them and i was like i know you guys like to experiment you seem to take all this stuff and you make it cool and i have no idea if you ever want to get into film

but you know if you do this is a great first step into it because i i was like i'm at a point in my career where you will make your money back right i know that you will yeah i don't know how much the profit will be and i have no idea where it'll end up but i know that you won't lose anything did netflix buy it netflix bought it yeah okay so i think it's so so third man was like yeah it worked out and i was like i wrote ben uh swank at third man i was like i i gotta be honest i didn't know that it would end up here but i was like that's kind of what i was hoping it would and then it did uh everybody everyone got well everyone did all right. Yeah, so I was like, I feel like I didn't let anybody down.

But I went into it, and luckily, like I said, they're awesome. Well, good, man. So I'll watch it. Cool. Thank you. I'll check it out. Yeah. Thanks for talking, buddy.

Yeah, thanks, man. That's it. That's our show that was rory scoville before that was maz jabrani before that it was rambling me rambling about sam shepard going off on a couple tangents doing a couple ads a sam shepard list planet yeah yeah look you guys go to WTFpod.com for all your WTFpod needs. Get on the mailing list. I'll mail you something. I'll play a little guitar. I'm not very inspired lately. Thank you. boomer lives it's a night for the whole family be a part of kids night when the toronto rock take on the colorado mammoth at a special 5 p.m start start time on Saturday, March 9th at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton.

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